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Xefas
2015-11-10, 07:38 PM
It was becoming steadily more clear to me that no one was going to make this thread, so I guess I'll do it since we're at page 50.

Here's a brief synopsis of what Mythos Classes are by Kymme from the last thread.


Mythos Classes:

The Mythos classes are homebrew classes created by Xefas that use Mythos, abilities that describe the stories that the classes tell and are told about them. The classes are about around Tier 2 in terms of power and are intended to represent truly mythical characters who are far more powerful than the mundane citizens of the story that takes place around them. They are intended to be extremely high powered and fit in with the other Tier 1-2 classes for a high power game.

Here're some links.

The Mythos Compendium (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?335295-Mythos-Compendium). Where all the works of Mythos are stored by qazzquimby, both mine and others.
My Homebrew Signature (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=6634147&postcount=52). If you just want the stuff made by me.
The Mythos Setting Timeline (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?447006-The-Mythos-Setting-Timeline). If you just want the fluff.

Mythos Homebrew Discussion I (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?323694-Mythos-Inspired-Homebrew-Discussion)
Mythos Homebrew Discussion II: Where Simplicity Goes To Die (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?364949-Mythos-Homebrew-Discussion-II-Where-Simplicity-Goes-to-Die&p=17873149#post17873149)

If anyone feels strongly enough about adding any more links to specific things, just say so. I just started with what I felt were the basics.

Anyway, I think we were discussing how much violence is enough violence.

Primal Fury
2015-11-10, 09:31 PM
Anyway, I think we were discussing how much violence is enough violence.
Is this supposed to be a joke? The answer should be... like... super obvious.

Also! I'm taking suggestions as to a better name for the Mythic Time-Bender. For some reason 'Fylakas' just isn't very satisfying.

As to what else the Teramach hates... Is there a whole lot of self-hate going on? That might be some interesting design space.

vasharanpaladin
2015-11-10, 10:55 PM
Anyway, I think we were discussing how much violence is enough violence.

More specifically, I had pointed out that the phrase "enough violence" cannot actually be used in conjunction with the Monster or any derivative anthols. :smalltongue:

spwack
2015-11-10, 11:22 PM
Ah, the reason I require a list of things a Teramach hates its to provide vague goals for a new mechanic. Once Exalted level is reached, "Everything" is appropriate. But what about at lower levels? That's what I'm looking for.

Temotei
2015-11-10, 11:44 PM
Also! I'm taking suggestions as to a better name for the Mythic Time-Bender. For some reason 'Fylakas' just isn't very satisfying.

Kairatos was my working name for The Apeiron (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apeiron_(cosmology))'s Mythos. It's a perversion of the "kairos (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kairos)."

Primal Fury
2015-11-11, 05:19 PM
Kairatos was my working name for The Apeiron (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apeiron_(cosmology))'s Mythos. It's a perversion of the "kairos (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kairos)."
Oh. There doesn't even need to be any corruption; the class can just be called "The Kairos". That feels better. Thanks Tem. :smallwink:

spwack
2015-11-14, 08:38 AM
Ok, probably the last thing before I reveal what I've been making: I need a dozen or so names (first or last) that a Teramach might be known by. It's not vital, but it'll make me finish it :P

DracoDei
2015-11-14, 02:01 PM
Hm... You don't think that applying the miss chance is enough? You think I should apply the bonuses as well? Like... While benefiting from this you might seem to move at increased speed, but if you're on the receiving end, you might appear to move in slow motion. Something like that?
I was just talking about those advantages in general, without consideration for which ones should and should not be used in specific. I think I would have defaulted to "What is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, so probably use all of them at one stage or another." but whatever makes things work the best, which is hard for anyone to tell without seeing a full rough draft.

khadgar567
2015-11-15, 02:26 AM
Small question to every one since we dismantle exalted how we can make daiklave via mythos class

spwack
2015-11-15, 08:46 AM
Here. Have this. I made this. It is messy. It is dumb. It is also mine. I lied. It's Xefas'. Never mind that.


Name: Omnom, Ripper, Burnt, Siddhran, Razortooth

Look:
Body – Oversized, fleshy, scarred
Eyes – Blazing, squinty, dripping, hollow
Teeth – Shark-like, blocky, fanged
Mulscles – Shredded, ripped, grotesque

Damage: 1d12
HP: 10+Constitution

Alignment:
Chaotic – Break the law and/or defy common sense
Evil – Enjoy… the suffering of a sentient creature
Hungry – Eat a lot of something, probably food

Race:
You may have been an elf, dwarf, halfling, or human before, but you sure aren’t one now.

Chewer – You can eat anything solid or drink anything liquid and gain sustenance from it
Pounder – Your hands and feet are nigh indestructible
Freakshow – When your very presence horrifies someone, gain 1 XP

Bonds (maximum of two):
_____ will die. Probably by my hands.
I can tell that _____ has a Monster within.

Starting Moves:
The Monsters Mythos – You gain a pool of Rage points equal to your STR+half your level. You can spend a point to turn a missed Hack and Slash roll, Defy Danger roll using Strength, Dexterity or Constitution, or any Teramach move into a partial hit. You gain one point of Rage each time you make progress towards destroying one of your Hatreds. You can also gain 1 XP per session for making significant progress in your quest for the destruction of your Hatreds. Choose two:

- The Trappings of Civilisation
- Beauty, Purity and Innocence
- Threats to Your Place in the Food Chain
- Complexity
- Imperfection

You also gain a Rage point each time you rip an enemy to shreds. By DM’s discretion, any missed roll made in pursuit of destroying one of your Hatreds may also be turned into a partial hit by expending a point. While you have at least one Rage point, you are incapable of showing any restraint in your attacks, you cannot flee from battle, and you can never, never show mercy to fallen enemies. Additionally, any creature that attacks you in any way is treated as an enemy for all purposes.

Primitive Brutality – You lose the ability to use manufactured weapons. In return, your unarmed attacks gain the messy and forceful tags, and are always able to be used to Hack and Slash, and you suffer no risk for going into melee unarmed. Additionally, improvised weaponry, the random detritus of combat, are always usable in a similar fashion to your unarmed attacks, however, they must have been collected within the last few moments. After a man has been killed with his own dinner table, that table's purpose, and its charm, are gone. The Teramach cannot coax more enthusiasm into it, any more than an artist can simply disgorge inspiration on command.

Scarred Flesh – You lose the ability to gain any benefit from manufactured armor or shields. Instead, you gain armor equal to your STR.

Starting gear:
The clothes on your back

Max load: 12+STR

Advanced Moves:

2-5
All-Consuming Rampage Release – The Monster is angry. Very, very angry. It's angry that it exists. It's angry that others exist. It's angry at the sky above its head, and the ground beneath its feet. Nothing has ever been made that does not make it angry. How is it not justice to repay in kind so infuriating a world? Gain a Rage point each time you enter combat, so long as it is a violent entry.

Fury Is Freedom – Spend a Rage point and suffer 1d4 damage to negate an ongoing effect you are suffering from

God-Smashing Blow – When you Hack and Slash, on a 10+ you knock your enemy to the ground

Psychotic Sapience-Brutalizing Devolution – Complexity is pain and weakness and indecision. To become the Monster is to gain the certainty never afforded to men. That terrible creature long ago tore from itself all of that which was not rage and murder, and by subtraction it became perfect and complete in its atrocity.

By letting go of your complexity, take the Stunned debility and gain a Rage point. While you have this debility, you may act normally, except you cannot speak and take -1 to INT. In return, you may spend a Rage point to turn a missed Defy Danger using INT, into a partial hit.

Raging Behemoth Charge – Enemies no longer have the drop on you, so long as you run and attack them straight away

Retribution Will Follow – Whenever a new enemy attacks you, you gain a Rage point, but you must kill them before you do anything else

Sacrosanct Blood-Titan Idol Adoption – You regain the ability to use manufactured weapons, but only if you have stolen them in combat in the last few moments. After that, you have no clue what you are doing with it.

World-Breaker Grip - When the Monster looks at the world, all it sees are things to kill, and things to kill with. The two are certainly not mutually exclusive. When you Hack and Slash while holding an enemy, you deal half the damage to the enemy you are holding.

Screaming Meat Shield (Requires World-Breaker Grip) – Enemies that you use as weapons take the full damage from being used to Hack and Slash. Additionally, any enemy that attacks you must Defy Danger to avoid hitting their ally.

Hot-Blooded Lunatic Conflagration – You become immune to non-magical fire. When you come in contact with fire, spend a Rage point to become wreathed in it for the next few moments. Any enemy that hits you or is hit by you must Defy Danger to avoid being set alight

Post Traumatic Brutality Roar – You have leverage against all sentient enemies that have seen you murder another sentient being. The leverage of course is “not being dismembered like that guy”. When you scream at them to use this leverage, roll+STR instead of +CHA. If you have the Scarred debility, you take +1 to this. For obvious reasons.

Solipsistic Reality-Rejecting Devolution - By letting go of your common sense, take the Confused debility and gain a Rage point. While you have this debility, you may act normally, but struggle to detect fine detail. You would be able notice that a ninja was sneaking up on you, but you would struggle to notice that his clothes are "black", instead of "orange", or "chair", or "quadratic meat bicycle", and take -1 to WIS. In return, you may spend a Rage point to turn a missed Defy Danger using WIS, into a partial hit.

6-10
Humanity-Reaving Psychosis Echo (Requires Post Traumatic Brutality Roar) – When you use PTBR, enemies must Defy Danger or be permanently damaged by their exposure to you. They must choose between taking -1 ongoing against you, forever, or becoming more like you. If they choose to become more like you, their alignment switches to “Evil – Enjoy… the suffering of a sentient creature”. These creatures are known as Reavers. If a group of Reavers tortures a sentient creature to death, that creature may choose to become a Reaver instead of being killed. You need never attack a Reaver if you do not want to.

Perpetual Rage Engine – When you reach the maximum number of Rage points, you increase in height and weight for the remainder of the battle. Enemies that Defy Danger to try and avoid or get away from you take -1.

Tireless Abomination Vitality – Spend a Rage point as soon as you get it to heal 2d4 hitpoints. Rage points you spend from your pool heal 1d4 hitpoints instead.

Meaningless Force-of-Nature Devolution - By letting go of your understanding of your own limitations, take the Scarred debility and gain a Rage point. While you have this debility, your hatred for living creatures transcends the physical. By spending a Rage point, you can detect any sentient, living creature within a small area for a few moments. This is not True Seeing or anything similar, you just know where they are through the residual hatred you feel for their continued existence

Rampaging Through Paper Cities – When you destroy an inanimate object with unimaginable strength, roll+STR. Take +1 if the object is in your way. It is destroyed. On a 10+, choose one:
- It takes absolutely no time at all to destroy it, you just plow through it
- You are left with a nifty improvised weapon
- The spray of shrapnel can damage nearby enemies
- The damage spreads throughout nearby connected elements, for example, you could punch a single brick in a castle wall, and the castle wall would collapse
On a miss, it is still destroyed, but it probably wasn’t a good idea to do so.

11-15 (Exalted)
Body Of Samsara's Supernal Monster (Requires Meaningless Force-of-Nature Devolution) – When you activate the hate-sense of MF-o-ND and you detect no allies, you may transform into the Body of Samsara's Supernal Monster. You double in size, the Hate-sense is permanently on, and you take +1 ongoing. If an ally enters your hate-sense field, either designate them an enemy or Defy Danger with WIS to remain Supernal. You must reroll this every time you make a move with an ally in the hate-sense field, taking -1 cumulatively for each time you have had to make the roll during the current transformation.

Land-Shaping Limitation Ignorance – Once per day, for a single moment, there is nothing you cannot kill or destroy in a single punch.

Protagonism-Devouring Legend Singularity – Enemies that you kill can never be revived. Additionally, if they can’t be killed for some reason, you can kill them. If they would come alive some time later, they don’t. If the DM disagrees with you, spend all your Rage points. The enemy dies when you kill it, and it stays dead.

Manifold Flesh-Monster Armory – You suddenly grow an additional four ‘arms’. Each ‘arm’ along with your original set, can take any form, from twisting tentacles to scything appendages to pounding fists. Your unarmed attacks gain +1 damage and the reach, near, piercing 2 tags. Your damage with unarmed attacks becomes b[2d12].

Sun-Eating Gorge-Monster Gluttony (Requires Rampaging Through Paper Cities) – When you use Rampaging Through Paper cities, you can pick two options, so long as one of them is the damage spread. When you do so, the damage is not a kick or a punch, but the tremendous pressure of your hunger, sucking in all destroyed objects or parts of objects in the area. If you manage to eat a huge amount, you may choose to vomit it up, dealing your damage to any enemies in front of you within near range.

Unconquerable Swallowed-Sun Prana (Requires Sun-Eating Gorge-Monster Gluttony, and for you to have eaten a sun) – Spend a Rage point and chose a point within far range. You breathe forth the radiance of the sun you have devoured in a line. Any enemy hit directly must Defy Danger or be incinerated, and any enemies or objects in the general vicinity are at risk of the intense heat.

Within A Perfect World, I Would Be Dead (Requires Humanity-Reaving Psychosis Echo and a large number of Reavers that worship, fear and/or hate you) – But the world isn’t perfect. When you die, the Reavers you influence begin fighting, murdering each other in a frenzy of violence. After about a month, a new alpha Reaver has arisen to take your place. They now the exact same stats, starting moves and advanced moves as you did, but will have a different name, look, race and bonds. Large portions of your memories overlay their own, as your essence claims it’s right to rule.

Untamed Apocalypse Shintai – When you take this move, your current Hatreds are removed. In their place, your new Hatred is “Everything”. You must always, always be moving towards sentient living creatures with the intent to kill them. If you do not, you go into a mindless rage until you kill the nearest sentient living creature. When you kill an enemy, you regenerate health equal to your current Rage points, and for the next few moments, instead of being reduced to 0 hitpoints by damage, you are instead reduced to 1 hitpoint.


Yes, this is a 3.5e homebrew class that has been ported into a medieval era hack for the Powered by the Apocalypse system. Deal with it.

So far, it's just a fair few of the Mythos that have been butchered to fit the DW system. Large blocks of flavor text have been copied indiscriminately. A few things have changed. A few things are very much the same. I'll add some brand new stuff when... when I get around to that. What do people think thus far?

Xefas
2015-11-15, 09:52 AM
What do people think thus far?

Looks good to me. The version of Dungeon World I've played seems to be older and different (somewhat) from the current one, so I can't say much mechanically. Scarred Flesh seems strong, but that might be just compared to my ye olde Apocalypse World knowledge. Rage Points are something I'd have to see in actual play to get a good feel for, but seem cool. I think you did a beautiful job adapting some Vincent Baker Hack-The-Apocalypse verbage to the abilities. Protagonism-Devouring Legend Singularity in particular gave me a big laugh. I love it.

It seems to me that the Teramach has a place in the Dungeon World lineup. Its Barbarian is defined by a lot more things than just strength and rage, so I think the two can coexist as different archetypes. Like Brick and Krieg.

Might I suggest an ability for dealing bonus damage to Groups or Hordes when you exact unnecessarily gruesome and unnatural violence against them?

spwack
2015-11-15, 07:49 PM
Looks good to me. The version of Dungeon World I've played seems to be older and different (somewhat) from the current one, so I can't say much mechanically. Scarred Flesh seems strong, but that might be just compared to my ye olde Apocalypse World knowledge. Rage Points are something I'd have to see in actual play to get a good feel for, but seem cool. I think you did a beautiful job adapting some Vincent Baker Hack-The-Apocalypse verbage to the abilities. Protagonism-Devouring Legend Singularity in particular gave me a big laugh. I love it.

It seems to me that the Teramach has a place in the Dungeon World lineup. Its Barbarian is defined by a lot more things than just strength and rage, so I think the two can coexist as different archetypes. Like Brick and Krieg.

Might I suggest an ability for dealing bonus damage to Groups or Hordes when you exact unnecessarily gruesome and unnatural violence against them?

Scarred Flesh gives a max of 3 armor, which is equal to an armor+shield combo. It has some utility as it cannot be removed, but it also disallows magic equipment, as per usual.

The Mythos Point and Hatred system is designed to reward insanity with partial immunity to failure. Which is OK I guess. I added the small XP bonuses because without those failures it's much harder. It might be interesting to get rid of this, force the player to decide between spending a point and missing the XP, or shouldering the blow and getting stronger from it.

I also like PDLS. I've moved a few of the more exotic Legendaries and Exalted Mythos into the 11-15 bracket, whereas every other class ends at 10. I'm torn between making levels 1-10 be of the same balance as other classes (and having 11-15 be higher powered), and bringing the whole thing up a notch. What do you think? I'm thinking that levels 1-10 should fit in with every other class, and 11-15 to be allowed or forbidden on a case-by-case basis. On the other hand... it's a Termach. This is Mythos.

I'll add a move that means overkill damage is spread around nearby enemies. It'll be a 2-5 move. An ideas for a name?

Lanth Sor
2015-11-16, 04:09 PM
I had a horrible idea. Mythic Insanity(I'm insane/make people insane...but mostly I'm insane), Mythic Sin(7 deadlies of course), Mythic Ignorance(Billy was actually a "genius", its spelled ORK)

Primal Fury
2015-11-16, 09:26 PM
I'm dipping my toes back into the Daskalos, the Mythic Teacher, and I'm wondering what would make sense as a way for them to gain more mythos points. Donating to their ally's improvement sounds reasonable, but that might translate to actual mechanical benefits.

Also. There's something in here called Hero-Fondling Hands. I make no apologies.

spwack
2015-11-16, 11:27 PM
I... uh... Fondling? Huh. Well, perhaps overly ornate framed achievements of your students could be a decent money sink? And when I say "overly ornate", really go ham.

Primal Fury
2015-11-16, 11:41 PM
I... uh... Fondling?
Yes. Fondling.


Huh. Well, perhaps overly ornate framed achievements of your students could be a decent money sink? And when I say "overly ornate", really go ham.
Oh... I see where you're going with that. Yeah... Yeah I like it. Like paying a bard to wander the land singing of their accomplishments. Or paying a bard to follow them around to record them.

spwack
2015-11-17, 12:28 AM
Yes. Fondling.


Oh... I see where you're going with that. Yeah... Yeah I like it. Like paying a bard to wander the land singing of their accomplishments. Or paying a bard to follow them around to record them.

I was thinking of a trophy wall (and was rather dissatisfied with it), but your idea of any record sounds much better (geddit? Sounds? Because it's a bard?)

Primal Fury
2015-11-18, 02:16 PM
Tell me how this sounds. I'm especially concerned about the last part with the traveling bard.


A Daskalos also has the ability to learn more Mythos, above the ones automatically allotted to him by leveling up. Whenever he spends resources wholly dedicated to glorifying the deeds of his disciples or allies, he recoups the gold piece value of those resources in mythos points. First, the Daskalos must witness his ally or disciple accomplish a feat worthy of recognition; this can include defeating a well-renowned opponent (such an orc warlord), or solving a centuries old riddle. Next, the Daskalos must determine how they will glorify the accomplishment. For the former example, he might decapitate the orc warlord and pay to have his head magically preserved, serving as a permanent trophy; for the latter example, the Daskalos might record the dialogue between his disciple and the sphinx presenting the riddle, later paying a bard to write an epic poem or compose a song painting them as a great hero accomplishing an impossible task. One could even go as far as to pay a bard to travel with the party to keep track of the group's achievements, paying them a regular salary. It must be noted that, in this final case, the gold piece value only becomes mythos points after the bard both creates AND distributes tales and ballads of your allies' glory.

pieman2945
2015-11-18, 02:24 PM
Tell me how this sounds. I'm especially concerned about the last part with the traveling bard.

Seems good to me. But I have to add that while you said 'centuries old riddle,' you never specified it had to be unsolved. Any easy riddle for children written 100 years ago might qualify. :smallwink:

DracoDei
2015-11-18, 10:02 PM
Some ramblings off the top of my head:
Picking the word "Bard" rather than "Minstrel" raises the the possibility of the NPC (or worse, PC) in question serving too useful of a resource, thus getting BOTH a useful party member AND Mythos points out of the payment. Of course, the "wholely dedicated" clause prevents this, but it does indicate a situation that is rather tricky to deal with in a fair manner.

I'll also point out that the whole thing gets a bit tangled (regardless of specific mechanism) when you get into an intrigue/guerilla warfare/stealth based campaign. Perhaps that particular class is simply unsuited for that sort of campaign? I don't even recall what the class is supposed to be, so take that with a grain of salt.

Primal Fury
2015-11-18, 10:14 PM
Some ramblings off the top of my head:
Picking the word "Bard" rather than "Minstrel" raises the the possibility of the NPC (or worse, PC)
That does make more sense.


I'll also point out that the whole thing gets a bit tangled (regardless of specific mechanism) when you get into an intrigue/guerilla warfare/stealth based campaign. Perhaps that particular class is simply unsuited for that sort of campaign? I don't even recall what the class is supposed to be, so take that with a grain of salt.
Well... What about propaganda and fear-mongering? Less "Hear ye people! The hero, whose name is Bob, has come to liberate us from tyranny!" and more "Hey guys, did you hear about that masked vigilante, Bob Man? Dude is crazy strong and super cool. Spread the word."

DracoDei
2015-11-18, 10:31 PM
Well... What about propaganda and fear-mongering? Less "Hear ye people! The hero, whose name is Bob, has come to liberate us from tyranny!" and more "Hey guys, did you hear about that masked vigilante, Bob Man? Dude is crazy strong and super cool. Spread the word."
Yeah, that sounds like the way to go, but you might want to include that explanation in the next draft of the paragraph you posted. Just makes it clearer for anyone who isn't thinking very creatively when they read that paragraph.

Also depends on if the goal is "plausible deniability" or "they would never in their wildest dreams guess it was Bob and his compatriots". Maybe explain that leaving the name "Bob" off it it, or even framing someone (fictitious?) isn't necessarily a deal-killer? Or at least in some campaigns?

spwack
2015-11-20, 11:15 AM
Ok, Anakitos port is done. I'm not quite as happy with this one as the Teramach port. I doubt it's the source material, I'm just not really getting the same sense of douche-baggery as I wanted... eh.

---


Name: Kakarot, Nappa, Bardock, Turles, Raditz, Tarble

Look:
Eyes – Vibrant, violent, hypnotic, ethereal
Hair – Flowing, braided, luscious
Aura – Twisting strands, vibrating essence, soft glow

Damage: d8
HP: 8+Constituion

Societal Alignment:
Lawful – Weigh the needs of the group over the needs of the individual
(Caprice: Don’t do something you are asked to do by authority)
Chaotic – Weigh the needs of the individual over the needs of the group
(Anxiety: Avoid making a plan or difficult decision by passing it off to someone else)

Moral Alignment:
Good – Alleviate the suffering of another
(Rage: Lash out in sudden violence against perceived injustice)
Evil – Treat the suffering of another as inconsequential
(Guilt: Avoid violence at any cost)

Bonds:

Starting Moves:
The Sun’s Mythos – Each move is marked with [Purity], [Conviction] or [Courage]. Each is a Fetter, a measure of how the Anakitos can uphold the lofty principles that the Sun’s power rests upon. Each Feature comes in three levels, Shining, Waning, and Broken. If a Fetter is Broken, moves relating to that Fetter cannot be used.

[Purity] is a measure of what lengths the Anakitos goes to maintaining their physical integrity. It is reduced by one rank when you take any debility, are poisoned, take more than one third of your hitpoints in damage in one hit, or spend more than a few moments in magical darkness. Purity is increased by one rank after an hour spent meditating. You cannot restore Purity ranks if you are suffering from poison, disease, or are drunk or otherwise intoxicated.

[Conviction] is a measure of your dedication to a particular set of ethics that you hold sacred. It takes the two-part form of your Societal and Moral alignment. You lose one rank of Conviction whenever you deliberately and directly act against your either part of your alignment, or convince someone else to do so. You regain one lost rank whenever you act in accordance with your beliefs, or convince another to act in accordance with your beliefs when they otherwise wouldn't. Along with losing access to [Conviction] moves, one (or both) of your alignments switches to the alternative alignment for 24 hours, or until your [Conviction] is Shining.

[Courage] is a measure of your willingness to accept challenges and threats, and attempt to overcome them even when it is inconvenient or dangerous. Quite simply, you lose a rank of Courage when you decline a challenge that is not completely impossible, and gain a rank when you complete a challenge.

Rising Sun Glory – Add half your Charisma score to maximum HP, and add the forceful tag to your unarmed attacks.

Advanced Moves:
2-5
Absolute Victory Meditation [Courage] – Each day at dawn, roll 2d6 a number of time equal to your STR. At any time, you may replace a Hack and Slash roll with one of these Arete dice after you roll. You may reroll your entire Arete pool once per day by meditating for 5 minutes.

Bravery-Inspiring Presence [Courage] - When the great calamity, the red beast, the heart of all monsters stood before the Sun, and galactic tides of horror burnt and withered his world, sending his soldiers fleeing to their deaths, he braced against the flood and did not look away. "Pray, little rebel.,” said the monster-heart, "Cast off your chains, so you may make good sport for my master."

The Sun regarded his golden chains, glimmering in the light of a burning sky. "Make no mistake, creature." He said. "My fetters withhold no strength, but weakness. Mine and others." And the monster-heart looked behind the sun, and four stars there shone, each grasping a link of the Sun's courage.

When you are face to face with a threat, with allies by your side, roll+CHA. On a 10+, choose two, on a 7-9, choose one. One a miss, still choose one but you’ve put yourself in harms way.
- Allies take +1 armor ongoing until the threat is removed
- Allies take +2 on Defy Danger rolls to avoid fear

Corruption-Denying Integrity [Purity] – When you Defy Danger to avoid an ongoing affect, on a 10+ choose one.
- You become immune to that effect
- Take +1 forward against the source of the effect
- You impress, dismay or frighten on looking enemies

Unblemished Unity Of Mind And Spirit [Purity] – When you have any penalty to a roll from an enemy effect, take +1 to that roll

Sun-Bronzed God King Physique [Conviction] – Your damage dice increases to d10. When you spend a day in sunlight, your Strength score increases by 1 to a maximum of 18. You can also never sunburn.

That Which is Not the Light [Purity] – Pick an enemy type, take +1 ongoing against them. When dealing with your Favored Enemy, betraying a Good, Chaotic, or Lawful tenet of your Conviction never causes your Conviction to diminish. Respecting the dignity of sentient life is all well and good... unless it's them. We file those atrocities under 'The Greater Good'.

Thousand Sunbeam Array [Courage] – When you Hack and Slash with a manufactured weapon, you can Hack and Slash another enemy with an unarmed attack.

6-10
Immaculate Sun-Soul Radiance [Purity] - Your soul begins to radiate a kind of pure cosmic energy; too much to be contained in your physical form. The energy leaks out of you in a brilliant nimbus of light - almost always golden in hue, with rare exception. This light shines out to near range, and can be seen from far range, and is natural sunlight in every way. You can suppress this effect through a minute of meditation, but take -1 ongoing and cannot use any abilities with this move as a requirement. You can release your aura in an instant, which always happens if you fall unconscious. You are immune to blindness.

Infinite Supernova Strength [Courage] – When you Hack and Slash, on a 10+ the enemy is knocked to the ground. You never suffer a penalty for attacking an enemy that is larger than you.

Sky-Illuminating Sunfire Projection [Purity] (Requires Immaculate Sun-Soul Radiance) – You can use your aura to fly.

Arms-Of-Heaven Anima Mandala [Purity] (Requires Immaculate Sun-Soul Radiance) – You gain extra set of glowing spectral arms that emerge from your aura. Attacks made with these arms gain the reach tag, and when Hack and Slash an enemy, on a 10+ you deal bonus damage equal to your CHA. If you attack an enemy with both your natural arms and your aura arms, your damage becomes b[1d8], or b[1d10] with Sun-Bronzed God King Physique. When you Hack and Slash an enemy, on a 10+ you deal bonus damage equal to your CHA

Rote Protagonism Strike [Courage] (Requires Absolute Victory Meditation) – You ready your weapon and address your posture towards a particular foe. They understand your intent to harm them, and their body responds as it always does to danger, doing what it can to prevent harm to itself. But then, within the passing of instants, they realize something utterly horrific; today, they woke up believing, as all do, that they were the central character of their own story, the protagonist whose actions were always justified, whose life was interesting and worthwhile simply because they were at the center of it, and they believed themselves to not just be some collection of particles drifting in a vast universe, living in the background of some greater being's tale - and they were wrong. You are the protagonist, not them. This is your story, and the hero always wins. It's what the audience wants, its what the writers churn out by the pounds and tons, its what sells. There was never any choice, never any possibility that your attack would fail, that they would manage to dodge it, that they could withstand it by any herculean feat of endurance, because that would mean that they matter.

Lose an Arete dice and make an attack. Don’t roll, you hit as if you rolled a 12+.

Self-Made Miracle Authority [Purity] – You gain the commune and cast a spell cleric moves. When you select this move, treat yourself as a cleric of level 1 for using spells. Every time you gain a level thereafter, increase your effective cleric level by 1.

11-15

Fiery Daystar Incarnation [Purity] (Requires Immaculate Sun-Soul Radiance) – The cosmic energy flowing from your soul is strengthened and stratified into four layers, the first extending to near range, the second to far range, the third to distant range and the fourth to extreme range. You are immune to all the effects.

Anything in the first layer must Defy Danger or be set alight and blinded if it has eyes. To avoid being blinded, a layer of material or something similar must be in place. Closed eyes will not suffice.

Anything with eyes in the second layer must Defy Danger if it looks directly at you.

Although the heat of the third layer is not enough to deal damage or blind, it does raise the temperature to uncomfortable levels, evaporating moisture into the air, and not allowing it to cool, preventing the formation of natural precipitation. If you stay in the same region for long enough without setting, crops will begin to wither, aquifers will begin to dry up, soil will dry and crack, and animals will be highly confused, possibly deserting the area.

To creatures in the forth layer, you appear as an indistinct light, like an oddly persistent sunrise or sunset.

It now takes you an hour to contain your aura, though it still takes only a moment to release it.

Sol Invictus [Conviction] – You cannot die, and damage never decreases you below 1 hit point.

Xefas
2015-11-20, 02:49 PM
I think the Conviction theme could work really well with Dungeon World's alignment system, but I doubt Purity should be translated so directly. I recall that Apocalypse World had a 'harm' move that you rolled when you suffered harm, where depending on how high you rolled, the MC could tack on some side effects, like getting knocked prone.

If Dungeon World has something like that, you could represent Purity as just adding an additional option for the MC - they can turn one of your powers off as one of their side effect choices if you roll badly on taking harm.

Courage could be something like when you deny a challenge, roll +Cha. On a 10+, you make the challenge sound either too foolish to take seriously or too beneath you to merit notice. On a 7-9, you must blindly accept the challenge without delay, or the MC turns off one of your powers. On a 6 or less, you must blindly accept the challenge without delay, or the MC turns off two of your powers and you take -1 ongoing.

Maybe not that exactly, but something like that.

Conviction could be something like when you act in opposition to one of your alignments or convince someone else to do so, roll +Cha. On a 10+, you justify the act to yourself for now, but take a stacking -1 ongoing to Conviction rolls until you roll a 6 or less on one. On a 7-9, the MC turns off one of your powers and you take a stacking -1 ongoing to Conviction rolls until you roll a 6 or less. On a 6 or less, you suffer a crisis of character and your alignments shift (Caprice/Guilt/etc, like you have it) for the next session. You don't make Conviction rolls during that session.

And their powers wouldn't necessarily need [Courage], [Conviction], [Purity] tags.

Just some thoughts. You know the system better than I do, and you did a good job with the Teramach, so I'm sure this will come together too.

spwack
2015-11-20, 07:26 PM
AW has harm and the harm move. DW has hitpoints like... well, pretty much everything else. I agree with you though, the harm move would work better. When (if) I make my consolidated Mythos World hack, I'll probably use harm once again.

