Druid Multiclass Help

[Nataris]

New player and poster here just looking for some advice.

I'm interested in creating a moon druid but with a small boost to casting and versatility. I'm not trying to min max here but slightly optimize.

My thoughts so far, Moon Druid 18 / Barbarian 1 / Wizard 1.

Short term goal Druid 2 / Barbarian 1 / Wizard 1.

What I was thinking is barbarian rage and unarmored defense helps me when going into beast mode. Wizard lvl we provides my druid with a few spells and cantrips such as Magic Missile, Sleep and Mage Hand. All of which I would think could be quite handy.

I'm trying to create my druid so I can be versatile in melee or ranged combat. Hanging back in the party launching spells like magic missile for damage while also being able to switch into a beast and rage into melee range.

If this doesn't work, any other ideas on how to add a bit of caster ability to a 18 druid? I do like the idea of barbarian rage while in a beast form and am just trying to add some casting to build.

Thanks for the help everyone!

[djreynolds]

I've been wrong in the past. But set right.

But I think the natural AC of the beast may not work with the barbarian's unarmored defense, I am unsure.

I'm told even in regard to dragon sorcerer's they cannot benefit from mage armor.

I'm unsure as well how a monk's unarmored defense would work and I'm leaning towards no.

You'll have to research that. Or perhaps forum members will be gracious enough to advise you and I.

But the barbarian may rage while in animal form and should benefit from resistance, though an animal may already have a form of that in some degree.

Hope this helps out,

[Mara]

It seems to me that two more levels of Druid will boost what you are looking for better than dips.

Moon Druid levels will advance your wildshape. Druid levels advance your casting and range options.

[Mrglee]

Unarmored defense should work with natural armor from beasts, but clear with your DM, because some people do feel the natural armor some beast get should stop UD from activating.
However, going Barb or Monk dip will make it so you want to be on the frontline more than most, though I argue just going Moon druid does that.

[Mara]

Unarmored defense should work with natural armor from beasts, but clear with your DM, because some people do feel the natural armor some beast get should stop UD from activating.
However, going Barb or Monk dip will make it so you want to be on the frontline more than most, though I argue just going Moon druid does that.

If Natural armor does not stop it, you would still choose either it or UD. At no point could you get both.

[hymer]

New player and poster here just looking for some advice.

I'm interested in creating a moon druid but with a small boost to casting and versatility. I'm not trying to min max here but slightly optimize.

My thoughts so far, Moon Druid 18 / Barbarian 1 / Wizard 1.

If you actually intend to play all the way to 20, this build will miss out on what is probably the most powerful capstone in the game. If you are going to play at 20, I heartily recommend you keep that in mind.


Short term goal Druid 2 / Barbarian 1 / Wizard 1.

What I was thinking is barbarian rage and unarmored defense helps me when going into beast mode. Wizard lvl we provides my druid with a few spells and cantrips such as Magic Missile, Sleep and Mage Hand. All of which I would think could be quite handy.

Dipping one level of wizard could be good in the short term. But you could also take the Magic Initiate feat for wizard, instead. That should give you most of what you seem to want, without holding back your spellcasting and wild shape advancement.


I'm trying to create my druid so I can be versatile in melee or ranged combat. Hanging back in the party launching spells like magic missile for damage while also being able to switch into a beast and rage into melee range.

A moon druid does these things naturally, although I'd focus on spells other than direct damage if I were you. Not that you can't throw in the occasional Blight, but as a Moon druid you need to be a little conservative with your spell slots, more so early on. If you want to deal damage, you can pick spells that do more for a spell slot, such as Heat Metal, Call Lightning or Sunbeam. But expect to be on the low end measured in damage per round in the party (this also goes for your wild shape after the early levels). You will likely be better off with summons, BC and debuffs when hanging back and casting.


If this doesn't work, any other ideas on how to add a bit of caster ability to a 18 druid? I do like the idea of barbarian rage while in a beast form and am just trying to add some casting to build.

