3.5 Arcane Trickster; hitting tier 4

[Apricot]

Hello everyone,

I'm looking for any advice on effectively constructing a Tiefling Arcane Trickster. It's for a group of mine which is not full of optimization-hungry powergamers in the slightest (Druid with a pony as his AC, Barbarian, Paladin, Ranger, Rogue without UMD, and my Sorcerer who took Shout over Polymorph). As such, I'm trying to hit that careful balance for any spellcasting character where she's interesting to play but not destructive. My current Sorcerer is certainly toeing the line, but stays kosher through using most spells for buff spam. There's a possibility that I'll need to carry a little more than my weight in the game, so I'm fine with being a little more potent than the rest of them, but I don't want to be majorly so. I'll start by explaining the character concept and then showing how I intend to translate it into mechanics. If there are any feats, spells, items, or other tidbits which really help with my fluff and crunch, or if I've accidentally weakened her too much, please let me know! Also, for recommendations, most of the people at the table are primarily familiar with Core, so major new wrinkles like Skill Tricks would be untoward.

The entire thing started when I was reading the entry for Tieflings in the Monster Manual. It stated that they were usually Evil due to their inherent nature, and that those who weren't would have to suffer public mistrust for it. So; sounds like a good roleplaying opportunity for me! The way I envisioned my character was as an outcast, maligned from birth, who has no particular love for or hatred towards non-planetouched, but just wants them to stop hurting her. Thus; an extremely anxious, antisocial Arcane Trickster, who delved into magecraft and stealth to protect herself from a world that hates her very existence. Adventuring, for her, is a way to get towards the other misfits of the population, to a place where the others are such freaks that they won't hate her so much, and a way to improve her skills so that she can just be safe. In combat, her methods are mostly about using magic to get in close and make her targets vulnerable before using her Rogue training to deliver a swift and firm kill: minimum fuss, maximum safety. She's found that Enchantment and Evocation spells are far too direct and involved for her to use them properly, but that the curse-stye spells of Necromancy suit her fiendish blood very nicely. Another mage might find them too dark and malicious, but she simply does not care. If she's going to kill someone, she's not concerned about the method behind it.

So, on to the character:
Rogue 3 Wizard 5 Arcane Trickster 1-2 (One level puts her effective level at a nice neat 10, while 2 gives her access to 4th-level spells; I'll discuss the potential spells but treat gear as a 10th-level. Rogue 3 Wizard 5 is, unless someone has information to the contrary, the minimum to gain entry into Arcane Trickster. Also important to note: the Tiefling +1 adjustment makes it impossible for an Arcane Trickster to get 9th-level spells before 21, which is by design. 9th-level spells can break campaigns.)

Alignment: CN. No, not the murderhobo CN.

Abilities: Now, my DM has a non-standard means of assigning stats, which is to give an 18, a 16, a 14, a 12, a 10 and an 8 to distribute how we please. That's way stronger than 32-point-buy, so I'll throw what I'd likely do for my 32pb in below so it's not so jarring. Please let me know if anything makes no sense.

DM fiat:
Str 10
Dex 16 +2
Con 14
Int 18 +2 +2 (Ability Point bonuses)
Wis 12
Cha 8 -2

32pb:
Str 8
Dex 16 +2
Con 12
Int 18 +2 +2
Wis 10
Cha 8 -2

HP ends up being 48/38 respectively, if my math is right. BAB is +4.

Skills are tedious to put down, but they include the Arcane Trickster entry requirements, a couple of points in Disguise, a little into Hide, and the maximum in Move Silently and Sleight of Hand. I'm intending to take a Cat familiar for the bonus to Move Silently. The rest are just obvious Roguish things. If there's something really strong but not obvious, please let me know. Also, UMD is skipped out on because the character has caster levels and awful Cha; is this a reasonable choice?

Spells: this gets a bit more complicated. I'll list the basic ones I intend to get from leveling, and then add on the other desirables as things to be paid for.
Specialist: Necromancy.
Banned: Evocation, Enchantment (if I wanted to make the build much stronger, I'd unban Enchantment and take things on the Charm/Dominate line).

Level 0: all. Isn't it lovely?

Level 1: I get 8 from having a +5 Int modifier at level 1 and 2 more at level 2 because it's the only thing I can research.
Disguise Self: it's what she uses to pretend to not be a walking abomination. She's got a false identity she typically uses with this, and one she's familiar with (read: circumstance bonus), but the poor social skills don't go away.
Identify: to find out what treasure is.
Alarm: the fearful half-Outsider's best friend.
Mage Armor: gives her good defenses without messing with casting.
Shield: see above.
Expeditious Retreat: get in, get out.
Jump: when she learned it, it was a poor Tiefling's Fly.
Feather Fall: see above.
Unseen Servant: generally useful trick.
True Strike: for making sure a blow or a powerful spell hits. Not always needed, but when it is...

