Optimization Bizarro Chef Optimization Challenge: Magic A is Magic B [Archive]

View Full Version : Optimization Bizarro Chef Optimization Challenge: Magic A is Magic B

Lagren

2015-12-21, 01:09 PM

Behold, another Iron Chef knock-off.

However, unlike Iron Chef, this contest isn't about restricting your options: rather, it's about providing new ones. Each round will be run under the effect of a house rule that significantly broadens the options available to optimizers.

For this inaugural round:

Arcane/Divine Magic Transparency

What scholars once thought of as wholly separate magic systems are in fact much closer than anyone suspected. While Clerics and Wizards still approach their studies differently, many specialized methods of training have been found to apply equally well to both arcane and divine magic.

All prestige classes that advance "+1 level of an existing Arcane spellcasting class" or "+1 level of an existing Divine spellcasting class" instead advance "+1 level of an existing spellcasting class." Similarly, all "able to cast Xth level Arcane spells" or "able to cast Xth level Divine spells" prerequisites become "Able to cast Xth level spells" prerequisites.

All Theurge classes require you to have two separate spellcasting progressions at the appropriate levels, but you can theurge Paladin with Favored Soul or Bard with Sorcerer: you're only prohibited from theurging a class with itself. Yes, this means you can qualify for Sublime Chord with Bard and then theurge Sublime Chord/Bard.

Any questions about the house rules should be posted publicly in the thread, so that the answers can be known to all contestants.

More general rules follow. Most of them are identical to Iron Chef, but you should still review them.

Contestants: You will need to present a full 20-level build for your entry. Also required is a rundown of how your build works at lower levels, to demonstrate that it is a functional character that could be played from 1-20 in a real game. Traditionally contestants give "snapshots" of tactics and abilities at levels 5, 10, 15, and 20, as well as a "sweet spot" of their choosing that represents what they believe to be the high point of the build.

Menu:
32 point-buy is the presumed creation method, but we have generally allowed other levels of point-buy.
If you do use a different point-buy, please make your case for its necessity in your entry. Keep in mind that for using exceptionally large or small point-buys may warrant deductions in elegance and/or power.

Kitchen: Competitors will be free to use any official 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon magazine is disallowed, and Unearthed Arcana is allowed; but see Elegance below. Web-exclusive 3.0 or 3.5 materials by WotC are expressly allowed, but take care to verify that an updated version did not appear in print elsewhere, as this may cause an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion. Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt or Generic Classes are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Please refrain from using Taint or Item Familiars.
NB: Official Errata and 3.5 updates to 3.0 content are considered valid regardless of whether their sources would otherwise be legal. This includes the 3.5 update of Oriental Adventures given in Dragon Magazine, and the 3.5 updates of Dragonlance Campaign Setting content given in later third party Dragonlance books.

Cooking Time: Contestants will have until January 9th, 2016 to create their builds and PM them to the Chair, Lagren. Please put the name of your build in the subject line of your PM. Builds will then be posted simultaneously, to avoid copying. Judges will have until January 22nd, 2016 to judge the builds and submit their scores. If no judges have scored by that point, only the scores of the first judge to submit will be counted. The Chair reserves the right to judge builds in the event that no other judges can be found.

Judging: Judging will be based on the following criteria, with each build rated on a scale from 1 (very poor) to 5 (exemplary) in each area: Originality, Power, Elegance, Use of House Rules.

Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. It's difficult to accept your award if you have to keep ducking flying books.

Elegance could bear a little elaboration. It basically measures how skillfully you put your build together, and whether you sacrificed flavor for power. We're cooking here - if your dish doesn't taste good, it doesn't matter how well-presented it is. Use of flaws is considered in poor taste, and judges are asked to take a dim view of this option, taking it into account while grading. Other things that will cause penalties here are excessive multi-classing, and classes that don't fit the concept - using Cloistered Cleric in a front-line melee fighter, for example, will lose you points. A legal source's relative obscurity should not be considered as penalizing Elegance, excepting the aforementioned issues with Unearthed Arcana. Using too many sources may result in a penalty to Elegance at the judges' discretion, but a book's relative obscurity may not. In that same vein, drawing solely from the Core 3 (and the d20 SRD) should not be punished for lacking Originality.