All the multiclass stuff needs to be cleared with the DM. The rules aren't very clear on what wild shape retains (the key phrase being about what the animal is physically capable of doing). Can it rage, can it add its Con modifier to its AC?
As for adding a wizard level, you will certainly get some spells and cantrips added. But you would be holding back your access to the next level of spells and wild shape. Would you rather have Sleep or Conjure Woodland Beings, e.g.?
A high elf druid would be proficient in longbow, and can have the dex to use it. It also adds one of those cantrips you're looking for. The longbow with dex 16 should tide your over in ranged combat until level 5, when your third level spells kick in. You can get Magic Initiate at level 4.
A variant human can start with Magic Initiate, but is limited to sling and spell in ranged combat at the early levels.

Another thing worth considering is this: You must have 13 str and 13 int to multiclass as you suggest. You can do that, but the eighteen levels of druid have little to no use for 13 in str and int. You could run with an 8 in those two and still be mechanically fine.

[Flashy]

Wizard lvl we provides my druid with a few spells and cantrips such as Magic Missile, Sleep and Mage Hand. All of which I would think could be quite handy.

The problem is you won't be able to use those most of the time anyway since you can't cast in beast shape. It also delays the max level of druid spells you can prepare. With a barbarian 1 and wizard 1 dip you won't get 2nd level spells until 5th level (though you will be able to upcast 1st level spells into 2nd level slots once you have wizard 1 and druid 2). Going for more spellcasting variety isn't of tremendous use to a moon druid simply because your ideal combat status doesn't let you cast spells.

However, if you want a lot of the flavor and utility of an out of combat wizard Ritual Caster is a great feat that I'd totally recommend.

[Malifice]

Wizard level is dead. Don't bother. Also you'll need a Str, Wis and Int of 13 to MC all three.

A much better option is Ancients paladin 2. You can use your spell slots for both healing (as a moon druid) and for smiting (as a paladin) while in Beast form. You can also smite while raging (as a bear no less).

Seeing as you'll be spending most of your time in beast form, it's a total no brainer. All the tankiness of a moon druid and barbarian with the brutal DPR of a Paladin. You have a full 9th level casting class underneath your bear chassis too.

Fluff wise it fits perfectly too.

Moon Druid till 3rd. Get Brown bear online at 2nd and it remains perfectly valid for many levels. You want 3rd level for bark skin (cast before wild shaping). At 4th level dip barbarian for rage. Now you're rhe tankiest kid on the block and the envy of the fighters in the party. At 5th and 6th take paladin. Just as your bear damage is starting to be outpaced by the other martials, you leap frog them again.

I'd go back to Druid next for 8 levels to get more slots (to smite and heal) and better combat forms. Elemental forms come online at druid the end here.

Once your a Barb 1/ Pali 2/ Druid 11 I would personally dip 2 more of barbarian. Reckless Attack is fantastic when you don't care if you get hit or not, and gaining advantage with your smite attacks is a massive boon. Grab a totem at 3rd (wolf or bear are the best) to round it out.

I'd probably go back to Druid from there. Druid 15/ barb 3/ paladin 2.

For race it doesn't matter. ASIs aren't as important to you seeing as you're rarely in your meat form (bump mental stats). Pick up feats like alert and lucky you can use in beast form. I'd probably go a Ghostwise Halfling for the telepathy (it sucks not being able to speak in animal form). They also get plus 1 to wisdom and racial luck traits so why wouldn't you?

Also fits the fluff perfectly.

Dump strength to 13 (minimum to MC into Barb and Pali) dump dex to 8 (you're always in animal form so who cares). Dump Cha to 13 (again so you can enter paladin). Dump int to 8 (Ghostwise halflings arent renowned for brains). Pump Wis to 15 (16 after racial mods) and Con to 14.

It's fluffy, potent, versatile and deadly.

[hymer]

You can also smite while raging (as a bear no less).

