Earliest entry PRCs

[SangoProduction]

I need them for either roguish classes or arcane casters. They don't need to be particularly good, just need to be able to enter as early as possible (no later than level 4).

Please also state how one would enter the class early.

[Necroticplague]

Rainbow Servant can be entered at second level.

[SangoProduction]

New stipulation:
Please also state how one would enter the class early.

[Abemad]

With versatile spellcaster and heighten spell, a sorcerer/shugenja can enter mystic theurge starting at level 4... While not exactly the best combo, it is very fun until about lvl 15-ish.

[ahenobarbi]

Dragonwrought kobold can enter any PRc that requires dragonblood as early as level 1. If you want something actually good Sorcer 1 / Singer of Concordance 4 is a nice way to start a build.

[SangoProduction]

Dragonwrought kobold can enter any PRc that requires dragonblood as early as level 1. If you want something actually good Sorcer 1 / Singer of Concordance 4 is a nice way to start a build.

How does dragonwrought get you third level divine spells?

[Grim Portent]

How does dragonwrought get you third level divine spells?

Due to bad wording the Dragon creature type RAW automatically qualifies for anything that has the dragonblood subtype as a requirement regardless of the other requirements. I think the relevant rule is in RotD, though it could be Draconomicon.

[SangoProduction]

That's a bit too cheese to actually work in a real game.

[Necroticplague]

New stipulation:
Please also state how one would enter the class early.

Human for a bonus feat, take a metamagic feat and Eldritch Corruption. That gives you third level spells (via Heightening a level 1 spell), thus qualifying for rainbow servant.
(This is assuming you handwave away the taint requirement, because the campaign isn't using taint rules. If they ware, any race works, and you can take Eldritch Corruption with the bonus feat having moderate depravity gives you).

[ahenobarbi]

Due to bad wording the Dragon creature type RAW automatically qualifies for anything that has the dragonblood subtype as a requirement regardless of the other requirements. I think the relevant rule is in RotD, though it could be Draconomicon.



Dragons automatically qualify for any classes, prestige classes (...) that require the dragonblood subtype.


I'm not sure if it's just bad wording - it makes sense fluff-wise (dragonblood creatures can emulate dragons but have to put more effort than actual dragons).


That's a bit too cheese to actually work in a real game.

I actually played such character in actual game :smallbiggrin:

[SangoProduction]

Yeah. I believe it meant that they qualify as dragonblooded for anything that has such as a prerequisite. But by RAW...yeah...
It's still cheese as flock, almost like polymorph stacking. Doesn't really make sense that being dragon makes you capable of casting divine spells.
Anyway, thanks for telling me.

[Vhaidara]

Stoneblessed from Races of Stone. Three level PrC that basically gives you Dwarf/Gnome/Goliath racial traits (the bad ones, not the good ones) that can be entered from basically any class at level 2 (so X 2/Stoneblessed 3). As a caster PrC the main use I could see would be for a non-gnome to get access to Shadowcraft Mage.

[SangoProduction]

Stoneblessed from Races of Stone. Three level PrC that basically gives you Dwarf/Gnome/Goliath racial traits (the bad ones, not the good ones) that can be entered from basically any class at level 2 (so X 2/Stoneblessed 3). As a caster PrC the main use I could see would be for a non-gnome to get access to Shadowcraft Mage.

Cool Stoneblessed. But how does one get that 4th level spell for early Shadowcraft Mage? (I guess I should google the Heighten thing, but...)
You could early entry in to that specialist thingy, by starting Wizard human and taking precocious apprentice, and the spell focus.

[Vhaidara]

I meant you would use Stoneblessed to count as a gnome so that a non-gnome could enter Shadowcraft Mage. Stoneblessed is generally pretty terrible (2 skill points, 3/4 BAB, d8 HD, horrid class features)

[Necroticplague]

Cool Stoneblessed. But how does one get that 4th level spell for early Shadowcraft Mage? (I guess I should google the Heighten thing, but...)
You could early entry in to that specialist thingy, by starting Wizard human and taking precocious apprentice, and the spell focus.

Human Beguiler 1. Moderate Depravity.
Feats:
1: [Any metamagic]
1-Human Bonus: Precocious Apprentice (Wall of Gloom).
Taint bonus feat: Eldritch Corruption.

you can use Eldritch Corruption to heighten the second level Wall of Gloom into a fourth level spell. Thus, you have a [Shadow] Spell of fourth level. If taint rules aren't in play (and thus the Depravity prereq for EC is waived), a flaw, selling your soul for a feat, or DCFSing away a bonus feat from worshiping an elder evil will also suffice.

[xyianth]

If you are not interested in early entry tricks, there are only a handful of prestige classes that can legitimately be entered prior to ECL 6.

