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View Full Version : What Would They Be (If They Were in D&D)?



Runa
2007-05-30, 05:34 PM
I saw a thread discussing Batman (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45837) as a D&D character, and it occurred to me it might be fun to see how the heck people think one could build D&D characters out of other fictional characters (Zapp Brannigan excluded, as he's already got a thread about him :P).

For starters: some of the cast of Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

Xander Harris: Commoner with a lot of ranks in Craft and decent (but not spectacular) Cha. No ranks in Bluff though, and only a couple in Diplomacy. Why? He's the only one who NEVER had powers and the only time he had special abilities was the Halloween episode where they turned into their costumes (he was dressed as a soldier) so that was temporary. He is, however, good at construction and repairing things. He's funny (high Cha), but he's not a particularly good liar (no ranks in Bluff), and he's sometimes good at interpersonal diplomacy (see for example talking Willow down from her angst-and-anger-riddled black magic binge at the end of season 6), but sometimes just messes up so it's hit or miss. Notable is that he's had two different steady girlfriends - one of whom wouldn't normally go out with him, (Cordelia in her high school days), the other of whom had been burned badly in a previous relationship and spent the past few centuries being a Vengeance Demon who specialize in hurting men. And then there's the brief sexual tension between he and Willow in season 3. Face it, he HAS to have decent Cha. But, he messes up on occasion, so obviously he needs more of those Diplomacy ranks. :P Skill focus is carpentry of course. Probably CG alignment.

Willow Rosenberg: Wizard, obviously. High level at that (but then, she's been playing for several years so... :smallwink: ). High INT but not necessarily a high WIS; she's clever but is fairly naive at times about how dangerous magic can be if you mess with it the wrong way. Low STR; she's a caster, not a Fighter for sure. Average to high Cha I think, or somewhere thereabouts; she's attracted two different lovers both of whom loved her deeply. Diplomacy... hmm, she has some ranks in it but rolled an awful lot of natural ones during season 6, poor dear. Alignment varies depending on the part of the series, but I believe she is predominantly CG as well... though she dipped into Neutral and then Evil alignment in season 6, only to bounce back to Good by season 7.

Buffy Summers: This is actually fairly hard in some ways. Ability scores not so hard though. Extremely high (like 18... or more, after all, we can probably count her race as Slayer instead of just human, she is portrayed as superhuman after all) Con (Rapid healing and ability to take way more than normal damage), Dex (very nimble, fast reflexes, excellent at handling objects large and small alike, etc.), and Str (superhuman strength and speed, remember?), with also fairly high Cha (seems charming enough, capable of leading, attracted two seperate guys even not counting the one with a fetish for Slayers, etc.) and Int (manages to get some pretty clever deductions out you know, plus good at figuring out things' weaknesses), not so high on Wis though, as she's impulsive. She obviously has proficiency in every category of weapon ever made, pretty much (with Weapon Finesse in several of them, say Wooden Stake, Sword, Battleaxe), has both Two-Weapon Fighting and Unarmed fighting abilities, and does not appear to take a -4 penalty on improvised weapons (we've seen her use a No. 2 pencil as a stake with no problem, we've seen her trick a vampire into swallowing Holy Water which killed it, or using bottles of Holy Water as a sort of Acid Flask for vampires, etc.). She also obviously has MASSIVE hit points. Decent ranks in Bluff (again: tricked a vampire into drinking Holy Water) and Diplomacy (she'd have to be to lead as well as she does), considerable ranks in Spot, Hide, Move Silently, max or near-max ranks in Tumble, Jump, Balance and Climb, and quite a few ranks in Search, Gather Information, and Intimidate, and a couple in Craft (Stake) (We've seen her whittling them, as I recall). She's obviously Good-aligned, though whether she's Neutral or Chaotic depends probably on interpretation, but my bet's on Chaotic; she's basically shown for the most part that she can and will bend the rules considerably if it means saving the day (or those she loves), something Lawful-aligned don't seem prone to do nearly as often as she does, and which seems more Chaotic. Though she may have a Lawful streak in her, I will admit. What do you suppose, high level Monk/Rogue/Fighter? Definitely elements of a Rogue and Fighter is obvious...

Any others? Or comments on these?

-Runa

Serenity
2007-05-30, 07:40 PM
Daniel 'Oz' Osbourne: Low to mid-level Bard afflicted with Lycanthropy. Maxed ranks in Perform (Guitar/Sarcasm). High Int (Willow identifies him as 'some kind of supergenius', and he, like her, was tapped for a job at a computer company), but low Wis (He simply didn't take his finals, the Veruka incident). Decent charisma, but not exceptional. He's attractive, good-natured, and a lead band member, but he's also a tad taciturn. Str, dex, and con are all decent, probably at around the same level as Xander when he's not a wolf. Neutral or Chaotic Good.

Rupert Giles: Archivist with a level or two of fighter. Physical stats are average, Intelligence and Wisdom exceptional, probably 18. Full ranks in Knowledge (The Planes, Arcana, Religion) and Perform (Guitar/Singing). Almost certainly Lawful Good.

Now for Firefly, we'll have to go into the Modern system...

Jayne 'Hero of Canton' Cobb: Strong/Tough Hero, with the Enforcer Advanced Class (Basically, Barbarian with a bit of Rogue-style fightin' dirty.) He takes every weapon proficiency and brawling feat he can get his grubby hands on. Intelligence is abysmal, and Wisdom's hardly better, but Str and Con are about as high as they come. Probably not particularly fast, though. Alignment TN or CN. He ain't exactly evil, but totally selfish. Oh, and he's also got Perform (Guitar)

Hoban 'Wash' Washburne: Smart/Fast Hero. He's taken max ranks in Navigate, Pilot, Drive, and Perform (Comedy). Some ranks in Knowledge (Technology) and Repair, enough that he can back up Kaylee in repiars. Slightly above average Strength ("I'm a large, semi-muscular man"), decent Dex. Excellent Charisma, considering who his wife is. NG.

River Tam: As of the movie, I'd say just give her divine rank and be done with it. :smallbiggrin: Seriously though, her stats would probably awfully similar to Buffy's, only with superhuman intelligence of well above 18. Levels in Telepath. Her psychosis gives hefty penalties to any influence type skills, but serious bonuses to Intimidate. Alignment: True Neutral. She's a force of nature, and too crazy to have much of a moral code. She just knows the people who love her and she'll do everything to protect them.

kjones
2007-05-30, 08:37 PM
I might actually stat out Willow and Tara as Druids rather than Wizards... Of course, the magic systems are very difficult to compare, and of course there's no wildshaping/animal companions going on. However, a lot of their spells have a very ritualistic component to them, with circles and candles and so forth, which seems to me to fit with druidic magic better than arcane. Also, Willow deserves a lot of Knowledge ranks, along with her computer skills (rebuilding the Buffy-bot?)

Furthermore, I think you're really selling Xander short. His greatest strength is something that's hard to determine in the context of a D&D game, but the best way I can say it is "heart"... Xander is really the only main character who is truly good at heart, without the twinges of darkness in Buffy (Angel? Spike? Faith? Coming back from the dead?) Willow (Season Six, but really it starts in "Becoming, Part Two" in Season Two) Giles (his past) Anya (demon, selfish) Oz (werewolf) Spike and Angel (figure it out for yourself) etc. He's the only one without any special powers, and yet in episodes like "The Zeppo", Season Three, and of course at the end of Seasons Five and Six, it's abundantly clear that he is an indispensable member of the Scoobies.

So how do you encompass "heart" in a statistic? I would say Wisdom, but he obviously failed his Will save badly on his wedding day... :smalltongue: I'd have to say Charisma. Charisma, of course, represents "force of personality", and while Xander is kind of a loser sometimes, he's got... well, heart.

Runa
2007-05-30, 09:30 PM
I might actually stat out Willow and Tara as Druids rather than Wizards... Of course, the magic systems are very difficult to compare, and of course there's no wildshaping/animal companions going on. However, a lot of their spells have a very ritualistic component to them, with circles and candles and so forth, which seems to me to fit with druidic magic better than arcane. Also, Willow deserves a lot of Knowledge ranks, along with her computer skills (rebuilding the Buffy-bot?)

Ah I can't believe I forgot the tech stuff. A generic "Knowledge (Technology)" category would seem to fit that. Top ranks in that!

Of course, I suppose Willow would then be a Druid/Wizard then, seeing as she does perform some obviously arcane-style spells later (see season 6 finale. What she did to Warren Mears was more along the lines of arcane magic, wasn't it? Not ritual there).