Malifice's suggestions are good; this line, though, I'd say 'Ask your DM'. Know before you start what s/he'll allow for your wild shape.

[Malifice]

Malifice's suggestions are good; this line, though, I'd say 'Ask your DM'. Know before you start what s/he'll allow for your wild shape.

Any reason why it wouldn't be allowed? You're only prohibited from casting spells in wildshape. Expanding slots for other purposes (self healing as a Druid, blade singer damage reduction, paladin smites, sorcerers adding points to their sorcery pool etc) all totally ok in beast form.

[hymer]

Any reason why it wouldn't be allowed? You're only prohibited from casting spells in wildshape. Expanding slots for other purposes (self healing as a Druid, blade singer damage reduction, paladin smites, sorcerers adding points to their sorcery pool etc) all totally ok in beast form.

I'd rule it that way too. Here's the potential problem: "You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so." PHB p. 67.
An uncharitable reading would say that bears cannot smite - it is beyond their physique (as it is beyond human physique). That sentence is a prime reason there's no multiclass section in my druid handbook, because MC druids depend heavily on how the DM interprets the physical capability of various beasts and some elementals.

[Malifice]

I'd rule it that way too. Here's the potential problem: "You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so." PHB p. 67.
An uncharitable reading would say that bears cannot smite - it is beyond their physique (as it is beyond human physique). That sentence is a prime reason there's no multiclass section in my druid handbook, because MC druids depend heavily on how the DM interprets the physical capability of various beasts and some elementals.

Smiting is related to physique? It's radiant damage powered by a spell slot and your spiritual adherence to a vow.

That's an extremely narrow interpretation for mine.

[hymer]

Smiting is related to physique? It's radiant damage powered by a spell slot and your spiritual adherence to a vow.

That's an extremely narrow interpretation for mine.

As said, I agree with you. But the wording is there to interpret, and a DM already annoyed at a brown bear at level 2 is prone to be uncharitable towards the player. All the more so if they don't realize how much more reasonable wild shape gets down the line.

[Doof]

To be honest, multiclassing into a wizard for casting versatility will hurt a druid's casting versatility because you'll access new spell levels a level late. Add in that barbarian level, it's just bad.

I'd recommend Ritual Casting (Wizard) or magic initiate for some varied spell access, but never a full level commitment. Casting sleep/magic missle two or three times per day is not worth not being able to cast a new spell level once a day.

Barbarian for rage is also a bit iffy because the raw combat potential of a druid comes from his wildshaping, and your old forms DO NOT increase in power as you level. You'll always be on the lookout for the newest, shiniest form to assume, and delaying that by a level to get access to Rage might put you back much further than you'd like.

Trust me on this. Being stuck on a low-level form as a moon druid is TERRIBLE.

Moon Druid already suffers from low damage output per round after level 11 or so (about half the dedicated martial characters like full fighter/barbarian), and multiclassing WILL hurt.

Unless it is vital for your character concept to multiclass such a way, I cannot in good conscience tell you it's fine to multiclass druid into 1 level of barbarian and wizard each.


TL;DR: take the magic initiate or ritual caster (both wizard, because wizard spells are nice) for extra spell varities, and just roleplay being a raging berserker in battle. Druid just doesn't scale in power very well from somewhere around 9-12 (access to giant scorpion/ankylosaurus etc) to 18 (cast some spells while wildshaped), and the capstone- level 20 class feature makes you unkillable. Limitless hp, anyone?

[Malifice]

As said, I agree with you. But the wording is there to interpret, and a DM already annoyed at a brown bear at level 2 is prone to be uncharitable towards the player. All the more so if they don't realize how much more reasonable wild shape gets down the line.

Good point re the bear at 2nd. Crap that thing is OP to the point of overshadowing the party at low levels.

I houseruled it so druids retain HP when shaped but get temp HP = to Druid level x 3. They also may calculate AC by adding proff mod to the forms base AC, are proficient in the natural attacks of the form (so gain their own proff mod plus the beats stats) and replace the forms special Attack DCs with the druids spell save DC.

