Quick question for an unusual situation (3.5)

[Aetis]

If a wizard made a human corpse permanently invisible using invisibility and permanency, and then later used Animate Dead to make a skeleton using the invisible corpse, is the resulting skeleton creature invisible?

What about other spells and effects that affect the corpse in other ways, and do they have any effect on the resulting creature?

Thanks in advance.

[Beheld]

If a wizard made a human corpse permanently invisible using invisibility and permanency, and then later used Animate Dead to make a skeleton using the invisible corpse, is the resulting skeleton creature invisible?

What about other spells and effects that affect the corpse in other ways, and do they have any effect on the resulting creature?

Thanks in advance.

I mean sure, it's permanently invisible, until it attacks someone, and then it's visible again.

[Ryuuk]

Going strictly by Permanency, I'd lean towards no:

Additionally, the following spells can be cast upon objects or areas only and rendered permanent.

Animate Dead targets an object and produces a creature, which could not be targeted by a Permanent Invisibility. It would depend on whether you consider undead objects.

If you are the player, this is the DMs call, and he could rule as he interprets it. Best to go to who matters.

If you are the DM, well, your call. Personally, I'm imagining an invisible body, but whatever negative energy flows through the it, animating it, being clearly visible. Similar to the scenes in Hollow Man where the body is becoming visible and the circulatory system can be seen. This would just be my fiat based interpretation of the situation though.

EDIT: What Beheld said is true too. You'd need a Permanent Greater Invisibility, and that spell is not on the list.

[Beheld]

Going strictly by Permanency, I'd lean towards no:

Additionally, the following spells can be cast upon objects or areas only and rendered permanent.

Animate Dead targets an object and produces a creature, which could not be targeted by a Permanent Invisibility.

I'm pretty sure that spells continue to operate on non legal targets, provided they were cast on legal targets.

[Âmesang]

I'd agree with Beheld; I can't see how or why spells would be constantly targeting their target every round. I.e. the spell checks to see if the target is valid once:

IF (valid == "yes")
{

spell = "on";
}
ELSE
{

spell = "off";
}

…likewise I'd agree that the invisibility would last until the undead attacks. Granted, the unguent of timelessness comes to mind, but considering a dead subject returns to life and his cells start dying and regrowing… hmm, perhaps have the effects wear off after a month like a self-inflected arcane mark? The ability to "resist the passage of time" is null and void simply because living flesh doesn't rot (usually :smalleek:). Either that or it slows them considerably! :smallbiggrin:

[nedz]

Yep, spell conditions are checked when you cast them - unless a specific rule says otherwise.

[Quertus]

I'd agree with Beheld; I can't see how or why spells would be constantly targeting their target every round. I.e. the spell checks to see if the target is valid once:

Magic is a flow of energy. You wouldn't say, "I had a current fleeting through this copper wire, then I polymorphed it into plastic / cut it / etc - I don't see why the current would target the wire each round". This is how I would interpret it. But I'm not sure if there is a RAW president.

[Aetis]

So the invisibility spell lasts on the skeleton until it attacks?

Uhh, ok.

[Rijan_Sai]

So the invisibility spell lasts on the skeleton until it attacks?

Uhh, ok.
Yep (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/invisibility.htm)


Of course, the subject is not magically silenced, and certain other conditions can render the recipient detectable (such as stepping in a puddle). The spell ends if the subject attacks any creature. For purposes of this spell, an attack includes any spell targeting a foe or whose area or effect includes a foe. (Exactly who is a foe depends on the invisible character’s perceptions.) Actions directed at unattended objects do not break the spell. Causing harm indirectly is not an attack. Thus, an invisible being can open doors, talk, eat, climb stairs, summon monsters and have them attack, cut the ropes holding a rope bridge while enemies are on the bridge, remotely trigger traps, open a portcullis to release attack dogs, and so forth. If the subject attacks directly, however, it immediately becomes visible along with all its gear. Spells such as bless that specifically affect allies but not foes are not attacks for this purpose, even when they include foes in their area.

Nothing in Permanency overrides this, and objects don't normally do much attacking...

[Keld Denar]

Hmmmm, if you took a totally mundane door, applied a Silent Portal Disk to it, and then Polymorph Any Object'ed it so that it became a corpse, then Animate Dead'ed it, would you have a completely silent zombie?