A Question Concerning Vampire's Coffins

[brian 333]

HPoH hasn't got one. He never laid in state for three days, was never buried, and he has no dirt from his grave upon which to rest.

So, assuming he's reduced to 0 HP and turned to smoke...

Where does the cloud go?

Usually a slain vampire turns to gaseous form and returns to his coffin to restore himself when he is reduced to 0 HP. Does this mean that without a coffin, Durkula has no place to go, and therefore cannot regenerate once defeated? Does it mean he simply dies when he is reduced to -10 HP?

[Reathin]

HPoH hasn't got one. He never laid in state for three days, was never buried, and he has no dirt from his grave upon which to rest.

So, assuming he's reduced to 0 HP and turned to smoke...

Where does the cloud go?

Usually a slain vampire turns to gaseous form and returns to his coffin to restore himself when he is reduced to 0 HP. Does this mean that without a coffin, Durkula has no place to go, and therefore cannot regenerate once defeated? Does it mean he simply dies when he is reduced to -10 HP?

I believe Malak specifically said he was vulnerable until he got his own coffin, so that implies if he hits 0HP, he's destroyed.

EDIT: Yup, 879 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0879.html) specifically calls out the fact that he doesn't have a grave to return to as a vulnerability.

[factotum]

Of course, he may have acquired a coffin or tomb since that strip. Malack's comment that Durkula does not "yet" have a sarcophagus to retreat to indicates that it's possible for him to get one somehow, although we don't know what the process of doing so is.

[rodneyAnonymous]

Does this mean that without a coffin, Durkula has no place to go, and therefore cannot regenerate once defeated? Does it mean he simply dies when he is reduced to -10 HP?

Unless he has gotten himself a coffin off-panel, yes.

[brian 333]

If he did make a coffin it's most likely on the Mechane.

If this is the case, then I look forward to meeting Felix the Vampire. That will be one well dressed villain! However, I tend to doubt it, because we'd have heard hammering or sawing something, and Andi would be missing a few tools.

[Psyren]

If he did make a coffin it's most likely The Mechane.

Fixed for dramatic twist :smallbiggrin:

[Lvl 2 Expert]

He seems to have put quite a bit of thought into this godmoot plan. I would absolutely not be surprised if he gets away by having arranged for a coffin to be ready inside a fast coach on a nearby route going north.

It's one of the simplest precautions he could have taken. Sending is a cleric spell.

[Shining Wrath]

We have not seen him arrange to survive being reduced to 0 HP. It is plausible that he could have made such arrangements. OTOH, the Giant is fond of having people perish because of their flaws and mistakes, in classic Greek Tragedy fashion, and I'd call the signature flaw of the HPoH arrogance.

[Fitzclowningham]

Don't vampires' coffins have to have the soil of their graves involved somehow? Seeing as how Durkon wasn't buried, I'm guessing the soil he would need for a coffin would be from the spot where he died/arose in Girard's pyramid. Although it's possible, it doesn't look like he took any with him when he left, so he not only doesn't have a coffin now, but he can't make one until he gets the soil from a particular spot of a building that was blown to smithereens on a continent hundreds or thousands of miles away.

[Kantaki]

Don't vampires' coffins have to have the soil of their graves involved somehow? Seeing as how Durkon wasn't buried, I'm guessing the soil he would need for a coffin would be from the spot where he died/arose in Girard's pyramid. Although it's possible, it doesn't look like he took any with him when he left, so he not only doesn't have a coffin now, but he can't make one until he gets the soil from a particular spot of a building that was blown to smithereens on a continent hundreds or thousands of miles away.

I don't think so, if that were the case Malack would have (told Durkula to) picked some pyramid dust up or at least mentioned it. At least in the Stickverse it doesn't seem to be the case.
Or, since he was never buried, Durkula can just dump his cofffin into the next ditch and have someone cover him with earth. Then he has a grave to take earth from.

[b_jonas]

I say he can just go to his ancestral tomb, next to his pappy and his granpappy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0333.html). Malack probably doesn't know about that one.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Oh right.

Who needs a coffin when you've got a tomb?








Okay, which vampire needs a coffin when they have a tomb?

[Zenzis]

I say he can just go to his ancestral tomb, next to his pappy and his granpappy. Malack probably doesn't know about that one.

That is a really interesting thought. Maybe he already has a designated spot in that tomb that would count as a coffin. A related thought (Origin spoilers):

He was booted out of his homeland secretly with no warning.
Dwarves are very dutiful and would not abandon their post.
What if he was presumed dead? Maybe they had a memorial service and gave him an honorary place in the tomb or somewhere else? This might have even been encouraged by the church of Thor, because it would mean people wouldn't go out hunting for him and risk bringing him back.

I think this would be an interesting twist because if he regenerated at the tomb it would allow him to be killed here so the world doesn't explode, and still get to reap death and destruction, which was prophesized.

[Rift_Wolf]

What if that's what he killed the Creed for? To have them make a grave for him somewhere in the temple? Presumably once godsmoot is over, hps are gonna leave quickly, and not check for Vampires in the basement.

[Roland Itiative]

I say he can just go to his ancestral tomb, next to his pappy and his granpappy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0333.html). Malack probably doesn't know about that one.
Seeing that moment between Roy and Durkon, right after seeing the fight between Roy and Durkula is kind of heart-breaking.