The forms now have a gradual increase across the levels rather than jarring OP bumps and the maths works out better.

I also nixed the Archdruid capstone. It now grants fire, lightning, thunder, acid and cold resistance and allows the Druid to Plane shift as an action to the elemental planes or the feywild once per short rest (instead of onion Druid).

[djreynolds]

Smiting tigers and bear, oh my!!!!! That is awesome. Just on awesomeness alone it is good. 11th level paladin/druid healing and smiting. Or an oath breaker with skeleton bears. Very cool

[Nataris]

Wow, thanks for all the replies so quickly!

I think what it really boils down to is that I would like at least 1 ranged magic spell that can actually cause some decent damage. I do understand that is a bit counter productive while a moon druid but I like that kind of combat versatility. I probably won't reach lvl 20 so not too concerned about the capstone.

Another idea someone suggested that I'm strongly considering now is 2 lvls in Warlock for Eldrich Blast and Agonizing. That would give me the ranged damage spell I'm looking for and I'm sure I can come up with a decent RD reason for it.

I do appreciate the help and know I'm being a bit stubborn hehe. Moon druid has versatility out the wazoo but doesn't seen to have a good ranged damage spell. Just for a fun build, I'd like to rectify that.

I know Eldrich scales with Charisma which is ok because I wouldn't mind a half decent charisma to help talk to and persuade animals. As part of the druid RP.

[Nataris]

Also, I'm ok with gimping a little bit of the moon druid since it's already a very very strong class. I plan to use moon a bit more sparingly as an "oh crap" situation. Then trying to exploit it's HP advantage. Which should also get me DM brownie points lmao.

[Mara]

Also, I'm ok with gimping a little bit of the moon druid since it's already a very very strong class. I plan to use moon a bit more sparingly as an "oh crap" situation. Then trying to exploit it's HP advantage. Which should also get me DM brownie points lmao.

Wildshape tones down very soon. You have good ranged options as a druid. Flying forms also help. You skip the normal form restrictions as a moon druid.

[numerek]

Good point re the bear at 2nd. Crap that thing is OP to the point of overshadowing the party at low levels.

I houseruled it so druids retain HP when shaped but get temp HP = to Druid level x 3. They also may calculate AC by adding proff mod to the forms base AC, are proficient in the natural attacks of the form (so gain their own proff mod plus the beats stats) and replace the forms special Attack DCs with the druids spell save DC.

The forms now have a gradual increase across the levels rather than jarring OP bumps and the maths works out better.

I also nixed the Archdruid capstone. It now grants fire, lightning, thunder, acid and cold resistance and allows the Druid to Plane shift as an action to the elemental planes or the feywild once per short rest (instead of onion Druid).

These rules would work great with my Giant Elk Barbarian (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?420494-Giant-Elk-Barbarian).

[NNescio]

Wow, thanks for all the replies so quickly!

I think what it really boils down to is that I would like at least 1 ranged magic spell that can actually cause some decent damage. I do understand that is a bit counter productive while a moon druid but I like that kind of combat versatility. I probably won't reach lvl 20 so not too concerned about the capstone.

Another idea someone suggested that I'm strongly considering now is 2 lvls in Warlock for Eldrich Blast and Agonizing. That would give me the ranged damage spell I'm looking for and I'm sure I can come up with a decent RD reason for it.

I do appreciate the help and know I'm being a bit stubborn hehe. Moon druid has versatility out the wazoo but doesn't seen to have a good ranged damage spell. Just for a fun build, I'd like to rectify that.

If Elemental Evil is on the table you can snag Frostbite, which has a range of 60 ft. Pitiful compared to Wiz/Sorc cantrips and EB, yes, but it does have a nifty rider effect ('though the debuff is weaker than Vicious Mockery and is unfortunately tied to a Con Save instead of Wis).

There's also Magic Stone, but it doesn't scale at all unless you have Extra Attack to hurl the additional stones. Might be a good option if you manage to get the DM to let you retrain cantrips later on.