Furthermore, I think you're really selling Xander short. His greatest strength is something that's hard to determine in the context of a D&D game, but the best way I can say it is "heart"... Xander is really the only main character who is truly good at heart, without the twinges of darkness in Buffy (Angel? Spike? Faith? Coming back from the dead?) Willow (Season Six, but really it starts in "Becoming, Part Two" in Season Two) Giles (his past) Anya (demon, selfish) Oz (werewolf) Spike and Angel (figure it out for yourself) etc. He's the only one without any special powers, and yet in episodes like "The Zeppo", Season Three, and of course at the end of Seasons Five and Six, it's abundantly clear that he is an indispensable member of the Scoobies.

True, but that wasn't something I could figure out how to stat. Except maybe as higher Cha than I really gave him credit for. :P


So how do you encompass "heart" in a statistic? I would say Wisdom, but he obviously failed his Will save badly on his wedding day... :smalltongue: I'd have to say Charisma. Charisma, of course, represents "force of personality", and while Xander is kind of a loser sometimes, he's got... well, heart.

Yeah, I suppose 18 Cha (or better for all I know) paired with a Good alignment is closer to capturing him... as little as you can capture him in pure stats, anyway. This is one of those cases where I would say the meat of a character is really how they're played, not in how they're put down in numbers and ability notations on a character sheet. You can sort of tell something about Buffy and Willow and etc. from their basic stats - that Willow is a bit nerdy and embraces magic and technology about equally should come off easily through the high Int, the Wizard class or multiclassing, and Knowledge (Technology) ranks; that Buffy is a warrior for good is obvious from her alignment and her abilities and all of that. But how integral Xander is the to party, er, Scoobies, really doesn't come off in the stats at all. At ALL.

Goes to show how much a good story - whether in teleplay or roleplay format - will often depend on the players and how they play, more than on any simple collection of abilities and statistics. Heh.

Serenity: Heh, I had to laugh when you said that bit about River. What makes it even funnier now that I think about it is that in the official Roleplaying Game core rulebook for Serenity, they have example profiles of each of the nine main characters... and it is noted that River had to be toned down from her movie version in order to provide balanced play! XD *snerk!* Divine rank, no kidding...

-Runa

Serenity
2007-05-30, 10:10 PM
Aye, I've got that one. After taking down a roomful of Reavers, I doubt River would have much trouble with the Hecatonchieres.

Shepherd Derrial Book: Smart/Dedicated Hero, high Wisdom and Charisma--he is a priest, after all. Mark down military for his occupation, that being background rather than what the character does now. He wasn't always a Shepherd, and whatever he was exactly, it was clearly some sort of warrior, most likely an Operative or similar. Highly proficient with firearms, as well as some Combat Martial Arts feats. LG.

Inara Serra: Charismatic/Dedicated/Personality. After all, the whole reason Mal keeps her around, aside from UST is the prestige and access she brings Serenity. Maxed out Charisma and a pretty exceptional Dex as well, Companioning ("Can I use Companion as a verb?") requiring a certain degree of grace. High ranks in Diplomacy, Sense Motive, etc.--she's been trained to be empathic and appealing. Proficient with rapiers and crossbows. Lawful Good.

Thexare Blademoon
2007-05-30, 11:14 PM
Stepping away from two things I know nothing about, let's go to Zelda. :)

Link
Ok, let's see. Fire Rod, Ice Rod, Bombos, Ether, and Quake (which appear as medallions, leading me to think scroll-like)... that implies a damn good UMD score. His fighting abilities tell me that he's got Fighter (or maybe Warblade, but I'm sticking with SRD) levels...

LttP:
Fighter 6/bonus feat Rogue 4 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#rogue)/Battle Scion 10 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/legendaryWeapons.htm#battleScion), max ranks in UMD.

Alignment: Neutral Good is my best guess.
Stats:
14 Str - while strong on his own, he usually has strength-enhancing gear to add to his power.
12 Dex - Though we've seen little that implies he's agile (much of that is from his equipment), he doesn't wear armor, so it could be assumed...
12 Con - Again, an issue of items that are picked up. For the "heart container" effect, boost Con at every level, I guess.
14 Int - How many puzzles does he get stuck solving?
12 Wis - Not much to say here. Partially ties into the above, as Wisdom affects your perception.
10/20 Cha - 20: He never talks and everyone still knows what he's saying. (joke) 10: Well, nothing to go by here...

To add OoT... don't. Din's Fire (and the others) seem to not be cast from items, which would mean you'd have to add some sort of spellcaster, and the rest of the build would hold that back quite a bit. But if you insist, replace Fighter and Battle Scion with 15 levels of Duskblade, I suppose, and add max ranks in Ride and Tumble. Still, seperating LttP and OoT Link seems best to me.

Also: Needs immunity to fear as a feat. Triforce of Courage and all that...

AtomicKitKat
2007-05-30, 11:53 PM
Willow would probably be Expert 2(focused on Technology), leading into Wizard.

Xander is Commoner 1/Warrior 1/Expert ??(Plain student, possesses "experience" left over from the costume, and he's now a Carpenter/Construction Worker.)

Kaerou
2007-05-31, 12:27 AM
My friends got into a discussion over what class and level build Waylander is..

JaronK
2007-05-31, 12:58 AM
Staying within D&D:

Mal Reynolds: Fighter 2/Marshal 2/Rogue 3. He's an experienced warrior who's not above using sneaky tricks to gain the upper hand, but he's not the best fighter out there. Feats probably used to increase shooting. Also, he's got the Landlord feat for his ship. Lawful Nuetral. Probably was Lawful Good, but has strayed a bit. Still tends back towards good when he has the chance. I say Lawful despite his problems with authority... he has a strong enough honor code to get him into trouble sometimes.

Jayne Cobb: Fighter 4/Monk 2/Rogue 1. Good close in fighter, definitely with Improved Grapple, and a decent ranged fighter as well. Chaotic Evil, but respects Mal.

Wash: Expert 7. Hey, he's a pilot. Nuetral Good. Probably Ex Chaotic Good, but his wife moved him more in the Lawful direction over the course of the series.

Zoe: Fighter 4/Ranger 2/Rogue 1. Like Jayne, she's a good warrior, and not above using underhanded tactics when events call for them. Lawful Nuetral, probably was Lawful Evil during the war, but Wash mellowed her out some.

Kayli: Expert 7, specialized more towards engineering than Wash. Definitely Chaotic Good.

Simon: Expert 7. Nuetral Good.

Inara Sarrah: Fighter 1/Expert 5/Marshal 1. More charismatic than the other skill types, and has some actual fighting experience in a pinch, though we rarely see it during the show. Definitely the beginnings of a diplomancer here. Chaotic Good... she grates against authority and has a distinct sense of Wanderlust.

River Tam: Gestalt Swordsage 5/Monk 1/Shou Disciple 5//Telepath 11 with Up the Walls and a variety of other tricks, plus Flaw: kinda nuts. Yeah, she's overpowered, and her stats are likely a bit too high too, but whatever, she's clearly played by the DM's girlfriend. Chaotic Nuetral. Wants to be Chaotic Good, but we'll have to wait till she stabalizes more for that to take place.

JaronK

GryffonDurime
2007-05-31, 01:27 AM
Personally, I think little Willow's an Ultimate Magus, combining her prepared ritual casting pre-Glory with her spontaneous casting post. But that's just me.

Willow Rosenburg, Wiccan Fury: Wizard 5/Sorcerer 2/Ultimate Magus 10/Archmage 3


Now, for slightly more esoteric options, I turn to...

The Spellbinder, Ashka Expert 20
Maxed out ranks in Use Magic Device (though, in all fairness, it's not really magic), and like everyone else in the show, maxed ranks in Bluff. Seriously, the girl can lie. She can lie 'til the cows come home, then she can look you in the eye and tell you that the cows haven't come home yet and probably make you believe it. Possibly a few levels in Rogue (for backstab...I mean Sneak Attack) and Artificer (she at least knew basic science enough to repair her suit).

Vala Mal Duran Rogue 14/Bard 6
Granted, she doesn't do magic, but she certainly knows enough bits of esoterica to qualify for Bardic Knowledge. Only half-maxed ranks in Bluff, but she thinks she's got truly epic scores in it. Charisma out the yin-yang.

Daniel Jackson Expert 2/Bard 8/Loremaster 10
Equally versed in cosmic ephemera...maxed ranks in all non-scientific Knowledges, Diplomacy, and probably about 40 ranks invested into Speak Language.

The Doctor
The Doctor is, without doubt, truly epic. I'm going to start him off with a healthy 20 Outsider HD, with the subtype (Native: Time Lord). From there, let's toss in Expert 20, and as of the new season Psion 10/Slayer (Dalek) 10...you know what? Add in a divine castingless Archivist 20; he's got too much Dark Knowledge not to have it.

He has a robust 73 ranks in all Knowledge skills, Bluff, Use Magic/Psionic Device...

skywalker
2007-05-31, 01:51 AM
she's clearly played by the DM's girlfriend.

HAha. I love it.

