LGBTAI+ #57 Infinity: I Love You, Always Forever

[JNAProductions]

Welcome to the 56th iteration of the LGBTAI thread!

Notice: This is mostly a support thread. There is an LGBTAI+ Q&A Thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?386745-LGBTAI-Questions-and-Discussion-thread-II-Make-It-Double&p=18487367#post18487367) right here.

The AI is for All-Inclusive because we have only so much space in the title, but everyone, regardless of orientation, direction, letter, acronym or chosen astrological symbol is welcome here!

We do, unfortunately, have a few rules. We are not an anarchist state! Or, we weren't until we voted we were? But shush.

1. We are primarily a support thread.
This means that the primary focus should be in helping people here feel better; about themselves, about their lives, about their problems. We are also an education thread, but when helping someone learn involves not supporting, we will default to support - Mostly. We are only mostly human, after all.

All of the other rules are basically precisions of rule #1.

2. If you want answers to triggering topics, spoiler-box or ask them privately.
Triggering topics are those which are likely to make other people feel bad, in any way whatsoever: for instance, rape, violence, bullying and many others may be triggering to some people. If someone, even just that one individual person, has a problem with a topic because it stirs demons best left in their pit, Do. Not. Bring. It. Up. Publicly. Use a spoiler box and think carefully about whether this is the place to broach the topic at all (see rule #1: "We are primarily a support thread.")

If you have questions or need help on something that involves triggering topics, please use spoiler tags and label your spoilers for trigger warnings. When in doubt, put trigger warnings.

3. Avoid discussing politics or religion.
It doesn't matter how much these two topics intersect with our forum topic, they are verboten. Sometimes, hints are...looked over, such as, "Man, in my country being gay sucks," but detail is right out, and even that could be considered willful disregard. Be careful. As the moderators themselves often say, if you aren't sure, don't.

4. Do not discuss moral justification.
No one here is going to discuss whether or not it's Right" or "Okay" to be LGBTAEIOUsometimesY or anything else. It's not topical, it's not relevant. We are, and we are here to cope with that and with the stresses it causes.
And no, my joking acronym doesn't constitute considering this rule less important.

5. Do not post sexually explicit content.
It's against forum rules, it's against decorum, and it will get us shut down pretty fast. What adults do behind closed doors is cool, and allusion is fine. Anything that could involve a diagram, though? No.

6. Avoid unfriendly debates.
Several topics of conversation have created huge arguments that made several people uncomfortable and defied our goal of being a support thread. This is especially true debates of definition. These do not always end well, and are best avoided.

Fight Club, AKA things we do not talk about.
This thread has a past of traumatic experiences which we would rather not repeat, and some topics which have created (in)famous rows include:
- The precise distinction between bi- and pansexual;
- What is or isn't a polyamorous relationship;
- Whether transgender is more correct than transgendered.
- Whether people who have homosexual sex should be able to give blood.
(Other topics may be added to the list.)
Unless you need support or help about this, please refrain from bringing up these topics.

Also, if a conversation that is not about support runs long, spoiler it if possible, even if it is polite.

Glossary of Common Terms

For reference, here is a list of commonly-used words in our community along with their definitions. Please keep in mind that this vocabulary is constantly evolving and that this list may not be complete. Any contributions to the list are appreciated.
LGBT: Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Trans*

LGBTAI: LGBT+Asexual/Aromantic/Agender+Intersex/All-Inclusive

QUILTBAG:
Q - Queer and Questioning
U - Unidentified
I - Intersex
L - Lesbian
T - Transgender/Transsexual
B - Bisexual
A - Asexual/Aromantic/Agender
G - Gay, Genderqueer

GSRM: Gender, Sexuality, and Romantic Minorities; sometimes only GSM

Where a word below is in italics, that means it has its own entry on the list.

A note on labels: many of these labels are seemingly interchangeable, and for some people they are. However, please do not presume to correct or judge another person's use of a label. Bisexual and pansexual are especially tricky in this regard, as are transgender and transsexual to a lesser degree.
Often the difference in why one person feels one label is appropriate and not another is deeply personal. If you wish to know more it is probably a topic to seek private advice on, from one of the people listed in the next section.

AFAB/AMAB: Assigned Female/Male at Birth.

Agender: Someone who lacks a gender.

Androgyne: Gender Identity with male and female aspects.

Androsexual: A person who is attracted to men.

Asexual: A person who does not feel sexual attraction.

Assignment/Assigned Gender:-The gender which someone is assigned at birth.

Bigender: Someone who identifies as both male and female (or as any two genders) either simultaneously or alternating. See also Genderqueer, Genderfluid

Binary, The: See: Gender Binary.

Bisexual: 1. attracted to two genders; 2. attracted to one's own gender and another gender; 3. attracted to various genders; 4. attracted to people regardless of gender; 5. ask the person who says they're bi what exactly they mean by that. See also Pansexual

Cis: See: Cisgender

Cisgender (CG): Somebody whose gender and sex align.

Demisexual: A person who is sexually attracted to someone only after they have formed an intense emotional relationship with them.

Dysphoria: The etymological opposite of "euphoria." A state of unease or generalized dissatisfaction. In this context, generally referring to the discomfort or dissociation Trans* people feel with their own body.

Male-to-Female (MtF): Someone who was assigned male at birth, but is female. (AKA: trans woman)

Female: See: Woman

Female-to-Male (FtM): Someone who was assigned female at birth, but is male. (AKA: trans man)

FAAB: Female Assigned at Birth.

Feminine: Something generally associated by society with women.

FFS: Facial Feminization Surgery: Surgery to reduce chin/nose/cheekbones. Associated primarily with MAAB Trans people

FtM: See: Female to Male

Gay: See: homosexual.

Gender Binary: The commonly held notion that there are only men and women on two extremes, with nothing in between.

Gender Expression (GE): How one expresses their Gender Identity to society.

Gender Identity (GI): How one feels inside society's idea of "man, woman, or other".

Genderfluid: Someone who fluctuates between different genders.

Genderqueer (GQ): Someone who is not of a binary gender; someone who is neither male nor female.

Gynosexual: A person who is attracted to women.

Heterosexual: A person who is attracted to members of the opposite gender.

Homosexual: A person who is attracted to members of their own gender.

HRT: Hormone replacement therapy. MtF's tend to progesterone, estrogens and androgen blockers, while FtM's take testosterone almost exclusively.

Lesbian: A woman who is attracted to women.

MAAB: Male Assigned at Birth.

Male-to-Female (MtF): Someone who was assigned male at birth, but is female. (AKA: trans woman)

Man/men: A cis man or trans man. Male.

Masculine: Something generally associated by society with men.

Pansexual: A person who is attracted to people regardless of gender. See also Bisexual

Polyamorous: A person who is interested in a relationship with more than one person.

Presenting: Trans* shorthand for appearing as their preferred gender, regardless of any HRT, SRS or other changes.

Trans*: Transsexual and Transgender primarily, with the asterisk denoting that the trans- prefix could be followed by any number of appropriate words. It also includes other labels, and is a catch-all term for people who identify as something other than their biological sex at birth.

Note: While "Trans*" was at one time preferred terminology, of late it has become seen as problematic for various reasons, and is being phased out of use. The preferred term at this time is simply "Trans". You use the term in the definition of dysphoria.
Also, FtM and MtF are sometimes seen as problematic, and i've been seeing a lot more 'Trans man/Trans woman' for target gender, moving on to 'Trans-feminine/Trans-masculine' which describes the direction of change, but does not define an end point.
"Transsexual" is also being phased out as being a bit obsessed with crotch bits and orientation linked either to the cis obsession with genital configuration, or the proven false idea that transgender people are just "super gay".

Transgender: Used in reference to a person whose sex(body) and gender(mind) are at odds or do not match. A transgender person can also identify as genderqueer, transsexual, or may use transgender as their only identity.

Transitioning: The process a Trans* person undergoes to move to their preferred gender. Often includes HRT, SRS, FFS.

Transsexual: In common terms the same as transgender above. In medical terms refers specifically to people who wish to transition from male to female or female to male, not accommodating any other options.

SRS: Sex Reassignment Surgery: Surgery to replace/transform a vagina into a penis, or vice versa. Mastectomies or plastic surgery may be used on breasts.

Sexual Orientation (SO): How one identifies who they are attracted to.

Significant Other(s) (SO): Person(s) you are in a relationship with.

Third-gendered: Someone who fits in a local society's third gender, usually male performing female tasks, occasionally vice versa. Also a person who feels they do not identify with any other gender identity.

Woman: A cis woman or trans woman. Female.

Allies: Heterosexual-Cisgender people who support equality for sexual, gender, and romantic minorities.

Aromantic: a person who does not experience romantic attraction.

Non-Binary: Same as Genderqueer.

Enby: Shortened form of "Non-binary".
Private Consultation.

We have a list of people who are willing and able to discuss topics that may not be thread-appropriate but are still topical. They can be reached by Personal Message (PM), thought they may not respond immediately, or may be on sabbatical.

Don't be afraid to reach out and talk to them.

Many of us on the list are more than willing to listen to your questions or concerns and will not just lash out in hostility or anger.


Name: Especially familiar with the topic(s) of
Absol197: Gender identity issues.
Philemonite: Relationships, depression.
Astrella: GSRM rights, feminism, trans stuff, Skype.
Chess435: Skype.
Eirala: Trans stuff (esp emotional issues), Skype(no voice or video, however).
Eldest: General/basics, bisexuality, polyamory, pansexuality will Skype(voice if needed, no video).
Enrico Dandolo (Caroline): Trans stuff, mental health, feminism, asexuality, hugs, make-up advice. PM first, Skype chat if asked.
Golentan: Mental health, fluid and questioning sexualities, and issues arising from sexual trauma.
HMS Sophia: Trans stuff (esp hormones).
inuyasha: Shoulder on which to cry, someone to listen.
Irish Musician: PM, Rants/Venting.
KenderWizard: General/basics, gender and feminism, bisexuality.
Kesnit: Trans stuff (FtM), legal issues.
Lea Plath: Genderfluidity.
Lentrax: General/basics, depression, bullying.
Lix Lorn: General/basics.
Lycunadari: Genderqueer and agendered.
Metditto: PM/Skype for L, T, GQ, BDSM(Off-thread or Spoiler Triggered), demisexual, feminism, therapy, depression, dissociative identities.
Miraqariftsky: Family issues, transfolk issues, bullying, depression
Musashi: General/basics, asexuality/demisexuality, depression.
Mystic Muse: Skype-y goodness.
noparlpf: General/basics, asexuality, greysexuality, biology, Skype.
Partysan: PM/Skype, polyamory, pansexuality, BDSM(Off-thread or Spoiler Triggered), Rants/Venting.
Socratov: Skype-ness.
TaiLiu: General Transgender information, transphobia.
Warkitty: Academic/technical discussions, Make-up advice.
Wormwood74: Transgender legal issues, transgender outside contacts.

Some people are also willing to talk off-board, through Skype or email or other means; this is especially useful if your question involves board-forbidden topics such as religion or politics. Also, we can't (and ethically shouldn't!) give medical advice. If you need medical advice, please see a professional!

And as a parting note, I will say that even though moderators do not read PMs, they are still part of the forum and still subject to forums rules. Non-allowed topics and discussion should NOT be conducted via PM.


Previous Incarnations

Like the Glorious and Unconquered Sun, we have risen, lived, died, and risen anew, with many faces, many voices, many hearts. In this past, much can be found, both good, and bad, should one be brave or perhaps, foolish, enough to seek it.


LGBT people in the playground

LGBT people in the playground - part II

LGBTitp - part III

LGBTitp 4: We are a family?

LGBTitp - Part Five

LGBTitp - Part Six

LGBTitp - Part Seven

LGBTitp - Part Eight

LGBTitp - Part Nine

LGBTAitp - Part Ten

LGBTAitp - Part Eleven

LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

LGBTAitp - Part Thirteen

LGBTAitp - Part Fourteen

LGBTAitp - Part Fifteen

LGBTAitp - Part Sixteen

LGBTAitp - Part Seventeen

LGBTAitp - Part Eighteen!

LGBTAitp - Part Nineteen

LGBTAitp - Part Twenty - Critical Hit!

LGBTAitp - Part Twenty-One - BLACKJACK!

LGBTAitP Part 22: The Best There Is

LGBTAitP Part 23: Et tu, ~Bianca?

LGBTAitP: Alphabet Soup-with 24 different Vitamins!

LGBTAitP part 25: Doing Away With Subtitles

LGBTAitP 26: No Time For Snappy Titles

LGBTAitP 27: Of Shoes, and Ships, and Sealing Wax

LGBTAitP #28: Come Taste the Rainbow!

LGBTAitP #29: The Rainbow Outreach Program

LGBTAitP 30: Free Cuddles (Enquire Within)

LGBTAitP #31: Cuddles Are On Back Order. Have Some Snuggles!

LGBTAitp #32: The Great Plushie Invasion!

LGBTAitp #33: The Thread at the End of the Rainbow!

LGTAitP #34: <3!!

LGBTAitp #35: What Midlife Crisis? :3

LGBTAitp #36: May Contain Bites!

LGBTAitP #37: Once upon a time...

LGBTAitP #38: Once More With Feeling!!

LGBTAitP #38: Making Your Way in the World Today....

LGBTAitP #40: Technicolour Partyboat

LGBTAitp #41 - Imprecise Terminology Supercenter

LGBTAitp #42: Better Than Skittles/The Meaning of Life!

LGBTAitp #43 [Insert snappy subtitle here]

LGBTAIitP #44: Quick, We Need To Vote A New Title!

LGBTAIitP #45: Rainbow Anarchy

LGBTAitP #46: I Cast Prismatic Hugs

LGBTAIitp #47: Weather Control Central

LGBTAIitp #48: For a Cuddly Tomorrow!

LGBTAIitp #49: Please check all baggage before boarding the Rainbow Rail Road

LGBTAI+ #50: Warning: This Thread Has Exceeded its Maximum Awesome Level

LGBTAI+ 51: Lay That Hammer Down!

LGBTAI+ 52: Aces High

LGBTAI+ 53: The Nefarious Rainbow Syndicate

LGBTAI+ 54: A Full Deck

LGBTAI+ 55: AKA The Page We'll Get to if I Don't Make a New One

LGBTAI+ 56: Prismatic Spray (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?424207-LGBTAI-56-Prismatic-Spray!)




Webcomics that touch on... Well, everything related to the thread.
Venus Envy. (http://www.venusenvycomic.com/) Long dead webcomic. The creator has chosen not to continue it and move forward in life.
Rain. (http://rain.thecomicseries.com/comics/first/) A story of a MtF girl in high school.
Khaos Komix. (http://www.khaoskomix.com/)As the creator puts it(from his site): "A complete GLBTWTFBBQ comic about gender and sexuality. (Trigger warnings for EVERYTHING and nothing is safe for work.)"
Always Raining Here. (http://alwaysraininghere.com/index.php/first-page/) "Adrian is heartsick, Carter is horny. This is a story about their misadventures as awkward teenagers as they fumble through unrequited romances."
Tripping over you. (http://trippingoveryou.com/comic/gmorning-sunshine/)An awkward blind date leads to better options.
Questionable Content. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/) The LGBTA characters are fairly well done, and not stereotypes.
What's normal anyway. (http://whatsnormalanyway.net/?p=93) "What’s Normal Anyway? is a comic that discusses the trans male experience through the story of Mel, who takes the big risk of being himself and transitioning from female to male."
Princess. (http://the-princess.funonthe.net/) A webcomic.
Twokinds. (http://twokinds.keenspot.com/) Keveak: "It generally portrays GRSM matters positively and is quite a nice tale overall."
Misfile (Misfile.com) The Rose Dragon: "Ash is a young boy who, as a result of a screw-up in Heaven, gets stuck in a girl's body in a life he doesn't recognize, and has to deal with the changes and challenges of his new body while trying to get back his old life. Supernatural hijinks and car racing are involved."
Portside Stories (http://portsidestories.tumblr.com/) A cute(and recently started) webcomic.
El Goonish Shive (http://www.egscomics.com/) A long running webcomic, that I've heard often touches on lgbta relevant stuff.
Validation (http://www.validationcomic.com/) A Slice of Life webcomic focusing on Ally, a young transger woman, just living her life.
Wildflowers (http://wildflowers.smackjeeves.com/comics/1579765/ve-shoutout/) A self proclaimed triggering comic dealing with suicide, depression, dysphoria and more.

I know I missed a few webcomics, and if anyone finds more, feel free to PM them to me with a brief description, and I will add them.

And a picture made by the Giant to celebrate gay amrriage legalization in America.

http://www.giantitp.com/Images/gitpkick/PrismaticSpray.png

[Jaycemonde]

Official "hi again" message goes here. Still working up the courage to actually share the news. Bear with me, please.

[JNAProductions]

Gosh darn it, I jumped the gun.

Take all the time you need. We're here for you.

[Athedia]

Aww, I miss the Giants pic in the intro thread.

[YossarianLives]

Yay, another thread. Woo-hoo!

I guess I'll go back to lurking now. See you in about 5 pages.

[JNAProductions]

Aww, I miss the Giants pic in the intro thread.

Should I add it back in? I wasn't sure if I should.

[Jaycemonde]

Should I add it back in? I wasn't sure if I should.

It wouldn't really be appropriate, I don't think. That was celebratory. For some reason the new name seems more solemn. Almost sad.




Still working on the news. I might break it after a nap.

[Athedia]

Should I add it back in? I wasn't sure if I should.

As Jaycemonde said, it wouldn't be appropriate. But I do miss it. Maybe in a spoiler? So it can be found by people just stumbling on the thread?

The solemn tone works, there has been... disagreement and anger recently and we need to acknowledge that the group is one of love and support.

[JNAProductions]

Added back in in a spoiler on the bottom.

It's really a great picture.

[Dire Moose]

Yay! New thread!

Also, is it just me, or have a lot of people been coming out as trans/questioning lately?

[JNAProductions]

Yes. Yes they have, Mr./Miss./Mz. Moose. (Is there a gender neutral form of address for that?)

[Rain Dragon]

Well, now that I've gone and said that and you've responded, Murphy's Law would dictate that a bunch of bad die rolls will happen in the next session and she will end up dying horribly.

Level 2 NG Elf Hunter named Siella with a Dromaeosaurus (using the basic "raptor" stats) named Fuzzball as her companion, in case you were wondering. Mainly basing her around archery and leaving Fuzzball to do melee.

Isn't that that anything that will go wrong will? So discussion did little to change that. :smalltongue:
I really hope she doesn't end up dying horribly.

Ah cool, thanks. I like archery.


Official "hi again" message goes here. Still working up the courage to actually share the news. Bear with me, please.

Hello again. o/


Added back in in a spoiler on the bottom.

It's really a great picture.

I agree.


Yes. Yes they have, Mr./Miss./Mz. Moose. (Is there a gender neutral form of address for that?)

