First time fighter in pathfinder

[JeepthingJim]

I am playing a half-giant two handed fighter. Starting at first level. 20 strength. Wielding a large greatsword (3d6 damage). I've laid out my feats till level 10. Any input or advice would be appreciated.
Feats are:
Power attack
Furious focus
Weapon focus
Toughness
Weapon specialization
Iron will
Vital strike
Cornugon smash
Hurtful
Improved critical
Intimidating prowess
Thank you

[Tuvarkz]

The two-handed archetype is outright terrible for fighter. You trade what minimal flexibility you had in combat for just being able to land big hits with two-handed melee weapons; something the baseline fighter is already good at doing. You don't need Toughness, HP you should have enough with 14 Con. Take instead the Lore Warden Archetype, which gives you far more utility, and a similar CMB bonus for maneuvers.
You should also grab the Weapon Master's Handbook, as some of the new tools in there (Particularly the Weapon Training group replacers) give you far more versatility in combat.
If your DM is allowing DSP content in the form of the Half-Giant, you might also want to ask about Path of War content, particularly the Myrmidon archetype for the Fighter.
Also, in regards to weapon an 18-20 critical range (2d6 damage as Large) Falchion or (2d8 damage as Large) Nodachi will be far better than the 19-20 Greatsword in the long run.

[JeepthingJim]

The two-handed archetype is outright terrible for fighter. You trade what minimal flexibility you had in combat for just being able to land big hits with two-handed melee weapons; something the baseline fighter is already good at doing. You don't need Toughness, HP you should have enough with 14 Con. Take instead the Lore Warden Archetype, which gives you far more utility, and a similar CMB bonus for maneuvers.
You should also grab the Weapon Master's Handbook, as some of the new tools in there (Particularly the Weapon Training group replacers) give you far more versatility in combat.
If your DM is allowing DSP content in the form of the Half-Giant, you might also want to ask about Path of War content, particularly the Myrmidon archetype for the Fighter.
Also, in regards to weapon an 18-20 critical range (2d6 damage as Large) Falchion or (2d8 damage as Large) Nodachi will be far better than the 19-20 Greatsword in the long run.

Wrestled with the falchion. Thought the greatsword might be better for vital strike. Thanks for tips

[Gnaeus]

If your DM is allowing DSP content in the form of the Half-Giant, you might also want to ask about Path of War content, particularly the Myrmidon archetype for the Fighter.

Of course, if PoW is in play, you just want to take warlord levels (or Daevic levels, also from DSP). Even a couple level dip into warlord is tremendously better than 2 more levels in fighter, and likely completely changes feat selection. In almost any build involving fighter, the less fighter the better.

[Tuvarkz]

Of course, if PoW is in play, you just want to take warlord levels. Even a couple level dip into warlord is tremendously better than 2 more levels in fighter, and likely completely changes feat selection.

Until recently? I'd agree completely- Warlord and Warder outdo any fighter build in all aspects. However, with the new toys Fighter just got? Myrmidon Lore Warden Fighter is now a decent class in comparison those two, even if slightly worse than either of them.

[JeepthingJim]

To tell the truth I'm considering the same race but a warpriest instead. Thoughts on this? This was my first choice

[Geddy2112]

If you are ever at loss for a feat, improved initiative is always a solid pick. Going first is almost always life or death considering the rocket tag nature of PF, particularly at higher levels.

Warpriests are generally better than fighters, but the two are different animals. Which one do you want to play and why? Are you just looking for the most optimized build? Which one fits your character best?

[Psyren]

Warpriest is definitely stronger than Fighter but you can build a solid fighter in PF no problem. One of the quickest ways to make Fighters more fun is to ask your GM to let you use the Combat Stamina (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/other-rules/stamina-and-combat-tricks-optional-rules) rules from Pathfinder Unchained. Some of the fun things that lets you do:

1) Automatic 20 Initiative
2) Reroll AoOs
3) Take Combat Expertise (and any subsequent feats) without needing 13 Int
4) Deadly Aim with no penalty
5) Lunge with no penalty
6) TWF with no penalty
7) Charge through enemies without failing
8) Trip as a free action after hitting and doing damage
9) 10 ft. step while cleaving
10) 15 ft. step after retreating foes
11) Stagger casters who cast in your threatened area (no save) or daze them if they save

And that's before we get to style feats, including changing styles when it isn't your turn, plus the pool can be refreshed every combat.

