A player wants a Gun scythe and another wants to a TWF gish, help please?

[Dusk Eclipse]

I finally started my RotRL campaign last Saturday and it went pretty well, though there were a few kinks here and there; those aren't the issue at hand. One of my players happened to come across a Ruby Rose (http://hdwallpapers.cat/wallpaper/ruby_rose_silver_eyes_red_hair_short_rwby_hd-wallpaper-1582631.jpg) while searching for a character image and fell in love with her Gun scythe and asked me if he could get one. To be honest I'm not adverse to the idea, but I'm not sure how to go with it. I mean it obviously would be an exotic weapon so I want to make it a worthwhile one; class choice currently is playing a harbinger, but he will probably change classes, but not race (Onispawn Tiefling btw).

For the TWF gish I have a few ideas in mind, (Dervish Defender going into Mage Hunter most probably), but I also talked with another friend about doing a small adjustment to magus, simply switch out Spellstrike for the ability to use spell combat while TWF, quick and simple, but I can't help but wonder if it is a too big nerf to his damage potential, granted he wants to go with the buffing type of gish a opposed to glass cannon burst mage so maybe it isn't that bad.

[EisenKreutzer]

Brewing up a gun scythe shouldn't be that hard. Just use the axe musket as a base, and replace the axe part with a scythe.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Well yeah, but in that case it would be something probably not worth a feat.

[Elricaltovilla]

Warpriest should be able to TWF gish effectively, especially as a buff-gish. Psychic Warrior could probably do it too.

[EisenKreutzer]

Well yeah, but in that case it would be something probably not worth a feat.

You could make it a modern firearm. That would definitely be worth a feat, especially if it is is capable of firing a large number of shots before reloading, like a revolver.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Warpriest should be able to TWF gish effectively, especially as a buff-gish. Psychic Warrior could probably do it too.

I hadn't thought about the the Warpriest, thank you. Psychic Warrior was offered but he didn't like it that much.


You could make it a modern firearm. That would definitely be worth a feat, especially if it is is capable of firing a large number of shots before reloading, like a revolver.

That on the other hand works might just work. Fancy Gun-fu can come from Tempest Gale and Solar wind.

[Swaoeaeieu]

I hadn't thought about the the Warpriest, thank you. Psychic Warrior was offered but he didn't like it that much.



That on the other hand works might just work. Fancy Gun-fu can come from Tempest Gale and Solar wind.

In the show, the gun scythe uses the recoil to increas jump distance, maybe give it +5 to acrobatics or something? Fun with the acrobatics disciplines

[Dusk Eclipse]

I didn't know that; I haven't actually watched the show. In eithercase that is something that I think he would find quite fun.

[EisenKreutzer]

I didn't know that; I haven't actually watched the show. In eithercase that is something that I think he would find quite fun.

The Acrobatics bonus could replace the scythes normal Trip feature.

[LudicSavant]

Heh, I actually made a build once based partly on Ruby Rose, able to do everything in her trailer... complete with being able to use Footsteps of the Divine to move hundreds of feet combined with the Desert Tempest maneuver to attack every foe you come into melee range of during your turn (e.g. kill a field of werewolves in a round of zipping about the map). Also could use Surge of Fortune and Sense Weakness to auto-crit with a scythe.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYW2GmHB5xs

[Rubik]

I didn't know that; I haven't actually watched the show. In either case that is something that I think he would find quite fun.If your player is fangasming over RWBY, I would suggest at least watching the four pre-series "trailers," which were designed to be watched prior to the show. It will help you figure out what the player is wanting out of his character and keep him happy by tailoring the game a bit.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iE-zt1K560U

[Swaoeaeieu]

I didn't know that; I haven't actually watched the show. In eithercase that is something that I think he would find quite fun.

For a quick intro to the weapon: episode 1 (https://youtu.be/-sGiE10zNQM?t=186) does the trick quite well.


edit: rwby has become to well knows, errybody's ninja'ing errybody round these parts :P

[Dusk Eclipse]

The Acrobatics bonus could replace the scythes normal Trip feature.

I was thinking of giving him the weapon without special modification and allowing him to "improve" the weapon as the game progressing. Still it is somthing to consider


Heh, I actually made a build once based on this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYW2GmHB5xs), complete with being able to use Footsteps of the Divine to move hundreds of feet combined with the Desert Tempest maneuver to attack every foe you come into melee range of during your turn (e.g. kill a field of werewolves in a round). Also could use Surge of Fortune and Sense Weakness to auto-crit with a scythe.


If your player is fangasming over RWBY, I would suggest at least watching the four pre-series "trailers," which were designed to be watched prior to the show. It will help you figure out what the player is wanting out of his character and keep him happy by tailoring the game a bit.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iE-zt1K560U

He is not really fangasming over Ruby, but over her scythe. He simply googled Scythe Wielder or something like that to get an image for his character and ruby popped in.

[Rubik]

He is not really fangasming over Ruby, but over her scythe. He simply googled Scythe Wielder or something like that to get an image for his character and ruby popped in.Watch that vid. He'll like that scythe even more once he sees it in action.


edit: rwby has become to well knows, errybody's ninja'ing errybody round these parts :PI was only ninja'd because someone edited his post after I made mine.