Otherwise, your best options for longer ranges without resorting to spell slots is to either go Wood Elf for long bow proficiency (again, this doesn't scale since you don't get Extra Attack, but the Wood Elf is one of the best races for a Druid nonetheless), or Magic Initiate for attack cantrips. The latter approach does mean you're not basing your spell attack off your primary attribute (Wis) though, unless you pick Cleric for Sacred Flame (which only has a range of 60 ft).


I know Eldrich scales with Charisma which is ok because I wouldn't mind a half decent charisma to help talk to and persuade animals. As part of the druid RP.

Animal Handling is keyed off Wisdom though (unlike in 3.x). That said, talking to intelligent animals might involve Persuasion/Deception/Intimidate instead, but that usually doesn't come up often. Then again, as a Moon Druid, you generally can afford to tank your physical stats (and even Con to some degree, but that's still not a good idea).


Also, I'm ok with gimping a little bit of the moon druid since it's already a very very strong class. I plan to use moon a bit more sparingly as an "oh crap" situation. Then trying to exploit it's HP advantage. Which should also get me DM brownie points lmao.

Eh, not really, aside from levels 2~4. After that you're at the mercy of the DM for summons and wildshape forms. The main problem with Wildshape (aside from the restriction on spellcasting) is that your attack modifiers (and rider DCs) don't scale at all (aside from getting new forms), and the number of higher CR beasts are very, very scarce (seriously there's only one beast each for CR 4 and CR 6). Also, there are no flying forms above CR 1 (aside from the Air Elemental, but that requires you to blow two uses of wildshape).

By level 6, CR 1 combat forms are obsolete, since everyone else has either Extra attack or two dice for their attack cantrips, with higher to-hit to boot.

HP advantage doesn't mean a lot when the enemies are better off targeting your party members instead of you. The best way to leverage Wildshape forms is by using a concentration spell, especially via battlefield control. Those generally only last one combat, rendering your extended Wildshape duration moot.

Alternatively you can try summoning instead, and a Druid summoner can be exceptionally hard to hit if he's flying or burrowing, but you can't issue verbal commands effectively while wildshaped either (unless wildshaped into an elemental), and summons puts you at the mercy of the DM thanks to a certain !@!#$ Sage ruling.

[SharkForce]

at level 1-4, you're not far behind anyone if you just use cantrips or regular weapons (or as a moon druid, animal forms). by level 5, you should be able to mix and match moonbeam, spike growth, and call lightning or conjure animals (conjure animals only if your DM won't screw you) for more difficult encounters. level 7 adds wall of fire and conjure woodland beings (again, with the caveat that your DM could screw you over - based on your fears of using wild shape and your concern for generating brownie points, it is entirely possible that your DM hates effectiveness in characters) plus polymorph (turn into a giant ape if you want to keep ranged options open). level 9 doesn't add much except more spell slots as far as damage as concerned, but level 11 adds sunbeam.

these are essentially the core of your damage-dealing capabilities (when the situation calls for damage dealing as opposed to the control spells which you are also very good at). access to elemental evil spells may add a few more options, but basically, you're focusing too much on a perceived lack of nukes. you have perfectly good damage options as a single-classed druid.

[Belac93]

Just stay as a moon druid. If you play to level 20, you will want that capstone. If that doesn't dissuade you, then still, don't take the wizard level. If you must, take magic initiate.

[NNescio]

Just stay as a moon druid. If you play to level 20, you will want that capstone. If that doesn't dissuade you, then still, don't take the wizard level. If you must, take magic initiate.

Oh, and I forgot to mention this, but Magic Initiate: Wizard or Sorcerer is attractive for the tasty, tasty Mage Armor. Far better than Barkskin, really, even if you can only use it 1/day, since it doesn't use up your concentration.

[Flashy]

Wow, thanks for all the replies so quickly!