Off the top of my head: (I've bolded the ones intended for rogues)

Maiden of Pain can be entered at ECL 2 as long as you are female, worship loviatar, take 4 ranks in intimidate, are evil, and take violate spell at level 1. Although it advances cleric casting, it does not actually require you to be a cleric to enter. You will have to find or buy a dose of agony at first level though.
Church Inquisitor can be entered at ECL 4 by any cleric that is of the proper alignment and faith.
Master Specialist can be entered at ECL 4 by any specialist wizard that takes the spell focus feat and the needed skill ranks.
Justiciar of Taiia can be entered at ECL 5 as long as you have BAB of +4 by ECL 4 and meet the other requirements.
Thief of Life can be entered at ECL 4 by any rogue that otherwise meets the requirements.
Anima Mage can be entered at ECL 4 by a binder 1/wizard 3 with the improved binding feat.
Master of Shrouds can be entered at ECL 4 by multiclassing cleric and any class that grants a good will save.
Dragonmark Heir can be entered at ECL 5 by taking the needed feats and skill ranks.
Ilithid Slayer can be entered at ECL 5 as a ranger that has a power point reserve.
Master Inquisitive can be entered at ECL 4 by taking the needed skill ranks and feat.
Silver Key can be entered at ECL 4 by any dwarven rogue (or skillful barbarian).
Warshaper can be entered at ECL 5 by any shapechanger race that has +4 BAB by ECL 4.
Walker in the Waste can be entered at ECL 4 by any cleric with the sand domain and the heat endurance feat.
Cancer Mage can be entered at ECL 4 by any evil human that takes the needed feats and multiclasses between classes that give good fort saves. (dwarven clerics can also manage it)
Bloodhound can be entered at ECL 5 by any ranger that takes the needed skill ranks.
Mythic Exemplar can be entered at ECL 5 by any rogue with the required skill ranks.
Dread Witch can be entered at ECL 5 by any sorcerer or wizard that knows cause fear and scare.
Fist of the Forest can be entered at ECL 5 by anyone taking the needed feats/skills and has +4 BAB by ECL 4.

With early entry tricks, the list expands greatly.

[SangoProduction]

awesome list.

[Vhaidara]

Actually, I remember a friend had a trick for Dread Witch. You grab Cause Fear normally, and use Precocious Apprentice to get Scare, then dip some other class with a high base Will save. Entry at ECL 3, complete.

[xyianth]

Actually, I remember a friend had a trick for Dread Witch. You grab Cause Fear normally, and use Precocious Apprentice to get Scare, then dip some other class with a high base Will save. Entry at ECL 3, complete.

Yeah, I count precocious apprentice as an early entry trick. Several of the options in that list can be entered even earlier if you want to. Generic Expert 1 is enough to qualify for Thief of Life for example.

[ahenobarbi]

You can enter Survivor as a Commoner 1 IIRC.

[darksolitaire]

You can enter Survivor as a Commoner 1 IIRC.

Indeed. Now we have to figure out why would anyone want to enter Survivor :smalltongue:
It does look like a possible dip for aspiring Ur-Priests...

[Taveena]

White Dragonspawn Human or Asherati Dread Necromancer 1 with Arcane Disciple (Sand), Versatile Spellcaster, Southern Magician, and Heat Endurance, taking Parching Touch as one of their 1st level Sorcerer spells, can enter Walker in the Waste next level. So ECL 3, but it can be bought off.

[xyianth]

White Dragonspawn Human or Asherati Dread Necromancer 1 with Arcane Disciple (Sand), Versatile Spellcaster, Southern Magician, and Heat Endurance, taking Parching Touch as one of their 1st level Sorcerer spells, can enter Walker in the Waste next level. So ECL 3, but it can be bought off.

Asherati can't take Southern Magician and Dread Necromancer can't learn parching touch until 4th level. White Dragonspawn Human won't qualify to take Heat Endurance as a Dread Necromancer until 6th level. (Fort save requirement)

Ultimately, it is unnecessary though. You can enter Walker in the Waste as an Asherati Cleric 1/Druid 1 by taking Versatile Spellcaster at 1st level. Clerics and Druids can both cast spells spontaneously. (Clerics can cure/inflict, Druids can summon nature's ally) Both Clerics and Druids know their entire list. If you grab the Thirst domain as a Cleric, you know parching touch, waste strider, and dessicate. No flaws required, and you can change Asherati to Human and just take Heat Endurance if you wish.

[Troacctid]

Asherati can't take Southern Magician and Dread Necromancer can't learn parching touch until 4th level. White Dragonspawn Human won't qualify to take Heat Endurance as a Dread Necromancer until 6th level. (Fort save requirement)

Ultimately, it is unnecessary though. You can enter Walker in the Waste as an Asherati Cleric 1/Druid 1 by taking Versatile Spellcaster at 1st level. Clerics and Druids can both cast spells spontaneously. (Clerics can cure/inflict, Druids can summon nature's ally) Both Clerics and Druids know their entire list. If you grab the Thirst domain as a Cleric, you know parching touch, waste strider, and dessicate. No flaws required, and you can change Asherati to Human and just take Heat Endurance if you wish.

IIRC, Clerics and Druids don't have "known" spells at all, unless they use the spontaneous variants. They just pray for spells directly off their class spell list.