With the Fetters, I left their severity where you had them, so I could have the moves up at Mythic levels. Risk/reward, you see. So long as you keep your standards up, you get the shiny toys. I'd probably need to playtest it to see where the balance between broken Fetters and overpowered moves falls apart.

Xefas
2015-11-20, 11:11 PM
AW has harm and the harm move. DW has hitpoints like... well, pretty much everything else.

Tangent
Hit points aren't all that common outside of D&D's direct sphere of influence. Storyteller has its health levels filled with different kinds of damage and wound penalties. Fate has its weirdly applied stress and taggable consequences. Mouse Guard and Lady Blackbird have purely narratively enforced condition tags. In A Wicked Age has mechanically enforced condition tags. Mythender has its wound boxes that, on their own, aren't anything special, but tie into their unique storm/thunder dice and corruption stuff (you can take on some corruption to punch death in the face and crawl out of the underworld Kratos-style as an explicit, universal, and potentially frequently used mechanic). Burning Wheel has the new-player-terror-inducing PTGS (Physical Tolerances Grayscale). Don't Rest Your Head has its pain dice/pain domination/despair coins/etc weirdness. Dread has instant deeeeath. Primetime Adventures and Pilgrims of the Flying Temple are so rules-light that physical consequences are purely narration. InSpectres has penalized die pools. The Marvel Heroic Roleplaying System uses stress and trauma dice.

The list goes on. There are a lot of ways to represent damage other than a pool of points that goes up or down, with a death threshold at the bottom.

I feel like Dungeon World was fairly unique in that it's a 'story game' that went back to the ye olde classic D&D hit points, which is very uncommon.

When (if) I make my consolidated Mythos World hack, I'll probably use harm once again.

I wish you luck, and I think there's a lot of potential there. It'll be cool to see what you come up with for Agendas and Principles.

spwack
2015-11-21, 01:20 AM
Huh. When I say "pretty much everything else" I was referring to the fantasy genre as a whole. Now that you mention it, I guess I'll take a look at all of this ^ before I do anything else. When I was running an uber-highpowered (read: dumb) PVP campaign, where everyone had pretty much whatever they wanted, I had a thing called Kill Shots. Basically, any attack could wound or incapacitate, but only dramatic actions, at the appropriate time, could kill any other player. Perhaps something like that could work? Just less stupid. I'll give some thought to the Agenda. What would you have in mind for that?

DracoDei
2015-11-22, 01:08 AM
Okay, here is a snippet from the Phileotheysia I need some formatting advice on, and maybe a double-check on the entire underlying concept (although I've mentioned it in the past, so someone probably would have mentioned if it were a horrible idea).

Class Skills: Concentration(Con), Craft(Int), Diplomacy(Cha), Heal(Wis), Knowledge[Religion] (Int), Profession(Wis), Sense Motive(Wis), Speak Language(N/A), Spellcraft(Int), Tumble(Dex), and Use Rope(Dex)

Full use of the following(some may also be available from different excellencies for partial use/access): Balance, Bluff, Climb, Decipher Script, Disguise, Escape Artist, Forgery, Gather Information, Handle Animal, Hide, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge[Dungeoneering], Knowledge[Geography], Knowledge[Local], Knowledge[Nature], Knowledge[Nobility and Royalty], Listen, Move Silently, Ride, Spot, Swim, and Survival

And partial use of these: Disable Device, Knowledge[Arcana], Knowledge[History], Knowledge[The Planes], and Search.

So, my formatting question is:
Should I take the extra time to list which excellencies add which skills I that part of the class? Cleric lists which SRD domains add which skills.

My other (less important) set of questions:
This concerns my idea that those Excellencies should increase the (6+Int. Mod.) skill-base of the class if one takes enough of them. First to 7+Int. Mod. (probably at 2 such excellencies) then to 8+Int. Mod. (probably at 3 such excellencies). Naturally, this would be retroactive. I assume that none of this should cause any great problems? Are the number of Excellencies required for each boost good? Should hitting 9 +Int. Mod be verbotin, or would say... 4 or 5 such excellencies justify making the rogue cry like that? I have 9 such excellencies so far.

If it is relevant, almost all such Excellencies add at least two skills*, and most of them add some feats too. Mostly just stuff like Alertness, Stealthy, etc that give bonuses to the skills being granted, but I did throw in Darkstalker** on top of Stealthy (+2 Hide & Move Silently) on the excellency that gives you Hide and Move Silently.
*The exceptions are the Excellency that only adds Appraise, but does a bunch of things for Craft, Profession, and sometimes Survival checks and the Excellency(EDIT: Actually, this one is an Exceptional Mythos, but I threw the [Skillful Protector] tag onto it too) that grants Perform to go with a somewhat narrow selection of bardic music abilities, which is arguably a single skill.
**I don't actually own the book for this one, but I have heard some stuff about it letting you make hide checks against stuff with Blindsight and such.

Xefas
2015-11-22, 07:16 PM
I'll give some thought to the Agenda. What would you have in mind for that?

Maybe something like:

Make the world seem larger than life
Present players with impossible challenges for which they require impossible solutions
Play to find out what happens

?

spwack
2015-11-23, 02:09 AM
... I wrote a little while ago:

- Embrace the Mythic nature of the world and characters
- Give the players epic challenges, and the tools to deal with them
- Play to find out what happens

Can't be a coincidence.

EDIT: Right. I've finished a bit more. This'll be somewhat of a stream of conciousness but, uh, yeah.


The principles are left more-or-less unchanged from AW:
- Spew forth Mythos
- Address yourself to the characters, not the players
- Make your move, but misdirect
- Make your move, but never speak its name
- Keep the headsmans axe sharp
- Name everyone that matters
- Let the winds of fate blow away the chaff
- Ask provocative questions and build on the answers
- Respond with grand and brutal narration and the rewards they fight for
- Be in awe of the power of the characters, but don’t let it blind you
- Work with the narrative essence of Mythos
- Think offscreen too
- Sometimes, disclaim decision-making

The five stats so far (as is traditional) are Rage, Wrath, Balance, Deception and Arrogance. Rage is "hot", Wrath is "cold", so to speak. Each has the a primary move linked to it, in order, Destroy, Attack, Counter, Strike, and Command. Every primary move can be used to make an attack, and also as a social move. It's made for some interesting descriptions so far. Yes, the Destroy move which is roll+Rage, favored by the Teramach, can be used in a philosophical debate. It's a thing.

I'm toying with the idea of Narrative Essence. This stuff, NE, is what separates the characters from the background chaff. Any major character, including of which is the players, have some amount of Narrative essence. For the most part, it is quite simple: It's impossible to kill someone who possesses any amount of it. NE can be spent to change the threat in a narrative manner (see below), empower moves, and allow Mythic Characters to fight in an awesome manner (also see below). They regenerate in some manner.

Regarding levelling, I'm kind of erring on the side of not having XP. Rather, in order to level up from Exceptional to Fantastic (or from background chaff to Exceptional) you have to meet a set of milestones. These would, pretty much, be exactly the descriptions of the Mythos Tiers. Exhibit A:


Exceptional Mythos tell the tales of thugs, brutes, madmen, psychopaths, cannibals, and serial murderers from the Teramach character. In order to become Exceptional, you need to be feared in a major population area for bloody, violent crimes. You might not have done them, you just need to be feared. Or any number of other milestones. I'm feeling milestones would be more like achievements, each with different points. Of course, players and MC would be invited to write their own, to the approval of all other players.

HPwise, NE covers most of that. If you don't defend yourself, your dead. If you are stabbed in such a manner that it is fatal, you are dead. If you would be stabbed and don't want to be, you can try and weasel your way out (difficult) or spend an NE.

Other uses for NE: A Teramach is on a mission to discover who murdered the latest king. He has found some clues, questioned some suspects, and is getting really, really bored with all this mystery. He spends one NE, leaps through a wall and lands on the prime suspect, literally in the act of killing someone else. Easy. Except the suspect has imbibed some magic serum, increasing their size and making them a threat of equal difficulty to solving the mystery. It doesn't just beat the challenge. It doesn't end the story. It just changes it in some way. A polite individual would tell the MC some time before they use it.

Or: A Cynosure and a Bellator are squaring off. The Cynosure thinks it's a battle of wits. The Bellator thinks it's a battle using bloody big bits of metal. Each time the Bellator takes a violent swing, the Cynosure pays the price, steps aside, and makes a quip. Each time the Cynosure tries to convince the Bellator to back down with remark about his parentage, he slashes forwards with his ridiculously oversized sword. Not entirely sure if this is going to be the final form of it, but it's just an idea.

UrsusArctos
2015-11-23, 11:05 PM
Hi everyone. I'm a huge fan of the Mythos subsystem, and I am currently working on a Mythic Monk, and I am worried that it might occupy the same space as a Termach on paper. I'm thinking of using Perfection, as in the perfection of self, as an ideal for it and contrasting the flavor of a zen warrior to the angry barbarian, but both are unarmed and unarmored.

7th son of sons
2015-11-23, 11:10 PM
Hi everyone. I'm a huge fan of the Mythos subsystem, and I am currently working on a Mythic Monk, and I am worried that it might occupy the same space as a Termach on paper. I'm thinking of using Perfection, as in the perfection of self, as an ideal for it and contrasting the flavor of a zen warrior to the angry barbarian, but both are unarmed and unarmored.

Plenty of mythos classes are "Unarmed" and "Unarmed". Off the top of my head, The Teramach, The Kathados, The Epifovian, and (to an extent) The Kreikiri, all fall into that distinction. So long as the overall flavor and feel of it is something new, you should be A-Ok.

spwack
2015-11-23, 11:20 PM
The Kathodos is currently the Mythic rework of the Monk, with an elemental bend, while the Bellator focuses solely on combat. The Anakitos would so far be the closest thing to having 'Perfection' as an ideal, but fueled by arrogance. Nothing so far has any sense of humility, as far as I can tell.

Tanuki Tales
2015-11-29, 07:54 PM
So, since as of late I'm more an idea man than an execution guy (unholy trinity of apathy, depression and a full time job making it very unlikely I'll ever Brew again...for the forseeable future), throwing this out there for someone to work with:



I already had an idea that their Mythos would be split between 3 types; Hunter Mythos, Tamer Mythos and Slayer Mythos

Hunter Mythos would give them bonuses on Survival checks, Diplomacy for Gather Information, etc. for each they have, to represent being at passively getting better at pursuing prey
Tamer Mythos would give them bonuses on interacting with a few creature types, to represent them at understanding, empathizing with and training their companions and other creatures
Slayer Mythos would give them bonuses on Knowledge checks, Stealth checks and anything that helps them kill stuff



Some ideas I had for actual Mythos/Excellencies would be: getting Favored Terrain as a Ranger, but you get half the bonus in all other Favored Terrains.
Getting Hide in Plain Sight and Pass without a Trace, along with knowing when you're being tracked
Getting a good bonus on Survival checks to track, ignoring penalties for weather and time conditions and casting Augury to know where/what your quarry plans to do next
Automatically always find enough sustenance, shelter and other necessities, as long as the environ you're in could even possibly support life
Animal Companion, beefed up, with options to have multiple companions (at lower effective levels for abilities) or use yourself (at a lower effective level)
Use something like Locate Object for something you've both seen and injured
Ignore defensive traits, based on Knowledge check results




Also just got an idea for a Mythic Shapeshifter, which would revolve around always adapting and being impossible to put down
With a capstone Mythos being that if the character is killed by something that normally would make it deader than deadest dead, it would still come back, with some level loss, because it rebuilt itself from a parallel timeline where it DIDN'T die

So even a Teramach can't kill it ;P

Well, without trouble. I'm thinking the thing would just give it Negative levels each time it functions, so you COULD probably wipe it out, given enough effort

Just pondered this one up like...20 minutes ago, while the Mythic Ranger concepts I've been stewing on for a few days. Maybe it could also gain other Mythos' classes Mythos/Excellencies in some capacity or emulate them or something?

ThreadNecro5
2015-11-30, 05:20 PM
It has been a while since I last checked in, but I am continuing with an idea I had a while back.

well, for a mythos I am planning I am planning to base mechanics on a feat I have herd of that grants the character ownership of an area of land that increases with level, can anyone tell me if such a feat actually exists?

For context it is for a mythos chain that essentially turns the character into a half-gold dragon whose breath weapon turns things into golden statues which can either be used for money, or animated and used as servants in a limited area.

Temotei
2015-12-01, 03:24 AM
well, for a mythos I am planning I am planning to base mechanics on a feat I have herd of that grants the character ownership of an area of land that increases with level, can anyone tell me if such a feat actually exists?

Landlord is the closest I can think of. It's in Stronghold Builder's Guide. Basically you get an allowance for land only and you buy the land with the allowance. The amount you get increases with level.

Jakman217
2015-12-01, 09:00 PM
Hey guys, I love this mythos stuff.

Have you considered moving it from these forums onto a wiki of some kind. It would be a lot nicer on everyone in the long run, and would give better version control. If you want help with it I'd be glad to volunteer helping set it up.

If you're interested just message me and I'll get to work.

I've been wanting to try my hand at mythos classes also. I've been contemplating something like a more morally neutral Dinyomi as I love the concept but hate how it is nearly impossible to be a good character.

vasharanpaladin
2015-12-01, 09:19 PM
Solution: Never use D&D alignment. Use the Color Wheel instead or, better still, let players define their own morality.

Ganondorf did nothing wrong.

ImperatorV
2015-12-01, 10:04 PM
I've been wanting to try my hand at mythos classes also. I've been contemplating something like a more morally neutral Dinyomi as I love the concept but hate how it is nearly impossible to be a good character.

I don't see anything about the Dinyomi that would force one to be non-good. Glory-hogging, yes. Prideful, yes. But neither of those are things a good character cannot be.

Granted, if you want to play the fluff of some of the mythos to the fullest, being good would be challenging. But it's just that: a challenge. And who better to overcome a challenge, then the Dinyomi?

Jakman217
2015-12-01, 10:29 PM
Solution: Never use D&D alignment.

Hah, no. I have no problem with the alignment system as it stands, only that people see it as a straight jacket to pidgeonhole themselves. I also don't default to subjective alignment as unless the setting is specifically made that way. There is an absolute objective morality to the D&D lore (even if DM's don't follow it perfectly). It could do with an additional 'positive' and 'negative' modifier, but that's adding detail that you could do yourself and I generally cover that with a lean to another alignment.


As to ImperatorV, let me put it more bluntly. A Dinyomi who isn't an A-hole. Most of the Dinyomi's abilities are focused on being a glory-hogging, hubris infused (prideful is not strong enough of a word) jerk. It is far more difficult to be a nice guy. You may be able to squeeze a LG character out of it, but he's guaranteed to be a jerk. I want a character who can gain power without crushing his subjects and minions underfoot, one who can seek to give all who stand with him glory rather than take it for himself. The character wouldn't be 'THE CONQUEROR', but 'THE KING' or 'THE LEADER'. They wouldn't have a frail ego, or try to hog the glory, but would seek to be the best. He may have abilities dependent upon how other's see him, but it wouldn't penalize him. I think it's best to sumerize with a quote from Hemingway.

“There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.”

This quote would be the heart of the character, and being a jerk would be entirely up to the player's methods rather than the abilities he's given.

ImperatorV
2015-12-01, 10:36 PM
As to ImperatorV, let me put it more bluntly. A Dinyomi who isn't an A-hole. Most of the Dinyomi's abilities are focused on being a glory-hogging, hubris infused (prideful is not strong enough of a word) jerk. It is far more difficult to be a nice guy. You may be able to squeeze a LG character out of it, but he's guaranteed to be a jerk. I want a character who can gain power without crushing his subjects and minions underfoot, one who can seek to give all who stand with him glory rather than take it for himself. The character wouldn't be 'THE CONQUEROR', but 'THE KING' or 'THE LEADER'. They wouldn't have a frail ego, or try to hog the glory, but would seek to be the best. He may have abilities dependent upon how other's see him, but it wouldn't penalize him. I think it's best to sumerize with a quote from Hemingway.

“There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.”

This quote would be the heart of the character, and being a jerk would be entirely up to the player's methods rather than the abilities he's given.

So more of a King Arthur than an Alexander the Great, eh? That, indeed, might take another class.

Also, I'm giving myself Fate/Zero flashbacks. Need to watch that again sometime.

Jakman217
2015-12-01, 10:38 PM
So more of a King Arthur than an Alexander the Great, eh? That, indeed, might take another class.

Also, I'm giving myself Fate/Zero flashbacks. Need to watch that again sometime.

Absolutely, a leader you want to follow rather than have to follow. I think it would be fair to give some 'dominating' effects, but they would be for the darker side or emergencies.

I do have a class that follows this idea better, but it's not done like a mythos class and its basically a defensive bard/knight hybrid.

And that's a great series.

roko10
2015-12-02, 03:23 AM
Hey guys, I love this mythos stuff.

Have you considered moving it from these forums onto a wiki of some kind. It would be a lot nicer on everyone in the long run, and would give better version control. If you want help with it I'd be glad to volunteer helping set it up.

If you're interested just message me and I'll get to work.

I've been wanting to try my hand at mythos classes also. I've been contemplating something like a more morally neutral Dinyomi as I love the concept but hate how it is nearly impossible to be a good character.


The Agios (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?401537-quot-I-am-the-bastion-before-the-%3Cbr%20/%3Ehorde-I-shall-not-fall-lest-the-weak-be-trampled-quot) manages to fulfil that quota quite well.

In fact, though, that's the problem with Mythos classes. Out of the 15 made, only 1 is geared for Good. The others are either too full of themselves, downright geared for capital E Evil, or just focused on something not based on the alignment system.

Heliomance
2015-12-02, 06:43 AM
Is there a newbie's guide to basic Mythos mechanics anywhere? I've looked at a few threads before, and haven't been able to make head or tails of them.

Temotei
2015-12-02, 10:50 AM
Is there a newbie's guide to basic Mythos mechanics anywhere? I've looked at a few threads before, and haven't been able to make head or tails of them.

Not as far as I can remember. Each class has the mechanics (generally just underneath the table), but what in particular is getting you?

Jakman217
2015-12-02, 11:35 AM
The Agios manages to fulfil that quota quite well.

In fact, though, that's the problem with Mythos classes. Out of the 15 made, only 1 is geared for Good. The others are either too full of themselves, downright geared for capital E Evil, or just focused on something not based on the alignment system.

I actually like that about most of the mythos classes, but I feel it's a bit unbalanced in that it's so difficult to play a good or nice character with these. I may play evil more than good, but playing a good character just feels right sometimes. Good in that they could be actually praised as heroes without any massive horrendous flaws.


But again I'll repeat my real question for the powers that be in this group. If I made a wiki for this collection would you guys use it? I'd gladly help you all with it, set it up, and help maintain it. It wolud make thinks so much nicer for everyone involved.

Heliomance
2015-12-02, 11:36 AM
Not as far as I can remember. Each class has the mechanics (generally just underneath the table), but what in particular is getting you?

I don't remember offhand. It's been a while since I looked. I just remember looking at some of the classes and realising it was a whole subsystem, and that so far as I could tell the classes assumed knowledge of the subsystem.

Temotei
2015-12-02, 12:19 PM
I don't remember offhand. It's been a while since I looked. I just remember looking at some of the classes and realising it was a whole subsystem, and that so far as I could tell the classes assumed knowledge of the subsystem.

Each class describes how it works. In the Bellator (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?336731-quot-Today-is-victory-over-yourself-Tomorrow-is-your-victory-over-lesser-men-quot)'s entry, for example, the pieces you'd want to look at would be "The Iron Mythos" and "Mythos Known" for the Mythos themselves. For Excellencies, you'd look at "A Warrior's Excellence," and for the class features other than Mythos and Excellencies, "Equipment Mastery."

Basically:


1. All that stuff about stories, Lawgivers, Gods, and Titans is fluff. If it distracts you, glaze over it until you see anything resembling mechanics. If you're interested in the fluff, go here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?447006-The-Mythos-Setting-Timeline) and here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?340811-Titans-of-the-Mythos-Subsystem). It's based on the Exalted system.


2. Mythos are abilities you acquire at a rate shown in the class table. The Bellator knows two Mythos at 1st level, and selects those two from the list of Exceptional Mythos in post #2.


3. Mythos are generally at-will abilities, though there are exceptions. Sometimes they grant feats, sometimes they grant new abilities, and sometimes they improve on your previous abilities by giving more options. Generally, a Mythos will have a profound effect on how you play a Mythos character.


4. Excellencies are abilities you acquire at a rate shown in the class table. The Bellator knows a single Excellency at 1st level, and selects that one from the list of Excellencies in post #5.


5. Excellencies tend to have less pronounced effects compared to Mythos. They serve to supplement a Mythos class's Mythos with bonuses and sometimes new abilities that are simply not active enough to be Mythos. Generally, an Excellency will have a relatively minor effect on how you play a Mythos character.


6. A Mythos class has at least one way to gain "Mythos points." A Bellator gains Mythos points by training and destroying equipment through this training. The equipment's value is translated directly into Mythos points. Some Mythos grant additional methods for acquiring Mythos points.


7. Mythos points may be spent on gaining additional Mythos or Excellencies. The costs are given under "Mythos Known" and, in the Bellator's case, "A Warrior's Excellency." Spending Mythos points is a voluntary action, and so they need not be spent immediately upon receiving them.


8. Each Mythos class also receives a number of features separate from Mythos and Excellencies. The Bellator receives "Equipment Mastery," which prevents fatigue from sleeping in armor and grants Quick Draw as a bonus feat at 1st level. Generally, one of these class features will have a smaller effect on how you play a Mythos character than Excellencies will (but should not be ignored--think the warblade's "battle" features).

EDIT: In case you started reading my post as soon as I posted it, I added a couple more points on gaining Mythos and Excellencies over and above the class table's granted number.

In addition to all of the above, a couple of classes have one or two additional caveats. The Kathodos (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?301261-3-5-quot-I-have-mastered-the-Elements-a-thousand-times-in-a-thousand-lifetimes-quot&p=15947087#post15947087), for example, has Mythos associated with the four classical elements and additional [Internal] or [External] tags, which have a few rules associated with them. Make sure you read each entry in detail before moving on to Mythos.

Kymme
2015-12-02, 01:21 PM
But again I'll repeat my real question for the powers that be in this group. If I made a wiki for this collection would you guys use it? I'd gladly help you all with it, set it up, and help maintain it. It wolud make thinks so much nicer for everyone involved.

I would definitely use something like that. Also, I'd be happy to provide assistance in setting up such a wiki. I don't really know how one goes about making one, but I'm willing to learn (plus I'm pretty good at copy-pasting stuff). :smallsmile:

Jakman217
2015-12-02, 01:39 PM
I'm mostly asking to build the wiki for everyone's sake, creators and users alike, rather than doing it and assuming support. I'd rather not be that guy.

Temotei
2015-12-02, 03:24 PM
I don't have any objections. I probably won't use it but my stuff (the Askopar, Quality-Muting Prowess) is free to go on there and I'll be sure to update it on the wiki whenever I do updates on GitP.

ThreadNecro5
2015-12-02, 03:55 PM
Landlord is the closest I can think of. It's in Stronghold Builder's Guide. Basically you get an allowance for land only and you buy the land with the allowance. The amount you get increases with level.

Yes, that was the feat I was trying to remember. Now unfortunately I cannot find prices for land anywhere, but thank you anyway.

Jakman217
2015-12-02, 06:09 PM
If there's no problems then I'll get to setting the wiki up. I'll try to keep it to those who've agreed, but I may mess up. I'll put up a link to it as soon as I get the main page up.

Also, whatever happened to the Future Mythos classes on the compendium? The one that links to the imgur with all the pictures and quotes of later classes. Are these out of date or 'the dream' to complete eventually? Because some of these seem closer to the idea I've been looking for, but seem to have already been put up and potentially have had their names changed, or have been forgotten.

Xefas
2015-12-02, 06:30 PM
Also, whatever happened to the Future Mythos classes on the compendium? The one that links to the imgur with all the pictures and quotes of later classes. Are these out of date or 'the dream' to complete eventually? Because some of these seem closer to the idea I've been looking for, but seem to have already been put up and potentially have had their names changed, or have been forgotten.

I think my current average is something like one full Mythos class every ~4 months. Based on 4th Edition's lifespan, you probably won't be seeing some of those until 6th Edition rolls around. :smalltongue:

DracoDei
2015-12-02, 06:54 PM
Note to self: Explain "Cruel Mercy" excellency I invented for Teramach.


In fact, though, that's the problem with Mythos classes. Out of the 15 made, only 1 is geared for Good. The others are either too full of themselves, downright geared for capital E Evil, or just focused on something not based on the alignment system.
FWIW, the Phileotheysia's fluff leans towards Good, although doing it as LE is not too hard, and anyone who places value on their comrades isn't to hard to justify. So basically, anyone but the most die-hard of Chaotic Evil shouldn't be too hard to make work with the class?

I guess I will count that as an incentive towards actually writing it up?

If there's no problems then I'll get to setting the wiki up. I'll try to keep it to those who've agreed, but I may mess up. I'll put up a link to it as soon as I get the main page up.
When/If I get the class published feel free to copy over anything mythos-related I make.

Plus any content I make for other people's classes etc.

Jakman217
2015-12-02, 07:08 PM
I'm currently trying to get to 10 posts to get post the link but I've got the home page started and got to the start of the mythos on the Askopar. So I'll post the link in a bit and you can spread that around.

To the other creators who've not responded, may I copy your stuff over so it can be edited and better consolidated and organized for everyone?

Jakman217
2015-12-03, 02:43 AM
Here's the link to the home page of the Compendium. I've finished up the Askopar as well and there is a link to it there.
http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Mythos_Compendium_Wikia

It's nothing too fancy, but hopefully it will improve at a decent pace.

7th son of sons
2015-12-04, 11:24 AM
I'm all for having my stuff on the wiki. And don't worry y'all, the mythoc not-really-a-bad-guy is coming. Soon

Jakman217
2015-12-04, 12:26 PM
I'm all for having my stuff on the wiki.
Thank you good sir, I'll be moving your material over post-haste.

And don't worry y'all, the mythoc not-really-a-bad-guy is coming. Soon
And another thank you, as the current ones are good, but a bit similar.

Jakman217
2015-12-05, 07:49 PM
Boom. Dinyomi, Done.

http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Dinyomi?venotify=created

Edit: Woops. Fixed.

DracoDei
2015-12-05, 08:47 PM
Thought I would give some commentary on the Teramach in terms of one of the characters from my campaign (which I have now placed on indefinite hiatus due to extremely slow posting by players).

Okay, what you need to know about my campaign is "that the forces of Good" are SCARY. Fight them "clean"? They will kill you unless you surrender (no surprise there). Fight them "dirty"? They will take you alive and then force one of your allies who lawfully surrendered to torture you to death (or else share your fate at the hands of TWO MORE lawfully surrendered allies).

So when TwentyFold wanted to play a Lawful Good Teramach, I decided that his character would need a new Excellency to allow him to deal subdual damage, regardless of what his other Mythos and Excellencies said. Otherwise it would have been too easy an out from one of the central philosophical conflicts of the setting. I called it "Cruel Mercy" although TwentyFold apparently picked different names for it.

Here is his character sheet if anyone cares.
Tzunzaku (Non-Raging) (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html?id=501779)


Boom. Dinyomi, Done.

http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Dinyomi?action=edit&section=1

Your link goes to an "edit" not a "view"...
EDIT: And you have fixed it now.

Jakman217
2015-12-12, 03:48 PM
Epifovian and Mythic Clone have been added

http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Mythos_Compendium_Wikia

Rogthnor
2015-12-13, 10:06 AM
So I stared the Mythic Bard a little while ago, in terms of exalted he's heavily inspired by the rahksha. Any way I can get it added to the WIP list?
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?398653-quot-All-the-worlds-a-stage-and-all-the-men-and-women-mearely-players-quot-(Mythos)

Jakman217
2015-12-13, 12:31 PM
So I stared the Mythic Bats a little while ago, in terms of exalted he's heavily inspired by the rahksha. Any way I can get it added to the WIP list?
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?398653-quot-All-the-worlds-a-stage-and-all-the-men-and-women-mearely-players-quot-(Mythos)

I can put on the wiki if you want.

Rogthnor
2015-12-13, 01:23 PM
I can put on the wiki if you want.

I'd appreciate that. Thank you!

Jakman217
2015-12-13, 06:52 PM
If you want to one up me and work on it there yourself, go ahead. It should be open to you.

Rogthnor
2015-12-14, 10:27 AM
Thanks. I won't be able to get to it until after finals, but I plan to start working on it again next week

Lanth Sor
2015-12-14, 06:15 PM
So me and xefas were talking about how it would be nice to do the wiki thing but how the formatting would be a pain a few months ago. So I'm glad your interested in starting it. Ima try to put the Agios in but feel free to update formatting cause i don't know it very well.


Feel free to add any of my content.

Also I need some inspiration for fantastic Agios Mythos as is there are too many weapon focused ones and not enough generic. What level should a mount be?

DracoDei
2015-12-14, 11:09 PM
What level should a mount be?
Don't even recall what the Agios is supposed to be, so take it with a grain of salt when I note that a Druid can have a horse as their animal companion from first level, and a Paladin gets their special mount at 5th. You could use those as your reference points.

Lanth Sor
2015-12-15, 11:16 AM
Agios is the Mythic Defender/Protector/Guardian take your pick but part of his stick is "Knight in Shining Armor" other part is tyrant that protects his property jealously but i think the latter one is mostly overlooked as the class sounds so goodie to shoes.

ZaneShadow
2015-12-15, 04:31 PM
Hey, I'm working on a Mythic Commoner class. It's pretty bare bones right now, but I'll take any criticism and advice offered.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472228-Mythic-Commoner&p=20196988#post20196988

Xefas
2015-12-15, 04:43 PM
I've been having a little extra free time at night lately, so I'm doing a choose your own adventure thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472239-Choose-Your-Own-Adventure-Exalted-Setting-Edition&p=20197304#post20197304). Exalted setting, no setting/rules knowledge needed. Because of Exalted's influence on Mythos classes, I figured some of you might be interested in participating.

Doing my Dresden Files one was hella fun. I considered starting it up again but I think the thread was auto-scrubbed due to age or something. I can't find it. Anyway... this'll be fun, too. Probably.

Lanth Sor
2015-12-16, 03:28 PM
Started paying a tinker character so I'll be doing some more random work on the tech system and when I get everything nailed down ill update the Efev̱réti̱s with mechanics based on the new system. For everyone interested in looking at where I'm at/keeping an eye on how they shape up. Click here (http://eraguya.wikia.com/wiki/Technology_System)

DracoDei
2015-12-16, 11:04 PM
Hey, I'm working on a Mythic Commoner class. It's pretty bare bones right now, but I'll take any criticism and advice offered.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472228-Mythic-Commoner&p=20196988#post20196988

Interesting concept, but I think calling it the Mythic Commoner is misleading.

When I saw "mythic commoner" I was thinking of something somewhat paradoxical with the concept of "mythic"... a character somehow able to weather any storm, but at the same time locked into never strongly influencing events and DEFINITELY never taking center stage except in very specific "lower deck episode"/"lets see the drama of one of the people just trying to avoid being incidentally stepped on by Godzilla"* sorts of circumstances.

*I think the movie "Cloverfield" might have worked this way? Maybe also the more recent "War of the Worlds" movie? Not sure...

Jakman217
2015-12-17, 03:01 AM
Hey, I'm working on a Mythic Commoner class. It's pretty bare bones right now, but I'll take any criticism and advice offered.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472228-Mythic-Commoner&p=20196988#post20196988

I'm with DracoDei here. A mythic commoner isn't quite the right name. It would be like making a mythos class based on The Fool from the Mythos Lore, a character who never got anywhere. I think it would be more accurate to call it a mythic rogue, though that name is already taken.

How about mythic everyman? I can't really think of a better name of it but its would be based more around luck and a humble air rather than how super awesome you they are. More in line with you idea I believe. Calling it the Common Mythos sounds about right though.

