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Insert Name Here
2007-06-12, 09:53 PM
Okay. For my birthday, I got the ToB. It was a good book, seems fairly balanced, and definitely more fun to play than regular fighter classes. However, one odd build occurred to me: The Healing Crusader.
In devoted heart, the crusader-exclusive discipline, there are maneuvers that allow one to heal himself or another. So, that seems regular, but with the way the crusader gets maneuvers and the stance martial spirit (heals 2 to self or another with every blow), does that mean that out of combat, the cleric blows a heal spell, while a crusader heals a person by massaging them? (Can strikes be used as touch attacks for this purpose, or do we need the less efficient unarmed strike for this?)
If this works, then for pure healing, in some ways, the crusader is superior to the cleric.

So, the cleric outfights the fighter, who outheals the Cleric?

Call Me Siggy
2007-06-12, 09:55 PM
Well, maybe, but the Cleric can buff and out-melee any ToB class or prestige class with the right spells. However, Crusader is more balanced. YOU DECIDE.

Insert Name Here
2007-06-12, 09:58 PM
Eh. Main question is just if the Crusader is entirely capable of doing the whole massage-to-full-health thing without a lot of loopholes. It seems plausible, though.

Fax Celestis
2007-06-12, 10:31 PM
Most of the healing ones require threatening opponents, IIRC.

Merlin the Tuna
2007-06-12, 10:37 PM
Devoted Spirit, for the record. And yes, they usually require threatening opponents, so out-of-combat healing usually isn't allowed. Depends on what kind of game your DM wants, though.

TheOOB
2007-06-13, 01:31 AM
A homebrewed feat that lets crusaders use clerical wands and scrolls doesn't seem to far-fetched, and would be a good solution to the problum.

Devoted Spirit Channeling
You can channel the powers of your spirit to use priestly magical items
Prerequisites: Three devoted spirit manuvers, one of which must be level 3 or higher
Benefit: You count as a cleric equal to half the combined level of all your classes that grant devoted spirit manuvers for the purposes of using spell-trigger and spell-compleation items (such as scrolls, wands, and staves).

Insert Name Here
2007-06-13, 12:40 PM
Damn. Devoted Spirit, right.

Ah well. It seemed valid at the time. Meh. I didn't read maneuver descriptions that thoroughly, so I guess I missed the threatening part.

Edit: I suppose the "threatening opponent" definition could be stretched, but that makes it more tenacious with the DM.

Insert Name Here
2007-06-13, 01:41 PM
Okay, upon checking back, most of them do require a threat. However, the stance "martial spirit" doesn't. So, still unlimited out of combat healing, as far as I know.

(Oh, and what does IIRC mean?)

Jack Mann
2007-06-13, 01:46 PM
If I Recall Correctly.

ReluctantDragon
2007-06-13, 01:47 PM
(Oh, and what does IIRC mean?)

If

I

Remember

Correctly


Here to help,
RD

Jothki
2007-06-13, 02:39 PM
Would mind-controlling the crusader and forcing him to assault someone with damage resistance be a viable workaround?

Fax Celestis
2007-06-13, 02:42 PM
Would mind-controlling the crusader and forcing him to assault someone with damage resistance be a viable workaround?

Yes, but you might suffer physical damage from your DM as he smote you with a book.

Shades of Gray
2007-06-22, 09:45 AM
Well if it lets you heal a creature then simple. Carry around a bag of tricks. any time your teamates are dying BAM stab a weasel :smallbiggrin:

Sylian
2007-06-22, 10:08 AM
The healing is actually the inspiration you give your friends, so no, it wouldn't work by attacking harmless critters.