Build Help: Aztec Warrior

[Alistaroc]

So, for some reason I feel compelled to craft an Aztec Jaguar Warrior.
Any source is okay really, I'm not too picky, and neither is anyone I play with.

All I have so far is a Human that takes 5-7 levels in Bloodhound for the subdual and Strength damage feel. Seems fun, but a higher powered version is always welcome.
Since I'm looking to stay mundane, a ToB class would be nice, but I don't really have any particular ideas.
A Fanged Blade from Arms and Armor fits the bill for the classic Aztec sword/club.

Anything come to mind to help out this build? Any help is appreciated. :smallsmile:

[Bullet06320]

you want to take a look at the Maztica stuff from Forgotten realms, its meso American based, most of it is 2ed but in Dragon 315 has a 3.5 update

and this homebrew from candlekeep might be useful
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19368

[Anlashok]

Pathfinder has stats for the macuahuitl (they refer to it as a terbutje though). Though their version is completely identical to a longsword.

[Alistaroc]

you want to take a look at the Maztica stuff from Forgotten realms, its meso American based, most of it is 2ed but in Dragon 315 has a 3.5 update

and this homebrew from candlekeep might be useful
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19368
I read through the Meztica books, but I didn't much care for them. However I will check out Dragon 315.

Oh, and if possible I'd like to stay away from homebrew; if I ever use it I most often tweak a class to make what I want.

[Zeb]

I recall that avalanche press released a book that wasn't bad in 3.0 :APL916 - Aztecs: Empire of the Dying Sun

If you can find it cheap give it a look. I think they had the weapons and a Jaguar warrior prestige class.

[Bullet06320]

Oh, and if possible I'd like to stay away from homebrew; if I ever use it I most often tweak a class to make what I want.

I know what you mean, but candlekeep is dedicated to FR and some of the fan works on that site are pretty good, the candlekeep compendium series there is written by some FR authors, so I tend to give the stuff over there more weight than most homebrew found elsewhere

[Alistaroc]

Pathfinder has stats for the macuahuitl (they refer to it as a terbutje though). Though their version is completely identical to a longsword.
I actually already have the macuahuitl, it's called the Fanged Blade in Arms and Armor(1d8+1, 19-20/x2)

you want to take a look at the Maztica stuff from Forgotten realms, its meso American based, most of it is 2ed but in Dragon 315 has a 3.5 update

and this homebrew from candlekeep might be useful
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19368
The Dragon 315 Jaguar Warrior is just a paladin with some shapeshifting thrown in. :/

I recall that avalanche press released a book that wasn't bad in 3.0 :APL916 - Aztecs: Empire of the Dying Sun

If you can find it cheap give it a look. I think they had the weapons and a Jaguar warrior prestige class.
I read through it, but the Eagle and Jaguar Warriors just look like the ones in 315 and Meztica; paladins with some abilities and shapeshifting.

I know what you mean, but candlekeep is dedicated to FR and some of the fan works on that site are pretty good, the candlekeep compendium series there is written by some FR authors, so I tend to give the stuff over there more weight than most homebrew found elsewhere
I'll take a look I guess.

I guess to clarify, I'm looking for something without spellcasting or shapeshifting, and with Tome of Battle worked in for the maneuvers.

[Novawurmson]

Let me ask, what do you really want out of the build? Just "Aztec" seems more like a fluff issue than a crunch issue. Any effective melee build could work with it - barbarian, crusader, warlord, ranger variants, even psychic warrior, binder, or totemist if you want to get really mystic with the fluff.

[Alistaroc]

Let me ask, what do you really want out of the build? Just "Aztec" seems more like a fluff issue than a crunch issue. Any effective melee build could work with it - barbarian, crusader, warlord, ranger variants, even psychic warrior, binder, or totemist if you want to get really mystic with the fluff.
Yep, pretty much fluff. But, I don't know what to fill out the rest of the levels with to make it... fluff-able.
I just want a decent melee build that uses 5-7 levels of Bloodhound, or something else that will allow subdual rather than lethal blows, and some ToB for the power boost.

[Dread_Head]

I would go with a build something like Swordsage 1 / Barbarian 1 / Ranger 3 / Swordsage +1 / Bloodhound 5 / Bloodclaw Master 5 / Swordsage +4.