Level 2: Four from leveling up.
Invisibility: bread and butter spell. They can't see you=they can't hurt you. Hide bonuses are a thing of the past.
Knock: means no ranks are needed in Open Lock.
Detect Thoughts: seems like the kind of spell a moderate paranoid would like knowing.
Rope Trick: sleep where nobody can see you.

Level 3: Same as above, plus a lot of useful extras.
Vampiric Touch: damage and healing. Good stuff.
Ray of Exhaustion: solid save-or-suck to hit the brawlers with.
Fly: soundless, three-dimensional movement.
Dispel Magic: enemy spells are no joke.
*Greater Magic Weapon: additional damage on a character with low Str.
*Keen Edge: higher crit range can mean more damage. Also, crits are fun and exciting for everyone at my table.
*Shivering Touch: this is the nuclear option. If the character runs into serious combat problems, this is how I intend to resolve most of them. Sure, anything that can dispel its reduction (it's NOT damage) can throw a massive wrench in, but it should cripple most things.

Level 4: Only two spells from leveling, and there can be some feat continuity issues. Oh well; that's easy to fiat out by delaying the feat gain by a single level.
Dimension Door: exactly the kind of spell someone as shifty as her would like.
Bestow Curse/Enervate: my main conundrum. I want to have some kind of spell I can use to cripple a single target before bringing them down with damage. One idea is to do some kind of target-specified curse that massively weakens them, while the other is to just use negative levels to mess them up. Either way, I want one or the other to be a major focus of the build, unless there are better options. I'm pretty sure Enervate is just plain stronger, because of the lack of saves and the metamagic potential, but I'd like hearing others on this.

Feats: this is something I'm struggling with, and would like some feedback.
Scribe Scroll: free.
Quicken Spell: free metamagic from level 5 Wizard. It's hella powerful and fun to use, so I figure I might as well take it.
Weapon Finesse: necessary if I want to use melee weapons. I'm pretty sure the feat tax for melee is less than what I'd need for ranged, so this is what I'm currently going for. Feel free to advise me differently. Level 1 feat.
Two-Weapon Fighting: I'm not going to get much damage from my Strength bonus and my Sneak Attack progression is nerfed by 5 Wizard levels, so I figure adding more attacks is the solution. Again, please tell me if I'm wrong. It's a shame that this feat has anti-synergy with Sneak Attack. Level 3 feat.
Arcane Strike: allows me to blow a spell slot for a bonus to attack rolls and extra damage. I haven't tried this out in the field, so I have no idea if it's secretly just trash. It kind of seems like it might be, when Lightning Bolt deals minimum 5d6 damage compared to the 3d4 of Arcane Strike. Level 6 feat.
Arcane Thesis: this is going to be applied to Bestow Curse or Enervate. A pretty obvious choice here is to take Enervate, switch out most of my feats for metamagic, and go utterly crazy. That might be too strong, though, and end up either trivializing encounters or forcing the DM to make everything important either be undead or use Death Ward. I don't want to do that to him or the party. The other problem is that it starts making less and less sense to have anything Roguish to the character at all, and I end up wondering why she isn't just a Human Wizard. Bestow Curse obviously benefits much less, but it gets harder to save against and I can Quicken it a bit more easily at higher levels. If there's another spell that it makes sense to use this on, then I'm more than open to suggestions. Level 9 feat.
*Conceal Spellcasting: I want Sleight anyway so that the Ranged Legerdemain class feature isn't totally ignored, and this presents cool opportunities. Not sure they're cool enough to put a feat into, though.

In addition to these, I'm concerned about which direction to take the character after. I get three more feats, which I can use for some combination of TWF or metamagic feats. Depending on my choice, I want to make sure that I can get everything I want. I would absolutely love feedback on this in particular.

Items: some of the gold totals are a little, uh, fudged. Still, if it exceeds the gold maximum, it oughtn't be by more than 100. I'm looking for feedback here, too, as I'm not very confident in my choices. I'm using the level 10 gold total; if the ECL is 11 should I be using the level 11 total instead?
Random junk, like spell component pouches, which totals very little gold: no point in listing.
Various scrolls for the sake of adding more spells to my list: a couple hundred gp, unless I splurge.
Gloves of Dexterity +4: reasonable price and helps with everything I want to help. 16,000gp.
Headband of Intellect +4: same as above. 16,000gp.
Double Short Swords of Wounding: I figured Wounding would be the highest damage-for-cost enhancement I could put on a weapon, especially against higher-level enemies and spellcasters. If it's actually really bad, I'm open to other options. 16,600gp for both, for a total of almost exactly 49,000.