I've seen Mx around but I have no idea how one would pronounce it. /Googles

[JNAProductions]

According to Wikipedia, Mx. is pronounced "Miks" or "Muks".

[Lord Raziere]

Official "hi again" message goes here. Still working up the courage to actually share the news. Bear with me, please.

Hello Jaycemonde, nice to see you again.

and yes, for some reason despite me thinking I'm transgender, I don't post in this thread much. I guess I don't have much an opinion on these things aside from my own identity, either that or I'm not really interested in arguing them.

I wish all bravery to you.

[Dire Moose]

Or just use "Moose" and do away with the prefixes.

It seems like some of the things tying me back to being male are almost becoming less and less mentally relevant to me now, like they're not bothering me as much. I guess this might be a good thing, but on the other hand if I am completely trans and not somewhere in the middle the prospect of that as my future is honestly really intimidating.

So for the moment I think I can safely say I'm not a cis male, and that I am starting to identify myself more and more as female now. There are still things that are holding me back to being male, but it seems like those are becoming less of an issue as time goes on and my mind gets more used to the idea. Still haven't told anyone outside the internet about it though, and I'm still uncertain of myself.

[JNAProductions]

Feel free to talk about your feelings to us, or vent, or do whatever. Support thread is support thread.

I do have hopes that your friends and family take it well, though from what you've said that's not by any means guaranteed.

[Dire Moose]

Feel free to talk about your feelings to us, or vent, or do whatever. Support thread is support thread.

I do have hopes that your friends and family take it well, though from what you've said that's not by any means guaranteed.

I feel like before telling anyone back in my "core group" that has known me since I was a child, I need to be a lot more sure of myself than I am now, since they've known me long enough to want to challenge me the most on it. That, and they're the one group of people that it would hurt the most to lose, so I really would have to be sure I'm doing the right thing if I'm risking that.

My dad in particular would take this really bad, and I'm afraid that no matter how sure I am and how good a case I present to him that we're going to fall out over this.

[JNAProductions]

*Offers Moose pre-emptive hugs*

That sucks. While I haven't really told my family about it, I'm lucky enough to know they'll be okay with it, regardless of where I end up.

[Svata]

Post for thread sub and to say hi, etc...

[EternalMelon]

Decides its time to shave legs again.
Buys band-aids for any cuts.
Doesn't cut legs.
Wears tights all day

Why did I bother :smallsigh: No regrets

[JNAProductions]

Decides its time to shave legs again.
Buys band-aids for any cuts.
Doesn't cut legs.
Wears tights all day

Why did I bother :smallsigh: No regrets

*High fives EM*

Nice!

[JusticeZero]

On definitions, could you possibly note that:
While "Trans*" was at one time preferred terminology, of late it has become seen as problematic for various reasons, and is being phased out of use. The preferred term at this time is simply "Trans". You use the term in the definition of dysphoria.
Also, FtM and MtF are sometimes seen as problematic, and i've been seeing a lot more 'Trans man/Trans woman' for target gender, moving on to 'Trans-feminine/Trans-masculine' which describes the direction of change, but does not define an end point.
"Transsexual" is also being phased out as being a bit obsessed with crotch bits and orientation linked either to the cis obsession with genital configuration, or the proven false idea that transgender people are just "super gay".
You might also add to the definitions -
Aromantic: a person who does not experience romantic attraction.
Non-Binary: Same as Genderqueer.
Enby: Shortened form of "Non-binary".

[JNAProductions]

Man, having post number one is actual work. I suddenly regret my decision. :P

Post number one updated.

[Ravens_cry]

Decides its time to shave legs again.
Buys band-aids for any cuts.
Doesn't cut legs.
Wears tights all day

Why did I bother :smallsigh: No regrets
For you, hun.:smallsmile:
***
In other news, I went to my endocrinologist appointment today. I got some blood work to do, which luckily can be done locally, and a follow up appointment in three weeks, but, but! If all checks out health-wise, they're going to be prescribing me the hormones.

[Lissou]

The full form is "Mixter" so I'd go with "mix" for the pronunciation of "Mx". Although I've always thought "Mixer" would be more appropriate for the full version than "Mixter", which sounds too similar to "Mister" to me. (It comes from "mix", but doesn't only apply to people who consider themselves a "mix" of genders. Heck, it can be used for absolutely everyone, even binary people, like "parent" can be used for a mother or a father, not just a nonbinary parent).

[Ifni]

While "Trans*" was at one time preferred terminology, of late it has become seen as problematic for various reasons, and is being phased out of use.

Is this generally accepted, and if so could you provide any kind of reference? On Google, I'm finding arguments both ways, from within the last year (i.e. some people advocating for it, some saying it's problematic). Or are you just saying that this thread's particular community has made that decision? If so, no worries - I'm just curious as to whether there's a broader consensus on preferred terminology, as I have previously been told to use the asterisk.


'Trans-feminine/Trans-masculine' which describes the direction of change, but does not define an end point.

This seems a little odd language-wise to me, as I've usually seen "feminine" and "masculine" used to refer to presentation/behavior/roles, rather than gender identity. For example, there can be masculine women, and feminine men, either cis or trans. Does transfeminine mean "moving in the direction of being more feminine", or "moving in the direction of feeling oneself more a woman"? They're really not the same thing. Is someone who is AFAB, happily identifies as a woman, but considers themselves very masculine (i.e. they like masculine hobbies, dress, etc) in the trans-masculine category?

(Gender wiki seems to conflate the two, talking both about people who "identify as feminine more often than other genders" and people who "identify as female more than other genders".)


Non-Binary: Same as Genderqueer.

Again, I'm not certain this is generally accepted. A quick Google finds me at least some people who are arguing for a distinction. (One quote: "non-binary refers to gender that is not binary (not man nor woman) and genderqueer refers to gender that is queer (non-normative)" - in this sense genderqueer is a broader term.) That said, the definition of genderqueer above does seem like a good definition for non-binary.

Anyway, none of these are a big deal, I'm just curious.

[JusticeZero]

Is this generally accepted, and if so could you provide any kind of reference? On Google, I'm finding arguments both ways, from within the last year (i.e. some people advocating for it, some saying it's problematic). It's that there IS a controversy, and I personally have seen a lot less trans* of late as a result.
Does transfeminine mean "moving in the direction of being more feminine", or "moving in the direction of feeling oneself more a woman"? They're really not the same thing. The former. A transgender person transitioning to present, etc. in a more female fashion, but without declaring where on the spectrum the transition will finish at. Could be a trans girl, could be enby. The circles I am in have me in one of those because I'm doing some social and aesthetic transition steps right now, and because society is binarist, it's all in one direction - even though I'm not actually a boy or a girl. I can't speak to the other usage because I haven't seen it yet.
Oh, and you attached part of my explanation to your definition so it reads funny. :)

[Jaycemonde]

I guess I don't have much an opinion on these things aside from my own identity, either that or I'm not really interested in arguing them.

I think that might be one of the biggest problems, and while it's being kept civil right now it looks like it's starting to take off again in just the discussions about definitions, like some kind of unpleasant business that needs to be seen to. Everyone seems to think that if they're trans they need to pick apart all the other trans people and say that their experiences are wrong and that they're "doing" transness wrong and argument over being trans is so ingrained in how most of the trans people on this forum think now that they don't ever bother coming to the thread unless they think they have to defend their position, because they're all tired of being here for the "community."


Sorry, I had to get that out. I wish we could just be a community like before, instead of a warzone barely contained behind a "this is how everything SHOULD be defined" DMZ.

Anyway, thank you for the kind words, everyone who's shared them. I was really unsure about coming back to the thread, and I'm still really unsure, but in light of the big news I have j kind of feel like I should try to care for my online relationships a bit more.



Okay, big news...first off, my girlfriend and I got an apartment. It's kind of a dump and it's shared with two other people, but it's a home, separate from my dad's house, and still close enough to places of business that at least one of us can stay in a job.

Second bit of big news, Evie is moving down from Alaska by plane next week to be in said apartment with me. It's a huge commitment and I won't lie and say I don't feel kind of uncomfortably guilty about making her come down, especially since Houston just voted against equal rights laws in businesses (please don't talk about this, I'm just mentioning it for context), but we're both happy with how things are turning out overall.

Third, Evie lost a friend a little while back. She was trans like us, not that her family seems to care about her pronouns in death, but they're going to get her ashes interred in the tombstone and it's going to have a picture of her fursona (a red wolf, if I recall) laser-engraved on it. That's honestly kind of another reason Evie's moving in with me--the cause of passing was a traffic accident and I'm a professional driver, so she nearly had a nervous breakdown when she realized the same thing could happen to me. On the other hand, at least she stopped texting while driving.

Fourth, I'm dropping out of college, full-time. I'm staying in one or two classes, but only the electives and only for personal enrichment. I'm done wasting time and money on a glorified high school-level curriculum when I've already got a job and I could be spending time improving my art.

Fifth, I've been getting a lot more art, both as gifts from friends and commissioned. I've been posting the majority of it on e621, which isn't nearly as awful a place as I originally thought even if their "Tag What You See" policy overrides what an artist or character owner knows about their characters (even where gender is concerned, though that doesn't affect me too much since all the applicable tags to my pictures are still feminine-coded and thus line up with my pronouns). I might want to share the more safe for work stuff I've gotten/will get in the future, if that's okay. This one's of me cosplaying as Poison:
http://40.media.tumblr.com/e3f3abc9333e3003df6c6d234b6b9c5e/tumblr_nx4ck1HAhy1tg6gi3o1_1280.png

I guess that's pretty much it. As far as this thread is concerned, well, we already went over my fears on returning. It's nice to see the people who are still here. I miss a few faces that I haven't seen yet, including ones we all know had things happen to them. Rain, nice to see you've apparently embraced Goatism. JNA and Moose, nice to meet you. Sorry if I'm missing any new faces. I'm bad at this.

EDITEDIT: oh, there's one more thing. I'm openly pagan, now, specifically devoting myself to Baphomet aka OG Goat Mom (Toriel step aside). I'm happy I can finally express my own beliefs independently from my legal family. I'm gonna build a nice shrine, hhhh.

[EternalMelon]

*High fives EM*

Nice!
Thanks! I'm proud of my intact skin!

For you, hun.:smallsmile:
***
In other news, I went to my endocrinologist appointment today. I got some blood work to do, which luckily can be done locally, and a follow up appointment in three weeks, but, but! If all checks out health-wise, they're going to be prescribing me the hormones.
I know, I'm glad i did it today so I don't have to do it tommorow.

Also, EFF YEAH, HORMONES!

[Heliomance]

On definitions, could you possibly note that:
While "Trans*" was at one time preferred terminology, of late it has become seen as problematic for various reasons, and is being phased out of use. The preferred term at this time is simply "Trans". You use the term in the definition of dysphoria.


It has? Since when?

[Jaycemonde]

And there it goes, already boiling over.

Anyway. Small update. Already had a fight with Evie about when exactly I'll be moving in. This is going well.



I shouldn't have bothered posting on the first page. I'm probably just going to delete it to avoid wasting space that could better be spent by people arguing.

[Lycunadari]

And there it goes, already boiling over.

Anyway. Small update. Already had a fight with Evie about when exactly I'll be moving in. This is going well.

*offers hugs* Hope you'll be able to sort it out soon, and welcome back. :smallsmile:


On the asterisk thing, I've seen arguments for both, and personally I'm okay with either being used for me. *shrugs*


Also, I guess, hi again? I've been away for a while cause I'm dealing with some bad health stuff and that doesn't really have anything to do with the thread topic. Also uni is stressful. But, in good and thread relevant news, my sister's girlfriend is visiting for the first time today - I'm exited I'm getting to meet her. :smallsmile:

–Juniper

[Heliomance]

So.

That appointment I was supposed to have on Tuesday. The one where we'd start discussing surgical options. The one that got cancelled because the doctor was off sick.

I've just found out that, unless there's a cancellation they can slot me into, it's not going to be rescheduled until some time around ****ing APRIL.

This is not going well.

Hmm. According to the National Health Service Commissioning Board and Clinical Commissioning Groups (Responsibilities and Standing Rules) Regulations 2012, "appropriate treatment" for non-urgent conditions must be started within 18 weeks of referral. Well, from a little digging back through forum posts, I was referred on the 22nd of June 2013, and my first appointment was on the 9th of July 2014. That's, what, 54, 55 weeks? I wonder if threatening legal action would get them to pull their collective thumbs out of their arses.

[Amazon]

@Jaycemonde

Nice to see you got more freedom now that you live away form your family.

I'm sorry to hear about your friend's friend. Are you sure about the college thing? I mean haven't you already spent too much time on it to just give up now?

Is there a site where you post your art? like deviantart for something? Oh and Hi nice to meet you. :)

[Athedia]

Well the credits will still exist so Jaycemonde can always change their mind. Also for some people it isn't worth it to finish. I have to because I am going for science research stuff but some people who were going for creative degrees (studio art, film, etc) decided to leave because they found work. Both are valid paths. Also college is hella stressful.

In happy news after an incident while cutting an apple I got stitches but now they are out! While part of my finger is numb I can bend it and it healed together perfectly!

[JusticeZero]

Yeah, I don't actually care about asterisks myself. Use them, don't use them, I know what you mean. But I know that a controversy on the subject exists - people started using the asterisk to exclude enbys, apparently - and I don't use it myself out of respect for the fact that some people now have reason to be annoyed about that particular term.

I have to see an endocrinologist for a completely unrelated problem, but I likely won't be able to get the appointment for a month or two. They're going through the teaching hospital to keep the costs down, but the waiting list for the cheaper service is very long. I'll probably ask about hormones then. I probably won't get them at that time since i'm sure that having symptoms for a medical issue involving out of tune body chemistry is going to result in them going "No, I am not going to add extra complications onto this right now", and I still have to talk about the subject with my partner anyways.

[Iruka]

On definitions, could you possibly note that:
While "Trans*" was at one time preferred terminology, of late it has become seen as problematic for various reasons, and is being phased out of use. The preferred term at this time is simply "Trans". You use the term in the definition of dysphoria.


Huh, completely missed that developement. Are there good places on the internet where I could read up on it?

[Jaycemonde]

Is there a site where you post your art? like deviantart for something? Oh and Hi nice to meet you. :)

Hi.

Like I said, what I posted in the other post isn't done by me, it was gift art for Hallow's Eve. I'm uploading all my commissioned and gifted art to e621, which I unfortunately can't link to because a). it's probably against forum rules and b). nearly every company, school, and small country ISP or network will have it blacklisted, though most of the art itself is SFW. If you do want to look it up just search for copyright:jaycemonde on the site.

I do make my own art too, but I don't really feel too excited about my skill or talent at the moment. I guess if you want to stare at it in vaguely unsettled incomprehension you can check my Tumblr. I almost never upload to FurAffinity these days and I haven't touched DeviantArt in years. Most of my stuff is grungy animals with guns and the like.

I also used to keep a thread going in the arts and crafts section here, but I haven't updated it in like a year and a half.

[Grytorm]

And there it goes, already boiling over.

Anyway. Small update. Already had a fight with Evie about when exactly I'll be moving in. This is going well.



I shouldn't have bothered posting on the first page. I'm probably just going to delete it to avoid wasting space that could better be spent by people arguing.

Um. I don't know how to reassure you. But you don't need to delete your posts. I'm glad to hear your good news and I hope you can work things out with your friends. Good luck.

[ThinkMinty]

On definitions, could you possibly note that:
While "Trans*" was at one time preferred terminology, of late it has become seen as problematic for various reasons, and is being phased out of use. The preferred term at this time is simply "Trans".

Personally, I think it's because people don't know how to pronounce the asterisk.

[JusticeZero]

http://hellyeahagender.tumblr.com/post/84578663190/so-i-saw-the-why-is-the-asterisk-in-trans-bad
A few reasons there. It just wasn't being used for good, but more to validate binarist nastiness.

Tried talking to my partner about the endocrinologist visit. Didn't finish because they kind've blew up before I could even start talking.
They were frustrated that my voice is harder to make out right now, and went off on a rant that basically went like... "I don't know why you bother with any transition stuff - nobody is ever going to see you as anything but your assigned gender, because I can never get anybody to stop misgendering ME, and I hate it, but I just have to live with it, and anyways nobody sees our gender as real so we will never not be misgendered so why fight it?"It was a long rant full of misery and I simply had no good answer to it.

[Ravens_cry]

Personally, I think it's because people don't know how to pronounce the asterisk.
Yeah. It might seem clever, but a name you can't pronounce, what's the point of that? Why make humanity's primary communications path unusable? It's a bit medical, and I know some people don't like that, but I use trans spectrum when actually speaking, and genderfluid to describe my own state.

Thanks! I'm proud of my intact skin!

I know, I'm glad i did it today so I don't have to do it tommorow.

Also, EFF YEAH, HORMONES!

THANK YOU!:smallbiggrin:

[Grytorm]

Sorry to hear that JusticeZero.

And congratulations to whoever had something to be excited about. I'm only vaguely cognizant about what is going on a lot of the time.

But also, can we stop discussing the terminology stuff? I know you have a good idea how to explain things and reach a mutual understanding with someone else but it makes some people find it distressing including at least one awesome person who has recently returned from hiatus and is already considering departure. Evenven if I don't understand why it causes stress I don't think we should be doing anything to drive others away from the thread. Okay? And this should probably includes making last points because someone else will want to make a final point as well and it just goes on.

[Rain Dragon]

According to Wikipedia, Mx. is pronounced "Miks" or "Muks".

The full form is "Mixter" so I'd go with "mix" for the pronunciation of "Mx". Although I've always thought "Mixer" would be more appropriate for the full version than "Mixter", which sounds too similar to "Mister" to me. (It comes from "mix", but doesn't only apply to people who consider themselves a "mix" of genders. Heck, it can be used for absolutely everyone, even binary people, like "parent" can be used for a mother or a father, not just a nonbinary parent).

Ah thanks, that's slightly more information than I saw at a glance. I only saw the wikipedia page and had to rush off. This is good to know. :smallsmile:


It seems like some of the things tying me back to being male are almost becoming less and less mentally relevant to me now, like they're not bothering me as much. I guess this might be a good thing, but on the other hand if I am completely trans and not somewhere in the middle the prospect of that as my future is honestly really intimidating.

So for the moment I think I can safely say I'm not a cis male, and that I am starting to identify myself more and more as female now. There are still things that are holding me back to being male, but it seems like those are becoming less of an issue as time goes on and my mind gets more used to the idea. Still haven't told anyone outside the internet about it though, and I'm still uncertain of myself.

That's okay too. ^.^ I think both have their challenges (with quite a bit of overlap) and I wouldn't worry too much about where you are in things. In the end, if you're able to be more you you'll probably feel more comfortable and happy. Sometimes, I like to try to remind myself about that comfort if things seem too much and tell myself it's all worth it.

That's alright.