Lanth Sor
2015-12-17, 03:07 PM
Been working on my fantastic mythos for the agios as there seems to be too few options for things that have nothing to do with swinging a weapon. Bolded information is new or modified. Line through is deleted


Shining Shield Legionnaires
Prerequisite: -

Standing avast the bastion word of the demon horde came catapulting down the causeway as the forward scout returned. Young Sigmund's face turned grim. "Why so glum?", the mountain of a man beside him inquired. Sigmund looked to Zio, "We stand no chance against the demons we have to few men." Turning with warmth in his smile Zio declared "But you have me their is no need to worry." Sigmund looked to the massive dragon man, "You are but one man you cannot possibly hold against their entire army." Zio bellowed out a mighty laugh, "Who ever said I was alone?" his tone shifted as he pointed at the horizon. A great peel of a horn broke the silence of the country side as glare caught a shield. Then an entire wall of gleaming knights clad it silver plates. Banners waving above denoting allegiance to Zio. "I am never alone." he replied looking down upon young Sigmund


The agios gains Leadership with no limit on cohorts. However, they take a -2 to leadership score for determining cohort level. They may not have a effective leadership socre less than 2 If the agios's effective leadership score for determining level is 2 or less they may not gain any more cohorts.

Advanced
Defenders Boon: The agios grants each cohort access to either Ardent Shield Aegis or Adroit Blade Parry. The agios may not grant a mythos they do not know. The cohort does not actually know the mythos and must still take it to meet any requirements.
Guardsman's First Lesson: The agios grants each cohort access to the constant guardian and dutiful guardian feats. The feats are bonus feats that are only available for use they do not actually have these feats unless they purchased them with their own levels or through their own class features.
Teaching The Masses: The agios grants each cohort access to Golden Rule Reciprocation. The agios must have Golden Rule Reciprocation. The cohort does not know the mythos and must still take it to gain anything that requires the mythos.
"Peel of the Guardian": The agios gains the ability to call any number of followers and cohorts to him, regardless of distance. Calling them takes 1 minute and they appear out of line of sight of the agios, no closer than 1 mile away. Upon completion the determined cohorts and followers are teleported to the nearest location in a direction the agios specifies, in formation fully equipped. Specified cohorts and followers may deny the call, but the agios instantly knows if they do. This ability may only be used once per month initially. When the agios gains access to Legendary Mythos this becomes usable once per month. When the agios gains access to Exalted Mythos they may use it once per day.



Still working on it ill remove this line when done

Steadfast Fortification
Prerequisite: -

The agios can as a standard action create a Aura of Impairment 30ft. Enemies cannot magically enter the Aura of Impairment, and all attempts to do so end with the enemy landing in the nearest legal space between them and their target space.

JKTrickster
2015-12-20, 11:26 PM
Hey!

So does anyone watch One Punch Man here? Particularly looking to see if Xefas jumped on that bandwagon yet.

You know how a big thing with the Bellator class was difficulty adapting it to the higher tiers of powers?

Essentially, it was hard to imagine what an "Exalted" Bellator meant because the idea of "Conflict" was just harder to grasp. Things like Anger or the Elements or Perfection lend themselves easily to grand powerful abilities with flavor attached. For a while the Bellator didn't even have a Shintai ability. And even the one it has now, while very flavorful, is hardly a match for the other Shintai abilities that exist. Most importantly, the flavor of the Shintai mentions that it is tainted - not really a pure spirit of Iron, but one that is tainted with too much blood. That's great flavor but it falls short of a "pure" Shintai that encapsulates the meaning of being a "Bellator".

Trying to extend Conflict into the higher levels ran into problems - it either ran too close to Teramach (being overall violence and anger) or ran too mundane (being the Mythic Fighter ultimately limited it in some way). After all, what does it mean to be the narrative equivalent of all Conflict, everywhere? How does that lend to interesting abilities that can affect the world as a whole? Even the Random Mythos document honestly does not have a lot in terms of "unique" takes on this idea. There's only one working Exalted Mythos (based off of Unlimited Blade Works from Archer in the Fate series). There are some Legendary Mythos, but they are just Fighting Style Plus (improvements on previous fighting styles). None of this is really breaking new ground here or introducing ways where Conflict can change the landscape.

Solution: One Punch Man.

Now if you have not watched the anime, I won't spoil anything here. But the protagonist has the remarkable ability to defeat anything in a single punch. And he despises it - he hates how powerful he is.

In fact, he doesn't really want to save the world (he even comments how he has had negligible impact on the world as a whole, and has not changed anything for the better). More than anything, he wants someone to represent an actual challenge to him. He craves the type of fight where he can go all out and just barely win by the breadth of his hair (incidentally, he has none). He spent years training to be strongest, but now he regrets how strong he has gotten. Nothing challenges him anymore, and he feels as if his emotions are all draining away. Anger, happiness, terror, elation - he starting to lose access to those feelings.

In the first episode (minor spoilers), he has a dream sequence where 70% of the world population is destroyed by terrible invaders. That's a scary amount of people dead. You would have to wipe all of the populations of the top 25 countries to get that death toll.

It was the best possible dream for the our protagonist because it meant he finally had something worth fighting against. Sure he wasn't exactly happy that so many people died, but he was very happy to finally meet opponents that he could be challenged by. Because he was getting bored.


Wouldn't that be the best exemplification of Conflict? Not someone who ever wants to stop fighting. Not someone who wants to fight for something. But someone who just wants to fight....for the sake of feeling that rush. They don't even want to win easily - because if they do win too easily, it wasn't a real conflict at all. Therefore, I think it would be possible to use One Punch Man as a sort of inspiration for a Legendary Shintai ability for the Bellator.

Not something that is tainted by blood (the protagonist kills things, but he finds no inherent joy out of it, and shows mercy when needed). But a Shintai that forces someone to always look for the greatest challenge - always looking for the next fight. Always looking to perpetuate Conflict on a grand scale.

Maybe they attract enemies of a higher CR, as the Mythos of the Bellator itself demands tougher and tougher enemies to overcome. Or maybe it drains the Bellator of all emotions and personality outside of battle, so that the Bellator only really feels alive when they are fighting with every fiber of their soul. Something to that effect?

~~

What do you guys think? And apologies if I haven't explained One Punch Man thoroughly enough - it really is something you have to see for yourself.

spwack
2015-12-20, 11:39 PM
Ding ding ding! Have you discovered the Tiger-General Sovereign by 7th son of sons? It's on the compendium page, under Bellator additions. In particular, the final advanced manifestation of "Flowering Ubiquitous Body-of-Conflict Edification", an Immemorial Mythos, is "Insurmountable One-With-The-Eternal Eclipsement of Existence", and it might be what you are looking for. But read the whole thing. It is a nice piece Mythos. Someone should light the Xefas-signal, see what his opinion of it is, but I really like it.

Kymme
2015-12-20, 11:40 PM
What do you guys think?.

You're on to something. One thing I like about every Shintai is how crazy gamechanging they are, and this... this is gamechanging.

DracoDei
2015-12-20, 11:58 PM
Could be good?

Defiantnight
2015-12-21, 12:36 AM
So, um... what IS a shintai? I keep seeing them referenced and for people asking the creator to make one.

spwack
2015-12-21, 12:39 AM
So, um... what IS a shintai? I keep seeing them referenced and for people asking the creator to make one.

Game-changing Mythos. Usually have an extraordinary benefit, matched by an extraordinary downside, both linking to the core concepts the class conveys. My favorite is the Teramachs 'Untamed Apocalypse Shintai'. When you kill something, you gain Regeneration/- for 1 turn, rendering you immune to lethal damage, but the only actions you can take must be related to murder and destruction. It's that limitation that makes it a Shintai.

Defiantnight
2015-12-21, 01:38 AM
Game-changing Mythos. Usually have an extraordinary benefit, matched by an extraordinary downside, both linking to the core concepts the class conveys. My favorite is the Teramachs 'Untamed Apocalypse Shintai'. When you kill something, you gain Regeneration/- for 1 turn, rendering you immune to lethal damage, but the only actions you can take must be related to murder and destruction. It's that limitation that makes it a Shintai.

Ah, that makes more sense now. :smallgrin:
Thank you for the quick response!

I'm trying to get a DM for a (probably evil-aligned) Mythos game, and I've never played or seen played a Mythos class because they're so world-wrecking. Any tips, either on the proper way to chant for Summon DM or for using Mythos classes in general?

spwack
2015-12-21, 08:07 AM
Ah, that makes more sense now. :smallgrin:
Thank you for the quick response!

I'm trying to get a DM for a (probably evil-aligned) Mythos game, and I've never played or seen played a Mythos class because they're so world-wrecking. Any tips, either on the proper way to chant for Summon DM or for using Mythos classes in general?

Tell me when you find one. Also, have you tried O-negative blood sacrifices? Worth a shot.

Lanth Sor
2015-12-21, 10:06 AM
I can DM a game, I run off roll20. The fair warning is I'm almost 100% off the cuff so don't expect anything pre-planed. I will have a few major events that happen in the background if you don't purse them. But my general DM style is welcome to the world what are you doing. Generic explanation ask for clarification. Open Sat, Mon, Wed, Fri.

spwack
2015-12-21, 11:34 AM
GIB GIB GIB. How many slots do you have open? A friend and I tried to join a game as Mythic characters, but that seems to have flopped. We have a Teramach and a Jagannatha both at level 11, but any level is fine.

Defiantnight
2015-12-21, 01:09 PM
Sent you a PM about the game (Unless you're running after 4:30 PST on the weekdays I won't be able to join you for a session that isn't pbp. But nobody else has chimed in as DM on the [URL="http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472685-Mythos-Game-D-amp-D-3-5&p=20218199#post20218199), Lanth.

Sorry for hijacking the thread, we should probably move on :smallredface:

pieman2945
2015-12-21, 05:11 PM
-Snip-

If anyone's read the marvelous web serial Worm (https://parahumans.wordpress.com/), the whole One Punch Man idea gives me a thought

"You needed a worthy opponent." The idea is like the same thing as Eidolon's inadvertent creation of the Endbringers. He created massive, city-breaking kaiju to challenge his massive powers.

Lanth Sor
2015-12-22, 11:46 AM
Nor worms for me.

So one person brought up a couple of classes that seem to lend themselves to Mythos classes not made yet. One that was brought to my attention kinda fits with the Archikos but is basically Elsa from frozen as a 12 lvl class. But i could see equal value in making a separate "Ice Witch" class for it having equal merit. What do you guys think?

Vauron
2015-12-22, 03:49 PM
I can't say that 'Ice Witch" feels like it is capable of supporting a full mythos class. 'Witch' might, but 'I wanna play Elsa using the mythos system*' sounds like either a supplemental mythos like the races or templates. Can you even come up with 7 other characters that count as an 'Ice Witch'? Sure, there is whats-her-name from The Lion, The Witch, and the Wardrobe, but thats just two characters. I guess you could throw in the Unseelie Queens from the Dresden Files, but 'Ice Witch' still feels too narrow.

Maybe put together some mythos for the Kathados? The Kathados already can do ice manipulation, so the main thing that Elsa did that I don't think the Kathados could do yet would be dressmaking, weather manipulation, and building that castle.

*The desire to play Elsa in DND is pretty well served by the Frostwind Virago (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?197236-3-5-Monster-Class-Frostwind-Virago) monster class.

ThreadNecro5
2015-12-22, 05:34 PM
haven't been keeping up with the class but I can rate how these mythos look individually.


Been working on my fantastic mythos for the agios as there seems to be too few options for things that have nothing to do with swinging a weapon. Bolded information is new or modified. Line through is deleted


Shining Shield Legionnaires
Prerequisite: -

Standing avast the bastion word of the demon horde came catapulting down the causeway as the forward scout returned. Young Sigmund's face turned grim. "Why so glum?", the mountain of a man beside him inquired. Sigmund looked to Zio, "We stand no chance against the demons we have to few men." Turning with warmth in his smile Zio declared "But you have me their is no need to worry." Sigmund looked to the massive dragon man, "You are but one man you cannot possibly hold against their entire army." Zio bellowed out a mighty laugh, "Who ever said I was alone?" his tone shifted as he pointed at the horizon. A great peel of a horn broke the silence of the country side as glare caught a shield. Then an entire wall of gleaming knights clad it silver plates. Banners waving above denoting allegiance to Zio. "I am never alone." he replied looking down upon young Sigmund


The agios gains Leadership with no limit on cohorts. However, they take a -2 to leadership score for determining cohort level. They may not have a effective leadership socre less than 2 If the agios's effective leadership score for determining level is 2 or less they may not gain any more cohorts.

Advanced
Defenders Boon: The agios grants each cohort access to either Ardent Shield Aegis or Adroit Blade Parry. The agios may not grant a mythos they do not know. The cohort does not actually know the mythos and must still take it to meet any requirements.
Guardsman's First Lesson: The agios grants each cohort access to the constant guardian and dutiful guardian feats. The feats are bonus feats that are only available for use they do not actually have these feats unless they purchased them with their own levels or through their own class features.
Teaching The Masses: The agios grants each cohort access to Golden Rule Reciprocation. The agios must have Golden Rule Reciprocation. The cohort does not know the mythos and must still take it to gain anything that requires the mythos.
"Peel of the Guardian": The agios gains the ability to call any number of followers and cohorts to him, regardless of distance. Calling them takes 1 minute and they appear out of line of sight of the agios, no closer than 1 mile away. Upon completion the determined cohorts and followers are teleported to the nearest location in a direction the agios specifies, in formation fully equipped. Specified cohorts and followers may deny the call, but the agios instantly knows if they do. This ability may only be used once per month initially. When the agios gains access to Legendary Mythos this becomes usable once per month. When the agios gains access to Exalted Mythos they may use it once per day.


So its leadership with extra but weaker cohorts and potentially buffing them or gaining the ability to concentrate a lot of bodies in one area, seems fair for a mythos and the reduced cohort level means steps are taken to avoid assorted cohort abuse.

from the wording I can pick up this is a fantastic mythos and the 'peel of the guardian' needs access to legendary mythos?



Still working on it ill remove this line when done

Steadfast Fortification
Prerequisite: -

The agios can as a standard action create a Aura of Impairment 30ft. Enemies cannot magically enter the Aura of Impairment, and all attempts to do so end with the enemy landing in the nearest legal space between them and their target space.


Nice ability, opens up some interesting tactical options.


As a question for anyone reading this, I have a list of banner characters for the class I am slowly working on (based on money and overall greed) that I would like an opinion on the characters picked, as well as any better suggestions anyone has. Also I need another character to add so suggestions are appreciated:
Greed- Diablo
Greed- Full Metal Alchemist

Scrooge McDuck- ?

Larfleeze- DC Comics

Smaug- The Hobbit

Wario- Mario Franchise

Oryx - Destiny

Lanth Sor
2015-12-22, 07:27 PM
So its leadership with extra but weaker cohorts and potentially buffing them or gaining the ability to concentrate a lot of bodies in one area, seems fair for a mythos and the reduced cohort level means steps are taken to avoid assorted cohort abuse.

I was thinking of adding a sub line requiring them to have heavy armor prof and tower shield prof or something similar as its intended that they are an extension of the character's ideals and not just random people following him.


from the wording I can pick up this is a fantastic mythos and the 'peel of the guardian' needs access to legendary mythos?

No legendary is only require for it to be usable 1/week.


Nice ability, opens up some interesting tactical options.

It may be inspired by new poppy.


Vauron I see plenty of options and as for characters, Elsa, Iceman, Killerfrost, The Snow Queen(of the orignial Fabel), Gray Fullbuster(Fairy Tail anime), Jack Frost, Lissandra(LOL), Jadis the White Witch, Kuzan(One Piece).

DracoDei
2015-12-22, 11:12 PM
As a question for anyone reading this, I have a list of banner characters for the class I am slowly working on (based on money and overall greed) that I would like an opinion on the characters picked, as well as any better suggestions anyone has. Also I need another character to add so suggestions are appreciated:
Greed- Diablo
Greed- Full Metal Alchemist

Scrooge McDuck- ?

Larfleeze- DC Comics

Smaug- The Hobbit

Wario- Mario Franchise

Oryx - Destiny

Well, MAYBE Rarity of My Little Pony? Probably not though since while she does have that as one of her defining characteristics, she is usually more interested in social standing than material goods and she is a rich dichotomy due to her core virtue being Generosity (I've heard at least two theories about how the two interact for her I think).

Will discuss more if requested, but for now I just want to get the idea down before I forget it and then go back to relaxing for bed (I have sleep issues).

vasharanpaladin
2015-12-22, 11:47 PM
As a question for anyone reading this, I have a list of banner characters for the class I am slowly working on (based on money and overall greed) that I would like an opinion on the characters picked, as well as any better suggestions anyone has. Also I need another character to add so suggestions are appreciated:
Greed- Diablo
Greed- Full Metal Alchemist

Scrooge McDuck- ?

Larfleeze- DC Comics

Smaug- The Hobbit

Wario- Mario Franchise

Oryx - Destiny

Ultra/Super Greed from The Binding of Isaac, Lex Luthor (deputized with an Orange ring during the Blackest Night, should tell you something), any fricking Nopon from Xenoblade.

Honorable mention goes to one Komachi Onozuka of Touhou Project fame, who actually uses money in her danmaku patterns.

Allnightmask
2015-12-23, 01:19 AM
When you said greed and wealth the first guy that came to mind was Shirojiro Bertoni from Horizon in the Middle of Nowhere. He can use his wealth and command of prices to rent strength and abilities from others. It's pretty intriguing to me.

Adam1949
2015-12-23, 04:02 AM
If you've ever seen Kill La Kill, Takarada is a hilarious example: he's literally so rich he sends his goons out with money as ammunition.

khadgar567
2015-12-23, 05:07 AM
Scrooge McDuck- ?



If you don't know uncle scrooge term comes from the same son of a duck whose only work is how to become more richer than richest duck in freaking world( which is him by the way) by the way he is from Disney where the moana, lilo pelekai, ventus and a death star worth of characters comes from

vasharanpaladin
2015-12-23, 05:10 AM
If you don't know uncle scrooge term comes from the same son of a duck whose only work is how to become more richer than richest duck in freaking world( which is him by the way) by the way he is from Disney where the moana, lilo pelekai, ventus and a death star worth of characters comes from

I believe you mean A Christmas Carol, thank you very much. The use of "scrooge" to refer to a pernicious miser vastly predates Disney and his misbegotten brood. :smallannoyed:

roko10
2015-12-23, 06:45 AM
Gray Mann is also a good example. His robots run on money.

The Tygre
2015-12-24, 04:12 AM
If we're still suggesting wealthy characters, there's always Choji Suitengu from the anime Speed Grapher. He's the most exorbitantly wealthy anime villain that I know, though not as flashy about it as Takarada.

Defiantnight
2015-12-24, 09:56 PM
Don't mind me, popping in for another Mythos question.

What are the assumed starting age levels and starting wealth of Mythos classes (specifically the Epifovian)?

DracoDei
2015-12-25, 06:35 PM
Don't mind me, popping in for another Mythos question.

What are the assumed starting age levels and starting wealth of Mythos classes (specifically the Epifovian)?
Off the cuff, without looking at anything but the Epifovian (and that not for very long).

Age:
Two ideas here.

1.)
Given that they are based around having a piece of an eternal story welded to your soul (right?) put most of them on the "Youngest" column along with the Sorcerer, Barbarian, and Rogue. Here is a link to the table I am referring to on the very small chance you actually need it. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/description.htm#age)

2.)
Put them with the classes they most resemble where such exists. All others on the "Youngest" column unless their fluff implies otherwise.

Wealth:
I'd put them with the class that most resembles them as far as equipment that is iconic for them to have or that goes with their skills. Well, except for the wealth-based on which should be on a par with the Aristrocrat, if not higher... or down with the monk if you want to go for "from rags to riches"... maybe that should be an "at character creation only" excellency for them or something?

Teramach is probably down with Monk if I had to guess (needs neither armor nor weapon, not an easy part of society so the fluff of having few 'creature comforts' like a tent and bedroll fits).

Bellator would be with Fighter.

Epifovian goes with the rogue or maybe slightly lower. They have Open Lock on their skill list (and thus should have enough wealth to be able to afford a set off thieves tools if they decide to start off with points in that), and the same light armor+no shield thing as the rogue. The major difference is that the rogue gets proficiency in hand crossbow, rapier, sap, shortbow, and short sword, most of which are more expensive than simple weapons.

Temotei
2015-12-25, 07:04 PM
The Askopar starts with 5d4x10 gp at a sorcerer's age.

Bdrone
2016-01-01, 01:37 PM
I've been digging about in Mythos off an' on for sometime now. MY GOODNESS the wonderful stuff goin' on here. I just have to say well done who is and has worked on this, and continues to make it reality-tearingly awesome.

Each class around here blows me away in their own ways, but right now if i were to build one, its gotta be between a mounted Bellator with a healthy amount of Archery involved (wish there was a in mythos way to get some allies, but when your THAT awesome already there's limits), or an Epifovean just going nuts with a swarm of tentacle attacks and some extra help from some spine manipulated pets. The Kreikiri, Dinyomi, Askopar, and Jagannatha also stand out, even if they aren't really my style, just because of the sheer scale of what they could do or how they made me giggle with glee- i kept myself busy just trying to figure out how many bodies i would need as a Kreikiri, figuring out how to run a minion focused Dinyomi with its state mechanics, trying to leverage the Askopar's clean up the wall dash mobility design with how id play at combat normally, or balking at the awesomeness of a Jagannatha and their ability to raise an Abyssal force, though wishing they had a brass beast to ride, Juggernauts of Khorne style.

sadly, im most at home at a distance, so a lot of the combat in the Mythos doesn't at it's best for me from what i've seen. so, I guess a question to ask is- in your opinions, what are your ways to make either a brutal ranged combatant or a SUPERBLY fast and mobile one? the epifovean and Bellator are what i hit on, but what other ideas do you all see? maybe im missin' something... i just don't feel right in standard melee range.

Also, i can't wait to see whats to come. im actually quite interested in one day seeing the Epicurean (particularly) and the Epistemian should they make an appearance. I really wonder how they will play out...

Vauron
2016-01-01, 02:45 PM
Well, as the Kathados is technically making unarmed attacks, not ranged attacks, you can use Elemental-Fisted Pugilist Style and all other unarmed attack boosters with Land-Strike Wrath to trivially make full attacks at range. Granted, the range isn't that far at level one, but it grows as you level. Meditating on the Elements would let you go for a fire imbalance and let you add (INT) to damage, provide Power Attack, and make your blows count as two-handed weapons for power attack. If the fan-made mythos are available, then against undead you could make use of Detritus Devouring Conflagration to increase your fire damage by 50%.


On an unrelated note, how does Omnicapable Human Spirit Ignition work with mythos classes? Specifically, the ability to buy mythos. Lets say that a human Kathados has taken OHSI and picks Teramach. Using the Excellence in Monstrosity class feature, the Kathados purchases two copies of Inhuman Constitution Proliferation. Then, the Kathados changes the class that OHSI grants. Does the Kathados still have the +6 to con? Could OHSI basically be used as a floating set of the Broken [Patron] Amalgam line?

DracoDei
2016-01-01, 07:51 PM
Quick and dirty post, please tell me if I'm being socially inappropriate on any points...

Would the three homebrew ranged Disciplines that Age of Warriors came up with do the trick for a Bellator? I THINK this is the final version we ended up with... (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?143785-Refactoring-ToB-archery)

Also, what sort of Mythic Elementalist can't shoot fire a hundred feet from his finger-tips? I mean warlocks can pull that off from first level I think (well the 100' part, the "fire" part is going to take more levels).

Getting back to Bellators and perhaps maneuvers, it seemed like the two Bellator players I had in my game were saying the class really felt starved for mythos or manifestations or something... like you basically HAD to spend a bunch of XPs on additional things to make a viable build. I may have mentioned this before, but I'm mentioning it again in case I didn't. We were at level 4, and I had given everyone about 200 XPs above the amount required to hit that level. I can probably dig up the posts and/or Skype text chat logs in question if requested?

I think my Phileotheysia may end up sorta the same way, but they have a special trick where they don't actually lose XPs when revivified, they just get put in a separate pool that can only be used for extra Phileotheysia purchases. Which really helps at higher levels, although I'd really like any input that people can provide as guidelines to suggest to GMs starting a campaigns at the levels where it becomes plausible for the overall system that a character would have been Raised at least once. I suppose that the question of "How lethal is my setting anyway?" is a good one, but I think the bigger problem may be that GMs may just be turned off by the whole concept... plus for all I know a lack of enough mythos to get the job done won't be a problem by those levels, if it ever was.

VoodooPaladin
2016-01-02, 02:01 AM
The Bellator is kind of thematically built around giving up exorbitant amounts of time, money, and energy to become a really awesome fighter. Punching Death in the face isn't a cheap prospect for a dude who's technically only human.


what are your ways to make either a brutal ranged combatant or a SUPERBLY fast and mobile one?

For a Bellator, if you can find a nice ranged combat discipline and a mobility-focused discipline, you can slur their movesets together into the hit-and-run fighting style you want. In lieu of that, the Swooping Raptor (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19026000&postcount=3) school seems like the right idea, but it could use an editor. Since you said you like mounted archery, remember that with Heroic Panoply-Forging Puissance a Bellator can bang out simple items like Horseshoes of Speed in an afternoon, so you can get Mongolian all over your enemies with trivial effort.

DracoDei
2016-01-02, 02:37 PM
The Bellator is kind of thematically built around giving up exorbitant amounts of time, money, and energy to become a really awesome fighter. Punching Death in the face isn't a cheap prospect for a dude who's technically only human.
Okay. I was just passing along the raw data. Since you say it is a feature, rather than a bug, I will believe you.

VoodooPaladin
2016-01-02, 04:33 PM
Okay. I was just passing along the raw data. Since you say it is a feature, rather than a bug, I will believe you.

Well, that's not to say I wouldn't love to see Xefas put out more Bellator Mythos. And I don't actually know Xefas' design intent; I didn't ask him.

I don't like to shut down critique without throwing down some of my own so... the Olethrofex feels flimsy to me. It might just be that it's trying to cover a lot of potential design space, but it feels off. I can't really isolate why it feels that way, since every Mythos feels fine individually: full of contempt for life and living in all sorts of different ways. It's like the Olethrofex as a class isn't integrating right with itself in my head. It's not how I can't see how its pieces add together, it's just... got a really scattershot approach, in a way that the Teramach before it didn't have.

spwack
2016-01-02, 07:49 PM
Well, that's not to say I wouldn't love to see Xefas put out more Bellator Mythos. And I don't actually know Xefas' design intent; I didn't ask him.

I don't like to shut down critique without throwing down some of my own so... the Olethrofex feels flimsy to me. It might just be that it's trying to cover a lot of potential design space, but it feels off. I can't really isolate why it feels that way, since every Mythos feels fine individually: full of contempt for life and living in all sorts of different ways. It's like the Olethrofex as a class isn't integrating right with itself in my head. It's not how I can't see how its pieces add together, it's just... got a really scattershot approach, in a way that the Teramach before it didn't have.

Well, it says only 50% complete, so that can't help. Also, it is specifically designed to have three main streams, Death, Undeath and Oblivion. The Shintai is pretty much entirely dependent on the DM, which is a pain. After reading Xefas' description of how it's supposed to work, I actually like it a lot more, but I never got that sense from the actual mythos.

Just my 2c.

Slawth13
2016-01-02, 08:13 PM
So I showed up and briefly mentioned in the last thread about my work on a Mythic Psion, the Setgetzen (though as it's evolved it's really become more of the Mythic Telepath). I had fully intended to talk some more about it and comment on some other people's works then, but real life came around and started kicking my butt. But I am here again, and wanting some opinions on a particular struggle I'm having.

I'm basically taking the Collective class feature of a lot of DSP's stuff and stacking Mythos on top of it for various Mythos. For those unfamiliar with DSP's psionics, the Collective feature allows you to basically act like a psychic WiFi hub for a number of people determined by your Int modifier plus your class level.

The Setgetzen learns to use psionic power to connect willing minds through an internal network that strengthens their psychic bonds. As a standard action, a Setgetzen can join any number of willing targets into their collective (up to their limit, see below). The Setgetzen must have line of sight to each target, each target must have a Wisdom score of at least 1, and all targets must be within Medium range (100 ft. + 10 ft. per class level). The collective can contain up to their Intelligence modifier plus their Setgetzen level creatures. The Setgetzen is always considered a member of their own collective, and does not count against this limit.

The Setgetzen can choose to remove a member as a free action on their turn, and any member can voluntarily leave the collective as a free action on their turn. Any member whose Wisdom drops to zero or who moves out of range of the collective is automatically removed. If a member enters a null psionics field, the connection to the collective is suppressed until the member leaves the field. A member who leaves the collective for any reason immediately loses any and all benefits they may have gained from being a member. A Setgetzen is aware of the status of their collective and can, roughly, sense the presence of each member, although beyond telling if such a creature is still a member, this has no mechanical benefit until certain Mythos have been obtained.

A Setgetzen can manifest certain powers through their collective. If a Setgetzen power specifies one or more willing targets (or is harmless) and has a range greater than personal, he can manifest this power on a member of their collective regardless of the range of the actual power. All other non-range restrictions still apply. They may manifest any power with the Network Descriptor this way, regardless of their actual ranges or targets. If they are capable of manifesting powers or casting spells from a different class (as is the case for a multiclass Setgetzen), any compatible spell or power with a range greater than touch can also be used through the collective.
If a member of the collective dies, the member is removed from the collective and the Setgetzen must make a Fortitude save (DC 15) or lose 1 power point for every Hit Die of the fallen member or be sickened for an equal number of rounds.

At 7th level, a Setgetzen’s collective range is doubled, and the Setgetzen may have a number of creatures in it equal to 1.5 x their Setgetzen level plus their Int modifier.

At 13th level, a Setgetzen's collective range is limitless on the same plane as the Setgetzen, and the Setgetzen may have a number of creatures in it equal to 2 x their Setgetzen level plus their Int modifier.

At 19th level, a Setgetzen's range reaches even across other planes and dimensions, and the Setgetzen may have a number of creatures in it equal to 4 x their Setgetzen level plus their Int modifier.

A Setgetzen is telepathically linked to every member of their collective, and can communicate with them freely in this manner. They can also share sensations and thoughts between other members of the collective at will.


Now I did this because the original idea was for a Mythos class that focused primarily on supporting its allies using its psionic powers, but as the concept has evolved there's also been a lot of heavily offensive Mythos that I've come up with, and I'm fairly divided on them. Let me give some examples of what I mean.

Mind-Melding Intellect Dispersal
Prerequisites: --
When it first bloomed, the Celosia was already rooted in the minds of life throughout existence, drawing strength from them and giving it back in turn. All members of the Setgetzen’s collective gain a +1 bonus to all Intelligence-based skill checks. This bonus increases to +2 at level 4, +3 at level 8, +4 at level 12, +5 at level 16, and +10 at level 20.


Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike
Prerequisites: At least 7 power points
When those who dared to uproot the Celosia failed to do so, they were punished for their treachery. While you do not yet have to the ability to rupture the minds of those who oppose you, you may still revoke their assaults. Once per round, when attacked you make an opposing attacking roll. Should your attack hit, you deal an additional 1d4 psychic damage for every two levels of Setgetzen you have (minimum 1d4).

Basic manifestations
Disjointed Mind-Breaking Shockwave: Whenever you make a Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike, you may expend 2 power points to strike fear in your target’s heart, causing them to be shaken for a number of rounds equal to your Intelligence modifier.
Surging Telekinetic Overdrive: Whenever you make a Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike, you may expend a number of power points up to 6. For every two power points you use, your target is pushed back 5 feet.


Thought-as-Form Ablation
Prerequisites: At least 10 power points
The wall of thought which surrounded the Celosia after it fled was a powerful defense, one impervious to many modes of attack. Whenever you or a member of your Collective would take damage from a psionic source, you make expend a number of power points up to your Intelligence modifier x 2. You gain 1 PR for each point spent this way. This PR may be divided up amongst the members of your Collective however you please.

