Turning UAS into a Reach Weapon OR the Best Reach Weapon to Complement Optimized UAS

[Rubik]

I've got a Dragonwrought kobold build which focuses a lot of martial optimization into his unarmed strikes, including a level of chaos monk and Tashalatora for flailing strike, the Beast Strike feat to add claw attack damage (and damage types) to its UAS, weapon enhancements such as throwing/distance/exit wounds/aptitude (and anything else I choose to add to it), a couple of feats to nab +15' natural reach, Knockback, Knock-Down, Improved Trip, Power Attack, Improved Bull Rush, Shocktrooper, and a couple of levels in dungeoncrasher fighter for bull rushing shenanigans. Furthermore, I've got AoO optimization going, including Robilar's Gambit, Karmic Strike, Combat Reflexes, Evasive Reflexes, and a sparring dummy of the master so I can 10' step out of the way of any melee attack within my AoO range.

With all of this effort spent souping up my unarmed strikes, needing a separate reach weapon seems a bit of a waste of UAS resources. Is there any way to make my unarmed strikes count as reach weapons so I have 30' reach? I know there's an Oriental Adventures feat that adds extra reach for spears (+10') and shortspears (+5'), which would work on my UAS with Aptitude, but that feat only works on my turn, rendering AoOs unaffected by it. Not that it isn't a good feat, but, y'know.

Alternatively, is there a reach weapon that works especially well with my unarmed strike optimization? I have the psychic warrior's soulbound weapon ACF, and I've got access to plenty more feats and lots of potential WBL, including Weapon of Legacy options, Ancestral Relic, and Item Familiar. I don't have any extra class levels to spend on things, but I do have access to any arcane/divine spell or psionic power you care to name, all skills, and plenty more feats (even accounting for all the feats I mentioned above). My primary choices for reach weapons are the spinning sword, spiked chain, kusari gama, and guisarme. I was thinking about an elvencraft longbow as my soulbound weapon due to the sheer diversity of things that can be done with it as a soulbound weapon, but it doesn't grant any extra reach, which is disappointing.

The build is level 21 gestalt. Chaotic Good Dragonwrought Arctic Kobold

Side 1: Telepathy ACF telepath psion 17/spell point abrupt jaunt conjuror combat wizard 1/soulbound psychic warrior 2/marshal 1 (motivate Int)
Side 2: Factotum 3/spell point cleric of Magic (Mystra) 3 (rune/good domains)/illithid savant 10/chaos monk 1/dungeoncrasher fighter 2/warrior skald 1/ardent 1 (conflict/creation mantles)

Any ideas?

[Curmudgeon]

You can add reach with the following feats:

Mourning Mutate [Aberrant] feat (Dragon # 359, page 110) with the "Unnaturally Flexible" option can substitute for Aberration Blood (flexible limbs) (Lords of Madness, page 178; Humanoid only) for prerequisites; level 1 only.
Extended Reach feat (Savage Species, page 34) works if you have flexible body parts, granting +5' to reach.
Inhuman Reach feat (Lords of Madness, page 180) can extend reach by a further +5', but at a cost of -1 to all melee attack rolls.

[Bronk]

The +1 weapon property 'extending' from Dragon 302 can increase or decrease weapon range by 5'.

[Troacctid]

The Psion/Wilder/Psychic Warrior power Reach (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040827e) extends your reach by 5 feet for 1 round/level.

[Rubik]

I like all of these options, but they still work better when actual reach weapons are involved. Remember, reach weapons double your natural reach. Add all of these reach boosters on your natural reach, and you're still better off using a guisarme or glaive for double the boost.

Is there a weapon property that forces a non-reach weapon into becoming a reach weapon?

[Bronk]

On a second read through, that's exactly what the 'extending' weapon property does for a melee weapon. It's Dragon 302, page 84 on the sidebar.

[Rubik]

On a second read through, that's exactly what the 'extending' weapon property does for a melee weapon. It's Dragon 302, page 84 on the sidebar.Would that be this? (http://www.realmshelps.net/magic/weapon/Extending) The site doesn't say where it came from, it's not entirely clear if it does actually turn a weapon into a "reach weapon," and it's using 3.0 rules.

All in all, I think it's potentially really useful on its own, but it's difficult to use with 3.5 reach rules and other, similar options, because it's too specific about how it goes about doing what it does.

[Bronk]

The text matches...

It does say it turns the weapon in to a reach weapon, although I see what you mean about the restrictions.

[Rubik]

The text matches...

It does say it turns the weapon in to a reach weapon, although I see what you mean about the restrictions.The weapon ability adds +5' or +10' of reach, whereas 3.5 reach weapons double your natural reach.

Not that the extending property doesn't have its use; it's just not as useful as changing a weapon to an actual reach weapon.

