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ghendrickson
2016-01-03, 07:02 PM
Hey playgrounders, I was looking at the lich template and seeing that they were immune to cold damage, I thought, wouldn't it be cool for liches to fly through space? My only real question is how much damage does pressure inflict in space? I can't find the ruling for it, and I was really curious. Any help would be very awesome. Thanks!

HeadAcheron
2016-01-03, 07:16 PM
Whatever the answer is, I'm sure it only applies to the living: people with lungs, blood pressure, eyeball fluids :smallbiggrin:

Gastronomie
2016-01-03, 07:20 PM
>PCs ravage through Lich's fortress (on earth)
>Lich states he can live in outer space, but the PCs can't
>"DESTROY THE PLANET!!!!"

Honestly, the idea is so awesome you should ignore all rulings (even if they actually exist) and just allow it.

J-H
2016-01-03, 07:22 PM
There's no pressure in space - it's the lack of pressure, and the temperature extremes & radiation (heat from the sun when exposed) that kill you.

I would put a maximum limit on how far a lich can travel in space from its phylactery before it loses the ability to reform... at which point you can treat it sort of like the NBSG Cylons with their resurrection ship.

OldTrees1
2016-01-03, 07:34 PM
Pressure(exerted inwards or outwards) has been done as bludgeoning, untyped, and even [new type] damage. This is in addition to the cold damage resulting from both temperature rules and when space was done as cold damage rather than pressure damage.

I believe Elder Evils and Stormwrack both had relevant rules however a DM ruling is probably a better way to go that choosing which RAW applies.

Quertus
2016-01-03, 10:25 PM
There's no pressure in space - it's the lack of pressure, and the temperature extremes & radiation (heat from the sun when exposed) that kill you.

I would put a maximum limit on how far a lich can travel in space from its phylactery before it loses the ability to reform... at which point you can treat it sort of like the NBSG Cylons with their resurrection ship.

Having come back when my phylactery was on another plane (I sure hope that was RAW legal), I'm hoping liches > necrons / cylons.

Liches are magically hardened bone. I imagine their DR is similar to rock's hardness, so, unless there is evidence that the moon is taking damage from being in space, I can't see liches having any trouble.

GentlemanVoodoo
2016-01-03, 11:55 PM
An interesting idea. But if you are needing a reference to how undead would be for outer space, I would suggest looking at white wolf's World of Darkness - Mirrors: Bleeding Edge. Though for the WOD system, there is good information as to how undead creatures would be in an cyberpunk or outer space themed game that can be translated to whatever system your running.

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-01-04, 06:20 AM
The pressure difference between outer space and sea level is about the same as the difference between sea level and 10 meters below the water. That's it. The main problem for humans would probably be gases and even fluids from our blood escaping through our lungs or some other "we didn't evolve for this crap" stuff. A creature made up of enchanted bones? Shouldn't have a problem. Even if theoretically for some reason the inside of his bones is pressurized without a way to let the pressure off the walls should hold just fine.

The cold is also not much of a problem. While space is really cold there isn't a good way to cool off in space, since there is no air to conduct heat to. The same reasons that make you cool off quicker in cold water or a cold wind than in cold still air make you cool off only really, really slowly in space. I don't know if liches produce any kind of magical body heat, probably not, but even without that they'll stay warm for a while, especially since...

Radiation is a problem. If you're in a part of space where you can see the sun you're going to be warming up. Without a good way to cool off, the temperature is going to rise quickly, and eventually get too high even for a skeleton to handle. Although admittedly that might take a while. A lich traveling through space is probably going to have to find a way to stay in the shadow for much of the time.