JaronK, I also like how you're keeping the levels low for the other serenity characters. They clearly aren't that powerful...

Nerd-o-rama
2007-05-31, 02:10 AM
Heh. I've been catching up on Buffy the 90's pop culture icon I never watched on the air lately. I like stuff mentioned here, but I will mention another couple things.

First, in yet another dissenting opinion on Xander, I think he's best represented in D&D as a straight Expert. He does a few things, best represented by skills, mundanely but very well. Diplomacy, Intimidate (watch "The Zeppo, season 3), Sense Motive, Knowledge(nothing useful). Zero mystical abilities that would make him a Bard or Factotum, no real combat skills (maybe Warrior 1 from his residual combat knowledge). He's also the most firmly Good character on the show, barring a few instances of petty selfishness and a terrible taste in women. Probably ethically Neutral, but I hate to pin down a Joss Whedon character to any particular alignment.

As of the Buffy Season 8 comics (yeah, I read 'em without finishing the series. Sue me, I know all the spoilers by now), he's a competent paramilitary commander. Perhaps he's earned a few Marshal levels, or something from Heroes of Battle.

I've seen Buffy represented rather accurately as a Ranger(minor, just for the Favored enemy and ranged combat boosts)/Monk (for the kung fu)/Shou Disciple (for the kung fu swordfighting).

Cordelia Chase. Bard for a base class (ranks in Perform: Cheerleading, not Acting), and. Hmm. What gives oracular ability other than some kind of custom Template. Can bards do Divine Oracle fairly well?

The demons of the Buffy universe pretty much require homebrewing, being entirely unlike the general D&D cosmology. As an example, Anya(nka) has the wish-granting/tempting portfolios of a Glabrezu with the vengeance/hot girl ideas of an Erinyes. And then gets turned into a human commoner. Ouch.

Oh, and Willow's a Druid. It's just that her animal companion turned back into a human and is now trying to kill her.

Finally, I'd like to say that if I was running a clone campaign of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, I'd probably use the New World of Darkness base rules. They allow for more varied and modern characters, like a Mage with a lot of ranks in Computers. Maybe Old World of Darkness Hunter and Mage, but then Xander is just screwed.

Ethdred
2007-05-31, 04:57 AM
Bard for a base class (ranks in Perform: Cheerleading, not Acting)

That is just such a great idea for a Bard character - would fit with the inspire type abilities, and presumably the fascinate ability is based on the short skirt!

Shadow of the Sun
2007-05-31, 06:20 AM
I wonder how you'd stat out Elric of Melnibone? I'd at assume he'd be something like a Swordsage. With a CON and STR of about 3 each.

Dhavaer
2007-05-31, 06:21 AM
I wonder how you'd stat out Elric of Melnibone? I'd at assume he'd be something like a Swordsage. With a CON and STR of about 3 each.

Maybe Warblade/Binder? He seemed more of the intelligent type to me. Or just Fighter/Binder, possibly.

kjones
2007-05-31, 06:29 AM
I would have to give Cordy NPC classes, at least until the end of Season 3 (where she goes off to be on Angel) simply because, well, she's not that good at anything, really.

Willow's magic produces an interesting conundrum. Obviously, the magical system is very different from anything in D&D... for example, "simple" things that she does are telekinetic actions, which have no real equivalent within cantrips. (except maybe open/close? or something?) Furthermore, she cast Raise Dead in Season Six... So we'd have to give her a bunch of cleric levels...

I think the best thing to do is make her a druid/wizard, but somehow have her druid levels count towards her wizard spells, kind of like a mystic theurge. She's decently high level by the time she goes all Dragonball Z at the end of Season Six.

Now, how about the Trio? Or Adam? Or, for that matter, any of the vamps?

Serenity
2007-05-31, 08:14 AM
I'd say Mal's pretty clearly CG; he's got a distinct Robin Hood-esque ethos. And I'd call Inara Lawful; she plays by the rules of her profession.

Sundog
2007-05-31, 10:52 AM
Maybe Warblade/Binder? He seemed more of the intelligent type to me. Or just Fighter/Binder, possibly.

Simply Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Cleric 5/ Mystic Theurge lots. He's supposed to be a great wizard, which in his world includes consorting with/working for a god or gods (thus the Mystic Theurge). Most of his hand-to-hand "skill" actually comes from Stormbringer. Al:TN. He wants to be better than he is, but is strongly linked to forces of pure evil.

"I was ever more evil than thou."

Telonius
2007-05-31, 11:57 AM
Stepping away from two things I know nothing about, let's go to Zelda. :)

Link
Ok, let's see. Fire Rod, Ice Rod, Bombos, Ether, and Quake (which appear as medallions, leading me to think scroll-like)... that implies a damn good UMD score. His fighting abilities tell me that he's got Fighter (or maybe Warblade, but I'm sticking with SRD) levels...

LttP:
Fighter 6/bonus feat Rogue 4 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#rogue)/Battle Scion 10 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/legendaryWeapons.htm#battleScion), max ranks in UMD.

Alignment: Neutral Good is my best guess.
Stats:
14 Str - while strong on his own, he usually has strength-enhancing gear to add to his power.
12 Dex - Though we've seen little that implies he's agile (much of that is from his equipment), he doesn't wear armor, so it could be assumed...
12 Con - Again, an issue of items that are picked up. For the "heart container" effect, boost Con at every level, I guess.
14 Int - How many puzzles does he get stuck solving?
12 Wis - Not much to say here. Partially ties into the above, as Wisdom affects your perception.
10/20 Cha - 20: He never talks and everyone still knows what he's saying. (joke) 10: Well, nothing to go by here...

To add OoT... don't. Din's Fire (and the others) seem to not be cast from items, which would mean you'd have to add some sort of spellcaster, and the rest of the build would hold that back quite a bit. But if you insist, replace Fighter and Battle Scion with 15 levels of Duskblade, I suppose, and add max ranks in Ride and Tumble. Still, seperating LttP and OoT Link seems best to me.

Also: Needs immunity to fear as a feat. Triforce of Courage and all that...

I've seen some suggestions that it's possible to stat him as a soulknife/soulbow, with the "throwing swords" attacks. But it's also possible he picked up some levels of Artificer. Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Boomerang is a necessity, as is some proficiency in the bow.

The Vorpal Tribble
2007-05-31, 12:19 PM
I've been working on statting up some fellows (especially with Uncon coming in a couple months on Wizards).

Two I've been working on is Sylar from Heroes and Dean Winchester from Supernatural.

The first I'm giving a few levels in commoner until he meets the prerequisites for Master of the Unseen Hand PrC. The rest of his abilities I'm just going to have to give as 'at will' spell-likes. Defientely chaotic evil.

Dean is definetely an Urban Ranger (non-magical variant) with favored enemy (undead) and (outsider: evil). Not sure if he's quite 10th level, though if so also throw in (monstrous humanoid). He'd be more of a d20 modern though, so I'd give him rapid shot with his guns. Not sure about his alignment... really he should be chaotic good, giving his soul over to save his brother and all, but then again he gets pretty vicious with those he fights. Most like chaotic good with neutral tendencies.

elliott20
2007-05-31, 12:33 PM
I've seen some suggestions that it's possible to stat him as a soulknife/soulbow, with the "throwing swords" attacks. But it's also possible he picked up some levels of Artificer. Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Boomerang is a necessity, as is some proficiency in the bow.

I actually would be hesistant to stat out link for the very reason that depending upon which game you play, he's a completely different character.

Ditto
2007-05-31, 12:52 PM
Xander is definitely high-Wis, low-Cha. Wis helps with Craft, and remember instances like the insanely-sagelike-advice "Listen to your heart" speech from Into the Woods? He's funny and all, but not terrifically attractive (not just looks, of course, since he's not exactly homely). Definitely Expert over Commoner.

Buffy doesn't get high Int scores for being clever. Willow and Giles are the clever ones. I don't care if the gets 1480s on her SATs. Season 7 Buffy definitely started putting ranks into Intimidate over Bluff/Diplomacy... and I don't think she's a Diplomacy sort of leader. She doesn't need to convince her friends to come help, they just do it. Or don't. Whichever. I wouldn't call her a Rogue, since the massive skills don't fit (mostly the Thief-y ones like Disable Device, Open Lock)... then again, I wouldn't give her the high Int to grant her max ranks in too many skills, so I guess it balances. Craft (Stake) is silly. That's like Craft (Quarterstaff) - untrained is plenty, since it has negligible cost. (Interesting fact: Because cost is negligible, theoretically crafting time is negligible. Therefore, you could Craft an number of Quarterstaves limited only be how many trees are within arm's reach as a free action - but it still takes a @#%! move action to draw one!)

