Ways to decrease initiative?

[SangoProduction]

Hey guys, I know it's typically considered a bad idea to not have the absolutely most uber initiative...but...who cares. The idea is something like my character goes in to an analytic trance as he recites the details of a creature he encounters, and then when he's done, combat's already started. (Rolling natural 20s in all my knowledge checks, and not getting above a negative initiative last game seems to indicate that the universe also wants this fluff.)

So, I was thinking of retraining my Psychic Warrior level to Psion, since they still don't have casting penalties from armor. I wanted to know what else, above and beyond the normal armor penalty...penalty, when you don't have proficiency with the armor.

Also, are there other ways to decrease initiative that also pays out decently? Probably won't be as good as the trade off for the flaw is, but I'm just wondering.

[Troacctid]

I'm not sure you need anything besides an armor check penalty. Even if all you have is full plate and a tower shield, both masterwork, that's -14 right there. Add in the Unreactive flaw and your natural 20 is already worse than anyone else's natural 1.

And Psychic Warriors aren't proficient with tower shields, so you don't even really need to switch to Psion, although I suppose taking -9 to all your attack rolls is probably a lot more painful for the PsyWar.

[SangoProduction]

I'm not sure you need anything besides an armor check penalty. Even if all you have is full plate and a tower shield, both masterwork, that's -14 right there. Add in the Unreactive flaw and your natural 20 is already worse than anyone else's natural 1.

And Psychic Warriors aren't proficient with tower shields, so you don't even really need to switch to Psion, although I suppose taking -9 to all your attack rolls is probably a lot more painful for the PsyWar.

OK. I had a suspicion that Armor non-proficiency impacted attack rolls.

[Rubik]

Reduce your Dex, Int, and Cha scores as much as possible, then take three levels in factotum and a level in marshal. "Add" your Int and Cha to Str and Dex checks. (Initiative is a Dex check.)

[ExLibrisMortis]

Most of those abilities have an 'if positive' qualifier, I believe.

[Rubik]

Most of those abilities have an 'if positive' qualifier, I believe.They specify a bonus. And if you're actually wanting a penalty, that penalty becomes a bonus for your purposes.

[ExLibrisMortis]

They specify a bonus. And if you're actually wanting a penalty, that penalty becomes a bonus for your purposes.
While pretty likely to fly at a table (assuming the party is immune to your narshal narwhal marshal aura), 'bonus' has a specific game meaning, being a positive modifier. The Marshal aura does not work, as it specifies a bonus (if any), meaning penalties don't qualify. You can't make people stupid by shouting stupid things at them, sadly. However, I checked, and the Factotum ability does not specify that your INT modifier needs to be positive, so that adds up to -4 to initiative.

[Âmesang]

You could always… maybe… smash a thunderstone against your head?

[Rubik]

Use Contingency on a spell (such as Deep Slumber, or a spell that deals enough nonlethal damage to exceed your normal hp total) which will knock you unconscious when it's time to roll initiative. You count as helpless, which gives you an effective Dex score of 0, for a -5 initiate modifier.

[nedz]

You can always delay.

In many games going first is imperative. If every encounter is an ambush, or even just a meeting engagement, then going first is very useful.

If an encounter starts with imperfect information though, perhaps because the opponents are stealthy or maybe you are exploring an area, then delaying until you have a better idea of what to do is a good idea. Delaying can also be useful if you are waiting for a buff, often something like Haste.

I have seen players delay for a few rounds even — though that is quite rare.

[Rubik]

You can always delay.

In many games going first is imperative. If every encounter is an ambush, or even just a meeting engagement, then going first is very useful.

If an encounter starts with imperfect information though, perhaps because the opponents are stealthy or maybe you are exploring an area, then delaying until you have a better idea of what to do is a good idea. Delaying can also be useful if you are waiting for a buff, often something like Haste.

I have seen players delay for a few rounds even — though that is quite rare.That would be the intelligent thing to do, but now I'm interested in how to negatively optimize initiative and will go to any length of stupidity that I have to in order to make that work. Or not work, as the case may be.

[Legendxp]

That would be the intelligent thing to do, but now I'm interested in how to negatively optimize initiative and will go to any length of stupidity that I have to in order to make that work. Or not work, as the case may be.

heh, for starters, look here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?320797-De-optimizing-initiative).:smallcool:

[Jormengand]

The Unreactive flaw is an obvious one.

[Darrin]

White Raven Tactics lowers your initiative.

[The Great Wyrm]

Be surprised, and get Shock and Awe'd. (-10 to initiative)

[Psyren]

Just delay. I know it's the boring answer ("surprise burn!" (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0836.html)) but it's guaranteed to work and you can fluff it any way you want.

Heck, if you want it to be a flaw you can even do that. "You must delay for the first round every combat unless you are last in initiative" sounds like a decent flaw to me.