DM help with murder mystery kind of game.

[RingofThorns]

So the basic story is that many years ago a young noble was in a duel however his opponent does not obey the classic rules of the duel and instead of showing up with just himself and a single witness instead shows with his eleven friends and beat the noble badly almost killing him and according to what most would think to crippled to ever duel again let alone seek revenge. However he has trained in secret and spent a large fortune on special items to get his revenge on the noble that he was supposed to duel and his eleven friends. I am basing the 'crippled' character off a recent character build that fights with a cane sword, using the sword and cane haft in a kind of duel wield fashion when outright fighting or relying on quick draws and strikes when people havent figured out that the cane holds a blade. Anyway when the game opens it picks up the day after the 'cripple' has killed what is...well...basically an orc pimp in a back alley, he leaves a cryptic message written on the wall for the players to try and figure out, now the trick is I need help figuring out what the message says, since this first kill was a test of his new blade and to make sure that his skills were still sharp before seeking out to kill the other noble and his eleven friends. Can anyone help me think up a neat/cool, cryptic,riddle, rhyme, sherlock kind of way say all of that?

[Geddy2112]

I don't have anything for the riddle,but for a murder mystery make sure you follow the three clue rule (http://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/1118/roleplaying-games/three-clue-rule)

[Flickerdart]

Why would he leave a message? He's not a psycho, he's just seeking revenge. It's in his best interests not to get caught and not to clue in the dozen victims that they're about to be done in.

[RingofThorns]

Well other then the basic thing that the whole game idea is kind of based in a sherlock kind of thing, well I was thinking about it and perhaps he has made other kills all to test himself and other pieces of gear he has that will help him with this, but it is the classic serial killer/stalker killer kind of thing where he wants them to be afraid and to know that some one is coming for them. Part of it is going to be that a long coat he wears has enchantments on it that make him appear to kind of fade like fog when he moves quickly and since another part of his gear is going to be a few things that give him big bonuses to his movement,tumble, and jump checks..along with a special enchanted wide brimmed hat that when worn covers the users face in a kind of illusion shadow that makes the wears face appear more or less like the shadow faced guy from the 'disturbed' album covers all in all it would lead to most thinking something very spooky and evil was coming after them.

[Flickerdart]

Would noblemen care about a guy murdered in an alleyway? You'd have to make the killing so shocking that everyone would be talking about it, including the nobility.

[RingofThorns]

hence why I added that you made a good point and that the killing first mentioned would be the latest in a string all done by the same person, and at all the scenes the same cryptic thing has been left. The players are supposed to deduce/solve the cryptic writing and think 'hmm might want to go talk to the guy this seems to be addressed to..." Also you have to walk a line with the killings, sure he can kill one high profile target a noble would often have contact with but then it becomes high profile and the wealthy and influence wielding members of the town [aka the nobles] would put greater demand on the guard to catch or kill the person doing it. However leaving something cryptic those twelve would hear about and start to feel like it was aimed at them would set a creeping worry into their minds which would only be reinforced by the pc's showing up and going 'hey we think some one might be trying to kill you.'

[Honest Tiefling]

1) Why did the guy not reveal that the evil nobleman screwed up a duel and try to shame him? Fear for his own life? Did...No one noticed he got really beat up?

2) If he's been crippled, he could have just used the same amount of money to buy an even better assassin, as opposed to risking himself and spending money on reversing the effects on himself. There are reasons a character would do this, but why?

3) Why not frame your Local Cult of Evil for this, if he doesn't want to get caught? Why be cryptic when he could use someone else's reputation for him and frame someone else for it?

4) Why has he not contacted enemies of his enemy? This guy sounds like he'd have a bunch of them.

[Eisfalken]

Naw, you're being too direct. He wants the nobleman who cheated him to feel terrified that he's on the hit list, but he doesn't necessarily want anyone to trip to that fact. The nobleman can't go to anyone for help, because he basically cheated a duel; in most societies with such things, that's a huge offense that could get you stripped of your title, or at the very least everyone would ostracize you (making it hard to marry your children to good families, or even hold on to wealth in some cases).