That might seem doable for say a trip to the moon, both solar and lunar eclipses are possible. But by far the easiest way to travel through space is to obtain an orbit. If you're in an orbit around earth you can speed up to widen that orbit, and eventually match the moons orbit. If your timing is right, you even end up in the moons orbit at the same point where the moon is at that moment. If you want to stay in the shadow you're going to have to fight your way straight up for most of the journey, which is a lot like just flying straight up back on earth. The moon is somewhat less than 50,000 times as far away from the surface as the top of mount Everest is (384,400 kilometers, according to google). This means Xykon wouldn't make it, because after 8 hours of flying he'd have to rest, and resting in non-orbital flight means falling straight back down. But if he's smart he could probably fashion some sort of reflective solar shield (and it will have to be pretty reflective, or the shield itself will heat up too much), and just hide behind it much of the time. That way he can use the orbital method of going up. It's a bit of a time waster, but in the end, yes, I do believe a lich could travel to the moon, or even beyond.

Mr. Mask
2016-01-04, 07:00 AM
Aww, I thought we were going to discuss undead space overlords in a scifi fantasy setting.

goto124
2016-01-04, 07:32 AM
But how does the lich get all the way to space-

Oh, right. Fly spell. So simple.

Douche
2016-01-04, 08:15 AM
That might seem doable for say a trip to the moon, both solar and lunar eclipses are possible. But by far the easiest way to travel through space is to obtain an orbit. If you're in an orbit around earth you can speed up to widen that orbit, and eventually match the moons orbit. If your timing is right, you even end up in the moons orbit at the same point where the moon is at that moment. If you want to stay in the shadow you're going to have to fight your way straight up for most of the journey, which is a lot like just flying straight up back on earth. The moon is somewhat less than 50,000 times as far away from the surface as the top of mount Everest is (384,400 kilometers, according to google). This means Xykon wouldn't make it, because after 8 hours of flying he'd have to rest, and resting in non-orbital flight means falling straight back down. But if he's smart he could probably fashion some sort of reflective solar shield (and it will have to be pretty reflective, or the shield itself will heat up too much), and just hide behind it much of the time. That way he can use the orbital method of going up. It's a bit of a time waster, but in the end, yes, I do believe a lich could travel to the moon, or even beyond.

This seems like a really informed and well-thought out theory. My question is, why not just teleport to the moon?

DigoDragon
2016-01-04, 08:15 AM
But how does the lich get all the way to space-
Oh, right. Fly spell. So simple.

Alternatively, a lich could teleport themselves into space. Nothing in the spell forbids you from going straight up. Just have to achieve an orbital speed when they get there.

Mastikator
2016-01-04, 08:32 AM
Radiation is a problem. If you're in a part of space where you can see the sun you're going to be warming up. Without a good way to cool off, the temperature is going to rise quickly, and eventually get too high even for a skeleton to handle. Although admittedly that might take a while. A lich traveling through space is probably going to have to find a way to stay in the shadow for much of the time.

That might seem doable for say a trip to the moon, both solar and lunar eclipses are possible. But by far the easiest way to travel through space is to obtain an orbit. If you're in an orbit around earth you can speed up to widen that orbit, and eventually match the moons orbit. If your timing is right, you even end up in the moons orbit at the same point where the moon is at that moment. If you want to stay in the shadow you're going to have to fight your way straight up for most of the journey, which is a lot like just flying straight up back on earth. The moon is somewhat less than 50,000 times as far away from the surface as the top of mount Everest is (384,400 kilometers, according to google). This means Xykon wouldn't make it, because after 8 hours of flying he'd have to rest, and resting in non-orbital flight means falling straight back down. But if he's smart he could probably fashion some sort of reflective solar shield (and it will have to be pretty reflective, or the shield itself will heat up too much), and just hide behind it much of the time. That way he can use the orbital method of going up. It's a bit of a time waster, but in the end, yes, I do believe a lich could travel to the moon, or even beyond.

The bright side of the moon is ~116 celcius, that's pretty much what a lich would expect to deal with in terms of radiation and heat. Is a lich damaged by being submerged in boiling water? I seriously don't know the answer to that.

The overland flight spell can take you 102km in 8 hours, Xykon could cast that like... 6(?) times without resting. So about 600km, which is 200km above the ISS.

That is assuming a fly spell works by spacial translation rather than acceleration. D&D bad physics aside I'm gonna assume that it works by anti-gravity plus acceleration and the max speed is because of air drag.

