Have a winged tiefling going into barbarian,She wants a touch more magic in her charc

[CyberThread]

So I have a level 5, winged tiefling that is starting up. They are going the totem path barbarian but wanting to do something a bit more magical. They originally thought the magic initiate would get them access to imp's as a familiar through the find familiar spell. I had to show them that was a no, and just something unique contract wise for story purposes not an actual alternative rule. They seem unhappy now, and am not sure what to give them as a runner-up prize after her entire concept and back story leaned rather heavily on the imp aspect of the character buddy system.

[Toadkiller]

So, let her have the imp? The whole point is for everybody to have fun. Giving her a better familiar isn't that big of a deal really.

[MrStabby]

So, let her have the imp? The whole point is for everybody to have fun. Giving her a better familiar isn't that big of a deal really.

I don't see why not.

Given the powerful feats available to barbarians it isn't like magic initiate is going to break anything.

If you are into homebrew let one of the "totems" be diabolic and give the imp familiar as one of the class features?

[Felvion]

Personally, i'd give her the imp at the cost of a feat. But it would be only the imp, not the find familiar spell nor the two cantrips. Something like the 3.5 leadership.
I wouldn't give her the connection a master and a familiar have (like watching through its eyes) unless she trains their bond through the campaign. Also, i think it should be a plain, mortal imp. If it dies, it's dead forever. One could try to revive it if there are ways to revive beasts in 5th, i'm not sure about that. On the other hand, should the imp die, i'd let her try to attract another companion of equivalent power (CR).

[JellyPooga]

I see nothing wrong with granting an Imp familiar using the Find Familiar spell gained through the Magic Initiate or Ritual Caster Feats. Going by the Imps as Familiars sidebar in the Monster Manual, the stipulations are implied to be that the master be a spellcaster and have a contract. Magic Initiate takes care of being a spellcaster and nothing says you can't have a contract before play starts. I'm not seeing any problems RAW for this character concept and being a Tiefling, possibly has better fluff reasons than some other concepts.

If you, as GM, don't want the player to have an Imp familiar for whatever reason (and it had better be a good one, because the first Chainlock that comes along wanting one will be treading all over your ruling on this), that's your call. At the end of the day, though, all you need do is sit down with this character and hash out the terms of the contract. Job done.

[JakOfAllTirades]

Actually, the Imp is a lot more powerful than the standard familiars. Last time I was GM, an Imp took the Fighter down to 0hp in one go, and I think I could've taken out one or two others, but I decided it might be too much for a 1st level party. (Resistance v. all their weapons, resistant to magic, invisibility, poison.) So it turned invisible and ran home to its master.

A "normal" familiar would've been dead after one round with that group.

[Coyote81]

Why not let her have the Owl stats and treat it as an Imp for looks? D&D really lends itself well to re-skinning mechanics to the looks you want.

[Toadkiller]

We have an imp familiar in a game I'm in. Other than being an invisible scout it's not been all that powerful. An owl would do more, actually. It can't really attack for free and you can trim off resistance if you want.

[Markoff Chainey]

Actually, the Imp is a lot more powerful than the standard familiars. Last time I was GM, an Imp took the Fighter down to 0hp in one go, and I think I could've taken out one or two others, but I decided it might be too much for a 1st level party. (Resistance v. all their weapons, resistant to magic, invisibility, poison.) So it turned invisible and ran home to its master.

A "normal" familiar would've been dead after one round with that group.

The imp from Chain Pact Warlock can take the attack action, a regular familiar cannot.

[kaoskonfety]

If they want the Imp from out of the book and have expressed interest in magic initiate for find familiar (I'd point them at ritual caster myself cause I feel it gets better mileage on a barbarian, but 6 of one, half dozen of the other in this case) I'd likely allow it. They use the standard spell and ALSO use "cool rare/expensive/quest obtained" component to summon up an Imp to bargain with - In character RP opportunity and you get to lay down the rules.

The familiar follows the alternate rules laid out in the DMG - It's free willed but generally obedient (its Qar from the comic... sure, that's funny), if you are not evil enough or act against its goals its out. And its not coming back. You can TRY to summon another, but it will demand much more upfront payment. And they will still be able to summon a run of the mill familiar if they realize this is not all its cracked up to be / tire of serving EVIL!

