Statting Out Fictional Characters: Final Fantasy 7

[DiscipleofBob]

I'm looking at the possibility of running a 5e game in the setting of Final Fantasy 7. In preparation, I'm trying to figure out what kinds of variant rules and home brew would be needed to make something like this work. So to start, as an exercise, I'd like to see just how close one can get to the original FF7 cast before home brew gets involved.

I'll probably have to look into some home brew, variant magic rules for Materia eventually, but for now I just take spell casting as optional depending on which characters use it more often.

So that's trying to stat out the following as PC's:

Cloud - 2-handed fighter. Do they still have Fullblades in 5e?

Barret - I remember seeing variant rules for guns, so maybe if a ranged Barbarian build is possible.

Tifa - Monk. Not sure which subclass.

Aerith - Possibly either Cleric or Favored Soul

Red XIII - Definitely some kind of home brewed race. Shifters are probably closest for comparison. Land Druid maybe?

Yuffie - Rogue, any of the subclasses would theoretically work.

Cait Sith - Warforged Wild Magic Sorcerer. Alternatively, DMPC because who in their right mind would want to play Cait Sith? (That was rhetorical, since I'm certain if I proposed this game to a group at least one player would think it's a good idea.)

Vincent - This I got no idea. Flavor wise, warlock sort of fits, but can they do shape shifting like Vincent?

Cid - Well, Polearm Master, but that's a feat not a class. Not sure if the FF Dragoon is plausible with what's available or if the Machinist stuff needs to be a separate class as well.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

(I know there are other overall systems which would be more accurate, some designed specifically for FF7, but I want to see how far it's possible to get with 5e's framework first.)

[Mr.Moron]

I guess the question to be asked here is what are we dealing with

FF7 characters based on their abilities in the in-game combat
FF7 characters based on their abilities according do what they do in cutscenes & movies.
FF7 characters based on what they're able to in the plot as whole, and how the act in story sequences.

Because a character with the Jump material can go sky-high in combat scenes, but still be bound to regular human movement during non-combat game play. A character can cut through like 20 enemy's at once in cut scene, but still get held up by a couple of guards in a story scene and take several turns to bring them down in battle.

From a mechanical standpoint these different visions of the characters need very different implementations that are incompatible with each other.

[DiscipleofBob]

I guess the question to be asked here is what are we dealing with

FF7 characters based on their abilities in the in-game combat
FF7 characters based on their abilities according do what they do in cutscenes & movies.
FF7 characters based on what they're able to in the plot as whole, and how the act in story sequences.

Because a character with the Jump material can go sky-high in combat scenes, but still be bound to regular human movement during non-combat game play. A character can cut through like 20 enemy's at once in cut scene, but still get held up by a couple of guards in a story scene and take several turns to bring them down in battle.

From a mechanical standpoint these different visions of the characters need very different implementations that are incompatible with each other.

Primarily in-game mechanics, but if possible all three.

I don't think giving everyone +50 to jump is important to capturing the overall feel of the characters (except maybe Cid) despite stuff that happens on maps while exploring and in-movie feats.

[silveralen]

The problem with game mechanics is that, by default, they don't really have many inherent abilities. They can attack and limit break, and have different stats. That's about it. Meaning you can turn any of the characters into any role to a degree.

For example: cloud has the highest default magic and strength stats, and a solid mp and luck. So depending on player you could easily get different variations on cloud, from ones that don't touch magic to ones whose sword is ornamental.

So for a lot of these characters, I think they are better represented by a vague multi classing

To return to the above example: Cloud would be fighter (EK) +Wizard (evocation), with the exact ratio changing game to game. Might straight EK one game, or fighter 1 + wizard x another.

[CoggieRagabash]

The problem with game mechanics is that, by default, they don't really have many inherent abilities. They can attack and limit break, and have different stats. That's about it. Meaning you can turn any of the characters into any role to a degree.

Final Fantasy 7 strikes me as a difficult game to stat characters up in for this reason. Compared to, say, FF4, where each character had a very distinct skill set and unique commands, it's just a bit muddled.

[DiscipleofBob]

So for a lot of these characters, I think they are better represented by a vague multi classing

To return to the above example: Cloud would be fighter (EK) +Wizard (evocation), with the exact ratio changing game to game. Might straight EK one game, or fighter 1 + wizard x another.

Very true. Even if Materia ends up being a series of magic items everyone's capable of using, there's still feats like Blade Beam, Meteorain, and Finishing Touch. A lot does depend on personal experience with the game and what each individual player expects.

Heck, I bet SOLDIER, or in Cloud's case, Ex-SOLDIER could probably be made into a subclass of necessary, but it might also be possible to build with just straight EK.

I'm more looking to see just how possible it is to create even one passable version of either character in 5e before getting into the category for home brew.

[silveralen]

Very true. Even if Materia ends up being a series of magic items everyone's capable of using, there's still feats like Blade Beam, Meteorain, and Finishing Touch. A lot does depend on personal experience with the game and what each individual player expects.

Heck, I bet SOLDIER, or in Cloud's case, Ex-SOLDIER could probably be made into a subclass of necessary, but it might also be possible to build with just straight EK.

