The Paladin - Hypothetical Fix

[Droopy McCool]

Well, I was toying with the idea of giving the Paladin the Bard's spell progression while using the Cleric's spell list, and also full CL. Also, changing the casting stat to Cha for less MAD.

I know some of the Pally spells are better (such as Bless Weapon vs Magic Weapon), but I'm not sure it'll matter at this point.

Overpowered? Underpowered still? Better way to make Paladins not suck as spellcasters while keeping it balanced?

McCool

[ComaVision]

It depends on what you're trying to balance it to.

My fix is Mystic Ranger spell progression, with full CL and Smite Evil is per encounter instead of per day. That should slot it in to T3.

EDIT: I forgot, I also key their casting to Cha.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Works just fine. 6th level casters generally translate pretty well to balanced Tier 3 characters. You might go through the list for unique Paladin spells and adjust their level for a 6-level progression- there are plenty of good and unique spells, especially in splatbooks.

[Droopy McCool]

I guess I should have mentioned Smite Evil. I think it should be usable a number of times equal to your Cha per day. One use per encounter when you have Cha/day uses seems good to me.

I probably will add some of the better Pal spells, but I wanted to see if you guys thought the Cleric list thing would work. Apparently so.

McCool

[Psychoalpha]

A friend of mine who still runs a mostly 3.5 game gave the 3.5 Paladin the Pathfinder Warpriest progression (I think it's the same 6 level progression as Bard, with access to the Paladin list modified somewhat to match, including adding some Cleric spells to fill it out), changed casting to Cha, and let them spend Lay On Hands uses to mimic the Warpriest ability where they can cast self-only spells as swift actions.

Personally I think his effort would have been better spent just converting his group to Pathfinder entirely, but a few of them are pointlessly stubborn. :p

[Florian]

Take a look at the Pathfinder Paladin, as that is a very different beast compared to the base 3,5 version.

Still 4 spell levels caster, but based on Charisma instead of Wisdom. Smite Evil is ongoing until the named target for it is defeated, meaning more bang for your buck against worthwhile targets, along with auto-critting and ignoring DR of said target. Lay on Hands reworked to be an actually good all-round restorative ability.

This version of the Paladin doesn´t need the Bard spell progression to be a terror in combat, it is highly effective the way it is.

[yellowrocket]

Guess i may have over done it then. Same 2 domain with the once a day ability and once per day use per domain level with the same progression in the domain as the cleric. Enlarge person, bulls strength, fly, or spiritual weapon at level 5 once per day are so much more useful.

Plus the ability to stop rays and orbs with their shield and a successful reflex save instead of smite, mostly for flavor.