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ShamasTheBard
2015-11-27, 09:18 PM
The Emissary



Level
Proficiency Bonus
Features
Spells Known
Spell Slots
Slot Level


1
2
Otherworldly Vision, Pact Magic
2
1
1st


2
2
Fighting Style, Weird Strike
3
2
1st


3
2
Weird Athleticism, Otherworldly Conscriptor
4
2
1st


4
2
Ability Score Improvement
5
2
1st


5
3
Extra Attack
6
2
2nd


6
3
Otherworldly Vision Improvement, Weird Athleticism Improvement
7
2
2nd


7
3
Otherworldly Conscriptor Feature
8
2
2nd


8
3
Ability Score Improvement
9
2
2nd


9
4
-
10
2
3rd


10
4
Otherworldly Vision Improvement, Otherworldly Conscriptor Feature
10
2
3rd


11
4
Well of The Weird
11
3
3rd


12
4
Ability Score Improvement
11
3
3rd


13
5
-
12
3
4th


14
5
Weird Athleticism Improvement, Otherworldly Blessing
12
3
4th


15
5
Otherworldly Conscriptor Feature
13
3
4th


16
5
Ability Score Improvement
13
3
4th


17
6
-
14
4
5th


18
6
Eldritch Soul
14
4
5th


19
6
Ability Score Improvement
15
4
5th


20
6
Otherworldly Grace
15
4
5th



Emissaries

A human in dire straights as his town is ravaged by a sudden unexplained devil incursion, reaches into his deepest feelings to pull fourth a power he can't explain. As he brings down his Maul on a Spined Devils skull, a deafening roar erupts from his weapon, immolating the devil before him and forcing back it's allies, showing the fury of his spirit.

A dragon born's bronze scales shimmered bright, feeling more connected with her ancestors than ever before, pulls fourth her deepest breath and belches out a pillar of lightning, crippling a necromancer and burning away at it's undead hoard.

The half elf's one eye looked down upon her fallen foe, her ghastly band behind her still sings of her glory and brutality in battle. She scans the battlefield and finds new prey. She will be paid a pretty penny today, and her queenhood is just beyond the horizon of this path she beats, unaware of what otherworldly being favors her so.

An Emissary is a special case for pact magic, because they were chosen, and sometimes even stolen for a purpose known only to their patron, a conscriptor of mortals who's goal can be anything from setting balance to the world, conquest, or observation to simply see what happens. Ancient Dragons, outcast fiends or feylords, even demigods will see opportunity in someone who is truly extraordinary. They may use this person as a pawn, or even create a conflict of their own for the mortal to fight for their own entertainment. Whatever the reason, an Emissary means power, and with power comes choice.

Class Features

Hit Points
Hit Dice: 1d10 per Emissary Level
Hit Points At First Level: 10 + your constitution modifier
Hit Points At Higher Levels: 1d10 (or 6) + your constitution modifier per Emissary level past 1st

Proficiencies
Armor: Light Armor, Medium Armor, Shields
Weapons: Simple Weapons, Martial Weapons
Tools: None
Saving Throws: Constitution, Charisma
Skills: Choose three from Athletics, Acrobatics, Intimidation, Insight, Persuasion, Deception, Religion

Otherworldly Vision
At first level as an Action, you may tap into your newly gained third eye. The world seems black and white except for a purple mist where you see clues others could not catch. When using your Otherworldly Vision, you may see where acts of death, larceny, kindness, and deception has or will take place, and you are able to discern which of those and where in your vision but not at what time, or even if it happened in the future or the past. Certain objects related to or of interest to the Conscriptor of this Emissary may be highlighted brighter, or in a different color.

At 6th level when you use your Otherworldly Vision feature you may see footsteps, objects of importance disembodied faces, and creatures within your vision. With a successful Charisma (investigatíon) check, you can attempt to recognize or clearly see the objects, creatures, footsteps, and faces. You can also determine the nature of the emotions in the Vision and determine if it will happen in the future or has already happened in the past, but not the exact time, or if all the things you see in your vision are happening together in the same instance, but you can determine if individual parts of the Vision happen in the future or past.

At 10th level, you can activate your vision as a bonus action and maintain it for one minute with concentration. Purple mist highlights weaknesses in one of your opponents armor and movements. Whenever you make an attack action against that creature, you make it with advantage. You may not do it again until you finish a short or long rest.