Advanced Manifestation
Body-Shielding Thought Shards: You may also activate Thought-as-Form Ablation when you would be dealt damage from a physical source. When activated this way, instead of gaining PR for each power point expended, you gain 1 DR for each two power points expended.


Psyche-Searing Retardation Aura
Prerequisites: Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike
After it fled, the Celosia constructed a barrier between it and those minds that would seek it harm. Whenever you would be the target of a melee attack, you may, as a reaction, activate this Mythos. The target of this Mythos must make a Will save. Should they make the save, nothing happens. Should they fail the save, roll 1d6 per member of your collective and add your Intelligence modifier. They take this much psychic damage; to the target of this Mythos, it feels as though their entire body is wreathed in flames. They must make an additional Will save to avoid being panicked.

Advanced Manifestations
Intellect-Devouring Rosewood Flames: Whenever you activate Psyche-Searing Aura of Retardation, you may choose to expend a quarter of your maximum power points. If you do so, instead of being panicked, the target must make a Fortitude save using their Wisdom in place of their Con. Should they fail, they take 1d4 Intelligence burn.
Mind-Piercing Pyre Thorns: Whenever you activate Psyche-Searing Aura of Retardation, you may choose to expend a quarter of your maximum power points. If you do so, instead of being panicked, the target must make a Fortitude save using their Wisdom in place of their Con. Should they fail, they take an extra d8 of fire damage equal to your Intelligence modifier.


And then the real kicker that has me unsure whether to go with the original idea of support or combat.

Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai
Prerequisites: Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike, Intellectual Briar-Thorn Imbuement
When the Celosia came under attack, it struck back and ripped the minds of those who had harmed it to shreds. Their gibbering psyches and wails of maddened anguish were like poison to the Mind Flower, and it retreated from them in its horror.

You have no such issue.

A number of times per day equal to your Intelligence modifier, as a standard action you make a ranged touch attack. The target must make a Will save. If they succeed, they only take half damage and ignore the other effects of Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai. Should they fail, they take Xd8+Y psychic damage, where X is equal to the number of creatures in your collective, and Y is the average Intelligence modifier of your collective. Additionally, the target of your attack becomes confused and sickened for a number of rounds equal to your Setgetzen level.

Advanced Manifestation
Psyche-Shredding Pistil Whip: Instead of confusing and sickening the target of your Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai, you may expend half of your maximum power points to double the damage it deals.


So, tl;dr. I'm making a psychic Mythis class, can't decide if I should go mostly support or mostly combat. A friend of mine suggested I do a branching thing like the Olethrofex, but I would like some opinions.

What is a story but an idea, a thought given room to run and leap and bound away from its own restraints? Even as the earliest Titans came to be, their very essence, the very idea of thought made flesh, was the seed of yet another idea. As the Titans multiplied and minds echoed raucously throughout existence, that seed grew, and eventually bloomed into the Celosia. Rooted in the thoughts and minds of all of creation, the Celosia flourished, and spread its branches across the collective unconscious of the universe, drinking deep of the ideas and emotions of all living things.

Some, however, felt as though the Celosia was an invader, a parasite which infected the minds of others, instead of the offspring of flourishing minds through the cosmos. And so they dared to cut at its tendrils, and in response the Celosia struck back, lighting their minds ablaze and tearing them asunder. The Celosia’s roots were still ingrained in the minds of these maddened creatures, and the Titan trembled, for such brokenness was unknown to it, and was as poison to it. The Celosia retreated then, hiding itself away, the bitter taste of scorching insanity still fresh on its tongue; a taste from which it would never escape, not truly.

Vauron
2016-01-02, 11:31 PM
Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike
Prerequisites: At least 7 power points
When those who dared to uproot the Celosia failed to do so, they were punished for their treachery. While you do not yet have to the ability to rupture the minds of those who oppose you, you may still revoke their assaults. Once per round, when attacked you make an opposing attacking roll. Should your attack hit, you deal an additional 1d4 psychic damage for every two levels of Setgetzen you have (minimum 1d4).


Basic manifestations
Disjointed Mind-Breaking Shockwave: Whenever you make a Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike, you may expend 2 power points to strike fear in your target’s heart, causing them to be shaken for a number of rounds equal to your Intelligence modifier.
Surging Telekinetic Overdrive: Whenever you make a Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike, you may expend a number of power points up to 6. For every two power points you use, your target is pushed back 5 feet.
When does the attack resolve? Does your damage happen first? From the sound of things it goes (Enemy Attack Roll)=>(PSVS induced Attack Roll)=>(PSVS Damage)=>(Enemy Attack Roll Damage)

Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai
Prerequisites: Psyche-Shattering Vengeance Strike, Intellectual Briar-Thorn Imbuement
When the Celosia came under attack, it struck back and ripped the minds of those who had harmed it to shreds. Their gibbering psyches and wails of maddened anguish were like poison to the Mind Flower, and it retreated from them in its horror.

You have no such issue.

A number of times per day equal to your Intelligence modifier, as a standard action you make a ranged touch attack. The target must make a Will save. If they succeed, they only take half damage and ignore the other effects of Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai. Should they fail, they take Xd8+Y psychic damage, where X is equal to the number of creatures in your collective, and Y is the average Intelligence modifier of your collective. Additionally, the target of your attack becomes confused and sickened for a number of rounds equal to your Setgetzen level.

Advanced Manifestation
Psyche-Shredding Pistil Whip: Instead of confusing and sickening the target of your Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai, you may expend half of your maximum power points to double the damage it deals.

How is this a shintai? Compare with the Teramach, Olethrofex, and Kathados Shintai. How does the change the way you play the character? I'm not saying what the mythos does is inappropriate at the moment, it just isn't a shintai.

Slawth13
2016-01-02, 11:46 PM
When does the attack resolve? Does your damage happen first? From the sound of things it goes (Enemy Attack Roll)=>(PSVS induced Attack Roll)=>(PSVS Damage)=>(Enemy Attack Roll Damage)


Ah, you're right, the wording is kind of ambiguous. It's supposed to resolve the enemy attack first, and then PSVS activates. I'll rewrite that portion.



How is this a shintai? Compare with the Teramach, Olethrofex, and Kathados Shintai. How does the change the way you play the character? I'm not saying what the mythos does is inappropriate at the moment, it just isn't a shintai.

See that's sort of where I'm torn. This was supposed to be what shifted the Setgetzen from a primarily support-focused class into a strong combatant, but I ended up making a bunch of other combat Mythos and now can't decide where to go with it, whether it should stay support-oriented or if I should do the branching Mythos thing, and make this a regular Mythos and then make a new Shintai.

DracoDei
2016-01-03, 01:00 PM
Well, that's not to say I wouldn't love to see Xefas put out more Bellator Mythos. And I don't actually know Xefas' design intent; I didn't ask him.
Well, design intent is a reasonable thing to wish to understand in this sort of discussion. It does occur to me to wonder if anyone has ever done much stacking up of "Zero XP Spent on extras" builds, against "10/20/30/40/50% of total XPs spent on extras" builds to compare their effectiveness on paper. Naturally, effectiveness in actual play would be superior, but with play-test data being so rare... incidentally here is a link to the OOC thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?327620-Ruceeglaelsktinag-quot-Justifiable-Genocide-quot-Contradiction-in-terms-(OOC)), in case I didn't give links before. From that thread links to the IC thread and (at least most of) the character sheets can be found within the first post or three.

We had a Bellator, a Teramach, a Kreikiri, and an abortive attempt at an Akastarepti.

Well, it says only 50% complete, so that can't help. Also, it is specifically designed to have three main streams, Death, Undeath and Oblivion. The Shintai is pretty much entirely dependent on the DM, which is a pain. After reading Xefas' description of how it's supposed to work, I actually like it a lot more, but I never got that sense from the actual mythos.

Just my 2c.
Off the top of my head(feeling too lazy to go look right this minute): How well does mixing and matching between the three streams work?

Vauron
2016-01-03, 01:05 PM
I was worried I was unclear. It seems I was right. My issue wasn't what the mythos did, but what it didn't do. I'll bring up some shintais and bold the parts that your shintai lacked an equivalent to.

Untamed Apocalypse Shintai
Prerequisite: -

You gain a permanent, amplified Rage that never expires or lessens. In addition to the behavioral restrictions of a normal Rage, you may not wield weapons or tools other than unarmed attacks or improvised weapons. You automatically fail checks made to build, repair, or create something physical (something incorporeal or ethereal is still impossible, but more ephemeral, conceptual things, like an idea, song, or plan are still fair game). Craft checks are always included. You may not voluntarily heal or alleviate the suffering of another living thing. You become sterile and/or infertile, and you perfectly negate all attempts to create life from you - even such magical effects as a "Simulacrum" spell, or a deity of fertility using your genetic material to create an immaculate child independently of you; these surrogate offspring rot away into dust before they can breathe their first breath. Finally, with the exception of the occasional single round of patching one's self up, or sleeping just long enough to maintain optimal functionality, or eating enough not to starve, if you are not actively engaged in harming sapient beings or defending yourself, you must be physically moving towards a place that you believe to be inhabited by sapient beings, with intent to harm them when you get there.

An exception exists in creatures that the Monster recognizes as part of itself, rather than an external being. You are not compelled by Untamed Apocalypse Shintai to harm creatures that possess a Mythos from the Teramach class, though you are certainly free to do so if you wish, nor are you compelled to harm Familiars, Animal Companions, or Special Mounts belonging to yourself or to creatures with a Teramach Mythos.

In exchange, you may now take a total number of Swift Actions per round equal to the number of Rage effects you currently suffer from (which may all be converted to Immediate Actions as normal). Furthermore, when you kill a living thing, you gain Regeneration X (X equal the number of Rage effects you currently suffer from) until the beginning of your next turn, which is not bypassed by any kind of damage.
Once you take UAS if you aren't killing people, you must be moving towards where you believe there are people to kill. Additionally, you can create nothing anymore besides pain and the lamentations of your victms.

Sojourner Of A Thousand Lives
Prerequisite: -
[Internal][Fire][Air][Water][Earth]

The Omphalos' relationship with time is not like a mortal's. It is not truly omniscient, though it might perhaps seem to cleave in that direction from a mortal perspective, perceiving most of its own existence from beginning to end as a single chain of memories, with all the inaccuracy, imperfection, and bias that a memory intails. But part of its future is dark; a great disastrous uncertainty. And it is for this purpose that, very occasionally, the Omphalos will turn its unspeaking, inscrutable will towards bending the very rules it was constructed to maintain, and withhold a dying soul from its afterlife.

These occurrences are rare; written off by the Outer Planar bureaucracy as a routine clerical error. Sometimes a soul destined to become a great Solar or Duke of Hell, or something of that kind, goes missing, and a god pops down to the Omphalos' inner machinery to check if anything has gotten stuck, but they are like toddlers staring into the workings of a great computer. Inevitably, they retreat back to their palatial estates and blame the whole affair on a rounding error.

However, in these vast mechanisms, the stolen soul is rejuvenated, relieved of its necessity to continue on to the afterlife and become one with the eternal ideological battlefield there. The custodians of the Omphalos inform the soul of its purpose and destiny, tutor it on matters that will one day become important and, eventually, send the soul backwards, back down to the Prime, where it inhabits a newborn body in place of a wholly new soul from the Positive Energy Plane. It remembers nothing. Yet. It grows into a new life, becomes a new person, makes new choices, and eventually dies again. And the process is repeated. Again and again, the soul is rejuvenated and recalled, over and over it lives, sometimes as a Kathodos, sometimes as a member of another class, other times as a simple sailor or dam-builder, once a human, once a dragon, once an orc, once a kobold, once a giant, and so on.

Eventually, the soul arrives here. It is a Kathodos, and it is ready to realize its purpose. Though great power awaits, such a choice is difficult and rarely taken once presented. To awaken as one of the Sojourners is tantamount to a death of the self, as that which the individual believes to be who they are - their various personality traits and quirks, likes, dislikes, beliefs, and ideals - is overtaken in a flood of a thousand lives just as rich and beautiful and painful and unique as their own. What's more, they suddenly remember all the trials and teachings given to them between lives, and so their scope of time stretches even further.

So varied and muddled becomes a Sojourner's personality that they effective lose their personality altogether. All traits are subsumed into the one purpose that they have been born, and born, and born ad infinitum to do; protect the Prime, protect the Inner Planes, protect the Omphalos. They have no personal desires (for every hundred lives they've had that have enjoyed doing something, perhaps they've had a hundred that disliked it), no true friends (one life of loyality is outweighed by a thousands lives that are indifferent) - they are only stoic guardians now, impartial stewards of balance.

You gain a +6 bonus to your Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma scores from the counsel of a thousand lives of experience. You gain a +30 competence bonus on checks with every skill, taught by a thousand lives of learning. You gain ten bonus feats of your choice, though you must meet the prerequisites for them. Finally, at (your initiative count - 10), you may act with a single standard, move, or swift action in addition to the actions you normally receive every round.
You stop being a character and become a meat robot defender of the world.

Angel of Death Shintai
Prerequisite: The Undead Type
[Death]

Through utmost denial of the more abominable origins of your power, you have forsaken the path of undeath and become a champion of the natural cycle. You retain all of the traits and features of the Undead type (and those granted by the Corpse-Life Apotheosis Mythos if you have it), with the following exceptions, but your actual type changes to Outsider (your native plane remains the same). The first exception is that you are now healed by both positive and negative energy, which overrides prior feats you may have, such as Tomb-Tainted Soul. Secondly, you are no longer destroyed at 0 hit points - you may be reduced to a negative hit point threshold before death, just like an Outsider. Thirdly, any immunity to mind-affecting effects that you possess through traits of your race or type, or via feats, do not function against Gods of Death (that do not also possess portfolios of Undeath), other deity-level entities aligned with Death, or the direct servants of such powers.

Furthermore, you may now see, at a glance, the remaining lifespan ordained by fate for any mortal creature with Intelligence 3 or more that you look upon that has hit dice equal to or less than (class level -4)*. This typically includes most Aberrations, Dragons, Giants, Humanoids, and Monstrous Humanoids. This time is not absolute; the actions of creatures that can alter fate, even a little, such as anyone with PC class levels, those important enough to be built with the Elite Array or better, or just particularly significant characters, can end a life prematurely. But, if all things go according to fate's plan, when a mortal's time strikes 0, something will kill them.

*For the remainder of this Mythos, the term "mortal" will refer to "mortal creature with Intelligence 3 or more".

As a servant of Death, you are barred from interceding with a mortal's natural allotment of time. Hostile actions taken with your Mythos (or by minions created by your Mythos) fail against mortals with more than a day's time left, your attacks cannot reduce them below 1 hit point, your ailments cannot push them over the threshold, and any power that you have to heal, evade, protect, or otherwise safeguard a creature fizzle in the face of Death's imminent hand if a mortal has less than a day to live.

Finally, by spending a full ten minutes in uninterrupted concentration, you may momentarily subvert time and space in one of the two following ways. In the first, you and up to (class level) willing creatures within 30ft, travel from the Prime Material Plane to an Outer Plane, or from an Outer Plane to the Prime Material Plane. If the Plane to which you are traveling hosts the domain of a deity, or other greater power, of Death, then you appear there. If it does not, then this ability functions with a margin of error as the Plane Shift spell.

In the second case, you may mentally aim for a city or other similarly sized geographical location on the same plane as yourself, either that you are familiar with or that you are capable of making a DC 30 Knowledge (Geography) check to direct yourself with (substitute Knowledge: The Plane outside of the Prime). If there is at least one mortal in that general location with less than a day to live by fate's measure, you disappear from your current location and appear somewhere near one such dying mortal (usually within 100ft or less), in the most ominous fashion possible; standing at the foot of a person's deathbed, or looking in their window as lightning flashes or the moon drifts out from behind a cloud are both very common. The mortal, whose imminent death allowed your passage, dies nearly instantly. The disease they struggle with takes them a little earlier than expected, they have a freak heart attack, a pot falls off a shelf and cracks their skull open, they fall down a flight of stairs, a nearby horse bolts from its handler and tramples them, etc, etc.

Can no longer kill those whose fated time to die isn't up. Note that generally mooks and such don't have the ability to go against fate, or anything with an INT of 2, 1, or - can be killed at whim.

DracoDei
2016-01-03, 02:44 PM
1.) Hmmm... as a discussion point, I wonder if my own Shintai is enough of a burden on the character to count by your standards?
Legendary Mythos
Unceasing Rapid-Rescue Shintai
Prerequisite: -
Every moment that you are idle is a moment when someone or something you care about is in jeopardy. Your soul refuses the necessity of travel, meaningless socialization, and the basic activities necessary to sustain life. You simply are wherever you are most needed.

Whenever you are not engaged in some activity that materially advances the protection of a cause or one or more persons that you value strongly you are simultaneously restored as if by a Heal spell and transported as per a Wish to wherever the GM decides that the most desperate need of your aid may be. Noting that any situation extreme enough you can not contribute to it materially obviously requires the aid of someone other than yourself. Thus, you might find yourself appearing near a wyrm gold dragon fighting his archnemisis, a Red Dragon who is a great wyrm, but not if the battle was happening below the surface of a lake of lava where you would almost certainly burn to death before you could even locate the combatants by sound and touch, let alone figure out what was going on.

Note also that this is not always a matter of violence. You might equally easily find yourself in the middle of a city wracked with plague, or just outside the council-chambers where the course of a nation is being debated (thus to probably talk your way in and join the debate).

You no longer require food, water, or sleep, and are immune to fatigue, exhaustion, and subdual damage that results from cold, heat, or continued exertion. You become amphibious, able to breathe water and air equally easily. The lower of your swim and land speeds increases to be equal to the higher of the two, including gaining an additional mode if you lack it. See the PHB and/or MM for the effects of having a swim speed.

If you do not have a fly speed you gain a fly speed of 30’ with Poor maneuverability.

You also gain the ability to speak a number of additional languages equal to your charisma score or your number of ranks in diplomacy, whichever is less.

You grown ever stronger, tested in the crucible of adversity. You no longer need to train to gain levels or purchase mythos, excellencies, and/or manifestations, even if that is the norm for the campaign.

Basic
Airless Rescue Flexibility
You no longer need to breath.

Household Welcomeness Stature Adjustment
Whenever you teleport via this Shintai your size (before all adjustments from other sources other than race and templates) is whatever it would otherwise be, one size larger, or one size smaller, whichever will make it most easy for you to navigate your new location. If multiple sizes are equally capable (such as in a wide open plain) you may select between them. This adjustment stacks with all other effects, including ones that state they don’t stack with anything.

Example: Thus a human with this manifestation would always arrive as small, medium, or large. If they also had Reduce Person as a permanent effect, they would instead arrive as Tiny, Small, or Medium.

Advanced
Resilient Regeneration Necessity
Whenever you are teleported by this Mythos, you also gain the benefits of a Regeneration spell, and always count as being on ground sacred to your deity for the purposes of your ability to recover from injuries, curses, etc.

Single-Minded Resolution of Purpose
You gain the effect of a Mind Blank spell, and add twice your level to all Sense Motive checks that would alter aims, or misdirect your overall actions towards those aims. Thus this bonus would not apply against feinting in combat, but would apply against an attempt for an infiltrator of a resistance movement you have joined for the moment to convince you that he is sincere in his support for the cause.

As long as there is <your cause, or opposite of your cause>...
Whenever you are slain, your body and all your equipment vanish within 1d3 rounds. 2d6 weeks later, you appear, returned to life as if by a Ressurection spell. The location is as per usual for the transportation effect of this mythos.

If you have at least one Exalted Mythos (regardless of if it is a Phileotheysia Mythos) then this effect instead duplicates True Resurrection.

2.) Who here has heard of "Nightmare Whisper, The Kindest of Lies" from the "Pony POV Series"? I'm thinking of replacing one of the images for the Phileotheysia with her, since I realized that she is one of the very few examples of ONGOING sacrifice that doesn't confine the character to an alternate dimension or similarly make them incapable of what would be "roleplay" if they were a player character.

While she is probably a better example than most of the images I currently have, she is also pretty obscure compared to them.


EDIT: I have MORE than enough Mythos and Excellencies to post the Phileotheysia. Ironically enough, the part I am most concerned about thus and haven't written up yet is the basic class abilities (the equivalents to the Teramach's 'Primitive Brutality'). Should I go ahead and post it, even without that?

Vauron
2016-01-03, 03:27 PM
Yeah, its burdensome enough to count to my mind. It sounds like your Shintai fits best in a bunch of small stories or one shots. A complete work consisting of such a Phileotheysia's tale would be more along the lines of 'The Collected Legends of the Savior", rather than something like 'The Epic of (NAME)' which you'd expect from an Anakitos. That said, the manifestations feel odd to me. Not wrong, necessarily, but odd.

Honestly, of the other shintai I've read and can remember, only the Angel of Death Shintai was something I'd consider taking. Sojourner flat out turns you from a 'they' to an 'it', while Untamed is essentially a Frenzied Berzerker whose Frenzy never ends. AoDS lets you still be a character, unlike Sojourner. Can't recall any of the fanmade shintai, so I wont comment there.

Rogthnor
2016-01-03, 03:31 PM
Anyone mind taking a look at my Mythic Bard? I'm having trouble deciding which mythos to put at which level, and it is badly in need of a beta.

Bdrone
2016-01-03, 03:50 PM
Bit of a Summary post here... sorry if this style doesn't fit. kind of random order.

To DracoDei and Voodoopaladin: Ranged disciplines and the Bellator. I mostly play pathfinder, so i look at mythos with that in mind, and the non-supernatural limitation blocked out the bulk of path of war and the Touhou tome of battle, what my first ports of call are. that said, if i could scrounge up enough mythos buys, im debating a Sunder two hander build (for the charge and cleaving abilities when needed) linked up with archery and extra excellency to make melee range disciplines count as ranged usable to a certain degree. either that with something like Broken Blade or working on something like Tempest gale. a melee school is better with that excellency because in theory you should be able to apply the strikes with One Kick Ten Thousand Times. Still looking for a good means of a mount, which with the expanded mythoses could make a brutally fast runner or horseback rider.

also to DracoDei: im VERY interested in your Phileotheysia class, just based on that Shintai. you say one of their character reps is Nightmare Whisper? ive not seen that myself, but ive wandered the realms of MLP before. I really would like to read what you have, even if you don't quite yet know what your basic class ability is at. im no judge for the power of a Shintai, but depending on the GM that could easily be a problem. however it could easily ALSO be that the quest your on is where you are needed most, so... *shrugs* i don't know. a cool concept, that's for sure. but its somewhere along the lines of the Kathodos Shintai to me- powerful as crap as a Shintai should, but potentially less restrictive then others.

to Slawth13: a Psychic Mythos class? im quite interested to see where this goes, though im loving the use of a collective right off the bat. that mythos doesn't feel like a Shintai though- id recommend making a separate path if you intend on it, but something else would probably suffice as a better shintai- you have to have a drawback to go with it. and honestly, i wouldn't eat a drawback for a per day ability like that caliber in this system- thats just me. i hate per day uses. i loe Mythos because it feels far more usable on all cylinders.

to Vauron: i WAS taking a good look at the Kathodos using that set of Mythos because of the consistent damage, maybe going TWF with the party as well. that said, a range increment enhancer was something id want to add to that one. that said, you also brought up the Omnicapable Human Spirit Ignition. im not sure how far that rabbit hole goes... but i blame you for a good bit of lost time the last few days- i had forgotten about amalgam line of feats. so i had to go back to the drawing board on potential concepts- namely a Kathodos or Askopar with Bellator mythoses.... more mythoses, more influences, more mix and match. yum.

random thought- was there ever a mythos class where sonic effects or songs where involved beyond the similar abilities of the Jagganatha or the Dinyomi? I've been in the mood for a Sound manipulation character, like a certain trio of Sirens, and i wonder what the Mythos system would actually do? (EDIT): speak of it, and it arrives. lemme see if i can give it a look.

DracoDei
2016-01-03, 05:12 PM
Here, have a LINK (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1g0DKLLjN3s-ahge2wP86rCm2JcttXUrlsPxP8IY03Cs/edit?usp=sharing) to what I have for the Phileotheysia so far. It is a Google Doc, and I have it set up so anyone can put comments on it, so do that or comment here as you think appropriate. I don't think I have any fluff written up there... except for in the mythos themselves, including the names.

If you want more fluff, see THIS (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?247637-Semi-hiatus-to-avoid-wearing-new-reviewers-out-but-ANYONE-can-post-here-if-you-want) thread, which is the class I am re-writing into the Phileotheysia.

Vauron
2016-01-03, 10:17 PM
Bdrone, have you looked at the Mythic Illumian (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=331253)? I think it fits with the idea of using sounds to achieve your ends. It may not be exactly what you desire, but it should be interesting to look into.

VoodooPaladin
2016-01-04, 03:33 AM
the Touhou tome of battle

Are you referring to the Touhou Battle Grimoire, or some Pathfinder-cogent material that I'm not aware of?

As for your thing about a sound-based Mythos things; in that movie, music was a direct metaphor for personal expression. So it's a Katametritis. They create artistic endeavors for the express purpose of the manipulation of people, places, and things. You can find its description here (http://imgur.com/a/EPekI). Sadly it has yet to be written in full.

DracoDei
2016-01-04, 07:47 AM
Are you referring to the Touhou Battle Grimoire, or some Pathfinder-cogent material that I'm not aware of?

As for your thing about a sound-based Mythos things; in that movie, music was a direct metaphor for personal expression. So it's a Katametritis. They create artistic endeavors for the express purpose of the manipulation of people, places, and things. You can find its description here (http://imgur.com/a/EPekI). Sadly it has yet to be written in full.

Your link goes to a PICTURE of a sort of index of a bunch of mythos classes (Just the opening images and a paragraph or three of flavor text). Is that what you intended?

Although if you scroll down far enough then the Katametritis IS in there.

As long as I'm here, a few links rather than teasing, regarding who Nightmare Whisper(the one by Alex Warlorn... apparently there is at least one other by that name) is:

The slow way where you actually get to experience the amazing story. Start with this story (http://www.fimfiction.net/story/32519/pony-pov-series-season-zero-discorded-ponies), then keep right on going through its sequels until you get to her. Nightmare Whisper is in Season Two... you can PROBABLY skip Season Zero if you have to since it is just covering what was going through the Mane Six's head during the periods when they were Discorded.).

The super-quick spoilery version:
In this continuity, a Nightmare is when someone becomes the absolute embodiment of one thing, to the exclusion of all other things, especially virtues. Nightmare Whisper is Fluttershy when she becomes the Nightmare of Kindness. She finds an external power source to boot, called the Elder Horn, loosely based on The Elder Wand from Harry Potter (but that happens entirely off-screen I think).

She starts transforming Equestria into a paradise where everyone is foals who play all day and there is no competition for resources, even between the roots of plants. There is enough to go around for everyone. The series later goes on to show us how VERY VERY close she came to making this a good thing. According to later episodes of the story, if she had simply asked permission from The Sisters and gotten their advice, rather than just going ahead blindly, it probably would have all worked out at least enough to make it a huge improvement even over the default Equestria from the show. We get a tiny glimpse after Nightmare Whisper is defeated of MULTIPLE alternate timelines where this actually works out to truly turn Equestria into something... something amazing *tear of joy and sorrow at what was/almost was*. Even in the story we actually get to read, she alters her actual plans mid-execution at least once. It has been a while since I read it, but I am fairly sure this is true. For instance, at one time she was using lotus-eater type dreams but I don't quite remember if that was an overall plan for Kindness, or if she just was using it as a defensive technique.

In order to do this, she had to take on the the suffering for every flaw in people, definitely moral and probably physical as well. The author, Alex Warlorn has the characters use the phrase "the child foal of Omelas" to describe the situation after it is revealed (it is even the title of one of the chapters), but this one was a volunteer.

Here is what she looks like:
http://fav.me/d4i7kyy

There is a very well written fight between her and the Mane Five and in the end the day is saved by... well, let's just say that sometimes "karma" is a wonderful, WONDERFUL thing. Just as with Luna/Nightmare Moon before her, everything works out pretty well in the end (the paradise is gone, but Fluttershy survives, and a lot of good comes of it across Equestria).

Bdrone
2016-01-04, 10:32 AM
Vauron: re-reading the Mythic Illumin, its a wonderful place to start. truespeech as a requirement can be... manipulated in it's own right, so perhaps i can put that to good use indeed... its manipulation has some definite uses I can think of- im loving Black Speech and even the Bull rush mythos right off the bat. Bardic music uses aside, this could be quite the riot... but ill be waiting for more like this in the future for certain.

VoodooPaladin: *cough* right, yes, the Touhou Battle Grimoire. as a fan of both Touhou and Martial initiation, a god number of those disciplines got my interest. I also like skills being involved in combat at times as well, which helped.

looking at the list of Mythos classes, this is a much longer list of ideas then i recall... and so many potentials. so this mythic artist is in the same space as the Epicurean and Epistemian right now. i see. we may be thinking of different Sirens (curse you Rainbow Rocks) but it could work... argh. now i want to see that as well. Annnnd id have to show a friend the Agapon when it arrives- Schrodinger is on the banner with Harley Quinn. jeeze... do i have to say anything about the possibilities of the Amyitos and the Michanikos? this is why i love this subsystem- so much can be done...

Dracodei: ....about Nightmare Whisper. sweet holy buggery. i suspected it would be something like that, but THAT? yeah. yeah. that would count in spades for your banner. unless you can think of something better, I would put her up there. no doubt in my mind.

Slawth13
2016-01-04, 11:14 AM
So taking the suggestions I was given, Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai is now just a regular Legendary Mythos and is no longer restricted by a times-per-day caveat. As far as things better suited to actual Shintai, does anybody have any suggestions? I've got the idea of a Phoenix-esque ability to take Int burn in exchange for a serious increase in power but I'm not quite sure how to implement it.

Zale
2016-01-06, 07:29 AM
Anyone mind taking a look at my Mythic Bard? I'm having trouble deciding which mythos to put at which level, and it is badly in need of a beta.

I'd love to see a mythic bard. Has it been posted somewhere yet?

Vauron
2016-01-06, 08:43 AM
So taking the suggestions I was given, Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai is now just a regular Legendary Mythos and is no longer restricted by a times-per-day caveat. As far as things better suited to actual Shintai, does anybody have any suggestions? I've got the idea of a Phoenix-esque ability to take Int burn in exchange for a serious increase in power but I'm not quite sure how to implement it.

I don't have a suggestion for what a shintai for your class could be, but I would suggest approaching from the fluffy side first. Ask yourself what kind of transformative idea fits with the class, then come up with powers to go with it. Essentially, focus on the "I don't kill people whose time isn't up' bit first, then try for the "Can see how long you have to live and planeshift/teleport" bit.

Zale
2016-01-07, 02:28 AM
So taking the suggestions I was given, Mind-Tarnishing Rose-Thorn Shintai is now just a regular Legendary Mythos and is no longer restricted by a times-per-day caveat. As far as things better suited to actual Shintai, does anybody have any suggestions? I've got the idea of a Phoenix-esque ability to take Int burn in exchange for a serious increase in power but I'm not quite sure how to implement it.

Maybe the character loses their physical form and now only exists within the minds connected to them?

nikkoli
2016-01-07, 11:12 AM
So I'm running a campaign (3.p/3.5) and I would like a little bit of input on "critters." Namely making BBEGs from mythos characters.
He's one of my players that's why.
So for this campaign all the characters were abducted by a huge diety power level dude names Tursue, and he called himself Prophecy. He is more or less a dead god and can't leave his demi plane and has about 0 followers in the prime world. Anyway, he also said that he is the father of all of the death gods and that the group of them (Zyphus, Urgatoya, Pharasma, Charon, and Orcus) are in the relitivly near future going to throw the world out of balance. Tursue wants the party to go and kill all the death gods so the world will be jolly and not cease to exist as the scourge ravages all of the planes.
Onto the killing dieties: if you want to say "you can't kill dieties and it's stupid to stat them" please don't. Otherwise would it be reasonable to make these dieties as oletherofex's and then give them divine powers based off of their divine rank? Also is there any support for epic oletherofex?
Also the setting is of my creation, so killing gods requires you to weaken their following and then do a super Planar binding on them to draw them into the prime to be slain, and each god has their own ritual.

