character advice

[Aleolus]

So, I have a character concept and story, but I'm not sure what to do regarding a few areas. I'll put the story in a spoiler tag, but the concept is basically a knight-type character who was betrayed by his own king and now has to live on the run. What I'm looking for advice with is
1) Alignment
2) Rough class build (assume the betrayal happened around level 6 or 7, also note I prefer no more than a 10/5/5 split for 20 levels).
3) Any miscellaneous suggestions for this type of character

Ok, this is character is actually my personal version of Lancelot, based off of my theories of what was really happening (you know, what history won't say because it makes the winners look bad). Arthur came to Lancelot to ask for his aid and support, and Lancelot agreed after seeing how devoted and loyal Arthurs men were. The two became lovers after a little while. Then, Arthur needed to take a bride, and he chose Gwenevere because Lancelot approved of her, at which point their nightly sessions became three-ways. Eventually, after Lancelot and Gwen fell in love, Arthur found a new lover and gave them permission to continue their relationship, with the warning that if they were ever found out, Arthur would deny all knowledge of it, and they would be dealt with as adulterers. Years pass, and rumors start to spread about Arthur not enjoying the company of women. Arthur panics, and sets Lancelot and Gwen to get caught. Lancelot is exiled, Gwenevere is to be put to death, then Lancelot rescues her at the last moment and they run away together

[DMVerdandi]

So, I have a character concept and story, but I'm not sure what to do regarding a few areas. I'll put the story in a spoiler tag, but the concept is basically a knight-type character who was betrayed by his own king and now has to live on the run. What I'm looking for advice with is
1) Alignment
2) Rough class build (assume the betrayal happened around level 6 or 7, also note I prefer no more than a 10/5/5 split for 20 levels).
3) Any miscellaneous suggestions for this type of character

Ok, this is character is actually my personal version of Lancelot, based off of my theories of what was really happening (you know, what history won't say because it makes the winners look bad). Arthur came to Lancelot to ask for his aid and support, and Lancelot agreed after seeing how devoted and loyal Arthurs men were. The two became lovers after a little while. Then, Arthur needed to take a bride, and he chose Gwenevere because Lancelot approved of her, at which point their nightly sessions became three-ways. Eventually, after Lancelot and Gwen fell in love, Arthur found a new lover and gave them permission to continue their relationship, with the warning that if they were ever found out, Arthur would deny all knowledge of it, and they would be dealt with as adulterers. Years pass, and rumors start to spread about Arthur not enjoying the company of women. Arthur panics, and sets Lancelot and Gwen to get caught. Lancelot is exiled, Gwenevere is to be put to death, then Lancelot rescues her at the last moment and they run away together

Alignment:Lawful Evil


Build:Cleric 5 [Shadow and Magic Domain]/Ruby Knight Vindicator 10/Divine Disciple 5

Pick up hatred as your extra domain in divine disciple. Use the Spontaneous domain casting Alternate class feature for shadow domain, so that you can cast shadow spells spontaneously.
This is my favorite build for the cleric, and it works super well as a black knight kind of build.

Character wise, Play that lawful evil up well. A good way to play it is as a person who respects order and laws that promote goodness, but all in all is egocentric. They might not be into hurting innocent people or causing suffering for personal gain, but how do they FEEL about that old lady crossing the street. Especially when she's holding up traffic. Secretly wish she breaks a hip.

They might not steal, but they romanticize just taking what they want, or murder scenarios, or just any evil little thing. Because they know it's "bad", but the ideas come to them naturally.

Playing your knight on the brink of always breaking a chivalric code would be dope. Always wishing someone would, or simply bearing ill will. Tons of potential conflict, character development, etc.

[Aleolus]

Hmmm. A very interesting idea, though I don't know whether LE really fits the backstory I gave him. LN maybe, possibly NG, since he only went against his king to stop the woman he loved from being executed for something she had permission to do, but that's why I'm asking here, because I'm unsure, and am looking for ideas. So thank you for that one

[DMVerdandi]

Hmmm. A very interesting idea, though I don't know whether LE really fits the backstory I gave him. LN maybe, possibly NG, since he only went against his king to stop the woman he loved from being executed for something she had permission to do, but that's why I'm asking here, because I'm unsure, and am looking for ideas. So thank you for that one

Well, the build itself is actually doesn't require an alignment, so you can still use it to full effect.