I think what it really boils down to is that I would like at least 1 ranged magic spell that can actually cause some decent damage. I do understand that is a bit counter productive while a moon druid but I like that kind of combat versatility. I probably won't reach lvl 20 so not too concerned about the capstone.

Heat Metal, Moonbeam and Call Lightning are all excellent damage spells on the Druid spell list, AND all interact nicely with the wildshape since you can continue to concentrate on them while you are in beast form. They don't really have any 1st level damage spells, but as long as you're willing to stick it out until Druid 3 you'll have some of the finest sustained damage spells in the game.

If you're really adamant about having a first level damage spell however I'd recommend dropping that wizard dip for either Magic Initiate: Cleric or one level of Cleric. Guiding Bolt is a first level Cleric spell that does 4d6 radiant damage (one of the best damage types available) and on a hit the next attack against the target has advantage. You don't have to worry about your int score and if you're dead set on a dip the tempest, war or life low level abilities potentially interact really well with a Druid instead of lying around mostly useless like Arcane Recovery. Ask your DM if you can use War Priest or Wrath of the Storm while you're in wild shape, or if Disciple of Life applies to the spell slots you use to heal yourself.

[NNescio]

Heat Metal, Moonbeam and Call Lightning are all excellent damage spells on the Druid spell list, AND all interact nicely with the wildshape since you can continue to concentrate on them while you are in beast form. They don't really have any 1st level damage spells, but as long as you're willing to stick it out until Druid 3 you'll have some of the finest sustained damage spells in the game.

Well, there's FUS ROH DAH Thunderwave, and if EE is on the table, the Druid also gets Earth Tremor and Ice Knife.

'though yeah, sustained damage only starts to kick in with second level spells and above.

[SharkForce]

Well, there's FUS ROH DAH Thunderwave, and if EE is on the table, the Druid also gets Earth Tremor and Ice Knife.

'though yeah, sustained damage only starts to kick in with second level spells and above.

but at first and second level if you're using a sling or throwing a javelin or hitting people with a shillelagh, you're probably not far behind anyone else in damage anyways. and this generally holds true until 4th (if primary damage-dealers take feats) or 5th (if they don't).

and for that matter as a moon druid, he's got nothing to worry about from a damage perspective before 5th level anyways, because he has that giant spike in power from levels 2-4.

[spartan_ah]

take 2 levels of moon druid, rhen 1 level of monk...
it wirks this way, either natural armor. or 10+dex+wis...

http://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/01/14/druid-monk-unarmored-defense-in-shapeshift-form/

if you'll check, you'll see that natural armor doesnt add a lot. you'd be better off with monk AC and way more tankier this way. take the rest as a moon druid.
capstone is overrated.. at this point no one actually plays a lot... how many gods can you kill?

[Doof]

Also, I'm ok with gimping a little bit of the moon druid since it's already a very very strong class. I plan to use moon a bit more sparingly as an "oh crap" situation. Then trying to exploit it's HP advantage. Which should also get me DM brownie points lmao.

Well, here's the thing... moon druid is not a very very strong class after everyone else get their extra attack. It barely keeps up until somewhere around level 9-12, then it falls off miserably.

Wildshape does not scale well at all into mid-level and don't hold any fantasy that it will be good in combat once the novelty of getting multiple attacks per action wears off.

Getting 'free' hp might sounds like an exploitable advantage on paper, but when everyone can hit you on a roll of 2-3 you really do end up using most of it if not all.

[Malifice]

Well, here's the thing... moon druid is not a very very strong class after everyone else get their extra attack. It barely keeps up until somewhere around level 9-12, then it falls off miserably.

Wildshape does not scale well at all into mid-level and don't hold any fantasy that it will be good in combat once the novelty of getting multiple attacks per action wears off.

Getting 'free' hp might sounds like an exploitable advantage on paper, but when everyone can hit you on a roll of 2-3 you really do end up using most of it if not all.

2 levels of paladin counters that nicely by adding a smite option to your natural attacks.

