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ThirdProgenitor
2015-10-27, 03:04 AM
There's been a lot of talk of a new warlock patron in sword coast but I haven't been able to find information on it anywhere.
Would anyone be able to post to a link or explain what it is/does?

Santra
2015-10-27, 03:53 AM
Patron: The undying
You serve someone who has transcended beyond mortality and learned the finer points of undeath. From the realms the examples are Larloch (the ultralich with 50 titles), and Gilgeam.

Expanded spells
Really bad

Among the dead
You learn spare the dying and have advantage on saving throws against disease. You also have a sanctuary-like effect against undead.

Defy death
Once a long rest you can heal 1d8+your con mod when you succeed on a death saving throw or use spare the dying.

Undying Nature
you can hold your breath forever and don't need food water or sleep though you still need rests. You also age 1 years for every 10 years you live through.

Indestructible life
Once a short rest you can use a bonus action to regain 1d8+warlock level. If you have a severed body part you can put it back into place and it will reattach.

All in all it has a pretty cool flavor but is mediocre. The spell list is quite bad which is the most depressing part.

Yorrin
2015-10-27, 08:58 AM
All in all it has a pretty cool flavor but is mediocre.

So much this. I wish that the abilities weren't rest-gated. If you could Use Defy Death or Indestructible Life at-will this would be a beast of a pact. As is it's just... meh.

Tanarii
2015-10-27, 09:14 AM
My first thought on reading it was weak. Very very weak. And abilities you never or rarely use don't add to flavor. It's so weak that it effectively rips out the flavor of the warlock otherworldly patron feature and replaces it with nothing.

One thing it'd be great for is re skinning as a Patronless generic Warlock, basically ignoring the Patron feature to depend on everything else. And everything else for a Warlock is a lot: cantrips, core warlock spells, pact boon, and eldritch invocations. If you want to acknowledge what little flavor it gives with Undying Nature at level 10, you're a sage pursuing everylasting life, and effectively your own patron.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 02:20 PM
It gets Silence, Blindness/Deafness, and Contagion but that's about it for exciting stuff. Still I love the flavor behind it.

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 02:23 PM
So much this. I wish that the abilities weren't rest-gated. If you could Use Defy Death or Indestructible Life at-will this would be a beast of a pact. As is it's just... meh.

Defy death at short rest is weird. Save one teammate from going into death saves per rest. Kinda pointless.

Though the last ability intrigues me. Let's say you had your head cut off, would you come back to life if someone reattached it?

DracoKnight
2015-10-27, 02:40 PM
Though the last ability intrigues me. Let's say you had your head cut off, would you come back to life if someone reattached it?

You are Deadpool.

Corran
2015-10-27, 02:47 PM
Yeah, it seems pretty weak, though I quite like some of the flavour it offers. Would anyone mind to list the expanded spells? If there is animate dead in it, then this pact is a go go for my current character, at least thematically.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 02:53 PM
Defy death at short rest is weird. Save one teammate from going into death saves per rest. Kinda pointless.

Though the last ability intrigues me. Let's say you had your head cut off, would you come back to life if someone reattached it?



You are Urza the planeswalker. All you need now are gems for eyes.

Santra
2015-10-27, 02:53 PM
Yeah, it seems pretty weak, though I quite like some of the flavour it offers. Would anyone mind to list the expanded spells? If there is animate dead in it, then this pact is a go go for my current character, at least thematically.

Sorry no animate dead.

1st- False life, ray of sickness
2nd- blindness/deafness, silence
3rd- feign death, speak with dead
4th- aura of life, death ward
5th- contagion, legend lore

WickerNipple
2015-10-27, 02:55 PM
Yeah, it seems pretty weak, though I quite like some of the flavour it offers. Would anyone mind to list the expanded spells? If there is animate dead in it, then this pact is a go go for my current character, at least thematically.

Heh there is no way Warlocks are getting Animate Dead on a short rest timer.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 02:59 PM
Yeah, it seems pretty weak, though I quite like some of the flavour it offers. Would anyone mind to list the expanded spells? If there is animate dead in it, then this pact is a go go for my current character, at least thematically.



Unfortunately not, but there's no reason you can't convince your DM to exchange those out. I know that there is a snippet on an Enworld post of the expanded spell list so I'll post the list below:

Spell Level Spells
1st False Life, Ray of Sickness
2nd Blindness/Deafness, Silence
3rd Feign Death, Speak with Dead
4th Aura of Life, Death Ward
5th Contagion, Legend Lore



The list is a lot more Death Domain Cleric rather than Necromancer Wizard. More "I preserve when all else crumbles around me" than "I raise the fallen around me", which is cool in theory. But with at least two of the spells being either Invocations or an ability of another pact, and more of the spells aren't exactly Greater Invisibility or Fireball it's ends up disappointing.