I like Giles being an Archivist just because the name is so fitting, but he and all Watchers are definitely Wizards.

melchizedek
2007-05-31, 01:00 PM
I wouldn't call any of the Watcher's Wizards. The only time Giles shows any magical powers is when the coven grants him the powers to face Willow at the end of season 6. Archivist may work. He probably has at least one level of fighter.

JaronK
2007-05-31, 01:02 PM
I'd say Mal's pretty clearly CG; he's got a distinct Robin Hood-esque ethos. And I'd call Inara Lawful; she plays by the rules of her profession.

Joss Whedon characters are of course not easy to pin down to a single alignment, but Mal's honor code regularly comes up. He's willing to put doing the honorable thing above his own survival on multiple occasions (the duel, crossing Miska, etc), and is very clear that his word is law ("I do a job. I get paid"). Despite his Robin Hood ethos, he's clearly lawful... he just believes in looking out for the little guy and disagrees with the current government.

Inara, meanwhile, is often said to have had the potencial to do anything in her profession, but her wanderlust and rejection of authority kept getting in the way. She may play by most of the official rules as necessary for the job, but she goes about this in a way that very few companions would, mostly so that she can have plenty of freedom. That screams Chaotic alignment in a profession that rewards the Lawful.

JaronK

Quietus
2007-05-31, 01:24 PM
Two I've been working on is Sylar from Heroes and Dean Winchester from Supernatural.

The first I'm giving a few levels in commoner until he meets the prerequisites for Master of the Unseen Hand PrC. The rest of his abilities I'm just going to have to give as 'at will' spell-likes. Defientely chaotic evil.

While I do like the Master of the Unseen Hand idea, I also think that for Sylar, you'd have to homebrew something to allow him to enter a class similar to the Illithid Savant, which lets him eat brains to gain powers.

elliott20
2007-05-31, 01:38 PM
I personally feel that Mal's character as is just doesn't fit very well into the standard D&D setting. Much of his background is hinged on a military past and giving rogue levels just feels.... well.... off.

At the core Mal is a military man who becomes jaded with the authority he served and left to form his own little brigade.

from that standpoint, seeing as the default military man profession is usually fighter, I think that would have made a better primary class choice.

Perhaps he leveled up in fighter up to a certain point where he could obtain leadership (gaining Zoe as a cohort) and proficiencies in most weaponry that is common to the setting. So, trade in the pistol with shortsword/longsowrd, rifle with a polearm, and then make him go from idealist to jaded war vet and you have Mal.

Zoe, considering her background training, would also receive a similar treatment.

Wash is somebody I think we would ALL have problems with. After all, in D&D you can't get good at anything without becoming better at combat yourself. Wash never exhibits any real combat prowess in any fashion. All he ever does is fly the ship (extremely well, no less). If there is any equivalent of a piloting skill, it probably would all go to something like "ride" or "navigation" or some equivalent. By necessity, Wash would probably be an expert of comparable level to Zoe and Mal, though by virtue of being an expert he isn't nearly as combat ready.

River... well... it's obvious she's going to be using the Psionics Handbooks fairly heavily. She doesn't even need to be that many levels ahead of the rest of the crew, seeing as by virtue of having access to magic, she's already a head and shoulder above the rest.

Thexare Blademoon
2007-05-31, 01:57 PM
I actually would be hesistant to stat out link for the very reason that depending upon which game you play, he's a completely different character.

That's why I limited myself primarily to LttP in mine. I was actually going to put together one for each of the games I've played enough (LoZ, the GBC games since they're all similar enough, OoT/MM, WW), but I got lazy.

JadedDM
2007-05-31, 02:25 PM
GryffonDurime, you think Vala and Daniel Jackson are both level 20? Wouldn't that make them near-god like? If that was the case, Daniel Jackson would never die (as opposed to dying numerous times) because he'd have so many HP that not even a gou'ald could take him out.

Deme
2007-05-31, 02:47 PM
That's why I limited myself primarily to LttP in mine. I was actually going to put together one for each of the games I've played enough (LoZ, the GBC games since they're all similar enough, OoT/MM, WW), but I got lazy.

a) you forgot Twilight Princess ^^
and b) I would say that, in most games, Link would have a fairly good charisma score. In most games, he has at least one female NPC attracted to him at a time. And people always, always, trust him with their innane problems, their secrets, etc, for no good reason except that they do. This being said, I would agree that most of any Link's stats would be fairly average, to average-good. He's always been played up as a sort of average guy.

elliott20
2007-05-31, 02:59 PM
to be honest, I'm actually more curious about the rest of the NPCs that show up in Zelda.

i.e. that stupid old man that gives you the rusty sword. what the hell is he supposed to be?

like, what would you do with say, the average Hyrulean knight? Or what about princess Zelda herself?

Deme
2007-05-31, 03:05 PM
like, what would you do with say, the average Hyrulean knight? Or what about princess Zelda herself?

OK...I'd say a low-level warrior. no PC class for the generic hylian soldier! Probably average stats all around. You never see them fight, really.

Zelda might be some sort of cloistered cleric-type. Not exactly, but mechanically, I'd think so. She has a fairly good charisma, I would say, and definately a high wisdom, as that is her department. She probably has a fairly good inteligence score, but her physical stats are probably lacking. Battle-princess, she is not. The reason I would say she'd be a cleric at all is the magic she throws around at the end of some games. and the general divine-ness.

elliott20
2007-05-31, 03:08 PM
well, Zelda too, depending upon the game you're playing is going to be very different.

Deme
2007-05-31, 03:11 PM
Right. I'm looking at things fairly generally. The problem of her occaisonal alter-egos is another issue; I'd treat them as seperate characters.

Nerd-o-rama
2007-05-31, 04:09 PM
The question, of course, boils down to this:

Pirate Zelda, or Ninja Zelda?

BelFire
2007-05-31, 05:13 PM
As saddened as I am to admit to having watched such a thing (damn you guilty pleasures!) I think Inuyasha would be a SwordSage with a Legendary weapon, and the Lecherous Monk could be an Intropomancer with his shard stuck in his hand. What do you think?

P.S. Sorry if I'm a little confused.....I only recently started playing.... :smallredface:

Mad Wizard
2007-05-31, 06:13 PM
Well, going by Twilight Princess mostly, I think Link is mostly a mid to high level warblade, due to the maneuvers that he learns and uses, some of which have almost perfect representations in D&D. For some of his equipment, maybe a boomerang with use-activated gust of wind, holy longsword, and bow, among other things. How would one represent the clawshots? How much of Link's equipment is actually magical?

Deme
2007-05-31, 06:23 PM
Well, going by Twilight Princess mostly, I think Link is mostly a mid to high level warblade, due to the maneuvers that he learns and uses, some of which have almost perfect representations in D&D. For some of his equipment, maybe a boomerang with use-activated gust of wind, holy longsword, and bow, among other things. How would one represent the clawshots? How much of Link's equipment is actually magical?

I would say...only the boomerang, the dominion rod, possibly the spinner (haven't gotten that far yet, but I'm looking at the guide) and the master sword are actually magic, except for the armors. The bow might have an enhancement bonus.

Also, I think TP Link would have a higher strength scores than, well, a lot of the other Links....

the clawshot, I am still lost on, though...anyone have an idea?

Ditto
2007-05-31, 06:35 PM
I don't think any of the Watchers are particularly *good* wizards. If they were competent, they'd spend all that time researching new spells actually scribing them in their spellbooks. Every now and then, the Coven stops laughing and passes them a few scrolls. :smalltongue:

JaronK
2007-05-31, 07:02 PM
Harry Dresden: Gestalt Binder 13/Warlock 10/Hellfire Warlock 3. Thus all his use of circles for magic and his tendancy to blow things up, and of course his use of Hellfire. He's bound to Buer a lot, hence his ability to survive the punishment he's taken. He took the Obtain Familiar and Improved Familiar feat, giving him Bob.

JaronK

kjones
2007-05-31, 07:08 PM
The way I see it, the Watchers don't have any particularly strong natural powers, only those which are afforded to anyone who extensively studies the occult and magical arts. You could say the same about Wizards, but I think that being a powerful wizard really would require some sort of natural talent, otherwise everyone would be one. That's just my own prejudices, though.

Which raises the question: What does the Watcher's Council do, exactly? If anyone replies, "Watch", I'll pop you in the nose.

As for Giles: He can hold his own in a fight, but I wouldn't give him any levels in Warrior or anything, just the standard BAB that comes with any mid-level character. Even if he's a straight-up wizard, he still has 1/2 BAB progression. From his training with Buffy, one gets the sense that he knows his way around the martial arts, if only by reading about them in books. Physically, he's certainly at least middle age, with everything that implies. He can do some incantations, rituals, potions, etc., but none of that implies any talent, merely skill. Rupert's real strengths lie in his research abilities, which are proven time and time again to be invaluable, and in his paternal affection towards Buffy, which sets them apart in many ways from other Watcher/Slayer pairs (Wesley/Faith, anyone?)