Overland flight lets you travel 40 feet in 1 round, or ~2m/s. Lets assume you get to keep a constant acceleration of 2m/s^2 for 8 hours, you'd only need 1800 seconds (30min) to reach a velocity of 12km/s, which is beyond escape velocity. So a single overland flight could let Xykon reach the moon. Though he'd have no way of knowing his speed and would almost certainly miss. Just teleporting to the moon would be a lot simpler. Greater Teleport has no speed limit and seems to cancel out relative velocity. (Otherwise you'd be flung to the side at break neck speed if you'd teleport to another part of a rotating sphere)

Reathin
2016-01-04, 08:41 AM
Vampire the Requiem actually covered this at one point (alongside one of my favorite developer commentaries: "What the hell kind of chronicle are you running, anyway?!"). The essence of it is that the vampires wouldn't be done in by the passive problems of space. They'd take some damage as their bodies collapsed, but because they don't actually need their organs working at all, much less in the highly precise manner the living need to, once the preasure adjusts, they're fine until they see sunlight.

Liches have even less to worry about. They have no inner pressure to re balance, no organs that are required at all, no tissue whatsoever for radiation to corrupt (and no natural growth in their bones either). So frankly, a lich would probably be perfectly fine in space barring something like falling into a star, black hole or meteor or whatnot.

Roentgen
2016-01-04, 08:52 AM
Similarly how far below sea level could a Lich go before he gets crushed? If even? I'm 8k XP from becoming a Lich in my campaign and I've got a good idea for where to store my phylactery.

goto124
2016-01-04, 08:58 AM
I shall imagine the GM flipping the entire game table, with all the character sheets and minis and maps flying into the air...

enderlord99
2016-01-04, 09:03 AM
Where's Aotr's? He should know a lot about space-liches.

...

I meant because he's smart, not just because he is a space-lich, though that is also a factor. Plants might not always know stuff about botany, but when they do, they really do.

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-01-04, 09:05 AM
But how does the lich get all the way to space-

Oh, right. Fly spell. So simple.


This seems like a really informed and well-thought out theory. My question is, why not just teleport to the moon?

Oh, right, I was indeed thinking of flight magic, but D&D had better things than that.


The overland flight spell can take you 102km in 8 hours, Xykon could cast that like... 6(?) times without resting. So about 600km, which is 200km above the ISS.

I was going by the comic where he complained he could only craft items for 8 hours a day, but flying probably works differently from crafting, due to being a "short time" activity.


That is assuming a fly spell works by spacial translation rather than acceleration. D&D bad physics aside I'm gonna assume that it works by anti-gravity plus acceleration and the max speed is because of air drag.

Overland flight lets you travel 40 feet in 1 round, or ~2m/s. Lets assume you get to keep a constant acceleration of 2m/s^2 for 8 hours, you'd only need 1800 seconds (30min) to reach a velocity of 12km/s, which is beyond escape velocity. So a single overland flight could let Xykon reach the moon. Though he'd have no way of knowing his speed and would almost certainly miss. Just teleporting to the moon would be a lot simpler. Greater Teleport has no speed limit and seems to cancel out relative velocity. (Otherwise you'd be flung to the side at break neck speed if you'd teleport to another part of a rotating sphere)

It's even better/worse than that. You have to spend at least part of your first turn speeding up, so the top speed you reach while traveling 40 feet in that six second round is up to two times higher than the average speed. The distance to the moon only looked large because I'm stuck in an environment with air.

So your method works (assuming flight spells do indeed work by acceleration rather than some magical speed limit). Gravity might slow down his acceleration while going straight up, but it's converted into height gained, which has exactly the same effect as far as escaping earths gravity is concerned.


The bright side of the moon is ~116 celcius, that's pretty much what a lich would expect to deal with in terms of radiation and heat. Is a lich damaged by being submerged in boiling water? I seriously don't know the answer to that.