Presentation: Builds will be posted anonymously, in order to avoid the potential of bias towards a particular competitor. For this reason, please don't put your name in the build.

Please use the hallowed standard table, handed down from the ancestors:
NAME OF ENTRY

Level
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

2nd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

3rd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

4th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

5th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

6th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

7th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

8th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

9th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

10th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

11th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

12th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

13th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

14th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

15th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

16th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

17th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

18th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

19th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

20th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

Code immediately below (spoiler).

Level
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

2nd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

3rd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

4th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

5th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

6th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

7th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

8th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

9th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

10th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

11th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

12th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

13th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

14th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

15th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

16th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

17th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

18th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

19th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

20th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

For entries with spellcasting, use the sacred Spells per Day and Spells Known table. (Spells Known only if necessary, i.e. Sorcerer or Bard, but not Wizard or Warmage)Spells per Day/Spells Known
Spells per Day/Spells Known

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th

1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

4th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

5th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

6th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

7th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

8th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

9th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

10th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

11th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

12th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

13th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

14th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

15th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

16th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

17th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

18th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

19th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

20th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

Code immediately below (spoiler)Spells per Day/Spells Known
Spells per Day/Spells Known

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th

1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

4th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

5th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

6th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

7th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

8th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

9th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

10th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

11th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

12th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

13th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

14th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

15th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

16th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

17th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

18th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

19th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

20th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

For other systems (Psionics, ToB, Incarnum, etc.) keep track of PP/maneuvers/essentia separately, preferably in a nice neat list.

Leadership is banned; we're producing a meal, not a seven-course banquet for a hundred diners. If your entry includes a prestige class or ACF that grants Leadership or a Leadership-like ability as a bonus feat, the feat should be ignored and is not eligible to be traded away for another feat or ACF through any means.

We will award 1st through 3rd places, as well as a shout-out for honourable mention. The honourable mention prize is given to the most daring or unexpected build. Judges, contestants and guests alike are invited to vote for honourable mention via PM. If there are no votes, Honourable Mention will go to the chair's favorite build. I will note that I much prefer originality and good flavor over power. :smallwink:

riccaru

2015-12-21, 04:54 PM

Posting for the sub.

Jormengand

2015-12-21, 06:11 PM

The opposite part of the gestalt can be drawn from any legal source.

Assuming this is a copy-paste mistake?

Lagren

2015-12-21, 06:40 PM

Assuming this is a copy-paste mistake?

And here I was, thinking I had read things closely enough. :smallredface:

Sian

2015-12-21, 06:44 PM

While the core idea is good I'd opine that you've started with a bit to TO friendly idea.

ATHATH

2015-12-21, 06:53 PM

Lagren

2015-12-21, 06:57 PM

While the core idea is good I'd opine that you've started with a bit to TO friendly idea.

If you would like to submit a TO build, feel free. But recall that Power is only one of four categories.

Personally, I'm more likely to give a high score to someone who submitted a workable divine rogue, rather than to a cheese-doused Incantatrix/Ur-Priest/Sublime Chord/etc. You can build high-op builds without this house rule: you can't really make a rogue with decent divine casting.

Jormengand

2015-12-21, 07:02 PM

If you would like to submit a TO build, feel free. But recall that Power is only one of four categories.

Personally, I'm more likely to give a high score to someone who submitted a workable divine rogue, rather than to a cheese-doused Incantatrix/Ur-Priest/Sublime Chord/etc. You can build high-op builds without this house rule: you can't really make a rogue with decent divine casting.

Divine Trickster was something I was considering, but the fact you need mage hand (and the fact that it already advances divine casting, you just need arcane to get into it) kinda nixed that.

Lagren

2015-12-21, 07:19 PM

Divine Trickster was something I was considering, but the fact you need mage hand (and the fact that it already advances divine casting, you just need arcane to get into it) kinda nixed that.