Pact Magic

Your arcane research and the magic bestowed on you by your patron have given you facility with spells. See chapter 10 for the general rules of spellcasting and the end of this description for the Emissary spell list.

Spell Slots

The Emissary table shows how many spell slots you have. The table also shows what the level of those slots is; all of your spell slots are the same level. To cast one of your Emissary spells of 1st level or higher, you must expend a spell slot. You regain all expended spell slots when you finish a short or long rest.

For example, when you are 5th level, you have two 2nd-level spell slots. To cast the 1st-level spell thunderwave, you must spend one of those slots, and you cast it as a 2nd-level spell.

Spells Known of First Level Or Higher

At 1st level, you know two 1st-level spells of your choice from the Emissary spell list.
The Spells Known column of the Emissary table shows when you learn more Emissary spells of your choice of 1st level and higher. A spell you choose must be of a level no higher than what’s shown in the table's Slot Level column for your level. When you reach 6th level, for example, you learn a new Emissary spell, which can be 1st, or 2nd level.

Additionally, when you gain a level in this class, you can choose one of the Emissary spells you know and replace it with another spell from the warlock spell list, which also must be of a level for which you have spell slots.

Spellcasting Ability

Charisma is your spellcasting ability for your Emissary spells, so you use your Charisma whenever a spell refers to your spellcasting ability. In addition, you use your Charisma modifier when setting the saving throw DC for a Emissary spell you cast and when making an attack roll with one.
Spell save DC = 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Charisma modifier
Spell attack modifier = your proficiency bonus + your Charisma modifier

Spellcasting Focus

You can use an arcane focus (found in chapter 5) as a spellcasting focus for your Emissary spells.

Fighting Style

Archery

You gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls you make with ranged weapons

Deuling

When you are wielding a melee weapon in one hand and no other weapons, you gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls with that weapon

Defense

While you are wearing Armor, you gain a +1 bonus to AC

Great weapon fighting

When you roll a 1 or a 2 on a damage die for an attack you make with a melee weapon that you are wielding with two hands, you can reroll the die and must use the new roll, even if the new roll is a 1 or a 2. The weapon must have the 2 handed or versatile property for you to gain this benefit.

Weird Strike

Starting at 2nd level, whenever you hit a creature with a melee weapon attack, you may expend an Emissary spell slot to deal an extra 1d8 thunder damage per slot level to a maximum of 5d8 in addition to regular weapon damage.

By sacrificing some damage from Weird Strike, you may also add an additional condition on a single creature you strike with your weapon attacks upon activating Weird Strike. Each condition requires a constitution saving throw against the Emissary spell save DC. Each condition lasts until start of your next turn.

By sacrificing 1d8 of your Weird Strike damage, you may attempt to impose the Prone condition on the creature you strike.

By sacrificing 2d8, you may attempt to impose the Frightened condition.

By sacrificing 3d8, you may attempt to impose the Restrained condition.

By sacrificing 4d8, you may attempt to impose the Stunned condition.

By sacrificing 5d8, you may attempt to impose the Paralyzed condition.

Weird Athleticism

Starting at 3rd level you may add your charisma modifier to your strength score for the purposes of determining how much weight you can push, drag, or lift, and for the purposes of your carrying capacity. You may also add your Charisma modifier to your Constitution saving throws for the purposes of resisting exhaustion from prolonged dashing, swimming, forced marches, and sleep deprivation.

At 6th level you may add your charisma modifier to your strength score for the purpose of determining your High Jump and Long Jump distances. Also, add your charisma modifier to your walking speed.

At 14th level, as a bonus action you may add your charisma modifier to your choice to your Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution modifiers for one minute. You must complete a long rest in order to use this feature again.

Otherworldly Conscriptor

An Emissary rarely is the one who sought out his or her Patron, rather they are chosen and conscripted for purposes unknown to them. A conscriptor can be any powerful beings, but there are a few who are known to do such things. Choose from the either Panterax The Free Fiend or the Ancient Dragon conscriptor options, though they have already chosen you. The descriptions of these patrons will be given at the end of this class description.

Ability Score Improvement

When you reach 4th level, and again at 8th, 12th, 16th, and 19th level, you can increase one ability score of your choice by 2, or you can increase two ability scores your choice by 1. As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.

