Magical Staff as Arcane Focus

[Daehron]

If a spell caster got their grubby mitts on a magical staff, say the Spider Staff from LMoP, or a Staff of Striking, or Staff of Charming, would you permit them to treat the magical staff as an Arcane Focus?

One could assume that a staff imbued with magical energies would be capable of being an arcane focus just as well as a 'normal' staff carved with runes, or topped with a crystal or whatever means it is that 'makes' a staff an 'Arcane Focus.'

Thoughts?

[Dalebert]

I 100% agree with you and have asked the same question but I don't know of it being explicitly stated anywhere. Just seems like something to present to your DM and I imagine most would say "yes".

[HoarsHalberd]

Non-Magical staves are already suitable arcane focuses. Pg. 151 PHB.

[CantigThimble]

Non-Magical staves are already suitable arcane focuses. Pg. 151 PHB.

That is true, but the question is are magical staves ALSO arcane foci?

I'd allow it based on the common sense of magical objects serving every purpose a mundane version would unless specified by the rules of that enchantment.

[HoarsHalberd]

That is true, but the question is are magical staves ALSO arcane foci?

I'd allow it based on the common sense of magical objects serving every purpose a mundane version would unless specified by the rules of that enchantment.

It doesn't just say non-magical staves, it says: "specialised staves." So it's pretty clear the intent and though everyone remembers: "specific beats general" they seem to forget: "general beats nothing." There is no general rule that says all magical items cannot be used for the same purposes as non-magical ones. Thus the general rule of: "Staves can be used for arcane focuses" applies.

[Dalebert]

It's not clear that they are. A staff can be made into an arcane focus. A staff can also be made to shoot fireballs. It makes sense that you would start by making the fireball staff into a focus first because it will be used by someone who needs a focus. But it's not RAW to my knowledge. I would be very surprised if no one has tweeted this to the developers.

[jkat718]

Not RAW, and a bit of a logical fallacy, but Mike Mearls said here (twitter.com/mikemearls/status/509454576999612416) (Twitter) that the staff option for Arcane Focus and Druidic Focus could be used as a Quarterstaff, and the DMG states that "Unless a staff's description says otherwise, a staff can be used as a quarterstaff" (DMG, p. 140). At my table, I'd be willing to say that "if magic staffs can be used as quarterstaffs, and focuses can be used as quarterstaffs, then magic staffs can be used as focuses." It's not at all a logically sound argument, but it makes sense to me.

[VoxRationis]

Not RAW, and a bit of a logical fallacy, but Mike Mearls said here (twitter.com/mikemearls/status/509454576999612416) (Twitter) that the staff option for Arcane Focus and Druidic Focus could be used as a Quarterstaff, and the DMG states that "Unless a staff's description says otherwise, a staff can be used as a quarterstaff" (DMG, p. 140). At my table, I'd be willing to say that "if magic staffs can be used as quarterstaffs, and focuses can be used as quarterstaffs, then magic staffs can be used as focuses." It's not at all a logically sound argument, but it makes sense to me.

It's extremely fallacious logic, but I agree with your conclusion. The cost of making a staff an arcane focus is negligible compared with making it a magic staff, and since it doesn't take away its weapon functionality to do so, I can't see why anyone would not make a staff to do all three.

Edit: It's like putting a calculator function on a laptop. Sure, you could leave it out, but why would you?

[Strill]

Yes. "Staff" is a category of arcane focus, just as "Longsword" is a category of weapon. Arcane Foci include Staves, wands, orbs, and crystals.

The only magic items that are explicitly described as arcane foci are ones that are not already listed as a type of arcane focus in the PHB, such as the Tome of the Stilled Tongue.

[Merbeast]

I always wonder at the motivation of people to ask questions like this on these forums because I suspect answers given will be used against a DM ruling.
So my answer would be:
1) Ask the DM. If the DM says no, plead your case but he may have a reason for saying no. The reason may also be something he can't tell you yet (for plot purposes). Also, he just gave you a magic staff, so be happy. He didn't have to.
2) If you are the DM, I find it best to say "Yes" to players unless you have a reason to say no. Letting a character use a magic staff as a focus certainly doesn't sound game breaking.

[SharkForce]

i'd probably have it depend on the staff in question.

a staff of striking, probably not. it was probably made for a monk, not for a wizard. a staff of charming or a staff of fire, definitely.