I didn't think about it like that, but that's a really clever way of getting an estimate for how hot things get in space. Normal bone would probably wear from being exposed to conditions like that, but magically hardened material, especially with a protection from whatever spell on top (which I forgot to account for)? The lich is safe after all.

So, correction, a lich couldn't just travel to the moon, it'd only be a trivial and temporary challenge.

Man, I hope there are no d&d based planets anywhere near here. Or maybe liches are secretly vulnerable to hard radiation or something, gives them bone cancer.

DigoDragon
2016-01-04, 10:21 AM
they're fine until they see sunlight.

Which is going to suck extra hard for the vampire since it's now unfiltered sunlight. :smallbiggrin:



So frankly, a lich would probably be perfectly fine in space barring something like falling into a star, black hole or meteor or whatnot.

Other liches. :smalltongue:


Depending on the setting, could also be hindered by Spelljamming ships.

Joe the Rat
2016-01-04, 11:51 AM
The overland flight spell can take you 102km in 8 hours, Xykon could cast that like... 6(?) times without resting. So about 600km, which is 200km above the ISS. He'd also need the Silent Spell feat, or a helmet full of air. In space, no one can hear your verbal spell components.

GrayDeath
2016-01-04, 12:10 PM
Any Lich worth its weight in Gold has that feat anyway. ;)

And just let me say: love the direction of the thread so far. :)

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-01-04, 12:32 PM
He'd also need the Silent Spell feat, or a helmet full of air. In space, no one can hear your verbal spell components.

If a tree falls in a forest and nobody hears it, does it still make a sound? And if a lich yells in space and it doesn't make a sound, does it still count as a verbal spell component?

DigoDragon
2016-01-04, 01:04 PM
And if a lich yells in space and it doesn't make a sound, does it still count as a verbal spell component?

I do not believe it does. There needs to be sound.

From the online SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#components):
Verbal (V)-
A verbal component is a spoken incantation. To provide a verbal component, you must be able to speak in a strong voice. A silence spell or a gag spoils the incantation (and thus the spell). A spellcaster who has been deafened has a 20% chance to spoil any spell with a verbal component that he or she tries to cast.

And this spell:

Silence
Upon the casting of this spell, complete silence prevails in the affected area. All sound is stopped: Conversation is impossible, spells with verbal components cannot be cast, and no noise whatsoever issues from, enters, or passes through the area. The spell can be cast on a point in space, but the effect is stationary unless cast on a mobile object. The spell can be centered on a creature, and the effect then radiates from the creature and moves as it moves. An unwilling creature can attempt a Will save to negate the spell and can use spell resistance, if any. Items in a creature’s possession or magic items that emit sound receive the benefits of saves and spell resistance, but unattended objects and points in space do not. This spell provides a defense against sonic or language-based attacks.


I've always interpreted this to mean all spells with a Verbal component needs to be [I]audible to work. Silence (from any source) would logically block such spells. Hence, the Silent Spell metamagic feat is useful to get around it.

ExLibrisMortis
2016-01-04, 01:39 PM
Sounds like you need a psionic lich! No verbal components (or, indeed, any kind of components), and none of that spellbook nonsense.

J-H
2016-01-04, 04:02 PM
Man, I hope there are no d&d based planets anywhere near here. Or maybe liches are secretly vulnerable to hard radiation or something, gives them bone cancer.





Other liches. :smalltongue:



What else does the sun burn?

MORE LICHES!

rooster707
2016-01-04, 06:47 PM
What else does the sun burn?

MORE LICHES!

Now, why do you think he is a lich?

YossarianLives
2016-01-04, 07:26 PM
I've been to space in D&D before. Shenanigans and a Monty Haul DM were involved.

Full story here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?393417-We-are-Invincible-please-help-save-my-DMs-sanity!).

illyahr
2016-01-04, 08:06 PM
Now, why do you think he is a lich?

Well, he looks like one.