Re the monk option above, barbarian version of unarmed defence is strictly better. Most forms have a Con in the 20 mark, adding rage to the mix is added gravy (and thematically nice too).

[spartan_ah]

2 levels of paladin counters that nicely by adding a smite option to your natural attacks.

Re the monk option above, barbarian version of unarmed defence is strictly better. Most forms have a Con in the 20 mark, adding rage to the mix is added gravy (and thematically nice too).

who on earth has 20 con? earth elementa, mammouth, and giant shark. that's it!

[Malifice]

who on earth has 20 con? earth elementa, mammouth, and giant shark. that's it!

Brown bear is 16. Online at 2nd. Apes can use shields too.

Add in the d12 hit dice, rage bonus damage and half damage from melee attacks. Add another level for reckless attack (if you get hit back, it's not your HP so who cares - plus as a moon Druid you WANT to be attacked) and then a third level for an extra rage per day, and either a totem or frenzy (the bonus attack works with multi attack).

You also get CON save proficiency which is gravy.

Splash 2 of Paladin for smite with your (unacessable for spell casting in beast form) spell slots.

Paladin 2/ Barbarian 3/ Druid 6 in cave bear form gets 42 HP twice per short rest an AC of 16 (barkskin), takes half damage (rage) and deals 2d6+7 and 1d8+7 damage with multi attack (and can lay a smite down for an extra 2-5d8 on his attacks.

I'd you're playing the long game, go a Frenzy barb. Elemental forms are immune to Exhaustion AND are already resistant to a ton of damage.

This grants a Barb 3/ Druid 10 AC17, 126 free HP per short rest (half damage) some scary resistances and 3 slam attacks per round dealing 2d8+7 damage. Dip 2 paladin and you also gain smite (feel free to add an extra 2-5d8 onto each of those slams).

21d8+21 per round (at advantage) is pretty scary.

[Person_Man]

Have you considered strait Land Druid?

The Druid spell list is awesome. (People have listed off plenty of cool Druid spell options, and I would peruse this list (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?371892-List-of-Useful-and-Powerful-Spells) if you want more ideas). And it gets even more awesome when you can renew them and add more spells to your list with the Land abilities. And then if you run out of spells (which happens very rarely for a Land Druid, even if you're using some in every combat), you can fall back on your still useful Wildshape forms.

Any short term benefit you might gain from Wildshape typically nerfs your spells/Wildshape in the long run. And unlike 1E/2E/3.X/PF, 5E doesn't really need multi-class builds to play well.

[SharkForce]

Well, here's the thing... moon druid is not a very very strong class after everyone else get their extra attack. It barely keeps up until somewhere around level 9-12, then it falls off miserably.

Wildshape does not scale well at all into mid-level and don't hold any fantasy that it will be good in combat once the novelty of getting multiple attacks per action wears off.

Getting 'free' hp might sounds like an exploitable advantage on paper, but when everyone can hit you on a roll of 2-3 you really do end up using most of it if not all.

moon druid is fine. you just have to remember that you are a DRUID who happens to be moon circle, rather than a pure-classed shapeshifter.

yes, moon druid will underperform if they only use their animal forms. all casters underperform when they don't use spell slots. if they didn't underperform when they don't use their only major class ability, that would be extremely worrying.

[Malifice]

moon druid is fine. you just have to remember that you are a DRUID who happens to be moon circle, rather than a pure-classed shapeshifter.

yes, moon druid will underperform if they only use their animal forms. all casters underperform when they don't use spell slots. if they didn't underperform when they don't use their only major class ability, that would be extremely worrying.

The base Druid spell list isnt the best man. Compared to Wizard or Cleric. Its below that of a Bard.

Moon Druids are expected to stay in Beast form for most encounters and primarily tank it.

[SharkForce]

The base Druid spell list isnt the best man. Compared to Wizard or Cleric. Its below that of a Bard.

