double weapons!!

[finaldooms]

hi hi everyone
im trying to make a new weapon for someone in my party to use ( currently not sure who yet) and its going to be LuBu's double voulge from dw6 ( was going to put a picture but it wont work) ..if you dont wana google it, its pretty much a two-sided sword ..except there are 2 of them so its a 4 sided sword?..idk

anyways my question was this.. do double weapons get the 1 1/2 str bonus from being 2 handed weapons? and what feats would a person need to reduce the combat penalty from using a double weapon?

( btw this weapon is going to have returning on it cause it can be thrown like a giant star..and it can come apart to swing at both sides) ..the weapon is obviously a work in progress but i needed help first lol.. btw if anyone has any suggestions on how to make this weapon viable please let me know :D

[paranoidbox]

From the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#doubleWeapons):

Dire flails, dwarven urgroshes, gnome hooked hammers, orc double axes, quarterstaffs, and two-bladed swords are double weapons. A character can fight with both ends of a double weapon as if fighting with two weapons, but he or she incurs all the normal attack penalties associated with two-weapon combat, just as though the character were wielding a one-handed weapon and a light weapon.

The character can also choose to use a double weapon two handed, attacking with only one end of it. A creature wielding a double weapon in one hand can’t use it as a double weapon—only one end of the weapon can be used in any given round.

So you would get 1-1/2 STR bonus if you attack with only one end, just like a regular two handed weapon. If you attack with both sides of a double weapon you'd use the attack and STR bonuses as if you're wielding a one-handed weapon and a light weapon. You'd need the two-weapon fighting feat(s) to do so in a somewhat effective way.

Is your intention that the wielder of this weapon gets 4 attacks?

[Darrin]

If you attack with both sides of a double weapon you'd use the attack and STR bonuses as if you're wielding a one-handed weapon and a light weapon.

Not exactly. By RAW, it only counts as a one-handed weapon and a light weapon for the purposes of calculating the attack penalty. PHB p. 113:

"A character can fight with both ends of a double weapon as if fighting with two weapons, but he or she incurs all the normal attack penalties associated with two-weapon combat, just as though the character were wielding a one-handed weapon and a light weapon (see Two-Weapon Fighting, page 160)."
(emphasis added)

Unfortunately, the RAW on calculating damage is ambiguous. PHB p. 134:

"Off-Hand Weapon: When you deal damage with a weapon in your off hand, you add only 1/2 your Strength bonus.
Wielding a Weapon Two-Handed: When you deal damage with a weapon that you are wielding two-handed, you add 1-1/2 times your Strength bonus. However, you don’t get this higher Strength bonus when using a light weapon with two hands (see Light, One-Handed, and Two-Handed Melee Weapons, page 113)."

Double weapons are gripped with both hands, so you could say the primary end gets x1.5 Str bonus, but it's not clear if the offhand end gets treated as a light weapon or a two-handed weapon. Most people just assume that you calculate the damage bonus the same way as the attack penalty: x1.0 for the primary, x0.5 for the offhand.

As far as reducing the penalties go, TWF OffHandbook (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?279079-3-5-The-TWF-OffHandbook) might be worth a look. In brief: primary -2/offhand -2, take Weapon Focus if you have a feat slot open. There are a few ways to get the penalty down to primary +0/offhand +0, but most of them are convoluted or too costly in terms of BAB or Level Adjustment.

[finaldooms]

ok il probly treat the damage as normal then with 1.0 and .5

and they will probly be able to attack 4x a round with this weapon..i just remembered it and really wanted to make it in dnd lol

if nothing else il make it unqiue in having an element attached to each blade so that they can switch between the elemental damage during the attacks? so like while swinging with a fire head they can switch to ice in the middle

....this is a work in progress that needs alot of work >>

[Âmesang]

I haven't had such a big smile across my face reading about porting over a weapon since someone way-back-when attempted to stat out Tira's "ring blade (https://www.schadenfreudestudios.com/backup/pictures/soulcalibur%20v/tira.jpg)" from SoulCalibur. :smallbiggrin:

Now I like Lü Bu. I mean, granted, he puts the ass in "badass," but he's still fun. Be that as it may his Dynasty Warriors 6 weapon was &$#$'n stupid — yet at the same time it's stupidly awesome because it shouldn't work yet it does… the guy held back a flood by spinning the thing like a propeller blade! "As if mere water could stop me!"