Extra Attack

Beginning at 5th level, you can attack twice instead of once, whenever you take the Attack action on your turn.

Well of The Weird

Your Conscriptor sees great promise in your abilities, and rewards you for your power in aiding yourself. Beginning at 11th level, when you score a critical hit with a weapon attack, you may choose to roll a d6 and adopt it's effect. The list below describes the effect.

1. Heal yourself or an ally for 3d10 + your class levels in The Emissary.

2. Gain an immediate weapon attack with advantage.

3. Double your movement speed for an hour.

4. Regain one Emissary spell slot back

5. Cast Invisibility on yourself for a maximum duration of 1 hour.

6. Gain a flight speed equal to your move speed. If you already have a flight speed, gain effect #3 instead.

This ability can only be done once per short rest.

Otherworldly Blessing

Beginning at 14th level, you may add your Charisma modifier to your AC.

Eldritch Soul

Beginning at 18th level, you have advantage on saving throws against spells and other magical effects.

Otherworldly Grace

At 20th level, increase your Charisma score and one other ability of your choice by 2, and increase the maximum of that score to 22.

Emissary Spell List

Armor of Agathys
Arms of Hadar
Charm Person
Comprehend Languages
Expeditious Retreat
Hellish Rebuke
Hex
Hunters Mark
Illusory Script
Protection From Evil And Good
Unseen Servant
Witch Bolt

Cloud of Daggers
Crown of Madness
Darkness
Enthrall
Hold Person
Invisibility
Mirror Image
Misty Step
Ray of Enfeeblement
Shatter
Spider Climb
Suggestion

Counterspell
Dispel Magic
Fear
Fly
Gaseous Form
Hunger of Hadar
Hypnotic Pattern
Magic Circle
Major Image
Remove Curse
Tongues
Vampiric Touch

Banishment
Blight
Dimension Door
Hallucinatory Terrain

Contact Other Plane
Dream
Hold Monster
Scrying
Telekinesis

Otherworldly Conscriptor

Panterax was a fiend that escaped the servitude of Asmodious to become his own god of music and adventure. He chooses his Emissaries to protect his position or even for his entertainment.

Children of The Grave

Beginning at 3rd level, you may summon a band of 4 Fiendish Spirits to aid you in battle once per short rest. The band takes any form you wish, otherwise they appear as wights with strange metal instruments. This band is always 10 feet directly behind you, has Incorporeal Movement, and has an AC of 15 + your Charisma modifier, and each fiend has an HP of 2x your Emissary Level. the fiends cannot attack or directly harm any creature, but each of them joins in song playing instruments of your choice to grant you an inspiration bonus of 1d4 per round of combat which you may use on an attack roll, saving throw, or ability check you make. You must use this inspiration bonus on your turn or it is lost and you must be able to hear their song in order to gain their benefit. The band has a total of one minute to play their song. For each one that drops to 0 hitpoints, the number of rounds their song can go on is reduced by 3. This inspiration bonus becomes a d6 at level 7, a d8 at level 11, and a d10 at level 15.

Flash of The Blade

Beginning at 7th level, while hearing the song from your fiendish band, you are under the effects of the Haste spell in addition to the effects they already granted you.

Cemetery Gates

Beginning at 10th level, while hearing the song from your fiendish band, your weapon attacks and Weird Strike can deal either Fire, Cold, or Necrotic damage. You must pick one of those types at the beginning of the song or it will be Necrotic damage.

Symphony of Destruction

Beginning at 15th level, the song from your fiendish band is telekinetic and cannot be interrupted by anyone but you and can still be heard through magical silencing, unless your band drops to 0 hitpoints. Choose from one of the following additional effects.

Dance of Death

While hearing the song from your fiendish band, you are under the effects of the Enlarge option from the Enlarge Reduce spell in addition to the other effects your band gives you.

Run To The Hills

Each hostile creature within 30 feet of you must make a Wisdom saving throw or suffer from the frightened condition.



Mouth For War

Choose from one of the following dragon types, and gain the benefits of it.