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 03:00 PM
Sorry no animate dead.

1st- False life, ray of sickness
2nd- blindness/deafness, silence
3rd- feign death, speak with dead
4th- aura of life, death ward
5th- contagion, legend lore

Why Legend Lore is on that spell list I will never know.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 03:02 PM
Heh there is no way Warlocks are getting Animate Dead on a short rest timer.



If my math is Right, a Level 3 Warlock could create 192 Zombies or Skeletons within a 24 hour period. It then has to spend 20 minutes of every hour after that retaining control over 8 of those but still. You won't get a lot done because you have to keep on resting to get that back and when the rest is done you have to recast it again.


The best I could see this for is having the Undead either Guard something or lay Siege to someplace, but you'd have to be with them at all times for this to happen.

WickerNipple
2015-10-27, 03:05 PM
If my math is Right, a Level 3 Warlock could create 192 Zombies or Skeletons within a 24 hour period.

It's a lvl 3 spell, so the number a lvl 3 warlock could produce is 0. But give the poor newb a few levels and that number would go up fast. :smallbiggrin:

Fortunately, not an issue. They didn't seem to care much about class balance in this splat, but they did avoid that one.

deathbymanga
2015-10-27, 03:09 PM
you know what I'd really want? a Living Patron. Like, say there's a super powerful giant, he bequeaths power to those who serve him. Maybe make this a super beefy Warlock Archetype, with the Enlarge spell as one of their Pact spells.

WickerNipple
2015-10-27, 03:10 PM
you know what I'd really want? a Living Patron. Like, say there's a super powerful giant, he bequeaths power to those who serve him. Maybe make this a super beefy Warlock Archetype, with the Enlarge spell as one of their Pact spells.

Requires Concentration, strictly less damage than Hex. Why bother?

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 03:18 PM
It's a lvl 3 spell, so the number a lvl 3 warlock could produce is 0. But give the poor newb a few levels and that number would go up fast. :smallbiggrin:

Fortunately, not an issue. They didn't seem to care much about class balance in this splat, but they did avoid that one.


:smallwink: Okay, point number one: Touché

Point number 2: I feel like if they didn't care about balance the Stormborn Origin Sorcerer would have kept its extra spell list. Maybe they should have tested a few more things in the book but that's different than apathy. That's a whole other issue altogether and I don't want to derail the thread.

Point number 3: an Invocation for *Animate Dead* that recharges on a Long Rest seems like a decent way to summon the dead and not get it broken.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 03:23 PM
Why Legend Lore is on that spell list I will never know.

It's a lot more "Stand the Test of Time" Undeath rather than "Unearth the Fallen" Undeath as the Theme. You get it because you have and will outlive everything so you know it. I think it's cool flavor wise but mechanic wise its a little lacking. The whole pact takes on a more "You are a Scholarly Adventurer" rather than "You are a Sword Fighting Adventurer"

Corran
2015-10-27, 03:24 PM
Point number 3: an Invocation for *Animate Dead* that recharges on a Long Rest seems like a decent way to summon the dead and not get it broken. Yes, that seems like a very nice idea. Though would you say that this invocation should have the undying pact as a prerequisite, or not?

WickerNipple
2015-10-27, 03:26 PM
Point number 2: I feel like if they didn't care about balance the Stormborn Origin Sorcerer would have kept its extra spell list. Maybe they should have tested a few more things in the book but that's different than apathy. That's a whole other issue altogether and I don't want to derail the thread.


I don't really think it was a decision so much about balance as it was about backlash. Apparently a lot of people freaked out about the bonus spells in other online formats. Around here from what I read most people seemed to like it. I hate the flavor of both the PHB options so I'd likely do storm anyway, but I lost all mechanical interest when that was cut.


Point number 3: an Invocation for *Animate Dead* that recharges on a Long Rest seems like a decent way to summon the dead and not get it broken.

I would be totally fine with an Invocation option for animate dead w/ a lvl 5 prereq. It's a cool idea, probably a little underpowered but flavorful and fun.


Yes, that seems like a very nice idea. Though would you say that this invocation should have the undying pact as a prerequisite, or not?

