Bard: Lyric Thaumaturge or Sublime Chord?

[ZeroNumerous]

I've recently been going through my stack of characters. Yes, I have a stack. I don't throw character sheets away, because I actually enjoy looking back over the people I've played as before.

Now, I've found that I have never played a Bard. Ever. Strange, I know, but singing at one's enemies has never appealed to me until today. I would like to try a character I've never done before, so I will be making a Bard in the future. However, I would like to know the general opinion on the two "best" Bard PrCs: Lyric Thaumaturge versus Sublime Chord.

[Amiria]

I like the Lyric Thaumaturge more, although, it doesn't get the high level wizard spells of the Sublime Chord.

The prerequisites ot the Lyric Thaumathurge are also lower => less skill points and a really useful feat that most bards would take anyway.

The Lyric Thaumaturge still gets access to some spells of the Wizard list.

Still, I would go into LT only after at least 8 levels of bard, the +2 base Inspire Courage is quite good, you can bring it to +4 with Song of the Heart and Inspirational Boost.

[ocato]

Well, Sublime Chord pretty much makes you a Bard//Sorcerer Gestalt by high levels. Flavorwise I am not a fan of that, but if you want all out smashums, it's probably better. I honestly can't remember LT, except that you need druid levels I think? I'd cut the fat and go straight bard into your PrC, but that's my personal no frills view of multiclassing: Only when strictly necessary.

[Illiterate Scribe]

The Sublime Chord does have some nice special songs of its own - Song of Arcane Power, Song of Cosmic Fire, that make it of interest beyond getting 9th level spells.

[Amiria]

I honestly can't remember LT, except that you need druid levels I think? I'd cut the fat and go straight bard into your PrC, but that's my personal no frills view of multiclassing: Only when strictly necessary.

You might confuse Lyric Thaumaturge (CM) with Fochlucan Lyrist (CAd). Lyric Thaumaturge doesn't need other classes beyond bard to qualify for and has full (really, enhanced) bardic spellcasting: more spells per day, more spells known, a bonus feat, extra damage with sonic spells.

[Saph]

Sublime Chord basically turns your Bard into a Sorceror who looks good in tights. :)

More seriously, Sublime Chord's a very powerful PrC, but you can't enter it until after level 10. Most campaigns are finished or about to finish by then, so it's only worth going for in a high-level game. Whereas for Lyric Thaumaturge you can qualify by level 6, which is a bit more realistic.

Of course, you can take both, if your DM doesn't mind multiple PrCing.

- Saph

[ZeroNumerous]

Hmm.. So far, I'm liking Lyric Thaumaturge, but I'm seriously not liking the fact that it lies my music hanging. More uses is nice, not advancing my music's potency.. Not so much. Right now, my two characters are looking like this..

Bard 8/Lyric Thaumaturge 2/Abjurant Champion 2/Lyric Thaumaturge 8. Full bard casting, still useful boosts, abit of fighting skill for being a secondary meleer, and very useful defensive measures. Singing at your enemies for sonic damage while flanking for the rogue is the basic concept behind this character.

Bard 5/Mindbender 1/Bard 4/Sublime Chord 10. Retaining full casting with the ability to always screw with someone's mind. Basically Sorcerer with Telepathy.

[Skyserpent]

I can't make any judgement calls since I've never done the Bard thing either... but I DO know that Lyric Thaumaterge has a really pretty picture. Which mechanically is useless fluff, but nonetheless, it makes looking at the page more bearable.

*shudder* Green Star Adept...

[Knight_Of_Twilight]

I can't make any judgement calls since I've never done the Bard thing either... but I DO know that Lyric Thaumaterge has a really pretty picture. Which mechanically is useless fluff, but nonetheless, it makes looking at the page more bearable.

*shudder* Green Star Adept...

I can't look at the Green Star Adept without Chuckling. XD

To the OP: I keep all my character sheets too. Espicially if they are low-mid level, because I sometimes pick them up in different campaigns if the DM will allow. Also, I tend to use some as NPCs...

[ocato]

You might confuse Lyric Thaumaturge (CM) with Fochlucan Lyrist (CAd). Lyric Thaumaturge doesn't need other classes beyond bard to qualify for and has full (really, enhanced) bardic spellcasting: more spells per day, more spells known, a bonus feat, extra damage with sonic spells.

That is infact exactly what I am doing. I've said it before, I'll say it again, PrCs, even Bardic ones, are not my strong suit.

[Talya]

If you plan on getting significantly past level 10, sublime chord = awesomeness.

[Illiterate Scribe]

Song of Arcane Fire, Song of Timelessness FTW!

[Merlin the Tuna]

I can't make any judgement calls since I've never done the Bard thing either... but I DO know that Lyric Thaumaterge has a really pretty picture. Which mechanically is useless fluff, but nonetheless, it makes looking at the page more bearable. Sadly, I've found that that often makes a big difference in how often a class gets used. I know it took me a long time to get around to reading up on War Weavers just on account of flipping through the book, seeing the NPC, and turning the page.

[Rincewind]

I've recently been going through my stack of characters. Yes, I have a stack. I don't throw character sheets away, because I actually enjoy looking back over the people I've played as before.

Now, I've found that I have never played a Bard. Ever. Strange, I know, but singing at one's enemies has never appealed to me until today. I would like to try a character I've never done before, so I will be making a Bard in the future. However, I would like to know the general opinion on the two "best" Bard PrCs: Lyric Thaumaturge versus Sublime Chord.

Choose "Rock Star". It gives a variated but boosted "Leadership" feat by which you can attract "fans". Especially "fangirls" :smallbiggrin:

[cupkeyk]

The best benefits of the fifth to tenth levels of Lyric thaumaturge is bonus spells and extra blasting power which can be better provided by sublime chord levels, so a Bard 6 LT4 SC would still be awesome if not heavy on the prereqs. I prefer LT since it's an easy qualification, versatile since you can go face or blaster aside from buffer.