Thexare Blademoon
2007-06-01, 01:35 AM
a) you forgot Twilight Princess ^^


That was intentional.


Let's see what I can do for OoT Link...

Duskblade seems good here. Good BAB, some spellcasting progression...

Stats:

Str: 14 - again, relies on strength-enhancing items.
Dex: 14 - he's got some more evasive maneuvers here.
Con: 12/14
Int: 15 - all five levels of Duskblade spells (they do go to 5, right?). Best way to simulate Din's Fire, I guess.
Wis: 10 - While he may not have had any reason specifically to believe that he'd open the Sacred Realm to Ganondorf, it was rather careless not to make sure he wasn't followed.
Cha: 12 - Mask salesman? I guess.

Skills: Max ranks in Ride, Tumble. Some ranks in Spellcraft. Some ranks in Jump.

Items: Master Sword, Biggoron's Sword, Kokiri Sword, Hero's Bow (Fire, Frost, and Holy Evil Outsider Bane Arrows), miscellaneous other equipment

Master Sword: This +1 Longsword acts as a +3 Longsword against evil creatures, +5 against evil outsiders. It cannot be sundered, and requires a Good alignemnt, non-chaotic. Required BAB: 10

Biggoron's Sword: This non-magical Greatsword can overcome any material-based damage reduction. Like the Master Sword, it cannot be sundered.

(I know, it's a stretch, but the Biggoron's Sword by itself wasn't really anything special.)

Kokiri Sword: This is just a +1 Shortsword that cannot be used by adults.

Hero's Bow: Simply a +1 Seeking Short Bow.

Leon
2007-06-01, 02:23 AM
Biggoron's Sword: This non-magical Greatsword can overcome any material-based damage reduction. Like the Master Sword, it cannot be sundered.


Adamantine/Cold Iron Alloy Fused with Alchemical Silver treated with the sacred oils of a Anointed Knight for Hardness and Health

GryffonDurime
2007-06-01, 02:41 AM
GryffonDurime, you think Vala and Daniel Jackson are both level 20? Wouldn't that make them near-god like? If that was the case, Daniel Jackson would never die (as opposed to dying numerous times) because he'd have so many HP that not even a gou'ald could take him out.

It's not so much what they are as where they'd be heading.

The idea being a full build; where they are on that path varies largely by episode and season, ne?

Tengu
2007-06-01, 04:17 AM
Mal is clearly CG - and not because he does not follow the laws. Possessing a code does not mean that you have to be lawful, besides - I haven't seen much of his so-called code in action. When he acted in a "lawful" way, it was either his pride or his conscience working.

Ditto
2007-06-01, 10:21 AM
Maybe Watchers (who WATCH! YES! MUAHAHA!) are some sort of Expert/Wizard combo. Or at least Giles is. Wesley figured out how to be a bit tougher after he actually got in the field. I'd be cool with Giles having 3/4, just cuz he's freaking awesome. Warrior would be over the top. I like the idea that Watchers never level up because they do nothing but scribe scrolls and brew potions and craft a few wondrous items and blow all their XP that way... it's not like they earn XP quickly anyway - "I myself have faced no less than *two* vampires. Under controlled conditions, of course." Woo, newbie-Wesley!

Serenity
2007-06-01, 10:24 AM
Thank you, Tengu. A code of honor does not make you lawful, it just means you have standards. Mal bucks (other) authority, mostly follows his conscience, and has been known to bend or break his own code when he felt it necessary. In the first episode, he informs Simon, "If I ever kill you, you'll be standing up, facing me, with a gun in your hand." Then, in Ariel, he knocks an unarmed Jayne out from behind to toss him out the airlock. Not to mention kicking Crow through the engine intake. He may insist on being in charge, but he's all about living free, not under someone's heel.

Serenity
2007-06-01, 10:37 AM
Oh, and further Firefly characters...

Simon Tam: Smart/Dedicated/Field Medic. Low Strength, moderate Dexterity, high intelligence and wisdom. Charisma is slightly above average--he's attractive but put his foot in his mouth on a regular basis. Max ranks in Heal, Knowledge (Biology, Chemistry). Allegiances to Good and River. (In regular alignment terms, Lawful Good->Neutral Good)

Kaywinnit Lee 'Kaylee' Frye: Smart/Techie. High Intelligence and maxed Charisma, but low Wisdom and Strength. Constitution is average; she has managed to recover from some pretty nasty wounds with medical attention, but she's clearly pretty fragile.

Zoe Alleyene Washburne: Fast/Strong/Soldier. Specializes in stealth/scouting type skills, like Hide, Move Silently, Search, Spot, and Listen. Main weapon is a sawed-off shotgun. I don't have the book on hand right now, so I can't say much more yet...

Deepblue706
2007-06-01, 10:38 AM
Anybody like Metal Gear Solid?

Solid Snake

Male Human
Fighter - lvl 50+
Alignment: Neutral

STR 15
DEX 24
CON 30
INT 16
WIS 16
CHA 11

Feats: All fighter bonus feats imaginable, barring Leap Attack, etc. Toughness would be taken at least 12 times. Also possesses every non-style and non-tactical feat from the Complete Warrior book - he'd probably have Elusive Target, though. Add in Skill Focus for both Move Silently and Hide, as well as Stealthy, Iron Will, Great Fortitude, Lightning Reflexes. Also, Able Learner. As for Epic Feats...he'd just keep increasing CON and DEX, maybe pick up Epic Toughness, and basically whatever else on the epic feat list a Fighter could EVER take and find useful.

Skills: Move Silently (cc), Hide (cc), and the rest nobody cares about.

Pauwel
2007-06-01, 10:42 AM
Anybody like Metal Gear Solid?

Solid Snake

Male Human
Fighter - lvl 50+
Alignment: Neutral

STR 15
DEX 24
CON 30
INT 16
WIS 16
CHA 11

Feats: All fighter bonus feats imaginable, barring Leap Attack, etc. Toughness would be taken at least 12 times. Also possesses every non-style and non-tactical feat from the Complete Warrior book - he'd probably have Elusive Target, though. Add in Skill Focus for both Move Silently and Hide, as well as Stealthy, Iron Will, Great Fortitude, Lightning Reflexes. Also, Able Learner. As for Epic Feats...he'd just keep increasing CON and DEX, maybe pick up Epic Toughness, and basically whatever else on the epic feat list a Fighter could EVER take and find useful.

Skills: Move Silently (cc), Hide (cc), and the rest nobody cares about.

Fanboy, much? :smallwink:

Deepblue706
2007-06-01, 10:45 AM
Fanboy, much? :smallwink:

lol COME ON! Do you know how many shots you can take in that game?

Big Boss in MGS3 literally takes shots to the head - and it's not even like a big moment in-game. You get shot by a mook, check your menu, and it says you have a bullet in your cranium. You extract it with your combat knife, put a bandage on it, and you keep moving. Also, you take on giant robots and tanks and...

...yeah shut up. Snake pwns.

Amphimir Míriel
2007-06-01, 11:53 AM
Miles Naismith Vorkosigan (around the time of Cetaganda, the third book)

Neutral Good Aristocrat 5 / Rogue 10

STR 8
DEX 13
CON 14 (had to endure multiple surgeries and painful treatments during youth)
INT 17 (brilliant intelligence, able to think outside the box)
WIS 13
CHA 18 (is able to convince everybody and his mother of almost anything)

Maxed out Bluff, Diplomacy, Gather Info and Sense Motive, with decent points in a few Knowledge skills

elliott20
2007-06-01, 11:56 AM
Snake, just like the Firefly crew, comes across as someone who just wouldn't fit very well into the conventional D&D setting as well. However, if we had to force his character into a D&D setting, I'd imagined him to be some kind of Fighter/Rogue build with another capstone PrC. Given his performance to in the games vis-a-vis the performance we've seen of characters in other video games, I would say that he's roughly around a level 12-15 or so. I definitely don't see him as a level 20 character.

As a character whose primary focus is in intensive combat training, I imagine that he would definitely have very good physical stats, probably with CON outstripping the rest of them, considering how much punishment and endurance he's exhibited in the games. (Not mention his ridiculous threshold for pain)

But I also think he would have at least decent, if not excellent mental scores. (Though we don't get to see TOO much usage of these scores, to be honest) His display of knowledge, however, could be simply a by-product of being in a class that is skill points intensive. So, it's really a toss up there. I'd say his mental stats would average out around a 14 or so, while his physical stats probably average out at 17-20.

Yeah, snake is obviously not using 32 point buy.

The Prince of Cats
2007-06-01, 12:52 PM
Maybe Watchers (who WATCH! YES! MUAHAHA!) are some sort of Expert/Wizard combo. Or at least Giles is.
Giles is hard to stat. His magic is probably incantations or even a single level of bard (he has a lot of random knowledge) and we saw him fencing with Buffy while reading a book in an early episode. Ripper implies a few experiences before he started on his current lifestyle and bard might suit it better than pure rogue or warrior.

