Two weapon class

[Sigmar1]

hello friends, i want to play 5e for the first time and i was thinking to make a two handed sword class

is dual wield any goon in 5th edition? If yes what classes are able to efficient use it? Ranger,Fighter,Barbarian or Rogue

thanks

[The Shadowdove]

honestly all of the above.

ranger and fighter combat wise have lots of similaries, with ranger having more utility and less feats.
barbarian is barbarian. you might prefer twohanded weapon instead of dual with this one in most cases though.

rogue is a totally different ballgame. but two weapons is two chances at landing your sneak attack for that round.

alternatively, dual wield hand crossbow is fun on ranger or rogue.

dex based fighter can be really fun too. consider a shield/buckler backup offhand and darts. with a whip and mobity+ multiple attacks, you control the engagement.

[JoeJ]

Two-weapon fighting eventually starts to fall behind other styles in damage done. This is much less noticeable if you're playing a Dexterity build, however, since you wouldn't have been using the high damage weapons anyway.

Looking strictly at fighter for the moment, compared to sword & board, at high levels you'll do slightly less damage with two weapons, but spread it out over more attacks, which means you'll be a little better at fighting crowds than at taking on a single powerful enemy. And if you take the Dual Wielder feat, you can rock a rapier and whip combination and unleash your inner Zorro. Especially if you also take Mobile. (Although I would definitely multiclass as a rogue for that concept.)

[Sigmar1]

ok i see...i will go with fighter with longsword and handaxe vicking style. I think that feats are really an advantage in 5e more than little power ups like they were in 3.5

one more question,a friend want to know. Same question, what class for a Longbow user?

thanks for your time

[JackPhoenix]

ok i see...i will go with fighter with longsword and handaxe vicking style. I think that feats are really an advantage in 5e more than little power ups like they were in 3.5

one more question,a friend want to know. Same question, what class for a Longbow user?

thanks for your time

Fighter, ranger or (valor) bard, rogue if you can get proficiency (like if you're an elf or if you multiclass) and don't mind around walking around with some 6 feet long piece of wood.

[Vogonjeltz]

hello friends, i want to play 5e for the first time and i was thinking to make a two handed sword class

is dual wield any goon in 5th edition? If yes what classes are able to efficient use it? Ranger,Fighter,Barbarian or Rogue

thanks

Two handed is different than Two Weapon, just so you know to avoid using confusing terminology in the future.

Two weapon fighting requires your bonus action, which is important when considering there are various builds that already have a prioritized use for that bonus action.

Classes with the fighting style feature for two-weapon fighting also probably make a good use of it.

Barbarian is good because more attacks is more opportunities to get Brutal critical, but Eagle (3rd level) and Wolf (14th level) for Totem warrior and the Frenzy feature for Berserker are in competition for the bonus slot. So those builds would not make good use of it. Berserker in particular is really best-suited for Two-handed weapon fighting.

Fighter has the fighting style and little competition for the bonus action. Second wind would only be used occasionally, Champion has no bonus action competition and benefits significantly from Improved Critical, some BM maneuvers compete for the slot, but most don't, however Eldritch Knight is a poor choice as it's two most important features (War Magic and Improved War Magic) compete for the bonus action.

For Ranger it depends on the sub-class option pursued. Hunters have little competition for their bonus action, however Beast Masters are better off using their action to have the pet attack, which would seem to invalidate the requirement that the Ranger take the attack action in order to use two-weapon fighting.

Rogue has direct competition in the form of Cunning Action which, if the conditions for sneak attack are not currently fufilled, needs to use the bonus action for that to gain advantage on the attack and thus apply the higher level of damage. If other conditions are fulfilled, then two-weapon fighting makes sense for the rogue to double the chances of hitting at all (despite not having the fighting style).


ok i see...i will go with fighter with longsword and handaxe vicking style. I think that feats are really an advantage in 5e more than little power ups like they were in 3.5

one more question,a friend want to know. Same question, what class for a Longbow user?

thanks for your time

Fighter Champion or Battlemaster and Ranger Hunter or Beastmaster would be good candidates. Both classes get the fighting style, Fighter has the ASI to pick up Sharpshooter and each of those class options has features that would work well with archery. Same for Ranger.