Decides its time to shave legs again.
Buys band-aids for any cuts.
Doesn't cut legs.
Wears tights all day

Why did I bother :smallsigh: No regrets

Ahah. I'm sure soon there'll come a day when your unblemished shaved legs will be visible (if you want).
Woo for no cuts!


Man, having post number one is actual work. I suddenly regret my decision. :P

Post number one updated.

I don't mean to nitpick, but I note those few are outside the spoilerbox. I can help ordering things if you want (after all, I pointed out more work for you).


I think that might be one of the biggest problems, and while it's being kept civil right now it looks like it's starting to take off again in just the discussions about definitions, like some kind of unpleasant business that needs to be seen to. Everyone seems to think that if they're trans they need to pick apart all the other trans people and say that their experiences are wrong and that they're "doing" transness wrong and argument over being trans is so ingrained in how most of the trans people on this forum think now that they don't ever bother coming to the thread unless they think they have to defend their position, because they're all tired of being here for the "community."


Sorry, I had to get that out. I wish we could just be a community like before, instead of a warzone barely contained behind a "this is how everything SHOULD be defined" DMZ.

Anyway, thank you for the kind words, everyone who's shared them. I was really unsure about coming back to the thread, and I'm still really unsure, but in light of the big news I have j kind of feel like I should try to care for my online relationships a bit more.



Okay, big news...first off, my girlfriend and I got an apartment. It's kind of a dump and it's shared with two other people, but it's a home, separate from my dad's house, and still close enough to places of business that at least one of us can stay in a job.

Second bit of big news, Evie is moving down from Alaska by plane next week to be in said apartment with me. It's a huge commitment and I won't lie and say I don't feel kind of uncomfortably guilty about making her come down, especially since Houston just voted against equal rights laws in businesses (please don't talk about this, I'm just mentioning it for context), but we're both happy with how things are turning out overall.

Third, Evie lost a friend a little while back. She was trans like us, not that her family seems to care about her pronouns in death, but they're going to get her ashes interred in the tombstone and it's going to have a picture of her fursona (a red wolf, if I recall) laser-engraved on it. That's honestly kind of another reason Evie's moving in with me--the cause of passing was a traffic accident and I'm a professional driver, so she nearly had a nervous breakdown when she realized the same thing could happen to me. On the other hand, at least she stopped texting while driving.

Fourth, I'm dropping out of college, full-time. I'm staying in one or two classes, but only the electives and only for personal enrichment. I'm done wasting time and money on a glorified high school-level curriculum when I've already got a job and I could be spending time improving my art.

Fifth, I've been getting a lot more art, both as gifts from friends and commissioned. I've been posting the majority of it on e621, which isn't nearly as awful a place as I originally thought even if their "Tag What You See" policy overrides what an artist or character owner knows about their characters (even where gender is concerned, though that doesn't affect me too much since all the applicable tags to my pictures are still feminine-coded and thus line up with my pronouns). I might want to share the more safe for work stuff I've gotten/will get in the future, if that's okay. This one's of me cosplaying as Poison:
http://40.media.tumblr.com/e3f3abc9333e3003df6c6d234b6b9c5e/tumblr_nx4ck1HAhy1tg6gi3o1_1280.png

I guess that's pretty much it. As far as this thread is concerned, well, we already went over my fears on returning. It's nice to see the people who are still here. I miss a few faces that I haven't seen yet, including ones we all know had things happen to them. Rain, nice to see you've apparently embraced Goatism. JNA and Moose, nice to meet you. Sorry if I'm missing any new faces. I'm bad at this.

EDITEDIT: oh, there's one more thing. I'm openly pagan, now, specifically devoting myself to Baphomet aka OG Goat Mom (Toriel step aside). I'm happy I can finally express my own beliefs independently from my legal family. I'm gonna build a nice shrine, hhhh.

Hurrah for a new home! \o/

That seems fair. Best of luck. Y'know what they say about all work and no play.

Ooh, that's a very kickass picture.

That's amazing news too. I wish you the best.


So.

That appointment I was supposed to have on Tuesday. The one where we'd start discussing surgical options. The one that got cancelled because the doctor was off sick.

I've just found out that, unless there's a cancellation they can slot me into, it's not going to be rescheduled until some time around ****ing APRIL.

This is not going well.

Hmm. According to the National Health Service Commissioning Board and Clinical Commissioning Groups (Responsibilities and Standing Rules) Regulations 2012, "appropriate treatment" for non-urgent conditions must be started within 18 weeks of referral. Well, from a little digging back through forum posts, I was referred on the 22nd of June 2013, and my first appointment was on the 9th of July 2014. That's, what, 54, 55 weeks? I wonder if threatening legal action would get them to pull their collective thumbs out of their arses.

Oh no... That's a whole lot longer than 18 weeks. Really, over a year, ewww. And they're rescheduling this for ~5 months away?! That's so uncool.
I hope they sort their nonsense out. That's ridiculous.


Tried talking to my partner about the endocrinologist visit. Didn't finish because they kind've blew up before I could even start talking.
They were frustrated that my voice is harder to make out right now, and went off on a rant that basically went like... "I don't know why you bother with any transition stuff - nobody is ever going to see you as anything but your assigned gender, because I can never get anybody to stop misgendering ME, and I hate it, but I just have to live with it, and anyways nobody sees our gender as real so we will never not be misgendered so why fight it?"It was a long rant full of misery and I simply had no good answer to it.

:smallfrown:

That's rather sad.
If I were to answer to it, I'd say that transition is more for me than for the world and be telling the truth. Things are changing, though, and the future is unclear. Being prepared for a future where constant misgendering will not occur is not in and of itself a bad thing either even if it doesn't happen within a few years. (But it will, eventually; it has to. Peace and understanding shall conquer.)

[JNAProductions]

I don't mean to nitpick, but I note those few are outside the spoilerbox. I can help ordering things if you want (after all, I pointed out more work for you).

Woops, that's my bad. Thanks for pointing it out.

[Psyren]

New thread smell!

I didn't even know the asterisk was even a thing, much less that it subsequently became a Bad Thing™. I did find this though: http://www.transstudent.org/asterisk

I've always just used trans or transgender. (I did use "transgendered" briefly before later finding out that was also a Bad Thing™.)

[EternalMelon]

Personally, I think it's because people don't know how to pronounce the asterisk.
I think we should use Trans*, especially in spoken language, and then just yell "STAR" as loud as we can to pronounce it. Even when whispering:

"Hey Noah, I'm actually TransSTAR so if you could say "she" and other female pronouns that would be great."
"Oh I'm sorry. I didn't know you were TransSTAR I'll try to be more considerate."
"Hey what are you guys yelling about over there?"
"Uhhh... celestial bodies?"

But anyways I don't actually want to argue semantics.


Or is it pedantics?


THANK YOU!:smallbiggrin:
YOU'RE WELCOME! (I like yelling)


Ahah. I'm sure soon there'll come a day when your unblemished shaved legs will be visible (if you want).
Woo for no cuts!
Someday, someday soon. But not really.

Also, you made me notice that my post looks like a ****ty poem:

Time to shave my legs
Bought band-aids for any cuts
Did not bleed today

Legs are now so smooth
But then I wore tights today
Exasperation

[Ravens_cry]

Yeah, good razors are bloody expensive, but cheap razors suck so much ass!

[Rain Dragon]

Woops, that's my bad. Thanks for pointing it out.

You're welcome.


Someday, someday soon. But not really.

Also, you made me notice that my post looks like a ****ty poem:

Time to shave my legs
Bought band-aids for any cuts
Did not bleed today

Legs are now so smooth
But then I wore tights today
Exasperation

Improved as poem
Elegant in form it be
And message remains

:smalltongue:

[Ravens_cry]

Itchy stubble,

Turns to cuts and trouble
Unless you double
Burma-Shave

[EternalMelon]

Yeah, good razors are bloody expensive, but cheap razors suck so much ass!
I get past that by buying cheep razors and using them just once so they cant go bad!

Yeah, that doesn't work.


Improved as poem
Elegant in form it be
And message remains

:smalltongue:
And now, because I'm not a huge fan of haiku:

Itchy scratchy legs
Irritates, and annoys.
Brings back smooth memories
Long lost shaven joys.

Time has come to recreate
This feeling I do miss.
To run my fingers over skin
And feel the soft soft bliss.

Ready now,
In a shower I do stand.
Cold and wet
And razor in hand.

Band-aids ready
To fulfill their need.
But through skillful hand
Legs do not bleed.

Briefly enjoy
My smooth soft skin
Before its covered
In soft cloth, so thin.

Put on a dress
And a smile.
For dressed like this
I'll be here a while.

The only one
Who sees me here,
Can't help but stare
In the mirror.

Her face is covered
In paint and powder.
Its not done well
But I'm happy for her.

I shave my legs
Just for one.
She's in the mirror.
She's glad its done.





I suck at poems
Which you can tell,
As this went on
It went downhill.



Itchy stubble,

Turns to cuts and trouble
Unless you double
Burma-Shave
:P

[noparlpf]

So.

That appointment I was supposed to have on Tuesday. The one where we'd start discussing surgical options. The one that got cancelled because the doctor was off sick.

I've just found out that, unless there's a cancellation they can slot me into, it's not going to be rescheduled until some time around ****ing APRIL.

This is not going well.

Hmm. According to the National Health Service Commissioning Board and Clinical Commissioning Groups (Responsibilities and Standing Rules) Regulations 2012, "appropriate treatment" for non-urgent conditions must be started within 18 weeks of referral. Well, from a little digging back through forum posts, I was referred on the 22nd of June 2013, and my first appointment was on the 9th of July 2014. That's, what, 54, 55 weeks? I wonder if threatening legal action would get them to pull their collective thumbs out of their arses.

Geez, that's ridiculous. (Over here, the soonest any shrink in the entire city of Philadelphia can see me is 12/15 and I have five days of one med left. I love modern healthcare.) And yeah...more like 69 weeks. Definitely point that line out. Good luck.

[ArlEammon]

I wonder if any of you guys or bi girls are interested in someone in Arizona.

[Astrella]

@Helio; not sure if threatening action would help, trans healthcare is just such a low priority that we get shafted. :/ You could try, but I'm not sure if that would garner you much sympathy from the NHS.

[Heliomance]

@Helio; not sure if threatening action would help, trans healthcare is just such a low priority that we get shafted. :/ You could try, but I'm not sure if that would garner you much sympathy from the NHS.

If there's legislation in place and they're not complying with it, it doesn't matter how low priority trans healthcare is, they don't have a leg to stand on.

[Serpentine]

If there's legislation in place and they're not complying with it, it doesn't matter how low priority trans healthcare is, they don't have a leg to stand on.
Preach! \o/
The more no one calls them on it, the more they get away with it - even when it's not deliberate; it's easy to let standards slip if there's no accountability.

[JusticeZero]

So annoyed at basically every guide to voice training I have seen so far. "Pitch isn't that important because there's a huge overlap. The important thing is to focus on rhythm and inflection! We will now spend the rest of this guide teaching you how to adjust your pitch." Bah.
Regarding razors, I use a safety razor. The decent blades for those are still very cheap compared to cartridges.

[Serpentine]

There's some razor subscription company around. Haven't tried them myself, but I think I've heard good things about it. A part of it is they're pushing it as gender neutral, too.

[Heliomance]

So annoyed at basically every guide to voice training I have seen so far. "Pitch isn't that important because there's a huge overlap. The important thing is to focus on rhythm and inflection! We will now spend the rest of this guide teaching you how to adjust your pitch." Bah.
Regarding razors, I use a safety razor. The decent blades for those are still very cheap compared to cartridges.

The important thing is tone, mostly. Yes, there's a huge pitch overlap, but male voices have masses of deep resonance that you need to learn how to shift, which is both the hardest and most important aspect, and probably what they're mostly trying to teach.

[golentan]

Aye. It's hard to shift your pitch to a feminine without falsetto, I think.

[Bobbybobby99]

Just informing everyone of my continued presence. My school is surprisingly accepting of being gay, and my grandmother just sort of doesn't care, so I don't have much to say most of the time.

[Dire Moose]

Well, that's good to note. I'm glad things are going so well.

On the other hand, I'm occasionally managing to distract myself with various things, but I'm still constantly having to deal with worse and worse anxiety about what lies ahead for me. It's becoming more difficult to keep this trans thing on the back burner and not worry about it, and trying to claim that I'm not sure or even that I'm somewhere in the middle is working less and less. Yet when I do try and accept myself I don't feel good or right at all, just scared and helpless. I wish this would just go away, but everything I've read just reminds me that it won't and will just keep getting worse unless I start taking steps to change myself. And that is likely to utterly destroy any amount of social progress I've ever made in the world.

tl;dr: Transition and my career/social life is utterly ruined; don't transition and I live with more and more guilt, disappointment, and self-abuse over being too afraid to do it until I finally break down.

Either way, I'm screwed, and I wish I could find a better way out than either alternative.

And I'm still overcome with doubts and second-guessing as well. Maybe I really am somewhere in the middle and jumping to the wrong conclusions, or maybe I really am trans; I still can't be sure. Why did I ever try this "figuring out my gender identity" thing in the first place when I could have left well enough alone and not had to deal with this?

[Grytorm]

I really know in a lot of ways what you are talking about. You are handling it better than I did, in the proactive approach to the whole situation. I ended up interacting in the thread from curiosity about some subjects and ended up realizing I kind of wanted to be a girl. And basically I haven't done much to explore that or start any sort of transition in the last year and a half. I got a skirt I hardly wear and I've told a few people. But that is about it.

[Jaycemonde]

Between still lagging behind everyone else with transitioning through reasons I can't control and apparently being the last person in the whole ****ing world to learn that Bailey Jay is apparently a huge trans rights activist and a precious nerdy cinnamon roll (though I'm still glad I knew about Fallon Fox long before anyone else in my circle of contacts) I've been feeling pretty fake and un-trans the last few days. As if my being nonbinary/my specific identification wasn't enough.

I'm just kind of glad so many people who [still] post here seem to be enby nowadays. It makes me feel slightly less gross.

Edit: I've been trying to change my avatar, but I forgot how absolutely horrible vBulletin is concerning avatars and how hard it is to find anything that will work on an iPhone for backing files up/uploading them with proper links.

[Dire Moose]

Between still lagging behind everyone else with transitioning through reasons I can't control and apparently being the last person in the whole ****ing world to learn that Bailey Jay is apparently a huge trans rights activist and a precious nerdy cinnamon roll (though I'm still glad I knew about Fallon Fox long before anyone else in my circle of contacts) I've been feeling pretty fake and un-trans the last few days. As if my being nonbinary/my specific identification wasn't enough.

Well, I'm feeling about the same way as you right now, and I haven't done much about it either, so you're hardly in a bad position by comparison.

[Rain Dragon]

Itchy stubble,

Turns to cuts and trouble
Unless you double
Burma-Shave

Bahah.


And now, because I'm not a huge fan of haiku:

Itchy scratchy legs
Irritates, and annoys.
Brings back smooth memories
Long lost shaven joys.

Time has come to recreate
This feeling I do miss.
To run my fingers over skin
And feel the soft soft bliss.

Ready now,
In a shower I do stand.
Cold and wet
And razor in hand.

Band-aids ready
To fulfill their need.
But through skillful hand
Legs do not bleed.

Briefly enjoy
My smooth soft skin
Before its covered
In soft cloth, so thin.

Put on a dress
And a smile.
For dressed like this
I'll be here a while.

The only one
Who sees me here,
Can't help but stare
In the mirror.

Her face is covered
In paint and powder.
Its not done well
But I'm happy for her.

I shave my legs
Just for one.
She's in the mirror.
She's glad its done.





I suck at poems
Which you can tell,
As this went on
It went downhill.


I like Haikus.

That version has style.


Just informing everyone of my continued presence. My school is surprisingly accepting of being gay, and my grandmother just sort of doesn't care, so I don't have much to say most of the time.

Greetings.


Well, that's good to note. I'm glad things are going so well.

On the other hand, I'm occasionally managing to distract myself with various things, but I'm still constantly having to deal with worse and worse anxiety about what lies ahead for me. It's becoming more difficult to keep this trans thing on the back burner and not worry about it, and trying to claim that I'm not sure or even that I'm somewhere in the middle is working less and less. Yet when I do try and accept myself I don't feel good or right at all, just scared and helpless. I wish this would just go away, but everything I've read just reminds me that it won't and will just keep getting worse unless I start taking steps to change myself. And that is likely to utterly destroy any amount of social progress I've ever made in the world.

tl;dr: Transition and my career/social life is utterly ruined; don't transition and I live with more and more guilt, disappointment, and self-abuse over being too afraid to do it until I finally break down.

Either way, I'm screwed, and I wish I could find a better way out than either alternative.

And I'm still overcome with doubts and second-guessing as well. Maybe I really am somewhere in the middle and jumping to the wrong conclusions, or maybe I really am trans; I still can't be sure. Why did I ever try this "figuring out my gender identity" thing in the first place when I could have left well enough alone and not had to deal with this?

I really know in a lot of ways what you are talking about. You are handling it better than I did, in the proactive approach to the whole situation. I ended up interacting in the thread from curiosity about some subjects and ended up realizing I kind of wanted to be a girl. And basically I haven't done much to explore that or start any sort of transition in the last year and a half. I got a skirt I hardly wear and I've told a few people. But that is about it.

Ouch. Sorry for clumping these together (short on time) but I wish you both well. It can be pretty difficult to deal with that sort of thing. I have no advice atm :smallfrown:, but would offer internet hugs or somesuch.


Keep finding myself in a frame of mind where I feel like I'm never going to make any progress with transitioning and never going to have any real shot at being happy. Just thinking about it and I end up feelin' like there just ain't no point trying anymore.

I sometimes try to focus on the idea that I don't know that transitioning will do nothing unless I give up. I hope you feel better about things soon.


Between still lagging behind everyone else with transitioning through reasons I can't control and apparently being the last person in the whole ****ing world to learn that Bailey Jay is apparently a huge trans rights activist and a precious nerdy cinnamon roll (though I'm still glad I knew about Fallon Fox long before anyone else in my circle of contacts) I've been feeling pretty fake and un-trans the last few days. As if my being nonbinary/my specific identification wasn't enough.

I'm just kind of glad so many people who [still] post here seem to be enby nowadays. It makes me feel slightly less gross.

Edit: I've been trying to change my avatar, but I forgot how absolutely horrible vBulletin is concerning avatars and how hard it is to find anything that will work on an iPhone for backing files up/uploading them with proper links.

Ouch sounds rough. I don't think you're fake.

Bleh, yeah. It'd be nice if it'd at least resize rather than crop, but alas.

[Heliomance]

Between still lagging behind everyone else with transitioning through reasons I can't control and apparently being the last person in the whole ****ing world to learn that Bailey Jay is apparently a huge trans rights activist and a precious nerdy cinnamon roll (though I'm still glad I knew about Fallon Fox long before anyone else in my circle of contacts) I've been feeling pretty fake and un-trans the last few days. As if my being nonbinary/my specific identification wasn't enough.

