Maximizing Fort as a Conjurer

[Jeargroth]

Hey Fellow Players,

I am starting a new Conjurer/Malconvoker/Archmage/Masterspecialist... she starts at lvl 7 and could play till lvl 20... Problem... Reflex and Fort saves. Her Will will be through the freaking roof, but all classes take a serious hit to Fort and Ref. Now I can get around Reflex saves by taking the feat Insightful Reflexes for a bit of a boost through my Int as its my primary needed stat. However, Fortitude is a loss... I can't see how to pump it up other than Items... there is no Feat that allows Int to Fort save. I saw a couple items like the Diamond Mind Ring, and the Belt of Endurance. Is that all i have to choose from a lot of expensive items that take up valuable body slots?

Any other ideas and feedback would be appreciated.

[LudicSavant]

Hey Fellow Players,

I am starting a new Conjurer/Malconvoker/Archmage/Masterspecialist... she starts at lvl 7 and could play till lvl 20... Problem... Reflex and Fort saves. Her Will will be through the freaking roof, but all classes take a serious hit to Fort and Ref. Now I can get around Reflex saves by taking the feat Insightful Reflexes for a bit of a boost through my Int as its my primary needed stat. However, Fortitude is a loss... I can't see how to pump it up other than Items... there is no Feat that allows Int to Fort save. I saw a couple items like the Diamond Mind Ring, and the Belt of Endurance. Is that all i have to choose from a lot of expensive items that take up valuable body slots?

Any other ideas and feedback would be appreciated.

Sourcebooks? Other party members? Any houserules or variants (such as flaws, etc)? Attribute spread?

[Deophaun]

I saw a couple items like the Diamond Mind Ring, and the Belt of Endurance. Is that all i have to choose from a lot of expensive items that take up valuable body slots?

If you're allowed the MIC, they don't take up that much in terms of body slots simply because common enhancements can be placed on those items without raising the prices. Even then, the price of a novice ring of the diamond mind is modest enough at 3,000 gp that the 50% tax isn't going to be felt for long.

And there's the headband of conscious effort in the MIC which is even cheaper for a 1/day effect.

[Jeargroth]

Sourcebooks? Other party members? Any houserules or variants (such as flaws, etc)? Attribute spread?

Lots of other party members all source books allowed with exceptions to specifics like "Item Familiar" that got banned out right... and I haven't done my Attribute spread as I haven't rolled yet. I am looking for ways to not make Con my primary start stat.

[animewatcha]

Let's try this another way. What affects does an undead need to up fort save for?

[LudicSavant]

Lots of other party members all source books allowed with exceptions to specifics like "Item Familiar" that got banned out right... and I haven't done my Attribute spread as I haven't rolled yet. I am looking for ways to not make Con my primary start stat.

Lots of other party members? How many? What are their abilities so that we can give you suggestions that synergize with them? All source books? Does that mean "all official 3.5e sourcebooks" or does it mean Dragon Magazine, 3.0, Pathfinder, third party, etc too?

The more information you can provide, the more helpful the feedback people can give you will be.

[Rubik]

Two feats: Wedded to History (Survivor) to use Will saves instead of Fort or Ref, but at an escalating penalty to Will saves each time you use it. Keen Intellect to use Int on Will saves instead of Wis, and Int on Wis-based skills instead of Wis.

Combine the two, and your Will save will be even higher, and you can use it in lieu of your Fort and Ref saves.

Take Faerie Mysteries Initiate to add Int to hp instead of Con.

Then you won't need Con for anything but Concentration checks, really.

[Jeargroth]

Paladin/Monk/Cleric

Cleric of Pelor (undead blaster type can't remember name)

Sorcerer- Dragon Blooded

Warforged Juggernaut-

Frenzied Berzerker-


are my fellow classes... not worrying about synergzing with them... but just keeping my fort higher and butt out of a Save vs Death spell... Like my last character got nailed with 4 times in the same game by 2 different encounters. Core, Splat and Some Dragon is allowed... No pathfinder.

[LudicSavant]

Greater Resistance (Spell Compendium). +3 Resistance bonus to all saves. It lasts 24 hours, which means that you can cast it the day before you go adventuring, and have the slot free the next day while the buff is still in effect. Your cleric can cast it too. Also, remember that you have the ability to have "empty" spell slots that you prepare later in the day.

You can "even out" your saves with traits (Unearthed Arcana) that give -1 to one trait and +1 to another.

A Headband of Conscious Effort (Magic Item Compendium) is 2000gp and allows you to attempt a Concentration check instead of a Fortitude Save once per day.