[Kurald Galain]

I am playing a half-giant two handed fighter. Starting at first level. 20 strength. Wielding a large greatsword (3d6 damage). I've laid out my feats till level 10. Any input or advice would be appreciated.

Well, what do you want to do as a fighter?

Just damage, and lots of it?
Make your foes run away screaming with intimidate?
Control the battlefield by tripping people?
Be fast and mobile
Be very hard to hit?

Also, ask yourself how you expect to deal with ranged enemies, and what you want to be doing whenever you're not in combat.

[JeepthingJim]

Ok. A little bit of my gaming history. I've been playing since 1982. Spent most of my early days playing fighters of one sort or another. The last two campaigns I have been involved with I ended up as party healer. For about the 8 years or so. An opportunity to play the fighter type came up so I jumped for it. Looking for a build that is effective yet nostalgic. First edition fighters were badass. Warpriest appeals to me since it's very close to what I tried to do as a cleric. Though not neglecting my support duties. Now I'm freed up to really fight and I'm exploring my options.

[Psyren]

All right - here's the Warpriest Handbook (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fAITTzF0hu2mCB-_5vSJGw697JGdSXIOWy9VMp5wyzY/pub), that should help with most general advice. Then you can ask for specific advice or get build critique.

[JeepthingJim]

Thanks. Took a good look. Leery of the 3/4 BaB. I'm the only melee character in the party. The reach build is very appealing.

[Psyren]

Thanks. Took a good look. Leery of the 3/4 BaB. I'm the only melee character in the party. The reach build is very appealing.

3/4 doesn't matter if you have class features that compensate - just ask Magus, Alchemist, Inquisitor, or even Bard. Between swift self-buffs, Sacred Weapon and Blessings you'll generally trounce most full-BAB classes.

[JeepthingJim]

Ok. Talked to my DM. He expects this campaign to take us from first to 20th. Got permission to use a large nodachi at no penalty. Half Giants have powerful build as a racial feature. I have laid out my feats form beginning to end as follows:
Power attack
Furious focus
Weapon focus
Iron will
Weapon specialization
Hurtful
Cornugon smash
Vital strike
Improved critical
Intimidating prowess
Greater weapon focus
Improved vital strike
Greater weapon specialization
Endurance
Critical focus
Die hard
Greater vital strike
Penetrating strike
Devastating strike
Greater iron will
Greater penetrating strike

Still considering a two handed fighter. Looking to do big damage often

[Samalpetey]

There's not much to say to be honest. Two-handed fighters have damage down to a T, so you're pretty much set. I would strongly recommend the falchion, since it's gonna be pretty massively increasing your crit chance when you have a keen weapon (15-20 vs 19-20), and the cost in terms of damage dice is pretty minimal. Also might wanna consider a barbarian dip for superstitious and rage

[JeepthingJim]

The nodachi is a two handed oriental sword. 2d8, 18-20x2 for large size. Thanks.

[Psyren]

I assume that's your feat list if you go with Fighter? Does that mean you've settled on Fighter over Warpriest?

[JeepthingJim]

Yes. Should he meet an early demise I will absolutely go warpriest. 10 years of being a cleric has burned me out. Any thoughts on my choices?

[Arbane]

Yes. Should he meet an early demise I will absolutely go warpriest. 10 years of being a cleric has burned me out. Any thoughts on my choices?

One of the big problems with fighters is that once you pick your feats, you're pretty well stuck with them for the forseeable future. Since you've played a spellcaster before, complexity shouldn't scare you, so maybe a Martial Master (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/fighter/archetypes/paizo---fighter-archetypes/martial-master) fighter? It'll help keep you from getting bored.