I'm sorry I don't have anything consequential to add, but I'd love to see this idea fully realized. I can't help but picture it being used like any other double weapon, just that each "head" of the weapon is used for different attacks (like, say, +5/+5/+0/+0 at 7th-level or something would each utilize a different head).

[finaldooms]

thats perfectly fine lol.. if i can get this to work out my next idea was going to be the flying sword guy's weapons XD,, im a huge DW fan and have always wanted to work their weapons into dnd ..my first fighter i made was a lu bu lol with the over the top feather hat and a halbard... i slaughtered actually XD

[Âmesang]

Actually that reminds me that while back I attempted to stat out Yue Ying's bladed hand crossbow for a Pathfinder human desert rogue based on an Arabian-like thief I had made in Empires — essentially it was just a finessable hand crossbow with a dagger firmly built into it (and not a "punching dagger" since the character makes slashing attacks with it in the game, but if forced to make it as such I wouldn't be too upset).

It's treated as a double weapon and would naturally require Exotic Weapon Proficiency (which the thief wouldn't have taken until 3rd level, as her two 1st-level feats were going to be Desert Dweller and Sandwalker; kind of shows her as being unwieldy with her unique weapon at first, taking time to, well, be proficient with it). 111 gp cost requiring a DC 15 Craft check to manufacture.

[Ruethgar]

It is possible to get a bow to be a tripple simple melee weapon, d6/d6/d4. Though the rules are a little fuzzy there, an exotic quadruple d4 weapon I don't think would be too powerful, maybe d6. But like the double bow I think I would put an extra -2 hit.

[finaldooms]

i was thinking either d8 or d10..although d6 makes sense since its 4 attacks and its a sword...sorta? ..and thats awsome about the crossbow :D if i can get this to work im guna keep on making weapons cause most of the DW weapons are to intresting to ignore!

[finaldooms]

welp accidently killed the party so looks like this idea is guna have to wait lol

[Ashtagon]

hi hi everyone
im trying to make a new weapon for someone in my party to use ( currently not sure who yet) and its going to be LuBu's double voulge from dw6 ( was going to put a picture but it wont work) ..if you dont wana google it, its pretty much a two-sided sword ..except there are 2 of them so its a 4 sided sword?..idk

anyways my question was this.. do double weapons get the 1 1/2 str bonus from being 2 handed weapons? and what feats would a person need to reduce the combat penalty from using a double weapon?

( btw this weapon is going to have returning on it cause it can be thrown like a giant star..and it can come apart to swing at both sides) ..the weapon is obviously a work in progress but i needed help first lol.. btw if anyone has any suggestions on how to make this weapon viable please let me know :D

I'm using this (http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/dynastywarriors/images/b/b1/Lubu_cg.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20121116015618) and this (http://koei.wikia.com/wiki/Lu_Bu) as references. If that's incorrect, sue me. I googled the wrong guy.

As a general rule, with double weapons that are correctly sized for you, you have the following options:


Wielding it one-handed, attack with a single end with no special attack penalties and get Str ×1 damage bonus.
Wielding it two-handed, attack with a single end with no special attack penalties and get Str ×1.5 damage bonus.
Wielding it two-handed, attack with both ends with attack penalties as if wielding a one-handed weapon and a light weapon, and get Str ×1 and Str ×0.5 damage bonuses.


The usual feat to reduce TWF penalties is, appropriately enough, called Two-Weapon Fighting. Full details are here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#twoWeaponFighting). Note that, at least within the SRD, it is impossible to cancel the TWF penalties completely. If there is a feat to fully negate the penalties, I'm not aware of it.

As for the weapon's stats, I'm not sure what specific "blade on a stick" that should count as. However, the SRD has a two-bladed sword, which is 100 gp, 1d8/1d8 damage, 19-20/×2 crit., 10 lb, slashing.

You say it can be thrown using a technique similar to a shuriken. Given the size of the thing, that is clearly magic and beyond the scope of any realism-based analysis.

[finaldooms]

thats the correct guy :D and yes i was thinking along the lines of a giant star lol...i saw that it said d8 on the double sword so i was going to use that...now i just gota convince the new fighter he really wants to have a weird weapon ( 3/5 of the party died and are now rewriting characters)