Rough, Artificer or Bard 3.5e

[karinrin55]

I'm putting aside my role as DM and moving back to a PC position, now I want to play something I'll enjoy role-playing cause I miss it.
My group already has too much damage output and enough magic (both arcane and divine), so I'm looking for a 5th wheel here.
Now I've played a bard before and a spell thief (which resembles a rough in some ways), both were extremely fun but not so productive. But that was a long time ago, now I'm much more familiar with the rules and my team's tactics and shticks.
Playing a bard again would be tons of fun, role-playing him in particular. But I'm interested in being a little more helpful to the team than a lousy buff (though it can be extremely op with the right build), I was looking at the rough at first which can be a skill monkey and get through tough situations with nearly everything in his kit. Then I thought of artificer, it was played only once in my group and for a very short period but it was interesting and helpful in nearly every situation. Now I'm coming here for advice.
Artificer, Bard or Rough?
I can optimize every one of them in so many different ways, but considering mt fondness to role-playing and being useful I have to ask you guys what you think would be best to play.
Thank you in advanced :smallbiggrin:


Crusader/Fighter-main DMG in round(tons of DMG with full attack with two weapon fighting)
Warblade-secondary DMG(tons of DMG on charge and then meh)
Warlock-some CC DMG and a few buffs
Cleric(of Pelor I think)-self explanatory
Wu-Jen-also self explenatory

[ComaVision]

Artificer is Tier 1, Bard is Tier 3, Rogue is Tier 4.

You could roleplay them all exactly the same.

[DrBloodbathMC]

I would do an artificer if I were you, you might be a buff to start but the items you can make could propel you to do at least some damage mechanically, and roleplaying those super smart characters are always fun for me. Maybe talk to your DM to get a craft engineering skill to make mundane items that replicate magic such as a parachute replicating featherfall? (I'm doing that in a game starting next month save a different class in an e6)

[Seward]

To decide which, think about what you'll do that will make you smile.


So if you are the guy in the party that wants to drive noncombat roleplay and the best party diplomat/bluffer/etc gets tongue-tied and has no ideas of how to proceed, take over the Face role and let the other guy roll "aid another". A Face needs to be socially inventive for that kind of thing to be any fun. It is a similar problem to doing anything interesting with illusions or suggestion spells. While a rogue has the class skills, being a face requires some Charisma investment and it sucks skill points away from scouting or trapfinding, plus the rogue lacks the spell support for the role the Bard enjoys. Advantage Bard

The Know it All is easier, and any intelligence-based primary caster class will likely be decent at it if you want to spend your resources that way. Again if somebody already does that, it's less of a priority. But if you want to be the guy who knows the stuff you as a player already know from Gm'ing, rather than having to firewall that information Bard's a solid choice, but Artificer's probably best, due to int-based nature of the class.

If you like sneaking around, all three classes have good options there (bard has the class skills+spell support, rogue's primary combat method requires similar stats to the skills, artificer can simulate the spells but not so much the raw skill. Hide works against True Seeing, for example, where invisibility does not. Trapfinding complements a scout, and the bard will have a harder time faking it, although detect magic and certain spells to spring magical traps can help. Advantage Rogue.

In combat, are you comfortable in a "setup artist" role"? Bards are excellent here, with several options to make enemies flatfooted, dim-door to move fighters next to the enemy and the obvious bardsong+haste to supercharge ordinary attacks. You have some solid disabling spells (grease, glitterdust, confusion, sound burst, calm emotions etc) but you don't have enough spell slots to do that routinely. Like the party Face, you need to have a certain kind of personality and situational awareness to play a setup artist and do well. If you don't get some satisfaction from helping allies succeed, you're better off with Artificer or Rogue. If you see bard as "a couple crummy buffs and I have nothing else to do" then you may not be well suited to the class (although if you want to learn how to be a good setup artist, it is a good and forgiving class to learn with).

In combat, do you want to be the guy who gets the kill? If your party is likely to do the things a rogue needs to get his sneak attack, a rogue can deal the most damage of anybody. But you will have encounters where you're reduced to UMDing or being a flanker for a "real" fighter type. If your party is more "every character for themselves" artificer is probably the best chasse to build somebody who puts damage on the enemy. Bards can do ok once the buffs are running, but the fight will often be over before they get their rapier into an enemy.

The point of this is to enjoy the things your character does. Pick the class that does more things that will cause you to grin, or remember it for a war story later. Then work out how to fit it into the party from a spotlight dynamic and a raw optimization standpoint.

[FocusWolf413]

Is there an idea you like?

Do you want to spread rumors about politicians? Do you want to inspire mobs into action with but a word? Do you want to be the greatest thief in the world, stealing the only prize that matters: hearts? Do you want to possibly turn everyone into a whirling dervish or doom and dragonfire? Do you want to have the magical might of a sorcerer while having boundless amounts of flash and pizazz? Do you want to be a walking library, collecting knowledge as you roam? Do you want to be a bard?

Do you want to be someone who always has the right tools for the job? Do you want to be someone who is an expert craftsman respected far and wide for his superior work? Do you want to play someone like Megamind, Batman, or any other superhero with too many tricks up his or her sleeve? Do you want to always be prepared, always have firepower, and always have a place? Do you want to constantly have the full abilities of an archivist, a wizard, a psion, a bard, and a trapsmith before they do? Do you want to be able to have the sweetest gear you can imagine? Do you want to be an Artificer?

Do you want to be bit abrasive, but occasionally useful? Do you want to play someone with a personality like sandpaper? Do you want to slowly wear down opponents, like the sands of time? Do you want to be a Rough?

[Fizban]

Artificers are ultra-boss, but if you don't want to deal with as many notes then having two combat classes around means bardsong buffs will make them all the more efficient. I've already done Bard myself and would take Artificer if given the chance.