I'm more looking to see just how possible it is to create even one passable version of either character in 5e before getting into the category for home brew.

Given that this is a class based system, it is probably best to have most materia not outright grant spells like a magic item, but merely be part of the class.

Personally, I would treat basic magic materia as a focus or material component. Thus I'd assume they have access to most "basic" materia, and their own skill in using it determines what sort of effects they can use. One might be able to get a shocking grasp out of a bolt materia, another could manage chain lightning, and some magic could be cast without it in rare situations (ie limit breaks). This still leaves room for "special" materia to be given as a reward, which would resemble more classic DnD items.

Given that take on it, here are the classes as I see them.

Cloud: Fighter (EK) x +Wizard (evocation) x. Already Discussed.

Barret - Barbarian (probably bear totem) x + Fighter (EK) x.Big tough tanky guy, with fighter for better ranged attacks and possibly magic.

Tifa - Monk (Any) x. Obvious.

Aerith - Cleric (life or light). Both fit fairly well.

Red XIII - Probably Bard (Any) x, since he is a jack of all trades sort that leans towards magic but still has fighting potential.

Yuffie - Rogue (arcane trickster). The fact she has a random healing limit break kinda throws me for a loop, but modified spell lists are probably a given in any case.

Cait Sith - Sorcerer (wild Magic) x

Vincent - This one requires homebrew or a real open interpretation of his limit tbh. You could just say he is using alter form or enlarge person (as best fits) to improve his melee melee attack for the first couple forms with the other abilities being spells, and his final form would be a true polymorph spell. This is simple and can be done by any caster class, assuming they have the correct spells or you add the correct spells (for warlock you'd need to add them). Otherwise, treat the lower level forms as special polymorphs only he can turn into.

Warlock is still a decent fit theme wise, with his guns as pact weapons.

Cid - Barbarian (eagle totem) x + Fighter (Champion or EK) x. All three have, to some degree, improved jump ability, either as a feature or spell.

[Falcon X]

Materia: All players play martial classes but gain spell slots as a full caster (preferably using Spell Points from the DMs Guide). However, you collect items attuned to certain in-game spells. Each spell gains it's own experience and levels up it's spell level at the same rate a player would. You can equip 1/2 character level + Intelligence mod spells.
Ex. So, let's say Cloud (12 intelligence) is at level 6. He can equip 4 materia at one time. So, he equips Sleep, Fireball, Hold Person, and Chill Touch. When he kills a 200xp monster by himself, he and all 4 materia gain experience. All of those materia were new except chill touch which already had 200xp on it. So now Cloud can cast it as a lvl 2 spell.

Of course, the only problem with this method is that different spells start out at different level. However, the nature of FF7 is that spells gain new qualities as they level up. So, it wouldn't be unreasonable for Fire Bolt to grow into Fire Ball.

Alternative for Materia: Go check out how soulmelds for Incarnates worked in 3rd edition's Magic of Incarnum sourcebook. Flavorwise it seems to be the closest thing that's already been done in D&D.

[DiscipleofBob]

Given that this is a class based system, it is probably best to have most materia not outright grant spells like a magic item, but merely be part of the class.

Personally, I would treat basic magic materia as a focus or material component. Thus I'd assume they have access to most "basic" materia, and their own skill in using it determines what sort of effects they can use. One might be able to get a shocking grasp out of a bolt materia, another could manage chain lightning, and some magic could be cast without it in rare situations (ie limit breaks). This still leaves room for "special" materia to be given as a reward, which would resemble more classic DnD items.

What I'm considering, and this is just the bare bones concept, is that Spell Slots are as depicted in the book, except maybe a few extra spell slots for each class, and then even non-casting martial classes get a handful of Spell Slots. Materia would then take the place of Spells Known, and each character would get their "Spells Known" as starting equipment Materia. Then it's just a matter of making sure me as DM gives them plenty of opportunities to buy or acquire new materia as they level up.


Red XIII - Probably Bard (Any) x, since he is a jack of all trades sort that leans towards magic but still has fighting potential.

I agree with most of the others, but this one struck me as odd. Granted, trying to pigeonhole any of these characters into a class is challenging in itself, but Red XIII never struck me as a particularly Charismatic character. I figured he would be something more Wisdom-based, but I always got the impression that he was a very shamanistic type character, what with the quiet reserved personality and the whole hippy colony that is Cosmo Canyon. Maybe Nature Cleric?


Vincent - This one requires homebrew or a real open interpretation of his limit tbh. You could just say he is using alter form or enlarge person (as best fits) to improve his melee melee attack for the first couple forms with the other abilities being spells, and his final form would be a true polymorph spell. This is simple and can be done by any caster class, assuming they have the correct spells or you add the correct spells (for warlock you'd need to add them). Otherwise, treat the lower level forms as special polymorphs only he can turn into.

Warlock is still a decent fit theme wise, with his guns as pact weapons.

Vincent's definitely the tough one. I think I'll definitely need to try building him from 1 - 20 just to see if it's possible. I'll need to do the same for the others as well, but him most of all.