I've never heard of either of those people, so I think you're ok :P

[JusticeZero]

Aye. It's hard to shift your pitch to a feminine without falsetto, I think.
It's fortunate that i'm not trying to shift my pitch far at all then, since a lot of my voice isn't very far from epicene by default. It's the other stuff that I need help with, and I'm fine if there's some confusion.

[Jaycemonde]

I've never heard of either of those people, so I think you're ok :P

Fallon Fox is the first ever openly trans-fem UFC fighter, and she's pretty damn good at it, too. Can take on people twice her size. There were a few concerns about how maybe she somehow gets some kind of advantage from "you know, her real body" or whatever, but people started being suitably impressed when someone explained that if anything, hormone replacement therapy and cosmetic surgery would only be a handicap in a fight.

Bailey Jay is, uh. Well, she's a porn star that's super chill and super outspoken about trans rights (and about *******s that fetishize trans people) and she's got a super sharp wit that can shut almost any rude jerk down. It's like she has a submachinegun in her mouth that chambers withering remarks about double standards and fragile egos. Seeing her go off is pretty inspirational. She also talks a lot about the bad parts of The Industry, which is nice. Not enough stars will do that, even if they can.

They're both role models of mine for a reason. Better than Caitlyn, for sure.




Also, I got art from like one of my all-time favorite artists ever last night, it's so amazingly good, I would link it but it's definitely not site-friendly :c

Also also, Evie and I made up after our (pretty awful) fight and I feel a lot better now, if still a little (a lot) defensive.

Edit: Oh yeah, on the subject of voices, while I can't do a lot to work on how my voice sounds (and I've been meeting a few people that suggest not sounding feminine is a good enough reason to explicitly undermine my pronoun choice/gender identity, which only reinforces my decision never to use microphones) I HAVE been finding promising solutions to allowing 42a-209 to talk. Pinning down his mental voice is proving a bit difficult, but I'm thinking of Text to Speech software for him so he doesn't have to deal with my stupid limited vocal range when he talks.

[Bobbybobby99]

Whenever I feel depressed, I start mentally repeating about Bluebirds, Butterflies, Daffodils and Lolipops, Bluebirds, Butterflies, Daffodils and Lolipops... But that probably isn't very effective. I wish I could give better advice. But maybe try it? Or not?

[golentan]

I remind myself I could leave my life behind whenever I wanted to, just start walking and rely on my various skill sets to find food along the way and stay warm until I find someplace worth being.

And there are things in my life that make me not want to, because as hard as being here can sometimes be, it's all worth it. ~snuggles miraqariftsky~

Also, I do meditative breathing and eat spice-drops. And this morning, I cooked myself eggs benedict from scratch using non-dairy bearnaise (it worked just fine, just needs extra egg yolks). As long as I have food and my lady love, it will be okay.

[YossarianLives]

Can I second everything golentan just said? Because they really know what they're talking about.

[golentan]

Why not (for unable to walk away)? What's tying you down?

I find most of people's ties are actually in their heads. The expectations of others that they will find a house and spouse and be readily available at all times for contact, and the ensuing requirements of stuff and labor to maintain that stuff and... But, when you realize you don't have to follow the script, it's strangely liberating that if you do stick with it, it's YOUR choice, because you are building whatever it is. Unless you're under arrest or in fear of your life (as from medical issues), there's not much I can think of that you couldn't choose to walk away from, into the unknown. It's the fear of going off script that holds most people, or the fear of disappointing others, or some as-yet unaccomplished goal. And the last is the only one that really matters to me, at this point.

And no, if everyone did it all at once, that would be bad. But most people have goals to work for. And maybe if people were more willing to walk out on bad situations, life would be better overall. Not just "I had a single bad day so I'm gonna go live in the mountains for a decade" but if you're caught in a poverty trap or a threatening situation or whatever else... Walk out. Sever the ties of toxic relationships, and cultivate a garden of positive ones. Don't worry about material stuff beyond what you need to live, and toss out all that old junk or give it to people who need it or repurpose it into that modern art sculpture you've always wanted to make (and I mean you, not me, I hate modern art, though I do like sculpture). Go walking for a week or two to clear your head (I once walked three hundred miles before I decided to take the bus back). Whatever.

[ArlEammon]

Eh, I'm unable to cope with this loneliness for much longer.
I keep eating too much.

[golentan]

So go meet people. There are dozens of places I can recommend looking, but I can't meet people for you.

If meeting people is too anxiety producing, go see a therapist.

If seeing a therapist is too problematic, I suggest a mental health hotline.

In the interim, have hugs. ~hugs~

[Rain Dragon]

The problem is not that transitioning will do nothing, just I have no clue how I'll ever actually get to the point where I can start transitioning anymore.

I meant to say 'trying to transition' rather than 'transitioning'. I was in a rush. :smallredface:

I sometimes feel hopeless and really need to find that drive to keep taking steps otherwise I'm going to forever be stuck in a cycle and it's going to spiral downwards. Also, looking back on things done is often a good idea, and thinking 'This is what I've done so far. They're good steps.' It's fairly difficult to tear down barriers or force one's way through when one's feeling down.


Why not (for unable to walk away)? What's tying you down?

I find most of people's ties are actually in their heads. The expectations of others that they will find a house and spouse and be readily available at all times for contact, and the ensuing requirements of stuff and labor to maintain that stuff and... But, when you realize you don't have to follow the script, it's strangely liberating that if you do stick with it, it's YOUR choice, because you are building whatever it is. Unless you're under arrest or in fear of your life (as from medical issues), there's not much I can think of that you couldn't choose to walk away from, into the unknown. It's the fear of going off script that holds most people, or the fear of disappointing others, or some as-yet unaccomplished goal. And the last is the only one that really matters to me, at this point.

And no, if everyone did it all at once, that would be bad. But most people have goals to work for. And maybe if people were more willing to walk out on bad situations, life would be better overall. Not just "I had a single bad day so I'm gonna go live in the mountains for a decade" but if you're caught in a poverty trap or a threatening situation or whatever else... Walk out. Sever the ties of toxic relationships, and cultivate a garden of positive ones. Don't worry about material stuff beyond what you need to live, and toss out all that old junk or give it to people who need it or repurpose it into that modern art sculpture you've always wanted to make (and I mean you, not me, I hate modern art, though I do like sculpture). Go walking for a week or two to clear your head (I once walked three hundred miles before I decided to take the bus back). Whatever.

I really wish I'd learned this earlier. Much, much earlier. It's good advice, for me at least.

[golentan]

I'm a wise fool and a kind jerk, when I want to be. :smalltongue:

[golentan]

Was aimed at Darth Arminius that part.

And bills are only important if you're buying things. My hypothetical walk-out, I wouldn't even talk to another human being more than once a month, let alone purchase (I know harvestable sources of all micro and macro nutrients in my environment and places I could go for shelter, as an example). A friend of mine went walkabout for a while, and learned to forage in cities for free food. If you're not feeling so extreme, if you can take on debt now for a future where you don't need it, or have a relationship that doesn't need to be tossed out with some of the ones you walk away from that you can call on for aide, well, pay it forward if you can't pay it back. I've known children who have survived on the streets with less training than I'm absolutely positive you have, and in warzones. It may not be pleasant, but you can do it.

It's the fear of the unknown, of going off script that is the mental block you're dealing with. When you realize that you can choose to face it, and can still choose to stay, it's at least YOUR choice whether to stay. And having the option is liberating even knowing you are unlikely to ever lose it. Ever see the learned helplessness experiments on dogs? A dog, punished enough, will give up hope of ever escaping even when the apparatuses blocking their freedom are removed. It's... quite horrifying, in truth, but it's applicable. The cage is gone everywhere but their own mind, but they stay within it and lament its nonexistent existence. It's real to them, by the by. The fact something is in your mind is not a dismissal, it's a hardship. Everything most worth pursuing and everything most horrifying exists only through the lens of thought, it's all in your head if it's worth a damn. But if you acknowledge that, you can test the bars. If you realize that your depression or your fear or your whatever else is a barrier to pursuing what you want in your heart of hearts... you may not break free the first time. Maybe not the second. But if you acknowledge that the bars are illusory and continue to test them, sometimes, just sometimes, you find yourself on the far side. And it only has to work once, when it counts.

[Comrade]

Was aimed at Darth Arminius that part.

My mistake, sorry.

[Rain Dragon]

Meeting people isn't really the problem. I appreciate the advice (and the hugs), and hell, being able to walk away would be nice. I'd like that option. But I just ain't cut out for hurling myself into the world on my own like that. Pretty much my whole life has been my family going 'You just keep going to school, we'll handle all financial stuff' so I've never had a job, never had to worry about paying bills, none of that. If I tried to up and strike out on my own I wouldn't have a clue what I was doing.

Good ideas, but unfortunately I really haven't done anything at this point, so there's not much for me to look back on. It's the getting things done that's tripping me up.

I've known quite a few people who had no idea as well and were sort of dropped into the world anyway and had to make their way. They're doing well. I didn't have much of a clue what I was doing on many occasions I thought would be foolhardy at best, but I survived and it turned out for the better.

From my pov, you seem to be sure of your transition and that you're going to try to move forward. That in and of itself really is something and it's rather important. It's a great first step. Have you researched what you need to do next? If so, that's a really great next step (and I get the impression you have). Maybe they seem like little things, but maybe it'd help to look at them and try to think 'Yes, I did that. Go me! That's great! Now I just need to do a little bit more.' Maybe muster up the courage to ask your GP about referral if that's something you need to do? Talk to someone? Go to a support group and ask questions about transitioning? Maybe you've already done all of those things, in which case that's a heck of a lot more than I've been able to do! It just gets really overwhelming for me to think about everything at once, so trying to hold onto one's achievements and use them as motivation to take just that little next step really helps.

(I found this advice in a better form somewhere on the internet, but I forget where it was. :smallredface:)


EDIT - @Golentan - Gee, I haven't seen the word walkabout for a while! It's good to see it again.

[Jormengand]

So, I got some breast forms today, sent by a lovely person from our very own playground, and I feel happier already wearing them. <3

On a sadder note, am probably going to have to buy hormone treatment, and do so without even my family's involvement, rather than wait for stuff to happen. Much sad.

[Irish Musician]

Yeah, good razors are bloody expensive, but cheap razors suck so much ass!
Safety razors. Wonderfully close shave and next best thing next to a straight razor. Not to mention their blades are about $12 for 50 or so.

Aye. It's hard to shift your pitch to a feminine without falsetto, I think.
It is all about working on those muscles. The more you talk in your falsetto, the more those muscles will build up, and the more powerful that range of the voice will be. Eventually it will sound about as close to full voice as you can get in falsetto.

So, I got some breast forms today, sent by a lovely person from our very own playground, and I feel happier already wearing them. <3
Happy Jor is happy, though :smallsmile:

[Rain Dragon]

I do have some idea of what I need to do from here-- there's an informed consent clinic an easy drive away, I'm planning to go there for a consultation as soon as possible. For the time being I'm still trying to do what I can to accommodate my folks in that, as much as I can reasonably be expected to-- found a therapist who specialises in family therapy for transgender issues so I'll be getting in touch with them and hopefully scheduling something for my folks. When that happens-- or, conversely, if worst comes to worst, when I go to that clinic on my own-- then I'll feel like I've done something. Til then, just wavering.

It sounds like a good plan and some good progress to me. Best of luck!


So, I got some breast forms today, sent by a lovely person from our very own playground, and I feel happier already wearing them. <3

On a sadder note, am probably going to have to buy hormone treatment, and do so without even my family's involvement, rather than wait for stuff to happen. Much sad.

Awesome!

Awh. Good luck.

[Jormengand]

My attempts to get hormone treatment have been defeated largely by the fact that I have no idea how to set up online payments, and information on how to do so is practically nonexistent.

[Lentrax]

So, I got some breast forms today, sent by a lovely person from our very own playground, and I feel happier already wearing them. <3

On a sadder note, am probably going to have to buy hormone treatment, and do so without even my family's involvement, rather than wait for stuff to happen. Much sad.
*queries atm*

Send money to Jor.

*blergh*

*punches atm.* Send my money to Jor!

Atm fights back in death arena.

Ashleigh steps over dead adversary to next atm.

"Send my money to Jor, please."

*blergh.*

*ad nauseum, as nauseum...ad nauseum..."

[Jormengand]

*queries atm*

Send money to Jor.

*blergh*

*punches atm.* Send my money to Jor!

Atm fights back in death arena.

Ashleigh steps over dead adversary to next atm.

"Send my money to Jor, please."

*blergh.*

*ad nauseum, as nauseum...ad nauseum..."

:smallredface:

Though the money itself isn't actually an issue so much as setting things up to send the money. Which is a pain.

[Heliomance]

So, I got some breast forms today, sent by a lovely person from our very own playground, and I feel happier already wearing them. <3

On a sadder note, am probably going to have to buy hormone treatment, and do so without even my family's involvement, rather than wait for stuff to happen. Much sad.

...I sent those second class on Saturday, I wasn't expecting them to arrive until like Wednesday! Royal Mail delivery times are unpredictable.

So I'm aware of the irony, considering my fairly awful experiences with Charing Cross, but how come you can't go the NHS route?

[Jormengand]

...I sent those second class on Saturday, I wasn't expecting them to arrive until like Wednesday! Royal Mail delivery times are unpredictable.

Well, thanks for them!


So I'm aware of the irony, considering my fairly awful experiences with Charing Cross, but how come you can't go the NHS route?

It's too long. I can't last that long. :smallfrown:

[Astrella]

@Jor; a prepaid credit card might work?

[Jormengand]

@Jor; a prepaid credit card might work?

The people I'm buying them from only accept a limited range of options and I don't even know how paying money online really, well, works, so there's that.

[Dire Moose]

So, as I'm starting to feel more secure in identifying myself as trans (though genderfluid/nonbinary is still possible, and all three can overlap, and it's still scaring me), I'm planning to come out about my feelings to my best friend sometime this week. I still have doubts and am shaky about my identity, but I would explain that to him as well.

He's been ok dealing with trans people before and does use the correct pronouns etc., but he doesn't seem to see them as members of their preferred gender at times. He did notably say "Well, you don't have to be female to win Best Female Costume" when a trans woman won said award one Halloween.

He's known me for 17 years and is totally accepting of me being bi, but this is different. I would effectively be telling him that the person he thought he knew never existed, and he would have to get painfully used to a fundamental aspect of his interactions with me changing. I know some people can't deal with it, and even some who think they can will back out after physical changes start occurring. He might bring up our history together to argue with me over it, or he might feel I betrayed him by not telling him back when I was 13 and first had these feelings.

Also, we currently live at opposite ends of the United States, so talking in person is not possible. I will be back home over New Year's, but that is a long way away and his schedule may not permit a visit. So it probably cannot happen in person.

Any advice on how to handle this best? Or would it be better to wait until I was absolutely certain?

EDIT: My editing overlapped with the post below.

[JNAProductions]

So, as I'm starting to feel more secure in identifying myself as trans (though genderfluid/nonbinary is still possible), I'm planning to come out about my feelings to my best friend sometime this week.

He's been ok dealing with trans people before and does use the correct pronouns etc., but he doesn't seem to see them as members of their preferred gender at times. He did notably say "Well, you don't have to be female to win Best Female Costume" when a trans woman won said award one Halloween.

He's known me for 17 years and is totally accepting of me being bi, but this is different. I would effectively be telling him that the person he thought he knew never existed, and he would have to get painfully used to a fundamental aspect of his interactions with me changing. I know some people can't deal with it, and even some who think they can will back out after physical changes start occurring. He might bring up our history together to argue with me over it, or he might feel I betrayed him by not telling him back when I was 13 and first had these feelings.

Also, we currently live at opposite ends of the United States, so talking in person is not possible. I will be back home over New Year's, but that is a long way away and his schedule may not permit a visit. So it probably cannot happen in person.

Any advice on how to handle this best?

Unfortunately, I don't really have any advice. But I do want to wish you the best of luck, Moose.

[Astrella]

The person he knew did exist and does exist, just because their gender might not be the same doesn't meant hey're fundamentally a different person now.

[ThinkMinty]

Fallon Fox is the first ever openly trans-fem UFC fighter, and she's pretty damn good at it, too. Can take on people twice her size. There were a few concerns about how maybe she somehow gets some kind of advantage from "you know, her real body" or whatever, but people started being suitably impressed when someone explained that if anything, hormone replacement therapy and cosmetic surgery would only be a handicap in a fight.

Bailey Jay is, uh. Well, she's a porn star that's super chill and super outspoken about trans rights (and about *******s that fetishize trans people) and she's got a super sharp wit that can shut almost any rude jerk down. It's like she has a submachinegun in her mouth that chambers withering remarks about double standards and fragile egos. Seeing her go off is pretty inspirational. She also talks a lot about the bad parts of The Industry, which is nice. Not enough stars will do that, even if they can.

They're both role models of mine for a reason. Better than Caitlyn, for sure.

As...I guess a "cishet guy who observes things", I have some...thoughts on Caitlyn Jenner. They're not something I've heard said elsewhere, and while my overall opinion amounts to "meh", I can break down how I arrive at that.

Caitlyn Jenner isn't who the people who propped her up to show how wonderful and tolerant they are thought she was, because they didn't care to do their ****ing homework...and it's kinda blown up in everyone's face rather than just theirs. Seriously, just ask Caitlyn Jenner any question outside of her personal needs and she's...rather consistently awful. The whole underpinning of her worldview(political or otherwise) is egotistical selfishness. Among many other things I could say, it takes a staggering amount of doublethink and arrogance to be a homophobic lesbian.

It's...probably an unfair comparison, but she's like Justine Tunney for Baby Boomers. So in short, she's just a selfish jerkass.
So yeah, a porn starlet and a pugilista (is that a word?) are better role models (and better people) than someone safe enough to be on a Wheaties Box. Your instincts on that are spot-on, at least from where I'm sitting.

[celtois]

The people I'm buying them from only accept a limited range of options and I don't even know how paying money online really, well, works, so there's that.
I'm not sure how universal these are to other countries but if you already have a bank account you might be able to get a visa enabled debit card. Which can work for online payments. PayPal could also work.


In in other news I found out a relative mine has been having a rough time with thier sexual identity. Suffice to say I'm extremely disappointed and ashamed that this is the case. Since I like to think of all of my relatives as pretty great people, and it sounds like some of them haven't been overly supportive of my other relative.

Its driving me bonkers, and I'm being intentionally obtuse about the situation in my above description since it's not my story to share. Let's just say rough time is an understatement :smallfrown: I also live on the other side of the country, which makes it hard to help and I'm not sure if my help would be appreciated by the intended recipient. :smallsigh:

[Heliomance]

Well, thanks for them!


Do we get a pic?

[Serpentine]

Oh... I had a sort of awkward moment the other day. I've mentioned a decent part of it before, but I'll go over the background again anyway. It's just an aside, though, nothing important here.