An Amulet of Fortune Prevailing (Magic Item Compendium) is 5000gp and allows you to reroll a save (which raises the average value of your d20 roll to ~14 and makes it much less likely to get low rolls).

Alter Fortune (Player's Handbook II) is a 3rd level spell that you, the Sorcerer, or Cleric can cast which pays a small XP cost to reroll a save as an immediate action. It is worth the XP cost!

A Ring of the Diamond Mind will allow you to replace a save with a Concentration check (without checking, IIRC you need to be level 2, 7, and 10 to use it for Will, Reflex, and Fortitude without any Martial Adept levels, respectively).

Con-boosting items and spells will of course boost your Fort saves. You should be getting these anyways so that you're not quite as squishy. Use the MiC rules to add Con boosts onto other items (instead of taking up a slot just for that).

Your cleric has a laundry list of spells that will boost your saves very high (Greater Resistance, Tyche's Touch, Recitation, and Conviction or Mass Conviction together will give you a +13 bonus to saves, for example. Tyche's Touch and Greater Resistance have 24 hour durations. Mass Conviction lasts over an hour. Recitation and Mass Conviction affect the whole party. All of these spells stack).

Also don't only look at boosting Fortitude Saves:

- Making yourself harder to target will reduce the number of saves you need to make. This can be accomplished with all kinds of methods (AC, miss chances, mobility, illusions, battlefield control, debuffs, sufficient offensive power, etc etc etc)

- Making yourself immune to various effects, or able to counter various effects (such as with a Third Eye Clarity from MiC) will reduce the danger of many effects that require fortitude saves. Look for immunities to poison, death effects, etc. For example, Death Ward Armor will make you shrug off a Death Effect or negative energy effect 1/day.

[Inevitability]

A rat or pinguin gives you a +2 bonus on Fortitude saves. Put it in a Familiar Pocket if you worry about its fragility.

[Ger. Bessa]

A dip in mindbender gives +2 for, grants telepathy and progresses spellcasting. If you have room for it in your build, it only costs a few ranks in social skills.

I Believe Ruathar gives +2 ref, as does Unseen seer, but Ruathar doesn't grant much (1 martial proficiency?) and Unseen seer requires LOTS of ranks.

[Jeargroth]

Thanks all... His Fort is in the Toilet but his Will is through the Roof... Will just try to make self harder to hit and find resistance items to buff up.

[LudicSavant]

Thanks all... His Fort is in the Toilet but his Will is through the Roof... Will just try to make self harder to hit and find resistance items to buff up.

Using no items:

- Since you seem to feel you have more than enough Will but not enough Fort, consider the Passionate trait that gives you -1 Will, +1 Fort. There's also Hardy which gives you +1 Fort, -1 Reflex.

- Get a rat familiar. +2 Fort.

- Cast Greater Resistance on yourself. Lasts 24 hours, +3 to all saves.

- Ask your party cleric to cast Conviction on you (it's a level 1 spell) or Mass Conviction on the whole party (level 3) spell. It's got a pretty long duration (1 hour and 10 minutes base by CL7).

- Also ask your cleric to cast Tyche's Touch on you. 24 hours, +4 to your first save during that period, -1 to the bonus for each successive save after that.

- Have Alter Fortune prepared in case you fail a save.

- Boost your Constitution a bit.

So, with 16 Constitution, Tyche's Touch, Conviction, Greater Resistance, Hardy, rat familiar, Passionate, and +2 from your class levels, that's +19 Fortitude with no feats or items used. And then if you fail a Fort save, you can cast Alter Fortune as an immediate action to reroll it.

There's also some other good save-boosting spells that aren't so long-lasting but will stack with all of that, like Recitation (which affects the whole party).

[Deophaun]

- Ask your party cleric...
More specifically, buy the party cleric a pearl of power of the appropriate level.

[ericgrau]

Also give the party cleric scrolls of remove this and remove that. Many of them are fort based effects.

[TheifofZ]

A Cloak of Resistance of any tier functions in much the same way as the Resistance spell line (indeed, the spells are required to make the cloak, and both occupy the same 'buff type-slot'.)
A +1 version only costs 1k gold, and adds 1 to all saves.
Higher levels cost more, but a +2 wouldn't be awry.

Also, a Rat/Penguin familiar, as mentioned above, is solid as a +2 bonus to Fort, if you don't have a familiar you -need- yet.

Use a trait to drop either Reflex or Will by 1 to increase your Fort by the same.
If you aren't too feat-starved, Iron Will will get you another +2.

If you go Cloak of Resistance +1, take the familiar, feat, and the Passionate trait, you'll gain +6 Fort, +1 Ref, +0 Will.
That's entirely doable at 3rd level, and adds a better Fort save than the generic fighter has by then.