There does exist a divine casting class that gains mage hand naturally: and Divine Trickster isn't the only arcane rogue that benefits from these house rules. I'll refrain from elaborating more, unless you'd like me to give it away. :smallwink:

Jormengand

2015-12-21, 07:28 PM

There does exist a divine casting class that gains mage hand naturally: and Divine Trickster isn't the only arcane rogue that benefits from these house rules. I'll refrain from elaborating more, unless you'd like me to give it away. :smallwink:

I'm sure there is (and I'd bet there's a domain that has it), but I've gone down a different route already anyway.

Lagren

2015-12-21, 07:38 PM

Some ideas for the next few versions of this challenge:

Feats in pre-requisites (not pre-requisites for feats) are replaced with BAB pre-requisites (1 BAB per formerly-required feat (perhaps factor in the pre-requisites of the pre-requisites of feats in the required BAB calculation)).

All skill requirements are lowered by five points.

Use the Prestige-6 (E6, but with prestige-classes as base classes (search "E6 prestige classes", and you should find a Google Doc)) rules with the normal 20 level system.

I like the second, but it might be a bit too permissive. Even three points would be enough, since that's the difference between a class skill and a non-class skill.

I've been thinking for the next one that I might make all caster prestiges progress Meldshaping.

Jormengand

2015-12-21, 07:46 PM

I've been thinking for the next one that I might make all caster prestiges progress Meldshaping.

Ugh, please don't force us to use a subsystem that not everyone knows. Or if you do, make it truespeak for added hilarity.

Lagren

2015-12-21, 08:36 PM

Ugh, please don't force us to use a subsystem that not everyone knows. Or if you do, make it truespeak for added hilarity.

Round 2: Revenge of the Obscure. All classes that progress arcane or divine spellcasting instead progress your choice of Meldshaping, Manifesting, Binding, or Truespeaking. :smallamused:

Jormengand

2015-12-21, 08:59 PM

Round 2: Revenge of the Obscure. All classes that progress arcane or divine spellcasting instead progress your choice of Meldshaping, Manifesting, Binding, or Truespeaking. :smallamused:

You realise that I'm now going to end up theurging psion/truenamer just for the hilarity of it all? :smalltongue:

Lagren

2015-12-21, 10:47 PM

You realise that I'm now going to end up theurging psion/truenamer just for the hilarity of it all? :smalltongue:

Mission accomplished. :smallbiggrin:

riccaru

2015-12-21, 11:17 PM

Round 2: Revenge of the Obscure. All classes that progress arcane or divine spellcasting instead progress your choice of Meldshaping, Manifesting, Binding, or Truespeaking. :smallamused:

Speaking of manifesting does that have any special rules in this round or is it just arcane/divine?

Lagren

2015-12-21, 11:34 PM

Speaking of manifesting does that have any special rules in this round or is it just arcane/divine?

Not in this round, no.

gorfnab

2015-12-21, 11:49 PM

Round 2: Revenge of the Obscure. All classes that progress arcane or divine spellcasting instead progress your choice of Meldshaping, Manifesting, Binding, or Truespeaking. :smallamused:
Don't forget Mysteries from Shadowcaster, Infusions from Artificer, and Maneuvers/Stances from Tome of Battle.

Lagren

2015-12-21, 11:53 PM

Don't forget Mysteries from Shadowcaster, Infusions from Artificer, and Maneuvers/Stances from Tome of Battle.

Nah, Maneuvers aren't obscure enough. That's why I didn't include Invocations either. But Infusions/Mysteries might work. :smallwink:

Lagren

2015-12-24, 12:06 PM

Anyone have any further suggestions for later rounds?

ben-zayb

2015-12-24, 01:42 PM

Jormengand

2015-12-24, 02:02 PM

Lagren

2015-12-24, 02:09 PM

"Non-initiator" classes have IL equal to their BAB? So we get either full, three quarters, or half. It also means a Crusader 1 / Swordsage 4 character has Crusader IL 4 and Swordsage IL 5.

EDIT: Obviously, since the relevant BAB will be tied to class, stuff like Divine Power does jack for this purpose.

