Possible for a undead to free themselves?

[Th3N3xtGuy]

Besides mystical plot magic is it possible for say a recently risen knight to resist the necros control and be free?

[Necroticplague]

Depends on how exactly the necromancer is controlling them.

[Th3N3xtGuy]

Depends on how exactly the necromancer is controlling them.

I assume magic, its not really a science I don't know how it works.

[ManicOppressive]

No, not according to the rules. Undead creatures (with the possible exception of free-willed ones, depending on how you fluff them) are not resurrected creatures under some sort of mind control. They're the lifeless corpses of creatures filled with the necromancer's energy, so by definition their only purpose or "desire" (if you could even call it that) in unlife is to serve the whims of the one controlling them.

Redcloak enunciates this pretty well over in the comic. Huge Spoilers, if you're not caught up. http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0830.html

An undead creature has no more chance of resisting based on who it was in life than does a corpse tied to a rope and used as a pendulum.

[Jack_Simth]

I assume magic, its not really a science I don't know how it works.
Right. But which bit of magic?

Suppose the necromancer is using animate dead, and turns the knight into a zombie or skeleton.
In this case, the zombie is mindless, and utterly subject to the orders of the necromancer. No way out other than:
Destruction of the zombie.
Death/Destruction of the Necromancer.
The necromancer letting the zombie go because the necromancer is at the control limit and is making new undead.
Someone casting Resurrection or better directly on the zombie (it's a clause in the undead type).
Control by another (which really, isn't a way out).
Plot devices (as always).

Suppose the necromancer is using Create (Greater) Undead, and turns the subject into something free-willed - anything on either list, really.
In this case, the undead is not automatically under it's creator's control. However, it's also very much NOT the original personality (Create Undead and it's Greater brother create standard creatures, not templated creatures). So while the creature might attack the necromancer, it might not. It might obey the necromancer, it might not. But it's not the original knight without a plot device.

There's other ways... but each method a necromancer has available via clearly-defined RAW has it's own mechanics and result. The Curst template can be deliberately applied to another, for instance (or, I suppose, applied to one's self via Craft Contingent Spell...) and generates a free-willed undead, as can Animate Dread Warrior (likewise) but generates a totally obedient slave (other than the confusion bit). Some methods result in a perfectly obedient servant that's stuck as much as the zombie was. Others make a horrible personality warping on the original, but leave class features, memories, some aspects of the personality, and free will largely intact (such as the Curst template).

So really, the question very much is "How is the necromancer making the undead?" As the specifics matter.

[Necroticplague]

I assume magic, its not really a science I don't know how it works.

Which magic? There are quite a few ways magic can be controlling undead. If he's Turned by an evil cleric, you're gonna have to have another cleric re-turn him. If he's a cleric, he could do it himself. If it's a spell with a duration, like Control Undead, he simply has to be away long enough for the duration to end. If it's something permanent, he might be able to dispel it from himself (or Iron Heart Surge). In almost all cases, bringing him back to life would probably sever the link, if he can get a resurrection.

Essentially, your question is too vague to answer. Is Knight his title, or class? What type of undead is he? How was he animated/raised/otherwise turned undead? What class feature or spell is the necromancer using to maintain control of him? Is what's his build? Would he have access to magic items? How close a leash would the necromancer be keeping on him in order to prevent such? The more of these you can answer, the better.

[Th3N3xtGuy]

Which magic? There are quite a few ways magic can be controlling undead. If he's Turned by an evil cleric, you're gonna have to have another cleric re-turn him. If he's a cleric, he could do it himself. If it's a spell with a duration, like Control Undead, he simply has to be away long enough for the duration to end. If it's something permanent, he might be able to dispel it from himself (or Iron Heart Surge). In almost all cases, bringing him back to life would probably sever the link, if he can get a resurrection.

Essentially, your question is too vague to answer. Is Knight his title, or class? What type of undead is he? How was he animated/raised/otherwise turned undead? What class feature or spell is the necromancer using to maintain control of him? Is what's his build? Would he have access to magic items? How close a leash would the necromancer be keeping on him in order to prevent such? The more of these you can answer, the better.

The knight was just a example. In my head I always imagined undead being controlled by the will of the caster that raised it, kinda like how in Warcraft as soon as the LK will wavered, undead began to rebel. In this scenario wouldn't a recently dead intelligent humanoid retain its intelligence due to no rot even if caster's will is absolute. I guess under standard rules they would be mindless servants, kinda boring.

[ManicOppressive]

Yeah, no, unless it's a specifically free-willed undead (Vampire, lich, a few others) it doesn't retain anything of its past. Undead would be pretty horrible to use if they did. They're not meant to be characters, they're tools and weapons.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

The knight was just a example. In my head I always imagined undead being controlled by the will of the caster that raised it, kinda like how in Warcraft as soon as the LK will wavered, undead began to rebel. In this scenario wouldn't a recently dead intelligent humanoid retain its intelligence due to no rot even if caster's will is absolute. I guess under standard rules they would be mindless servants, kinda boring.