Thanks for the help, hopefully the spoiler works

Defiantnight
2016-01-07, 03:19 PM
Maybe the character loses their physical form and now only exists within the minds connected to them?

The Epifovian has a shintai sort of similar to that, except it turns you into Bloody Mary. :smallsmile:
You could look at that for ideas?

VoodooPaladin
2016-01-08, 12:00 AM
*cough* right, yes, the Touhou Battle Grimoire. as a fan of both Touhou and Martial initiation, a god number of those disciplines got my interest. I also like skills being involved in combat at times as well, which helped.

Ooh, if your group's cool with Battle Grimoire material, then your Bellator must be ecstatic. You mentioned THF with a bow for backup, so I have to ask if you've looked into using Thousand-Armed Weaponmaster Intuition to get yourself one of the Moon Agent's Yumi bows, or an Oni Brawler's Weighted Chain. They are, after all, just really nice exotic weapons.

I wonder if a Bellator's Open-Minded Smithing Practices would let them make Youkai-Forged Blades? Probably not wield them, since that's the purview of the NetherWorld Gardener feat, but that would be really cool in its own right.


As far as things better suited to actual Shintai, does anybody have any suggestions?

How about a Shintai that centers around abandoning the ability to perceive reality or formulate opinions outside of the thoughts and perceptions of others?

7th son of sons
2016-01-08, 11:14 AM
If you were playing a Dinyomi, but wanted to be a Hero, what kind of mythos would you want that would make you sort of like a Necessary Evil Good Guy, or a Bad Guy with a Good Cause?

Bdrone
2016-01-08, 02:55 PM
Ooh, if your group's cool with Battle Grimoire material, then your Bellator must be ecstatic. You mentioned THF with a bow for backup, so I have to ask if you've looked into using Thousand-Armed Weaponmaster Intuition to get yourself one of the Moon Agent's Yumi bows, or an Oni Brawler's Weighted Chain. They are, after all, just really nice exotic weapons.

I wonder if a Bellator's Open-Minded Smithing Practices would let them make Youkai-Forged Blades? Probably not wield them, since that's the purview of the NetherWorld Gardener feat, but that would be really cool in its own right.

Really im a Ranged Primary person, and I don't really have a group, just a box i put ideas into to hopefully use someday. i quite prefer Crossbows, but Arching Comet Style is just... amazing. any build that provides me 2+ range feats on entry has my attention alone, nevermind the rest that one mythos does otherwise. if i was big on bows it would be a drooling point all it's own. i brought up THF though because the bulk of the Bellator is a master of all weaponry (rightfully so- they are a shoe in innately for PoW 2.0 Mithral Current, and they can pass on enhancement bonuses between weapons by just BORROWING a magic weapon for a bit) and the THF style can have sunders for more mythos along with the full benefits of more mythos like Tavern-Clearing Cleave, Battalion-Engaging Charge (though id take focusing the iron storm- obvious reasons), and One Kick Ten Thousand Times (this move here? makes me salivate and I'm usually the one furthest back).

However with the expanded Mythos and excellency file alone (my goodness what you can do with Broken feat line and Race Mythos...), you can use melee manuvers with ranged weapons in addition to more ranged usable mythoses and mounted combat ones. other then finding a way to get a mount that is to my liking and fine picking what disciplines I want in that case, this field is amazingly open. especially if One Kick Ten Thousand Times can be synced up with my bow in that way. got a Dex based idea that scares me.

As for the Touhou Battle Grimoire and the Bellator involing it... while i sure didn't think of yoinking their weapon designs (the Yumi in theory would gain the strength mod... hmm), that does make for a good idea. it's just ever since the moon agent and the introduction of Pure Crafting (honestly, that was one of the few times in my life i really felt like using the term overpowered. i could use insight to the Moon Agent and Pure Crafting in general for someone else's opinion on that one), the classes have been interesting, but even im not sure about them in the games i could get. the Mythical Maid (Currently WIP) has my eye right now, but what I'm most intrigued by are the disciplines and the races (Kasha and Inchling in particular- YES, ive considered an inchling ranged martial user on a bird mount). you may indeed be able to craft Youkai Forged Blades with that mythos, but you couldnt use them.

sadly digging in the TBG for the Bellator Seed mythos series comes up slim, because so many of the abilities in a discipline are spelled out to be either directly supernatural (Dream Battle), or whole maneuver lists start by stating the list is supernatural unless otherwise stated (most of the rest). the only disciplines that aren't stated to be supernatural directly that i can recall are oddly enough Mysterious Millennium (which i never really went through before. color me intrigued if i can get Dangerous Drug to work.) and the WIP Lunar Dial, which is stated to be Ex. even ancient temple is SU. a good deal of Path of War has SU elements as well, leaving out among ranged the now improved Solar Wind, but bringing in Tempest Gale as a trick based option (providing line attacks, ranged combat manuvers, and such). for power play, discipline weaponing in Broken Blade from PoW with the ranged to melee expanded excellency is one of my better bets for raw power.

Whatever the case, i feel like ive cracked on something that utterly suits my style when im not feeling natural attack crazy (for that we have Epifovian, which i still enjoy and wish i could cross more effectively). just got a few more things to set. it's given me a crash course in all things animal companion and mounted as well!


If you were playing a Dinyomi, but wanted to be a Hero, what kind of mythos would you want that would make you sort of like a Necessary Evil Good Guy, or a Bad Guy with a Good Cause?

huh. Good question, this. I wasn't sure if i could play a Dinyomi because of the glorious/humbled state of things, but when I was thinking on it it felt like to be a good aligned one you had to be a kind of grim commander. I saw myself using the mounted mythos combined with a good deal of the lacky mythos series to go for a Leader of the people design. your thinkin' of Mythos's to allow for a Knight Templar or even Noble Demon?

When I first read it, I thought maybe something diplomacy or intimidate based that perhaps gets people to see your side of things through how certain you truely are (but then, that may have already been done). alternatively, maybe a progression from Altruistic Burden-Bearing Ego Suppression in where in where over time you gain benefits from striking down those who you truely are against, but suffer less and less alignment wise from acts that you wouldn't do or possibly regret until eventually you gain some sort of additional bonus that effects most targets and your alignment can be treated as one you choose, even though you've done so many deeds that would ruin that for you, because the ends justified the means to get you where you did. after all- you know whats best. ehh. its a thought I figured may work. Wish I had something more to add.

roko10
2016-01-08, 04:58 PM
Alright, have a free excellency that spits in the face of what the Bellator is supposed to represent, just because I really really like ToBhou.


Supernal Martial Adaption
Prerequisite: [Discipline] Seed Awakening in a discipline with Supernatural maneuvers.

Select one disciple that you have selected [Discipline] Seed Awakening with, and contains supernatural maneuvers and stances. You may learn and use supernatural maneuvers and stances from that discipline, although they are still considered Supernatural. This overrides the "[Discipline] Seed Awakening never allows you to learn or activate Supernatural maneuvers or stances" clause in [Discipline] Seed Awakening.

At level 11, your supernatural maneuvers and stances are considered extraordinary (Ex), allowing them to be used even in an Anti-Magic Field. This Excellency may be learned multiple times, once for each [Discipline] Seed Awakening in a discipline with Supernatural maneuvers that you possess.


EDIT: Also, I started to work again on the Mythic Determinator (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?456529-quot-Fall-down-seven-times-Stand-up-eight-quot-Mythos). Please PEACH.

VoodooPaladin
2016-01-08, 08:38 PM
i could use insight to the Moon Agent and Pure Crafting in general for someone else's opinion on that one

Wow, that's quite a lot of text.
The feel I got from Pure Crafting was that it was thoroughly half-baked. Not a very good rules patch, not a very good setting patch, not a very good boost for pure fighters, and still easy to abuse to boot.
Misteryous Millenium not being Su is probably a typo, as none of the clearly magical stuff is marked as such. I could've sworn all the stuff (up until Lunar Dial) was Su, which is why I've joked for years about how headbutts are actually magic.
Bellator who like throwing weapons are completely spoiled for choice. While most of the discipline feats require a stance, Sleep Under The Flowers, Red-White Butterfly only requires a Border of Life maneuver. For two feats and warfan, you'll never need a returning weapon, though you're limited to Point Blank range. Lunar Dial needs no further explanation.
Though it's absurdly feat-intensive, I wonder how much raw power you could get out of NetherWorld Gardener + Till When? + Steel Avalanche Style (Ambidextrous Razor Wrath).



If you were playing a Dinyomi, but wanted to be a Hero, what kind of mythos would you want that would make you sort of like a Necessary Evil Good Guy, or a Bad Guy with a Good Cause?

Whichever ones you want to. Dinyomi refuse no path to power. :smallwink:

But in all seriousness:


http://s21.postimg.org/it8u7kx1j/Mao_Banner_Single.png


This guy. Mao, from Disgaea 3, is an example of a heroic Dinyomi. He plays up the Evil Nemesis angle, and then carries forward with the part where a Dinyomi is perfectly able to have and keep a small circle of trusted compatriots. Nothing about a Dinyomi requires you to be an Evil person: merely a violent and egotistical jackass.

Since I don't see this as adequately represented, here's something to help with that.


Unbound By Common Sense
Prerequisite: -

Who knows what thoughts pass through the fractious mind of the Conqueror? If there is cruelty in his heart, why does he recruit from among his enemies? If he is merciful, how can he slay his foes with such joyous abandon? Perhaps he is simply too great to be understood. Or perhaps he is too insane for it to matter.

Upon receiving this Excellence, your Alignment ceases to be a meaningful factor in your identity. Whenever an effect or prerequisite would check for your alignment, you are whichever combination of Good, Evil, Lawful, Chaotic, and Neutral you consider most beneficial. Impossible combinations such being both Good and Evil at once are possible, and expected. If you possess an alignment subtype, it is now indeterminate in the same way.

At any point, if you should choose to replace your written alignment with a more accurate representation of your nature, such as a scratch mark, an ink blot, a null symbol, "-", "Not Applicable", or any other pithy dismissal of morality and ethics, you gain Open Minded (CA) as a bonus feat. This can only occur once, as your non-alignment cannot be changed by any effect once adopted.

ImperatorV
2016-01-09, 11:35 AM
If you were playing a Dinyomi, but wanted to be a Hero, what kind of mythos would you want that would make you sort of like a Necessary Evil Good Guy, or a Bad Guy with a Good Cause?

The big thing standing in the way of a good Dinyomi for me is the glorios/humbled mechanic. It's hard to get a really truely good-aligned character when your pride requires you to kill/one-up everyone who insults you or sees you in a moment of weakness. Perhaps add a mythos allowing you to graciously forgive people for not respecting you (after making a show of force to let them know what you could have done).

VoodooPaladin
2016-01-09, 11:48 AM
The big thing standing in the way of a good Dinyomi for me is the glorios/humbled mechanic. It's hard to get a really truely good-aligned character when your pride requires you to kill/one-up everyone who insults you or sees you in a moment of weakness. Perhaps add a mythos allowing you to graciously forgive people for not respecting you (after making a show of force to let them know what you could have done).

Yeah, I just looked that up. A lot of text, kind of hard to parse quickly. To be honest, I'm not sure how you could have a Conqueror who actually spends most of his time conquering if he can't ignore a personal challenge without wasting time killing the challenger. His Ego should probably not be quite the straightjacket it's currently written to be.

If I had to rule an answer on the spot, I'd probably say that beating the tar out of someone non-lethally is an effective way to return to Glory, provided they admit defeat in some capacity. And that even righteous Dinyomi have this problem a lot, so they don't get to have amazingly active social lives.

Zenna
2016-01-09, 07:08 PM
New here but I've been playing dnd 3.5 for since I was a teen. I really like the idea of mythos classes and how they work thinking of trying my hand at one. A sort of mythic dragonslayer (focusing on monsters is too broad). Anyone mind, suggestions etc

Jakman217
2016-01-09, 09:08 PM
New here but I've been playing dnd 3.5 for since I was a teen. I really like the idea of mythos classes and how they work thinking of trying my hand at one. A sort of mythic dragonslayer (focusing on monsters is too broad). Anyone mind, suggestions etc

If your talking about using one my suggestion is the Bellator as it's the most flexible in martial combat. If your talking about making one then I suggest something along the lines of a mythic hunter on mythic nemesis. Hunter for a more general version, nemesis for a more specific version.

Also, for the other people here who want to move their stuff onto the wiki I now have a format guide on the wiki here http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Class_Formatting_Template.

ZaneShadow
2016-01-09, 11:13 PM
I've been working on a Mythic Commoner class, with the idea being that someone ordinary has a catalyst that turns them into a hero. Any advice or suggestions would be welcome.

Jakman217
2016-01-10, 02:30 AM
I've been working on a Mythic Commoner class, with the idea being that someone ordinary has a catalyst that turns them into a hero. Any advice or suggestions would be welcome.

I suggest looking at characters you think fit in the class and get inspiration from there.

As for more specific things, how about a mythos that allows an automatic type of ability check. Say so many times per day or week you may do an ordinarily impossible feat, such as lifting a giant monster, or shattering a cliff side with a punch to cause an avalanche that only you will survive.

How about a mythos (probably a shintai) that specifically makes you the bane of a their enemy. No matter what the character does, they will get a generally happy ending.

Maybe a mythos where they can get sparks of inspiration to overcome a challenge almost flawlessly.

Those are just two ideas I can think of for it.

roko10
2016-01-10, 04:42 AM
Or a Shintai that automatically resurrects you when you die, but forbids you from living a normal life. The Call Knows Where You Live.

Zenna
2016-01-10, 02:19 PM
> Jakman217
Hunter is TOO General, and nemesis isn't fitting at all of my class vision. Natsu, Alexstrasza, Nowi, St george, Dovahkiin is what I want to base my idea around

Vauron
2016-01-10, 02:56 PM
I'm curious, how do you intend to distinguish your 'dragonslayer' from the Bellator? While I don't reconize all the names you mentioned, Bellator would work well for most of them. My gut says either a mythic supplement or a couple Favored Enemy-ish mythos for the Bellator. Perhaps that is just a failure of imagination on my part.

7th son of sons
2016-01-10, 03:38 PM
I'm curious: Why Nowi? I know Wyrmslayer is one of her skills, but her personality and role in the story never really make her out to be a dragonslayer like the others you listed.

Bluydee
2016-01-10, 04:49 PM
> Jakman217
Hunter is TOO General, and nemesis isn't fitting at all of my class vision. Natsu, Alexstrasza, Nowi, St george, Dovahkiin is what I want to base my idea around

4/5 of the people you listed are either dragons or people with the powers of dragons. Not a good track record for slaying them, is it? :smallwink:

Jakman217
2016-01-10, 06:14 PM
> Jakman217
Hunter is TOO General, and nemesis isn't fitting at all of my class vision. Natsu, Alexstrasza, Nowi, St george, Dovahkiin is what I want to base my idea around

By nemesis I meant more along the lines of the living bane of the being you hunt. A dragonslayer who reaches Mythos levels should be the bane of all dragons and should be both hated and feared by them. Even a Godslayer, a sidestep away from the original concept would do the same with gods and could kill them. Hence becoming a nemesis to an entire race of beings.

As for the examples you give, I am wont to agree that you should just make a specialized bellator since St. George, the Dovahkiin, already fit into the bellator idea. Natsu (from fairy tail I presume) would probably be more apt in the Kathados as he's more an elementalist than a fighter from what I know. Nowi, yeah, not sure where to put her as I've never played fire emblem, but what little I gleamed from the wiki doesn't really make her sound like a dragon slayer, and Alexstrasza (presumably from WoW) may be unique enough of a concept to not be put in a preexisting class but from the little I read she seems more like a dragon tamer than slayer.

vasharanpaladin
2016-01-10, 07:12 PM
I've been working on a Mythic Commoner class, with the idea being that someone ordinary has a catalyst that turns them into a hero. Any advice or suggestions would be welcome.

Kyon (or depending on the theories you subscribe to, Haruhi) might be someone to look at. This lends more toward an archetype that wants to blend into the background, but their narrative prevents it (Kyon), or someone who's just sick of being another face in the crowd and actively tries to gatecrash into someone else's story (Haruhi). The Call Knows Where You Live versus Jumped At The Call.

Zenna
2016-01-10, 07:17 PM
Well that's exactly it, when you look at dragons. The things slaying them are either Heros (These are the more bellator like guys) and Dragons, Pokemon Dragon type is effective against dragons, Nowi (yes her wyrmslayer skill is why i added her, you dont need to be grim to be a slayer) is effective against dragons, Natsu uses fire dragon magic, Dovahkiin has the soul of a dragon.
A bane idea would be cool sure. But its too general, and then I cant distinguish it from bellator which ideally I'd do through a heavy focus on the dragon aspect, taking on dragon elements. Finding, hunting dragons and slaying them for power.

Jakman217
2016-01-10, 07:30 PM
Well that's exactly it, when you look at dragons. The things slaying them are either Heros (These are the more bellator like guys) and Dragons, Pokemon Dragon type is effective against dragons, Nowi (yes her wyrmslayer skill is why i added her, you dont need to be grim to be a slayer) is effective against dragons, Natsu uses fire dragon magic, Dovahkiin has the soul of a dragon.
A bane idea would be cool sure. But its too general, and then I cant distinguish it from bellator which ideally I'd do through a heavy focus on the dragon aspect, taking on dragon elements. Finding, hunting dragons and slaying them for power.

You could make it such that the Mythic Nemesis must focus on a specific type of creature or being and as they either kill their target or simply as they level up they gain abilities that negate or reflect the strengths of their targets and exploit their weaknesses.

A Nemesis who focuses on dragons eventually gains the ability to ignore the defenses of dragons, reflect or ignore their breath weapons, fly after them so they can't run, and upon defeating them can add a scale or bone to his armor as a trophy that improves himself. But never becomes a dragon himself.

A Nemesis who kills gods could automatically ignore bonuses granted from divine ranks, remove the target's immortality, and withstand the god's power on their home plane. By drinking their blood he gains the ability to ignore an even stronger god's powers. But he never becomes a god.

A nemesis who kills mind flayers can't have his mind read, or eaten by them, ignores their grappling, and can negate any magical or martial abilities they have, and in turn devour their minds for knowledge and power. But, never becomes a mind flayer.

I mostly give the extra examples as turning the Nemesis into mythos class could work, but focusing on dragons exclusively does kind of limit the class and beg why it isn't part of another. While stealing or gaining power from his opponents is an interesting idea, the class should never turn them into what they hunt.

This is just my thoughts though and if you don't follow the idea of the nemesis I may do it after I finish my Mythic Leader Class I'm currently working on.

Edit: And, as I think about it a Kreikiri may also have similar ideas, but is more about devouring all rather than a specific creature.

Zenna
2016-01-10, 08:03 PM
the class should never turn them into what they hunt.
Maybe for nemesis, but the world needs more dragons and that's where my idea is

EDIT: I want to get the idea across that a dragon slayer, is actually very little different then a dragon. In a lot of myths or fantasy works, those that are taking down dragons either use their enemies weapons against them. I know theres room for classic heros too, and to that end I plan to include them and work with a tag system, a Hero & Dragon tag wherein grabbing more hero mythos helps you to defeat dragons, while grabbing dragon mythos grants you their power. Sort of leave the option open for more knight based characters.
imgur.com/fZ1A9Yd.png with only 5 posts i cant link yet.
Went with a silver dragon because they're sworn to destroy evil dragons and can shape shift and went with Kamui rather then Nowi because I think I could pull more inspiration

Zale
2016-01-11, 02:59 AM
With that banner, Mythic Dragonslayer wouldn't be my first choice of theme.

Mythic dragon warrior, maybe. A mythic dragon disciple, possibly- but Dragonslayer would be tertiary.

But it that's what you're going for, by all means, I only worry that a focuses slayer class might run into situations where 90% of their class features don't work because they aren't fighting dragons.

Zenna
2016-01-11, 02:03 PM
Mythic dragon warrior, maybe. A mythic dragon disciple, possibly- but Dragonslayer would be tertiary.




I'm hesitant to make a mythos prestige class, and warrior could work, except for the classical knight theme which I wanted to include, simply so that this isn't just Mythos Dragon

the mythos not working on non dragons is something I've considered luckily being really good at piercing a dragons skin makes you good at stabbing in general so it's probably fine

Jakman217
2016-01-11, 02:41 PM
I'm hesitant to make a mythos prestige class, and warrior could work, except for the classical knight theme which I wanted to include, simply so that this isn't just Mythos Dragon

the mythos not working on non dragons is something I've considered luckily being really good at piercing a dragons skin makes you good at stabbing in general so it's probably fine

To be fair you don't need to make a prestige class for it to be a mythic dragon disciple. If you think a grand narrative concept can come from a dragon disciple, then it can be made into a mythos class. The only real hindrance would be getting enough material to constitute a full class from level 1-20. Just for ease of connection as to what would make it There's the rough guideline for making a mythos class mechanically http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=17828883&postcount=1276. Then here's the overarching guideline for the mythos class's fluff from Xefas (it's the last spoiler) http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?323694-Mythos-Inspired-Homebrew-Discussion.

And as a note just so I don't sound like I'm trying to scare you, you can and should use inspiration from characters and other people here.

Zenna
2016-01-11, 04:14 PM
I'll get my ideas posted soon so I can get more targeted feedback
I've already thought of how I want the basics to go and the name whatever it is isn't as important to me as the mechanics

at this point through I'll keep slayer in the name, I don't want to focus solely on dragon attributes & I want to be a. it varied, dragon warrior is cool but Beowulf and St George are not really that

Lanth Sor
2016-01-12, 02:45 AM
So I have started work on Mythic Enhanced Being (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?474743-quot-Some-times-to-be-stronger-you-have-to-get-up-Humanity-quot-Mythos-3-5-PF). I started with Claymore, and will be bringing Witchers, and Warcraft/diablo Demon Hunters to the table. Each one will have a different Source feat providing the start down a specific path. They all start with special rituals and what not leading to becoming the race/template, then you pick your specific path referring to the feats. I'm not intimately familiar with Claymore abilities so its been a little bit of a struggle, but I've done my best. Currently I have a player that is playing the race and they where the idea began. I could use plenty of advice for what the 2 Exceptional, 2 Fantastic, and 1 Legendary for them should be. Once claymore are complete I'll follow up with Witchers, then Demon Hunters.

Jakman217
2016-01-12, 05:40 AM
What do you mean by Enhanced Being?

vasharanpaladin
2016-01-12, 07:32 AM
What do you mean by Enhanced Being?

From the look of the thing, augmented humanoids. The eponymous Claymore warriors (of the manga, mind), Warhammer 40k's Space Marines, and presumably there'll be others.

Lanth Sor
2016-01-12, 11:49 AM
Correct vash, I hadn't even thought about Space Marines, and i talk about 40k all the time.
In regards to the mythic slayer pathfinder has a slayer class. It's a ranger rogue mix getting sneak attack and favored enemy.


Ok so I think I have the Enhanced Being Abberation (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?474743-quot-Some-times-to-be-stronger-you-have-to-give-up-Humanity-quot-Mythos-3-5-PF) done Please review I'm Looking for balancing Help.[Peach]

DracoDei
2016-01-18, 12:05 PM
Sudden inspiration regarding the mythic wealth accumulator: What about a mechanic that allows the standard "spend 1 XP, gain 5 GP worth of savings on an item" crafting mechanic to where you can dedicate a separate hoard of wealth and gain 1/5th the GP value in XPs? It is completely insane at first glance, but I think it might be something that could be refined to work within the Mythos system... I mean that as an Exalted Mythos? Probably underpowered actually... so it should fit somewhere, right?

Lanth Sor
2016-01-18, 12:24 PM
That sounds horrible and hilarious. But as much as I like the idea, I feel the safer bet would be to have a benefit based on amount of gold in your hoard. If your going to do XP i advise 25g=1xp as in crafting, that is the equivalence provided.

Jakman217
2016-01-18, 03:18 PM
For the Mythic Wealth Accumulator, how about a non-standard BAB? Their BAB is based off of their wealth. Or, they can bling out their gear with random gems and stuff, effectively loosing no 'wealth' in terms of useless shiny things, but it acts as though they were enchanted for them alone? Being dressed in expensive clothes counts as a charisma buff, having expensive glasses makes you look smarter therefore you are. A bit silly, but a bit in line with MONEYH IS POWAH motif in my mind.

The craziest yet, they store XP in Gold? They gain no XP and instead gain gold. Their total value*Some modifier is equivalent to the XP of their character. So any penny spent is lost XP.

DracoDei
2016-01-22, 10:34 AM
I continue the long, slow process of working on the Phileotheysia. A few more concerns:
1.) Most of their early-level basic cl ass abilities aren't as strongly sacrificial as their mythos and excellencies, except in the meta-textual/meta-game sense that they are related to heal-botting, and very few people want to play the heal-bot. Later on of course they get their revivification abilities, which cost them ability burn (although they can just use a clerical scroll of the revivification spell to avoid that if they prefer). Is this going to confuse people too much?
2.) If I'm almost, but not quite satisfied with a given mythos or excellency, should I include it, or keep it separate until I can polish it some more? What about in-line editing questions for my readers? Would (()) work or should I use spoilers?
3.) Do I need to get someone to write me a Titan-story, force myself to do it even though that whole aspect of things never appealed to me, or just leave that out? I've mentioned this issue in a vague sort of way before, but I don't think I've been this clear with how I said it.

Lanth Sor
2016-01-22, 11:37 AM
I continue the long, slow process of working on the Phileotheysia. A few more concerns:
1.) Most of their early-level basic cl ass abilities aren't as strongly sacrificial as their mythos and excellencies, except in the meta-textual/meta-game sense that they are related to heal-botting, and very few people want to play the heal-bot. Later on of course they get their revivification abilities, which cost them ability burn (although they can just use a clerical scroll of the revivification spell to avoid that if they prefer). Is this going to confuse people too much?

While this can be fine its important to make any special abilities fun or thematic like counter balance cure at will with taking non lethal or something. And watch for mechanics not interrupting combat too much. While the agios shield is thematic it can be very disruptive if gm/party isn't prepared for it initiating on nearly every physical attack. I would advise making the counting as a exellency or something stating they count as a Cleric equal to class level with the healing domain for purposes magic item activation.


2.) If I'm almost, but not quite satisfied with a given mythos or excellency, should I include it, or keep it separate until I can polish it some more? What about in-line editing questions for my readers? Would (()) work or should I use spoilers?

Without seeing it I couldn't advise on completeness of abilities I prefer to see the full process and unfinished ideas as it helps get a full view of the classes direction, but that seems to rather unpopular thought on giants.


3.) Do I need to get someone to write me a Titan-story, force myself to do it even though that whole aspect of things never appealed to me, or just leave that out? I've mentioned this issue in a vague sort of way before, but I don't think I've been this clear with how I said it.

Draco if you not interested in the titan stuff and looking for someone to write it I'd be happy to assist. Just let me know the "Fantasy" of the class and I'll do my best. Check out the agios and archikos for samples of my work.

DracoDei
2016-01-22, 02:33 PM
While this can be fine its important to make any special abilities fun or thematic like counter balance cure at will with taking non lethal or something.
It seems to me like you are contradicting yourself here. Is it okay to have "necessary but boring, and non-sacrificial" stuff or not? I assume it is okay since you later suggest allowing a blanket ability to use clerical items (which I'm not going to do exactly because: CoDzilla).

And watch for mechanics not interrupting combat too much.
The only time the abilities in question are likely to come up in combat come down to "I can use this clerical item to heal you" (and in-combat healing is still usually a bad idea), or "I can take 10 or 20 on some heal checks".

While the agios shield is thematic it can be very disruptive if gm/party isn't prepared for it initiating on nearly every physical attack. I would advise making the counting as a exellency or something stating they count as a Cleric equal to class level with the healing domain for purposes magic item activation.
Actually, something like that is a basic class feature from level one.

Without seeing it I couldn't advise on completeness of abilities I prefer to see the full process and unfinished ideas as it helps get a full view of the classes direction, but that seems to rather unpopular thought on giants.
Have a link then. (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1g0DKLLjN3s-ahge2wP86rCm2JcttXUrlsPxP8IY03Cs/edit)


Draco if you not interested in the titan stuff and looking for someone to write it I'd be happy to assist. Just let me know the "Fantasy" of the class and I'll do my best. Check out the agios and archikos for samples of my work.
Please do! The document is set up so that anyone can add comments, despite the fact that only I can actually edit the text itself.

EDIT: Or you can comment here of course.

Zenna
2016-01-24, 12:36 AM
Hey guys, I figured I'd post what i have right now, lemme know your thoughts.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?476165-The-Mythic-Dragonslayer&p=20337961

ThreadNecro5
2016-01-25, 03:47 PM
For the Mythic Wealth Accumulator, how about a non-standard BAB? Their BAB is based off of their wealth. Or, they can bling out their gear with random gems and stuff, effectively loosing no 'wealth' in terms of useless shiny things, but it acts as though they were enchanted for them alone? Being dressed in expensive clothes counts as a charisma buff, having expensive glasses makes you look smarter therefore you are. A bit silly, but a bit in line with MONEYH IS POWAH motif in my mind.

The craziest yet, they store XP in Gold? They gain no XP and instead gain gold. Their total value*Some modifier is equivalent to the XP of their character. So any penny spent is lost XP.

If you are talking about the class I am Woking on what you are suggesting here is similar to ideas I had but could never balance, but the ideas here are amazing, especially the 'no XP but gold' one. So now I'm thinking giving the class all bad saves, only two skill points/LV, and wizard BAB, but they use gold for XP and 'invest' into bonuses for them.

well, I'm of to 'brew. :smallcool:

Jakman217
2016-01-25, 05:11 PM
If you are talking about the class I am Woking [snip]

I'm actually not quite sure. I saw DracoDei post on it, and responded with my own idea. If he was saying his idea in regards to yours, then yes. If you want to use my ideas then go ahead, I'd love to help where I can.

Also, as a general reminder to those with mythos classes I still have the wiki up and there is a template you can use to add your own class to if you so wish. Though, I do suggest posting here also so comments can be seen by people here also. I've been bogged down with personal business so adding 7th son of sons stuff has been slow. I'd also like to add Xefas' stuff, but without permission I'd rather not accidentally step on toes.

Edit: Since the original post I've finished Elf, and added Ghost and Melanier in their entirety. Only 3 more from 7th son of sons left then I'm out of material to add with permission.

DracoDei
2016-01-26, 07:54 PM
I'm actually not quite sure. I saw DracoDei post on it, and responded with my own idea. If he was saying his idea in regards to yours, then yes. If you want to use my ideas then go ahead, I'd love to help where I can.
I'm not very good at remembering who posts what. I probably had no idea who the author of what I was responding to was when I wrote that.

Happy to have been of inspiration to whoever can use the idea, regardless of who I was TECHNICALLY responding to. That idea of mine is free to use for all.

Yasahiro
2016-01-27, 02:48 AM
Greetings.

Some might remember me, some might not. But I am coming here with update on Mythic Grammarist.

Proper term would now be Mythic Programmer. Viewing laws and so on set by Lawgivers and Omphalos like code, editing variables and such. Great Wheel is technically like both Virtual Reality and regular Reality at the same time to them. Class will focus on [GLITCH] tagged Mythos, inspired by Missingno(creature and the class) which will spawn a Mythic Glitch race eventually, but also other tag of Mythos for proper editing, debugging, programming. It will, of course, still use ideas of grammarism. This class is meant to remain deliciously complex and yet understandable.

Possible people for Banner include Kayaba Akihiko(Sword Art), Sans(Undertale), some more people I had written down but forgot due to typing this on phone while list is on PC. Open to suggestions though.