And the idea of Durkula being "killed" now, just to instantly "go back home" is legitimately chilling and tragic. I hope you're right.

[Peelee]

I say he can just go to his ancestral tomb, next to his pappy and his granpappy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0333.html). Malack probably doesn't know about that one.

Even assuming that would work, I'd hope he can travel mighty fast.

[Talion]

Even assuming that would work, I'd hope he can travel mighty fast.

If we go by RAW, he can go about 9 miles over the course of two hours, as the vampire flies. That's neither very far or very fast, with the sole exception of basically ignoring terrain and traps (whether wind would be a hindrance is left moot). This means that he could reasonably be followed, and even if he made it back to whatever coffin/tomb he might have within that time frame he is rendered helpless for a full hour before he can start being dangerous again. Of course, he also wouldn't have a chance to replenish his spells, so he'd be at an even greater disadvantage than before even if he managed to regenerate unimpeded, and would have the full fury of the remaining Order of the Stick (and any help they got) brought down upon him.

[factotum]

If we go by RAW, he can go about 9 miles over the course of two hours, as the vampire flies.

He has far better options for long-range travel, though--Wind Walk, for example. That gives him a speed of 60mph, and while the Mechane can presumably beat that (or else Durkula wouldn't have been travelling aboard the ship in the first place) he only needs to get a couple of hours' head start and he's well away.

[Talion]

He has far better options for long-range travel, though--Wind Walk, for example. That gives him a speed of 60mph, and while the Mechane can presumably beat that (or else Durkula wouldn't have been travelling aboard the ship in the first place) he only needs to get a couple of hours' head start and he's well away.

If he hasn't been reduced to Mist form through damage, certainly. Though, in all fairness, I'm not entirely clear on if a vampiric caster is able to use spells to enhance their movement in that instance. It feels a little too powerful.

Edit: I just checked and, per RAW on Gaseous Form, he couldn't cast any spells while in gaseous form. At least, not without applying 3 separate metamagic feats.

[factotum]

So he uses gaseous form to escape to somewhere not easily reachable, reverts to normal form, then casts Wind Walk.

[dtilque]

He seems to have put quite a bit of thought into this godmoot plan. I would absolutely not be surprised if he gets away by having arranged for a coffin to be ready inside a fast coach on a nearby route going north.

It's one of the simplest precautions he could have taken. Sending is a cleric spell.

Yes, but who is he going to Send to? It's not like he knows anyone who wasn't on the Mechane. I suppose he could try to fool someone Durkon knew before, but shouldn't his enlarged canines give away that he's a vampire?


So he uses gaseous form to escape to somewhere not easily reachable, reverts to normal form, then casts Wind Walk.

The situation is if he's forced to mistform by being reduced to 0 HP. He can't revert to normal form if that happens.

[ChillerInstinct]

If we go by RAW, he can go about 9 miles over the course of two hours, as the vampire flies. That's neither very far or very fast, with the sole exception of basically ignoring terrain and traps (whether wind would be a hindrance is left moot). This means that he could reasonably be followed, and even if he made it back to whatever coffin/tomb he might have within that time frame he is rendered helpless for a full hour before he can start being dangerous again. Of course, he also wouldn't have a chance to replenish his spells, so he'd be at an even greater disadvantage than before even if he managed to regenerate unimpeded, and would have the full fury of the remaining Order of the Stick (and any help they got) brought down upon him.

While it's true that the Order could probably follow him there and finish the job... I don't think they WOULD.

If his speed is that slow, and his ancestral tomb is far enough for it to matter, then the Order would have to track him for at least a day. The problem is, they're explicitly running against the clock, since if Xykon gets to the Gate first, it's Game Over. With the HPoH's plan to win the vote ruined, they could easily decide that getting him back isn't quite top priority, and that they'll get to him once the world's safe (I mean, presumably all they would need is a divination to find him, right?)

Not to mention that, with the vote failing, the only way for Hel to complete her master plan would be for the gate to fall anyway, since the gods would need to pull the trigger on destroying the world in order to save existence. That would mean that Not-Durkon would, sooner or later, have to make a move on the gate, so really all things considered the Order would be better off just camping out at the gate to wait for him than pursuing him anyway.

I have to say, though, if Durkon WOULD be taken to his ancestral tomb when he died, it WOULD make for a terrifying chance for Hel to raise a Vampire army... after all, it seems Dwarves spend most of their time out of the sun anyway... (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0947.html)

[Reboot]

But unless they could talk one of the High Priests into going along, they'd be short on healing with no cleric...

[ChillerInstinct]

I suspect they might bring Veldrina and Wrecan along, unless they have other commitments. Considering the fate of the world's on the line they could certainly use some extra firepower.

I just can't help but feel that the HPoH isn't going to die here, at least not permanently. Too many loose ends, and considering the Order really doesn't have time to make a rest stop in the Dwarven Lands while Durkon has his character arc it would be leaving a lot undone (unless my theory about the HPoH getting moved into Gontor's body after Durkon gets rezzed ends up happening but I suspect this makes much more sense). Durkon getting launched back into his homelands but helpless to do anything as the HPoH brings a wave of terror with them would also make for some interesting scenarios.