Cid - Barbarian (eagle totem) x + Fighter (Champion or EK) x. All three have, to some degree, improved jump ability, either as a feature or spell.

I hadn't even thought about Eagle Totem Barbarian, but yeah, that would be perfect for a FF Dragoon. I think this is the first edition where that sort of character concept is feasible without some really obscure feats, items, or homebrew.


Materia: All players play martial classes but gain spell slots as a full caster (preferably using Spell Points from the DMs Guide). However, you collect items attuned to certain in-game spells. Each spell gains it's own experience and levels up it's spell level at the same rate a player would. You can equip 1/2 character level + Intelligence mod spells.
Ex. So, let's say Cloud (12 intelligence) is at level 6. He can equip 4 materia at one time. So, he equips Sleep, Fireball, Hold Person, and Chill Touch. When he kills a 200xp monster by himself, he and all 4 materia gain experience. All of those materia were new except chill touch which already had 200xp on it. So now Cloud can cast it as a lvl 2 spell.

Of course, the only problem with this method is that different spells start out at different level. However, the nature of FF7 is that spells gain new qualities as they level up. So, it wouldn't be unreasonable for Fire Bolt to grow into Fire Ball.

I think this is a good start. I'm not sure I'd want to limit players to martial classes when a lot of casting classes have other features that make them tempting. Maybe house rule a way for martial classes to get a small amount of spell slots, and maybe to make up for it other classes get more, as I mentioned above?

The materia gaining XP and leveling up could be tricky. Some players I know would love that idea. Others might ignore or forget keeping track of XP for their spells as it's a lot of extra bookkeeping.

[silveralen]

What I'm considering, and this is just the bare bones concept, is that Spell Slots are as depicted in the book, except maybe a few extra spell slots for each class, and then even non-casting martial classes get a handful of Spell Slots. Materia would then take the place of Spells Known, and each character would get their "Spells Known" as starting equipment Materia. Then it's just a matter of making sure me as DM gives them plenty of opportunities to buy or acquire new materia as they level up.

That's reasonable as well. It's also not entirely make or break with the materia acquisition, since materia does level up in game you can justify a bit of that.


I agree with most of the others, but this one struck me as odd. Granted, trying to pigeonhole any of these characters into a class is challenging in itself, but Red XIII never struck me as a particularly Charismatic character. I figured he would be something more Wisdom-based, but I always got the impression that he was a very shamanistic type character, what with the quiet reserved personality and the whole hippy colony that is Cosmo Canyon. Maybe Nature Cleric?

I was looking for something that mechanically matched up. I'd probably just make him a wisdom based valor bard personally, but some variety of cleric is probably a decent second choice.


Vincent's definitely the tough one. I think I'll definitely need to try building him from 1 - 20 just to see if it's possible. I'll need to do the same for the others as well, but him most of all.

Well, you mentioned wanting to do a campaign with it, so technically Vincent wouldn't need to start at level 1 if you plan to follow the original story arc. How you'd handle new character dropping in/out is also at your discretion.


I hadn't even thought about Eagle Totem Barbarian, but yeah, that would be perfect for a FF Dragoon. I think this is the first edition where that sort of character concept is feasible without some really obscure feats, items, or homebrew.

Well, in point of fact the dragoon concept doesn't really give any benefits this current edition either. How exactly you'll reward the jump+attack thing is still kinda up in the air.

[Foxhound438]

Vincent - This I got no idea. Flavor wise, warlock sort of fits, but can they do shape shifting like Vincent?


one of the warlock invocations gives you polymorph, take true poly as your 9th level arcanum. he might be a bit difficult otherwise, seeing as how he's a gunslinger. your best bet is probably to flavor e-blast as gunshots, but that might be a bit of a stretch.

[Foxhound438]

Materia: All players play martial classes but gain spell slots as a full caster (preferably using Spell Points from the DMs Guide). However, you collect items attuned to certain in-game spells. Each spell gains it's own experience and levels up it's spell level at the same rate a player would. You can equip 1/2 character level + Intelligence mod spells.
Ex. So, let's say Cloud (12 intelligence) is at level 6. He can equip 4 materia at one time. So, he equips Sleep, Fireball, Hold Person, and Chill Touch. When he kills a 200xp monster by himself, he and all 4 materia gain experience. All of those materia were new except chill touch which already had 200xp on it. So now Cloud can cast it as a lvl 2 spell.

Of course, the only problem with this method is that different spells start out at different level. However, the nature of FF7 is that spells gain new qualities as they level up. So, it wouldn't be unreasonable for Fire Bolt to grow into Fire Ball.

Alternative for Materia: Go check out how soulmelds for Incarnates worked in 3rd edition's Magic of Incarnum sourcebook. Flavorwise it seems to be the closest thing that's already been done in D&D.

or you could try to just re-make all of the vanilla materia, ie fire1 = burning hands, fire2 = scorching ray, fire3 = fireball; higher level fire based spells require summon or contain materia (ie flare would be wall of fire, ifrit could start with fireball and eventually get firestorm, bahamut-zero would cast comet storm)