Dragon
Dragon Type
Breath Weapon


Black
Acid
5 by 30 ft Line (Dex Save)


Blue
Lightning
5 by 30 ft. line (Dex. Save)


Brass
Fire
5 by 30 ft. line (Dex. Save)


Bronze
Lightning
5 by 30 ft. line (Dex. Save)


Copper
Acid
5 by 30 ft. line (Dex. Save)


Gold
Fire
15 ft Cone (Dex. Save)


Green
Poison
15 ft. Cone (Con. Save)


Red
Fire
15 ft. Cone (Dex. Save)


Silver
Cold
15 ft. Cone (Con. Save)


White
Cold
15 ft. Cone (Con. Save)



Upon choosing a dragon type, you gain it's breath weapon and when using it, your skin temporarily flashes with the scales and color of the dragon chosen. The dragon type you chose is the dragon type that has conscripted you. You may only use this feature once per short rest. The damage for the breath weapon is 1d8 at 1st level, 2d8 at 5th level, 3d8 at 9th level, 4d8 at 13th level, and 5d8 at 17th level. Any creature within the area of the breath attack may take half damage on a successful saving throw.

In addition, you gain resistance to the damage type of your breath weapon. If you already have advantage from that damage type due to your racial feature, you may choose a different type.

Crack of The Skye

Beginning at 7th level when you use your Weird Strike feature, you may cause it to have an area of effect in addition to the damage it's self. Choose between a 15ft cone or a 10ft radius centered on yourself (but not affecting yourself). All creatures within that area of effect must make a Dexterity or Strength saving throw (their choice) against your spell save DC. On a failed save, they are also pushed away from you to the edge of the area of effect and knocked prone. On a successful save, they take half damage and are not moved back and are not knocked prone. You may only use this feature once per short rest.

Strength Beyond Strength

Beginning at 10th level, you gain the ability to spend an Emissary spell slot to cause a 20 ft radius area at a 150 ft. range to erupt in the magical energy of your chosen dragon type. The damage is 2d6 per level of the spell slot to a maximum of 10d6. Each creature within the 20 ft. radius must make a Dexterity saving throw, taking half damage on a successful save. In addition, each hostile creature within 30 ft. of you takes 1d8 of the damage type specified by your chosen dragon type at the start of their turn or when moving within that 30 ft. radius space when you use this feature. This area of effect lasts for 1 minute.

Empire of the Clouds

Beginning at 15th level, you may expend an Emissary spell slot to gain spectral magic wings which are the color of your chosen dragon type giving you a flight speed equal to your walking speed. These wings last for a number of hours according to the level of the spell slot expended. A 1st level spell slot will last an hour, a 3rd or 4th level spell slot will last 8 hours, and a 5th level spell slot will last up to 24 hours.

ShamasTheBard
2015-11-28, 08:52 PM
Alright guys, I'm finally done, please let me know what you think and what kinds of things might need to change.

Mr.Moron
2015-11-28, 10:06 PM
Fluff: I'm uncertain what this class really is after reading it? Is it a paladin of Cthulhu or something?

General format issues:

Having *Everything* in spoilers makes this kind of hard to read. Just fyi, it make giving feedback kind of tough for me.

1st pass:

17th: This is a bit of dead level.

Weird Strike: This is just a weaker of smite. I'm not a fan of this. A lot of half casters seem to just be "Paladin with a differrent skin" i'd like to see a unique or new mechanic here, not just the same thing but with thunder damage.

Improved Weird Strike: I can't make heads nor tails of what htis is supposed to do? Does it let you cast spells in place of an attack? Does it let you use spells as a rider on weird strike?Please Clarify.

Otherworldly Grace: This is just the barbarian capstone for charsima. See comments on weird strike

Children of The Grave: How many musicians appear? How does losing members affect the output of the ability, if at all? Are they all one creature?Please Clarify.

Mouth For War: Feels weak. What if it didn't need a spell slot spent to be used?]


Crack of The Skye: This aoe damage is never defined? Please Clarify.

ShamasTheBard
2015-11-28, 10:34 PM
Fluff: I'm uncertain what this class really is after reading it? Is it a paladin of Cthulhu or something?

General format issues:

Having *Everything* in spoilers makes this kind of hard to read. Just fyi, it make giving feedback kind of tough for me.

1st pass:

17th: This is a bit of dead level.

Weird Strike: This is just a weaker of smite. I'm not a fan of this. A lot of half casters seem to just be "Paladin with a differrent skin" i'd like to see a unique or new mechanic here, not just the same thing but with thunder damage.

Improved Weird Strike: I can't make heads nor tails of what htis is supposed to do? Does it let you cast spells in place of an attack? Does it let you use spells as a rider on weird strike?Please Clarify.

