Incarnate Sniper?

[Ursus Spelaeus]

So I was thinking of putting together an Incarnate character put together for stealth and ranged combat.
This isn't actually for a campaign. I just like building characters for fun.
Incarnate Avatar and Dissolving Spittle for the ranged attacks. Maybe see about a psionics dip so I can get a Psicrystal, and argue with the hypothetical DM about Share Soulmeld and the magic/psionics transparency rules.
Then Fellmist Robe for the concealment, the Darkstalker feat from Lords of Madness, and something to improve my hide checks.
Let's say this is for an Epic 6 campaign (http://www.myth-weavers.com/wiki/index.php/Epic_6/Character_Creation).
No gestalt.

Any suggestions?

[The Viscount]

In terms of simple stuff, the sighting gloves are obviously helpful for increasing damage, and you can use Airstep sandals to keep away from the combat. An interpretation of them that may be worth a discussion with your DM is that using them to Hover dodges the whole starting and stopping on a solid surface, so you don't have to waste a bind on them.

In terms of hide checks, you might consider taking shape soulmeld for a totemist meld like the worg pelt, which will help you. Alternatively, you can actually dip or splash into totemist. That's more complicated, so I'll let one of the more experienced Incarnum veterans discuss that.

[Venger]

So I was thinking of putting together an Incarnate character put together for stealth and ranged combat.
This isn't actually for a campaign. I just like building characters for fun.
Incarnate Avatar and Dissolving Spittle for the ranged attacks. Maybe see about a psionics dip so I can get a Psicrystal, and argue with the hypothetical DM about Share Soulmeld and the magic/psionics transparency rules.
Then Fellmist Robe for the concealment, the Darkstalker feat from Lords of Madness, and something to improve my hide checks.
Let's say this is for an Epic 6 campaign (http://www.myth-weavers.com/wiki/index.php/Epic_6/Character_Creation).
No gestalt.

Any suggestions?

As ever, it's a good idea to start with the handbooks.

here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?217064-Soulmeld-List-by-Class-and-Slot) is a breakdown of all* the melds and what they do broken up by class. look over incarnate and learn about your melds. the organization in moi is alphabetical rather than by slot so it's handy to have this to see everything based on where you'll be shaping/binding it.

here (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=6920.0) is the incarnate handbook, a good overview of the class overall, talking about its strengths and what it's good at.

incarnates suck at stealth on their own, lacking both hide and ms as class skills and having no melds to boost them or give relevant skills such as invisibility.

dissolving spittle is their one of their only ranged attacks, and sighting gloves is their only thing that boosts it easily.

if a psicrystal is the only reason you want to dip psionics, rather than theurging, don't bother. levels are precious even in normal games, they're much more important in e6. use one of your infinite feats to buy a wild cohort (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031118a) he's bigger and meaner than a psicrystal plus you can ride on him and thus do mount stuff if you feel like it.

there's no arguing involved for a psionics/meldshaping character, they both work together, and they even made the soul manifester class for theurges (though in e6 you can't enter it of course without special considerations)

if you like powers, just shape the mage's spectacles (assuming your dm plays by RAW and allows transparency) and mess around with dorjes. if he doesn't, then shape the psion's eyes instead.

if you're deadset on skulking around as an incarnate, e6 is probably the best environment for it. take shape soulmeld either kruthik claws or worg pelt (both boost hide/ms. kruthik pelt gives a higher bonus but occupies your hand, worg pelt's bonus is lower, but it only occupies your foot) and then nab darkstalker since you have bottomless feats.

the best incarnate to be is evil. it gives automatic access to all 6 of the necrocarnum soulmelds which no one else can shape, and its bonuses from alignment melds boost melee damage. good incarnate is next with access to 2 unique incarnate melds (one of which is crummy, but w/e) and its boosts focused on AC. law is third with no unique meld access and bonuses to to-hit in melee. chaos is worst with no unique melds and bonuses to ranged attack.

depending on your familiarity with soulmelds, you might go totemist2/incarnate4, getting access to all melds on both lists and all 10 chakras.

if this is your first time with a meldshaping character, this will probably be too much bookkeeping, and you should probably stick with one or the other.

if you've got a decent familiarity with incarnate and like his meld list better, but just want a sneaky one for whatever reason, go incarnate6 and grab ss kruthik claws/worg pelt and darkstalker.

if you just want a character who is sneaky and can do range, totemist is a much better fit for you, having many melds that can help, such as the manticore belt, and it has kruthik claws/worg pelt on its list already.

its handbook is here (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2943.0) and its meld list is with the other meld list.


In terms of simple stuff, the sighting gloves are obviously helpful for increasing damage, and you can use Airstep sandals to keep away from the combat. An interpretation of them that may be worth a discussion with your DM is that using them to Hover dodges the whole starting and stopping on a solid surface, so you don't have to waste a bind on them.

In terms of hide checks, you might consider taking shape soulmeld for a totemist meld like the worg pelt, which will help you. Alternatively, you can actually dip or splash into totemist. That's more complicated, so I'll let one of the more experienced Incarnum veterans discuss that.

sighting gloves' damage bonus is pretty crummy without any precision damage (not viable in e6) but it is worth mentioning.

there's no interpretation with airstep sandals: perfect means you can hover, so you should be able to hover without binding them to your foot, but if the dm wants to nerf you, it would be handy to know about in advance.

*there are a handful more melds for both totemist and incarnate in dragon magic, but they're only available if you have the dragonblood subtype. they're pretty amazing, so since you have a lot of feats, definitely throw one into something to gain that type, or roll dragonborn if it's compatible with your alignment.

let me know what your decisions are and what questions you have and we can go from there.

