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View Full Version : Pathfinder Fated Guide Patrons and Flavors



Xuldarinar
2015-10-23, 03:01 AM
In occult origins, one of the many wonderful archetypes (and thankfully one of the fully functional things in there) is the Fated Guide. Im not going to really give anything away in this, save for one small mechanical thing to discuss as needed, but they are spiritualists with an association with Pharasma (if only as the mechanism of them getting the spirit) who serve as guides for a phantom (remorse emotional focus), in this case a judged soul being returned and linked to a believer for another shot, not that they remember a thing from their past lives. Thats for you to figure out and to help them move on.

Theres just one problem in this, or rather an opportunity. At first, I assumed they would have to serve Pharasma but there is no mechanical requirement they be tied to Pharasma, though they have to be tied to a deity because Deific Obedience is in the mix. So, here is where the discussion comes in. I've thought of a few approaches one can throw in to give their fated guides that oomph, specifically in the form of patrons they follow and what that could entail.


The Petitioned: In essence, the concept of this route is someone is sent back to the material. They are fated and judged, given to the follower of a particular deity to serve. This is under the influence of the deity who owns the soul. This doesn't vastly differ from the initial concept, but the facilitator for their return isn't (purely) by the hand of Pharisma, but by the hand of their deity. Not all deities make sense for this concept, as being tied to remorse doesn't fit all directly, but where you cannot come up with a rational explanation, you may be able to negotiate with your DM for a more fitting emotion.

The Damned: Another approach is the spirit was one fated for one of the lower planes, specifically to your patron. Congratulations, you've been given a pet, now go out there and do what you will with them. Considering the torture some deities inflict upon those delivered to them, your phantom should be relieved to have some time away from that, whether they have known pain yet or not. Aiding in this concept, one could ask their DM to allow them to substitute in Demonic Obedience if they served a demon lord rather than a deity.

The Repentant: Going another route, you are the servant of a deity of the higher planes. The soul you are sponsoring is someone who may have been fated for the lower planes, but they have shown such remorse for their misdeeds they have been given a chance, whether or not they have a chance. So go, guide them. Help them avoid the horrors of the lower planes. Aiding in this concept, one could ask their DM to allow them to substitute in the Celestial Obedience if they served an empyreal lord rather than a deity.

The Condemned: Yet another route but one sharing in some of the previous notions is as follows. You have, by your own ability or with the aid of another, intercepted a soul destined for the higher planes. Rather than allowing them to reach their just reward, you get to corrupt them and force them to serve the will of your deity. Perhaps they were one who vexed you or your patron, or maybe they are simply unfortunate enough to have come to you. What ever the case may be, you shall condemn them to the lower planes and deliver them unto your patron.


What these lack are specifics. So, whether you've notions of these or of other routes, what would/could you do with the general concept of this archetype?

Psyren
2015-10-23, 09:57 AM
I think your interpretation is correct and that neither you nor the Phantom are bound to follow Pharasma specifically. She judges all souls after all, not just the ones that serve her or would stay in her domain.

Your potential fluff explanations for such a pairing are also fine, though I'd be curious why a Damned soul would be attached to a spiritualist whose patron would want them to be damned. Seems to me there's no reason for that match-up beyond a pointless delay; the soul certainly wouldn't get any less damned following a Spiritualist who venerates Asmodeus for example. I'd expect instead a situation where a soul is about to be damned and gets attached to a good-aligned Spiritualist instead as sort of a last-ditch effort.

Condemned, Repentant and Petitioned are all fine though.

Xuldarinar
2015-10-23, 10:24 AM
I think your interpretation is correct and that neither you nor the Phantom are bound to follow Pharasma specifically. She judges all souls after all, not just the ones that serve her or would stay in her domain.

Your potential fluff explanations for such a pairing are also fine, though I'd be curious why a Damned soul would be attached to a spiritualist whose patron would want them to be damned. Seems to me there's no reason for that match-up beyond a pointless delay; the soul certainly wouldn't get any less damned following a Spiritualist who venerates Asmodeus for example. I'd expect instead a situation where a soul is about to be damned and gets attached to a good-aligned Spiritualist instead as sort of a last-ditch effort.

Condemned, Repentant and Petitioned are all fine though.

The damned route would be a route of service as I see it, something I didn't explain well perhaps. The patron is lending them to the spiritualist for use, rather than to change where they stand in the scheme of things.

Psyren
2015-10-23, 10:57 AM
The damned route would be a route of service as I see it, something I didn't explain well perhaps. The patron is lending them to the spiritualist for use, rather than to change where they stand in the scheme of things.

See, that I don't think Pharasma would be cool with. Once you're sentenced, you're sentenced, and it's afterlife time (good or bad). Putting you back in the world as part of your sentence, especially to serve a mortal spellcaster, would be an awful lot like making you undead, which she wouldn't be gung-ho about.

Xuldarinar
2015-10-23, 12:44 PM
See, that I don't think Pharasma would be cool with. Once you're sentenced, you're sentenced, and it's afterlife time (good or bad). Putting you back in the world as part of your sentence, especially to serve a mortal spellcaster, would be an awful lot like making you undead, which she wouldn't be gung-ho about.

Granted. Though, also certain deities likely wouldn't be suitable for this. For instance, what of a servant of Rovagug becoming a Fated Guide?

Psyren
2015-10-23, 12:47 PM
Granted. Though, also certain deities likely wouldn't be suitable for this. For instance, what of a servant of Rovagug becoming a Fated Guide?

None of the gods ally with him, not even her. So I agree, I don't see that happening. (Nothing prevents it mechanically though.)

Xuldarinar
2015-10-23, 01:12 PM
None of the gods ally with him, not even her. So I agree, I don't see that happening. (Nothing prevents it mechanically though.)

Well, if memory serves, she was involved in fighting him. Now if only there weren't mechanical obstacles for other things (Outer gods and great old ones and other deities lacking entries regarding Obediences, feats that could substitute for demigods other than the demon lords and empyrean lords, so on.) Any other patrons you think would be... unlikely choices?

I wonder what one of Lamashtu would be like.. Or Nocticula.

Psyren
2015-10-23, 01:42 PM
ISG 174 says that GMs should try to develop suitable Obediences and Boons for any deity their players choose, and even suggests mixing and matching equal-level boons from deities with similar portfolios or domains as a quick and dirty approach. The assumption is that the feat can be taken by any worshiper on Golarion, not just a follower of one of the major players.

As far as Lamashtu, I could see a soul being assigned to one of her followers. A monstrous soul in particular - a that of a bugbear or hag or even a Tiefling or something - could be one that she lays claim to.

Xuldarinar
2015-10-23, 10:06 PM
Something just occurred to me that is worth consideration.

Deific Obedience (and the two feats that could be used in its place) require one to worship a deity, but nowhere does it say anything about alignment restrictions. This might be the only archetype, perhaps even class, to explicitly tie one to a deity but not directly restrain their alignment. The only restriction would be that they should still have to follow the tenants of their faith, something more difficult the more divorced they are from the alignment of the deity they worship, with some deities more so than others (Try being CN and worship Asmodeus, for instance.).