I don't see why it would have to be.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 03:33 PM
Yes, that seems like a very nice idea. Though would you say that this invocation should have the undying pact as a prerequisite, or not?



Thematically, it makes sense.

Mechanically there is no invocation you cannot chose if you had a Fiend patron rather than a Ghost in the Machine patron.

Plus there's nothing saying a Fairy can't raise you from death to torment or use you some more. An Elder Being could view Death as nothing more than breathing and could undo it. Demons and Devils care about the soul so who cares about the body when you can't use it for much more than a zombie or skeleton. Then you have GLaDOS like beings who could easily find ways to use subjects that feel no pain and can complete simple tasks.


So no. I do not see the need to make it a prerequisite. I DO see the need to make it Recharge on a Long Rest and/or Make it use up a spell slot to prevent the level 5 warlock from walking over every minor town and hamlet in her/his path.

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 03:36 PM
It's a lot more "Stand the Test of Time" Undeath rather than "Unearth the Fallen" Undeath as the Theme. You get it because you have and will outlive everything so you know it. I think it's cool flavor wise but mechanic wise its a little lacking. The whole pact takes on a more "You are a Scholarly Adventurer" rather than "You are a Sword Fighting Adventurer"

I did notice it was less malicious undeath. That's what attracted me towards it. It's all very limited compared to the other patrons though.

Plus side is pseudo-immortality, but that's rarely a concern in games.

WickerNipple
2015-10-27, 03:40 PM
So no. I do not see the need to make it a prerequisite. I DO see the need to make it Recharge on a Long Rest and/or Make it use up a spell slot to prevent the level 5 warlock from walking over every minor town and hamlet in her/his path.

If it's an invocation with a long rest attached you're not going to get enough casts to run over anything at lvl 5. All you're going to get out of this is a handful of cr1/4 buddies.

WickerNipple
2015-10-27, 03:43 PM
I did notice it was less malicious undeath. That's what attracted me towards it. It's all very limited compared to the other patrons though.

Plus side is pseudo-immortality, but that's rarely a concern in games.

It's actually a great concept for a character. Much more nuanced than I'd expect from a 'death warlock'. They good points for concept, but the execution is pretty awful. I'd work with a player to make it better if someone wanted it for a game of mine.

But no: you can't have Animate Dead on your bonus list. :smallbiggrin:

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 04:07 PM
You are Deadpool.

You are Urza the planeswalker. All you need now are gems for eyes.

Both good. Really it's hard to decide between them.


It's actually a great concept for a character. Much more nuanced than I'd expect from a 'death warlock'. They good points for concept, but the execution is pretty awful. I'd work with a player to make it better if someone wanted it for a game of mine.

But no: you can't have Animate Dead on your bonus list. :smallbiggrin:

I'm actually building around the concept for a new character. Half-orc bladelock, mixing in a little Baron Samedi (Skull face motif whenever he uses an armor based spell) and a seasonal theme focusing on Autumn. Death is natural and it is the will of his Patron that deviations from the cycle be removed. The dead should not walk the land of the living.

Biggest downside is justifying why his warlock followers (I'm thinking he's a feyish lord of an Autumn Court. Conceptually looks like Baraggan's hollow form from bleach except with a beard made of dead leaves, antlers growing out of his skull, and a tree motif in his clothes) are technically becoming undead. I guess it's meant to sacrifice themselves from the cycle in order to fix it.

I've even thought about other courts and subclasses that can work with them! Sun Soul for the summer court!

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 04:25 PM
Both good. Really it's hard to decide between them.

I'm actually building around the concept for a new character. Half-orc bladelock, mixing in a little Baron Samedi (Skull face motif whenever he uses an armor based spell) and a seasonal theme focusing on Autumn. Death is natural and it is the will of his Patron that deviations from the cycle be removed. The dead should not walk the land of the living.

Biggest downside is justifying why his warlock followers (I'm thinking he's a feyish lord of an Autumn Court. Conceptually looks like Baraggan's hollow form from bleach except with a beard made of dead leaves, antlers growing out of his skull, and a tree motif in his clothes) are technically becoming undead. I guess it's meant to sacrifice themselves from the cycle in order to fix it.



They aren't becoming undead as they don't really gain the Undead type. Think of it as the Oath of the Ancient's ability to grant a similar pseudo-immortality to it's Paladins; Why should a guardian of Nature which changes, dies and is reborn, stay consistently young and unable to die from natural causes too? Because it is a reward and allows them to continue their service.

Why should the thing you are trying to keep in order prevent you from keeping said order?