EDIT: You might also partially or fully lift the 3-maximum limit of Martial Study

I was considering 'all non-casting classes grant full IL', but Tying it to BAB would be interesting for a more gishy sort of round.

Here are a few others for your consideration:

- All skills are class skills for all classes.
- Whenever you would select a bonus feat from a list, you may instead select any two feats from that list. (You must still fulfill any necessary prerequisites: 'any feat' is not a qualifying list.)
- Whenever you would select a class feature from a list of options, you may instead select any two options from that list.
- All forms of precision damage (skirmish, sneak attack, sudden strike) are mutually convertible.
- Pick any two races. You gain all the benefits and penalties of both.
- All deity and alignment restrictions no longer apply.

Insane option:
- Leadership and leadership-like abilities are not banned.

Edit:
There are now only three ability scores: Power, Cunning, and Conviction. Whenever you would use Strength or Constitution, use Power instead. Whenever you would use Intelligence or Dexterity, use Cunning instead. Whenever you would use Charisma or Wisdom, use Conviction instead. Build a character using 16 point buy in this system.

Troacctid

2015-12-24, 02:55 PM

Anyone have any further suggestions for later rounds?

Full attacks are a standard action.

Feats are granted at every level.

Level adjustments affect your point buy rather than your level (the E6 system).

All prestige classes that advance casting offer full casting advancement.

ben-zayb

2015-12-24, 08:03 PM

More suggestions

Prestige classes without spellcasting/manifesting progression progress non-spellcasting class features of whichever base class you already had the most progression with?
You automatically gain Fighter Bonus Feats whose requirements 1. you already meet and 2. includes another Fighter Bonus Feat that you already have. This excludes fighter bonus feats that could be taken multiple times, such as Martial Study and Martial Stance.
EDIT: You can "chain" ACFs/variants regardless of class, as long as you have the Class Feature to trade away.

Yeah, about that...Problem with that is "not everyone knows" as a parameter would be very nebulous, to the point that we'll likely end up using core/SRD elements only because that's the likely (but still not definite) common ground.

Jormengand

2015-12-24, 08:20 PM

Problem with that is "not everyone knows" as a parameter would be very nebulous, to the point that we'll likely end up using core/SRD elements only because that's the likely (but still not definite) common ground.

I don't see that as a problem. If you focus on an element that all, or a lot of, classes have then you can use ToB and I can use core and that's fine. If you focus on an element that exists in one book then everyone has to use ToB and that's no fun.

ben-zayb

2015-12-24, 09:10 PM

I don't see that as a problem. If you focus on an element that all, or a lot of, classes have then you can use ToB and I can use core and that's fine. If you focus on an element that exists in one book then everyone has to use ToB and that's no fun.Yup, my newer suggestions above would likely have broader applications.

More suggestions!

hybrid LA+0 races of the same type (basically, race gestalt)
class chassis is adjustable: one upgrade/downgrade of hit die (d4,d6,d8,10,d12), class skill point (2,4,6,8,10), bab (good,medium,bad), of any of the individual saves (good, bad), to downgrade/upgrade another

riccaru

2015-12-24, 09:47 PM

Mongobear

2015-12-24, 10:15 PM

Modular Class Builds

Build your own Class(es) from the Warrior/Expert/Spellcaster Generic classes in Unearthed Arcana.

No Base Classes from any other source allowed
ACFs may be taken if you choose the class feature at the appropriate level
Prestige Classes are allowed, but no Theurges

Lagren

2015-12-24, 10:20 PM

All base classes use the generic classes rules.

NPC base classes only.

Build the strongest familiar/psicrystal/animal companion.

X levels of Y class needed.

Gestalt.

Fluff based builds like "knight in shining armor".

All characters get X class feature for free.

I feel like you're starting to drift a bit, here. Some of these are fine contest ideas, but they're not exactly "house rules that broaden available options." For instance, there's already a gestalt contest. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472730-Big-Ball-of-Whatever-A-Gestalt-Optimization-Challenge)

Full attacks are a standard action.