[Psyren]

One of the big problems with fighters is that once you pick your feats, you're pretty well stuck with them for the forseeable future. Since you've played a spellcaster before, complexity shouldn't scare you, so maybe a Martial Master (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/fighter/archetypes/paizo---fighter-archetypes/martial-master) fighter? It'll help keep you from getting bored.

I second this, and also the Vital Strike line is pretty poor, but at least this way you can grab them all the handful of times you might benefit from them and not be stuck with dead feats any time you're able to full-attack instead.

[JeepthingJim]

Martial master is appealing. I will take it under consideration. I feel vital strike gets a bad rap. I've spent 1/5 of my feats to insure a very nasty standard attack. Not a bad investment I feel. My DM is a tactical beast when it comes to combat and often out maneuvered our fighter and prevented full attacks. I myself have been in many situations where a full attack wasn't available. This way I can deliver high damage in less than optimal situations. I also like the way it pairs with overhand chop/ cornugon smash/ hurtful. I can retrain the feat if I don't like it before commiting to the whole line. What would you recommend in place of vital strike?

[Florian]

@Jeepthing Jim:

Compare Vital Strike to anything that gives you "Pounce". Please do consider that the whole VS chain doesn't work with the Charge action, which is your main means to get into the frey.
If you know that your dm is using the tactical POV for enemies, there should be better ways to adapt to that. As has been noted before, a high number of AoSs and tripping can help with dealing with target that try to leave your reach, keeping them in your full attack radius. Picking the Step Up line up to Step up and Strike is good punishment for enemies that want to disengage.
Couple that with Strike Back and Dazing Assault, you're pretty much set.

[Triskavanski]

In the new book, there is a style that lets you use Vital Strike at the end of a charge, and again on the first AoO you make a round when you use a great sword.


Since Nodachi are a polearm, there is a new style for Polearms that can let you use it as a double weapon, and some weapon tricks (which are like equipment tricks, but only work with specific weapons) that gives some benifits to polearms and two handed weapons.

[Florian]

@Triskavanski:

The way I see it, VS simply doesn't cater to what the Fighter is good at, which is piling on static damage boni and crit fishing to apply riders. And for that, you want to make as many attacks as possible.
Where its good at, though, is the situation when you have a multi-dice weapon and next to no statis boni, something that can happen with various "pets" or wildshaped Shillelagh-wielding druids. (For example, an Anger Phantom ends up using a 3d10 weapon).
Still more interesting are builds which enfoced economy of action prevent full attacking and that actually do have ways to built on VS. Best example here would be the Vexing Daredevil archetype for the Mesmerist: You are forced to use you Move Action to use a certain class feature, therefore your Standard Action can be VS, but you are rewarded for this by the option to make iterative attacks when you land a hit with VS.

So yes, the new options look nice, but still cost another feat and block your availlable stances, so I wouldn't chose them just to make VS be a bit more viable, if I wasn't alread using a build that is centered around VS (Which the above mentioned Fighter is not).

[Psyren]

The book may very well make VS more viable; I'll certainly be judging that for myself once I can buy it. Whether it does or not though, I'd be getting it for the Stamina additions if nothing else, and more style feats designed to work with weapons are always welcome. (Cudgeler Style was disappointing to say the least.)

[Florian]

The book may very well make VS more viable; I'll certainly be judging that for myself once I can buy it. Whether it does or not though, I'd be getting it for the Stamina additions if nothing else, and more style feats designed to work with weapons are always welcome. (Cudgeler Style was disappointing to say the least.)

Let's put it this way: VS is always a good backup option to have and the book expands on that. The way how they did expand it is the problem, as things can get very feat taxing, without providing as much benefit as one of the more regular combat styles. So yeah, the Fighter may have feats to spare, but investing up to 4 feats (in addition to the VS chain itself) in a backup option is something I don't deem to be too feasible outside using the Stamina subsystem, something I think will not see regular use in most groups.