Otherworldly Grace: This is just the barbarian capstone for charsima. See comments on weird strike

Children of The Grave: How many musicians appear? How does losing members affect the output of the ability, if at all? Are they all one creature?Please Clarify.

Mouth For War: Feels weak. What if it didn't need a spell slot spent to be used?]


Crack of The Skye: This aoe damage is never defined? Please Clarify.

Okay, so sorry about a few things I missed there. This class is like a warlock except that they were conscripted instead of the character going out and seeking a patron. The whole thing is that you are pressed into service by a very powerful being for whatever reason it has.

As for the putting everything in spoilers, sorry about that, I wanted to keep things nice and neat. What should I keep out in the open and what in spoiler?

As for the Weird Strike feature, I kinda remember seeing A LOT of posts about warlock and paladin multi-classing. I honestly wanted to make a base class that just accomplished what that multiclass accomplished. I'm sorry if it doesn't seem too inspired, but it's something I honestly just wanted to do when I was thinking about it because to me it sounded cool. I thought about making the strike Force damage but I didn't want to seem like someone who was just trying to make another OP class.

My intention with Improved Weird Strike is that you could take spells like Vampire Touch and channel it through your sword and hit more than once with it. Normally a spell that requires a Melee Spell Attack or Ranged Spell Attack only lets you attack with it once in a turn (unless you're a fighter with action surge), I wanted you to be able to attack with your Spell Attack as many times as you had attacks in a turn as if you had taken the Attack action instead. I figured spells like Vampiric touch or others don't have that much more damage than say some of the smite spells Paladins have, so I didn't see much of a problem with it. How do you think I should better word this?

I know the capstone is pretty much a charisma barbarian capstone, but it's actually kinda what I wanted. Something simple but helpful. I'm open to suggestions though.

I could have sworn I specified that there are 4 musicians in the Children of The Grave feature, maybe I was just thinking really loudly and forgot to type it. It happens a lot to me. As specified in the ability, the song only lasts a minute, but killing one of the band members shaves off 3 rounds of the song. Do you think I should rewrite it to make it more clear?

Is the breath weapon underpowered? I was a but sheepish about it considering it pops up after a short rest. I'll see what other people have to say about it costing a spell slot. Maybe if it really is I can add a status effect to it or amp up more damage? I'll take your idea into consideration though.

Crack of The Skye should be based on the dragon type you chose. I'll check to make sure I did that right.

[edit: I just remembered, it's supposed to be your regular Weird Strike damage, which is Thunder currently without modifications.]

Thanks for all the feedback.

[edit again: also about level 17, I figured learning a new spell and getting a 4th level 5 slot didn't make it that bad or was good enough. But if it's not, suggestions?]

Ivellius
2015-12-01, 03:55 PM
Thoughts on features:

- Shouldn't the conscriptor be known at 1st level? This is partly a fluff issue, but it's how Warlocks work as well. Perhaps you could tie in different types of actions that each conscriptor could discern when using Otherworldly vision.

- The Otherworldly Vision improvement at 6th level seems strange. The rest of it makes for a cool ribbon feature, however.

- I actually like Weird Strike as a "Let's just do Paladin / Warlock multiclass" synergy.

- Weird Athleticism is *strong* for what it does--maybe just replace Strength score with Charisma, or just incorporate the modifier somehow (such as on the 10th level feature)? It's definitely a "ribbon" feature in that jumping / carrying isn't a huge part of the game, but I think there might be some tweaks that would help.

- Not entirely clear on how Improved Weird Strike works. If it's how I think it's way too strong. You sort of clarified, but I think it would be better to just not do what you're hoping to do with this--spell attacks require spell slots for a reason.

- It gains its highest-level slots too early. You should switch to the Paladin progression, I'd say, gaining higher-level slots when it does. It would also spread out the class's strength a bit more--at 9th level it's basically as good a caster as a Warlock and as good a fighter as a Paladin.

- I think the archetype options are nice from a fluff standpoint and certainly leave other options open. They're pretty dependent on spell slots, though, which is probably bad, and especially the Panterax option centers completely on one base mechanic. It's cool, but I don't think the entire archetype needs to focus on it--it would leave for a fairly weak feeling when you don't have your band up.