[Masakan]

Heh, I actually made a build once based partly on Ruby Rose, able to do everything in her trailer... complete with being able to use Footsteps of the Divine to move hundreds of feet combined with the Desert Tempest maneuver to attack every foe you come into melee range of during your turn (e.g. kill a field of werewolves in a round of zipping about the map). Also could use Surge of Fortune and Sense Weakness to auto-crit with a scythe.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYW2GmHB5xs

Oh Definitely a build I'm particularly proud off Borrows heavily from Weiss's fighting style(Albeit a more defensive take on it), though personality wise he's more like blake.

In fact when ever I make a character when i feel they are finished i ask myself...could they fight someone from either kingdom hearts or RWBY and actually hold their own and if the answer is yes they are combat ready.......is that too powerful?

[LudicSavant]

In fact when ever I make a character when i feel they are finished i ask myself...could they fight someone from either kingdom hearts or RWBY and actually hold their own and if the answer is yes they are combat ready.......is that too powerful?

Well if you ask me, anything less is a disgrace to the Fighter archetype, devoid of Nice Things, seeing as mid-high CR monsters get to answer yes to that question.

[Andreaz]

Adapt from musket axe, large magazine, no misfire, and the feat to use it also eliminates aoos from doing ranged attacks with that specific weapon. I'd even throw a free, similarly restricted, twf for him.

[Dusk Eclipse]

How does this looks?


Exotic Weapon (Advanced Two Handed Fire Arm)
Damage 2d4 crit x4 (Both forms) Range 80 ft. 3 round magazine
Anyone proficient in the use of a Gunscythe may attack using either form interchangeably during a full attack, ranged attacks against adjacent foes don't provoke AoO from the target of the attack.

Firearms no longer misfire, but they target normal AC instead of touch across all range increments.


I'd also like some further comments on my idea of allowing Magus to use spell combat while TWF at the cost of not being able to use spellstrike.

[Tvtyrant]

The gunscythe is fine. It takes a feat to basically tie some pistols to a scythe.

I would probably just let the Magus cast with a weapon in each hand, seeing as how the better two handed weapon style can. Maybe make a feat to let them channel through both blades.

[atemu1234]

How does this looks?


Exotic Weapon (Advanced Two Handed Fire Arm)
Damage 2d4 crit x4 (Both forms) Range 80 ft. 3 round magazine
Anyone proficient in the use of a Gunscythe may attack using either form interchangeably during a full attack, ranged attacks against adjacent foes don't provoke AoO from the target of the attack.

Firearms no longer misfire, but they target normal AC instead of touch across all range increments.


I'd also like some further comments on my idea of allowing Magus to use spell combat while TWF at the cost of not being able to use spellstrike.

Is this pathfinder only, because I think that 3e firearms are much better than PF ones. Gunslinger becomes almost optimal with them.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Yes it is PF only.

[Jack_Simth]

I finally started my RotRL campaign last Saturday and it went pretty well, though there were a few kinks here and there; those aren't the issue at hand. One of my players happened to come across a Ruby Rose (http://hdwallpapers.cat/wallpaper/ruby_rose_silver_eyes_red_hair_short_rwby_hd-wallpaper-1582631.jpg) while searching for a character image and fell in love with her Gun scythe and asked me if he could get one. To be honest I'm not adverse to the idea, but I'm not sure how to go with it. I mean it obviously would be an exotic weapon so I want to make it a worthwhile one; class choice currently is playing a harbinger, but he will probably change classes, but not race (Onispawn Tiefling btw).

For the TWF gish I have a few ideas in mind, (Dervish Defender going into Mage Hunter most probably), but I also talked with another friend about doing a small adjustment to magus, simply switch out Spellstrike for the ability to use spell combat while TWF, quick and simple, but I can't help but wonder if it is a too big nerf to his damage potential, granted he wants to go with the buffing type of gish a opposed to glass cannon burst mage so maybe it isn't that bad.

TWF Gish is pretty straightforward - most double weapons allow you to hold it in one hand, which makes casting easy. A standard double weapon with the TWF chain on a normal gish build will mostly do the job, mechanically speaking. Perhaps a Vivisectionist Alchemist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/vivisectionist) for sneak attack to keep up the damage, and alchemy to handle the spells... which, as technically supernatural abilities, don't require free hands?

[martixy]

I've wanted to play a character with that weapon for ages, precisely because of that trailer up there(man, I will never get tired of it).

Consequently I've looked into the issue a lot.

One option you have is this:
Dungeonscape features a thing called "Wand chambers" - additions to weapons that can house wands.
Good candidates for wands are the various orbs - the have no SR or save, just ranged attack roll.
Another logical extension is putting in Dorjes(the psionic equivalent of wands), with say - Crystal Shard, which seems a really appropriate power to put in such a wand.

The only problem is that by RAW there is no way(that I am aware of) of interleaving melee attacks and wand discharges.