So. You start with an orc pimp being killed. That's a red herring: the real intention was to kidnap one of the elves who helped cheat the duel, but of course elven pride means they will not even listen to accusations of one of them "slumming" it up with lesser races like that. Instead of a note, killer leaves behind a token. How about a shattered piece of his rapier (or whatever weapon he was using in the duel)? It has a unique inscription in an obscure language (maybe something extraplanar); it only has a couple of letters legible on it, so the PCs start scratching their heads.

Meanwhile, it turns out your orc pimp's girl who was with the kidnapped elf ran off, and is being pursued by the cheating noble's agents; he suspects something amiss, and wants confirmation, but certainly will kill the girl to keep the secret, of course. So now that's a thing. Oh, and around this time the kidnapped elf's corpse should be found; examination shows inhuman torture used against him.

Each elf that helped is eventually murdered, preferably tortured and kidnapped first, and the killer has no qualms cutting down anyone in his path to get to them, but doesn't actually care if anyone runs off (the pimp tried to stop a murder in his place of business, so he gets killed, but the girl there wasn't in any danger from the killer). During all this, the cheating noble should figure out the PCs are involved, so he should do everything he can to quietly stop their investigations: arrange for accidents that delay or inhibit them, make trouble with the town guard/watch, perhaps even send a few crude assassinations their way.

The pieces of the blade should, eventually, give them some Knowledge (nobility & royalty) checks to figure out that it belongs to a specific noble house (DC starts high, gets lower each time a blade piece is found). Then they do some Gather Information and/or Knowledge (local) checks (or bardic lore, of course) to find out who the blade belonged to, and the fact that he went to a duel and never returned, meaning he is thought to be dead.

This setup will give you a number of crazy things to throw at the PCs, and if they have a number of different classes, then they should all have challenges to face. Have your killer employ folks who can do poisons and/or magic to help out; maybe the PCs can back-track attacks using such methods to the folks your killer is employing, then they can do the "good cop, bad cop" routine.

Hopefully this should give you plenty to work with and set up. Take your time and close up all the loopholes in the plot as best you can, but give them plenty of chances to solve the mystery before it's too late.

[Amphetryon]

Did your Players know at the start that this was going to be a murder mystery sort of game? I ask because the D&D ruleset, particularly in 3.X, makes that a tough style of game to run believably without the Players buying in ahead of time.

[RingofThorns]

Allright guys I really like all the help and the way you are trying to make me rethink this, but please re read the original post. I have said that this 'is' happening, that what I want is to just find some cool way to do it, I havent asked for tips on how to make the story more real world rational or if it is a good idea. I am looking for help to make a cryptic warning that as a bonus might rhyme.

Though as a side note, assume that it is the word of eleven people against his saying that they werent there and had nothing to do with the duel and the 'cripple' lost because of his own failings.

That intended target and his friends are all viewed as maybe not the most charming or popular but are certainly in good standing in their respective circles so one person pointing a finger and saying "it was them!" just isnt enough to get any one to really take a deeper look into it.

As for why would the 'cripple' lie and pretend to be more injured then he is? you get hurt like that it will send you to a dark place he has more then likely planning this since that day they almost killed him. Why is he doing this on his own?.....sometimes you just want to be the one to handle it yourself, plus hitmen can talk they can be bought and what if some how he was bought and turned against the 'cripple'? Why not just do it himself and avoid the middle man. Not to mention it proves that he is greater then all of them that if not for pretty much ambushing him at what should have been an honor duel they never could have taken him one on one.

Now work with the thought that in most DnD games I have run there isnt an evil cult skulking around in every last major city in creation, plus that is just a massive and over done plot device, dont get me wrong so is my idea but well I like my idea more.