There are other little details like languages, but I assume those are uninteresting. If you've read this far, thank you very kindly for your attention, and I look forward to whatever suggestions you have to make. Feats and items are what I'm most worried about, and I'd like to keep the character more or less true to the original vision, but I'm very open to making modifications on that count if there's anything irredeemably broken in an overpowered, underpowered, or outright dysfunctional sense.

[Troacctid]

In core, a more efficient entry for Arcane Trickster is to replace Rogue 3 with Rogue 1/Assassin 1, getting your sneak attack in two levels instead of three. That's a no-go if you want to avoid being evil, though. Outside core, of course, you can replace Assassin with Spellthief, or, better yet, Unseen Seer.

I would not recommend Two-Weapon Fighting (or Weapon Finesse, or melee in general). As a mage, you can just make your sneak attacks with Scorching Rays and the like, which is safer, easier, more accurate, and much more cost-effective. Alternately, the Acidic Splatter reserve feat is a good vehicle for sneak attacks. It's a touch attack with unlimited uses that ignores spell resistance, has no verbal or somatic components, and deals a type of damage that's not often resisted. Short range, yes, but you have to be within 30 feet anyway, so it's no big deal.

I agree with skipping UMD, since you have access to the whole Wizard list without rolling it. I don't like the cat familiar, though; if you want a Move Silently bonus, the snowy owl from Frostburn has better stats and can fly.

I don't think you need Disguise. Why do you care if you look different? You've given up trying to blend in. It's not like you're the party face—let them mistrust you, it's their loss. Also, as a mage, you should have Concentration, since you need it for spellcasting in combat. Spellcraft is vital as well, since Wizards use it to learn new spells. Knowledge skills are also useful for knowing whether your enemies have spell resistance, energy resistance, sneak attack immunity, high saves, low saves, and so on; if you don't know your enemy, you might end up trying to use Invisibility to sneak past something with blindsight or trying to cast Enervation on a creature that's immune to energy drain or whatever, which is embarrassing at best and fatal at worst.

You don't actually need Conceal Spellcasting because hiding spellcasting is a native function of the Sleight of Hand skill, per Rules Compendium p117. The feat only adds the ability to avoid attacks of opportunity and counterspells, which I assume isn't the part you care about.

[Apricot]

Thank you for your advice!

I'll look into seeing if the DM would be willing to waive the Evil requirement for Assassin in exchange for losing some other bonus of the class, because I'm not particularly interested in running a standard wicked Tiefling. Those other classes you mentioned sound interesting as well, although I might give them a miss this go-around.

Giving up melee would make things easier in a lot of ways, though I might go ahead and get some kind of standard weapon just in case. I wasn't aware that magical attacks can count for Sneak Attacks; that smooths things out quite a bit, and I'll read up on those rules myself. It might turn out that optimizing carefully for magic-only would lead to my character ending encounters too quickly, though, in which case I'll take some sort of weapon feat tax to get back to a safe level.

I'll see about the owl, though it might require reskinning or outright nixing if it completely fails to fit into fluff. Thank you for the recommendation; I certainly wouldn't have known about it on my own.

The Disguise is because she does have to talk to ordinary folk sometimes, and she's understandably terrified of them figuring out what she is. It's solely to shore up a bit of weakness with the rolls on Disguise Self, although I think the crunch there can be handwaved if it's just a single, regular, nondescript human form with no bonuses that she just uses to keep herself safe. I have Concentration and Spellcraft as well, but thank you for pointing them out. Knowledge, though, I'm just a little shakier on: what Knowledge skills typically have high bang-for-buck?

That detail about Sleight is fascinating, and I appreciate you educating me. I'll forget about the feat entirely.

[Troacctid]

Giving up melee would make things easier in a lot of ways, though I might go ahead and get some kind of standard weapon just in case. I wasn't aware that magical attacks can count for Sneak Attacks; that smooths things out quite a bit, and I'll read up on those rules myself. It might turn out that optimizing carefully for magic-only would lead to my character ending encounters too quickly, though, in which case I'll take some sort of weapon feat tax to get back to a safe level.
If you're worried about the damage if you go magic-only, then I'd definitely go with the reserve feat, since it's just essentially just giving you back the sneak attack you lost from your Wizard levels. (It deals 1d6 damage per level of your highest-level acid spell, so a Wizard 5/Rogue 3 deals 5d6 damage, same as a Rogue 8's 5d6 sneak attack.) If you want to tone it down even more, you could use Invisible Needle, which is a force effect, but deals less damage and targets normal AC instead of touch; or Clap of Thunder, which deals sonic damage and has a chance to deafen the target, but uses melee instead of range. I suppose in the latter case, using melee could be considered a minor upside, since you can flank with it? *shrug*


Knowledge, though, I'm just a little shakier on: what Knowledge skills typically have high bang-for-buck?
Arcana, Dungeoneering, Local, Nature, Religion, and Planes are the ones that identify creatures, so they're the big ones.