Though that could be fixed with the stipulation that discharging a wand from a wand chamber is counted as an attack action - this can be done through a feat - allowing the weapon to be used as normal, without being exotic(unless it is by default), while unlocking this new fancy style of combat for anyone with the feat.
You could limit the types of spells/powers that can be used with that feat to those that follow a similar prototype - e.g. creation effects that have no SR/PR, no Save(?), are Instantaneous and require an attack roll.

Edit: Oops, this is PF.
Well at least the above is valid for 3.5.

[Seclora]

Hi. Big fan of the show.


First off, I'd suggest looking at some of the D20 modern stuff if you want to integrate weapons together. Try a Talenta Sharrash, from the Ebberron books(it's a scythe on illegal halfling steroids) + Barret .50 cal(High caliber sniper rifle) combination, with mandatory EWP for the combined weapon. Then you take Exotic Weapon Master, out of Complete Warrior, to not provoke in melee, and whatever other fun tricks(I suggest flurry) you want from the class if any. It's not hard to qualify for.
Finally, Ruby is straight swiftblade (https://web.archive.org/web/20100327172812/http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327). Speed is essential for pulling off most of her tricks, plus its a decent class. Sorcerer/Warblade should work, don't know PF well enough to say which of their classes work best to pull off that same sort of deal, but you get the picture.

[Rubik]

Finally, Ruby is straight swiftblade (https://web.archive.org/web/20100327172812/http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327). Except she's not a caster. At all. She has insane speed and maneuverability, yes, but no magic whatsoever. I think she's more of a very high level multiclass warblade/unarmed swordsage, myself, who focuses on maneuverability maneuvers and mixing extremely powerful armed strikes with debilitating unarmed ones.

If you want a swiftblade, look at Weiss.

[Seclora]

Except she's not a caster. At all. She has insane speed and maneuverability, yes, but no magic whatsoever. I think she's more of a very high level multiclass warblade/unarmed swordsage, myself, who focuses on maneuverability maneuvers and mixing extremely powerful armed strikes with debilitating unarmed ones.

If you want a swiftblade, look at Weiss.

So she doesn't actually use her spells. You know how many Duskblades I've seen do that? Plenty of people only actually use the one spell. They're hardly optimized, but they do.
Also, Ruby can't throw a punch to save her life, as evidenced in season two.

Besides, she attacks and moves way faster than Weiss. Weiss is more like a Snowflake Wardancer, support casting and Charisma based build.

[Rubik]

So she doesn't actually use her spells. You know how many Duskblades I've seen do that? Plenty of people only actually use the one spell. They're hardly optimized, but they do.In lieu of any evidence whatsoever that she utilizes magical effects, I'm going to assume she doesn't have any levels in a casting class.

She can fling herself around the battlefield like nobody's business, so fast that she might as well be using short-range teleportation. The Shadow Jaunt maneuvers work quite well to simulate this. Swift, move, standard, and an extra turn from White Raven Tactics to teleport some more, followed by one hell of a flurry of strikes. She can also hurl herself in a line and slaughter everything in her path, she can fling herself so hard she produces a tornado in her wake, and she can drag an enemy by the neck and use her movement to deal a ridiculous amount of damage as a result. Tornado Throw, anyone?

She's purely martial, as far as I've seen. A multiclassed initiator works perfectly for her, albeit perhaps with one or two refluffed or homebrewed maneuvers.


Ruby can't throw a punch to save her life, as evidenced in season two.But she has a seriously mean kick. She's always spinning around on top of Crescent Rose and kicking the absolute crap out of enemies with those army boots of hers.


Besides, she attacks and moves way faster than Weiss. Weiss is more like a Snowflake Wardancer, support casting and Charisma based build.I can see that, but she also makes for a good bard/sublime chord/swiftblade.

[Masakan]

Except she's not a caster. At all. She has insane speed and maneuverability, yes, but no magic whatsoever. I think she's more of a very high level multiclass warblade/unarmed swordsage, myself, who focuses on maneuverability maneuvers and mixing extremely powerful armed strikes with debilitating unarmed ones.

Specifically I imagine Rwby to be a heavily focused Diamond Mind/Iron Heart Adept with maybe a couple levels in Bloodstorm blade
Weiss to be a Swordsage/Wizard/Swiftblade(mostly due to the face that while she's fast/agile as ****, she can't take a hit to save her life)
Blake easily a Two weapon fighting Rouge/Swordsage with a Focus on Shadow hand and Tiger claw no idea what her prestige class would be though.
And Yang....Probably a Unarmed Crusader/Warblade Whether you think it's viable or not she tanks hits like nobodies business.

[Draconium]

But she has a seriously mean kick. She's always spinning around on top of Crescent Rose and kicking the absolute crap out of enemies with those army boots of hers.

Snap Kick. :smallamused: Making an unarmed attack as part of your standard action can really pack a punch, huh?

[Rubik]

Snap Kick. :smallamused: Making an unarmed attack as part of your standard action can really pack a punch, huh?That works, yes, but without Improved Unarmed Strike...

[Draconium]

That works, yes, but without Improved Unarmed Strike...

Oh, I wasn't saying she didn't have it. I was just commenting about what she probably had in addition to it.