So one of my cousins is a rather handsome young man who, as far as any of the family knows, has never really had a girlfriend. I was speculating that he might be gay but hiding it from us, and it turns out a few other people in our family had been as well. Anyway, a few Christmases ago he had a bit of a breakdown and ended up having a D&M with my sister (after having a bit of a chunder). Because she knew I'd been speculating and I'd be fine with it, she told me that he'd told her that he's actually bisexual, and had been struggling with it a bit. But I wasn't meant to know, so I couldn't tell him I knew much less talk to anyone else in our family about it.
Fast forward, and my cousin has found himself a (rather lovely, from the looks of things) girlfriend. My dad gets a bit excited about it when talking with me and my grandparents, and goes, "You know, I thought he was gay! Did you think he was gay, [Serpentine]?"

Me:

http://photo4.ask.fm/859/835/907/-359996997-1so0khd-4g595g1rq2de8e5/preview/nocomment.jpg

I'M REALLY BAD AT KEEPING SECRETS YOU GUYS

[Jaycemonde]

So yeah, a porn starlet and a pugilista (is that a word?) are better role models (and better people) than someone safe enough to be on a Wheaties Box. Your instincts on that are spot-on, at least from where I'm sitting.


Yeah, I basically have the same thoughts on the Big Jennitor. There are plenty of trans people who can be *******s and it bugs me when people say I should consider Caitlyn a role model.
I appreciate your agreement and endorsement (? Is that a relevant word) of my actual role model choices. The two of them have a lot more in common with most transfem people I've seen than Jenner does, by far and how.
And yeah, it's stupid that jerks are allowed to be on cereal boxes but budding cryptozoologists and Krav Maga experts aren't, just because they don't turn to infighting to make their "section" of the spectrum more exclusive and palatable to baby boomer trash. If our society didn't demonize service workers and fetishize trans people so much we wouldn't have these problems, but that's unfortunately getting into board-unsafe territory.

But again, thank you. It means a lot to know other people feel the way I do on this.

[Grytorm]

On the subject of people. I think there was a transgender League of Legends player who succeeded in her goal to reach a pro level. After that she did drop out because of depression and stress. I think that is what happened, but it is only a partly remembered event.

[Jaycemonde]

On the subject of people. I think there was a transgender League of Legends player who succeeded in her goal to reach a pro level. After that she did drop out because of depression and stress. I think that is what happened, but it is only a partly remembered event.

Part of that was due to an international league or some **** deciding it was against the rules for any team to have "any more than one gay or transsexual" (sic) player. Maybe it was actually DOTA 2, I don't really remember the details. I just remember being pissed off.

[Heliomance]

Part of that was due to an international league or some **** deciding it was against the rules for any team to have "any more than one gay or transsexual" (sic) player. Maybe it was actually DOTA 2, I don't really remember the details. I just remember being pissed off.

They backtracked on that one pretty damn sharpish.

[JusticeZero]

In in other news I found out a relative mine has been having a rough time with thier sexual identity.
Suffice to say I'm extremely disappointed and ashamed that this is the case. Since
I like to think of all of my relatives as pretty great people, and it sounds like some of them haven't been overly supportive of my other relative.
(snip)
I also live on the other side of the country, which makes it hard to help and I'm not sure if my help would be appreciated by the intended recipient. :smallsigh:

the OFFER for help would be very appreciated. They know you don't have much power to help, but it feels really nice to have someone who at least says "I support you.", even if their support isn't going to be very helpful. Publicly shaming and beating back the most awful people that you encounter because seriously, it's 2015 and THAT **** DOES NOT FLY ANYMORE would also be a good thing that doesn't stir things up. Just basic notice of a humanity fail.

Re: Caitlyn - Caitlyn is sort've the fast food of role models. Everyone sees her, she's very visible, and so for a lot of people she's the only role model they've got so far. There are better role models once you dig deeper, but Caitlyn's celebrity power is an asset of its own. She's not the high visibility icon we want, but she's the one we got - and she's not so much a bad role model as she is not particularly good at it.

[Jormengand]

I'm not sure how universal these are to other countries but if you already have a bank account you might be able to get a visa enabled debit card.

Yeah, problem is I don't know how to do that and the website is... unhelpful.


Do we get a pic?

No. :smallmad:

http://oi66.tinypic.com/35me3q8.jpg

Muahaha! I almost look like I have real breasts now!

[JNAProductions]

Damn Jor, you are looking fine!

[Lentrax]

Yeah, problem is I don't know how to do that and the website is... unhelpful.



No. :smallmad:

http://oi66.tinypic.com/35me3q8.jpg

Muahaha! I almost look like I have real breasts now!

*tacklehug*

Hello, good looking!

[Jormengand]

:smallredface:

Thank you...

[Svata]

I echo the above sentiments in regards to your attractiveness, Jor.

[Grytorm]

Yeah you look great like that. I'm glad you've stopped taking your pictures all formal and serious like. I can really see you in this one.

[Bobbybobby99]

Yeah, problem is I don't know how to do that and the website is... unhelpful.



No. :smallmad:

http://oi66.tinypic.com/35me3q8.jpg

Muahaha! I almost look like I have real breasts now!

You look great! And what do you mean by "almost" :smallwink: (though I'm probably not the best person to ask)

[Rain Dragon]

Any advice on how to handle this best? Or would it be better to wait until I was absolutely certain?

EDIT: My editing overlapped with the post below.

Hey, best of luck. I don't have any sane advice atm, but if you're ready to talk now then go for it. It is a huge help to have support in the form of close friends, at least in my experience.


The person he knew did exist and does exist, just because their gender might not be the same doesn't meant hey're fundamentally a different person now.

This is pretty important.
In fact, a couple of people I know didn't believe me for a time because they were expecting some sort of drastic change which for me just never came.


As...I guess a "cishet guy who observes things", I have some...thoughts on Caitlyn Jenner. They're not something I've heard said elsewhere, and while my overall opinion amounts to "meh", I can break down how I arrive at that.

Caitlyn Jenner isn't who the people who propped her up to show how wonderful and tolerant they are thought she was, because they didn't care to do their ****ing homework...and it's kinda blown up in everyone's face rather than just theirs. Seriously, just ask Caitlyn Jenner any question outside of her personal needs and she's...rather consistently awful. The whole underpinning of her worldview(political or otherwise) is egotistical selfishness. Among many other things I could say, it takes a staggering amount of doublethink and arrogance to be a homophobic lesbian.

It's...probably an unfair comparison, but she's like Justine Tunney for Baby Boomers. So in short, she's just a selfish jerkass.
So yeah, a porn starlet and a pugilista (is that a word?) are better role models (and better people) than someone safe enough to be on a Wheaties Box. Your instincts on that are spot-on, at least from where I'm sitting.

I didn't really know about any of that. That said, aside from the Vanity Fair thing I hadn't heard anything at all about her.


Part of that was due to an international league or some **** deciding it was against the rules for any team to have "any more than one gay or transsexual" (sic) player. Maybe it was actually DOTA 2, I don't really remember the details. I just remember being pissed off.

Dumb rule is dumb.


They backtracked on that one pretty damn sharpish.

That's a relief.


No. :smallmad:

http://oi66.tinypic.com/35me3q8.jpg

Muahaha! I almost look like I have real breasts now!

You look awesome! :smallbiggrin:

[Dire Moose]

Yeah, problem is I don't know how to do that and the website is... unhelpful.



No. :smallmad:

http://oi66.tinypic.com/35me3q8.jpg

Muahaha! I almost look like I have real breasts now!

Wow, they really do look natural. I hope I can look as beautiful as you someday.

[Heliomance]

Yeah, problem is I don't know how to do that and the website is... unhelpful.



No. :smallmad:

http://oi66.tinypic.com/35me3q8.jpg

Muahaha! I almost look like I have real breasts now!

I'm glad you're enjoying them! All I ask is that if they're still in a fit state if and when you no longer need them, you find someone else to pass them along to ^_^

[Jormengand]

I'm glad you're enjoying them! All I ask is that if they're still in a fit state if and when you no longer need them, you find someone else to pass them along to ^_^

I know a girl who'd look very cute with them. : 3

[Irish Musician]

http://oi66.tinypic.com/35me3q8.jpg

Muahaha! I almost look like I have real breasts now!

Yowza! :belkar:

[Icewraith]

@dire moose:

You're only a completely different person if you want to be.

[Dire Moose]

I think I'll wait on telling my friend until I'm more certain, to be honest. There's still one major reason why I'm holding back, and that's because I still identify more with male characters in movies, videogames, etc. than female ones. despite everything else I mentioned before. I still think this is something that needs to be settled, and I still need to wait on telling my friend until I can be sure.

[ArlEammon]

Perhaps you, Dire Moose, are projecting feelings of powerlessness into femininity instead of identifying with fictional characters.

[JusticeZero]

It could also be that most female characters, frankly, are pretty awful and uninspiring. It has been an issue for quite awhile..

[Psyren]

It could also be that most female characters, frankly, are pretty awful and uninspiring. It has been an issue for quite awhile..

And will continue to be one due to the underlying problem. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MostWritersAreMale)

[Ravens_cry]

Well, I went to a local thrift store today and looked around at shoes. I found some that are rather worn, but that also means they're pretty much broken in, and they're 10W woman's, which means I can fit into them comfortably, for lady shoes, that is. And they're super cute, with 1 1/2 inch heels with a little buckle. They give me unwanted height, but no getting around that. I also found this simple, but nice, purple scarf that I could also wear as a sash. It's really helping my confidence just to go in and buy things. While I have had people judge me when I buy this stuff, generally people are OK when money is involved. That is, if they're the ones getting it.

[Rain Dragon]

I think I'll wait on telling my friend until I'm more certain, to be honest. There's still one major reason why I'm holding back, and that's because I still identify more with male characters in movies, videogames, etc. than female ones. despite everything else I mentioned before. I still think this is something that needs to be settled, and I still need to wait on telling my friend until I can be sure.

It could also be that most female characters, frankly, are pretty awful and uninspiring. It has been an issue for quite awhile..

Yeah, it's sad but true... :smallfrown:

I'm having a mind blank when it comes to great female characters, alas. There are some in obscure SciFi books I'm reading at the moment. An author I remember when I was younger is Tamora Pierce, though I didn't read many of her books beyond the first set of the Circle of Magic ones. I've heard a lot about her strong female characters from a friend so have been meaning to quickly reread those (if I can find them).


Well, I went to a local thrift store today and looked around at shoes. I found some that are rather worn, but that also means they're pretty much broken in, and they're 10W woman's, which means I can fit into them comfortably, for lady shoes, that is. And they're super cute, with 1 1/2 inch heels with a little buckle. They give me unwanted height, but no getting around that. I also found this simple, but nice, purple scarf that I could also wear as a sash. It's really helping my confidence just to go in and buy things. While I have had people judge me when I buy this stuff, generally people are OK when money is involved. That is, if they're the ones getting it.

That's pretty awesome. Yay purple!

Ouch. Yay confidence, but people shouldn't be so rude in the first place. :/

[Syless]

On the note of good female characters, Nintendo announced today that the 3DS Hyrule Warriors will include a female Link (http://www.polygon.com/2015/11/12/9725838/hyrule-warriors-legends-3ds-girl-link-linkle)!

My girlfriend's response on hearing the news: 'Congrats to Link on completing her transition!'

[ArlEammon]

Just interested if people in here are in Arizona/Mesa/Phoenix area. . . I have a date, but back up is always good if my crush doesn't crush me back. ;)
hey folks. What advice do you have for dating? I am about to date a crush.

[Comrade]

I'm having a mind blank when it comes to great female characters, alas. There are some in obscure SciFi books I'm reading at the moment. An author I remember when I was younger is Tamora Pierce, though I didn't read many of her books beyond the first set of the Circle of Magic ones. I've heard a lot about her strong female characters from a friend so have been meaning to quickly reread those (if I can find them).

A lot of the sci-fi/fantasy books I've been reading recently tend to have an emphasis on the ill-defined 'strong female character' (which usually just means a book with a diverse, fleshed out female cast... sad that that's so rare). Dreamships (and its sequel , Dreaming Metal), Trouble And Her Friends, Woman on the Edge of Time, Embassytown, the Elemental Logic series, all had great female casts (and a lot of them feature LGBT characters/couples too).

[golentan]

I think I might have broken my fiance. :smalleek: (in a good way, I think?)


Just interested if people in here are in Arizona/Mesa/Phoenix area. . . I have a date, but back up is always good if my crush doesn't crush me back. ;)
hey folks. What advice do you have for dating? I am about to date a crush.

Don't plan for failure. Don't try to "win" them by being someone you're not. Just go in thinking "Might work, might not, and we both have to agree for it to work," have fun, talk, maybe touch each other if the moment is right and you're both into it, get to know them better...

[Dire Moose]

On the note of good female characters, Nintendo announced today that the 3DS Hyrule Warriors will include a female Link (http://www.polygon.com/2015/11/12/9725838/hyrule-warriors-legends-3ds-girl-link-linkle)!

My girlfriend's response on hearing the news: 'Congrats to Link on completing her transition!'

WHAT?

OK, ok, ok, whatever it takes I have to play this now.

[Ravens_cry]

That's pretty awesome. Yay purple!

Ouch. Yay confidence, but people shouldn't be so rude in the first place. :/
The last person who was is dead now.
Heh, that sounds terrible doesn't it?
Anyway, here's the latest picture of me. I got some nice compliments of how this outfit turned out. You can't see it, but I am wearing an embroidered jean skirt on my bottom.
http://i1105.photobucket.com/albums/h355/ravens_cry/Morgan_2015_colour_zpsbbpluhfk.jpg

[Dire Moose]

Awww, you really are a cute one, raven.

...I have got to get some more girl clothes and put one of me up here.

[JNAProductions]

The last person who was is dead now.
Heh, that sounds terrible doesn't it?
Anyway, here's the latest picture of me. I got some nice compliments of how this outfit turned out. You can't see it, but I am wearing an embroidered jean skirt on my bottom.
http://i1105.photobucket.com/albums/h355/ravens_cry/Morgan_2015_colour_zpsbbpluhfk.jpg

You look derpy-cute. I like it. :)

[Jaycemonde]

Olivia Dunham from Fringe is a great one, as are all of her alternative forms (both one-off joke episode Noir Dunham and the alternate universe (and alternate timeline, which is different) Olivia. I always default to her when this subject comes up for a few good reasons. The first is that she's not a Vasquez knock-off like nine out of ten Strong Female Characters. The second is that while she's a law enforcement official, she has lots of quirks that point to a somewhat lax following of the actual rules when they would interfere with finding justice for the victims of crimes. The third is that she's still got lots of faults and bad points, beyond the standard-issue stubbornness of most SFCs, and she's also got vulnerabilities and things that scare her, but they don't ever actually affect her core character (meaning her story arc doesn't center on them) until one specific incident about two thirds of the way through the show, and that one is handled very discretely and tastefully. Fourth, it's heavily implied that Prime Universe (aka Main Character) Dunham is somewhere on the autism spectrum, because of her combination of insanely good mathematical skills (and photographic memory) and her skewed sense of emotional displays, and she actually does bring it up and discuss it with other characters, wondering if it's bad that she isn't "normal" in the regard of being disgusted by horrific crime scenes or not seeing any issues with drinking puréed tapeworms to jog her memory (that last bit is kind of an extremely specific example, but it makes sense in context). Coming from a family with an autistic brother and mother, and probably being autistic myself (I have a lot of the traits, like stimming, but I've never been tested for it), I found it really nice that a sci-fi show had such a nice portrayal of neurodivergency, to say nothing of lots of mental disorders like psychosis--trust me, it's not cringe-inducing).

(There's also another well-written autism spectrum character who's a bit more obvious, but that's a super good heartwarming episode and I don't want to spoil anything.)

I don't mean to gush so much about the show, but GHHHHHH. Olivia Dunham was one of the first characters on TV I ever actually identified with to a major extent. And she has good trigger discipline, too, which is a huge turn-on for my inner Operator.


Also, there's always Scully.

[Dire Moose]

OK, new gender icon is up!

Still confused, still unsure, but if I don't at least try this now I'll never know, so I'm going for it.

[JNAProductions]

Yay! Miss Moose is back! :P

I support you 100% as a person, Moose, regardless of where your gender ends up. You're still people, and people are worth supporting.

[Grytorm]

The last person who was is dead now.
Heh, that sounds terrible doesn't it?
Anyway, here's the latest picture of me. I got some nice compliments of how this outfit turned out. You can't see it, but I am wearing an embroidered jean skirt on my bottom.
http://i1105.photobucket.com/albums/h355/ravens_cry/Morgan_2015_colour_zpsbbpluhfk.jpg

I like your hair, it is very stylish and quite sensible looking.

[Dire Moose]

Yay! Miss Moose is back! :P

I support you 100% as a person, Moose, regardless of where your gender ends up. You're still people, and people are worth supporting.

Aww, thank you.

And I apologize for going back and forth all the time in the last month. It's all very confusing to have one's identity challenged and I appreciate you all standing by me all this time.

Also, I'm not sure how comfortable I am with being called "miss." I suppose my mental image of myself is still male at this point. Kind of like how Roy's appearance in the afterlife was still like he'd been in life since he'd only just died, I guess? Anyway, this will still take a lot of getting used to. Especially considering I have no idea how to do anything feminine.

[JNAProductions]

Then plain ol' Moose it is. *Glomps Moose* (Iffin that's okay, of course.)

[Svata]

Aww, thank you.

And I apologize for going back and forth all the time in the last month. It's all very confusing to have one's identity challenged and I appreciate you all standing by me all this time.

Also, I'm not sure how comfortable I am with being called "miss." I suppose my mental image of myself is still male at this point. Kind of like how Roy's appearance in the afterlife was still like he'd been in life since he'd only just died, I guess? Anyway, this will still take a lot of getting used to. Especially considering I have no idea how to do anything feminine.

*Gives the Moose a resounding high five*

[Dire Moose]

Not sure how easy it is to glomp a moose, but sure!

*high, um, hooves? Svata back*

[Serpentine]

Tamora Pierce, a lot of Anne McCaffery's work, Terry Pratchett's Witches novels (and some others), The Hunger Games, Jasper Fford's Thursday Next books are good places to start for books, and I also did up a really big list of kids' books with good female protaganists if that's worth digging up.
For shows, there's quite a lot lately (especially (fantasy-)police procedurals) with good female characters, often with the male co-star being the civilian - e.g. Forever, Castle, Elementary, Sleepy Hollow, Grimm (a bit of a mixed bag there, though). Bones is particularly good, as well, I think. Bones herself is incredibly logical (to a fault, even), is a leader in her scientific field, and is extremely intelligent. She isn't classically beautiful and she's also definitely not particularly thin, especially by TV's standards, but they never portray her as intrinsically undesirable or anything. It's only rarely that her gender comes up at all, but it's also never suggested that she's any less of a woman for having a number of (traditionally/stereotypically) masculine traits. <3 Bones' character.
Games... I dunno. I haven't really been playing much, and the ones I do you can choose your genders usually (At the moment my Avernum game is 100% lady adventurers :3). I find it a bit sad that in all the gaming news I've heard about recently, I've heard about two where you can have a dog, but none where you can play a woman.