From what I've skimmed so far, all the basic fighter trueisms still stand unchanged by the content of the book.
Static damage boni still exclipse the mean average and then the die value total of a given weapon, the best way to soup up a standard action is still the class feature of the two handed warrior archetype, which is also still the best at triggering potential extra attacks with a standard attack.

[Kurald Galain]

Compare Vital Strike to anything that gives you "Pounce".

Vital Strike is clearly weaker than Pounce.

But to my knowledge, not all classes can easily obtain pounce. It may be a good plan to take VS and retrain out of it if and when you get pounce.

[Florian]

Vital Strike is clearly weaker than Pounce.

But to my knowledge, not all classes can easily obtain pounce. It may be a good plan to take VS and retrain out of it if and when you get pounce.

Let's put this into prespective: Non-reach 2H is practically the worst choice for a PF Fighter unless you can get your hands on pounce. Even if you do, all other fighting styles can do the same and still will stay superior to 2H. That's the basic problem here.

[Kurald Galain]

Let's put this into prespective: Non-reach 2H is practically the worst choice for a PF Fighter unless you can get your hands on pounce. Even if you do, all other fighting styles can do the same and still will stay superior to 2H. That's the basic problem here.

True. I wonder how much a reach fighter benefits from Vital Strike? I find that having reach makes it much easier to get a full attack off.

[Psyren]

I agree, VS is iffy at best. Even in situations where you absolutely have to reposition to get to the next foe (which honestly, between 5ft. step + reach weapon + Lunge are actually going to be the exception rather than the rule), I'd rather just charge and get +2 to hit. And once you get the ability to charge as a standard action (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/rhino-charge-combat) there is very little contest.

And the feats that losing the VS/DS chain frees up can be readily spent elsewhere. It saddens me that so many are willing to disregard Stamina while simultaneously declaring that the Fighter needs help, because that is definitely where I would put those feats instead. Or if you truly have nothing better to spend the feats on, VMC instead.

As for pouncing fighters, the Mobile Fighter archetype all the way back from the APG gets that.

[Kurald Galain]

And the feats that losing the VS/DS chain frees up can be readily spent elsewhere. It saddens me that so many are willing to disregard Stamina while simultaneously declaring that the Fighter needs help, because that is definitely where I would put those feats instead. Or if you truly have nothing better to spend the feats on, VMC instead.
It's not so much that players disregard these, as that (as far as I can tell) most GMs simply don't allow these subsystems. Yet.


As for pouncing fighters, the Mobile Fighter archetype all the way back from the APG gets that.
Kind of. At level 11, he can either move and attack once at +11, or use this archetype to move and attack twice at +6 and +1. Although it gets better at very high levels or with Haste, I think you're better off dipping for your pounce ability.

[JeepthingJim]

Why do you find 2h fighters weaker? From the numbers I've crunched I should be doing huge damage by mid level; which is my goal. Everything I see about pounce says it's a special attack, not a feat. Frankly charge isn't always an option. For 3 feats I get a nice chunk of damage off with a standard attack when I'm stuck with one. With a large nodachi and greater vital strike I'll be doing 8d8 damage plus double strength, plus 10 for power attack, plus magic bonus and plus 4 for weapon specialization off the top of my head. That's good damage is it not? Not to mention a free intimidate check and free attack from hurtful. Seems like a good deal.

[Tuvarkz]

Why do you find 2h fighters weaker? From the numbers I've crunched I should be doing huge damage by mid level; which is my goal. Everything I see about pounce says it's a special attack, not a feat. Frankly charge isn't always an option. For 3 feats I get a nice chunk of damage off with a standard attack when I'm stuck with one. With a large nodachi and greater vital strike I'll be doing 8d8 damage plus double strength, plus 10 for power attack, plus magic bonus and plus 4 for weapon specialization off the top of my head. That's good damage is it not? Not to mention a free intimidate check and free attack from hurtful. Seems like a good deal.