[RingofThorns]

To start this reply off Amphetryon I am going to have them roll up new characters for this and use the scoundrels book that talks about making investigator type characters as a guide line and tell them that this is going to be a very sherlock kind of inspired DnD type game.

Eisfalken dude thank you so much, you got so much right about what I was going for with my first post how ever what I said was eleven as in 11 not elven still thank you for the ideas. The only thing though is that I was going for a cryptic warning over something like a token because something personal to the 'cripple' character would pretty clearly point straight to him being behind this, where as a cryptic warning plus the strange and seemingly in-human things the killer can do would make the targets think of him as some avenging shade or vengeful spirit that they cannont seem to escape,placate,or bargain with instead thinking it to be some dark thing they must answer to.

The reason for the 'cripple' to kill the orc pimp and several other low life types is basically to test not only his gear but himself to make certain that he is up to the task and to make sure all of his gear and his weapon will work when it comes to a fight. When the noble and his friends start to get picked off the cryptic warning/rhyme will be there again at the scene only changed to reflect that there is one less, heck if he really wants to make is creepy he could have it scrawled on a wall in like spectral green faerie fire.

[Honest Tiefling]

Though as a side note, assume that it is the word of eleven people against his saying that they werent there and had nothing to do with the duel and the 'cripple' lost because of his own failings.

Either someone didn't connect the dots on how he nearly died in what I presume is NOT a fatal duel, or this place has the most bad*** duels, like pankration. Someone would have found or noticed that the guy was nearly dead, so did they assume he just tripped really badly on his own sword, repeatedly?

I think the problem is, without understanding the character better, it is hard to make a cryptic clue. Why does he handle things personally? I am going to assume that he wants to see the life bleed out of these people, one by one, taking pleasure in the fear and terror in their eyes as they slowly die. With a murder like this, we need to know how his mind works, because a part of the mystery is not the who, but the why. To give better advice, we need to know why he would forego more efficient options and how far he's willing to go.

[RingofThorns]

Either someone didn't connect the dots on how he nearly died in what I presume is NOT a fatal duel, or this place has the most bad*** duels, like pankration. Someone would have found or noticed that the guy was nearly dead, so did they assume he just tripped really badly on his own sword, repeatedly?

I think the problem is, without understanding the character better, it is hard to make a cryptic clue. Why does he handle things personally? I am going to assume that he wants to see the life bleed out of these people, one by one, taking pleasure in the fear and terror in their eyes as they slowly die. With a murder like this, we need to know how his mind works, because a part of the mystery is not the who, but the why. To give better advice, we need to know why he would forego more efficient options and how far he's willing to go.

Why do you assume the noble doesnt fight with a mace or a hammer? most of the injuries he has could easily have been done to him by a single opponent if they were good enough. Then the noble did the "noble" thing and actually takes the 'cripple' back to the healers stating the the duel simply got out of hand when the 'cripple' refused to yield out of stung pride because the 'cripples' family is known duelists to the point of having a school perhaps.

Why do it himself? His families entire standing is based on how they are great duelists and are so skilled and now everyone looks down on the 'cripples' family because look at how the heir was so badly beaten in a one on one, so of course he is doing it to prove that he is better that he could easily take them in one on one. For how brutal the kills are well that is somewhere between assassins creed...and jack the ripper. The 'cripple' would play up his injuries to make everyone think he is so unable to get back at them all why giving him a good alibi and for the gear he will have he has spent hundreds of thousands of gold on this gear to get his revenge because he wants it himself, it wont mean anything if some random assassin does it.

[Honest Tiefling]

Why do you assume the noble doesnt fight with a mace or a hammer? most of the injuries he has could easily have been done to him by a single opponent if they were good enough. Then the noble did the "noble" thing and actually takes the 'cripple' back to the healers stating the the duel simply got out of hand when the 'cripple' refused to yield out of stung pride because the 'cripples' family is known duelists to the point of having a school perhaps.