[Ravens_cry]

I like your hair, it is very stylish and quite sensible looking.
Thanks. It's a wig, but I like it a lot. It truly is my hair, even if I didn't grow it. The first time I wore it, I felt so wonderfully feminine.:smallsmile: Sadly, testosterone poisoning has killed (literally) any chance of the kind that is on my scalp working alone.

[YossarianLives]

@Dire Moose
Glad to hear you're getting things figured out Dire Moose. As I myself have discovered, figuring out this gender stuff is very, very confusing.


@Ravens_cry
I love the hair. It really suits you!

[Ravens_cry]

You look derpy-cute. I like it. :)
Heh, thanks:smallredface: I was a little tipsy at the time, as it was at the end of a good get together with friends who did not judge and consistently used proper pronouns.


@Ravens_cry
I love the hair. It really suits you!
Thank you!:smallbiggrin:

[JusticeZero]

Also, I'm not sure how comfortable I am with being called "miss." I suppose my mental image of myself is still male at this point. Kind of like how Roy's appearance in the afterlife was still like he'd been in life since he'd only just died, I guess? Anyway, this will still take a lot of getting used to. Especially considering I have no idea how to do anything feminine.
Oh thank heavens I'm not the only one having trouble! My family is getting better at using "they" and I have been really nervous that something is wrong with me for not having waves of contentment and normalcy when I hear it.
Still deciding how much I need to say at work. Customers are just a small wince but they can't know better. Coworkers are slightly more frustrating.

[Astrella]

Aww, thank you.

And I apologize for going back and forth all the time in the last month. It's all very confusing to have one's identity challenged and I appreciate you all standing by me all this time.

Also, I'm not sure how comfortable I am with being called "miss." I suppose my mental image of myself is still male at this point. Kind of like how Roy's appearance in the afterlife was still like he'd been in life since he'd only just died, I guess? Anyway, this will still take a lot of getting used to. Especially considering I have no idea how to do anything feminine.

It's alright, it takes time to a) figure it out and b) adjust your mental self-image.

Heck, I've been on HRT for almost three years now and I still occasionally dream of myself as a guy or accidently misgender myself. Don't fret about it. :)

[goto124]

To be honest, I've always thought that 'strong female characters' meant 'strong characters who happen to have female bits'. Which means 'strong female characters' would be 'just like a male strong character, same script, but with an actor of a different sex and the pronouns swapped around'. Things like that.

[Serpentine]

It varies. Sometimes they're good characters that just happen to be women, and if you swapped their genders they'd be pretty much the same. Sometimes the fact they're a woman is a major defining feature of the character, that couldn't be done or that would be very different if it was a man. Compare Ripley from the first Alien movie with Ripley from the last two Alien movies. The main goal is diversity of character types.

[Dire Moose]

Thanks. It's a wig, but I like it a lot. It truly is my hair, even if I didn't grow it. The first time I wore it, I felt so wonderfully feminine.:smallsmile: Sadly, testosterone poisoning has killed (literally) any chance of the kind that is on my scalp working alone.

I've been trying to grow my hair out myself since September, but it hasn't gotten very far. I had really long hair in high school and figured I could grow it back to that length, but maybe at 28 I can't do it like that anymore.

..also, my Pathfinder group (only 3 people) knows about me now and they're fine with it. I'm still trying to think of a way to let my best friend know without scaring him to the point of alienating him though. I know "if he can't accept you, he was never your friend," but I absolutely cannot bear to have him leave me at this point. At all.

[Ravens_cry]

I've been trying to grow my hair out myself since September, but it hasn't gotten very far. I had really long hair in high school and figured I could grow it back to that length, but maybe at 28 I can't do it like that anymore.

Yeah, the effect is more Robert Pickton than Dolly Parton.:smallyuk: So wigs it is!


..also, my Pathfinder group (only 3 people) knows about me now and they're fine with it. I'm still trying to think of a way to let my best friend know without scaring him to the point of alienating him though. I know "if he can't accept you, he was never your friend," but I absolutely cannot bear to have him leave me at this point. At all.
I really don't have an answer to that, sorry. Sometimes, you just got to say it and let them come to terms with it themselves. You can say things in all manner of different ways, but, when it comes down to it, the ball is in their court once you say it.

[Heliomance]

Hormones are really weird. The past couple of weeks, I've been finding tears springing to my eyes really easily - as in, I so much as think about a piece of music I find stirring and my eyes start leaking. So strange, and somewhat annoying.

[Ifni]

I've been trying to grow my hair out myself since September, but it hasn't gotten very far. I had really long hair in high school and figured I could grow it back to that length, but maybe at 28 I can't do it like that anymore.

How long did it take to grow that long in high school? Two months is not very long, for hair growth. I'm a cis woman, I got my hair cut to ~standard male length last May (i.e. 18 months ago), and it's now a couple of inches past my shoulders - if I tie it up in a ponytail, the tail is maybe 3-4 inches long. I had waist-length hair before I cut it, but that was about five years worth of growth. I mean, it may indeed be a change in your body since high school, but I honestly wouldn't expect to see much change over two months, except that if you have a fringe it might start to get in your eyes.

Good luck with your friend!

[Dire Moose]

Hormones are really weird. The past couple of weeks, I've been finding tears springing to my eyes really easily - as in, I so much as think about a piece of music I find stirring and my eyes start leaking. So strange, and somewhat annoying.

I'm on a hair trigger for that as it is lately... probably means I'll be a hopeless mess when I'm where you are.

And I've let my friend know I'll be calling him Monday evening with something really important, which I've already warned him will be difficult to hear. I did ask him that regardless of what I said, he remain friends with me.

I'm still very nervous though. This isn't something people have to hear all that often.

[Astrella]

I miss being able to cry... rubbish anti-anxiety meds.

My mom's been in a foul mood for two days now, and only she's allowed to have worries. I have a surgical consult about orchi / tracheal shave Tuesday and I don't know what to do but she's minging in and deciding what I need and when I need it. I should essentially not plan anything on the off chance I might get my work contract extended. My brother doens't even bother looking for work but gets and appartment paid for him, I live at home and have to pay rent to her and still get contantly guilt tripped about money and my healthcare.

[Togath]

Not sure if I've mentioned this here, but I finally came out to my family about being trans. ^_^
I'm still not quite brave enough to present as female full time... But I've been doing it a lot now, at least in my own home.
I haven't really been keeping track of the forums much lately, but hopefully people are doing well, and *hugs* to anyone who isn't nya.

I also finally got away from my abusive father, which is another plus.

Also got to dress up for Halloween finally this year. ^w^
http://img.prntscr.com/img?url=http://i.imgur.com/CbwpB7W.png

[Iruka]

I find it a bit sad that in all the gaming news I've heard about recently, I've heard about two where you can have a dog, but none where you can play a woman.

The next Assassin's Creed will allow to play a female character.

[Athedia]

Not to mention Tomb Raider and Fallout 4 now out. Or two new IPs being developed Horizon: Zero Dawn and Recore. Or the new Mirrors Edge coming out soon.

[Jaycemonde]

Not to mention Tomb Raider and Fallout 4 now out. Or two new IPs being developed Horizon: Zero Dawn and Record. Or the new Mirrors Edge coming out soon.

I find it hard to believe that someone hasn't heard of Fallout 4, considering there are about four hundred thousand people playing it at any one time AND it has a dog you can put goggles on AND it lets you date a robot with a buzz saw arm. I think people might just be assuming you can't play as a woman. For some reason.

Also Unreal Tournament 4. It's got a pretty sweet Necris character named Viss, though I can't stand playing as her ever since they jacked up her jaw texture and haven't bothered fixing it. I'm weird about stuff like shiny jet-black armored body parts not being shiny jet-black armored anymore. But yeah, she's cool. Sort of like a utilitarian sci-fi version of Frankenstein's monster, mixed with an android. If anyone's read James Knapp's State of Decay series, you'll know what I'm talking about. Techno-zombies with morbid catch-phrases are cool.

[Coidzor]

It does sort of go without saying that the latest game in a series where you've always been able to pick or make male and female characters to play as would continue to have that feature and it'd only be noteworthy if they had suddenly decided to take that feature out of the games for some dunderheaded reason or another.

[Rain Dragon]

The last person who was is dead now.
Heh, that sounds terrible doesn't it?
Anyway, here's the latest picture of me. I got some nice compliments of how this outfit turned out. You can't see it, but I am wearing an embroidered jean skirt on my bottom.
http://i1105.photobucket.com/albums/h355/ravens_cry/Morgan_2015_colour_zpsbbpluhfk.jpg

A bit. :smalltongue:

You look nice!


OK, new gender icon is up!

Still confused, still unsure, but if I don't at least try this now I'll never know, so I'm going for it.

/fistpump

Best of luck.


I've been trying to grow my hair out myself since September, but it hasn't gotten very far. I had really long hair in high school and figured I could grow it back to that length, but maybe at 28 I can't do it like that anymore.

I don't know how aging affects hair, but I'm certain with patience you'll get at least shoulder length hair soon enough.


Not sure if I've mentioned this here, but I finally came out to my family about being trans. ^_^
I'm still not quite brave enough to present as female full time... But I've been doing it a lot now, at least in my own home.
I haven't really been keeping track of the forums much lately, but hopefully people are doing well, and *hugs* to anyone who isn't nya.

I also finally got away from my abusive father, which is another plus.

Also got to dress up for Halloween finally this year. ^w^
http://img.prntscr.com/img?url=http://i.imgur.com/CbwpB7W.png

Oh, cool!

You look cool. :smallsmile:

Re - female characters - Oh cool, a whole lot of new things to look up. :smalltongue:

[Dire Moose]

I can't see Togath's picture.

[Jormengand]

I can't see Togath's picture.

Me neither. :c

[Lentrax]

Not sure if I've mentioned this here, but I finally came out to my family about being trans. ^_^
I'm still not quite brave enough to present as female full time... But I've been doing it a lot now, at least in my own home.
I haven't really been keeping track of the forums much lately, but hopefully people are doing well, and *hugs* to anyone who isn't nya.

I also finally got away from my abusive father, which is another plus.

Also got to dress up for Halloween finally this year. ^w^
http://i.imgur.com/CbwpB7W.png

Try looking now...

Hope you don't mind Togath. If you do, I'll erase the link out.

[Togath]

I don't mind. Not sure what is going wrong(still displaying on my end for now, but I have had a lot of trouble posting pictures of any sort lately)

[Lentrax]

It's the img.prntscr.com part that was causing the problem in this case.

[Florian]

It varies. Sometimes they're good characters that just happen to be women, and if you swapped their genders they'd be pretty much the same. Sometimes the fact they're a woman is a major defining feature of the character, that couldn't be done or that would be very different if it was a man. Compare Ripley from the first Alien movie with Ripley from the last two Alien movies. The main goal is diversity of character types.

Mind explaining that a bit? Maybe I'm dense or I've become too indifferent, but I don't see the difference here.

[Jaycemonde]

Mind explaining that a bit? Maybe I'm dense or I've become too indifferent, but I don't see the difference here.

Might I just quickly suggest talking about how changing cis male to cis female characters may or may not affect their character traits (and related topics) in the Q&A thread so we don't get that same stupid fight from the last thread? I nearly didn't come back after seeing that and I'm pretty sure everyone is still sore from it. Everyone who didn't leave, anyway.

[Jormengand]

Try looking now...

Oah, pretty. : 3

[ear_spoon]

Hi all.

I guess I need some support and opinions. Not that there's anything really painful happening to me. It's more that I feel I've been turning in circles. Discussions with friends don't bring anything new. I don't want to go talk to a doctor. It's not like I feel I have health issues.

First, a few words of disclaimer. For extra anonimity, I created a new account for posting in this thread. I'm discussing very personnal things. I don't feel at all confortable posting them publicly on the net. I'll try to use the glossary sparingly. Instead, I'll try to describe how I feel things. I'll talk about my experience, with no attempt at generalization.

I was assigned male at birth. No corrective surgery as far as I know.
I feel neither 100% a woman nor 100% a man. I don't like using labels for this. If pressed, depending on mood, I'd choose "agendered" or "genderfluid".
In the public space, I appear as a boy. Mostly because I feel it makes things easier. Also, because I don't really care about what strangers perceive. In private, depending on the company and my mood, I like to appear, as often, either as a woman or as a man. Inside, I feel mostly the same regardless how I appear.
I have issues with my body as it is. I'd like it to be more androgynous. I've already made some efforts in that direction. More are planned.

These last years, I've been a slut. By that I mean I've accepted intimacy, regardless of my lack of attraction (physical or emotional), as long as the person was nice to me. For many reasons, I'm tired of this. (I still think sluts are the best persons and there should be a lot more of them. I just don't have the patience for the complications anymore.)

Right now, I'd like to find someone with whom to be in a commited relationship. As long as I was dilly-dallying, fooling around and plucking flowers, I didn't care that much who was the next one, as long as there was a next one. I believe that strong physical attraction is necessary for a long lasting non platonical relationship.

In what follows, I'm talking only about physical and sexual attraction, not emotional bonding.
As a kid and teenager, I only felt attracted to girls. I was extremely shy. I couldn't date at all during my teenage years.
As a young adult, I only dated heterosexual cis women. Most didn't like my more feminine side. Some didn't care. When I started meeting more non-heterosexual women, I also had a few partners who actually enjoyed my more feminine side.
Then, I started feeling attracted to some men, but not that often. I took time before I met a man with mutual attraction. My few relationships with men have been disapointing until now.
Sometime in the middle of all this, I realized I'm way more attracted, in general, to people whose body and general appearance straddles the line between genders. Specifically, I'm often way more attracted to feminine AMAB persons. For example, but not only, very physically effeminate gay men and trans women. I am not confusing them. I'm just talking about what kind of body and appearance I am physically attracted too. I'm also talking about body type and features, not only about what is between their legs.

I've never dated a person for whom I feel such a physical attaction. (There were some stories going on for a few nights, however my partners were only interested in intercourse, not in romantical relationships.) I guess it's in part because they're not so common in my social circle. Also, I was too busy handling a few relationships with strong emotional bonding that took me a lot of time and energy.

That's were my issues start. In an irrelevant order:
First, whenever I'm in front of a stranger I'm strongly attracted too, out of shyness, I always become quite agitated or very uneasy. Since I appear as a man publicly, most of these strangers usually assume I'm acting that way because I'm an evil hetero-normative guy who resents them. (It more rarely happens when meeting cis women, but they justly assume that I'm a dork.) I really don't know how to prevent that.
Second, until now, in my experience, persons with the kind of body I'm attracted to tend either to be attracted to masculine men or to be strictly lesbians. I've actually managed to pose as a masculine man. The couple times I made the pretense last past the bedroom door, I had very bad experiences.
Third, this applies only to androsexual trans women: the few I've met got really upset when they felt I was attracted to them because of their body's androgynous features. To them, it means I'm attracted to a person they were, not the person they are. For the same kind of reasons, they weren't interested in relationships with non-heterosexual men. Having experienced a few difficult discussions, I don't even anymore know how to broach the subject without hurting someone or being labelled as a "trans chaser". I'm only describing my own experience. I make no attempt at generalization. I'm not saying all trans women are like this.

I sometimes think that the only solution is to continue meeting new people until I stumble upon someone with whom it just works. I wonder however if there are other things I could do to make things work better for me. Most of my partners were people met through either the internet or through my social circle (half and half, more or less). The ratio of LGBTAIetc people in my social circle is very low. I quit dating websites and applications some time ago because they made me feel lonely and depressed. I could start going to bars/pubs/clubs/parties that are close to the local LGBTAIetc scene, however, my shyness will probably prevent me from flirting with anyone.

Am I overthinking all this? Is there something I can do? Should I just be patient and continue as usual?
At the point where I am, any opinion is welcome. (Just be nice, huh, it's difficult for me posting all that.)

[AmberVael]

Third, this applies only to androsexual trans women: the few I've met got really upset when they felt I was attracted to them because of their body's androgynous features. To them, it means I'm attracted to a person they were, not the person they are. For the same kind of reasons, they weren't interested in relationships with non-heterosexual men. Having experienced a few difficult discussions, I don't even anymore know how to broach the subject without hurting someone or being labelled as a "trans chaser". I'm only describing my own experience. I make no attempt at generalization. I'm not saying all trans women are like this.

I don't have a lot to contribute, but I feel like I can address this topic.

I don't think there is anything wrong at all with being attracted to androgyny. However, many transwomen are exactly the wrong place to look for that. For a transwoman in the midst of a very awkward transition, focusing on that awkward state that they're longing to get through and wanting that will be quite disconcerting. For a transwoman attempting to pass, pointing out where they're having the most difficulty passing is going to be very disheartening.

But even putting that aside, think of it this way: the very things you're attracted to are the things they are generally trying to eliminate. If you're attracted to them, then they're not satisfied with where they're at. If they're satisfied with where they're at, you're probably not attracted to them anymore. In short, its a big incompatibility. You can't both be happy at the same time.

Now, there are transwomen out there who are more comfortable with or even embrace some androgyny... but not all of us want that (probably most of us don't, really). You're probably better off making sure that's what they want before moving attempting any kind of move on your attraction, otherwise the chance that it will end in humiliation for everyone is undesirably high.

[Dire Moose]

I finally managed to come out to my best friend today. He actually took it really well and said he'd still be my friend no matter what I ultimately decided to do.

EDIT: Apparently, one of the teenagers he had supervised as a camp counselor before had come out to him about the same, so it wasn't that big a deal to him.

[Comrade]

I finally managed to come out to my best friend today. He actually took it really well and said he'd still be my friend no matter what I ultimately decided to do.

That's great to hear! Happy it worked out that way.

[AmberVael]

I finally managed to come out to my best friend today. He actually took it really well and said he'd still be my friend no matter what I ultimately decided to do.

EDIT: Apparently, one of the teenagers he had supervised as a camp counselor before had come out to him about the same, so it wasn't that big a deal to him.

Hooray! Supportive friends are really nice to have.

[Svata]

*offers high fives to my paleontologist friend* (er, wold you consider us friends? I'll chuck that if you find it uncomfortable)

[ear_spoon]

I don't have a lot to contribute, but I feel like I can address this topic.
Thanks for the answer. You're right, I should give-up on that front.

[Dire Moose]

*offers high fives to my paleontologist friend* (er, wold you consider us friends? I'll chuck that if you find it uncomfortable)

Yes, Svata, I would indeed. *returns high five*

...and the acceptance from my friend doesn't really feel like a victory, I must confess. On the contrary, I'm even more depressed now. With people starting to adjust now, it's sinking in that this is the way it's going to be from here on out. All of my previous sense of normal is gone, and I need to start relating to people in a different way. Almost like my former identity is slowly dying in front of me, and I hate it.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I've been hoping this was just a phase.