Personally, I think Giles is a D20 Modern character. He is a Smart Hero who took a level or two in a spell-casting PrC when he was younger but is generally focused on just being a Smart Hero.

elliott20
2007-06-01, 12:54 PM
Giles is hard to stat. His magic is probably incantations or even a single level of bard (he has a lot of random knowledge) and we saw him fencing with Buffy while reading a book in an early episode. Ripper implies a few experiences before he started on his current lifestyle and bard might suit it better than pure rogue or warrior.

Personally, I think Giles is a D20 Modern character. He is a Smart Hero who took a level or two in a spell-casting PrC when he was younger but is generally focused on just being a Smart Hero.

Most of the characters discussed in this thread thus far are D20 modern characters.

Drascin
2007-06-01, 01:05 PM
The question, of course, boils down to this:

Pirate Zelda, or Ninja Zelda?

Tetra was awesome. Also, she was the only Zelda with a bit of a disposition to hold her own in a battle in pretty much ever (and was able to aim, unlike TP Zelda, who had me grumbling "just give me the damn bow and I'll shoot myslef while riding. I have better aim with my left pinky toe than you do with your hands!"). Plus any Zelda who solves an entry conundrum through the application of cannonfire merits extra points in my book :P. And WW is severely underrated. Therefore, for all of these reasons, pirate Zelda. Which pains me, since I'm usually on the side of ninjas in this internet war

Also, I'd give OoT Link a bit more Wisdom than a 10 - yeah, he did some reckless things, but the guy had a nice Will save, given the things he endured (and the fact that he didn't squash Navi :smalltongue: )

Now, seeing my sig, I'm feeling inspired to do some Disgaea.

Laharl, Prince to the Underworld

Race: Either Half-fiend or simply Evil Outsider, given his demonic heritage far overpowers his human one.
Class: I'm going with mostly warblade, with maybe a bit of Barbarian sprinkled in for his tendency to get angry and beat things into a pulp rather fast. During cutscenes he seems to have a fairly strong magical power, and his three special attacks attest to this power, but this could be most likely attributed to some kind of template, given it seems to be more of an inborn thing than actual magic training.
Alignment: CE all the way. Around the end of the game, he starts making a slight shift towards CN, but he's still solidly CE.

Scores (trying to stay somewhat reasonable, so I'll go with basics. His templates will probably push some of these to high heaven):

Strenght: 18. Max score here, and with good reason. When a character can two-hit a very tricked out final boss who outlevels him by more than a 20%, you know you're looking at a very heavy hitter.
Dexterity: 12-14. He fights unarmored, so I can only think he has some ability to dodge, but he's not exceptionally nimble, and his reaction time has been proven to be somewhat below par.
Constitution: 16. He's very resistant to injury, both enemy and ally -induced, and in-game, his HP total was pretty impressive.
Intelligence: 10-12. No, he's not an idiot. Laharl gets things quickly, and can be devious when he has a good day. If he seems like a dunce sometimes is because of the next point...
Wisdom: 6 ...Namely, that his wisdom is absolutely abysmal. Overconfident, rash, prone to acting too quickly, you name it, he's got it.
Charisma: 6 Don't misunderstand me, I like the guy, but when someone can't command the respect he wants and is consistently laughed at, despite being able to crush you with the middle toe of his left feet, it looks like a sign of horrid charisma score.

Okay, whoever was playing this guy, had some pretty polarized rolls. Also probably was a very close friend to the DM, given the powerful templating with no repercussion that the character enjoyed :smallwink: .

-------------------------------------

Flonne, Angel Trainee

Race: Duh. She's an angel, so Good Outsider.
Class: some kind of noncombative Cha-based Cleric or Favored Soul, probably. She just sin't that effective by herself in combat. She's a good healer, tho.
Alignment: I'd say NG. She's got a lawful streak, what with her abiding by all Celestian rules and accepting undue punishments just because she had to, but she's also pretty chaotic in action, being fairly random and acting as she thinks it's best despite her orders, so I feel it evens up. And she keeps attempting to help everyone, avobe everything else, which I seem to remember was pretty much the NG description in the manual.

Scores:

Strength: 8. Flonne wasn't very strong. I don't feel this needs much explanation. Her body is like that of a what, 12 year old?
Dexterity: 12-14. She manages to fire a bow with good accuracy despite minimal training. On the other hand, she's also a bit of a klutz at times.
Constitution: 12-14 Yeah, she looks frail, but I dunno, she didn't have mage-like HP and she seemed surprisingly resistent for a little, frail girl. I mean, just to endure the conditions Laharl had her in for a lot of time, she had to be hardy.
Intelligence: 6-8. Flonee was, how to put it... not the sharpest tool in the shed. "Oh, hello :smallsmile:. My name is Flonne. I'm an assassin sent from Celestia to kill the Overlord. Nice to meet you". To said Overlord's son's face. Yeah :smallsigh: .
Wisdom: 4. When Laharl, of all people, calls you ditzy, you know your attention span has issues. Add to that a tendency of being distracted by every cute thing in existence, and... well, you can picture it.
Charisma: 20. Flonne is not a girl. She is a receptacle of pure, unadultered cute, congealed and given bipedal form. She has proven able to stop CE psychos just by smiling and being her usual idiot self. She has managed to stay on everyone's (including opposing parties) good side without even realizing it. Hell, she has managed to make a demon, and a especially antisocial one at that, care for her. Yeah, the girl's got some mighty Cha score.

...This looks so much like a character I would play.

And I'm having to go for now. Next time, I'll try to get Adell and Rozalin.

Thexare Blademoon
2007-06-01, 04:52 PM
Also, I'd give OoT Link a bit more Wisdom than a 10 - yeah, he did some reckless things, but the guy had a nice Will save, given the things he endured (and the fact that he didn't squash Navi :smalltongue: )Duskblade has good Will progression, IIRC. Good point about Navi, though... Iron Will, perhaps. Didn't bother assigning any feats.


Now, seeing my sig, I'm feeling inspired to do some Disgaea.

Laharl, Prince to the Underworld

Race: Either Half-fiend or simply Evil Outsider, given his demonic heritage far overpowers his human one.I'd call it Human, mechanically, since (aside from the first Disgaea greatly favoring plot characters) he's really not much different from the other humanoids

Pauwel
2007-06-01, 05:10 PM
lol COME ON! Do you know how many shots you can take in that game?

Big Boss in MGS3 literally takes shots to the head - and it's not even like a big moment in-game. You get shot by a mook, check your menu, and it says you have a bullet in your cranium. You extract it with your combat knife, put a bandage on it, and you keep moving. Also, you take on giant robots and tanks and...

...yeah shut up. Snake pwns.

Oh, I agree, Snake is truly awesome. He is not a god, however, and the fact that he can pick out a bullet from his skull with a knife in the midst of battle isn't because he's a divine combat medic, it's because the games are totally unrealistic in that matter.
If you want to stat Snake, use Mutants and Masterminds. It'll be way easier, and I have actually seen some pretty effective Snake builds at realistic Power Levels (8 or so, which is what I would put him at myself).

Ditto
2007-06-01, 05:16 PM
Actually, I think taking Ripper into account makes him seem a lot *more* like a Wizard. They were messing around with primal forces for kicks and giggles, and poof! They made a little Big Bad (Eyghon) when they were sitting around the campfire stoned one night. If wanton universe-tinkering isn't a wizard, I don't know what is. :smallsmile:

And he has Weapon Finesse. Fencing, some light broadswording, and he's damn handy with a crossbow. He's no pantywaist. Every wizard has 1/2, sure, but most of them just pick up a quarterstaff and forget about it. God forbid someone actually use his BAB for something... I don't know that bard fits, because all of the Watchers are pretty clearly research oriented. The whole Buffy world seems prepared-caster oriented anyway, what with ritualistic and formulaic magic. Everyone always needs their eye of newt and blood of the unclean. ("Why is it always *blood* of the unclean? Can't it ever be *urine* of the unclean?" ::Wes draws the dagger to slice Lorne:: "Oh, I think I'm making some of that right now...")

Serenity
2007-06-01, 08:56 PM
I said Archivist largely for the Dark Knowledge ability, which seems to be the purpose of the Watcher...

Runa
2007-06-01, 10:55 PM
Giles has ranks in Perform (Guitar) and Perform (Sing), remember? :smalltongue: Of course he's got a level or two of Bard... but I think he's mostly Wizard, with one or two Fighter levels. Or that Archivist thing. Then again, Bard does give some rather Fighter-like abilities, doesn't it? (Or at least, that's the way our Bard played it in that one game... *imitates*: "Trip! STAB! Trip... STABBITY STAB!") Plus all those Knowledge class skills. Makes sense, actually.