I think the best way to think about alignments is this. The first alignment shows how they interact with society and it's STRUCTURE as a whole(On a practical and theoretical level). Lawfully, Chaotically, or neutrally.
The second is what they feel and what values they hold towards societies COMPONENTS (i.e. individuals) Altruistism(Good), malice(Evil), or neutrality

Now I would just say for more fun, don't let this system (3.5) limit your ability to create an interesting character based on alignments and class. They would WANT you to think that knights are all good and noble all the time and, for all intended purposes, all taking the paladin OR knight class[Crusader if you want to get fancy].

But really, what since does that really make? Why can't a knight be a duskblade, or a rogue?
Why does a knight always have to be in full-plate and on horseback (Really questions you should ask yourself)
Why can't he be a wizard and still be considered a knight?

Why must he be good, if for all intended purposes, his job entails killing tons of people for money, land, and title? Why does evil have to appear unattractive visibly corrupting? Why do evil people have to look like they are doing evil instead of constantly looking like they are doing the right thing?

Questions, you know... Personally, True Neutral is best alignment, but that's just me.

[John Longarrow]

For class builds, we'll go off of the standard 'Lancelot is the greatest with sword and lance' motif.

Lvl 1 Fighter
Lvl 2 Fighter
Lvl 3 Fighter

This gives us 5 feats in the first 3 levels to work out a good 'knight'.
I'd say weapon focus long sword, weapon focus lance, mounted combat, Ride By Attack, Spirited Charge.

At this point he's really good in melee/mounted.

Lvl 4 Fighter, bonus feat Dodge
Lvl 5 Warblade - Initiator level is 3 so we can grab 2nd level maneuvers to start. This lets you do extra damage and cut through DR.
Lvl 6 Warblade Feat Iron Will - required to take our next level in DragonSlayer (Immunity to Fear, fits with the concept really well)
Lvl 7 DragonSlayer

At this point you have a fearless expert who's exceptional with both sword and lance. While I'm not partial to mounted combatants this guy is all about shock cavalry tactics. He's also going to take people apart on foot.

For skills, I put warblade last so you can maximize the class skills. Not sure what the beginning stats are, so I can give a better work up.

Progressing from here if you take anything that improves BAB you'll qualify for Cavalier at 9th.
As your describing him being betrayed at 7th, 8th could be Barbarian (The rage class feature representing his rage brought upon by betrayal), Ranger (having to learn to fend for himself and his love), or Knight (With a code based on bringing justice to those who cannot protect themselves). It mostly depends on how you play the character from here out.

For the historic Lancelot Knight doesn't fit. He is a warrior in service to the crown, not a paragon of virtue.

[FocusWolf413]

Keep it simple. A standard Ruby Knight Vindicator build with a different deity or straight Crusader should work just fine. NG should work for you.

[Aleolus]

Thank you guys for the advice so far, its definitely giving me ideas! Though, I think you meant paladin wouldn't fit the historic lancelot (which I agree with), but Knights don't have to be paragons of virtue. They just have to be Lawful.

Also, DMV, I do agree with you, especially considering in the real world (doubly so nowadays) all a Knight is is someone who has been given a fancy title by the ruler of a nation (commonly England). Look at Sir Ian Mckellen (apologies if I misspelled that) or Dame Judy Dench. Both simple actors, but they've been knighted, which would mean (in D&D terms) they're Bard/Knights, which mechanically doesn't work but is a fun image

[Waazraath]

Did you consider the ronin prestige class? It fits thematically. A build like paladin 6 / ronin 10 / divine champion 4 could work (given your requests, pally 4 / fighter 2 / ronin 10 / divine champion 4 would be better - feats could be 1) two weapon fighting, B1) oversized two weapon fighting, 3) travel devotion 4B) extra turning 5F exotic weapon proficiency - bastard sword, 6) animal devotion 6F) improved two weapon fighting, 9) craven 11B) two weapon rend 12) staggering strike, etc.

ACF: spell less paladin (feats instead), replace immunity to fear with any ACF to allow the craven feat.

Gives: extra move as a swift action, ability to fly, debuff (staggering strike, poison bite), and lots of attacks with lots of damage (1d10 + craven + str increase + sneak attack).

Much less powerful then a RKV build, but fits the flavour I think, and decent enough in most campaigns.