[Svata]

Well, with any major change, desire for things to stop changing are natural. As someone who has averaged moving once a year for the past decade, I completely understand, even if your situation is more extreme than that, which would only exacerbate the situation. *offers all the hugs and support, as well as a sympathetic ear*

[Astrella]

@ear_spoon; seconding AmberVael, but have you considered dating someone who is non-binary as well? Or just someone cis / binary trans who likes androgyny. There are people that feel comfortable being androgenous is what I mean.

[ear_spoon]

@ear_spoon; seconding AmberVael, but have you considered dating someone who is non-binary as well? Or just someone cis / binary trans who likes androgyny. There are people that feel comfortable being androgenous is what I mean.
I'd be fine with someone that's non-binary. I'd actually be fine with anyone as long as there's mutual attraction, both physical and emotional.
EDIT: the examples I gave were from my experience until now. They didn't mean any more than that.

The question is more about how to find out someone is fine with why I'm attracted to them? What is OK or not to do while I don't know yet?
I'm asking honestly. It just feels weird to walk-up to someone you don't know and ask: "how do you define your gender?"
On my side, I wouldn't feel comfortable if someone I don't know asks me the same. I might even feel offended.

[Florian]

@ear_spoon:

Out of idle curriosity, what size of community do you life in?

[ear_spoon]

It's a large western world city. A couple millions.

[Florian]

It's a large western world city. A couple millions.

Thing is, you're caught between a rock and a hard place and there's no way to change that. I can relate to what you're attracted to, that's not an issue, but you're in a position where you find yourself with more "false positives" than "positives". In the end, you'll either end up finding some social circles where your prefered target group is to be found (unlikely) or you run the risk of alienating people by being more or less direkt. That approach may seem rude, but being a minority with a taste bordering on the fetish, what else is there?

[Rain Dragon]

I don't mind. Not sure what is going wrong(still displaying on my end for now, but I have had a lot of trouble posting pictures of any sort lately)

I hope this isn't unwanted, but.

Images seem to work best if the url portion starts with the 'http' part and ends in an image file type thing like .png, .gif, .jpg, etc. (this latter part is not always necessary, but most of the images that I've had not display for some people lack this for some reason).


I finally managed to come out to my best friend today. He actually took it really well and said he'd still be my friend no matter what I ultimately decided to do.

EDIT: Apparently, one of the teenagers he had supervised as a camp counselor before had come out to him about the same, so it wasn't that big a deal to him.

Hurrah! That's great news!


Yes, Svata, I would indeed. *returns high five*

...and the acceptance from my friend doesn't really feel like a victory, I must confess. On the contrary, I'm even more depressed now. With people starting to adjust now, it's sinking in that this is the way it's going to be from here on out. All of my previous sense of normal is gone, and I need to start relating to people in a different way. Almost like my former identity is slowly dying in front of me, and I hate it.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I've been hoping this was just a phase.

I really get that. (When I told my family, I sometimes wanted to take it all back and have things go to the way they were and stability for the first couple of months.) I'm sure you'll adjust and you'll be happy, but I totally get feeling that way in the face of such a change.

Good luck. And I hope you feel less depressed soon!

[Astrella]

I had a nice talk with the gender team therapist yesterday, and had a surgical consult and I'm having an orchi in February as a first? step. (Still have lots of fears regarding vaginoplasty, so am not sure in that regard yet. But not needing anti androgens that tire me out a lot anymore and parting with a part of my body that I feel dysphoric about is good to start)

[noparlpf]

I had a nice talk with the gender team therapist yesterday, and had a surgical consult and I'm having an orchi in February as a first? step. (Still have lots of fears regarding vaginoplasty, so am not sure in that regard yet. But not needing anti androgens that tire me out a lot anymore and parting with a part of my body that I feel dysphoric about is good to start)

Congrats! It's still weird to me that human medicine needs that long in advance to schedule it, but that's great.

[Nemirthel]

So I've been lurking here for a while, and I think it's time I introduce myself. I'm a transgender (albeit pre-everything) university student in the US, and I'm trying to deal with the fact that I probably won't be able to start transitioning for about another year (due to financial reasons). I really don't have a lot to say at the moment, but I figured I ought to introduce myself now instead of waiting.

[Lentrax]

So I've been lurking here for a while, and I think it's time I introduce myself. I'm a transgender (albeit pre-everything) university student in the US, and I'm trying to deal with the fact that I probably won't be able to start transitioning for about another year (due to financial reasons). I really don't have a lot to say at the moment, but I figured I ought to introduce myself now instead of waiting.

*welcome hugs*

Welcome!

[Svata]

Congrats! It's still weird to me that human medicine needs that long in advance to schedule it, but that's great.

"Human medicine"? Is there something you need to tell us about?

[Lentrax]

"Human medicine"? Is there something you need to tell us about?

Nah. Nope works with animals.

[Miriel]

Getting validation as a woman is hard.

[Svata]

Nah. Nope works with animals.

*Feels immensely idiotoc*

[golentan]

*Feels immensely idiotoc*

We two (Nope and I) being in vet medicine have what may be either a skewed or more unbiased view of a lot of biological weirdness and medical practice quirks. One of my mentors while nursing her infant son for the first time successfully haggled the hospital administrator down on the price of her c-section apparently.

The quote she told me: "You're charging me 3 times market value for this drug and 20 times the cost of this scalpel blade, I do all the reordering for my vet hospital and unless prices have changed shockingly in the last 6 hours you can't charge me German steel prices for a Pakistani instrument pack and expect me to just knuckle under and pay it."

[Dire Moose]

Everyone?

I apologize for having to do this again. To be honest, while it looks like being trans may fit the facts on a purely intellectual level, and while it is seemingly the only explanation for a whole set of experiences I've had that were never explained, that isn't sufficient. I need to be sure of this on a deeper and more emotional level than what I have now.

I need to know for sure that this is right. I will need to explore myself more, talk to a therapist, and try a lot of new things before I can be sure enough that transition is something I really want to be doing. And during this timeframe, trying to label myself as anything definitive has only caused me to question that later.

As such, I really need some time to decide, and I don't want to label myself until I do.

[Astrella]

@Dire Moose; no need to be sorry, take your time to figure stuff out properly, it's not an easy thing. :)


Congrats! It's still weird to me that human medicine needs that long in advance to schedule it, but that's great.

Well it's cause my current work contract ends then, and since I'm not really allowed to lift much during recovery I couldn't really work then.


Getting validation as a woman is hard.

Validation of your womanhood or just being validated while being a woman? (Cause both are hard. :/ )

[Skeppio]

Everyone?

I apologize for having to do this again. To be honest, while it looks like being trans may fit the facts on a purely intellectual level, and while it is seemingly the only explanation for a whole set of experiences I've had that were never explained, that isn't sufficient. I need to be sure of this on a deeper and more emotional level than what I have now.

I need to know for sure that this is right. I will need to explore myself more, talk to a therapist, and try a lot of new things before I can be sure enough that transition is something I really want to be doing. And during this timeframe, trying to label myself as anything definitive has only caused me to question that later.

As such, I really need some time to decide, and I don't want to label myself until I do.

That is completely fair. This sort of thing is not easy to come to a conclusion on, a lot of people question themselves for a long time. And that's only logical, really, it's a big thing. :smallsmile:
I hope you can find what definitely feels right for you. *offers hugs*

[AmberVael]

Everyone?

I apologize for having to do this again. To be honest, while it looks like being trans may fit the facts on a purely intellectual level, and while it is seemingly the only explanation for a whole set of experiences I've had that were never explained, that isn't sufficient. I need to be sure of this on a deeper and more emotional level than what I have now.

I need to know for sure that this is right. I will need to explore myself more, talk to a therapist, and try a lot of new things before I can be sure enough that transition is something I really want to be doing. And during this timeframe, trying to label myself as anything definitive has only caused me to question that later.

As such, I really need some time to decide, and I don't want to label myself until I do.

I think this is a very reasonable and sensible thing to do. Its really easy to dismiss the emotional as irrelevant to the intellectual and logical, but its really important to factor it in especially in situations like this. The emotional is a massive part of what determines you, who you are, what you want, even if maybe that doesn't seem very sensible.

And I applaud your courage in being able to step back, to admit that maybe this isn't quite right, at least not yet. Admitting you may be wrong about your own identity is hard, especially after you've already taken some nervewracking steps on the subject.

This is not something anyone needs to apologize about. Determining who we are, being willing to experiment and make mistakes is a right. We are entitled to the pursuit of discovering ourselves, and even a mistake is a sign of someone pursuing that goal, showing progress and bravery. It doesn't require forgiveness. If anything, it demands more encouragement and approval than is usually given.

[noparlpf]

We two (Nope and I) being in vet medicine have what may be either a skewed or more unbiased view of a lot of biological weirdness and medical practice quirks. One of my mentors while nursing her infant son for the first time successfully haggled the hospital administrator down on the price of her c-section apparently.

The quote she told me: "You're charging me 3 times market value for this drug and 20 times the cost of this scalpel blade, I do all the reordering for my vet hospital and unless prices have changed shockingly in the last 6 hours you can't charge me German steel prices for a Pakistani instrument pack and expect me to just knuckle under and pay it."

Hah, that's great.


Well it's cause my current work contract ends then, and since I'm not really allowed to lift much during recovery I couldn't really work then.

Ah, that makes sense. Generally a good idea to time surgery for time off work. Good luck.

[Lycunadari]

I had a nice talk with the gender team therapist yesterday, and had a surgical consult and I'm having an orchi in February as a first? step. (Still have lots of fears regarding vaginoplasty, so am not sure in that regard yet. But not needing anti androgens that tire me out a lot anymore and parting with a part of my body that I feel dysphoric about is good to start)
I'm glad the talk went well and you can do another step. :smallsmile:


So I've been lurking here for a while, and I think it's time I introduce myself. I'm a transgender (albeit pre-everything) university student in the US, and I'm trying to deal with the fact that I probably won't be able to start transitioning for about another year (due to financial reasons). I really don't have a lot to say at the moment, but I figured I ought to introduce myself now instead of waiting.
Welcome! If you have any questions about anything or need support with something, we have lots of very knowledgeable and nice people here. :smallsmile:


Getting validation as a woman is hard.
*offers hugs*


Everyone?

I apologize for having to do this again. To be honest, while it looks like being trans may fit the facts on a purely intellectual level, and while it is seemingly the only explanation for a whole set of experiences I've had that were never explained, that isn't sufficient. I need to be sure of this on a deeper and more emotional level than what I have now.

I need to know for sure that this is right. I will need to explore myself more, talk to a therapist, and try a lot of new things before I can be sure enough that transition is something I really want to be doing. And during this timeframe, trying to label myself as anything definitive has only caused me to question that later.

As such, I really need some time to decide, and I don't want to label myself until I do.
That's completely okay and you don't need to apologise. Take your time in figuring things out, there's no need to rush. :smallsmile:

[Miriel]

Validation of your womanhood or just being validated while being a woman? (Cause both are hard. :/ )
Validation of my womanhood.

[Sobol]

So I've been lurking here for a while, and I think it's time I introduce myself. I'm a transgender (albeit pre-everything) university student in the US, and I'm trying to deal with the fact that I probably won't be able to start transitioning for about another year (due to financial reasons). I really don't have a lot to say at the moment, but I figured I ought to introduce myself now instead of waiting.
Hi, Nemirthel.
Welcome to the secret order of Those Who Read This Thread But Don't Have a Lot to Say Themselves. I suspect there are quite a few of us :)

[DataNinja]

Hi, Nemirthel.
Welcome to the secret order of Those Who Read This Thread But Don't Have a Lot to Say Themselves. I suspect there are quite a few of us :)

I'm pretty sure there are. I lurk here because I just try and know more about the world at large. Despite having a few LGBTAI+ friends, I'm sadly ignorant about these things.

[Dire Moose]

Yes, a big weakness of mine, which I thought was actually a strength, is that I've tended to reject emotional arguments and stick totally to facts and reason. This was mostly because religious friends of mine kept trying to get me to do the opposite. But in the end, it's really important that I use both methods if the issue is big enough.

Ironically, despite being a longtime fan of the original Star Trek, this was something I'd failed to grasp.

When I mentioned coming out to my best friend, I was careful to place it in terms of something I was considering, but wasn't sure about. Which was probably for the best. If I do find out that I have to transition, I plan on making a major announcement to everyone then, but I'm keeping everything within a limited group of close friends for now.

EDIT: There is still one intellectual argument that would convince me to transition if it were valid. If it could be shown that the various issues with angst and depression I've had off and on since 15 (a year after I'd buried my initial feelings of wanting to be female) were in fact caused by gender dysphoria, I would do what was necessary to eliminate them. Problem is, none of them were triggered by anything involving my body and they seem to have come out of nowhere for the most part.


So I've been lurking here for a while, and I think it's time I introduce myself. I'm a transgender (albeit pre-everything) university student in the US, and I'm trying to deal with the fact that I probably won't be able to start transitioning for about another year (due to financial reasons). I really don't have a lot to say at the moment, but I figured I ought to introduce myself now instead of waiting.

Well, we're very happy to have you here. And it's great that you figured yourself out early on.

[Miriel]

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/12226562_10153742363157354_988286753_n_zpsvh3chju6 .jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151116_130035_zpstplxoceg.jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/20151106_202741%202_zpsdbm5wisb.jpg

Do people think I pass?

[Dire Moose]

You're very pretty, and you absolutely shouldn't worry about passing. I've seen plenty of cis girls who look more masculine than you.

[YossarianLives]

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/12226562_10153742363157354_988286753_n_zpsvh3chju6 .jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151116_130035_zpstplxoceg.jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/20151106_202741%202_zpsdbm5wisb.jpg

Do people think I pass?
You look fantastic! I honestly wouldn't be able to tell if I just met you on the street.

[JetpackJimmy]

Suggested webcomic: Dumbing of Age, by David Willis. A story with multiple (and incredibly well-portrayed) GSRM characters of such frequency that Willis is often criticized for having "too many gay characters". Of course, bisexuality, different transgender experiences, the gender binary, the Kinsey Scale, and many other such things are treated with care and depth. Also involves college vigilantes, beatdowns, and Christian children's TV.

[The_Snark]

Do people think I pass?

Yes, you do.

[goto124]

What is the main topic of the webcomic?

[EternalMelon]

What is the main topic of the webcomic?
A bunch of collage students in collage are in collage.
Its a reboot of his old comic universe but you don't need to know anything about that really to understand the comic.
That's all really.

[Svata]

A bunch of college students in college are in college.
Its a reboot of his old comic universe but you don't need to know anything about that really to understand the comic.
That's all really.
FTFY
Also, they're all at least slightly screwed up. Except Dorothy (as far as we know).

[Athedia]

A bunch of collage students in collage are in collage.
Its a reboot of his old comic universe but you don't need to know anything about that really to understand the comic.
That's all really.

*cough*College*cough*

[Skeppio]

*cough*College*cough*

Hey, it could be about students living inside a world made of a patchwork collection of images! :P

[YossarianLives]

Hey, it could be about students living inside a world made of a patchwork collection of images! :P
Heh. That would probably be more interesting and original.

[EternalMelon]

*cough*College*cough*


Hey, it could be about students living inside a world made of a patchwork collection of images! :P
I knew that word didn't look right

:2

[goto124]

Also, they're all at least slightly screwed up.

Aren't we all?

[Dire Moose]

I'm really worried.

After I told my best friend I might be trans (said I wasn't sure and was still going to wait on making a decision), he reacted very positively, almost laid-back about it. He said we would always be friends no matter what happened. I did my best to reassure him of it as well, offering to answer any questions he had, which he didn't have any. He in turn said that no, nothing would change, and nothing would be awkward either. We talked for a while longer about random other things, and eventually he said he had to go.

Seemed like a good thing, except I've noticed he hasn't responded to any messages I've sent him. None of these were about any trans-related things, just a video about stuff I worked on over the summer and a question about what his son's first words were. I am getting nervous. Maybe he's just busy with his job, but could he be avoiding me because he's having second thoughts? Could I be losing him?

And considering I don't even know for sure, it's possible I could be losing my best friend over nothing. And it would all be my fault for telling him this early. I couldn't imagine how I could keep going on with life without him, after we've known each other for 17 years.

EDIT: This was all over the phone by the way. We live at opposite ends of the country and couldn't speak in person.

[Heliomance]

Everyone?

I apologize for having to do this again. To be honest, while it looks like being trans may fit the facts on a purely intellectual level, and while it is seemingly the only explanation for a whole set of experiences I've had that were never explained, that isn't sufficient. I need to be sure of this on a deeper and more emotional level than what I have now.

I need to know for sure that this is right. I will need to explore myself more, talk to a therapist, and try a lot of new things before I can be sure enough that transition is something I really want to be doing. And during this timeframe, trying to label myself as anything definitive has only caused me to question that later.

As such, I really need some time to decide, and I don't want to label myself until I do.

Eh, I spent a full year swapping back and forth between male and female on a monthly basis. Working these things out takes time.

[Florian]

@Dire Moose:

I'll give you a bit of a hard-nosed answer on this one. There's a world of difference between internal and external perception and oftentimes, things stay the same even if there're huge changes.
Me personally, I don't give a damn heap of manure about the external, existential or sexual preferences of my friends, as those things don't bother me at all, as long as there is no implicit change in said friendship from friend to potential partner or sexual object. Note that it's not that I don't care, they're friends after all, it's just that those things don't have an impact on our shared friendship.

So if my best friend was to call me and tell me about eventually being trans and wanting to change, I'd simply shrug and get on with other topics, because what would I have to say about another beings happiness? I don't give permission to be happy or something.

[Dire Moose]

Considering how well he took everything in the actual conversation, I should probably just assume the best of him until proven otherwise. Due to negative experiences where people I thought were friends went and complained about me behind my back on a few occasions, I've developed trust issues that this situation has only amplified. And this wouldn't be the first time he's failed to notice messages from me due to being busy.

I still can't help but worry though.

[Florian]

Considering how well he took everything in the actual conversation, I should probably just assume the best of him until proven otherwise. Due to negative experiences where people I thought were friends went and complained about me behind my back on a few occasions, I've developed trust issues that this situation has only amplified. And this wouldn't be the first time he's failed to notice messages from me due to being busy.

I still can't help but worry though.

Let me comment on something you wrote earlier:
We may be creatures able to formulate rational thougths, but we're still mainly emotional creatures. Don't lie to yourself. What we individually perveive to be rational, is still driven by our personal fear, needs and greed.

You're insecure now about yourself and you crave outside recognition and affirmation of positive ties. At that point, don't mix up your insecurities with what your friend has given to you.

[Rain Dragon]

I had a nice talk with the gender team therapist yesterday, and had a surgical consult and I'm having an orchi in February as a first? step. (Still have lots of fears regarding vaginoplasty, so am not sure in that regard yet. But not needing anti androgens that tire me out a lot anymore and parting with a part of my body that I feel dysphoric about is good to start)

Awesome. I hope things go well for you!