[Ursus Spelaeus]

Well, I think I'm going to need the feet open for the airstep sandals, so I'm going to go ahead with shape soulmeld: kruthnik claws.

I was thinking of going chaotic, since incarnate avatar gives a +1 insight bonus on ranged attack rolls for every essentia invested in it, but only for chaotic characters. The necrocarnum soulmelds are nice, but they don't seem to fit what I'm trying to do.

What if I select githyanki for my race? It's LA +2, but level adjustment has special rules for E6 (it just reduces my ability score point buy.) It provides +2 con (good for meldshapers) and +2 dex (good for ranged attackers). If I go with the psionic version of the githyanki, that will qualify me for psionic feats like psicrystal affinity and psionic shot.
With share soulmeld on the psicrystal, and the dissolving spittle soulmeld shaped, I get to hock an extra glob of acid every round. There's even a psicrystal personality that grants a +3 to hide checks.
Would the concealment granted by the githyanki's concealing amorpha power stack with the concealment granted by the fellmist robe?

*edit*
So... maybe:

Feat 1: Expanded Soulmeld Capacity
Flaw Feat: Psicrystal Affinity (Coward)
Flaw Feat: Share Soulmeld
Flaw Feat: Darkstalker
Feat 3: Shape Soulmeld (Kruthnik Claws)
Feat 6: Bonus Essentia

As I pick up feats, maybe look into getting:
Point Blank Shot, Psionic Shot, Psycarnum Crystal, Cobalt Precision, Many Shot

*edit2*

On the other hand, githyanki are not a small race. I could really use that extra bonus to hide checks that being small provides. Maybe a whisper gnome with the phrenic template?

[Venger]

Well, I think I'm going to need the feet open for the airstep sandals, so I'm going to go ahead with shape soulmeld: kruthnik claws.
ok. kruthik claws are good. bind them to your hands for weapon finesse if, for whatever reason, you want it


I was thinking of going chaotic, since incarnate avatar gives a +1 insight bonus on ranged attack rolls for every essentia invested in it, but only for chaotic characters. The necrocarnum soulmelds are nice, but they don't seem to fit what I'm trying to do.
ok.

but it's necrocarnum melds (six of them) vs no melds. it does give a bonus to attack, but dissolving spittle's a touch attack, so it's not really necessary.


What if I select githyanki for my race? It's LA +2, but level adjustment has special rules for E6 (it just reduces my ability score point buy.) It provides +2 con (good for meldshapers) and +2 dex (good for ranged attackers). If I go with the psionic version of the githyanki, that will qualify me for psionic feats like psicrystal affinity and psionic shot.
With share soulmeld on the psicrystal, and the dissolving spittle soulmeld shaped, I get to hock an extra glob of acid every round. There's even a psicrystal personality that grants a +3 to hide checks.
Would the concealment granted by the githyanki's concealing amorpha power stack with the concealment granted by the fellmist robe?

githyanki's a mediocre race, especially for +2.

if all you care about's con, dragonborn water orc is the traditional choice, for a total of +4 Strength, -2 Dexterity, +4 Constitution, -2 Intelligence, -2 Wisdom, -2 Charisma

if you want to abuse free LA, something ridiculous like karsite for free SR or something else (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=342.0) depending on your tastes.

if all you want the psicrystal for is share soulmeld, you're better off with a wild cohort, which does not cost you class levels or determine your race. it also has no prereqs. psionic shot also has no requirement aside from pbs.

githyanki don't have concealing amorpha, but even if they did, it would not. when you get concealment from more than one thing, only the highest counts.



*edit*
So... maybe:

Feat 1: Expanded Soulmeld Capacity
Flaw Feat: Psicrystal Affinity (Coward)
Flaw Feat: Share Soulmeld
Flaw Feat: Darkstalker
Feat 3: Shape Soulmeld (Kruthnik Claws)
Feat 6: Bonus Essentia

As I pick up feats, maybe look into getting:
Point Blank Shot, Psionic Shot, Psycarnum Crystal, Cobalt Precision, Many Shot

*edit2*

On the other hand, githyanki are not a small race. I could really use that extra bonus to hide checks that being small provides. Maybe a whisper gnome with the phrenic template?
that is also a possible race. you'd be pretty worthless in melee, but if that's not a consideration, you could just focus on flying around and kiting. again, totemist would probably be better for your needs. check out piggy knowles's archer build thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?284283-Piggy-Knowles-Archer-Build-Thread) particularly number 6, the strafing manticore.

since you get all these feats, open more chakras to get more binds. shape soulmeld is never wrong to pick up goodies from whichever list you don't have access to.

[Troacctid]

If you're getting "free" LA, then I would be more inclined to go with the Shadow template (from Lords of Madness) to give yourself total concealment in any illumination other than full daylight, so you don't even need to bother with hide--you're just automatically invisible. It also comes with some other excellent perks, like evasion, fast healing, and 1/day plane shift.

Note that Dissolving Spittle is somewhat unwieldy for sniping due to its short range (only 30 feet).

[ShurikVch]

How about the Incarnate Construct template? :smallsmile:

Warforged Scout as a base race - for +2 Dex
Lolth-Touched for +4 on Hide and Move Silently checks
And another free LA probably best as Chameleon: +4 on Move Silently, and +10 on Hide

EDIT: Or, if Chameleon don't work (it's inherited template not for Constructs), then how about the Dark Creature?
+8 on Hide and +6 on Move Silently checks