I really like this one.

Edit: To elaborate: I feel like this is the kind of change that could make a whole lot of things immensely broken, but I have no immediate ideas about how to exploit it. It's tricksy. :smallbiggrin:

daremetoidareyo

2015-12-25, 02:16 AM

Atomburster

2015-12-25, 11:48 AM

Hmm. How does this work with Mystic Theurge, Greenspeaker and Arcane Hierophant? What about Ultimate Magus?

Some ideas for other challenges:
1) Advance by Hit Dice only. CR 20 instead of ECL 20. Create the best optimized TPK machine!
2) No more than 100 GP in items.
3) Feats at every level.
4) 1 Class. 1 Level. ECL 20. GO!

Inevitability

2015-12-25, 12:00 PM

One more: All prestige class prerequisites are deleted. You may not take a base class. Prestige classes that advance something that you were supposed to get through a base class do not grant those class features just because they advance them. If you pick a second prestige class that grants a class feature later, the earlier advancement is applied.

I really like this one, but wonder if it doesn't allow jumping into certain prestige classes too early.

I recommend instead lowering all skill rank/BAB requirements by a certain amount and lowering all 'able to cast level X spells' by a certain amount.

Lagren

2015-12-25, 12:11 PM

Hmm. How does this work with Mystic Theurge, Greenspeaker and Arcane Hierophant? What about Ultimate Magus?

All Theurge classes require you to have two separate spellcasting progressions at the appropriate levels, but you can theurge Paladin with Favored Soul or Bard with Sorcerer: you're only prohibited from theurging a class with itself. Yes, this means you can qualify for Sublime Chord with Bard and then theurge Sublime Chord/Bard.

Mystic Theurge now requires you to have 2nd level Arcane spells from two different classes, 2nd level Divine spells from two different classes, or the original prerequisite. Arcane Heirophant is the same, save that you also need to have Trackless Step from somewhere, and you probably also want Wild Shape to get full value out of the class.

Ultimate Magus now requires 1st-level spontaneous casting (arcane or divine) and 2nd-level casting from a spellbook (arcane or divine). These must be granted by different classes. The archivist's prayerbook or similar such systems are considered spellbooks for this purpose, but regular Druid or Cleric casting does not qualify. The Ultimate Magus advancement reads "+1 level of lower-level existing casting class." (This does mean you can qualify with Wizard/Sorcerer and then advance Cleric casting as a 'prepared caster' though, since it doesn't advance a class 'with a spellbook'...)

I wasn't able to find greenspeaker. What's the source?

Edit: Oh, and for all theurge classes you must advance two different classes at each level. No taking Mystic Theurge with Wiz/Sorc and then double-advancing one of them while ignoring the other.

Lagren

2015-12-31, 09:05 PM

A reminder to all contestants: we're more than halfway through the cooking time! Builds are due in 9 days. (That's on January 9th of the new year.)

As I will be closing the contest at some random time on that day, I recommend you actually submit on the 8th. Consider this your one-week warning. :smallwink:

Lagren

2016-01-06, 08:56 PM

Our first entry has been submitted!

Competitors are once again reminded that the contest closes in three days, more or less. Keep them coming. :smallwink:

Lagren

2016-01-08, 09:09 PM

Tomorrow is the deadline, so get your entries in soon, lest ye be judged! Or, er, not judged, as the case may be. :smallbiggrin:

Lagren

2016-01-10, 08:41 PM

We've still got exactly one entry. :smallredface: Any other builders out there working?

Jormengand

2016-01-16, 02:49 PM

We've still got exactly one entry. :smallredface: Any other builders out there working?

I'm guessing you never got any more entries? :smallfrown:

Lagren

2016-01-17, 11:18 PM

I'm guessing you never got any more entries? :smallfrown:

Actually, I have a second entry!

Anyone care to add a third?

Jormengand

2016-01-18, 11:44 AM

Actually, I have a second entry!

Anyone care to add a third?

Ehh. We had a villainous competition where we only had two entries, and that worked out all right (by which I mean I won :smalltongue:) so...