It's not that fighters with two-handed weapons are bad, it's that the specific archetype is bad because it trades class features for more damage than the fighter needs (Because it already has enough damage, the extra won't effectively change much), and said class features could be traded for more effective things (Or be actually useful by themselves, thanks to the Weapon Master's Handbook)

[JeepthingJim]

I see. I misunderstood. I have had misgivings about the loss of class features. We've only recently switched to pathfinder so we are still feeling our way. I may just go straight fighter using after all. But until I try it I still think vital strike is underestimated for some builds. With big damage weapons anyways

[Kurald Galain]

Why do you find 2h fighters weaker? From the numbers I've crunched I should be doing huge damage by mid level; which is my goal. Everything I see about pounce says it's a special attack, not a feat. Frankly charge isn't always an option. For 3 feats I get a nice chunk of damage off with a standard attack when I'm stuck with one. With a large nodachi and greater vital strike I'll be doing 8d8 damage plus double strength, plus 10 for power attack, plus magic bonus and plus 4 for weapon specialization off the top of my head. That's good damage is it not?

The catch is that a reach fighter, or an archer fighter, or a fighter with pounce will get four to six attacks per round at this level.

Your base damage is 2d8 (weapon) +8 (str) +10 (power attack) +4 (magic weapon) +4 (specialization) or 35 damage per hit. With greater vital strike, you now do 35+27 = 62 damage. With four attacks, you would do 35x4 = 140 damage.

This is why we find 2H fighters weaker: 62 < 140.

[Florian]

I see. I misunderstood. I have had misgivings about the loss of class features. We've only recently switched to pathfinder so we are still feeling our way. I may just go straight fighter using after all. But until I try it I still think vital strike is underestimated for some builds. With big damage weapons anyways

In part, it's about ways and means to reach the same end point.
As Psyren has already mentioned, Lunge, reach weapon, a simple potion of Enlarge Person and a 5 ft. step will mostly be enough to stay in full attack range of an enemy.
If it's about killing enemy spellcasters, than Disruptive, Spellbreaker, Step Up, Following Step and Step up and Strike are your tools, as you stay "sticky" to a chosen target and move along with it.

Edit: In addition to what Kurald just wrote about the damage, let me add riders. The whole critical chain lets you try to add a rider per crit, meaning you must hit often to activate this ability.

The whole difference in damage will get worse when you compare 2H to TWF, as the later combat style gets double the boni from most feats and fighter class features.

[Psyren]

It's not so much that players disregard these, as that (as far as I can tell) most GMs simply don't allow these subsystems. Yet.

Eh, until I see another census of some kind I have to go by the paizo boards where GMs/groups are raving about them (VMC in particular.)



Kind of. At level 11, he can either move and attack once at +11, or use this archetype to move and attack twice at +6 and +1. Although it gets better at very high levels or with Haste, I think you're better off dipping for your pounce ability.

Considering how ubiquitous Haste is (or potions, or a Speed weapon if your casters are being particularly parsimonious) I'd say this is something you can safely be assumed to count on being available.

[JeepthingJim]

I understand full attacks do more damage. 62<140 is perfectly obvious. I intend on full attacking as often as possible. That's a no brainier. I'm looking at those bad situations where you are denied a full attack. Such as being slowed, dropping your weapon, below zero hit points, etc. Surprise rounds are another example. TWF is cool as is archery but didn't fit this character. Looking to loosely model him after the Mountain, Gregor Clegaine

[Florian]

I understand full attacks do more damage. 62<140 is perfectly obvious. I intend on full attacking as often as possible. That's a no brainier. I'm looking at those bad situations where you are denied a full attack. Such as being slowed, dropping your weapon, below zero hit points, etc. Surprise rounds are another example. TWF is cool as is archery but didn't fit this character. Looking to loosely model him after the Mountain, Gregor Clegaine

There're different ways to cope with those problems.
First of, a Fighter should have both, good Str and Dex scores, either natural or pushed with magic. That leads to a very good CMD score, reducing the risk of being tripped or disarmed significantly.