[Anime Squirrel]

For Ranger it depends on the sub-class option pursued. Hunters have little competition for their bonus action, however Beast Masters are better off using their action to have the pet attack, which would seem to invalidate the requirement that the Ranger take the attack action in order to use two-weapon fighting.
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Unless im mistaken, beastmaster requires an attack action and states that if you have multiple attacks it only requires one of them. Two weapon fighting would then allow you to attack once, pet attack, thrn bonus attack with 2nd weapon.

[rollingForInit]

Two-weapon fighting eventually starts to fall behind other styles in damage done. This is much less noticeable if you're playing a Dexterity build, however, since you wouldn't have been using the high damage weapons anyway.


Also very worth noting that since the Rogue's damage comes from sneak attack, and more attacks = greater chance of landing one, two weapons don't lack scaling in the same way for them. In addition to using dex builds ...

[MrStabby]

In general two weapon fighting is best on a) dex builds and b) crazy multiclass options.

Dexterity boosts initiative, which is a huge, huge advantage which is only somewhat offset by the much better fighting styles/feats available to str based weapon users. If you are not going the get the benefits of these weapon feats you should get the benefits from high dex at least.

Crazy multiclass is also linked to this. If you are planning a build that jumps between a few classes so you will be behind on ASIs you probably won't have much to spare for feats. A lot of bonus action abilities come from feats so you are less likely to have this assigned if you are missing your feats.

To get value out of this you will also want abilities that enhance damage. An extra d8 damage is nice but sneak attack, elemental damage etc. means your bonus attack will scale much better.

For example consider something like a Paladin 5, warlock 3 focussed on smiting. You are level 8, but 1 ASI behind single classed characters - the extra bonus attack can be used to smite with for extra damage. Whilst it might conflict with Hex, Hex will also cause the attack to do additional damage as well.

[djreynolds]

My rogue fights with two-weapons, very fun. Useful for any make. The off hand attack is a bonus action, you do not have to use it. But really if you are going sword and board or two-weapon there is little difference. Sword and board primary does +2 extra with duelist style and +1 AC extra vs the guy with the duel wield feat.

Most think, and I agree, dexterity gets the most out of two-weapon fighting. Strength gets more with Sword and board and shield master

If you are not playing with feats, two-weapon increases in power IMO.

Beast masters stuck in melee can get some use out of two-weapon fighting if their beast goes first, they have a bonus action to attack. Hunter's mark needs a bonus action to move to another target, so if the target is not dead no worries.

But concept trumps all, if you want to play a guy with dual wielding flails and rhymes, go ahead.

[MightyDog16]

I am one of few that really like the two-weapon Barbarian.

If you don't mind playing an aggressive (albeit more dangerous) style, you could use Reckless Attack to gain advantage to help benefit from bonus Rage damage (which increases as you level) on all of your attacks. The extra rolls will also increase your odds of landing crits. The downside of enemies having advantage against you is mitigated by your damage reduction from Rage most of the time.

Take the Dual-Wielder feat so you aren't limited to light weapons.

Consider taking one or more levels in Fighter to get Two Weapon Fighting Style so you can add your Str modifier to your off-hand attacks as well as the Fighter's other goodies.

All of this is completely doable by level 5 and you'll find yourself doing consistent damage no matter what you roll for damage.

If you want more damage, go Berserker. If you want to be a bit more tanky, go Bear Totem.

[hymer]

If you want more damage, go Berserker.

With a two-weapon style??

[Vogonjeltz]

Unless im mistaken, beastmaster requires an attack action and states that if you have multiple attacks it only requires one of them. Two weapon fighting would then allow you to attack once, pet attack, thrn bonus attack with 2nd weapon.

Unfortunately you are mistaken, I think it might be preferable if it were.

[Saggo]

Unfortunately you are mistaken, I think it might be preferable if it were.