I might allow the added "if you sell him (hell) your soul, it is straight up chain warlock with all the bells and whistles" familiar territory. You weren't using your SOUL anyway right?

Cause I'd in NO way have the threat of extra special eternal torment for mistreating the familiar be looming in every conversation they have from then on (no actual MECHANICAL difference from Chainlock, just... creepier)


EDIT - as far as runner up prize options - an Imp familiar that follows the standard familiar rules - 1hp, no attack etc., reskin raven or bat and replace mimicry or blind sight with "transparent"- or whatever - crappy invisibility - say: proficient (or expert) with stealth and advantage on hiding from visual observation - they do realize that the creature they summon is not an beast but a Celestial, Devil, Aberration, Fey or other magical thing shaped like a bird (or whatever)? The core spell lets you summon a fiend that is hedged out by protection from evil.

[PoeticDwarf]

So I have a level 5, winged tiefling that is starting up. They are going the totem path barbarian but wanting to do something a bit more magical. They originally thought the magic initiate would get them access to imp's as a familiar through the find familiar spell. I had to show them that was a no, and just something unique contract wise for story purposes not an actual alternative rule. They seem unhappy now, and am not sure what to give them as a runner-up prize after her entire concept and back story leaned rather heavily on the imp aspect of the character buddy system.

Just let her have the imp, or, if you think other players are wanting things too. You can say that her character has to take 3 levels warlock for imp.

[Levism84]

Looking over Totem Barbarian, I would suggest removing Spirit Seeker (beast sense and speak with animals as rituals) and adding the Pact of the Chain features from Warlock; straight-up cut and paste. I would alternatively offer them the ability to take Voice of the Chain Master (Warlock invocation) in place of Fast Movement at 5th level. Since they are both primarily exploration abilities, you shouldn't run into too many mechanical issues. This is also the level you would normally be able to take that invocation, and they would be giving up 10 feet of movement while not wearing heavy armor for an enhanced connection with their Imp familiar. Seems fair.

While they don't have as much "spellcasting" as they would with Spirit Seeker, those are nature-based spells and this barbarian looks like it is going a much more fiendish route. I would even suggest replacing the 10th level Spirit Walker (commune with nature as a ritual) with Omniscient Whispers (contact other plane as a ritual) since it plays to the risk/reward nature of dealing with fiends and could provide more versatility than knowing about local flora and fauna.

[Maxilian]

If she just want to go with something Magical while still being a cool Barb, try showing her the Rune Scribe, the spells that you get are not really spells, so she could still use them while raging!



BTW based on the MM, the DM could allow other ways to get an Imp familiar, they would have to gain or buy the imp loyalty somehow, she wouldn't get it with Find Familiar, but give her a mini-quest to get this Imp familiar (it could bring many interesting story hooks) :smallbiggrin:

[Temperjoke]

I'm curious why she wanted to play a barbarian? Maybe instead of trying to flavor the barbarian with warlock features, it might be better to go with warlock and focus more on barbarian-style play?

[kaoskonfety]

I'm curious why she wanted to play a barbarian? Maybe instead of trying to flavor the barbarian with warlock features, it might be better to go with warlock and focus more on barbarian-style play?

I've been doing the "magic barbarian" thing in a game lately and its a BLAST. We just hit level 4 and I picked up magic initiate to go with my Variant human feat ritual caster. Optimization wise, for may stats, I should have zero levels of barbarian and have dug straight into wizard, cleric and/or druid (Int/Wis/Con 16, Str 14, Dex/Cha 10 DM was QUITE generous on the stats). Backstory wise I definitely could have gone 2 druid, land/2 wizard, diviner and be rocking out the hedge wizard thing.

But that wasn't the point. The point was to be telling people I'm a wizard, self identifying as a wazard, having the tricks to demonstrate it causally, and have zero wizard levels - because city wizards are frail and my people are not frail. Because magic isn't for fighting, is for subtle power and knowledge. I have an ax for fighting.

As a 5th level tiefling the character has a fair bit of magic trick already. Grabbing magic initiate to show some added commitment to that power while not actually being a warlock is cool and fits. Having a consultant from hell on your shoulder, giving you apparently sound, but evil, advise is just part of the shtick.

I'd agree just handing them the Imp feels a bit too easy so story line it up, or make its summoning the opening scene and "temptations from hell" a central theme or, or, or...