Moon Druids are expected to stay in Beast form for most encounters and primarily tank it.

it isn't the best, no. but it *is* very good. easily good enough to contribute substantially to any party.

[spartan_ah]

Brown bear is 16. Online at 2nd. Apes can use shields too.

Add in the d12 hit dice, rage bonus damage and half damage from melee attacks. Add another level for reckless attack (if you get hit back, it's not your HP so who cares - plus as a moon Druid you WANT to be attacked) and then a third level for an extra rage per day, and either a totem or frenzy (the bonus attack works with multi attack).

You also get CON save proficiency which is gravy.

Splash 2 of Paladin for smite with your (unacessable for spell casting in beast form) spell slots.

Paladin 2/ Barbarian 3/ Druid 6 in cave bear form gets 42 HP twice per short rest an AC of 16 (barkskin), takes half damage (rage) and deals 2d6+7 and 1d8+7 damage with multi attack (and can lay a smite down for an extra 2-5d8 on his attacks.

I'd you're playing the long game, go a Frenzy barb. Elemental forms are immune to Exhaustion AND are already resistant to a ton of damage.

This grants a Barb 3/ Druid 10 AC17, 126 free HP per short rest (half damage) some scary resistances and 3 slam attacks per round dealing 2d8+7 damage. Dip 2 paladin and you also gain smite (feel free to add an extra 2-5d8 onto each of those slams).

21d8+21 per round (at advantage) is pretty scary.
it's all rainbow and sunshine, until you add 13 STR or 13 CHA... now calculate you stats and tell how bellow are you? this is MADness
plus you can't concentrate while raging so drop barkskin... barb 3 druid 10 will get you mere 2 ASI which will leave you well behind all other classes and will leave you with a bad spell DC, spell attack while you assume simple nova you are well behind as a spell caster and your role as a druid.
a simple 1 level dip in monk will leave you way ahead with AC and will keep your ASI for WIS, resilient and war caster.

[Cakesnizzles]

Dude, eveytime the druid changes form, he get healed. You'll be able to be much more effective full druid.

[Malifice]

it's all rainbow and sunshine, until you add 13 STR or 13 CHA... now calculate you stats and tell how bellow are you? this is MADness
plus you can't concentrate while raging so drop barkskin... barb 3 druid 10 will get you mere 2 ASI which will leave you well behind all other classes and will leave you with a bad spell DC, spell attack while you assume simple nova you are well behind as a spell caster and your role as a druid.
a simple 1 level dip in monk will leave you way ahead with AC and will keep your ASI for WIS, resilient and war caster.

V human.

Str 14
Dex 8
Con 13 (14)
Int 9
Wis 14 (16)
Cha 14

Alert feat.

[hymer]

Dude, eveytime the druid changes form, he get healed. You'll be able to be much more effective full druid.

How do you figure that?

[tieren]

Have you considered strait Land Druid?

The Druid spell list is awesome. (People have listed off plenty of cool Druid spell options, and I would peruse this list (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?371892-List-of-Useful-and-Powerful-Spells) if you want more ideas). And it gets even more awesome when you can renew them and add more spells to your list with the Land abilities. And then if you run out of spells (which happens very rarely for a Land Druid, even if you're using some in every combat), you can fall back on your still useful Wildshape forms.

Any short term benefit you might gain from Wildshape typically nerfs your spells/Wildshape in the long run. And unlike 1E/2E/3.X/PF, 5E doesn't really need multi-class builds to play well.

I agree with this sentiment.

I am working on a ranger/rogue/druid multiclass which is focused as an archer. As a land druid I can get haste and invisibility, I am going to go Arcane Trickster with the rogue levels (which I mostly wanted for sneak attack but like the magic for flavor). The end result should be a pretty interesting magical woodland archer. My main use of wildshape will be for scouting or getting into advantageous firing positions (or escapes).

[Cakesnizzles]

@hymer

They take the HP of the animal form and their normal HP is not affected. Switching back and forth between animal forms is basically healing. (with the wis base healing effect)