I'm afraid of a TPK

[Dr TPK]

Recently my PCs were annihilated and humiliated by a pyro-hydra. The next session will start with the PCs facing an "ancient evil" that has managed to put up a big fight against a guardian naga (result: stalemate) a thousand years ago.

I don't the PCs to die, but I want the fight to be hard. Therefore I'd like to get a seal of approval from you guys before I go on with the fight.

The PCs have been warned about the special abilities of the creature. They are in full control of the situation. The creature (shown below) will attack them first since it has blindsight. The fight will happen in a deep jungle. The PCs are fully rested and ready, without any hindrances.

The PCs:
Human Battle Sorcerer 9/Fighter 1
Human Cleric 7 (cohort)
Dwarf Expert 3/Fighter 2/Horizon Walker 4
Human Barbarian 7

Ssvaklor (old and missing a claw)
Medium Dragon
Hit Dice: 15d12+75 (182 hp). Spell resistance 18.
Initiative: -1 (Dex).
Speed: 40 ft., swim 40 ft.
AC: 20 (-1 Dex, +11 natural), touch 9, flat-footed 21 / DR10/magic.
Base Attack/Grapple: +15/+19
Attack: Bite +13 melee (+poison Fort DC 22 / 1d4 Con / 1d4 Con)*
Full Attack: Bite +13 melee (+poison)* and 1 claw +8 melee*
Damage: Bite 2d6+8/19-20 plus poison*, claw 1d8+6* (*Includes adjustments for Power Attack feat.)
Space: 5 ft/5 ft.
Special Qualities: Blindsense 60 ft., damage reduction 10/magic, darkvision 60 ft., immunity to magic sleep effects, poison, and paralysis, low-light vision, scent, spell resistance 18.
Special Attacks: Breath weapon, poison, spell-like abilities.
Saves: Fort +14, Ref +8, Will +8
Abilities: Str 16, Dex 9, Con 21, Int 11, Wis 10, Cha 14 .
Skills: Bluff +19, Diplomacy +5, Disguise +1 (+3 acting), Intimidate +3, Jump +8, Listen +17, Sense Motive +17, Spot +17, Survival +17, and Swim +12.
Feats: Cleave; Combat Reflexes; Improved Critical (bite); Improved Natural Attack (bite); Improved Natural Attack (claw); Power Attack.

*Poison: Fortitude save DC 22 / 1d4 Con / 1d4 Con

BREATH WEAPON: 30 ft. cone (once per 1d4 rounds). Reflex save DC 22 halves: 1d4 Con / 1d4 damage

Spell-like Abilities: 1/day - animal trance (DC 14), cause fear (DC 13), darkness (DC 14), entangle (DC 13). Caster level 15th.

CR: 9

Do you guys approve this fight as non-TPK-ish?

[Platymus Pus]

They should be able to kill it in one to three rounds and be flat out immune to poison if they prepared properly.

[Hamste]

Doesn't seem that bad assuming their DPR is decent. The PC know it has poisons so the cleric casts delay poison (each which lasts 8 hours) on everyone near the beginning of the day with several neutralize poisons prepared. The spells won't really matter unless it makes brilliant use of that darkness and Dr 10/magic is worthless at this level. With out that, it has an annoying breath weapon (Assuming it is not poison, if it is poison then it is worthless), some mediocre damage and that spell resistance. As long as the cleric knows they are going to fight it and prepares appropriately the fight they will win probably easily. With out the cleric being appropriately prepared it may be a bit nasty, it would depend on your parties fort saves and con. Also if they can fly and nothing stops them from flying, they could also plink it to death if it can't swim deep underwater.


Also you have the flat-footed ac wrong, it is 20 as you lose only the dex bonus to ac.

[Zanos]

The creature (shown below) will attack them first since it has blindsight.
?
It should only get a surprise round if everyone fails to make their spot/listen. (You also only gave it blindsense.)
Seems okay assuming they've prepared countermeasures for the con damage. Good use of darkness/blindsense could make the fight really difficult for the party, though.

[nedz]

It looks fine on paper, but how good are your players in terms of building characters and then playing them ? We don't know the answer to this question, but you should already.

Also though, looking at the breath weapon and the poison, they could run out of Con — which is generally fatal. How reliably can the PCs make DC 22 Fort ? The Sorcerer looks the most vulnerable here, so as long as he stays out of melee they should be fine.

[Dr TPK]

It looks fine on paper, but how good are your players in terms of building characters and then playing them ? We don't know the answer to this question, but you should already.

Also though, looking at the breath weapon and the poison, they could run out of Con — which is generally fatal. How reliably can the PCs make DC 22 Fort ? The Sorcerer looks the most vulnerable here, so as long as he stays out of melee they should be fine.

So far the consensus seems to be that the PCs can kill it fairly easily.

I don't want to comment their players' ability since they can read this, but the barbarian's player is awful.

The barbarian and the dwarf can make their fort saves easily.

[Dr TPK]

?
It should only get a surprise round if everyone fails to make their spot/listen. (You also only gave it blindsense.)
Seems okay assuming they've prepared countermeasures for the con damage. Good use of darkness/blindsense could make the fight really difficult for the party, though.

I stand corrected.

[nedz]

So far the consensus seems to be that the PCs can kill it fairly easily.

I don't want to comment their players' ability since they can read this, but the barbarian's player is awful.

The barbarian and the dwarf can make their fort saves easily.

I was more concerned about the Sorcerer since his build choices seem to indicate a desire to Gish, but because he hasn't taken any of the usual PrCs he would be vulnerable doing this. He is three levels ahead of the Barbarian though, which could explain the Barb's weakness somewhat. The normal rule of thumb is that if you are four levels behind: your job is to carry the bags.

[Hamste]

I was more concerned about the Sorcerer since his build choices seem to indicate a desire to Gish, but because he hasn't taken any of the usual PrCs he would be vulnerable doing this. He is three levels ahead of the Barbarian though, which could explain the Barb's weakness somewhat. The normal rule of thumb is that if you are four levels behind: your job is to carry the bags.

Or if you are three levels behind you get to carry the torch in pathfinder (The torchbearer feat).

[Dr TPK]

Level and power imbalance is problem, but just because the dummy who plays the barb keeps dying.

[nedz]

Level and power imbalance is problem, but just because the dummy who plays the barb keeps dying.

I thought as much — and now, because he is lower level, he dies even more often. This is why I no longer play the level loss rule.

[Grod_The_Giant]

I was more concerned about the Sorcerer since his build choices seem to indicate a desire to Gish, but because he hasn't taken any of the usual PrCs he would be vulnerable doing this.
Meh, Battle Sorcerer is more solid then people give it credit for. Sure, it falls behind the usual Spellsword 1/Abjurant Champion 5 builds, and is generally inferior if you PrC out, but you still get full sorcerer casting, 3/4 bab, light armor and a d8 HD. As far as gish in cans go, it's pretty punchy.

In any case, as long as the party can and will deal with poison, you're fine.