So I've been lurking here for a while, and I think it's time I introduce myself. I'm a transgender (albeit pre-everything) university student in the US, and I'm trying to deal with the fact that I probably won't be able to start transitioning for about another year (due to financial reasons). I really don't have a lot to say at the moment, but I figured I ought to introduce myself now instead of waiting.

Welcome! I hope the wait isn't too bad. :smalleek:


We two (Nope and I) being in vet medicine have what may be either a skewed or more unbiased view of a lot of biological weirdness and medical practice quirks. One of my mentors while nursing her infant son for the first time successfully haggled the hospital administrator down on the price of her c-section apparently.

The quote she told me: "You're charging me 3 times market value for this drug and 20 times the cost of this scalpel blade, I do all the reordering for my vet hospital and unless prices have changed shockingly in the last 6 hours you can't charge me German steel prices for a Pakistani instrument pack and expect me to just knuckle under and pay it."

Wow, cool (though not cool that it was priced so high to begin with).


Yes, a big weakness of mine, which I thought was actually a strength, is that I've tended to reject emotional arguments and stick totally to facts and reason. This was mostly because religious friends of mine kept trying to get me to do the opposite. But in the end, it's really important that I use both methods if the issue is big enough.

Ironically, despite being a longtime fan of the original Star Trek, this was something I'd failed to grasp.

When I mentioned coming out to my best friend, I was careful to place it in terms of something I was considering, but wasn't sure about. Which was probably for the best. If I do find out that I have to transition, I plan on making a major announcement to everyone then, but I'm keeping everything within a limited group of close friends for now.

EDIT: There is still one intellectual argument that would convince me to transition if it were valid. If it could be shown that the various issues with angst and depression I've had off and on since 15 (a year after I'd buried my initial feelings of wanting to be female) were in fact caused by gender dysphoria, I would do what was necessary to eliminate them. Problem is, none of them were triggered by anything involving my body and they seem to have come out of nowhere for the most part.

Re: earlier quote - There's really nothing to apologise for. Working out who you are (generally) is a lifelong process and if it were easy then the world would be unimaginably different. You have time, so feel free to take as much as you need to think. You've been referring to this as a big thing to you and big things just don't (usually) happen overnight.

A balance of both is important. Ignoring one tends to cause problems, I find.

Looking at the past like that is difficult and our memories are not perfect. You can work with the present though, and try to pay attention to your current anger and depression? It sounds like either way, these are issues you might want to address anyway so even if they aren't linked then at least perhaps you're closer to being free of them.


http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/12226562_10153742363157354_988286753_n_zpsvh3chju6 .jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151116_130035_zpstplxoceg.jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/20151106_202741%202_zpsdbm5wisb.jpg

Do people think I pass?

With flying colours. Honestly.


Considering how well he took everything in the actual conversation, I should probably just assume the best of him until proven otherwise. Due to negative experiences where people I thought were friends went and complained about me behind my back on a few occasions, I've developed trust issues that this situation has only amplified. And this wouldn't be the first time he's failed to notice messages from me due to being busy.

I still can't help but worry though.

I would try to assume the best as well. It's also worth keeping in mind you said earlier you'd been friends for 17 years. Your friendship is probably important to him as well. He's probably busy.

[KyooTrap]

Sooooooooo the girl I was talking about last topic is nowwwww dating me :3 much success! She's so pretty and cool and a rock star so why does she like me??? Prolly cause I'm cute. But yeah! Trans girl yuri is purest relationship tbh

[Grytorm]

How do some people always end up with so much affection and love?

[golentan]

Transgender day of remembrance today folks. Stay safe.

[Dire Moose]

OK, my friend finally did respond to me.

I'm sensing there might a certain level of awkwardness there, but that he's honestly trying to keep everything up on his end. Which at least is something.

EDIT: Meh, we've just been chatting back and forth like old times. Seems there was nothing to worry about after all. :smallsmile:

[Serpentine]

Miriel: It's hard to see from two of those photos but I think that, yes, you would pass unnoticed. You look to me like the woman you are, and I can't see anything much to suggest that you might get pinged as trans by anyone who doesn't otherwise know.

[Miriel]

@ Dire Moose: Take your time. It's your process, it's your life, it's your rythm.


You're very pretty, and you absolutely shouldn't worry about passing. I've seen plenty of cis girls who look more masculine than you.


You look fantastic! I honestly wouldn't be able to tell if I just met you on the street.


Yes, you do.


With flying colours. Honestly.

Okay. Unanimity feels good. Just have to work with my own internalized transmisoginy or something, I guess. *sigh*

But thanks people :smallsmile:


Miriel: It's hard to see from two of those photos but I think that, yes, you would pass unnoticed. You look to me like the woman you are, and I can't see anything much to suggest that you might get pinged as trans by anyone who doesn't otherwise know.

I've been clocked a lot on OkCupid recently, to be honest. It really hit me hard. I'm feeling very insecure.

But thanks.

[JusticeZero]

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/12226562_10153742363157354_988286753_n_zpsvh3chju6 .jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151116_130035_zpstplxoceg.jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/20151106_202741%202_zpsdbm5wisb.jpg

Do people think I pass?

Okay, since it isn't validation you want.. Yes, it's pretty close. But you are in the uncanny valley somehow. Your skin tone in those pictures looks too pale and uniform somehow, with some sort of china doll quality, and the lipstick is too vivid. I don't read you as male, but I read you as uncanny valley. If other people are reacting the same way, they might be examining your features more closely than normal, and that tends to lead people to clocking.
You might want to add some sort of subtle eye shadow, but i'm not sure what all your facial makeup routine involves.
I notice that certain facial angles are much worse for clocking in photographs than others. Avoid sending full on photographs; pose your pictures for social media at 3/4 view.

[Serpentine]

I've been clocked a lot on OkCupid recently, to be honest. It really hit me hard. I'm feeling very insecure.

But thanks.
Hm. Are they the photos you're using on there?

[Miriel]

Hm. Are they the photos you're using on there?
No, I wanted to know if these were.

IIRC, I had these before. They were mostly older pictures, before I started being agressive wth my eyebrows and stuff.

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/IMG_2948_zpsahv7kuju.jpghttp://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/DSCN0579_zpsj9zydqeo.jpghttp://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/Caroausit-in_zps7cb49cae.jpg


Okay, since it isn't validation you want.. Yes, it's pretty close. But you are in the uncanny valley somehow. Your skin tone in those pictures looks too pale and uniform somehow, with some sort of china doll quality, and the lipstick is too vivid. I don't read you as male, but I read you as uncanny valley. If other people are reacting the same way, they might be examining your features more closely than normal, and that tends to lead people to clocking.
You might want to add some sort of subtle eye shadow, but i'm not sure what all your facial makeup routine involves.
I notice that certain facial angles are much worse for clocking in photographs than others. Avoid sending full on photographs; pose your pictures for social media at 3/4 view.
Don't worry about validation. It's pretty hard for me to get the validation I need online.

My skin tone is fairly pale to start with. As for uniform, that's fair. I use something with high coverage because of my shadow.

I don't understand what you mean by uncanny valley. Is it just about the makeup, or something else?

Other random assortment of recent pictures for you to judge.

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/photo_zpssvvqogqt.jpg
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/20150829_170521_zpsf6xycy5r.jpghttp://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/IMG_2999_zpsaho8bp9t.jpg
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151106_134047_zpslhmm9ejo.jpghttp://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151120_144011%202_zpsttecvybx.jpg

[Serpentine]

Heeee, the one in the red coat makes me giggle :smallbiggrin:
Well, I suppose I can see how you might get clocked with those ones (I might think it was a possibility, but I probably wouldn't be certain). Your new ones are much better, though. Time for a profile update, I reckon!

[JusticeZero]

Other random assortment of recent pictures for you to judge.


Baby
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/20150829_170521_zpsf6xycy5r.jpg
Water
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/DSCN0579_zpsj9zydqeo.jpg
These images I read as male, almost entirely because of the shape of your jaw and chin being accentuated by the camera angle, et cetera.

Coat doll
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/Caroausit-in_zps7cb49cae.jpg
Grainy Mall
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151120_144011%202_zpsttecvybx.jpg
Your skin tone looks like porcelain there. the texture of your face is almost completely wiped out - slips a bit into the Uncanny Valley, and that gets people to start looking too closely. Basically, I expect to see some blemishes and shadows on your face, and in the absence, your face looks like it has an albedo and reflectivity that doesn't fall within the range of human normal. That makes me look at the pictures more closely.

Radio
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151106_134047_zpslhmm9ejo.jpg
Galleria
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/IMG_2948_zpsahv7kuju.jpg
Pizza
http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/IMG_2999_zpsaho8bp9t.jpg
In particular, the one with headphones, because the angle conceals that jawline and accentuates your face as almond-shaped. I can't even FORCE my brain to flip that one to a masculine face.

[Serpentine]

I disagree about the one with the baby. That one I noted the first look through as being one of the most feminine ones.

[JusticeZero]

I disagree about the one with the baby. That one I noted the first look through as being one of the most feminine ones.
I'd suspect that is because of the prop (a baby). I was focused on the features. I have house husband friends, so I don't automatically associate caregiver with female.

[Serpentine]

Neither do I - my father was our primary caregiver. And to me, that one's one of the more feminine shots, with or without baby.
But anyway. By the way, you're lookin' pretty durn cute, Miriel.

[Heliomance]

If you still have some shadow, Miri, the really bright red lipstick might not be the best idea. It draws attention to your mouth region, and thus to the parts of your face that still have hints of beard. I experimented with it myself for a while, before deciding I just couldn't pull it off.

[AmberVael]

Hang on hang on hang on.
Are those strawberries on pizza? :smalleek:

[Ravens_cry]

*shrug* I like raspberry jam and natural* peanut butter as toppings for a beef burger.
*as in just peanuts.

[Shadowscale]

So, how's everyone been holding up as of late? Felt like checking in.

[Lissou]

I'm doing great! I met an awesome nerdy guy, who happens to be pansexual. He's in a long-term relationship with a bi guy. They're both awesome. I'm in the blissed out stage of a new relationship although I'm trying not to get my hopes up too high. But I'm really happy :) We all (the two of them, my husband and I) meet up for games once a week and that's a lot of fun. We also play online every now and then. And although we met on OKCupid, not in a physical, local place, he lives less than 2 miles away from me! And we both live right next to the tram station (2 stops away) so it's a quick trip either by car or public transit.

And we have so much in common it's kind of crazy. Every time I visit, I learn a few more things I have in common with either him or his partner.

Hugs all around to everyone who isn't as lucky as me right now! And hugs all around to people who are lucky too, because hey, I have hugs to spare.

[Astrella]

Oh, congrats Lissou, hope you keep having good times. :)

----

I'm okay, just trying to deal with my mom and the usual relationship anxiety and other anxieties that crawl around in my head. :/

[Shadowscale]

Oh, congrats Lissou, hope you keep having good times. :)

----

I'm okay, just trying to deal with my mom and the usual relationship anxiety and other anxieties that crawl around in my head. :/

(That reminds me, would you be okay with offering some advice / support related to poly stuff sometime, Lissou? Is alright if not of course.)

Anything I could do to help with the anxiety?

[Grytorm]

I'm sorry. That I would like to die a lot of the time.
I do make the same sort of mistakes again and again.
I'm posting this because I don't feel to well.
I held my breath for a minute and my heartbeat felt weird.
And I can't stop paying attention to it.
(Does anyone know if that is serious)
Which sounds weird. I'm crying right now.
And I'm sorry that if I die I couldn't be here.

[EternalMelon]

I'm sorry. That I would like to die a lot of the time.
I do make the same sort of mistakes again and again.
I'm posting this because I don't feel to well.
I held my breath for a minute and my heartbeat felt weird.
And I can't stop paying attention to it.
(Does anyone know if that is serious)
Which sounds weird. I'm crying right now.
And I'm sorry that if I die I couldn't be here.
I'm not sure about your situation, but I hope you are talking to someone about your morbidity. If you're not, I would see about fixing that ASAP. It doesn't have to be a doctor necessarily, just make sure its someone you know/trust/love/any of the above. If you can't find anyone I'm sure anyone here would be open to help.

Holding your breath for a minute is generally not the best thing to do, and quick google search doesn't suggest anything serious besides a mild arrhythmia. But I would recommend seeing doctor as soon as possible and not sleeping (I don't know what time it is there but its super late here) if you do have concerns. Or at least until it goes away.

Crying is alright, if you're scared, just try and calm yourself down.

Hope this helps.

[ThinkMinty]

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/12226562_10153742363157354_988286753_n_zpsvh3chju6 .jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/WIN_20151116_130035_zpstplxoceg.jpg

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/af96/abvrbecondita/20151106_202741%202_zpsdbm5wisb.jpg

Do people think I pass?

...wait you're trans? I honestly was just like, "Oh, there's a brunette with the that goes foof.". Ya got a foofy head, ya foof.


Sooooooooo the girl I was talking about last topic is nowwwww dating me :3 much success! She's so pretty and cool and a rock star so why does she like me??? Prolly cause I'm cute. But yeah! Trans girl yuri is purest relationship tbh

Yuri in general is purest relationship. I uh, eh, girls in girl-love is ****in' adorbs. Girls that like girls are cute...and now y'all know about Minty and his fondness for girls that like girls. I don't gotta justify myself.


It varies. Sometimes they're good characters that just happen to be women, and if you swapped their genders they'd be pretty much the same. Sometimes the fact they're a woman is a major defining feature of the character, that couldn't be done or that would be very different if it was a man. Compare Ripley from the first Alien movie with Ripley from the last two Alien movies. The main goal is diversity of character types.

The easy way to get from "Female Character, Strong" to "Strong Character, Female" is by including enough chicks so that no one or two chicks have to represent their whole gender. Then they're characters who are incidentally chicks, so they can be ditzy or grumpy or lovestruck or hyperactive without people losing their damn minds over every little character flaw.

[Grytorm]

I'm not sure about your situation, but I hope you are talking to someone about your morbidity. If you're not, I would see about fixing that ASAP. It doesn't have to be a doctor necessarily, just make sure its someone you know/trust/love/any of the above. If you can't find anyone I'm sure anyone here would be open to help.

Holding your breath for a minute is generally not the best thing to do, and quick google search doesn't suggest anything serious besides a mild arrhythmia. But I would recommend seeing doctor as soon as possible and not sleeping (I don't know what time it is there but its super late here) if you do have concerns. Or at least until it goes away.

Crying is alright, if you're scared, just try and calm yourself down.

Hope this helps.

Oh it was late. I'm fine now at least as far as feeling healthy. It probably was an arythmia. Or something. Sorry if I scared everyone. The morbidity is harder to fix. Um, I'll try to think of a better response later.

[Astrella]

Anything I could do to help with the anxiety?

Is just tied into general lack of self-worth, viewing myself as not having any value. so the deal is that my girlfriend is poly. She lives in the UK, I live in Belgium and she has another girlfriend in the US. Adn my mind just has periods of going "if you were a decent partner she wouldn't need anyone else" which I know is nonsense and not how being poly works, but the nagging just pops up from time to time and makes me scared and insecure.

[Ravens_cry]

Follow up with the endocrinologist this week. Scary but awesome. Also, a dress (http://www.sammydress.com/product2017887.html) I ordered online finally arrived. Yay~! It's not quite as flared as the picture, guess you'd need a petticoat for that, but it still gives quite the appearance of hips as is.
In other news, I asked someone out I'd been mooning about for some time. They said no, but I am glad I did, if only because it gave some closure to my whole obsession.

[EternalMelon]

Oh it was late. I'm fine now at least as far as feeling healthy. It probably was an arythmia. Or something. Sorry if I scared everyone. The morbidity is harder to fix. Um, I'll try to think of a better response later.
Well I'm glad your feeling better. No need to apologize for any scaring.

WHile im here...

Follow up with the endocrinologist this week. Scary but awesome. Also, a dress (http://www.sammydress.com/product2017887.html) I ordered online finally arrived. Yay~! It's not quite as flared as the picture, guess you'd need a petticoat for that, but it still gives quite the appearance of hips as is.
In other news, I asked someone out I'd been mooning about for some time. They said no, but I am glad I did, if only because it gave some closure to my whole obsession.
Yay dress! Yay Closure!

/lurk

[Shadowscale]

Is just tied into general lack of self-worth, viewing myself as not having any value. so the deal is that my girlfriend is poly. She lives in the UK, I live in Belgium and she has another girlfriend in the US. Adn my mind just has periods of going "if you were a decent partner she wouldn't need anyone else" which I know is nonsense and not how being poly works, but the nagging just pops up from time to time and makes me scared and insecure.

Take what I say with a grain of salt, but it sounds like you're not poly and the only reason you're going along with this is out of fear of making her unhappy or losing her in the event she had to choose, either way doesn't sound the most healthy of a situation.

[Virdish]

Take what I say with a grain of salt, but it sounds like you're not poly and the only reason you're going along with this is out of fear of making her unhappy or losing her in the event she had to choose, either way doesn't sound the most healthy of a situation.

I'm not so sure of that. I mean, I may not be completely knowledgeable about the situation but I know when I first started poly I had some serious issues. A lot of it was dealing with rewiring my brain to not associate another partner with a problem in the relationship. I was raised Christian and so the transition to poly was rough but it was one of the best things I've ever done for myself. I had people tell me at first that I wasn't poly but I chose to ignore them and I finally came out the other side.

By the way. I'm Virdish. I'm poly, genderqueer, and pansexual. Nice to meet you all.

[Miriel]

Thanks ThinkMinty :smallsmile:


Hang on hang on hang on.
Are those strawberries on pizza? :smalleek:

Yes :smalltongue:

[Lissou]

Oh, congrats Lissou, hope you keep having good times. :)

----

I'm okay, just trying to deal with my mom and the usual relationship anxiety and other anxieties that crawl around in my head. :/

Thanks! And I'm sorry to hear about your anxiety :(


Is just tied into general lack of self-worth, viewing myself as not having any value. so the deal is that my girlfriend is poly. She lives in the UK, I live in Belgium and she has another girlfriend in the US. And my mind just has periods of going "if you were a decent partner she wouldn't need anyone else" which I know is nonsense and not how being poly works, but the nagging just pops up from time to time and makes me scared and insecure.

*Hugs* That sucks. Mono/poly relationships can be very challenging, and it's perfectly normal, even if you know, rationally, how it works, to worry about it, because it's just a fundamental difference you can understand in theory but is much harder to completely understand and internalize. And I'm sure it doesn't help that it's all long distance, since a lot of people get comfort from touch. So if you need extra reassurance from her it's completely normal and unsurprising. Long-distance can be hard because the distance can make you feel like you're losing that connection. Any extra challenges, such as different relationship styles, would compound the problem.

I really hope the situation with your mom will get better. It seems to lead to a huge amount of stress and that sucks. *Hugs* again.