I will also like to announce arrival of a new, original, race. And of course, their Mythos. But the race itself will work with non Mythos games too, of course.

The people of the banner may provide hints. Archer(EMIYA) from Fate Stay Night, Genos from One Punch Man, Orpheus from Persona 3.

Central theme of which parts the Mythos will build off and focus on?
Forge

These are not warforged. This is something else...

Jakman217
2016-01-27, 02:49 AM
Ok, so with a sudden, short burst of frantic work I've added All of 7th son of sons stuff to the wiki now. I also have Temotei's Askopar, and Rogthnor's WIP Rhapsados.

All of the work done so far can be found HERE. (http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Mythos_Compendium_Wikia) I'll be working on adding Lanth Sor and Xefas stuff soon (I completely missed the thumbs up from Lanth about 2 or 3 pages back and feel silly now).

I'm also working on my Mythic Leader idea called the Megaligeti. I'll be adding that in soon enough and looking for input. It's got quite a bit of stuff, but will probably need some rebalancing.

silphael
2016-01-27, 06:20 PM
I was thinking about working on a Mythic Ascendant, as in chinese styled Immortal without making it elemental based. I don't know when I'll have to advance that project, but it's slowly making it's way in my mind... not sure it will be good, however, when comparing it with my other homebrews ><

Jakman217
2016-01-27, 10:11 PM
Ok, so during my break of copy/pasting other peoples mythos classes I've finally gotten my own up on the wiki here (http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Megaligeti).

I also have a discussion thread on it here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?476601-quot-A-king-without-an-army-is-just-a-man-in-a-funny-hat-quot&p=20354873#post20354873) so that this isn't just a thread jacking and I can keep most of the comments easy to find.

Other than this, any help and comments would be appreciated on the thread, and I'll continue my work with ctrl+C and ctrl+V.

DracoDei
2016-01-28, 11:12 AM
I was thinking about working on a Mythic Ascendant, as in chinese styled Immortal without making it elemental based. I don't know when I'll have to advance that project, but it's slowly making it's way in my mind... not sure it will be good, however, when comparing it with my other homebrews ><
What can it hurt to try?

Ok, so during my break of copy/pasting other peoples mythos classes I've finally gotten my own up on the wiki here (http://mythos-compendium.wikia.com/wiki/Megaligeti).

I also have a discussion thread on it here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?476601-quot-A-king-without-an-army-is-just-a-man-in-a-funny-hat-quot&p=20354873#post20354873) so that this isn't just a thread jacking and I can keep most of the comments easy to find.

Other than this, any help and comments would be appreciated on the thread, and I'll continue my work with ctrl+C and ctrl+V.
Thank you very much for your hard work!

ThreadNecro5
2016-01-29, 06:21 PM
I have some details for my Class that are semi-finalised for the first draft, posing below for opinions and to make sure I don't completely mess something up.

Lore:

Money is a curious thing, for all it is is simple metal. Yet this is a simple metal that by it’s mere existence controls the fates of nations, over which the darkest of deeds and hardest of choices made, and to which all concerns become secondary once its scent hits the air.

This is a simple fact of life and like all other originated with the Titans and the Lawgivers, in this instance, the Gilded Wyrm. The Wyrm was a greedy being, indeed it invented the concept merely so it could own it, and in the war it acted in a mercantile role, it traded and sold between those who were buying. In the end it stood atop a pile of wealth which would form avalanches when visited by smaller beings, and with with stood a Lawgiver negotiator. One with a bargain that could only exist in abstract.

Whatever the trade was over bartering took a turn for the worse when the Lawgiver sweetened the deal with folly, an then with that deal made offered imprisonment for freedom, the Wyrm saw that it had plenty of freedom, yet no imprisonment taking the offer and so was bound.
That is how the all-consuming desire for wealth came to become part of existence and marked it ever after.


Class Feature (originally a mythos, was tweaked as I recall):

Hordemaster
The pockets, bags, sacks, and other assorted containers carried by the Chrimatia all link to a personal endless realm (referred to as your vault) that may only be accessed only by you. Any valuables the Chrimatia possess (valuables here defined as an item that is traditionally thought of as of significant worth such as jewelry, fine ornaments, bars of gold, Magic Items, or even just money itself) can be placed within the vault as a free action. Any item within the vault may be converted into 50% of its value in GP as a free action.

You may access the items held within the vault as a free action, even should your hands be tied or you have no pockets available you may access this realm. When you die all the contents of the vault are found on your corpse, no matter how little sense it would make.

Additionally you may open a portal in order to transport you inside your vault by spending a minute in concentration.

By default a vault is a dark 15x15x15 room containing only a poor quality chandelier for light. In the center of the room is a 3ft tall pillar of cracked marble, on whose top is an empty sack of rough-spun wool that, when opened when empty, emits a small cloud of dust and a live bat or moth flies out (this disappears between visits). Should you possess any valuables within your vault, they are found in this room held within appropriate devices for display (e.g jewlery could be in a box or just on a table, works of art could be hung on the wall or in sufficient amount could form a separate area to function as a gallery).

Money within the vault fills the sack until it is overflowing, at which time the sack and pillar is replaced by a chest of some nature that, when full, is replaced by a pile of gold coins proportionate to the amount of coins within the vault. As the value of all items within the vault rises, the size and opulence of the vault also does so in proportion, generally appearing as a dwelling of a sort that the Chrimatia would inhabit given the amount of money they have available.

To leave your vault you must spend a full round action, which transports you to the same location form which you entered (or the closest space should it be occupied. When you leave your vault any items inside that are not valuables are destroyed.


The 'gain GP instead of XP and invest if for stat buffs' class feature is still in development. Also what do people think about a Shinai that turns the character into a dragon literally made of your fortune (I am thinking have it replace your HP with a value equal to the amount of gold you have, so your gold is then your HP as well as your EXP).

Banner Characters: (thank you to all who offered suggestions)
Greed- Diablo Three

Greed- Full Metal Alchemist

Ultra Greed- Binding of Isaac

Scrooge McDuck- Disney

Larfleeze- DC Comics

Smaug- The Hobbit

Takarada - Kill La Kill

Greasusus Goldtooth- Warhammer Fantasy


Some Assorted Exceptional Mythos:
The Toss of a Coin
Prerequisites: -
You may make a ranged touch attack to throw a handful of money as a standard action. You choose any single dice to roll (a D100 is treated as one dice in this case), the creature takes an amount of damage equal to the result of the dice roll and you lose an equal amount of GP.
If you cannot pay the full amount equal to the dice roll, you instead take the same amount of damage that cannot be healed in any way until you pay an amount of GP equal to the amount you could not pay by +50%.

Mine
Prerequisites: -
As a standard action you can target a single item that is within 30ft that you can see, and which is light enough for you to carry within one hand. The target item is immediately transported to your hand. Should the item be on the person of a creature they gain a will save to resist loosing the item.

Instead of a single item you may instead take a number of coins equal to that you can hold in one handful. You must still be able to see the coins you wish to take.

Basic manifestations:
Take it all
When using this Mythos you may take any item which you can carry instead of having the limitation of carrying it in a single hand. Additionally instead to transporting it to your hand you may instead place it within your Vault.

Window Shopping
As a swift action you may call to yourself an exhaustive list of all items a single creature or container within 30ft possesses that are a valid size for this Mythos. This list is based on the personal belief of the target creature or the creature who placed the item within the container, so if the creature is under some disillusion as to the nature of an item, or an item is cursed and the creature is unaware you would receive incorrect information when using this Manifestation.

Five Finger Discount
When using this Mythos and successively take an item, all creatures apart form you must take a Spot check with the same DC as a Saving through brought about via a Mythos. On a failure the creature does not notice the item going missing and will not notice you carrying it for a minute afterword.

Gaze of greed
Prerequisites: -
You may spend a minute polishing a gold piece in order to copy the effect of a Scrying spell (the gold piece is used as the focus for the effect). For every 50GP you spend when using the effect, the target takes a -1 penalty on the will save.

Additionally as a move action, you may place a coin within your eye, embedding it inside. While a coin is so embedded you gain low light vision. Should you already possess low light vision you instead gain 60ft of darkvision, should you possess both your darkvision is extended by an additional 60ft.


Also I am beginning to work on another Mythos class at the same time to make a 'Mythic Nothing'. Just pointing this out in case anyone wonders why I am also posting about a completely different class in the coming days.

Jakman217
2016-01-29, 06:57 PM
Do love the idea, this looks like a fun class to play. My only thing does it have to be a dragon? I'm not against the it, but being required to be a dragon feels ... limiting.

vasharanpaladin
2016-01-29, 09:35 PM
Do love the idea, this looks like a fun class to play. My only thing does it have to be a dragon? I'm not against the it, but being required to be a dragon feels ... limiting.

Dragons are traditionally associated with avarice in fantasy. Also, y'know, he just said the Shintai would do that... your anthol is not required to take the Shintai in order to advance.

Bdrone
2016-01-30, 02:00 AM
ThreadNecro5: with the exception of the Dragon stuff (can't say im EVER a fan of that stuff), i love the idea of this class that's the essence of greed. a core class ability that lets you store and convert things to gold, complete with the ability to duck into the dimension and wallow about in the gold? that's just awesome. Stealing items from other people just by going "MINE!"? chucking a piece of gold so big you kill someone with it but can blowback yourself? Scrying by looking through coins at someone? sweeet. plus, Chrimatia is a neat name.


not to mention that gp as xp mechanic really does sound interesting. I can't wait to see how that class fully pans out.

ThreadNecro5
2016-01-30, 04:22 PM
ThreadNecro5: with the exception of the Dragon stuff (can't say im EVER a fan of that stuff), i love the idea of this class that's the essence of greed. a core class ability that lets you store and convert things to gold, complete with the ability to duck into the dimension and wallow about in the gold? that's just awesome. Stealing items from other people just by going "MINE!"? chucking a piece of gold so big you kill someone with it but can blowback yourself? Scrying by looking through coins at someone? sweeet. plus, Chrimatia is a neat name.


not to mention that gp as xp mechanic really does sound interesting. I can't wait to see how that class fully pans out.

Thank you, always nice to hear about someone enjoying your works. As far a the 'DRAGON!' stuff it will be limited to just the Shintai, a Mythos that essentially makes you a half gold dragon, and another Mythos that if you have the 'half gold dragon' Mythos also grants you a breath weapon that deals DEX damage by turning things to gold, and creatures may be animated into your golden statue servants (if you remember the old cartoon Shaolin Showdown, its like the sapphire dragon from that).

The general idea is having a dragon subtheme because dragons are the archetypical powerful money hoarding fantasy creature.


Also an Excellency idea for anyone reading this:
What do you think about an excellency that jut flat out grants say 500-1000 GP per level you have when you take it? Make it able to be taken multiple times, and probably add a limitation of only being able to take it a number of times equal to your level to prevent Mythos point cheesing.

Jakman217
2016-01-30, 04:58 PM
The general idea is having a dragon subtheme because dragons are the archetypical powerful money hoarding fantasy creature.

What about king Midas? I think he's a far better representation of greed. Or the demon Mammon, who became wealthy in hell itself? Dragons get an unfairly high representation and while powerful, I think there are more interesting options than just be a dragon. Also, greed from FMA would be sub-par at this class, because he hardly got any gold in setting.

vasharanpaladin
2016-01-30, 08:28 PM
What about king Midas? I think he's a far better representation of greed. Or the demon Mammon, who became wealthy in hell itself? Dragons get an unfairly high representation and while powerful, I think there are more interesting options than just be a dragon. Also, greed from FMA would be sub-par at this class, because he hardly got any gold in setting.

Midas is more associated with short-sighted thinking (wishes that whatever he touched would turn to gold, without stopping to consider what that would entail) and hubris (what resulted in the aforementioned wish to begin with; he thought he'd outsmarted a god) than with greed specifically. The result is certainly appropriate to the concept, I certainly wouldn't look askance at a mythos that gives one the Midas touch, but as far as embodiments of said concept go, Midas himself isn't one.

Mammon could probably stand to be referenced a few times in the fluff, but he's also not appropriate to think of as an embodiment of avarice. The serpent is temptation, the dragon is its more fantastic cousin.

And FMA Greed is not only appropriate, but nearly required. Money isn't the whole end of avarice; Greed wants people, he wants friends or family. He doesn't defend them because they're his friends, he defends them because they're his friends. Which makes him one of two characters listed for that banner that fall to the "white" end of the moral charts.

Jakman217
2016-01-30, 09:21 PM
My problem is that dragons are overused and boring. And besides, if you look at eastern dragons wealth has little if anything to do with them.

I think tainting a class based on a supreme greed, material hording, and ultimately shallow wealth doesn't need to turn to a dragon. It seems so rote and standard that I may as well make a mythic unarmed fighter and make become humanoid and go super saiyan as a shintai. It's overdone, and highly limiting to force a race change on a raceless concept. I think a demon, at least as an option, would be better.

If you want me to be more direct, creating a shintai which should be considered a central-most feature that forces an ephemeral concept like greed to become a specific creature is painfully limiting. What if I want to be a demon of greed? Maybe I want to effectively be a skeleton of pure gold? Maybe I want to be a misshapen blob of sentient gold that is so heartless and greedy that a snake moving on it's belly in the dirt cannot represent how low I stoop for wealth.

A dragon is a proud and vicious beast, but a dragon would not stoop for a singular dropped coin. Mammon was literally defined as always bent over looking for material wealth at all times, just as a true embodiment of greed should. It may be vicious, it may be eternally hungry, and have a temper that can be compared to dragons, but true Greed is without pride, dignity, or grace.

VoodooPaladin
2016-01-30, 11:51 PM
Try focusing on the parts of dragons that have to do with wealth and greed, and leave out the rest. Have a hoard and guard it jealously, but what does wealth have to do with scales, wings, and breathing fire? Let him smell gold; let him smell fear. If greed is about more than shiny trinkets, then let him collect people, places, and concepts. A dragon is a tyrant. If this Mythos becomes a tyrant, it has to do so in a way that is still centered on Being Richer Than God. Otherwise you really should just go take a shot at Io's Mythos.

EdroGrimshell
2016-01-31, 11:46 PM
Try focusing on the parts of dragons that have to do with wealth and greed, and leave out the rest. Have a hoard and guard it jealously, but what does wealth have to do with scales, wings, and breathing fire? Let him smell gold; let him smell fear. If greed is about more than shiny trinkets, then let him collect people, places, and concepts. A dragon is a tyrant. If this Mythos becomes a tyrant, it has to do so in a way that is still centered on Being Richer Than God. Otherwise you really should just go take a shot at Io's Mythos.

This might be better represented by The President of The Company from The Gamer webtoon, adding people into a collective driven by the idea of gaining profit, able to spend money to buy back life to its members, buy lands and make things it doesn't want to happen not happen, etc. It's an even better representation of Greed than a dragon and is by far more interesting because it does what VoodooPaladin suggests, emphasized by me, letting them just collect, to Hoard, everything, not just gold, not just gems or works of art, or other valuable.

Jakman217
2016-02-01, 01:05 AM
And I just realized I had another good example of a greed character. 'C: The Money of soul and possibility Control'. It's literally an entire setting where everyone's power is defined by money. Every single character and monster could fit in this class.
Example characters.
Kimmimaro Yoga, the MC, would be an example, but he never really fight directly he leaves it to the next character.
Msyu, his demon companion who is literally powered up the more money she (Kimmimaro) has and is able to burn money to fight stronger.
The final option would be Masakaki, the banker and overseer of the realm they fight in.

Seriously, if you want some inspiration, I suggest paying a look at this. Though it does have an economics bent, but that's rather fitting for the class.

Oh, and idea for a suicide/last resort attack from the show.

Scorched Earth: You may as a full round action burn your wealth to explode yourself. for every 100 gp you burn you may deal either an additional d6 of fire damage, or increase the radius of the explosion by 5 ft. Reflex half, and the land is now on fire for 1 round/100gp.

Manifestations: Change element, more power, stuff about burning your less material assets, and other such stuff.

Zenna
2016-02-01, 01:50 AM
When picking a mythos, do you gain a basic mani immediatly AND advanced next level?

Jakman217
2016-02-01, 01:54 AM
When picking a mythos, do you gain a basic mani immediatly AND advanced next level?

Yes, you gain a basic the level you gain the mythos and the advanced kicks in the next level. You don't have to necissarily chose the advanced the level before, but it's suggested.

7th son of sons
2016-02-01, 02:13 AM
Checking in between bouts of working, working on schoolwork, and working on my next mythos class, I'd like to add in my own suggestions for some classic Greed characters:

Wario: A Man who literally ignored a captured damsel to acquire more wealth, his entire motivation in Wario World was to get more money, and basically all his motivations in life are because he's a greedy b*stard.

Mr. Krabs: Sold Spongebob's Soul for 62 cents, will abandon his post for a penny, bathes in money, dates money, and has made a wide variety of terrible decisions in the name of, what else: Money.

Count Olaf: The amount of insane, evil, and downright rediculous things this man did in the name of the Baudelaire fortune is astounding.

Gilgamesh (Fate Version): He's incredibly insistant that everything of value is his, to the point of wanting the holy grail not to use it or because he wants the grail, but because he doesn't want anyone else to have it. As an added bonus, by the lore of the series, Gil used to actually own EVERYTHING IN THE WORLD. And that's impressive.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-01, 02:35 AM
Mr. Krabs: Sold Spongebob's Soul for 62 cents, will abandon his post for a penny, bathes in money, dates money, and has made a wide variety of terrible decisions in the name of, what else: Money.

I made an attempt at a "Money Mythos" awhile back. Here's one from my notes. Meenah Peixes, from Homestuck. Regularly steals her friends' clothes and sells them back at a profit. Cheated the author of her own story out of its funding. Spent multiple eternities sitting in her palace, counting her riches. And then grew up to become the unconditional Empress of the Universe, despite being implied to have never having actually ruled over anything in her life.

ImperatorV
2016-02-01, 02:55 AM
I made an attempt at a "Money Mythos" awhile back. Here's one from my notes. Meenah Peixes, from Homestuck. Regularly steals her friends' clothes and sells them back at a profit. Cheated the author of her own story out of its funding. Spent multiple eternities sitting in her palace, counting her riches. And then grew up to become the unconditional Empress of the Universe, despite being implied to have never having actually ruled over anything in her life.

You forgot the multiple-story tall gold statue of herself.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-01, 03:55 AM
You forgot the multiple-story tall gold statue of herself.

Thanks for the catch, there. Would you like some Prawn Shop (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvstvbCT_wM) to go with that?

ThreadNecro5
2016-02-01, 04:31 PM
I have took on board the offered suggestions, I will make the dragon based stuff more customisable (if it was not clear the Shintai would not turn you into a literal dragon but more replace your body with all your money, which would them form into a dragon-like shape, if anything mechanics would likely be closer to a construct with partial swarm abilities, with a fly speed and breath weapon coming form different mythos). Oddly enough a lot of the ideas that were handed out were similar to ones I had but were jet to write up at the time.

Also, is it listed anywhere the value of a soul in GP?

Finely I have a couple of Fantastic mythos, the second of which I am on the fence between Fantastic or Legendary.

A Wealth of Trust
Prerequisites: - Must have at least three beings who consider you an ally (as defined below)
You gain a +4 bonus on Diplomacy an Bluff checks when on allies. An ally is defined as a being who personally knows you, thinks of you in a non-negative light, and can generally be counted on to preform minor requests and show trust in you. Additionally whenever using aid another, you and all allies within 60ft increase the bonus by an amount equal to the number of allies within 60ft.

In addition to this whenever an ally is made to attempt to betray you or knowingly act against your interests, they gain a bonus of any saves/rolls to resist equal to half your Chrimatia level. Should no such roll be made, the initiator of the effect instead takes a penalty of all rolls to succeed equal to half your Chrimatia level.

Advanced Manifestations:
Trust Me
A number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier, you may mimic the effects of a Suggestion spell. Uses of this spell are specific to each ally, so if you had a charisma modifier of +3, you would have three uses on each individual ally, not a flat three uses.

Willed goods
When an ally dies, and you were not the one who killed them or knowing assisted in their death, you gain complete knowledge of all possessions they own, from jewels, land, and titles, to their underwear. You may select any one object they owned. Should the possession logically pass to someone else or another wishes to dispute your taking of it, then they must pass a will save. Should they fail you inherit the item and all believe it right that you do so (or at the very least do not complain about whatever oddity.).

Armour of Comradeship
You and all allies within 60ft succeed on attempt to use aid another with no roll needed. Additionally should you or an ally within 30ft become the target of an effect, you or an ally within that range may get in the way of it. Should they do this the original target may use aid another on the interrupter and they become the new target of the effect. Should they survive the interrupter may preform a standard action that must be used to attack the source of the effect they interrupted. Should a creature take a standard action in this way they loose their next rounds standard action.

Weight of Avarice
Prerequisites: -
Should a being attempt to steal an something you own (be it the literal taking of an item, or a more metaphorical stealing such as through attempting to turn an ally against you, or to live on land you own without permission), they are (upon preforming the act, such as casting a spell to achieve the result, simply pocketing a gold coin, making a diplomacy check on your ally, or making the mental choice to settle on land you own) cursed. This curse, popularly dubbed Avarice, may be resisted with a will save and causes the cursed creature to slowly turn to gold, taking one point of Dexterity Drain for each hour they remain within a quarter of a mile of you, land you own, one of your ally's, or anything that is definitively yours. The curse is removed when the thief ends their attempts to take the possession from you, and it is returned (e.g. A coil is given back to you or a suitable representative, or a spell that turns an ally against you ends). Should the curse be removed the Drain becomes Damage. Outside of the quarter of a mile distance the drain instead becomes every 24 hours instead of each hour.

Should the item have been damaged since it was stolen returning it fails to remove the curse (for non material things damage constitutes permanent effects, including instantaneous magical effects or permanent mental trauma). Should the object be again stolen by, or traded to, another creature the one who now possesses the item also must save against Avarice as if they sole it, as well as the original thief. Thin continues to spread in a similar manner.
Should the creature fail to become cursed with Avarice and the item has not been returned to the vault, the creature must save to resist being cursed with Avarice every 24 hours. A creature reduced to zero Dexterity by Averice turns fully into a golden statue, with select parts of their anatomy, such as horns or teeth, occasionally becoming some type of precious gemstone instead.

Additionally you gain a melee touch attack that, should it hit a creature forces them to save against a similar affliction to Avarice that forces the creature to pass a Will save or take 1d4 Dexterity damage for a minute, with a will save to resist the damage each round. Should they be reduced to zero dexterity, they are turned to a golden statue as if by Avarice.

Creatures turned to gold by Avarice are worth 1000GP per HD they possessed to a minimum of 1000GP. This value does not count class levels.
By paying an amount of gold equal to the value of the golden statue you may animate it, which in mechanical terms is achieved through the statue turning back into the original creature, with class levels removed, and applying the Gilded template to them. If the creature has no HD, they gain one level of Warrior. You control all creatures with the Gilded template that you caused to gain the template, and all such creatures are transported to your Vault.

Gilded Template:
Size and Type
Type changes to Construct.

Hit Dice
Racial HD are Replaced with an equal number of Construct HD

Speed
As typical for base creature

Armour Class
As typical for base creature

Attack
If they lack a natural attack, a Gilded creature gains a Slam attack as a Primary natural attack that deals 1d6 damage.

Full Attack
As typical for base creature

Special attacks
As typical for base creature

Special qualities
A gilded creature gains the mindless special quality, DR5/Adamantine or, should they already have any DR higher than 5, it instead becomes an equal amount of DR that is now penetrated by Adamantine.

Abilities
- Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma become 10 if they were higher, otherwise no change.

Skills
As typical for base creature

Feats
No change beyond the Mindless Quality.

Basic Manifestations:
Breath of Golden Vapour
You gain a breath weapon identical to your melee touch attack that may be used every 1d4 rounds. You may not use the touch attack when the breath weapon is recharging.

Golden Servants
You may transport a creature with the Gilded template form your Vault to a space within 10ft (creatures larger than medium may have their space extend beyond this point, just one of the spaces they take up must be within this radius) of you. You may only have a total HD of such creatures outside of you vault equal to four times your Chrimatia level.

vasharanpaladin
2016-02-02, 06:33 AM
Also, is it listed anywhere the value of a soul in GP?

Book of Vile Darkness lists them at 250gp for one in larval form (naturally found in the Lower Planes), or 200gp for one in a receptacle (usually resulting from a spell such as soul bind or trap the soul).

Defiantnight
2016-02-02, 11:42 AM
Book of Vile Darkness lists them at 250gp for one in larval form (naturally found in the Lower Planes), or 200gp for one in a receptacle (usually resulting from a spell such as soul bind or trap the soul).

It may have been a different book, but I seem to recall it also mentioning that increasingly powerful souls were worth more, without giving actual prices to them. I like to think that those are for commoner's souls, not level 30 wizard souls, but that's just me.

Edit: Weight of Avarice looks like a Legendary mythos, but I don't know how they're tiered.

vasharanpaladin
2016-02-02, 02:00 PM
It may have been a different book, but I seem to recall it also mentioning that increasingly powerful souls were worth more, without giving actual prices to them. I like to think that those are for commoner's souls, not level 30 wizard souls, but that's just me.

Yeah, it doesn't say exactly whose souls. Lords of Madness also has a formula for determining slave costs (CR^2*100gp; round fractional CRs to 1), also noting that neogi will tend to jack up the price depending on other traits and who they're selling to. "Other traits" being at a premium when you're talking about balls of light, this could probably also be adapted somehow?

JKTrickster
2016-02-02, 05:38 PM
Sorry to pop back in here unannounced but was there ever any plans for a Mythos class based on the Moon?

We have one based on the Sun now, but was wondering if anyone had anything related to the Moon. As far as I know, the closest reference was the Mythic Lycanthrope Feat/Mythos.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-02, 07:29 PM
We have one based on the Sun now, but was wondering if anyone had anything related to the Moon. As far as I know, the closest reference was the Mythic Lycanthrope Feat/Mythos.

Primal Fury was the one to come up with the idea. He called it the Somnari, but it wasn't completed. This is what I could find of it.

The Somnari


http://i.imgur.com/L18GVQv.png
"I think you're like me. A nameless, senseless queen, with many shapes, and an invisible kingdom. Not just black like Lord Square, or white like Ms. Viv's smile. A brilliant shade of purple... That's your real crown." ~Mabel; Zebra Girl

I have no name... no True Name at least. I have given myself many titles though, such as the Great Dreamer, the Argent Madonna, the Queen-Mother of Storyfolk, the Ninefold Chimaera, and a host of others you can neither pronounce nor comprehend while awake; but they mean nothing. I am the Moon of the Lawgivers, and it was I who brought the First Night to the world, allowing it respite from my brother's burning glory. I still haven't received any thanks for that, by the way. But then... how could my siblings, or anyone else, think to thank me? I barely even exist.

The mind of a Primordial is such a curious thing, isn't it? It is a combination of a host of lesser minds, who are themselves combinations of those lesser than they. Unlike your kind, they have no ability to simply "forget" that which comes to mind, as that would require an entire legion of entities to do the same. No, everything that is discarded has to go somewhere. As you may have guessed by now, I am the byproduct of the Sun's conception, making me his antithesis, his foil, and his shadow. Where he drags others down the path to his glory bound by unbreakable virtues, I guide them to their own with transient whispers and fevered visions. While he has protected allies with the bulwark of his unquenchable courage, I would feed them to their darkest fears, proving they can protect themselves... should they survive. And where he would strike his foes down with unquestionable purity, I would heap upon them imaginary sins such that they crumble under their weight, leaving them utterly crippled with suicidal shame.

So, it seems you have stumbled into my story, little mortal; tread carefully, for it is one of thankless glory and horrid nightmares. You will fade from the thoughts of others just as dreams fade from the waking mind. Your eyes will see the world not as it is, but as it could be, as it wishes to be, and as it must never be. You are my child now, my Somnari, and you are doomed to madness. But fear not sweetling, for the road to insanity is paved with indescribable wonders.

What A Day For A Daydream
Prerequisite:-

I do not govern only the dreams that come at night, my child. I rule even those idle fancies that constantly drift in and out of your minds. I do so love how, even in the midst of a terrible conflict, your thoughts can wander and touch upon the most ridiculous of notions. I think your kind underestimates just how valuable a short attention span can be.

In order to use this Mythos, you must take a move action to roll a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), and fail. You CANNOT fail this roll intentionally. If you succeed in failing, your mind drifts away, and you begin to daydream. While you are daydreaming, you gain a bonus to your Will Save equal to your Charisma modifier, but you can only move at half your base land speed. You may not move beyond this speed, regardless of your other modes of transportation. This state lasts as long as you care to maintain it. You take no other penalties, but you may take no hostile actions while daydreaming. If you do, the state ends immediately.

This lethargic state is incredibly infectious; as a standard action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity, you may sigh or yawn. All who hear this expression of exhaustion must succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), or take 1d6 non-lethal damage per two Somnari levels. As their own fatigue sets in, they drift closer and closer to dreamland; if a creature takes enough non-lethal damage from this ability to equal their current hit point total, they fall asleep. When undead are subjected to this ability, they feel the call of the grave, and begin to fall apart; undead take a like amount of lethal damage from this ability.

Advanced
It's Such A Beautiful Day, Isn't It? (Requires 4 Ranks in Diplomacy): While daydreaming, you may ask someone about the state of the weather, or something equally as meaningless to the current situation. If you succeed on a Diplomacy check opposed by your target's Sense Motive check, they also begin daydreaming. They gain none of the benefits you get from daydreaming, only the reduction in speed, and the inability to act in a hostile manner for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier. If they are attacked, this state ends immediately. Once a creature successfully saves against this ability, they cannot be affected by it again for 24 hours. This a language-based mind-affecting ability.

When you use this on an ally that is suffering from a mind-affecting ability, they are allowed another saving throw with an additional bonus equal to your Charisma modifier.

Just Five More Minutes: In response to a hostile action, you may politely ask your attacker to leave you alone for a little while. If they succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), their attack continues. If they fail however, they begrudgingly leave you alone for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier, choosing to attack someone else. If there is no one else they wish to attack, they impatiently wait for the duration instead. A creature can only be affected by this ability once every 1d4 rounds. If your attacker fails this save by 10 or more, they are compelled to leave you alone for five minutes.

If you have fallen asleep due to the 'I Fell Asleep Beneath The Flowers' manifestation, the DC for this ability increases by 1 for every tier of Mythos you have access to.

I Fell Asleep Beneath The Flowers: If you fail a saving throw against a mind-affecting ability while daydreaming, you may neutralize it by taking an immediate action to fall asleep. While sleeping, you are immune to mind-affecting abilities, and gain a dodge bonus to your AC equal to your Charisma modifier. This state lasts for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier, and cannot be ended prematurely. If you fall asleep in, or somehow end up in, a harmful area you may take move actions to remove yourself from it. Upon learning this manifestation, you can no longer be caught flatfooted or be coup de graced while sleeping.


The Sandman Cometh
Prerequisite:-

Twilight has always been my favorite time of day... or night, depending on how you look at it. As I drag the cloak of night across the sky, I place a single grain of silver sand upon each eye of every mortal about to drift off to sleep, that they might gain entry into the Region of Dreams. Just between you and me, I like splashing the stubborn ones with a little extra; they make the most delightful sounds when they finally doze off.

You can conjure magical silver sand seemingly from nowhere. You can splash this sand in your opponent's face as a melee touch attack, or throw it as a ranged touch attack out to 60ft; you may extend this range to 120ft by halving the damage. It deals 1d8 non-lethal damage per two Somnari levels. This damage becomes lethal when used against undead creatures, such is the power of the call to the Final Rest. Rather than Strength or Dexterity, you gain a bonus to attack and damage equal to your Charisma modifier.

It must be noted that using the sand in this way is NOT considered a hostile action for the purposes of the 'What A Day For A Daydream' Mythos.