Oh well. Unless someone has other ideas, I suppose I'll start having to look for another weapon that complements my unarmed strike optimization. Any ideas on that front?

[Troacctid]

With Improved Trip, you'd probably go for either a guisarme, spiked chain, or dwarven warpike.

[Rubik]

With Improved Trip, you'd probably go for either a guisarme, spiked chain, or dwarven warpike.With the aptitude weapon enhancement and, say, the Pole Master feat, I can force literally any weapon to become a special monk weapon through the way the two options interact. So I could add Extending to my unarmed strikes to use them as reach weapons, then use Pole Master and Aptitude on my elvencraft longbow to use flailing strike with my longbow, as well, using the quarterstaff option for up close and personal thwacking. The only problem I can see with that is that quarterstaffs aren't tripping weapons...

But that's what Knockback and Knock-Down are for, right?

Now I just need to figure out how to bull rush with a longbow...

[ben-zayb]

If your WIS is extraordinarily high, and you have a decent ranged attack mod, you may instead combine your max-ed reach weapon of choice (for getting threat range) with Ring the Golden Bell (for making the ranged UAS AoO 1+Wis per day, with range increment of 5ft*(1+WIS)) from Dragon Compendium.

[Troacctid]

Don't see why you'd spend money on an Aptitude enhancement. Dwarven warpike and guisarme are fine weapons and they don't need Aptitude to work with Pole Master. If you need a backup ranged weapon, that's what shurikens are for, yes? They work with flurry of blows, they're cheap to enhance, and you can draw them as a free action.

Or just use psionics if you need to fight at range.

[Rubik]

If your WIS is extraordinarily high, and you have a decent ranged attack mod, you may instead combine your max-ed reach weapon of choice (for getting threat range) with Ring the Golden Bell (for making the ranged UAS AoO 1+Wis per day, with range increment of 5ft*(1+WIS)) from Dragon Compendium.Stat spread (without buffs):

Str 18
Dex 20
Con 14
Int 37
Wis 14
Cha 24

Don't really need Con or Wis for anything. +Int to just about everything, including hp, Will saves, and Wis-based skill checks, Can sub Will saves for Fort and Ref saves, and Supernatural Transformation (Psionics) means that Concentration checks are almost never an issue.


Don't see why you'd spend money on an Aptitude enhancement. Dwarven warpike and guisarme are fine weapons and they don't need Aptitude to work with Pole Master. If you need a backup ranged weapon, that's what shurikens are for, yes? They work with flurry of blows, they're cheap to enhance, and you can draw them as a free action.

Or just use psionics if you need to fight at range.I do plan on using psionics -- that, or my unarmed strikes, but the range is kinda piddly, even with max boosting.

The elvencraft longbow is mostly so I have a super-high range weapon and more versatility when choosing weapon enhancements via the soulbound weapon ACF. I prize versatility over almost everything else.

I like guisarmes, honestly, and with Pole Master, they can be used with flailing strike. They have reach, are 2-handers, and can trip. They're reasonably versatile. They're not very unique, but they're useful. Just checking to see if there was anything I was missing that would complement my UAS extremely well.

[Darrin]

Is there a weapon property that forces a non-reach weapon into becoming a reach weapon?

Consider a Scorpion Kama with the Morphing property. Morph it into a kusari-gama.

[Rubik]

The only thing I can think of that undeniably works to make one's unarmed strikes into reach weapons while retaining adjacent ability is to take kensai. It explicitly forces you to enhance each fist separately, rather than actually following the rules for unarmed strikes. That means you apply the extending property to one and use it as a reach weapon, while leaving the other alone.

You have to pay twice as much as any other option allows and have to take a really sucky PrC, but you get exactly what I want on this.

Though, now that I think about it, I suppose that would apply to gauntlets as well, wouldn't it? They count as unarmed strikes and can be enhanced separately...

[Rubik]

Actually, I think that's just about perfect. Gauntlets are considered unarmed strikes, so any unarmed strike optimization I do will segue with an extending gauntlet perfectly. I can use the gauntlet for long-distance strikes and regular unarmed strikes (or unarmed strikes with a different gauntlet) for anything adjacent. I have levels in soulbound psychic warrior so I can summon a gauntlet whenever I need it, and it'll conform to whatever I want it to be. And I can even make it a two-hander via Savage Species' rules on turning any masterwork+ weapon into a multi-handed weapon for no additional cost.

Perfect.

[Troacctid]

Actually, I think that's just about perfect. Gauntlets are considered unarmed strikes, so any unarmed strike optimization I do will segue with an extending gauntlet perfectly.

Probably not. An attack with a gauntlet isn't an unarmed strike, it's an unarmed attack, which is a relevant distinction, as the terms are not synonymous.