- Text doesn't always match tables (Improved Weird Athleticism says 10th level in text but 14th in table, for example).

Overall I do actually like it (fluff is pretty good), and I think with some tweaks it'd be fairly balanced.

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-01, 05:53 PM
Thoughts on features:

- Shouldn't the conscriptor be known at 1st level? This is partly a fluff issue, but it's how Warlocks work as well. Perhaps you could tie in different types of actions that each conscriptor could discern when using Otherworldly vision.

- The Otherworldly Vision improvement at 6th level seems strange. The rest of it makes for a cool ribbon feature, however.

- I actually like Weird Strike as a "Let's just do Paladin / Warlock multiclass" synergy.

- Weird Athleticism is *strong* for what it does--maybe just replace Strength score with Charisma, or just incorporate the modifier somehow (such as on the 10th level feature)? It's definitely a "ribbon" feature in that jumping / carrying isn't a huge part of the game, but I think there might be some tweaks that would help.

- Not entirely clear on how Improved Weird Strike works. If it's how I think it's way too strong. You sort of clarified, but I think it would be better to just not do what you're hoping to do with this--spell attacks require spell slots for a reason.

- It gains its highest-level slots too early. You should switch to the Paladin progression, I'd say, gaining higher-level slots when it does. It would also spread out the class's strength a bit more--at 9th level it's basically as good a caster as a Warlock and as good a fighter as a Paladin.

- I think the archetype options are nice from a fluff standpoint and certainly leave other options open. They're pretty dependent on spell slots, though, which is probably bad, and especially the Panterax option centers completely on one base mechanic. It's cool, but I don't think the entire archetype needs to focus on it--it would leave for a fairly weak feeling when you don't have your band up.

- Text doesn't always match tables (Improved Weird Athleticism says 10th level in text but 14th in table, for example).

Overall I do actually like it (fluff is pretty good), and I think with some tweaks it'd be fairly balanced.

Thanks for all the input man. I'll definitely fix up some of those issues. As for the spell attack stuff, I figured it wouldn't be too powerful since spells like Vampiric Strike doesn't do much more damage if at all more than a paladin does. Maybe I'll limit it to spell attacks that require concentration?

I probably will scale the spell levels back, but I might keep the slots the way they are otherwise this guy is stuck with two slots at level 20. Maybe it would open up a 17th level ability and let me retool Weird Strike Improvement.

If I take away the dependency on spell slots for the archetype abilities, that would definitely make it easier to reduce the spell slots. Do you recommend making the band beefier, or give them more resistances of immunities? I saw the ability as kinda strong and so I wanted counterplay. Maybe I could make a feat only for the Emissary that lets you get hit instead of your band, or make it a class ability, so you can decide whether you want to take the damage or the band does.

I figured Weird Athleticism wasn't *that* strong because it's basically what a Bear barbarian gets at 3rd level IIRC.

Also I kinda wanted the level 6 Otherworldly Vision ability to be weird, but if you look carefully enough, a DM can make a plot point off of those visions. Will a murder take place in this alley way? has it already taken place? who were the people involved? What were the emotions of the people standing in what place? Could one person be a witness? Could one person, who was framed for the murder, actually just be a bystander who was in the wrong place at the wrong time? Being able to see the position of a death and the murder weapon for instance can save someone's life. I figured it was a good lowish level tool for DM's to use in a plot.

Also, did you notice any of my Easter eggs?

Ivellius
2015-12-01, 08:44 PM
As for the spell attack stuff, I figured it wouldn't be too powerful since spells like Vampiric Strike doesn't do much more damage if at all more than a paladin does. Maybe I'll limit it to spell attacks that require concentration?

I probably will scale the spell levels back, but I might keep the slots the way they are otherwise this guy is stuck with two slots at level 20. Maybe it would open up a 17th level ability and let me retool Weird Strike Improvement.

If I take away the dependency on spell slots for the archetype abilities, that would definitely make it easier to reduce the spell slots. Do you recommend making the band beefier, or give them more resistances of immunities? I saw the ability as kinda strong and so I wanted counterplay. Maybe I could make a feat only for the Emissary that lets you get hit instead of your band, or make it a class ability, so you can decide whether you want to take the damage or the band does.

I figured Weird Athleticism wasn't *that* strong because it's basically what a Bear barbarian gets at 3rd level IIRC.