Arcana and Planes are the most important IMO. They cover a very diverse array of creatures with a diverse array of special abilities that you need to know about to fight them. Dragons, constructs, magical beasts, elementals, and outsiders are all very good to know about. Also, as the arcane caster of the group, you're kind of expected to know about this stuff.

Dungeoneering covers aberrations and oozes. These creature types are less common, but when you do face them, it's very good to know what they can do, because, again, they have a diverse array of special abilities. Oozes can often trip you up with abilities that are similar, but slightly different (if you're deciding between fireball and lightning bolt, you definitely don't want to mix up ochre jellies with gray oozes), and aberrations are all over the place.

Local is probably the least important of the six. It only covers humanoids. Humanoids are common, but they're also not very interesting, and knowing about them is unlikely to give you a tactical advantage. It's still a useful skill, and you want at least 1 point to use it trained, but other than that, I'd say it's optional.

Nature is similar to local in that it covers some common creature types, but those creature types also tend to be boring. Animals, giants, and vermin rarely have supernatural abilities that you need to know about. Plants and fey are another story, but they're also fairly uncommon to encounter. Furthermore, I find there's often a "Wilderness Guy" in the party who's already maxing this skill, so they can share the load for you. A few points here are good, but if you're strapped for points, you can skimp on it.

Religion is only used against undead. Undead can be scary, but the main things you need to know about them tend to be the traits that are common to all undead, or to all incorporeal undead, so general knowledge will get you a long way. So you definitely want points here, but you don't necessarily need to max it (especially if there's a Cleric in the party who's already maxing it).

[A_S]

I wasn't aware that magical attacks can count for Sneak Attacks; that smooths things out quite a bit, and I'll read up on those rules myself. It might turn out that optimizing carefully for magic-only would lead to my character ending encounters too quickly, though, in which case I'll take some sort of weapon feat tax to get back to a safe level.
Quick note: not all spells can be used to sneak attack, only spells that require attack rolls (called "weaponlike spells"). The rules for this are in Complete Arcane.

[Dromuthra]

If your DM will okay it, they did release a non-evil version of the assassin. Meet The Avenger (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070401a)

[DrMotives]

If your DM will okay it, they did release a non-evil version of the assassin. Meet The Avenger (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070401a)

That's really weird. The fluff near the top says bards rarely take avenger because they aren't quiet enough. But then under spells while it keys their spellcasting to int, otherwise they cast as bards. It probably should say sorcerer instead, but RAW they have verbal components to all their spells & can never use the silent spell metamagic.

[Apricot]

Thank you for the additional advice, Troacctid! I'll work on putting some sensible Knowledge ranks in.

Thanks for the detail on magical Sneak Attacks, A_S. That makes sense, and I was planning just to use the roll-to-hit ones in any case, so there's not much lost.

The Avenger is interesting, but it would require the same sort of reworking or fluff sacrifice as the Assassin. There's no homeland or nation to avenge and the alignment I'm aiming for is Chaotic, so it gets kinda awkward. I could bring it up as evidence that there are other reasonable ways to get the class bonuses, though.

[Jack_Simth]

That's really weird. The fluff near the top says bards rarely take avenger because they aren't quiet enough. But then under spells while it keys their spellcasting to int, otherwise they cast as bards. It probably should say sorcerer instead, but RAW they have verbal components to all their spells & can never use the silent spell metamagic.
Check the date on the article, DrMotives.

[Troacctid]

That's really weird. The fluff near the top says bards rarely take avenger because they aren't quiet enough. But then under spells while it keys their spellcasting to int, otherwise they cast as bards. It probably should say sorcerer instead, but RAW they have verbal components to all their spells & can never use the silent spell metamagic.

That clause is taken directly from Assassin, FWIW.

[DrMotives]

Ah, I'm guilty of converting from 3.0 to 3.5 and not paying enough attention to all the changes. 3.0 assassins used a spellbook and worked exactly like wizards. I don't use the class very often, so I didn't realize that they became badly worded spontaneous casters.