Flashy
2015-10-27, 04:38 PM
But no: you can't have Animate Dead on your bonus list. :smallbiggrin:

I'm playing a Warlock with a necromancy bent in a campaign, and the DM granted me a custom invocation I think could be appropriate to this kind of situation.

Necromantic Tutelage
Prerequisite: 7th Level
You can cast Animate Dead as a third level spell without using a spell slot. You can't do so again until you finish a long rest.

deathbymanga
2015-10-27, 04:52 PM
I'm playing a Warlock with a necromancy bent in a campaign, and the DM granted me a custom invocation I think could be appropriate to this kind of situation.

Necromantic Tutelage
Prerequisite: 7th Level
You can cast Animate Dead as a third level spell without using a spell slot. You can't do so again until you finish a long rest.

that's like one of the best instances of an Invocation, since you're only going to be casting Animate Dead once a day anyway

Flashy
2015-10-27, 04:58 PM
that's like one of the best instances of an Invocation, since you're only going to be casting Animate Dead once a day anyway

The idea is that the warlock would just short rest the slot back into the mix anyway, so it skips over the necessity.

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 05:37 PM
They aren't becoming undead as they don't really gain the Undead type. Think of it as the Oath of the Ancient's ability to grant a similar pseudo-immortality to it's Paladins; Why should a guardian of Nature which changes, dies and is reborn, stay consistently young and unable to die from natural causes too? Because it is a reward and allows them to continue their service.

Why should the thing you are trying to keep in order prevent you from keeping said order?

Feels a bit hypocritical in my mind is all.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 05:46 PM
Feels a bit hypocritical in my mind is all.

So is the Pathfinder Inquisitor or Matt Mercer's Witch Hunter Class. Using things that aren't always kosher with everyone who hold a certain set of beliefs but they guard against dark forces by using small parts of them. It's almost the nature of the 5e Warlock to be not entirely clear and instead straddle the line of what you fight and what you are.

FatherLiir
2015-10-27, 06:42 PM
Plus you aren't Undead; you are beyond Death with this Patron. It cannot touch you.

JellyPooga
2015-10-27, 07:27 PM
To those peeps saying the expanded spell list is lacklustre; I have to respectfully disagree!

OK, so the 1st and 3rd level offerings are bland, I agree and 5th isn't much to write home about...but 2nd and 4th has some pure gold.

Silence is an astonishingly useful spell; I don't think I need to explain why.

Death Ward. DEATH frickin' WARD. On a Warlock. The non-concentration, 8 hour duration, target: touch Death Ward that gives you a one-shot flat immunity to dying from practically any single effect? The one you could happily spam cast on yourself and all your friends before going anywhere or doing anything, making your party practically invincible on the condition that you can spare a couple of hours every morning? I've mapped out some convoluted multiclassed Warlock builds just to get this spell known for use with Pact Magic and now they've decided to hand it out as a single class Warlock? Thank you very much WoTC. I'm very happy to have the option of being a functionally immortal Bladelock from level 7 onward.

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 09:57 PM
Plus you aren't Undead; you are beyond Death with this Patron. It cannot touch you.

That's a good point.

Atalas
2015-10-27, 10:40 PM
I did notice it was less malicious undeath. That's what attracted me towards it. It's all very limited compared to the other patrons though.

Plus side is pseudo-immortality, but that's rarely a concern in games.

if you start off at a high level campaign and have it, if you're an elf or dwarf you could say that you are very, VERY old. Or even just be a human and have been there through most of your elven and dwarven friends' lives.

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 11:17 PM
if you start off at a high level campaign and have it, if you're an elf or dwarf you could say that you are very, VERY old. Or even just be a human and have been there through most of your elven and dwarven friends' lives.

Elf druids and monks can no longer say they are the oldest living player race combos!

MaxWilson
2015-10-27, 11:38 PM
To those peeps saying the expanded spell list is lacklustre; I have to respectfully disagree!

OK, so the 1st and 3rd level offerings are bland, I agree and 5th isn't much to write home about...but 2nd and 4th has some pure gold.

Silence is an astonishingly useful spell; I don't think I need to explain why.

Death Ward. DEATH frickin' WARD. On a Warlock. The non-concentration, 8 hour duration, target: touch Death Ward that gives you a one-shot flat immunity to dying from practically any single effect? The one you could happily spam cast on yourself and all your friends before going anywhere or doing anything, making your party practically invincible on the condition that you can spare a couple of hours every morning? I've mapped out some convoluted multiclassed Warlock builds just to get this spell known for use with Pact Magic and now they've decided to hand it out as a single class Warlock? Thank you very much WoTC. I'm very happy to have the option of being a functionally immortal Bladelock from level 7 onward.