Also I kinda wanted the level 6 Otherworldly Vision ability to be weird, but if you look carefully enough, a DM can make a plot point off of those visions. Will a murder take place in this alley way? has it already taken place? who were the people involved? What were the emotions of the people standing in what place? Could one person be a witness? Could one person, who was framed for the murder, actually just be a bystander who was in the wrong place at the wrong time? Being able to see the position of a death and the murder weapon for instance can save someone's life. I figured it was a good lowish level tool for DM's to use in a plot.

Also, did you notice any of my Easter eggs?

I still think you should just give up the idea for Improved Weird Strike and find something else. Having 4 spell slots at 20th level should be fine for this class. I think for your class features just making them short / long rest dependent would be fine in most cases.

For the Panterax band, my point is just that, while it's an interesting and probably not too strong feature (I like the counterplay), I worry that someone playing it won't feel like they're playing their character without having the band available to them, and it won't be up all the time. That's why I think if you could find a couple of features that don't rely on it it would feel better to play.

That's kind of what I mean about OV--there are a lot of potential plot uses for it. It's cool; it's just really strange for a character to have. What do you think about having the kind of things detected by it changing based on the patron?

3rd level WA gets a 6th level Barbarian feature, and being "Strong Guy" probably shouldn't be the Emissary's thing. At 6th level, extra mobility is also really good for a primarily melee class, and this one isn't designed as a lightly armored striker type. These both need some toning down, if you ask me. The 14th level improvement is probably pretty good, though.

Not sure about any Easter eggs. Didn't notice anything hidden.

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-01, 10:59 PM
I still think you should just give up the idea for Improved Weird Strike and find something else. Having 4 spell slots at 20th level should be fine for this class. I think for your class features just making them short / long rest dependent would be fine in most cases.

For the Panterax band, my point is just that, while it's an interesting and probably not too strong feature (I like the counterplay), I worry that someone playing it won't feel like they're playing their character without having the band available to them, and it won't be up all the time. That's why I think if you could find a couple of features that don't rely on it it would feel better to play.

That's kind of what I mean about OV--there are a lot of potential plot uses for it. It's cool; it's just really strange for a character to have. What do you think about having the kind of things detected by it changing based on the patron?

3rd level WA gets a 6th level Barbarian feature, and being "Strong Guy" probably shouldn't be the Emissary's thing. At 6th level, extra mobility is also really good for a primarily melee class, and this one isn't designed as a lightly armored striker type. These both need some toning down, if you ask me. The 14th level improvement is probably pretty good, though.

Not sure about any Easter eggs. Didn't notice anything hidden.

Considering that I came up with that as a "I gotta put something at 10th level to make his ability better, but I don't want to just copy and paste completely from paladin" I think you're right honestly. If I come up with something better, I'll definitely put it there.

Maybe for the Panterax ability I can make passive abilities for him that are always on but are just barely not ribbons? Maybe giving this class proficiency in Performance and giving advantage on charisma checks on a short rest? I also considered making the song last all day but they only have a max of 10 rounds to give the character a bonus, and the character chooses when it uses one of those rounds, otherwise the band is invisible to everyone but him (because of his Otherworldly Vision) and he then gets advantage on perception checks against traps and ambushes or something. Basically the band would follow him around all day and tell him cool dead people advice. I also kinda wanted to make a requirement that he has to summon the band at the start of each day and jam with them for an hour (which counts as light activity so you can do it on a long rest or short rest).

Maybe for the Weird Athleticism I would allow them advantage on a Strength check on a short rest as a 3rd level ability instead. Maybe I can let them add their Cha mod for their walking speed, but I kinda really want the jumping stuff. Could you explain what makes it too powerful though? I really wanted it to have a thematical effect because I wanted to tie charisma to the strength of the relationship between the character and their patron. I wanted this ability to be that the patron is explicitly using it's power to make this character faster, stronger, and more able to take on foes. What if I made it so you could add your Charisma mod to constitution saving throws against exhaustion as a 3rd level ability instead?

Also look at the names of the abilities for the sub classes. Are you a metal fan by any chance?

I'll also tone down on the spell levels to make it more half castery.

Flashy
2015-12-02, 12:52 AM
Maybe for the Weird Athleticism I would allow them advantage on a Strength check on a short rest as a 3rd level ability instead. Maybe I can let them add their Cha mod for their walking speed, but I kinda really want the jumping stuff. Could you explain what makes it too powerful though? I really wanted it to have a thematical effect because I wanted to tie charisma to the strength of the relationship between the character and their patron.