So...Pankration rules then, that actually makes more sense. Through why didn't the noble just kill the soon to be cripple? Better to take care of loose ends. Is the guy prideful, and wanted him to survive for some reason? He probably should have expected some form of assassination...

Also, why were there no witnesses to the duel? Not a custom native to the region?


Why do it himself? His families entire standing is based on how they are great duelists and are so skilled and now everyone looks down on the 'cripples' family because look at how the heir was so badly beaten in a one on one, so of course he is doing it to prove that he is better that he could easily take them in one on one. For how brutal the kills are well that is somewhere between assassins creed...and jack the ripper. The 'cripple' would play up his injuries to make everyone think he is so unable to get back at them all why giving him a good alibi and for the gear he will have he has spent hundreds of thousands of gold on this gear to get his revenge because he wants it himself, it wont mean anything if some random assassin does it.

See, this makes more sense. He has a personal vendetta, and he wants to best them. You mentioned Jack the Ripper, is he taking body parts for some reason? Maybe the best clue is one that is not written, but to have one of the eleven die before the PCs get there, or be a more mundane incident that no one takes notice. And then just mail kidneys to the next victim. Or another organ that represents courage or prowess, like the heart, hands or eyes. No handwriting to trace.

Also, how did this guy hide the gear he bought? Magical gear can only be crafted by higher level casters and costs a pretty penny. How did he hide buying it, and where his money is going? If he has a family, wouldn't someone try to dig through records to figure out why they cannot buy a new dress for the gala?

[RingofThorns]

So...Pankration rules then, that actually makes more sense. Through why didn't the noble just kill the soon to be cripple? Better to take care of loose ends. Is the guy prideful, and wanted him to survive for some reason? He probably should have expected some form of assassination...

Also, why were there no witnesses to the duel? Not a custom native to the region?



See, this makes more sense. He has a personal vendetta, and he wants to best them. You mentioned Jack the Ripper, is he taking body parts for some reason? Maybe the best clue is one that is not written, but to have one of the eleven die before the PCs get there, or be a more mundane incident that no one takes notice. And then just mail kidneys to the next victim. Or another organ that represents courage or prowess, like the heart, hands or eyes. No handwriting to trace.

Also, how did this guy hide the gear he bought? Magical gear can only be crafted by higher level casters and costs a pretty penny. How did he hide buying it, and where his money is going? If he has a family, wouldn't someone try to dig through records to figure out why they cannot buy a new dress for the gala?

In the rules of dueling witness can be and normally was a third party that was supposed to be neutral to the conflict being resolved, the witness would have been easily bought. You hit the nail on the head the noble is prideful so what is better then taking what should have been your biggest threat and trapping him in a body that isnt supposed to work anymore? What is worse is that because of the nobles standing and the standing of his friends any accusations the 'cripple' would make just sound like the broken ego of some one that bit of more then they could chew but cant handle the consequences of it.

I mentioned jack the ripper because if he has the time he will make them suffer and will make it rather messy but if he has to he can also be clean and precise, that was the only reason I mentioned jack the ripper.

Everything you just asked are what most refer to as clues, I left that as an open thing for the players to discover, the 'cripple' I dont think is going to have immediate family around at this point. Keep in mind he has been prepping for this for years....years...this wasnt like it all happened last week and he is now trying to get even, in the game this will have been years in the making for the 'cripple'.

I appreciate that you are trying to help man but again, you have pretty much just been trying to get me to change my mind or point out it is a bad idea with the whole cryptic message thing. I want to say this one more time, I am not asking if that is a good idea or not, I said this IS happening....I want it to be cool and cryptic since I want to run this on or near Halloween, but if I have to and cant get any help with making it more interesting I will literally just have 'twelve to go' written on a wall or something and when another one dies just move it down one 'eleven to go......ten to go...so on' I am asking for help to make that cool and interesting.