-Runa

Ditto
2007-06-02, 12:43 AM
Dark Knowledge? Watchers are such pantywaists! Dark Knowledge scares them. Or else, they get excited and write it in a book and congratulate themselves for being clever and then promise that they'll lock it up so no recurring villain from season 5 can get a hold of it and let loose its unspeakable terror into the world. >.>

Again, Giles/HarryPotterHair Wesley vs. all other Watchers/Preppy'n'Proper Wesley are two different things. There should perhaps be variant rules like in Unearthed Arcana for a Book Watcher and a Field Watcher. Think about it... there's only one *actual* watcher in the world at a time, handling a slayer. They should probably beef up their skill set, even if it's not fighting. As for the Perform ranks, I'm torn... if you think Quentin Travers has Perform as a class skill, you're sorely mistaken; then again, Giles totally Enthralled the women Scoobies when they caught him crooning in Where the Wild Things Are. :smallamused:

Giles has no exceptional combat skills. He fights the same as Robin Wood or Xander. He's picked up a few extra weapon proficiencies and takes the time to use them, that's all.

AtomicKitKat
2007-06-02, 08:23 AM
Oh snap! I just realised what Watchers are. Loremasters! They have the mad knowledge, they pick up weird Feats and stuff, etc.

Ditto
2007-06-02, 10:41 AM
Still coming out of a Wizard base, of course. :smallwink: But honestly, I think Loremasters are way too cool for Watchers. They know tons of bonus languages, sure, but that doesn't turn into bonuses to reflex saves and hit points. Those guys are squishy!

Lobsopdoy
2007-06-09, 06:25 PM
I think Solid Snake would be NG. He's the only "snake" who really puts people over ideals. That's why he ends up where he is in Metal Gear Solid 2

*runs away*

TheGreatJabu
2007-06-09, 07:35 PM
Whew! Lots of things to comment on!

Buffy the Vampire Slayer

I also believe that being the Slayer is pretty much its own race and/or template. My vote goes for 20-24 Strength (she can overpower common vamps, but the "elite" ones were stronger than her), about 16 Dexterity, and probably a good 16-20 Con. She's somewhat bright (but never applies herself in her school work), so I'll give her about a 13 for Int. Wisdom - 10. She falls for every trap just about every time. Angelus's words in Season 2 - "*Laughing*...and you fall for it every time!" Charisma around 13 or 14 - she's not super suave but she can be charming/intimidating. I think a lowish-level Monk / moderate level fighter would describe her best. Like a Monk 5/Fighter 9. She's not super-skilled at Martial Arts, she's just decent but has LUDICROUS damage from all that Strength. She doesn't avoid attacks all too often, just shrugs them off (high HP from all that Constitution).

Xander? My hero and role model in life? Was a level 1 or 2 commoner, turned into commando-man at Halloween to get a level in warrior (he says a time or two that he retains all his memories of his training "I'm pretty sure I can take an m16 apart in under 30 seconds.". After that he probably alternates between levels in Warrior and Expert (he starts being able to kind of hold his own against common vamps in the later seasons, does he not?)
Str 13 Dex 12 Con 12 Int 10 Wis 14 (except when it comes to his ladies, his instincts aren't that bad) Cha 14. We know he has ranks in Craft, Swim, a bit in Diplomacy, and Heal (if he can perform CPR, he's got to have some training). I also like the comment about lots of ranks in Knowledge: Useless stuff. Seems like a good call to me. :smallbiggrin:

Willow? Magic is too different, so I'll just sell-out and say she's a Spellcaster from the Generic classes in Unearthed Arcana. :smallbiggrin: Or maybe a super-high level Adept.

Watchers? Level 0 wizards all the way. Drop a level in Expert here or there. Give Giles a level in Rogue from his wilder "Ripper" days. If you've been possessed by a demon god, watch out for Giles and his pillow-sneak attack!

Firefly:

D20 modern is really the way to go for this show. Jayne seems like a combo of Strong Hero and Tough Hero. Mal seems like a Fast Hero/Gunslinger. River? Good God. Lots of levels in Strong Hero, a few in Fast Hero, and take the Martial Artist PrC. At least I THINK one of the Strong-based PrCs is Martial Artist. My old d20 Modern SRD website doesn't work right for me anymore.

Legend of Zelda:

Depends ENTIRELY on the game. Anything on a console from OoT onwards, Link is pretty fierce. However, as has been mentioned there's a disparity between his Strength in OoT and Twilight Princess (now he can pick up heavy stuff all on his own!)

For Twilight Princess, I'd say...
Str 15
Dex 19 (You can roll out of the way of ALMOST ANYTHING - and how often do you not win Initiative?)
Con 12 (with Endurance feat)
Int 13
Wis 12
Cha 14

Class? Fighter - all the way. Warblades and knights and crusaders are wonderful and all, but fighter suits him better. Give him a couple of Skill Tricks from Complete Scoundrel and a few feats from Complete Warrior/Adventurer, and it's a perfect build. There's no denying he has 1,000,000 feats. What skills does he use besides 1. Jump 2. Ride 3. Climb 4. Tumble (cross-class, all he does is roll and backflip) and 5. Balance (cross-class, if you get hit you're STILL definitely falling off).

I actually had the Master Sword discussion with some friends while we were playing Twilight Princess. We thought it was pretty much a fancified version of a +3 Holy Longsword, possibly with Bane (Wielder of the Triforce of Power). It's most likely Intelligent but can't speak or perform any special power. It just disallows almost everyone from drawing it.

Solid Snake:

D20 Modern takes him home, as well. It's pretty easy to take 1,000 bullets to the face if guns do 2d6 damage. I'd just say he's Strong Hero/Soldier/Fast Hero/Infiltrator. Probably roughly level 16 when you shell those levels out.

Inuyasha:

Is there an animé character that DOESN'T have at least 5 levels in Monk? I'd say mostly Monk with possibly some SwordSage. My dilemma in giving him much in the ways of swordfighting classes is that he never really does anything spectacularly impressive with that giant doggy tooth of his. He just swings it around and occasionally releases its special power. That's more just having a Huge-sized katana that can cast a really powerful attack spell once a day.

Everyone else mentioned:

Don't know them. Sorry.

CockroachTeaParty
2007-06-09, 09:02 PM
I question Snakes INT score... It's probably around 6. Come on, he has to have someone call him to tell him how to climb a ladder!

TheGreatJabu
2007-06-09, 09:06 PM
Hahah! Fair enough. Maybe he's just SOOOO lawful, that he has to be ordered to perform simple tasks.

Unless shooting dozens of people and crawling around inside cardboard boxes is chaotic. If it is, then the system is broken. :smallconfused:

Swordguy
2007-06-09, 09:34 PM
Those of you wondering about Dan Jackson and other SG-1 characters...there IS a d20 SG-1 RPG published until very recently by AEG. You can check thier specific stats there.

Beleriphon
2007-06-09, 10:24 PM
Superman!

He's a second level Kryptonian fighter. If nothing else his massive strength bonus makes up for his his other lack of skills. Fortitude save? Huge con bonus. Anything else is rolled up into Profess (Journalist) and cross class skills.

SurlySeraph
2007-06-10, 12:48 AM
Jack Bauer's a Tough Hero/Soldier/Infiltrator. Tough Hero for the ridiculous amounts of damage he survives every day, Soldier for his combat skills, and Infiltrator for his stealth and heavy use of improvised weapons. He's got Weapon Focus (pistol) and Weapon Specialization (pistol), plus Weapon Focus (switchblade) and a lot of unarmed combat feats. Bauer also has max ranks in Intimidate and Skill Focus (Intimidate) for the torture.

Dhavaer
2007-06-10, 01:53 AM
Bauer also has max ranks in Intimidate and Skill Focus (Intimidate) for the torture.

d20 Modern doesn't have a Skill Focus feat. He could be a Dedicated Hero, or he could take the Confident feat.

SurlySeraph
2007-06-10, 02:42 AM
^ Jack Bauer's occasionnal bouts of extreme (if entirely justified) self-hatred pretty much preclude anything with "Confident" in the name, and he's obsessively dedicated to America, so a level in Dedicated Hero would make sense.

mauslin
2007-06-10, 02:23 PM
I'm curious on how some of the characters from Discworld would be statted. Like say, Granny Weatherwax, Sam Vimes, and the Patrician.

Dhavaer
2007-06-10, 05:46 PM
I'm curious on how some of the characters from Discworld would be statted. Like say, Granny Weatherwax, Sam Vimes, and the Patrician.

Granny would probably be a Telepath/Druid or Telepath//Druid. Vimes is a Rogue/Streetfighter. The Patrician is a Rogue.