Basic
Bring Me A Dream: By sprinkling this sand over the eyes of a sleeping or unconscious creature, you can give them exceptionally pleasant dreams. In addition to pleasant dreams, dying creatures you use sleep-sand on are automatically stabilized. Each round spent sleeping heals the target for a number of hit points equal to half the damage of your sleep-sand. The target sleeps for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier, waking early if they are fully healed, or if you choose to wake them. If a hostile action is taken against a character sleeping in this way, they awaken immediately, and may defend themselves normally. Using sand in this way is a standard action that provokes attacks of opportunity.

Make Him The Cutest That I've Ever Seen: Anyone struck by your sand must succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), or be Fascinated by you for (Charisma Modifier) rounds.

Advanced
Don't Have Nobody To Call My Own: If a creature is benefiting from a status effect, such as barbarian's rage or a spell, they must make a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2) when struck by your sand. If they succeed, nothing happens and they are immune to this effect for 24 hours. If they fail, they lose a single beneficial effect of your choice to the bottomless void of ennui and despair.

Please Turn On Your Magic Beam: By collecting the sand in your hand and softly blowing upon it, you create a stream of sand that refracts light so beautifully it's no wonder others mistake it for moon-beam. You may deliver your sleep-sand in a line attack that requires a Reflex Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2) to avoid. This line extends out 15ft per tier of Mythos you have access to. You can only use this attack once every 1d4 rounds. You may also create a cone attack with a great sweeping gesture out to the same distance, though you may only use this method once every 2d4 rounds.


I Fell Asleep Beneath The Flowers
Prerequisite:-

It almost breaks my heart to hear that so many mortals think time spent sleeping is time wasted. Almost. It doesn't matter how they may feel about it, they know that without sleep, they would be reduced to shambling wretches within days. I sometimes wonder what they find so difficult about a few hours of rest. Seems like the simplest thing in the world to me.

As a full round action, you can fall asleep. Often times, you will immediately fall prone, though you may remain standing by leaning on a wall, tree, cane, or other similar object. Regardless of your position, your tossing and turning always seems to keep you just out of harms way, allowing you to retain your Dexterity bonus. While sleeping, you gain a +2 bonus to your Will save for each tier of Mythos you have access to. If you do fail a Will save against a mind-affecting ability, it takes a full round for you to wake up before it can take effect. You can take no actions while sleeping, unless you possess another Mythos or manifestation that says otherwise. You may sleep as long as you like, though it takes another full-round action to awaken.

This lethargic state is incredibly infectious; as a standard action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity, you may sigh or yawn. All who hear this expression of exhaustion must succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), or take 1d6 psychic damage per two Somnari levels.

Upon learning this Mythos, you can no longer be caught flatfooted or coup de graced while sleeping, nor are you considered helpless.

Basic
A Sleep Like Death: You gain Hibernate as a bonus feat. In addition, you can sleep for any length of time without food, water, or even breathing. You may be quite hungry or thirsty upon waking, but suffer no ill effects. By purchasing this manifestation a second time, you heal 1 point of ability drain if you sleep for 8 uninterrupted hours. If you sleep for 24 full hours, you heal 2 points of ability drain.

Rain-Or-Sleet Ignorance: So long as you sleep, you gain a resistance of 5 against fire, cold, electricity, acid, and sonic damage. You may purchase this manifestation up to three times, each purchase beyond the first adding 5 to your resistances.

Advanced
Just Five More Minutes: If you fail a will save against a charm or compulsion effect while asleep, you may delay it for a while, opting to sleep a little longer instead. Each round you wish to stay asleep, you must succeed on an opposed Charisma check. Both you and your opponent receive the following bonuses (HD + Charisma Modifier). If you manage to beat their check five times, the effect is completely neutralized. This check is made as a free action at the beginning of your turn and your opponent's turn.

I Dream Of You Amid The Flowers: While sleeping, you dream of your friends, safe and happy. While sleeping, choose an ally. They gain one of the following bonuses: a deflection bonus to their AC, or a bonus to their Fortitude, Reflex, or Will saving throws; this bonus is equal to your Wisdom modifier. You may take a move action to provide this bonus to a different ally, or change the type of bonus an ally is receiving. This effects characters regardless of distance, even across planes.

Defiantnight
2016-02-02, 07:45 PM
I find it hilarious that you can yawn and make your enemies sleepy, or make them wait a few minutes to attack while you catch a few more Z's. :smallbiggrin:

Lanth Sor
2016-02-03, 02:43 AM
So I'm working on an idea for a Mythic Mage. It uses essentia to power its Stuff. As far as spells I was needing to define where issues would arise for making things at will. The first point I have is you gain Highest Mental Modifier + 2 per level essentia. And may only invest 1 + 1 ever three levels past one. SO 4th(2)/7th(3)/10th(4)/13th(5)/16th(6)/19th(7).

By investing essentia equal to the spell level you gain the ability to cast the spell. Now I was planning on being able to cast spells at-will as soon as you gain access to them. But i know there are some spells that would be just broken, IE pathfinder witches get cure light wounds at level 1. Immediate thoughts would be to have it be at will but limiting the effects on a single target or effects lasting hours being changed to 24 hour duration and only one instance being active per time prepared.

An alternative way to mitigate the problem would be to take a Shadow Magic Approach. You invest enough to meet the spell level and gain it as an arcane spell 1/day for every 1 you invest over the minimum you gain an extra casting. If you invest 2 over the spell level it is cast as a spell like ability. If you invest 5 over the level it is cast as a supernatural ability. So a 2nd level spell would be arcane 2-3 essentia would be cast arcane spell, 4-6 essentia would be cast a spell-like abilities and at 7 essentia invested they would be supernatural abilities. If a 0 level spell is chosen it is usable at will and becomes spell-like at 4th level and supernatural at 13th level.

Tacitus
2016-02-03, 02:54 AM
My feeling for Mythic Mage has always been there either should not be one or they should not grant spells but rather have each mythos give a related family of effects that scale with level. Similar to learning a sphere of influence, take a mythos to gain fire effects. Burn with flames, fire swords, fireballs, fire elementals, the fire of inspiration/leadership, etc. Healing, and suddenly start learning the entire healing subschool. Bindings. A massive pile of CC effects.

That or gain components of spells and every "spell" they cast is a lego mishmash of these components. I cast an Adjective Noun that Verbs Nouns. Blazing Sword that Wields Itself. Chilling Bolts that Weakens Enemies. Massive Summon that Taunts Foes. Chained Bolt that Heals Allies. Healing Song that Cleanses Allies. Build your own spells dammit! XP

Lanth Sor
2016-02-03, 10:56 AM
While I do understand the merit of build your own spells it has been my experience that system can be inherently Broken(Same issue with Technology based on real science). Prime example being the ridiculous Chaos Mage(had a player at level 4 make party member glow with the intesnity of the sun literally and then make a black hole and for his final magic trick he mad a ring of wish out of a rock that he could not use and lasted 1 round. To revive the party member killed by the black hole.) While the shenanigans lead to awesome story that is so unreasonable. There is a mitigation in the forms of paths of chaos where you hit 10 crit fails and you cease to be a character period, with no way to undo it including true resurrection and wish/miracle.

While doing individual mythos providing access to basic abilities may work I am very leery of anything free form as being used as one thing I've found like cancer is the phrase "At DM Discretion" Which is next to required for free form systems.

Jakman217
2016-02-03, 03:04 PM
I suggest you take a look at the Sphere's of power books from PF (3pp). Its a lot more freeform than the standard spell system, and removes both the first few levels weakness while removing the high level godmode engage section.

If you want a copy of it pm me and I'll see about sending it to you. It may not be exactly what your looking for but it may help you a bit.

ThreadNecro5
2016-02-03, 04:03 PM
I just had a brainwave with applying a GP cost to a soul. what if the cost was the expected wealth by level of the creature? Counting racial HD into the final number.

JKTrickster
2016-02-04, 02:08 PM
Primal Fury was the one to come up with the idea. He called it the Somnari, but it wasn't completed. This is what I could find of it.

The Somnari


http://i.imgur.com/L18GVQv.png
"I think you're like me. A nameless, senseless queen, with many shapes, and an invisible kingdom. Not just black like Lord Square, or white like Ms. Viv's smile. A brilliant shade of purple... That's your real crown." ~Mabel; Zebra Girl

I have no name... no True Name at least. I have given myself many titles though, such as the Great Dreamer, the Argent Madonna, the Queen-Mother of Storyfolk, the Ninefold Chimaera, and a host of others you can neither pronounce nor comprehend while awake; but they mean nothing. I am the Moon of the Lawgivers, and it was I who brought the First Night to the world, allowing it respite from my brother's burning glory. I still haven't received any thanks for that, by the way. But then... how could my siblings, or anyone else, think to thank me? I barely even exist.

The mind of a Primordial is such a curious thing, isn't it? It is a combination of a host of lesser minds, who are themselves combinations of those lesser than they. Unlike your kind, they have no ability to simply "forget" that which comes to mind, as that would require an entire legion of entities to do the same. No, everything that is discarded has to go somewhere. As you may have guessed by now, I am the byproduct of the Sun's conception, making me his antithesis, his foil, and his shadow. Where he drags others down the path to his glory bound by unbreakable virtues, I guide them to their own with transient whispers and fevered visions. While he has protected allies with the bulwark of his unquenchable courage, I would feed them to their darkest fears, proving they can protect themselves... should they survive. And where he would strike his foes down with unquestionable purity, I would heap upon them imaginary sins such that they crumble under their weight, leaving them utterly crippled with suicidal shame.

So, it seems you have stumbled into my story, little mortal; tread carefully, for it is one of thankless glory and horrid nightmares. You will fade from the thoughts of others just as dreams fade from the waking mind. Your eyes will see the world not as it is, but as it could be, as it wishes to be, and as it must never be. You are my child now, my Somnari, and you are doomed to madness. But fear not sweetling, for the road to insanity is paved with indescribable wonders.

What A Day For A Daydream
Prerequisite:-

I do not govern only the dreams that come at night, my child. I rule even those idle fancies that constantly drift in and out of your minds. I do so love how, even in the midst of a terrible conflict, your thoughts can wander and touch upon the most ridiculous of notions. I think your kind underestimates just how valuable a short attention span can be.

In order to use this Mythos, you must take a move action to roll a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), and fail. You CANNOT fail this roll intentionally. If you succeed in failing, your mind drifts away, and you begin to daydream. While you are daydreaming, you gain a bonus to your Will Save equal to your Charisma modifier, but you can only move at half your base land speed. You may not move beyond this speed, regardless of your other modes of transportation. This state lasts as long as you care to maintain it. You take no other penalties, but you may take no hostile actions while daydreaming. If you do, the state ends immediately.

This lethargic state is incredibly infectious; as a standard action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity, you may sigh or yawn. All who hear this expression of exhaustion must succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), or take 1d6 non-lethal damage per two Somnari levels. As their own fatigue sets in, they drift closer and closer to dreamland; if a creature takes enough non-lethal damage from this ability to equal their current hit point total, they fall asleep. When undead are subjected to this ability, they feel the call of the grave, and begin to fall apart; undead take a like amount of lethal damage from this ability.

Advanced
It's Such A Beautiful Day, Isn't It? (Requires 4 Ranks in Diplomacy): While daydreaming, you may ask someone about the state of the weather, or something equally as meaningless to the current situation. If you succeed on a Diplomacy check opposed by your target's Sense Motive check, they also begin daydreaming. They gain none of the benefits you get from daydreaming, only the reduction in speed, and the inability to act in a hostile manner for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier. If they are attacked, this state ends immediately. Once a creature successfully saves against this ability, they cannot be affected by it again for 24 hours. This a language-based mind-affecting ability.

When you use this on an ally that is suffering from a mind-affecting ability, they are allowed another saving throw with an additional bonus equal to your Charisma modifier.

Just Five More Minutes: In response to a hostile action, you may politely ask your attacker to leave you alone for a little while. If they succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), their attack continues. If they fail however, they begrudgingly leave you alone for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier, choosing to attack someone else. If there is no one else they wish to attack, they impatiently wait for the duration instead. A creature can only be affected by this ability once every 1d4 rounds. If your attacker fails this save by 10 or more, they are compelled to leave you alone for five minutes.

If you have fallen asleep due to the 'I Fell Asleep Beneath The Flowers' manifestation, the DC for this ability increases by 1 for every tier of Mythos you have access to.

I Fell Asleep Beneath The Flowers: If you fail a saving throw against a mind-affecting ability while daydreaming, you may neutralize it by taking an immediate action to fall asleep. While sleeping, you are immune to mind-affecting abilities, and gain a dodge bonus to your AC equal to your Charisma modifier. This state lasts for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier, and cannot be ended prematurely. If you fall asleep in, or somehow end up in, a harmful area you may take move actions to remove yourself from it. Upon learning this manifestation, you can no longer be caught flatfooted or be coup de graced while sleeping.


The Sandman Cometh
Prerequisite:-

Twilight has always been my favorite time of day... or night, depending on how you look at it. As I drag the cloak of night across the sky, I place a single grain of silver sand upon each eye of every mortal about to drift off to sleep, that they might gain entry into the Region of Dreams. Just between you and me, I like splashing the stubborn ones with a little extra; they make the most delightful sounds when they finally doze off.

You can conjure magical silver sand seemingly from nowhere. You can splash this sand in your opponent's face as a melee touch attack, or throw it as a ranged touch attack out to 60ft; you may extend this range to 120ft by halving the damage. It deals 1d8 non-lethal damage per two Somnari levels. This damage becomes lethal when used against undead creatures, such is the power of the call to the Final Rest. Rather than Strength or Dexterity, you gain a bonus to attack and damage equal to your Charisma modifier.

It must be noted that using the sand in this way is NOT considered a hostile action for the purposes of the 'What A Day For A Daydream' Mythos.

Basic
Bring Me A Dream: By sprinkling this sand over the eyes of a sleeping or unconscious creature, you can give them exceptionally pleasant dreams. In addition to pleasant dreams, dying creatures you use sleep-sand on are automatically stabilized. Each round spent sleeping heals the target for a number of hit points equal to half the damage of your sleep-sand. The target sleeps for a number of rounds equal to your Charisma modifier, waking early if they are fully healed, or if you choose to wake them. If a hostile action is taken against a character sleeping in this way, they awaken immediately, and may defend themselves normally. Using sand in this way is a standard action that provokes attacks of opportunity.

Make Him The Cutest That I've Ever Seen: Anyone struck by your sand must succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), or be Fascinated by you for (Charisma Modifier) rounds.

Advanced
Don't Have Nobody To Call My Own: If a creature is benefiting from a status effect, such as barbarian's rage or a spell, they must make a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2) when struck by your sand. If they succeed, nothing happens and they are immune to this effect for 24 hours. If they fail, they lose a single beneficial effect of your choice to the bottomless void of ennui and despair.

Please Turn On Your Magic Beam: By collecting the sand in your hand and softly blowing upon it, you create a stream of sand that refracts light so beautifully it's no wonder others mistake it for moon-beam. You may deliver your sleep-sand in a line attack that requires a Reflex Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2) to avoid. This line extends out 15ft per tier of Mythos you have access to. You can only use this attack once every 1d4 rounds. You may also create a cone attack with a great sweeping gesture out to the same distance, though you may only use this method once every 2d4 rounds.


I Fell Asleep Beneath The Flowers
Prerequisite:-

It almost breaks my heart to hear that so many mortals think time spent sleeping is time wasted. Almost. It doesn't matter how they may feel about it, they know that without sleep, they would be reduced to shambling wretches within days. I sometimes wonder what they find so difficult about a few hours of rest. Seems like the simplest thing in the world to me.

As a full round action, you can fall asleep. Often times, you will immediately fall prone, though you may remain standing by leaning on a wall, tree, cane, or other similar object. Regardless of your position, your tossing and turning always seems to keep you just out of harms way, allowing you to retain your Dexterity bonus. While sleeping, you gain a +2 bonus to your Will save for each tier of Mythos you have access to. If you do fail a Will save against a mind-affecting ability, it takes a full round for you to wake up before it can take effect. You can take no actions while sleeping, unless you possess another Mythos or manifestation that says otherwise. You may sleep as long as you like, though it takes another full-round action to awaken.

This lethargic state is incredibly infectious; as a standard action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity, you may sigh or yawn. All who hear this expression of exhaustion must succeed on a Will Save (DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + Class Level/2), or take 1d6 psychic damage per two Somnari levels.

Upon learning this Mythos, you can no longer be caught flatfooted or coup de graced while sleeping, nor are you considered helpless.

Basic
A Sleep Like Death: You gain Hibernate as a bonus feat. In addition, you can sleep for any length of time without food, water, or even breathing. You may be quite hungry or thirsty upon waking, but suffer no ill effects. By purchasing this manifestation a second time, you heal 1 point of ability drain if you sleep for 8 uninterrupted hours. If you sleep for 24 full hours, you heal 2 points of ability drain.

Rain-Or-Sleet Ignorance: So long as you sleep, you gain a resistance of 5 against fire, cold, electricity, acid, and sonic damage. You may purchase this manifestation up to three times, each purchase beyond the first adding 5 to your resistances.

Advanced
Just Five More Minutes: If you fail a will save against a charm or compulsion effect while asleep, you may delay it for a while, opting to sleep a little longer instead. Each round you wish to stay asleep, you must succeed on an opposed Charisma check. Both you and your opponent receive the following bonuses (HD + Charisma Modifier). If you manage to beat their check five times, the effect is completely neutralized. This check is made as a free action at the beginning of your turn and your opponent's turn.

I Dream Of You Amid The Flowers: While sleeping, you dream of your friends, safe and happy. While sleeping, choose an ally. They gain one of the following bonuses: a deflection bonus to their AC, or a bonus to their Fortitude, Reflex, or Will saving throws; this bonus is equal to your Wisdom modifier. You may take a move action to provide this bonus to a different ally, or change the type of bonus an ally is receiving. This effects characters regardless of distance, even across planes.


That looks so promising as a start! The emphasis on dreams and sleep looks really nice!

But after reading the way the Moon won its challenges, I wonder how the class can even be structured? A Mythos class based on the moon? What mechanics would it use? What type of class would it look like?

I'm obviously very interested but its hard to even think about where to start...

Lanth Sor
2016-02-04, 03:37 PM
That would be terrifying. Also I strongly agree that Fate Stay Gilgamesh embodies greed, he also embodies royalty, king of kings.

What would be defined as the bases for magic, I have; Air, Water, Earth, Fire, Cold, Acid, Electricity, Sound, force, charm, Compulsion, Foresight, far-sight, Identification, Summoning, Teleportation, Creation, Destruction, Shaping, Reconstruction, Enhancing, Animation, Reanimation, Healing, Repairing, necrotic infusion(inflict spells), Restoration(non +/- energy based), Figment, Phantasm, Emotion, Protection, Purging(dispel), Calling, Shadow, glamer, Pattern, Polymorph.

Right now for Magos I'm thinking Van Hohenheim(FMA), Xerath(LOL), Aegwynn(Warcraft), Doctor Strange(Marvel), Caster(Fate Stay Night Unlimited Blade Works), Nethys(Pathfinder God of Magic), still working on the roster.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-04, 11:35 PM
That looks so promising as a start! The emphasis on dreams and sleep looks really nice!

But after reading the way the Moon won its challenges, I wonder how the class can even be structured? A Mythos class based on the moon? What mechanics would it use? What type of class would it look like?

Well, to be fair, the Moon as described is the Moon. A Somnari is merely an Anthol of the Moon's Mythos. As an adult, fully-matured Titan, the Moon will have attained Sempiternal Mythos, and is thus at minimum almost level 30. A Titan is a microcosm, and therefore need not expend wealth to innovate Mythos; one can assume she has every Mythos that a Somnari can qualify for. The difference is a matter of raw scope.

I've actually thought about this before. Still have notes for a Lunar Mythos of a different sort, right here. Not very good, but eh, whatever. The big thing about Somnari is that they're sold as dreamers, but all we got was sleep. I actually think I remember coming up with a neat quote to help refocus it. Something like...


The Moon does not cast illusions. She is illusion. But you can't look away: what right have you, when lies tell truth?

khadgar567
2016-02-05, 06:29 AM
That would be terrifying. Also I strongly agree that Fate Stay Gilgamesh embodies greed, he also embodies royalty, king of kings.

What would be defined as the bases for magic, I have; Air, Water, Earth, Fire, Cold, Acid, Electricity, Sound, force, charm, Compulsion, Foresight, far-sight, Identification, Summoning, Teleportation, Creation, Destruction, Shaping, Reconstruction, Enhancing, Animation, Reanimation, Healing, Repairing, necrotic infusion(inflict spells), Restoration(non +/- energy based), Figment, Phantasm, Emotion, Protection, Purging(dispel), Calling, Shadow, glamer, Pattern, Polymorph.

Right now I'm thinking Van Hohenheim(FMA), Xerath(LOL), Aegwynn(Warcraft), Doctor Strange(Marvel), Caster(Fate Stay Night Unlimited Blade Works), Nethys(Pathfinder God of Magic), still working on the roster.

agreed with gilgamesh aka ultimate greed with unlimited ego works( guys ego need his own universe he is beaten in several paths( even in fanon) and bastard never changes or get the idea) and aegwynn is quite of ( dont play mmo but personaly guarantee effing a dark god shows her power very well), plus caster from unlimited blade works just wants to find a new home and love ( check sakura portion of next war)

Lanth Sor
2016-02-05, 08:26 AM
and aegwynn is quite of ( dont play mmo but personaly guarantee effing a dark god shows her power very well), plus caster from unlimited blade works just wants to find a new home and love ( check sakura portion of next war)

You are just confusing me I'm referring to mythic mages and who should be in the banner. But Aegwynn used magic to extend her life hundreds of years past her mortal existence, on top of soloing the most powerful force in the burning legion. Caster may have had simple goals in the end but she was an indisputable master mage. I'm looking for mages that look at magic and refuse convention and create their own because convention cant comprehend how to manage their power.

khadgar567
2016-02-05, 09:01 AM
You are just confusing me I'm referring to mythic mages and who should be in the banner.
yes

But Aegwynn used magic to extend her life hundreds of years past her mortal existence, on top of soloing the most powerful force in the burning legion.[/QUOTE] she do that to keep her son medivh safe from bunch of power thirsty politics obsessed mages of tirisfall
Caster may have had simple goals in the end but she was an indisputable master mage. I'm looking for mages that look at magic and refuse convention and create their own because convention cant comprehend how to manage their power. medea in that version is came from nearly age of gods so she cast with true names rather than current chant based style of UBW when

Lanth Sor
2016-02-05, 10:20 AM
I feel like where having different conversations. Are you saying they are bad options or reinforcing them as good ones?

EdroGrimshell
2016-02-05, 10:28 AM
I think this (http://grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1982) is relevant to the current topic of Mythic Hoarder

Zale
2016-02-05, 11:16 AM
That would be terrifying. Also I strongly agree that Fate Stay Gilgamesh embodies greed, he also embodies royalty, king of kings.

What would be defined as the bases for magic, I have; Air, Water, Earth, Fire, Cold, Acid, Electricity, Sound, force, charm, Compulsion, Foresight, far-sight, Identification, Summoning, Teleportation, Creation, Destruction, Shaping, Reconstruction, Enhancing, Animation, Reanimation, Healing, Repairing, necrotic infusion(inflict spells), Restoration(non +/- energy based), Figment, Phantasm, Emotion, Protection, Purging(dispel), Calling, Shadow, glamer, Pattern, Polymorph.

Right now for Magos I'm thinking Van Hohenheim(FMA), Xerath(LOL), Aegwynn(Warcraft), Doctor Strange(Marvel), Caster(Fate Stay Night Unlimited Blade Works), Nethys(Pathfinder God of Magic), still working on the roster.

Very modern. No Circe or Merlin; no book based characters either.

I wouldn't make a mythic wizard using the spell system to be honest, that defeats the point of making a mythos class. I'd probably try to create at will/limited abilties that emulated the feeling of fictional magic without using spells.

JKTrickster
2016-02-05, 11:43 AM
Well, to be fair, the Moon as described is the Moon. A Somnari is merely an Anthol of the Moon's Mythos. As an adult, fully-matured Titan, the Moon will have attained Sempiternal Mythos, and is thus at minimum almost level 30. A Titan is a microcosm, and therefore need not expend wealth to innovate Mythos; one can assume she has every Mythos that a Somnari can qualify for. The difference is a matter of raw scope.

I've actually thought about this before. Still have notes for a Lunar Mythos of a different sort, right here. Not very good, but eh, whatever. The big thing about Somnari is that they're sold as dreamers, but all we got was sleep. I actually think I remember coming up with a neat quote to help refocus it. Something like...


The Moon does not cast illusions. She is illusion. But you can't look away: what right have you, when lies tell truth?

I'm trying to get an idea for what an Anthol for the Moon should even be. If the Sun embodies Narrative-Ending-Perfection, a literal Mary Sue character, than what does the Moon represent?

Beyond the idea of sleeping and dreaming, I'm trying to brainstorm what an Anthol would even be capable of doing. Most of the stories and fluff surrounding the Moon emphasize her cleverness. The quote I like best about the moon is this one:


- a challenge delegated to the one among the Lawgivers that they feared most, not their most powerful champion, in the form of the Sun, but to the one whose truthless nature allowed her to darken the Sun's unstoppable light, to melt his unbreakable heart, and to turn aside his unimpeachable valor. The Moon was never the smartest god, but she approached her problems from angles that greater minds had never even considered, she was not the strongest, but her victory conditions rarely required her to be, and rarely aligned with her opponent's.

I know that obviously allows for Illusions (and the whole Sleeping aspect is pretty nice too). But the Moon isn't the smartest (or the most creative, which might be Design or something). The Moon is....the trickiest? What other aspects might fall under "Trickster" aside from Illusions?

vasharanpaladin
2016-02-05, 12:07 PM
I'm trying to get an idea for what an Anthol for the Moon should even be. If the Sun embodies Narrative-Ending-Perfection, a literal Mary Sue character, than what does the Moon represent?

Beyond the idea of sleeping and dreaming, I'm trying to brainstorm what an Anthol would even be capable of doing. Most of the stories and fluff surrounding the Moon emphasize her cleverness. The quote I like best about the moon is this one:



I know that obviously allows for Illusions (and the whole Sleeping aspect is pretty nice too). But the Moon isn't the smartest (or the most creative, which might be Design or something). The Moon is....the trickiest? What other aspects might fall under "Trickster" aside from Illusions?

If the Sun is the Protagonist, then the Moon is that weird koan-spouting monk who deliberately twists definitions just to make a point.

A mythos associated with the Moon might give benefits for abusing Exact Words, or for glibly lying through your teeth. No benefits that might lend themselves toward actually succeeding, but lots that prevent failure. She doesn't have to make you lose, only ensure that you don't win.

ImperatorV
2016-02-05, 12:34 PM
She doesn't have to make you lose, only ensure that you don't win.

This. Both of the moon vs sun challenges were won/forced to a draw by abusing the rules of the game. Fights against a moon Anthol should be decided before they start, frustrating, and/or inconclusive. Or the Anthol just gets what they want without needing to win. Changing, twisting, and abusing the rules of the game is a given.

vasharanpaladin
2016-02-05, 03:32 PM
This. Both of the moon vs sun challenges were won/forced to a draw by abusing the rules of the game. Fights against a moon Anthol should be decided before they start, frustrating, and/or inconclusive. Or the Anthol just gets what they want without needing to win. Changing, twisting, and abusing the rules of the game is a given.

"Talking with Rin is like playing chess with a supercomputer who does seemingly random moves as if to mock everything you know about chess. It's like that, but with human interaction. And even if I win, it feels like losing."

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-05, 06:17 PM
Anthols don't just do things, they become those things. A Somnari, therefore, does not merely become able to inflict and manipulate illusions, but actually cedes portions of her literally reality, and in turn projects dream-like unbeing into the world around her. Think Lewis Caroll's Red King, who dreams Wonderland into being. Think Azathoth, Lovecraft's Blind Idiot God that must never be allowed to wake. Think Inception or Total Recall, where the line between fantasy and reality is not just blurry, but intentionally impossible to determine.

There was a thing Xefas said, during the early discussion between him and Primal. Something to the effect of "if you looked at the Moon with a True Seeing effect going, I don't think you'd see anything at all". That's what I based my idea on. She's not only the trickiest - she is a literal walking, talking trick upon your every sense and perspective, both real and hypothetical. Her words are no more manipulations than statements of the obvious. She really is only as cruel as you would be to yourself. She really is only as kind as you would be to your worst enemy.

I don't see the Sun as Narrative-Shattering perfection. Perfection is the Empyrean's job description. The Sun's nature is one of never backing down, never letting oneself be bested or broken. Never allowing 'you' to be redefined, corrupted, or otherwise be made less real or meaningful. That's why I see the Moon as being less real, less solid and pure, but somehow no less true. Like the silvery sea she turns, carelessly and yet like clockwork, she doesn't fight - not because she has a brilliant plan, but because she honestly has no ego to defend. No purity to question. No true self to unmake. She just... is? I think?

Jakman217
2016-02-07, 01:21 AM
So I remade my thread for my class to make it easier to access for people. It should be relatively clean.
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?477620-3-5-Base-Class-quot-A-King-without-an-Army-is-just-a-Man-in-a-Funny-Hat-quot&p=20393871#post20393871

ThreadNecro5
2016-02-09, 06:41 PM
I think this (http://grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1982) is relevant to the current topic of Mythic Hoarder

Indeed it is. thank you for posting this, I can use some of it as the opening quote for the class. Also the guy may have found a place on the banner.


in other news of the class, I have put the 'GP=EXP' class feature into working order, just need advice on weather the GP cost for the buffs are right. for reference the class has wizard BAB, all bad saves, and is only proficient in light armour and simple weapons.

Money is Power
From 1st level a Chrimatia ceases to gain experience points and instead whenever they would they instead gain an equal quantity of GP. Similarly when they would lose Experience points they instead loose GP. Functionally for all purposes the Chrimatia uses their total GP as their Experience points. Additionally a Chrimatia gains a natural amour bonus to AC equal to their Charisma modifier. Should the character gain a level of Chrimatia, their current total of experience points are immediately converted into GP.

At 1st level a Chrimatia may use gold to increase the BAB, AC, bonus on initiative rolls, and saving throw bonuses. For saving throws and BAB, it costs 500 GP per +1 until the bonus equals half your Chrimatia level, after which point it costs 1000GP per +1. Exceeding your Chrimatia level costs 2000GP per +1. Increasing the bonus on initiative rolls and raising AC costs 1000GP per +1 until the total raises equal your level, after which it costs 2500GP per +1.
At 3rd level a Chrimatia may ‘invest’ their GP into providing a permanent untyped bonus to their Ability Scores. For an Ability Score that is lower than their Chrimatia level it costs 1000GP per point. To increase a score so that it is beyond double your Chrimatia level it costs 3000GP per point, until you have done so a number of times equal to your level, at which point the cost increases to 6000 per point. When increasing Ability Scores with this class feature do not take temporary changes such as ability damage/drain, or temporary spells, into account.

At 5th level a Chrimatia may turn any item they own into a masterwork version of itself for half that items cost. Additionally they may then enchant their equipment as if they had the Craft Magic Arms and Armour feat, and they may craft magic rings, staffs, and Wondrous items as if they met all the prerequisites to do so. Items enchanted/created this way do not have any magical properties when used by a non-Chrimatia, appear more ornate and embellished than normal, and may be completed with only a minute of work which must be preformed inside the Chrimatia’s vault. You are automaticly proficient with any weapon or amour that is given an enchantment bonus by you.

Gold expended any manner originating form this Class Feature does nor visibility disappear from the quantity that appears within your vault but is otherwise unavailable to you and is not treated as existing. In order to ‘invest’ GP using this class feature, you must spend a minute of work which is preformed inside the Chrimatia’s vault.