[Curmudgeon]

IIRC, Clerics and Druids don't have "known" spells at all, unless they use the spontaneous variants. They just pray for spells directly off their class spell list.
This is the way of it. Unless a divine spellcasting class explicitly states that they have known spells (example: Favored Soul), they don't.
known spell

A spell that an arcane spellcaster has learned and can prepare. For wizards, knowing a spell means having it in their spellbooks. For sorcerers and bards, knowing a spell means having selected it when acquiring new spells as a benefit of level advancement.

[Jowgen]

Kinslayer, DotU, can be entered at level 1; provided you're real evil, can get the 4 pre-requesite feats and meet the racial requirement (which, according to the adaptation section, can be tweaked).

You need Endurance & Diehard (which you can get through items later so you can re-train the actual feats), and 2 of the Vile Vow feats; which can be a non-issue if serving elders evils is on the table.

It's actually a decent PrC as well, being full BAB, 2 good saves and nets you (Ex)Mettle, plus rage 1/day and some creature specific thing I forget.

[Taveena]

Asherati can't take Southern Magician and Dread Necromancer can't learn parching touch until 4th level. White Dragonspawn Human won't qualify to take Heat Endurance as a Dread Necromancer until 6th level. (Fort save requirement)

Ultimately, it is unnecessary though. You can enter Walker in the Waste as an Asherati Cleric 1/Druid 1 by taking Versatile Spellcaster at 1st level. Clerics and Druids can both cast spells spontaneously. (Clerics can cure/inflict, Druids can summon nature's ally) Both Clerics and Druids know their entire list. If you grab the Thirst domain as a Cleric, you know parching touch, waste strider, and dessicate. No flaws required, and you can change Asherati to Human and just take Heat Endurance if you wish.

First off: Clerics and Druids do not explicitly know their entire list. They, in fact, do not have a Spells Known class feature at all. Spontaneous Cleric with Thirst and Sand domains and Versatile Spellcaster can UNAMBIGUOUSLY enter after level 1.

Second, The question was about Arcane characters, so that's not super helpful here, though I'd honestly never noticed the Heat Endurance fort prereq until now. Also, Parching Touch was learned as a SORCERER spell from White Dragonspawn, which grants casting as a 1st level sorcerer. A moot point, given the contradictory prerequisites, but Advanced Learning was not involved.

White Dragonspawn Scablands Half-Orc Dread Necromancer with Human Heritage (1st), Heat Endurance (Racial), Southern Magician (Flaw), Arcane Disciple (Sand), and Versatile Spellcaster (3rd) can enter after level 3. So. It's something.

EDIT: This can be done without Human Heritage if your DM uses the Variant: Half Humans and Humanlike Races found on page 150 of Races of Destiny.

[Ruethgar]

Mystic Theurge level 2 via test requirement rules. A lot of things can be entered early if your first levels are a Major Bloodline. 0xp to get to level one, take bloodline, you're now ECL 0 class level 1, 0xp to next level, spend it on the next bloodline level, etc. Then go for a high skill class to fill in the gaps. Laborious Training is an officially lisensed feat that gives +2 max ranks in all int skills. Less useful than the +1 to all per bloodline level but still nice.

[Necroticplague]

Master of Many Forms can be entered at level 2 by a Human Divine Servant, which is ECL3 entry.

[TheifofZ]

I need them for either roguish classes or arcane casters. They don't need to be particularly good, just need to be able to enter as early as possible (no later than level 4).

Please also state how one would enter the class early.

Going to ask the question noone else is: How loosely will you (as the DM, assuming that's what this is for), be interpreting the rules?
And as a corollary, how loosely will you be okay with your players interpreting rules? Because if you use the vaguest possible interpretation of a rule to qualify something, even if by any sane definition it's as far from that as possible, than your players will likely do the same.

Also: As DM, any mooks you make that the players don't look closely at don't technically need to be, by RaW, legal in terms of class progression.
It's entirely possible to make an NPC mook with 5 levels of Assassin as his only levels, as long as you don't tell the party his level or build.

[SangoProduction]

Going to ask the question noone else is: How loosely will you (as the DM, assuming that's what this is for), be interpreting the rules?
And as a corollary, how loosely will you be okay with your players interpreting rules? Because if you use the vaguest possible interpretation of a rule to qualify something, even if by any sane definition it's as far from that as possible, than your players will likely do the same.

Also: As DM, any mooks you make that the players don't look closely at don't technically need to be, by RaW, legal in terms of class progression.
It's entirely possible to make an NPC mook with 5 levels of Assassin as his only levels, as long as you don't tell the party his level or build.

No, I was just looking for a way to get out of the Factorum class as quickly as possible, since it's the only allowed base class that did what I wanted. Then I realized "Oh, inspiration is at the start of *every* encounter. That's kinda neat." And then realized, "yeah, this isn't going to work." And decided to play a technomancer Psion.

[TheifofZ]

That's the kind of thing you explain at the start.
I suggest asking the DM about class retraining, instead of trying to use early entry shenanigans.

Also tell us how much munchkinry the DM will allow; just because, for instance, you can qualify for walker in the waste at level 3 with some very loose rules interpretation, doesn't mean the DM will actually let you do it.