Serenity
2007-06-10, 05:52 PM
Aristocrat/Assassin with extraordinary Charisma and Intelligence. Pumped ranks in Bluff, Intimidate, etc.

AtomicKitKat
2007-06-11, 12:55 AM
Buffy probably doesn't have much more than 20 Strength(just enough to overpower your average High School American Football Player/Wrestler). 24 would be near the end of the series, when she's put her level up points into it.

Slayer template: +2-4 Strength, +2-4 Dexterity, +2-4 Constitution, +2 Charisma(it really depends on the Slayer. It's mostly just enough to put them over the average semi-fit person/match a vampire) Fast Healing 1(Enough to recover from an unarmed humanoid roughing up within minutes, but slow enough that they actually take real damage when fighting non-humans). Premonition 1/plot Feels like PMS. :smalltongue: I'm undecided about the Charisma bonus. On the one hand, they're certainly a lot more assertive(not to mention, more attractive) than the average female. On the other hand, maybe the Slayer power just calls out to those who are already more assertive/attractive than the norm.

Lobsopdoy
2007-06-11, 02:50 PM
I wonder what Roland Deschain's (The Gunslinger) stats would be. Once I even got a suggestion that he should be one of those unstatted "Your characters die if they attack him" characters

psychoticbarber
2007-06-11, 05:31 PM
Miles Naismith Vorkosigan (around the time of Cetaganda, the third book)

Neutral Good Aristocrat 5 / Rogue 10

STR 8
DEX 13
CON 14 (had to endure multiple surgeries and painful treatments during youth)
INT 17 (brilliant intelligence, able to think outside the box)
WIS 13
CHA 18 (is able to convince everybody and his mother of almost anything)

Maxed out Bluff, Diplomacy, Gather Info and Sense Motive, with decent points in a few Knowledge skills

I sadly have little to add, but I LOVE you. Officially. As of now.

Nerd-o-rama
2007-06-11, 05:43 PM
How about the Heroes? Obviously, Mutants & Masterminds would be the best d20 system for them, but there are a few I can manage through D&D classes rather than custom templates.

Nikki/Jessica. Gestalt Barbarian/Barbarian. Yes, I'm aware that makes no sense.
Isaac Mendez. Expert...Divine Oracle. Hmm. Needs casting from somewhere.
Claire Bennet. Low level bard with...dammit...Fast Healing template from somewhere.
Sylar: Wizard/Master of the Unseen Hand who somehow got into the Illithid Savant PrC. And has Contingent True Resurrections from somewhere as well. Stupid BBEGs.
The Haitian: Telepath with a really, really focused power set.
Mr. Linderman: Aristocrat/Healer.
Eden McCain and Candace Wilmer: Both Beguilers, one focused on Enchantment, the other on Illusion.
Mr. Bennet. There are a number of Rogue or Ranger-based PrC's that fit his job, and I don't feel like looking them all up.
There's no time-controlling classes I know of, but Zerth Cenobites use deja-fu in much the same manner as Future Hiro.

Yeah, let's stick to M&M, although that's kinda harder to discuss.

SurlySeraph
2007-06-11, 06:28 PM
Okay, I'm bored. I'm going to try to stat out Hamlet.

Aristocrat 3/ Fighter 1

Feats: Negotiator, Deceitful, at least 1 dual-wielding feat for the last scene in the play, and Leadership (with Horatio as his cohort).

Skills: Lots of ranks in Bluff and Diplomacy, ranks in Knowledge (religion), Knowledge (philosophy), and Knowledge (nobility).

Alignment: This is the textbook example of where alignment systems don't work. With that said, Chaotic Neutral, with Lawful Good, Chaotic Good, and Neutral Evil tendencies. Not that that's a legal alignment, but it works.

Possibly he took insanity as a flaw, if you think he isn't feigning madness, but I'm not going to get in to that.

Runa
2007-06-11, 08:54 PM
How about the Heroes? Obviously, Mutants & Masterminds would be the best d20 system for them, but there are a few I can manage through D&D classes rather than custom templates.

Nikki/Jessica. Gestalt Barbarian/Barbarian. Yes, I'm aware that makes no sense.


Actually, the Barbarian thing makes perfect sense. After all the "Jessica" half is physically stronger, and lacks a lot of Nikki's patience and fear. You call Jessica the "rage" part of her, with exception that she does it more often than Barbarians actually can. :P However, I would say she's also got a level or two of Rogue, with her criminal activities. Her alignment would be hard to figure, but I suppose Chaotic Neutral would work (some part of me figures she'd be Neutral, I don't know why, except maybe it's me trying to balance the seemingly Evil Jessica with the clearly mostly Good Nikki)

What would DL be? Some kind of caster?

Micah is, I'm not actually as familiar with some of the terminology that's being tossed around her, but perhaps an "Expert"? With some crazy casting and Craft abilities? I realize he's young, but... then again, it seems like the whole cast is nearing epic levels already! :P


-Runa

Callix
2007-06-12, 06:35 AM
I'm going to have to contribute something to the Daniel Jackson debate here. Early levels pure Expert, with Speak Language, Knowledge (History), Profession (Archaeologist), Decipher Script, Diplomacy, and anything else that seems to fit. Stats: low Con (Allergies, tendency to die), high Int (academic), Low Wis (See Withdrawal, Hathor. He tends to fall under charm effects fairly regularly), average Cha (Hit-and-miss negotiations, a beautiful wife, several social gaffes), average Dex (doesn't get shot all that often even though he keeps dying) and average Strength. Later on, he starts to get some interesting stuff with an Ascended template etc.

Sam, on the other hand... Expert with Craft (Technology), Knowledge (Science), Knowledge (Technology), Disable Device, and much more. Few quick abilities: Freed Host. Can sense Goa'uld in a 10' radius. Possesses knowledge of parasite. Can function as either possessed or free, whichever is more beneficial (the hand device, the insanity bugs). Jury-rigging: can turn any technological device into any other device, but it takes X time and only works for Y time. Bombs are a favourite, as they only need to work once. Maybe take a few levels of Fighter to add attack bonus and proficiency (Goa'uld hand device).

elliott20
2007-06-12, 09:09 AM
Okay, I'm bored. I'm going to try to stat out Hamlet.

Aristocrat 3/ Fighter 1

Feats: Negotiator, Deceitful, at least 1 dual-wielding feat for the last scene in the play, and Leadership (with Horatio as his cohort).

Skills: Lots of ranks in Bluff and Diplomacy, ranks in Knowledge (religion), Knowledge (philosophy), and Knowledge (nobility).

Alignment: This is the textbook example of where alignment systems don't work. With that said, Chaotic Neutral, with Lawful Good, Chaotic Good, and Neutral Evil tendencies. Not that that's a legal alignment, but it works.

Possibly he took insanity as a flaw, if you think he isn't feigning madness, but I'm not going to get in to that.
He would need to be at least level 6 to take the leadership feat. Though, to be honest, he doesn't need to gain horatio necessarily as a cohort really. He could just have horatio as a loyal NPC.

If we take into account of the whole concept of "4th level characters are like the MENSA intellectual elite" model, then putting Hamlet there, who probably does belong to the top 2% of the skilled world population, wouldn't too far of a stretch to me.

Though, stating out Hamlet would also necessitate we stat out Horatio as well.

Commoner 1 / Warrior 1 / Fighter 1

Seeing as Horatio came from a peasant background, he'll need at least one level in commoner. His time spent in the military as a soldier along side Hamlet's father would give him a level of warrior, although depending upon how you would like interpret this, he could have gained a fighter level instead of just a warrior level.

He's rational and the voice of reason, which serves to be Hamlet's foil in the works. It is suggested from this that he might be lawful neutral and he probably possesses slightly higher than normal mental stats for someone in his position. (maybe a WIS and INT 12-13 range)

His explicitly forgetful presence (which I believe was a very deliberate move on Shakespeare part) suggests he might not have a stellar charisma score either. But this could simply be because he chose to be silent as opposed to him not having any real presence when he chooses to assert himself.

Lobsopdoy
2007-06-22, 02:27 PM
No takers for Roland Deschain then?

Lycurgus
2007-06-24, 09:12 AM
Simply Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Cleric 5/ Mystic Theurge lots. He's supposed to be a great wizard, which in his world includes consorting with/working for a god or gods (thus the Mystic Theurge). Most of his hand-to-hand "skill" actually comes from Stormbringer. Al:TN. He wants to be better than he is, but is strongly linked to forces of pure evil.

"I was ever more evil than thou."

Remember that the conflict was between Law and Chaos, not Good and Evil. He might have a level or few of Favored Soul for Lord Arioch. In one of the more recent books he dealt with an ancestral pact with an Elemental Prince also. Could be that his Wizard levels were Conjuror specialized. The Raumathari Battlemage PrC has a very Elric feel to it also, except for the evocation bit.