Gloves of Dueling are practically a must-have item for every fighter that didn't trade Weapon Training away, as it pushes both significantly, Weapon Taining and CMD.

A quick runner's shirt is a cheap item that gives you another move action 1/day. It's cheap enough that you can carry more than one and swap them out after combat. (Am I the only one thinking about a Nike-branded tricot by the items description?)

For the endgame, you'll want the Dueling enhancement on your primary weapon. It's costly, but again rises your CMD and boosts your Initiative scores significantly.

Each time your Weapon Training rises by +1, you can select another Weapon Group. Chose "Close" as your second group and use a gauntlet as your backup weapon. Your Gloves of Dueling also boosts their Weapon Training score.

Conditions are the bane of all melee types, as they can seriously cramp your style. Heroic Defiance is a boon there, as it delays the onset for a while.
A one level dip into Mesmerist can actually be pretty useful, as you gain access to the Mask Misery trick, helping you delay the onset time of conditions, as well as the debuffing stare class feature.

For dighting on while being disabled or dying, that's why Half Orcs are among the better choices for Fighters, as their racial traits and feats (Ferocity, Deaths Initiate, and so on) all go in that direction.

Then there's VMC (Variant Multiclassing). You trade away 5 feats to gain access to some class features of another class.
For example, VMC Barbarian gives you Rage and will lead you to aquire pounce along the way, VMC Sorcerer would let you access either the abysal or orc bloodline for a scaling inherent bonus to strength and assorted goodies a fighter can you better then the sorcerer, and so on.

[Tuvarkz]

Or instead of gaining a new fighter weapon group for weapon training, you could get one of the Weapon Master's Handbook alternatives, such as getting Bravery to Will saves in general.

[Psyren]

A quick runner's shirt is a cheap item that gives you another move action 1/day. It's cheap enough that you can carry more than one and swap them out after combat. (Am I the only one thinking about a Nike-branded tricot by the items description?)

I always thought of it as Under Armor myself, or a similar athletic material (spandex/lycra/etc.)



Each time your Weapon Training rises by +1, you can select another Weapon Group. Chose "Close" as your second group and use a gauntlet as your backup weapon. Your Gloves of Dueling also boosts their Weapon Training score.

I'd recommend a slashing (adamantine) weapon instead, in case you get swallowed whole, or need to cut through a (relatively thin) wall/door/bars.

[Florian]

@Tuvarkz:

That's a bit depending on the build. Focusing on the heavy blades or polearms groups. I'd at least pick thrown as a backup group before trading Weapon Training away, as Javelins make great ranged weapons with no limit to Str and multifunctioning weapons like daggers and handaxes are also included.

@Psyren:

Haha, yes, the adamantine universal lockpick ;)

[JeepthingJim]

So much advice! Thank you all. Much to think about. Great idea about the adamantine slashing weapon. In 3.5 I carried a vicious dagger for the same purpose. I'm probably going with armor spikes at first as I like the look. Still on the fence about two handed archetype. Some say I don't do enough damage and some say I don't need to do that much damage. And losing armor training is something to think long and hard about. I may try vital strike and retrain it if I don't like it. Otherwise you have given me some very good options besides it. One last question. Is the nodachi a sword or pole arm? Images I have googled it appears to be an oversized katana. It does not have reach. But it does have brace. How is it classified in Pathfinder? Thanks again for your time. If you like I will post occasional updates.

[Florian]

So much advice! Thank you all. Much to think about. Great idea about the adamantine slashing weapon. In 3.5 I carried a vicious dagger for the same purpose. I'm probably going with armor spikes at first as I like the look. Still on the fence about two handed archetype. Some say I don't do enough damage and some say I don't need to do that much damage. And losing armor training is something to think long and hard about. I may try vital strike and retrain it if I don't like it. Otherwise you have given me some very good options besides it. One last question. Is the nodachi a sword or pole arm? Images I have googled it appears to be an oversized katana. It does not have reach. But it does have brace. How is it classified in Pathfinder? Thanks again for your time. If you like I will post occasional updates.