Plenty of skill points, reasonable combat capabilities and decent manoeuvres. Go for Whirling Frenzy (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/classFeatureVariants.htm#rageVariantWhirlingFrenzy ) (take extra rage to use it more than once) and the TWF combat style so you are making lots of attacks (all the better for crippling strike). Focus on Tiger Claw, Shadow Hand and Setting Sun for the manoeuvres.

[Alistaroc]

I would go with a build something like Swordsage 1 / Barbarian 1 / Ranger 3 / Swordsage +1 / Bloodhound 5 / Bloodclaw Master 5 / Swordsage +4.

Plenty of skill points, reasonable combat capabilities and decent manoeuvres. Go for Whirling Frenzy (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/classFeatureVariants.htm#rageVariantWhirlingFrenzy ) (take extra rage to use it more than once) and the TWF combat style so you are making lots of attacks (all the better for crippling strike). Focus on Tiger Claw, Shadow Hand and Setting Sun for the manoeuvres.
TWF? I had planned to just use the Fanged Blade two-handed, for the flavor. That's why I assumed Tiger Claw's TWF wouldn't work too well with it.

[Greenish]

TWF? I had planned to just use the Fanged Blade two-handed, for the flavor. That's why I assumed Tiger Claw's TWF wouldn't work too well with it.Most Tiger Claw maneuvers work just as well or better for two-handers than they do for TWF.

You can TWF with a two-hander and unarmed strike.

[Alistaroc]

I would go with a build something like Swordsage 1 / Barbarian 1 / Ranger 3 / Swordsage +1 / Bloodhound 5 / Bloodclaw Master 5 / Swordsage +4.

Plenty of skill points, reasonable combat capabilities and decent manoeuvres. Go for Whirling Frenzy (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/classFeatureVariants.htm#rageVariantWhirlingFrenzy ) (take extra rage to use it more than once) and the TWF combat style so you are making lots of attacks (all the better for crippling strike). Focus on Tiger Claw, Shadow Hand and Setting Sun for the manoeuvres.
So I took a look through my Tome of Battle again, and I like the Swordsage idea for Setting Sun and Tiger Claw.
But why Ranger 3? I can understand Ranger 2, but what's so great about Endurance?
And why Bloodlclaw Master? It's almost entirely reliant on dual-wielding kukris or other Tiger Claw weapons.

[Dread_Head]

Ranger 3 gets you both Track and Endurance which you need to enter Bloodhound. It's the simplest and easiest way of getting both the feats and it also gives you good BAB and skill points for those levels. I was suggesting TWF as it comes free with being a ranger and so you can get more attacks to inflict Str damage with. Then I suggested bloodclaw master because if you are TWFing and using tiger claw already you might as well take a PrC which helps both. You can of course go the route of TWFing with a two handed weapon and an unarmed strike if you want. I was picturing something like a Kukri in one hand and a hand axe in the other (both tiger claw weapons) would be pretty aztec styled. The core of the build will of course work without TWFing or Bloodclaw Master, you could drop those levels and take the archery combat style for ranger (backup for when you can't get into combat) going THFing as your main focus.

Edit: Nothing is great about Endurance, which is why its better to get it without taking it as a feat.

[Alistaroc]

Ranger 3 gets you both Track and Endurance which you need to enter Bloodhound. It's the simplest and easiest way of getting both the feats and it also gives you good BAB and skill points for those levels. I was suggesting TWF as it comes free with being a ranger and so you can get more attacks to inflict Str damage with. Then I suggested bloodclaw master because if you are TWFing and using tiger claw already you might as well take a PrC which helps both. You can of course go the route of TWFing with a two handed weapon and an unarmed strike if you want. I was picturing something like a Kukri in one hand and a hand axe in the other (both tiger claw weapons) would be pretty aztec styled. The core of the build will of course work without TWFing or Bloodclaw Master, you could drop those levels and take the archery combat style for ranger (backup for when you can't get into combat) going THFing as your main focus.

Edit: Nothing is great about Endurance, which is why its better to get it without taking it as a feat.
Woops, forgot about Bloodhound prereqs; good idea with Ranger 3.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e6/Jaguar_warrior.jpg
I'm gonna stick to the Fanged Blade, and probably drop the shield, I do like the idea of THF with Fanged Blade and having a fist to TWF or throw with Setting Sun.