There are several types of intelligent undead - in fact, more or less every kind of undead except for your basic skeletons and zombies are intelligent to a degree (though many, like ghouls, are dumb and animalistic). However, most forms of control over undead - such as an (evil or neutral) cleric's rebuke undead ability, or the control undead spell are absolute - once control is established, there's not much the undead can do about it (though breaking of the control via an outside source is possible, and of course, if the controller dies...) The only method I can think of to get the kind of non-absolute control you're talking about it the command undead spell, which when used on an intelligent undead acts somewhat similarly to a charm spell and does not allow for obviously suicidal orders (though the definition of `obviously suicidal` here is a rather lax one).

Also, whether an undead is intelligent or not is entirely dependent on it's creature type. Basically, if it's a basic skeleton or zombie (such as created by an animate dead spell), it's mindless, while if it's more or less anything else (for example, anything created by the create undead spell), it isn't. The state of the corpse has very little to do with it.

If you want more information, I recommend looking at the spells I've mentioned in the Players Handbook, the entries for undead in the Monster Manual, Libris Mortis (basically the undead splatbook) and this (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=ln3rbeb025s5qobc9cj6oltia4&topic=2733)

[Deophaun]

However, it's also very much NOT the original personality (Create Undead and it's Greater brother create standard creatures, not templated creatures).
Create undead can create creatures with the Bone Creature, Corpse Creature, and Juju Zombie templates, which retain most everything they had in life. Now, the Corpse Creature shifts alignment to evil, and the Juju Zombie template talks about how it's a "bloodthirsty thing, driven to destroy the living and bring woe wherever it wanders," but the Bone Creature template doesn't touch any of that: a Paladin turned into a Bone Creature will still be Lawful Good, apparently.

[Necroticplague]

The knight was just a example. In my head I always imagined undead being controlled by the will of the caster that raised it, kinda like how in Warcraft as soon as the LK will wavered, undead began to rebel. In this scenario wouldn't a recently dead intelligent humanoid retain its intelligence due to no rot even if caster's will is absolute. I guess under standard rules they would be mindless servants, kinda boring.

Some spells work like that. Animate Dead is one example. If he was raised by that, he is under the necros control and the only real hope is that the necromancer screws up and animates too many things. Others don't inherently have any connection to the necromancer, and are free to sod off as soon as they wake up, like cursts. So your answer will vary wildly depending on exact circumstances.

[Florian]

The knight was just a example. In my head I always imagined undead being controlled by the will of the caster that raised it, kinda like how in Warcraft as soon as the LK will wavered, undead began to rebel. In this scenario wouldn't a recently dead intelligent humanoid retain its intelligence due to no rot even if caster's will is absolute. I guess under standard rules they would be mindless servants, kinda boring.

Warcraft is a bad example as part of the underlying setting was based ln simply transforming living people into undead versions of themselves with bo big changes to their personality.

The closest thing to that would be the Necropolitan template that simply turns a living being into a straight undead version of itself.

Most other forms of undead are pretty far advanced beyond that kind of simple transformation.

[Willie the Duck]

Some undead are created by other undead and are subservient to their will (such as vampires). The easiest way to end that effect is to convince a party of adventurers that they're not a threat to them, and get them to kill their master. Makes being the boss of unloyal minions rather challenging, no? Otherwise, it will be entirely dependent upon the type of animation, and the game world (that mystical plot magic).

[Jack_Simth]

Create undead can create creatures with the Bone Creature, Corpse Creature, and Juju Zombie templates, which retain most everything they had in life. Now, the Corpse Creature shifts alignment to evil, and the Juju Zombie template talks about how it's a "bloodthirsty thing, driven to destroy the living and bring woe wherever it wanders," but the Bone Creature template doesn't touch any of that: a Paladin turned into a Bone Creature will still be Lawful Good, apparently.
I suppose I should have said off of the core 3.5 list. Still.

[Flickerdart]

Some undead are created by other undead and are subservient to their will (such as vampires). The easiest way to end that effect is to convince a party of adventurers that they're not a threat to them, and get them to kill their master. Makes being the boss of unloyal minions rather challenging, no? Otherwise, it will be entirely dependent upon the type of animation, and the game world (that mystical plot magic).
A vampire can simply make its own vampiric servant. Because the only cap on a servant's strength is double the master's HD, a vampire's vampire's vampire can have up to 4 times the HD of the original vampire, in which case it should have no problem slaying its master's master.

[Willie the Duck]

Well sure, assuming something you can defeat and turn into a vampire can kill something the defeated you and turned you into a vampire.

[Mr Adventurer]

Ghouls have above-average Intelligence, Wisdom, AND Charisma. They're superior to baseline humanoids in every way, not "dumb and animalistic".

I've always thought a ghoul or ghast would be an excellent BBEG for 1st level characters...

[Flickerdart]

Well sure, assuming something you can defeat and turn into a vampire can kill something the defeated you and turned you into a vampire.
Again - the HD caps are in your favour here, and you have Dominate so finding some saps to help you (or just dominating the victim - pick a guy with a low Will save) is easy.