Âmesang
2016-01-04, 10:00 PM
I've honestly been fascinated with direct space travel after passing up an amulet of natural armor for a necklace of adaptation, albeit for a living character, obviously; I figured most of the other dangers could be mitigated via endure elements and protection from energy (cold/fire). Radiation could possibly be dealt with using neutralize poison (or antitoxin in a pinch) if you treat it as a poison, or if you treat it as a disease, well… the character's got some fair hit points and a decent Fortitude save. :smalltongue:

The epic spell, nailed to the sky, lists vacuum as inflicting 1d4 damage per round (and suffocation), which may not seem like much… but the keep in mind your average person is a 1st-level commoner with 2 hp, and your average combatant a 1st-level warrior with 5 hp. I'd peg astronauts closer towards warriors due to their extensive training, or at least experts. So, let's say a 5 hp astronaut finds himself in the vacuum of space and takes, say, 3 hp damage. Ouch. Six seconds later he takes another 3; now he's at –1, unconscious, and (internally?) bleeding to death.

1d4 may not be much for your typical D&D character, but for us lowly humans I'd say it still makes it fairly easy to die in vacuum in less than a minute. :smalleek:

(Especially when high-level characters could reasonably survive being exploded with dynamite or being submerged in lava; I fail to see why they should still be held to our standards of, um… dying?)

DigoDragon
2016-01-04, 10:52 PM
I'd peg astronauts closer towards warriors due to their extensive training, or at least experts.

I'd say experts, though in the early space program days, your typical astronaut was a military test pilot who faced danger the way most of us face a cup of coffee in the morning. :smallbiggrin: Maybe they multi-class?

Âmesang
2016-01-05, 05:56 AM
Except for Richard Garriott. He's an aristocrat, being "Lord British" and all. :smallcool:

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-01-05, 06:26 AM
If any job in the world requires a PC class, it's astronauts. As much as I like to make fun of say Buzz Aldrin, you need to be a serious bookworm badass to even get into the program.

Which class they have, no idea.

Mastikator
2016-01-05, 06:53 AM
He'd also need the Silent Spell feat, or a helmet full of air. In space, no one can hear your verbal spell components.

An airtight glass bowl on his head would deal with that. Or potentially some sort of space suit. A lich with Greater Teleport could go anywhere since the maximum distance is unlimited, a lich could go to another star system, or another galaxy. Or inside the event horizon of a black hole and then out again. Or beyond the horizon of the universe.

Madbox
2016-01-05, 06:55 AM
The high INT requirement points to wizard, but the STR and CON points to Fighter. My money is on bard, to be honest. They have the fighter/wizard skillset, plus that CHA score has to be up there to resist the urge to panic about sitting on top of a gigantic bomb. The engineers designing the rocket are clearly gnome wizards, though :smalltongue:

DigoDragon
2016-01-05, 07:03 AM
plus that CHA score has to be up there to resist the urge to panic about sitting on top of a gigantic bomb.

Definitely you gotta have nerves of steel for that kind of job. :smallbiggrin:

Gotta be calm when something goes wrong, like your rocket gets struck by lightning, you're almost out of fuel before landing, you hit a space lich on the way to your destination...

J-H
2016-01-05, 08:43 AM
When you drop a lich off of a cliff, the lich floats. That's how you know it's a lich. Then you burn it.

King of Casuals
2016-01-05, 11:14 AM
I shall imagine the GM flipping the entire game table, with all the character sheets and minis and maps flying into the air...

I am the GM of this game and I'm down with this. He actually had a pretty good idea to get to the moon: He casts 2 plane shift spells, one to travel to another plane, and another to teleport to a point on the moon (theres a 5-500 mile margin for error, but when youre aiming for a moon you really cant miss, and even then he can use teleport to go to a specific location, like his moonbase). The only problem I can actually think of for a lich being in space (assuming that he's completely skeletal and has no flesh or blood to depressurize) is that no air means no sound, and no sound means no casting without using metamagic or a staff of some kind

Joe the Rat
2016-01-05, 12:48 PM
An airtight glass bowl on his head would deal with that. Or potentially some sort of space suit.