It might be useful to explain why. Two-weapon fighting's bonus attack requires you to take the Attack Action and strike with a light weapon. When you command your pet to take the Attack Action you get to make an additional weapon attack, not take half your own Attack Action. Choosing to interpret that as fulfilling the Two-weapon requirement is up to your table.

[djreynolds]

It might be useful to explain why. Two-weapon fighting's bonus attack requires you to take the Attack Action and strike with a light weapon. When you command your pet to take the Attack Action you get to make an additional weapon attack, not take half your own Attack Action. Choosing to interpret that as fulfilling the Two-weapon requirement is up to your table.

Many tables allow the ranger his bonus action still, either with off hand attack or moving hunter's mark etc. A lot guides say you can. It is a big deal, actually because it makes pole-arm master beast masters okay, I mean you still have a wolf at 20th level but what the hay.

[Saggo]

Many tables allow the ranger his bonus action still, either with off hand attack or moving hunter's mark etc. A lot guides say you can. It is a big deal, actually because it makes pole-arm master beast masters okay, I mean you still have a wolf at 20th level but what the hay.


I'm aware of how useful an additional strike would be. Guides can say whatever they want, that doesn't mean it's supported by the PHB. The Attack Action and a weapon attack are related but very separate concepts. Both Polearm Master and Two-weapon fighting require you to take the Attack Action, and Beastmaster only let's make an additional weapon attack. A DM has to amend the requirements for those two things to work.

Beastmaster never took your bonus action away, so any Ranger could Hunter's Mark.

[Mechaviking]

Barbarian 5/Ranger 4?

Rage, fast movement, some ranger abilities, fighting style and rage for when you lack hunters mark or hunters mark when you lack rage.

ahh **** sorry forgot the "class" not build portion.

[Deadandamnation]

At early levels Dual Wield gives the "best" damage output, followed by Two Hand, Sword and Board and Archery.

Then it start to fall down when you get better things to do with your bonus action and take Extra Attack.

It's a very valuable combat style for Rangers and Rogues.

Rangers because of Hunter's Mark (That make them the best Single Target at Early Levels)

Rogue because you want to land that SA every turn.

Barbarian can add rage bonus damage to the extra attack (Frenzy Barb will never play Dual Wield past 3 anyway)

Fighters can Dual Wield but they get much more value from other styles.

Dual Wielder feat it's just a passive (+2 damage +1 AC) it's not bad but it's not so great either. (It open up a larger weapons selection like double whip that can be fun).

[djreynolds]

I'm aware of how useful an additional strike would be. Guides can say whatever they want, that doesn't mean it's supported by the PHB. The Attack Action and a weapon attack are related but very separate concepts. Both Polearm Master and Two-weapon fighting require you to take the Attack Action, and Beastmaster only let's make an additional weapon attack. A DM has to amend the requirements for those two things to work.

Beastmaster never took your bonus action away, so any Ranger could Hunter's Mark.

You are correct, you must take the attack action. I'm wrong. I was thinking of the polearm master only in terms of using your reaction. My bad, sorry.

I think the guides are assuming because you gave your beast the attack action, you can get your bonus attack action off of that, and that may actually be pretty cheesy. So, it is not really supported

[The Shadowdove]

https://twitter.com/mikemearls/status/609960714908766208


I could be wrong, but I believe mearls says intended use is Animal Companions will defend themselves/continue an attack action in the next turn.

Meaning:

1) you only have to use your action to control the animal in turn 1.

2)Your animal would keep attacking in turn 2, freeing up your action.

3)Your action would have to be used again to get your animal companion to do a different action, however.


An example being, if enemy 1 dies, you'd have to use an action to redirect it to another task.


Keep in mind he says it's a DM's call.

I'd run it as he would though. Unless, for some reason, your animal companion IS actually a robot incapable of thinking for itself.

[hymer]

https://twitter.com/mikemearls/status/609960714908766208


I could be wrong, but I believe mearls says intended use is Animal Companions will defend themselves/continue an attack action in the next turn.

Doesn't look to me like he's talking about intended use, though, but about how he'd run it. He may be as dissatisfied with BM as anyone.