Personally I'd argue that it's adding the score rather than the modifier that does it. Default 30 odd foot running long jump is pretty nutso, even without adding Jump into the equation. It also badly overshadows the thief's Second Story Work since that feature keys off the modifier. You don't really want a general class to seriously outshine a specialist archetype at something it's supposed to be pretty good at.

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-02, 01:35 AM
Personally I'd argue that it's adding the score rather than the modifier that does it. Default 30 odd foot running long jump is pretty nutso, even without adding Jump into the equation. It also badly overshadows the thief's Second Story Work since that feature keys off the modifier. You don't really want a general class to seriously outshine a specialist archetype at something it's supposed to be pretty good at.

Oh dang that's really true. Maybe I can make it a short rest ability that can be done as many times as a Cha mod? I don't want to step on the toes of other classes. I already toned down the damage on this guy's Weird Strike because of how it can be augmented by the two different sub classes.

Edit: wait no, I'll just make it the Cha mod instead of the score.

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-02, 02:57 AM
I edited the text on Improved Weird Strike to at least make it more clear until I come up with an altogether better ability to write down.

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-04, 02:44 AM
Changed Improved Weird Strike into the new Well of The Weird ability. I know the contest is over but honestly I had way too much fun making this class to quit. Let me know what you think of it. It seems powerful but you guys let me know.

Ivellius
2015-12-04, 12:34 PM
Changed Improved Weird Strike into the new Well of The Weird ability. I know the contest is over but honestly I had way too much fun making this class to quit. Let me know what you think of it. It seems powerful but you guys let me know.

I may have said this already, but I think I'd move this ability to 11th level and the archetype features back to 10th. It fits better with class design as a whole.

It does look pretty strong, but not being able to choose the effect probably keeps it in line. I don't think you can allow the invisibility off WotW to persist after attacks, and the healing option feels a bit too high to me. Otherwise, I think it's an amusing and interesting benefit to put into this class.

Also, shouldn't you keep editing it even after the contest is over if you want to do it right? :smallsmile:

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-04, 01:41 PM
I may have said this already, but I think I'd move this ability to 11th level and the archetype features back to 10th. It fits better with class design as a whole.

It does look pretty strong, but not being able to choose the effect probably keeps it in line. I don't think you can allow the invisibility off WotW to persist after attacks, and the healing option feels a bit too high to me. Otherwise, I think it's an amusing and interesting benefit to put into this class.

Also, shouldn't you keep editing it even after the contest is over if you want to do it right? :smallsmile:

:smallbiggrin: Yep you're right. I will keep editing it just because I'm having fun with this class. I think I will switch 10th and 11th around because now that I think about it it's pretty strong to let someone go 10/10 with in another class. The 5d10 healing is based on the idea of it being a 3rd level heaving spell, but I'll see if I can't tweak it to make it 25 average points but give it a lower maximum perhaps. Maybe 3d10 plus Emissary level?

And your probably right on the invisibility thing.

Also now that I just moved it around, having the otherworldly vision improvement happen at the same time as the Conscriptor feature improvements feels better flavorwise too.

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-06, 12:49 PM
What do you guys think about giving the player the option of replacing damage with a status effect instead?

Making the power of the status effect increase the more damage you give up.

Sacrificing 1d8 would require a saving throw against the frightened condition, sacrificing 2d8 would give something similar to the poisoned condition. Just throwing examples, what do you guys think of that idea?

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-07, 01:19 AM
Alright so I added some effects to the Weird Strike ability. Let me know what you guys think! Also, I tried out my first game test today with the Emissary. The player went Panterax. He had a lot of fun with the spectral band and his Otherworldly Vision. Ended up having an AC of 25 after his ASI's and being level 14 and having +2 light armor and a +4 to his dex and I think a cloak of protection too. They didn't add a shield bonus because they went archer with this class. Does that seem too high for level 14? Should I make Otherworldly Blessing an Unarmored Defense?

Mind you in this party there's a fighter with an AC of 29 and another with an AC of 27.

ShamasTheBard
2015-12-09, 07:18 PM
Do you guys think it would be over powered to make a subclass that gave the emissary healing spells? is healing spells with pact magic too broke?