[Rubik]

Probably not. An attack with a gauntlet isn't an unarmed strike, it's an unarmed attack, which is a relevant distinction, as the terms are not synonymous.Gauntlets of the Talon, from Complete Divine (pg 97) are an example where gauntlets are specifically used to enhance monk unarmed strikes. Not definitive, but it has potential for indicating RAI.

Are there knuckledusters or similar somewhere in 3e?

[Troacctid]

Gauntlets of the Talon, from Complete Divine (pg 97) are an example where gauntlets are specifically used to enhance monk unarmed strikes.

Oh, all gauntlets enhance your unarmed strikes. They turn your unarmed strike damage into lethal damage. Totally separate effect, though. Kind of like how armor spikes enhance your grapples.

Magic Item Compendium has the more recent version of Gauntlets of the Talon, FYI. Much cheaper, works without expending a spell slot, and the rules are cleaned up a bit.

[Rubik]

Oh, all gauntlets enhance your unarmed strikes. They turn your unarmed strike damage into lethal damage. Totally separate effect, though. Kind of like how armor spikes enhance your grapples.

Magic Item Compendium has the more recent version of Gauntlets of the Talon, FYI. Much cheaper, works without expending a spell slot, and the rules are cleaned up a bit.Then skip extending gauntlets and go for an aptitude ramhammer, ranseur, or other reach weapon. Now it counts as an unarmed strike due to Improved Unarmed Strike, so everything that affects unarmed strikes affects that reach weapon. Use it for reach and your actual unarmed strike for adjacent strikes.

[ben-zayb]

Then skip extending gauntlets and go for an aptitude ramhammer, ranseur, or other reach weapon. Now it counts as an unarmed strike due to Improved Unarmed Strike, so everything that affects unarmed strikes affects that reach weapon. Use it for reach and your actual unarmed strike for adjacent strikes.

I count two benefits from the feat:
1. You don't provoke AoO when attacking while unarmed
2. Your Unarmed Strikes can deal lethal or nonlethal damage, at your option.

You definitely benefit #2 via Aptitude. You could probably make a case that #1 can be parsed as "Unarmed Strikes no longer provoke AoOs, ever", and thus is a pretty useful Aptitude benefit when making ranged attaks or when fighting AoO builds.

However, the effect you seem to want to have with your Aptitude reach weapon is "Unarmed Strikes now count as Unarmed Strikes", which obviously is not anywhere written in the feat. Probably because that's always the case, feat or no feat.

[ShurikVch]

It may be useful:
A monk can also consider a gauntlet as an unarmed strike and use one during her flurry of blows.

[Rubik]

It may be useful:Exactly what I needed.

Now just take your internet cookie. I'll get the milk.

[Troacctid]

Then skip extending gauntlets and go for an aptitude ramhammer, ranseur, or other reach weapon. Now it counts as an unarmed strike due to Improved Unarmed Strike, so everything that affects unarmed strikes affects that reach weapon. Use it for reach and your actual unarmed strike for adjacent strikes.

Aptitude weapons don't interact with the Improved Unarmed Strike feat, since it doesn't affect any particular type of weapon. Remember, unarmed strikes are, by definition, made without a weapon.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Deformity (Tall) from Heroes of Horror (requires the feat Willing Deformity) gives you +5 ft. reach, but only if you're medium size. Combined with all those feats Curmudgeon mentioned, you'll have a 20 ft. natural reach. You'll want to take two flaws for two extra feats regardless.

[Rubik]

How about combining with the Sun School feat to attack after a teleportation? Use swordsage to grab a standard, move, and swift action teleport, and a level of abrupt jaunt conjuror will let you teleport and attack as an immediate action. Or you could buy that shadow cloak in Drow of the Underdark for the same basic immediate action teleport.

Too bad Sun School specifies "adjacent" teleportation, because having 30' reach would make for a great way for an immediate action surprise interrupt, especially with the combo outlined above.

[ben-zayb]

How about combining with the Sun School feat to attack after a teleportation? Use swordsage to grab a standard, move, and swift action teleport, and a level of abrupt jaunt conjuror will let you teleport and attack as an immediate action. Or you could buy that shadow cloak in Drow of the Underdark for the same basic immediate action teleport.

Too bad Sun School specifies "adjacent" teleportation, because having 30' reach would make for a great way for an immediate action surprise interrupt, especially with the combo outlined above.
Ring of Blinking, but that's probably TO in many tables.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Oriental Adventures feat that adds extra reach for spears (+10') and shortspears (+5'), which would work on my UAS with Aptitude, but that feat only works on my turn, rendering AoOs unaffected by it. Not that it isn't a good feat, but, y'know.You mean Long Reach, from Unapproachable East?

[Endarire]

What about talking with your GM about making something for/with you?

[Necroticplague]

How about using Aptitude in order to make the Flying Tiger feat work for your unarmed strike?