That's a good point about the value of Death Ward--it is a generally underrated spell and always a tempting target for Magical Secrets and an excellent use of spell points. "Functionally immortal" is overstating it quite a bit though. You're still left with only one HP, and probably deeply in trouble if something just depleted all your HP. There's a good chance you're about to be finished off by a second monster, or a second attack from the same monster, or an opportunity attack when you try to flee. Put it this way: if short-rest Death Ward is functional immortality, then the 7th level Regenerate is immortality on steroids, since you regain 1 HP at the start of every single turn for an hour. In practice there are plenty of things that can kill you despite Regenerate, and those things will kill you despite Death Ward too.

Nevertheless, it is a pretty cool spell to have on a warlock spell list. Thanks for pointing that out.

I wouldn't mind hearing you expound on Silence. It's the spell my Shadow Monk appreciates the least, out of the spells which she has. Has some obvious anti-spellcaster utility and a secondary function preventing reinforcements from getting summoned in a door-kicking scenario, but the fact that it's immobile kills most of the other uses I can think of for it. What am I overlooking?


Elf druids and monks can no longer say they are the oldest living player race combos!

Does a wizard with Clone count? Or does the Nth body count as a separate "living being" than the wizard's original body?

Reincarnate works too.

Ralanr
2015-10-27, 11:43 PM
That's a good point about the value of Death Ward--it is a generally underrated spell and always a tempting target for Magical Secrets and an excellent use of spell points. "Functionally immortal" is overstating it quite a bit though. You're still left with only one HP, and probably deeply in trouble if something just depleted all your HP. There's a good chance you're about to be finished off by a second monster, or a second attack from the same monster, or an opportunity attack when you try to flee. Put it this way: if short-rest Death Ward is functional immortality, then the 7th level Regenerate is immortality on steroids, since you regain 1 HP at the start of every single turn for an hour. In practice there are plenty of things that can kill you despite Regenerate, and those things will kill you despite Death Ward too.

Nevertheless, it is a pretty cool spell to have on a warlock spell list. Thanks for pointing that out.

I wouldn't mind hearing you expound on Silence. It's the spell my Shadow Monk appreciates the least, out of the spells which she has. Has some obvious anti-spellcaster utility and a secondary function preventing reinforcements from getting summoned in a door-kicking scenario, but the fact that it's immobile kills most of the other uses I can think of for it. What am I overlooking?

Does it work like Darkness where you can cast it on an item? If so, cast silence on throwing knives and BOOM, instant ranged silence zones.

That's some ninja stuff right there.

MaxWilson
2015-10-27, 11:45 PM
Does it work like Darkness where you can cast it on an item? If so, cast silence on throwing knives and BOOM, instant ranged silence zones.

That's some ninja stuff right there.

Unfortunately, no it doesn't.

Ralanr
2015-10-28, 12:15 AM
Unfortunately, no it doesn't.

Lame.

Doesn't even scale with slot level. I really dislike those spells for warlock. Useful sure, but warlocks have automatic scaling slots for a reason.

Maxilian
2015-10-28, 11:53 AM
It's actually a great concept for a character. Much more nuanced than I'd expect from a 'death warlock'. They good points for concept, but the execution is pretty awful. I'd work with a player to make it better if someone wanted it for a game of mine.

But no: you can't have Animate Dead on your bonus list. :smallbiggrin:

Actually... i love the concept of it, i'm working on a character for that (a more tanky warlock, maybe take 1 lvl in Fighter for medium armor and shield or take the AM feat and go with EB), the concept its more for a Witch Doctor (I have been thinking about this concept for a Warlock and when i saw this archetype, it was just gold for me, its true its not that good as others but the flavor and concept of it is soooo GOOD!)

Ralanr
2015-10-28, 12:00 PM
Actually... i love the concept of it, i'm working on a character for that (a more tanky warlock, maybe take 1 lvl in Fighter for medium armor and shield or take the AM feat and go with EB), the concept its more for a Witch Doctor (I have been thinking about this concept for a Warlock and when i saw this archetype, it was just gold for me, its true its not that good as others but the flavor and concept of it is soooo GOOD!)