Lanth Sor
2016-02-10, 12:17 PM
So I've been looking over the Archikos and the Eoteras trying to work the two myths together in and I noticed one key thing while one seems to be about innocence destroyed the other is immortal embodiment of nature. So I'm trying to update the banner for the Archikos and running into a brick wall. I have Orb(Incarnations of Immortality), Iceman(X-Men), Thrall(Warcraft), Maleficent(really she fits both classes well)

Defiantnight
2016-02-10, 12:25 PM
So I've been looking over the Archikos and the Eoteras trying to work the two myths together in and I noticed one key thing while one seems to be about innocence destroyed the other is immortal embodiment of nature. So I'm trying to update the banner for the Archikos and running into a brick wall. I have Orb(Incarnations of Immortality), Iceman(X-Men), Thrall(Warcraft), Maleficent(really she fits both classes well)

Poison Ivy? Kinda? In some versions she fits that, she has a lot of retcons.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-10, 04:55 PM
So I've been looking over the Archikos and the Eoteras trying to work the two myths together

They are actually pretty different Mythos. Best of luck. Also: Thrall is already in the Kathodos banner, so you're kind of cheating there.

Lanth Sor
2016-02-10, 06:57 PM
I just re read the fluff for the Eoteras and realized it was basically natures son who was the patron titan. And Thrall is just the best example of communing with nature out there. Totally forgot but Poison Ivy is on the roster.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-10, 07:57 PM
I just re read the fluff for the Eoteras and realized it was basically natures son who was the patron titan. And Thrall is just the best example of communing with nature out there. Totally forgot but Poison Ivy is on the roster.

Thrall isn't even the best example from Warcraft. Malfurion Stormrage is. Nor would either of those be my first choice. That title goes to DOTA 2's Rooftrellan, followed by my second choice, Disney's Tarzan.

khadgar567
2016-02-11, 10:58 AM
Thrall isn't even the best example from Warcraft. Malfurion Stormrage is. Nor would either of those be my first choice. That title goes to DOTA 2's Rooftrellan, followed by my second choice, Disney's Tarzan.
sorry mate but jerkfurion is really bad choice only think he did is act like lawful idiot while trall reforms all of horde from top to bottom

roko10
2016-02-11, 02:51 PM
Thrall isn't even the best example from Warcraft. Malfurion Stormrage is. Nor would either of those be my first choice. That title goes to DOTA 2's Rooftrellan, followed by my second choice, Disney's Tarzan.

Not Nature's Profit Prophet/Furion?

Lanth Sor
2016-02-11, 05:18 PM
Thrall is basically the pinnacle of becoming being both one with nature and the legendary warrior. Malfurion seems like a natural choice but he just seems to fall short of what i intend. Previously i had Ysera and Malfurion i think Ysera will stay.

Tarzan is nothing but a feral child with no special abilities hes just the weird kid that grew up in the jungle. So if you were pitching barbian that became one with the land in the hunter sense or something of that nature hed be right up that ally but this is one with nature not though modern means but truely becoming nature itself.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-11, 05:41 PM
sorry mate but jerkfurion is really bad choice only think he did is act like lawful idiot while trall reforms all of horde from top to bottom

I never said he was a good person, or a good leader. (or that anything post-Vanilla WoW is well-written) I only said that he is the greatest druid who ever lived, who trained at the foot of the Demigod of Nature, Cenarius, and whose guidance is implied to be the source of all Night Elven druidism. His 10'000-years of pilgrimage within the Emerald Dream can speak for itself.

But those are all excuses, I suppose. Lots of characters have a list of accolades that could be attributed to them. The real reason I picked him is because his command of nature is clear and ever-present. This is a guy who tells the trees what to do, and they just get up and do it. If he stumbles across a ten-millenia-old magic bridge, he doesn't fumble around looking for a key. He just tells it 'Do you know who I am!?' and it activates itself. That kind of rule over natural forces is what I think of when I think 'Mythic Druid,' so I'll admit my position's subjectivity.

Tarzan was picked for much the same reason. 'King of the Jungle' and all that.

7th son of sons
2016-02-11, 05:56 PM
One with Nature AND a Legendary Warrior? Off the top of my head: Kraven the Hunter (Marvel), San (Princess Mononoke), Udyr (League of Legends), Toph (Legend of Korra), The Na'Vi (Avatar).

Lanth Sor
2016-02-11, 06:28 PM
I guess I don't know how to say what I mean. I'm not looking for druids, as i see druids they are simultaneously discovering nature while they interact with it and protect it. This feels more in line with the proteans story. What I want are examples of nature, that are nature, they don't need to learn about nature because they are it inherently. This is why Yesra is a better choice over Cenarius, Thrall, or Malfurion. Looked up ROOFTRELLEN but he doesn't seem to quite fit the fantasy of the class to me. The Nav'hi are close but feels like they are missing a key element.

VoodooPaladin
2016-02-11, 08:18 PM
What I want are examples of nature, that are nature, they don't need to learn about nature because they are it inherently.

Well. You're going to need all of the luck, then, because that isn't exactly common. But I'll see what I can do.

Okay. The Scion of Mana (https://i.ytimg.com/vi/5W0S7Q8qEcI/hqdefault.jpg) is the final boss of Children of Mana. Anise (http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/mana/images/e/eb/Anise-_Dawn_of_mana.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20121206115718) might also fit, but I'd need to look more into it. It's possible the Mana Goddess at the end of Legend of Mana would fit better, but all I have to go on is this Youtube video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DkqUnNjXIw).

Captain Planet and whichever Gaia-expy you prefer are just about the only others I could dig up. Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

EdroGrimshell
2016-02-11, 10:24 PM
DC's Swamp Thing

Durazno
2016-02-11, 11:26 PM
How about Omnath? (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=197759)

Lanth Sor
2016-02-11, 11:42 PM
Well. You're going to need all of the luck, then, because that isn't exactly common. But I'll see what I can do.

Okay. The Scion of Mana (https://i.ytimg.com/vi/5W0S7Q8qEcI/hqdefault.jpg) is the final boss of Children of Mana. Anise (http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/mana/images/e/eb/Anise-_Dawn_of_mana.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20121206115718) might also fit, but I'd need to look more into it. It's possible the Mana Goddess at the end of Legend of Mana would fit better, but all I have to go on is this Youtube video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DkqUnNjXIw).

Captain Planet and whichever Gaia-expy you prefer are just about the only others I could dig up. Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

Thanx for the mana suggestion it would filled my last slot, but i cant find a pic of the goddess..


DC's Swamp Thing

If I didn't have poison ivy he would be on there.

I pulled my old roster back up and updated it. Currently I have Cernunnos(Celtic God), Marah(Dawngate), Maleficent, Ysera(Warcraft), Poison Ivy(DC), Gaia(Marvel), Hanna(The Tithe: penny arcade), Orb(Incarnations of Immortality)


http://i.imgur.com/bmK8NTT.jpg

spwack
2016-02-16, 08:08 PM
Xefas (or anyone), I'm very keen to paly with Mythos characters, but less keen to deal with all the baggage that is 3.5e. Would you recommend Exalted? Which edition? And how difficult would it be to port back the classes?

Slawth13
2016-02-16, 09:41 PM
Back again with some progress report on the Setgetzen.

I ended up going along with the idea of branching Mythos paths, eventually settling on tagging Different Mythos with the [Growth] and [Burn] tags. [Growth] tags tend to indicate a Mythos that aids the Setgetzen's entire Collective in some way, or that help expand the story of the Mind Flower's original tale. Mythos with the [Burn] tag indicate more offensively-oriented, self-targeting abilities, or ones that branch off to explore the searing madness that has haunted the Celosia since it was assaulted.

I also finally settled on a solution to my Shintai problem, and there are now two of them for the Setgetzen, one for both [Burn] and [Growth].

Roots Ingrained in Thought Shintai

Prerequisites: Telepathic Talent Transferal, Space-Transcending Cerebral Positioning, Boundary-Dissolving

Collective Cognition, 2 other Mythos with the [Growth] descriptor.

[Growth]

The Celosia was a part of all things’ minds, and never needed to be separate from them, for it was them. You too gain this ability.

Firstly, the number of creatures that you may have in your collective is doubled. Secondly, you are aware of all information that the creatures in your collective are aware of; they cannot keep secrets from you, and you have access to all of their memories. Thirdly, you share the senses of every member of your collective, and experience all emotions and sensations that they do simultaneously.
However, taking this Mythos renders your physical body immobile, and you become rooted the spot you are standing at when you acquire this Mythos. You no longer require food, water, sleep, or any other such petty mortal needs. Your body never ages, and is effectively immortal – you can be killed, but you will never contract illness or die of natural causes. You may continue to utilize class features, spells, psionic powers, and any other ability that does not require you to physically move in any way other than speaking.


Rise From Rosen Ashes Shintai

Prerequisites: 4 other Mythos with the [Burn] descriptor, Psychometabolic Regeneration Hideaway

[Burn]

Found in the minds of all living things, the Celosia retreated deep into the collective unconscious when it was seared. You have a similar ability, though you turn it to a different purpose.
Upon taking this Mythos, your body bursts into flame and evaporates. Your consciousness then occupies the nearest target of your choice. Your feats, mental ability scores, class features, skills, and all other powers overwrite those of your new host. For all mechanical purposes, this character is you with a new body. However, every week, your host makes a Will save with a DC equal to your Setgetzen level + your Intelligence modifier.

Should they succeed on this save, your mind is immediately expelled from their body, and they become immune to possession in this fashion. You are also expelled from their body should they die. In order to possess a new host, you must choose a target to make the same Will save as a target who is attempting to expel you. Should they fail, you gain control of their body. You may only spend a number of days equal to your Intelligence modifier without a host, or your consciousness will dissipate and you will die.

In addition to all of the above, should you use Consciousness-Consuming Conflagration while possessing somebody, you may choose to take Con drain or burn instead of Int.


Also, in case I never included it with any of my earlier posts, the Celosia's story.

What is a story but an idea, a thought given room to run and leap and bound away from its own restraints? Even as the earliest Titans came to be, their very essence, the very idea of thought made flesh, was the seed of yet another idea. As the Titans multiplied and minds echoed raucously throughout existence, that seed grew, and eventually bloomed into the Celosia. Rooted in the thoughts and minds of all of creation, the Celosia flourished, and spread its branches across the collective unconscious of the universe, drinking deep of the ideas and emotions of all living things.

Some, however, felt as though the Celosia was an invader, a parasite which infected the minds of others, instead of the offspring of flourishing minds through the cosmos. And so they dared to cut at its tendrils, and in response the Celosia struck back, lighting their minds ablaze and tearing them asunder. The Celosia’s roots were still ingrained in the minds of these maddened creatures, and the Titan trembled, for such brokenness was unknown to it, and was as poison to it. The Celosia retreated then, hiding itself away, the bitter taste of scorching insanity still fresh on its tongue; a taste from which it would never escape, not truly.

The children of the Celosia partake of their mother’s fruit, tapping into not just the minds of others but also themselves, honing their thoughts into roaring pyres of psionic power and amassing the might of the collective unconscious. Master mentalists, tacticians, and psychic warriors, Setgetzens are a living testament to the strength of mind over matter.

Defiantnight
2016-02-17, 04:01 PM
Quite interesting... a shintai in which you choose immobile immortality or possession-hopping with a chance of death if your host is in the middle of nowhere.

Edit: Is that literally rooted, or can people carry you around?

Slawth13
2016-02-17, 10:12 PM
I was thinking literally rooted. However, they're still able to influence events through their Collective. One of the Setgetzen's Excellencies will allow it to learn a psionic power, and I intend to give the class the ability to manifest powers through members of their Collective, meaning they'll be able to use their Collective members as conduits for their psionic powers even though the Setgetzen itself will be locked into a single physical location.

Lanth Sor
2016-02-18, 01:44 PM
All it makes me think of is the leader of namek

khadgar567
2016-02-18, 02:16 PM
I was thinking literally rooted. However, they're still able to influence events through their Collective. One of the Setgetzen's Excellencies will allow it to learn a psionic power, and I intend to give the class the ability to manifest powers through members of their Collective, meaning they'll be able to use their Collective members as conduits for their psionic powers even though the Setgetzen itself will be locked into a single physical location.


All it makes me think of is the leader of namek
or from warhammer emperor of moronkind

spwack
2016-02-18, 06:27 PM
That last line of the Burn Shintai really interested me. In a crowded room, I can see the Anthol jumping from host to host, draining Con left and right (for power points I'm assuming), before leaving in whichever host is last. Leaving the building full of skeletal husks, mind and body fried as one.

Could you make it so hosts killed due to Con drain burst into psychic flame? Because that would be sick.

Slawth13
2016-02-18, 06:46 PM
All it makes me think of is the leader of namek

It's vaguely similar.


That last line of the Burn Shintai really interested me. In a crowded room, I can see the Anthol jumping from host to host, draining Con left and right (for power points I'm assuming), before leaving in whichever host is last. Leaving the building full of skeletal husks, mind and body fried as one.

Could you make it so hosts killed due to Con drain burst into psychic flame? Because that would be sick.

Well, CCC, the Mythos referenced by that line, causes a giant burst of psionic fire centered on the user. So that's pretty much exactly how it works already. Normally you take Int drain or burn (depending on whether or not you use the advanced manifestation), but if you have RFRAS, that'd be the end of you since you're just a free-floating consciousness. So I gave the option to torch your host in exchange for big damage instead of self-inflicted braindeath. It's still risky because there's a chance you'll burn up the nearest available replacement host, but what's life without a little danger?

EDIT
The thread is up (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?479033-Mythos-%93What-You-Think-You-Become-%94).

ThreadNecro5
2016-02-20, 06:54 PM
Just put together the soul-owning mythos, not entirely satisfied but it's a start. was also hoping for a similar mythos for owning land but I got delayed.

I'm thinking around Legendary tier?

-Soul Collecting Mythos-
You may now acquire the souls of creatures, storing them in your Vault in the same way as other valuables. A soul is worth an amount of GP equal to the WBL of its original possessor (taking into account all HD) but the price can be up to 50% higher for notable individuals.
You may gain a soul either by having it given to you willingly (or through trade) or by purchasing it, which is accomplished through finding a creature which is willing to sell their soul and offering an amount of GP equal to the souls value and seeing if the creature accepts. Should the creature not accept this deal you may make a DC20 Diplomacy check to persuade them otherwise.

A souls owner who knows the nature of their property may sense its original bearer’s location at all times (getting an exact sense of direction and distance), may communicate with the bearer as if they had telepathy that operated over planar boundaries and with infinite range, and the owner(s) may one per week use an effect that functions as a CL 20 Geas spell which may not saved against at will. If the GP value of a soul is traded between several creatures they all may make an opposed Charisma check should they collectively disagree on using this geas.

A soul may only be traded willingly without magical compulsion (the creature does not however have to know they seriously did so, a soul given in jest is still a soul given.). Once in your possession the soul takes any form you wish, with examples including statues of the being they are form, coins stamped with the face of the souls originator, or even poker chips if the Chrimatia so wished. Should a creature die when their soul is not owned by them have their mind trapped within the form the soul takes, and may see and/or talk should their owner wish them to. If you convert a soul into its value in GP, you may return the value in coins back into a soul as a free action.

On gaining this mythos your own soul is deposited into your Vault, it is always worth 50% more than a creature of your HD’s soul should be worth. Any class feature that you spend the value of your own soul on, and which physically does not result in the loss of gold from your Vault, may be refunded by spending an hour in your hoard.

Advanced Manifestations:
Buyout
You may forcefully buy a soul. This costs an amount equal to the souls value and its owner must make a will save with a +2 bonus (this is doubled should another being have a strong claim on the soul, such as on most divine spellcasters, or on those who have made some pacts with a fiend). On a failed save you gain full ownership of the soul.

-name-
You may geas someone whose soul you (and only you) own at will, and by concentrating you may see through the senses of any soul you own (you may only so this with one soul at a time). Additionally should you have the ‘Gaze of Greed’ Mythos, you do not need to concentrate to use your senses and may do so with all souls you own at a time.

Free Enterprise
You gain 1% of all GP earned by should you own. Should this ownership be shared, this GP is shared by a fraction equal to the amount of the souls value in GP each party owns.

And a couple of Excellences:
Honest Pay
Whenever you preform a task for a being whom you is not a ally of yours without expectation of a reward and the person you do the task for would not plan to give you one suitable for the task, they must pass a will save or provide you with a suitable reward that is within their means to give. You may take a DC20 diplomacy check to steer this rewards towards a form you wish, but its specific nature is chosen by the being giving the rewards. A being will always give you a reward comparable to the task, even if it would leave them to go hungry, homeless, or otherwise inconvenienced or impelled.

Bribing Fate
Whenever you make a roll, you may pay to increase the result of the roll. Before rolling you choose hoe much GP you wish to spend for a bonus, with each 50GP granting a +1 bonus on the resulting roll. This cannot take the roll over the maximum it could natural roll (so for example if you put 400HP into a d20 roll, and get an 18, the roll will be treated as a twenty before other modifiers). This bonus on the roll is treated as the natural roll is all ways, so a d20 that is made to become a twenty is treated as a natural twenty in all regards.


Another thing I came of mind of, there is a couple of Kreikiri mythos for symbiont stuff that I never of officially added and were left in an incomplete state when by old laptop broke. So I've whipped the remnants I could find into a somewhat usable state from what I could remember, and would like an opinion, both mythos being fantastic tier.

Symbiotic Creature
Perquisite: Monster-Making Beast-Lord (Flesh-Altering Master)

This Mythos unlocks the new ‘Symbiotic Creature’ Feature for Created Creatures.
Symbiotic creature
This Feature is available to Created Creatures with the Symbiont subtype only (see Fiend Folio p.215). A Creature with this feature may select any of its Features, Augments and/or Evolutions; these selected traits become classified as Symbiotic Traits. These traits are still considered and treated as the type of trait they normally are for all purposes, including limitations on the total number of times it can be selected (for example, a Symbiont created by a 5th level Kreikiri with Stable Implement of Empowerment can select the Fast Healing mutation a maximum of twice, making one, none, or both into Symbiotic Traits, while any not Symbiotic would apply to the Symbiont itself), the classification only has an effect within the effects of this Feature. The graft point cost of any Symbiotic Traits when creating the creature is reduced by -1, to a minimum of one point. When attached to a host, by the Creature taking a full-round action, the Creature fills a single magic item slot (which one is chosen by the Kreikiri upon creation). Any magic items placed in that slot have no effect.

Attaching to a creature is a full round action performed by the Symbiont, unattaching is also a full round action performed by the Symbiont. The Host may try to forcibly remove the Symbiont as a full round action, in which the host and Symbiont make an opposed grapple check, with the Symbiont calculating its bonus as if it was one size category larger than its host (it should be noted that when the Symbiont notices what its host is doing a personality conflict will likely immediately occur, forcing the host to make the save before the grapple check). If the host wins the check then they successfully pull out the Symbiont, dealing 1d4 constitution damage to themselves, and depositing the Creature into an adjacent space.

A Symbiotic Creature is unable to make use of any of its Symbiotic Traits, only providing them to an attached host as if they were grafts (the Augments of Features selected as Symbiotic Traits are similarly affected). While bound to a host the Symbiont is only able to take purely mental actions unless it can gain control of the host through a personality conflict (see Fiend Folio p.215).

A mindless Symbiont is incapable of taking mental actions (it is mindless), however, when it is in control it will generally go on the rampage, as per a mindless creature from ‘Storm-of-cuts life altering flurry’. The host is fully aware but cannot act in any way when the Symbiont is in control. On creation the Symbiont automatically gains a single Character Trait (see Unearthed Arcana) that both they and their host benefits from, and that helps determine when a personality conflict would occur, e.g. an Aggressive Symbiont might provoke a personality conflict if the host stopped attacking a still living foe, or a Cautious Symbiont might provoke a personality conflict if the host rushed ahead without taking care for to spot traps.

A Symbiotic creatures' Ego score is only modified by special qualities and special attacks granted through Symbiotic Traits (as above), as well as increasing by +1 per class level the Symbiont possesses. A Symbiont created through this Mythos has its Ego score halved against anyone with levels in Kreikiri as it instinctively submits to even a shard of the Kyniteros.

Augments:
Universal Trait Cost 2
Select a single Feature, Augment, or Mutation that is a Symbiotic Trait. The Symbiont may benefit from it as it was not a Symbiotic Trait when not attached to a host. The trait selected cannot be one that requires activation or uses an action (so a Breath Weapon Mutation cannot be selected but a Flesh Feature or a Fast Healing Mutation can).


Singularity of Life
Perquisites: Monster-Making Beast-Lord (Flesh-Altering Master), Symbiotic Creature

This Mythos unlocks additional Augments for the ‘Symbiotic Creature’ Feature.

[]iMeat Suit[/i] Cost 30% the creatures total cost before taking into account this augment.

When a Symbiotic Creature attaches to a host of their size category or smaller, the Symbiont fills all magic item slots on the host (the host is seen as being somehow enveloped by the Symbiont, such as using it as a suit), taking a full-round action to attach or detach. While functioning as host, the host is more fully enhanced by the Symbiont, with the following effects: Symbiotic Traits are applied to the host as normal, movement capabilities are determined using the higher of the Hosts or the Symbionts, use the higher of the hosts or the Symbionts Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution ability scores and Natural Armor bonus, and use the higher of the hosts or the Creatures BAB. The host also gains the traits (other than HD size, BAB, skill ranks, and saving throw progression) of the Symbiont’s creature type if the Symbiont is at least one size larger than the host, and any feats the Symbiont possesses which the host qualifies for (after taking into account the modifiers from the Meat Suit, and ignoring ‘must be taken at 1st level’ prerequisites).

As long as the Symbiont has one or more hit points, the host is protected from harm. Damage in excess of that which would reduce the host to less than one hit point is instead transferred to the symbiont. This damage is transferred 1 point at a time, meaning that as soon as the symbiont is reduced to a number of hit points capable of killing it, all excess damage remains with the host. Effects that cause death but not damage are unaffected by this ability.

These additional shared qualities increase the Symbionts Ego score by 6 (in addition to Ego from Symbiotic Traits, ability bonuses, etc.). When in control the Symbiont may freely use the hosts class features, feats, etc., sharing uses per day.

Should the host be Dominated, Charmed, Confused, or otherwise mentally incapacitated, the Symbiont can make a Will save versus the effect (even if such a thing would normally be denied) to allow itself to take over. The control duration is as per normal (24 hours).

Parasite: Cost: 20
The Symbiont’s Ego score increases by +2. Additionally when attached to a host and in control after a personality conflict, it may restore up to a number of hit points to itself equal to it’s HD as a free action, but only once per round. Doing this deals an equal number of points of damage to the host. Ability damage may also be removed instead of healing, with each point of such damage dealing ten HP of damage to the host.

EdroGrimshell
2016-02-21, 01:57 PM
Just put together the soul-owning mythos, not entirely satisfied but it's a start. was also hoping for a similar mythos for owning land but I got delayed.

I'm thinking around Legendary tier?

-Soul Collecting Mythos-
You may now acquire the souls of creatures, storing them in your Vault in the same way as other valuables. A soul is worth an amount of GP equal to the WBL of its original possessor (taking into account all HD) but the price can be up to 50% higher for notable individuals.
You may gain a soul either by having it given to you willingly (or through trade) or by purchasing it, which is accomplished through finding a creature which is willing to sell their soul and offering an amount of GP equal to the souls value and seeing if the creature accepts. Should the creature not accept this deal you may make a DC20 Diplomacy check to persuade them otherwise.

A souls owner who knows the nature of their property may sense its original bearer’s location at all times (getting an exact sense of direction and distance), may communicate with the bearer as if they had telepathy that operated over planar boundaries and with infinite range, and the owner(s) may one per week use an effect that functions as a CL 20 Geas spell which may not saved against at will. If the GP value of a soul is traded between several creatures they all may make an opposed Charisma check should they collectively disagree on using this geas.

A soul may only be traded willingly without magical compulsion (the creature does not however have to know they seriously did so, a soul given in jest is still a soul given.). Once in your possession the soul takes any form you wish, with examples including statues of the being they are form, coins stamped with the face of the souls originator, or even poker chips if the Chrimatia so wished. Should a creature die when their soul is not owned by them have their mind trapped within the form the soul takes, and may see and/or talk should their owner wish them to. If you convert a soul into its value in GP, you may return the value in coins back into a soul as a free action.

On gaining this mythos your own soul is deposited into your Vault, it is always worth 50% more than a creature of your HD’s soul should be worth. Any class feature that you spend the value of your own soul on, and which physically does not result in the loss of gold from your Vault, may be refunded by spending an hour in your hoard.

Advanced Manifestations:
Buyout
You may forcefully buy a soul. This costs an amount equal to the souls value and its owner must make a will save with a +2 bonus (this is doubled should another being have a strong claim on the soul, such as on most divine spellcasters, or on those who have made some pacts with a fiend). On a failed save you gain full ownership of the soul.

-name-
You may geas someone whose soul you (and only you) own at will, and by concentrating you may see through the senses of any soul you own (you may only so this with one soul at a time). Additionally should you have the ‘Gaze of Greed’ Mythos, you do not need to concentrate to use your senses and may do so with all souls you own at a time.

Free Enterprise
You gain 1% of all GP earned by should you own. Should this ownership be shared, this GP is shared by a fraction equal to the amount of the souls value in GP each party owns.

And a couple of Excellences:
Honest Pay
Whenever you preform a task for a being whom you is not a ally of yours without expectation of a reward and the person you do the task for would not plan to give you one suitable for the task, they must pass a will save or provide you with a suitable reward that is within their means to give. You may take a DC20 diplomacy check to steer this rewards towards a form you wish, but its specific nature is chosen by the being giving the rewards. A being will always give you a reward comparable to the task, even if it would leave them to go hungry, homeless, or otherwise inconvenienced or impelled.

Bribing Fate
Whenever you make a roll, you may pay to increase the result of the roll. Before rolling you choose hoe much GP you wish to spend for a bonus, with each 50GP granting a +1 bonus on the resulting roll. This cannot take the roll over the maximum it could natural roll (so for example if you put 400HP into a d20 roll, and get an 18, the roll will be treated as a twenty before other modifiers). This bonus on the roll is treated as the natural roll is all ways, so a d20 that is made to become a twenty is treated as a natural twenty in all regards.

What about being able to purchase skill points, ability scores, HP, saving throw bonuses, BAB, etc. or even purchasing abilities, which you can then use yourself.

ThreadNecro5
2016-03-01, 05:13 PM
What about being able to purchase skill points, ability scores, HP, saving throw bonuses, BAB, etc. or even purchasing abilities, which you can then use yourself.

kind of like how being can offer some of their own power in the Kathodos' Steam-and-Dust Showdown mythos, but as a more direct trade/sale? I am planning that as a alter mythos, and have been slacking in writing the class from designing stuff for a homebrew setting (I cannot stop thinking of new races).

Aside from that idea I also have a land-buying mythos planned that will give the ability to manipulate owned patches of land. I'm also stuck on thinking of smaller scale things for Exeptional Mythos.


finally as a general update I will add that the Kreikiri content in a few days assuming nobody as any complaints about it.

commander panda
2016-03-03, 12:27 PM
i…i just realized this thead was here… i thought the mythos system had died… so happy right now:smallfrown:

ThreadNecro5
2016-03-03, 05:22 PM
I have a couple of new Chrimatia Exceptional Mythos written, as usual posting them here for checking that their are no glairing problems. the first one has a Manifestation I don't have a name for yet, and the second I am still thinking of Manifestations for.


Auriferous Hoardmasters Corpulence
Prerequisites:-
You gain DR5/-. Additionally whenever you take damage you may prevent some portion of it by paying 5gp per point of damage you wish to prevent.

Basic Manifestations
Company Health Plan
You may pay to prevent the damage of any creature within 60ft as if they were yourself, taking any other manifestations into account.

Purifying Metals
You may pay 50GP to prevent points of ability damage and drain.

-name-
The cost to prevent a point of damage reduces by 1GP. You may take this Manifestation multiple times through the expenditure of Mythos points, you may not reduce the cost to below 1GP.

Sign of success
Any creature who possesses less money than you (spread across all their and your possessions) is naturally as their attitude towards you begin one step closer to Helpful, and you gain an additional +2 bonus on Diplamocy and Bluff checks to convince them to preform a specific course of action. Most Chrimatia with this Mythos also have their feature subtly shift so that they look like a ‘successful’ individual according to their home society and personal outlook, which can include appearing more physically fit from a rugged lifestyle, putting on weight as if from years of decadence, or gaining features that would be recognized as ‘noble’ and such.
Advanced Manifestations

I also have added some Manifestations to Gaze of greed, posting them here:
Gaze of Greed
Prerequisites: -

You may spend a minute polishing a gold piece in order to copy the effect of a Scrying spell (the gold piece is used as the focus for the effect). For every 50GP you spend when using the effect, the target takes a -1 penalty on the will save.

Additionally as a move action, you may place a coin within your eye, embedding it inside. While a coin is so embedded you gain low light vision. Should you already possess low light vision you instead gain 60ft of Darkvision, should you possess both your Darkvision is extended by an additional 60ft.

Advanced Manifestations
See your Fortune
When using the Scrying ability of this Mythos you may treat yourself as standing on the space of the Scrying sensor whenever it would benefit you. Additionally you may copy the following spells when Scrying on someone, and they have a 100% chance of functioning through the sensor: Detect Chaos, Detect Evil, Detect Good, Detect Law, Detect Magic, and Message.

I Want to see the World
When using Scrying with this Mythos the sensor gains the benefits of True Seeing with a 10ft range, the effects duration becomes infinite (lasting as long as you conscious), and the sensor is not confined to following the initial target, and instead it may move around as you will it, including through solid barriers apart from those made of force.

And finally some Excellences:
-name-[.b]
Whenever you deal damage to a being you may transport a sum of valuables whose GP cost equal to your level or the amount of damage dealt (whichever is higher) x10 from that beings possessions to your Vault.

[b]Eternal Profiteering
You may safely consume money. One GP functions as enough food and water for 24 hours. Additionally whenever you consume GP you may choose to either add a day to your maximum lifespan (to an age category of your choice) or to reverse your aging by a day and thus appear younger with a sufficiency high consumption. One you have aged to a point when you would gain bonuses to an ability score you gain that bonus, and when not old enough to take penalties to your ability scores such such penalties you currently suffer/would otherwise suffer from are removed.

Take the Glory
Any bonus a creature would gain on a Sense Motive check against a lie to convince someone you preformed a specified action is not benefited from, and instead you gain that as a bonus to your Bluff Check. In addition, should the creature believe the lie, any creature they tell the lie to who lacks significant evidence against it being the truth naturally believes them, as does anyone who they tell, and so on.

Bask in Magical Force
Any spell that targets a space or individual creature within 60ft of you may , as an immediate action, be re-targeted to effect you or the space you stand (as appropriate). Should you fill more than one space choose which one is targeted. The spell otherwise functions as normal. After using this effect you may not use it again for 1d4 rounds.

At Least One of Everything
You may at all times purchase any item you have sufficient GP to buy. The item appears in any space within 30ft, and in whatever state you so chose so, for example, a bear trap could appear set up. The actual purchase of the item is a swift action. You may made a Slight of Hand check opposed by viewers Spot checks to place this item in secrecy.

Look at the value!
You pass appraise checks to determine an items value without need to roll. Additional you gain a +2 bonus to convince others that an item’s cost is different than what it truly is.

Defiantnight
2016-03-04, 03:30 AM
For the unnamed one, perhaps Tax Cuts?

Kapskaen
2016-03-04, 05:02 AM
The more I see of the Chrimatia Mythos, the more I'm reminded of The President of The Company, from the korean manga 'The Gamer'. If there isn't a Resurrection Mythos called Life Insurance, I think I'll be disappointed.

On the whole though, I like the idea of a character that is literally fueled by money.

gkathellar
2016-03-04, 08:54 PM
On reflection, it seems like certain excellencies (notably Heroes' Misfortune, Primal [Skill] Perfection, and Unthinking [Skill] Comprehension from the Teramach) have little in particular to do with the class they're attached to, and should really have equivalents in the excellency lists of other classes. Is there any particular reason this isn't the case, or is it just an oversight?