The Nodachi is a 2h sword, falling under the heavy blades group. It doesn't have reach and it's not a polearm. If you want, it's a Katana on a stick, therefore the brace option.

As for Armor Training, that's a bit of a tricky beast to handle. You're a Fighter, you want to pose as a good target that enemies simply won't pass by. Unlike a Paladin, you don't want to wear too sophisticated armor as you can get quite a good mileage out of whatever you wear.
Remember that I wrote earlier that you actually want to increase your Dex along the way? Now that comes into play. If things go as planned, you'll progressivelly downgrade your armour from heavy to light, while your fellow team members do uograde in the opposite way.

[JeepthingJim]

Sorry. Should have posted before. We use dice not point buy. Scores are really good. S 20, D 16, C 16.

[Florian]

Sorry. Should have posted before. We use dice not point buy. Scores are really good. S 20, D 16, C 16.

Just to be clear, the Str 20 is including the Half Giant racial bonus?

[Tuvarkz]

The Nodachi is a 2h sword, falling under the heavy blades group. It doesn't have reach and it's not a polearm. If you want, it's a Katana on a stick, therefore the brace option.

As for Armor Training, that's a bit of a tricky beast to handle. You're a Fighter, you want to pose as a good target that enemies simply won't pass by. Unlike a Paladin, you don't want to wear too sophisticated armor as you can get quite a good mileage out of whatever you wear.
Remember that I wrote earlier that you actually want to increase your Dex along the way? Now that comes into play. If things go as planned, you'll progressivelly downgrade your armour from heavy to light, while your fellow team members do uograde in the opposite way.

Actually, it is on the polearm weapon group as well as the heavy blades one, thus qualifying for both. Thus, picking up Polearm for weapon training gives you the full bonus on a Nodachi, and let's say a Bardiche.

[JeepthingJim]

@ Florian....yes

[JeepthingJim]

@ Tuvarkz...thanks

[JeepthingJim]

Ok. Here's my new game plan. Half giant martial master using a large nodachi. Focusing early on on power attack. Going with a hurtful build followed by a critical build after 8th level. Back up weapons will be a large composite long bow and a large earth breaker. What do you think?

[Florian]

Sounds good. Only suggestion I'd have is using thrown weapon as backup instead of the bow, as you can get more out of your Str bonus this way. Also meshes better with crit feats.

[JeepthingJim]

Duly noted. I'm fond of javelins. Maybe both?

[Psyren]

@ Florian....yes


@ Tuvarkz...thanks


Ok. Here's my new game plan. Half giant martial master using a large nodachi. Focusing early on on power attack. Going with a hurtful build followed by a critical build after 8th level. Back up weapons will be a large composite long bow and a large earth breaker. What do you think?

FYI, the mods frown on double- and triple-posting. It's better to edit your last post if you have more to say before someone else replies.


Sounds good. Only suggestion I'd have is using thrown weapon as backup instead of the bow, as you can get more out of your Str bonus this way. Also meshes better with crit feats.

I'd recommend a Composite Longbow instead. You still get a benefit from your strength, with much longer range (handy for flying opponents) and best of all, you can enchant the bow without literally throwing money away like a thrown weapon would.

[Florian]

@Psyren:

A bit of a knee-jerk reaction?

If you invest in crit rider feats and high Str, the Comp. Longbow is not the best you can get w/o investing in additional stuff like to bow high-crit bracers.

[Psyren]

@Psyren:

A bit of a knee-jerk reaction?

If you invest in crit rider feats and high Str, the Comp. Longbow is not the best you can get w/o investing in additional stuff like to bow high-crit bracers.

How is it knee-jerk? I explained the advantages of the bow pretty clearly.

[JeepthingJim]

Thanks for tip about posting. I'm leaning towards composite longbow due to the range. Natural flexibility should make up the difference in feats eventually