Damn right it is! I can't get the idea out of my head!

http://img03.deviantart.net/5347/i/2013/031/3/b/baron_samedi_by_chronoperates-d5tdnpu.jpg

Maxilian
2015-10-28, 12:19 PM
Damn right it is! I can't get the idea out of my head!

http://img03.deviantart.net/5347/i/2013/031/3/b/baron_samedi_by_chronoperates-d5tdnpu.jpg

No idea who this guy is (Looks like i have some reading to do)

But... the idea of a Witch Doctor chapter came to me when i saw the Whisper of the Grave invocation (SOOO Flavorful!)


https://38.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcrgagGlts1qem9g8o1_500.gif

The Whisper of the Grave will let me go around with a group of shrunken heads!!

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-78WwJwkx1ro/VB3WyffTy0I/AAAAAAAALmY/NoEQDaf9eh4/s1600/princessfrogvoodoo.jpg

Ralanr
2015-10-28, 12:26 PM
No idea who this guy is (Looks like i have some reading to do)

But... the idea of a Witch Doctor chapter came to me when i saw the Whisper of the Grave invocation (SOOO Flavorful!)


https://38.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcrgagGlts1qem9g8o1_500.gif

The Whisper of the Grave will let me go around with a group of shrunken heads!!

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-78WwJwkx1ro/VB3WyffTy0I/AAAAAAAALmY/NoEQDaf9eh4/s1600/princessfrogvoodoo.jpg

You are in for a treat.

Funnily enough, the Shadow Man can be played as a level 14 pact of the chain Fey warlock.

Maxilian
2015-10-28, 12:44 PM
You are in for a treat.

Funnily enough, the Shadow Man can be played as a level 14 pact of the chain Fey warlock.

Why a chain Fey Warlock?

I have always seen him as a Ritual Casters, that uses Unseen Servant all the time (the shadows), use minor illusions on the deck of cards he have to change the looks of them, etc...

Ralanr
2015-10-28, 01:27 PM
Why a chain Fey Warlock?

I have always seen him as a Ritual Casters, that uses Unseen Servant all the time (the shadows), use minor illusions on the deck of cards he have to change the looks of them, etc...

The scene where he tries to manipulate Tiana into giving him the necklace looks like the level 14 fey warlock ability. AFB so I can't give exact details on the ability.

Maxilian
2015-10-28, 04:45 PM
The scene where he tries to manipulate Tiana into giving him the necklace looks like the level 14 fey warlock ability. AFB so I can't give exact details on the ability.

That's completely true and it makes the spell even more fun! but still... i will go with the Undying pact (Still i'm not going to go with a full model over this guy, he's even going to use medium armor and a shield -actually the shield is going to be a tomb (his tomb)-

Ralanr
2015-10-28, 05:38 PM
That's completely true and it makes the spell even more fun! but still... i will go with the Undying pact (Still i'm not going to go with a full model over this guy, he's even going to use medium armor and a shield -actually the shield is going to be a tomb (his tomb)-

Nothing stopping you (was just saying what I thought the shadow man was). I'll probably do the same on my witch doctor half-orc bladelock. I'll ask my dm if I can fluff it so I have a skull painted on whenever I use an armor spell.

VoltaicVitriol
2016-10-07, 10:35 PM
Feels a bit hypocritical in my mind is all.

okay. Switch the damage of their Eldritch Blast from Force to necrotic. All those years that they are not aging? They are forcing on others.

Sigreid
2016-10-07, 10:44 PM
If my math is Right, a Level 3 Warlock could create 192 Zombies or Skeletons within a 24 hour period. It then has to spend 20 minutes of every hour after that retaining control over 8 of those but still. You won't get a lot done because you have to keep on resting to get that back and when the rest is done you have to recast it again.


The best I could see this for is having the Undead either Guard something or lay Siege to someplace, but you'd have to be with them at all times for this to happen.

That's not how you use a huge body of animated dead. You animate them and point them at the town, city or kingdom you want destroyed and walk the other direction before your control breaks. A warlock on the loose with animate dead could very easily be the king of asymmetrical warfare.

tkuremento
2016-10-07, 11:47 PM
okay. Switch the damage of their Eldritch Blast from Force to necrotic. All those years that they are not aging? They are forcing on others.


That's not how you use a huge body of animated dead. You animate them and point them at the town, city or kingdom you want destroyed and walk the other direction before your control breaks. A warlock on the loose with animate dead could very easily be the king of asymmetrical warfare.

Isn't this necro posting by nearly a year now? :|

Sigreid
2016-10-08, 11:38 PM
Isn't this necro posting by nearly a year now? :|

Maybe. I posted the first time I saw it on the front page. /shrug.