[ericgrau]

Strategy:
For the basic arcane trickster you want to double sneak attack round 1 against anything that hasn't gone yet, since that makes it flat-footed. Then round 2 you drop a crowd control spell that is also a sneak attack trigger for round 3+. In the morning or at the entrance of a dungeon you drop long duration buffs on your party. Crowd control plays nicely with a party, damage stacks nicely with their efforts, and of course they like buff spamming. This way you get to do better at support and they can shine more. I left out most debuffs like ray of enfeeblement, even though it's necromancy, because it goes to far and makes it look more like you took out the foe.

Notable Gear:

1-3 lesser rods of extend spell for your buffs.
A lesser rod of silent spell may be handy for quietly hasting before a fight or other such buffs.
Plenty of diamond dust for stoneskin spamming. Maybe 3,000-4,000 gp, buying more later, and it's well worth it.
Wand of invisibility, spam on whole party to bypass many encounters, also works on doors to see through them, to hide other objects, etc.
Consider a staff with black tentacles on it to spam on top of the one you prepare(~2 charge cost), maybe stoneskin to spam too (~3 charge cost) so you don't have to prepare it.
If it's not too much optimization for your party, get a wands of golem strike, grave strike and vine strike. UMD to use grave strike and vine strike. May want to scroll vine strike instead since it's rare. UMDing a wand of swift invisibility is also a thought for a sneak attack trigger.
Dust of disappearance x 3: Yes it is expensive, but it is likely you will win 3 encounters with this. Plus yourself and the rogue can sneak attack with it.


Effective Party Friendly Spells:
Also consider orbs, acid arrow or some such both as backup non-fire damage and as additional damage spells for when you run out. Lots of options below and limited spells per day, so pick and choose. I tried to put the better ones towards the top.

Level 4:

Empowered scorching ray and/or enervation, quickened any damage cantrip: your staple for damage, only 2 sneak attacks (1 per spell IIRC), not 3-4, but still decent damage. Sneak attack with enervation does negative energy hp damage plus it seemed more thematic for a necromancer.
An orb spell can also act as a backup for the rare fire immune foe, or enervation (does negative energy damage on a sneak attack), etc.
Black Tentacles: Crowd control, grappled foes are subject to sneak attack. Also kind of thematic.
Stoneskin spamming: Prepare buff for dungeons not wilderness, cast at entrance
Dimension Door: Good utility. Get away in combat or ferry the party past an obstacle.
Mass Enlarge Person: So you have a barbarian, paladin and a ranger huh? Might skip this spell if the ranger isn't melee. If the enemy has humanoids that don't like to melee, include them in the chain to make them easier targets.


Level 3:

Greater magic weapon: 8-24 hour buff spam on the party.
Greater mage armor to 8-24 hour spam on yourself, the druid, his AC and the sorcerer (unless the sorcerer is your old character?).
Magic circle against evil: Prepare only for dungeons to buff spam on the party at the entrance. Charm/domination immunity, AC, saves.
Haste: Very nice for your party so you may want to bite the bullet and cast this sometimes instead of another spell. Around level 13 your party should get their own boots of speed or some such though.
Halt Undead: Nice backup against undead if you don't get a wand of gravestrike. And thematic for a necromancer. Better than command undead below. I'd prepare only one or the other unless you expect a lot of undead.
Phantom Steed: Wouldn't usually prepare it but when your party needs to travel it's a nice fast way to go. Or if you want to conserve 3rd level spells consider mount instead or in addition to knowing this spell. Plus the party pony won't have as much trouble keeping up.


Level 2:

Command undead: Seemed like a nice backup if you don't get a wand of gravestrike, plus thematic for a necromancer.
See Invisibility: Cast at dungeon entrances in case you run into invisible foes. Also prepare in wilderness. Could also be scrolled for wilderness use to save a spell slot.
Glitterdust: Reveals invisible foes, makes foes blind so you can sneak attack them.
False Life: Get up 8-24 hours on yourself. Those with d4s and d6s like HP. And it's necromancy.
Swift Fly (SpC): Get multiple copies to fly without losing your standard action.
Levitate: Great utility in and out of combat. Rescue allies/NPCs/Macguffins, ferry party past obstacles using the barbarian elevator.


Level 1:

Mage armor: If you can't tag quite everyone with greater mage armor, then mage armor will do.
Unseen servant: Gives you some utility to burn your 1st level slots on, because when else will you have time to cast them? Could also be up 24 hours if you want, but that's not critical.
Nerveskitter: Not good if you want to quickened sneak attack round 1, but great otherwise. Tag a party member to be party friendly.
Feather Fall: Again, you won't have much time to use 1st level spells otherwise.