My mental image is Xykon with a fishbowl over his head, sealed with wax.
And the crown on top of the fishbowl.

illyahr
2016-01-05, 01:20 PM
When you drop a lich off of a cliff, the lich floats. That's how you know it's a lich. Then you burn it.

So can anyone tell me what else floats in midair? We can determine a weight test for finding lich's.

Joe the Rat
2016-01-05, 01:24 PM
So can anyone tell me what else floats in midair? We can determine a weight test for finding lich's.

Lead? Very Small Rocks?

Murk
2016-01-05, 03:16 PM
So can anyone tell me what else floats in midair? We can determine a weight test for finding lich's.

A DUCK.






That's how we do it around here, right? We quote?

ExLibrisMortis
2016-01-05, 05:17 PM
If any job in the world requires a PC class, it's astronauts. As much as I like to make fun of say Buzz Aldrin, you need to be a serious bookworm badass to even get into the program.

Which class they have, no idea.
I think Expert is fine, really. Most of the bonuses are going to be from using a 12/12/14/16/14/14 array or similar, and then 10 skill points on top of that (6 expert, 1 human, 3 int) will do the rest.

If astronauts are Experts, I'd put (specialist) surgeons in there, too. Operating by hand is a seriously stressful job, that requires the ability to concentrate for hours, make extremely precise movements, recalibrate a ten-hour surgery on the fly (people are different, for some reason), and you need a ton of medical and technical knowledge.

illyahr
2016-01-05, 05:47 PM
A DUCK.

The amusing thing being that, since lich's have lost most of their skin and organs, they probably do weigh the same as a duck. :smallbiggrin:

Âmesang
2016-01-06, 12:06 AM
The only problem I can actually think of for a lich being in space (assuming that he's completely skeletal and has no flesh or blood to depressurize) is that no air means no sound, and no sound means no casting without using metamagic or a staff of some kind
You could just give him a necklace of adaptation anyway, no? Sure, the lich doesn't need to breath, but being that it sheaths him in a shell of air it would theoretically give him substance for sound to travel through… theoretically…

Endarire
2016-01-06, 12:22 AM
Lichdom: How to survive radiation and space exposure in D&D since people thought it was a good idea.

John Longarrow
2016-01-06, 12:55 AM
For how deep underwater a lich can go, I'd say all the way down. Pressure wouldn't affect his bones due to their construction. They would equalize very quickly. The real problem going deep only affect beings that have a circulatory system. Unless you have nitrogen in your blood system you don't need to worry about how deep you go or how quickly you go down/up.

For humans the biggest issue is if the water pressure exceeds the pressure in their tanks. Then things get really nasty. Otherwise since we are mostly water we equalize.

Now in theory you could have some place so deep it could be an issue, but since bones at the deepest part of the ocean are not crushed I don't think the Lich has much to worry about.

As to space, Since his bones are white I can see the lich reflecting most of the ambient light much the same way the surface of the moon does. Won't really get all that warm, at least compared to something a lot darker. For the fishbowl to work though, you'd have to make sure you keep it warm enough that the atmosphere inside doesn't eventually liquify. That could cause some very weird issues, including having the bowl crack/shatter as it boils when exposed to the sun.

Mutazoia
2016-01-06, 01:31 AM
For an answer to this and may other "[D&D thing] in space" questions, please refer to the Spelljammer setting.

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-01-06, 05:31 AM
I think Expert is fine, really. Most of the bonuses are going to be from using a 12/12/14/16/14/14 array or similar, and then 10 skill points on top of that (6 expert, 1 human, 3 int) will do the rest.

If astronauts are Experts, I'd put (specialist) surgeons in there, too. Operating by hand is a seriously stressful job, that requires the ability to concentrate for hours, make extremely precise movements, recalibrate a ten-hour surgery on the fly (people are different, for some reason), and you need a ton of medical and technical knowledge.

O yeah, surgeons are definitely experts, as are world famous physicists and most other non-combat professions. At least in the western world most people can probably be modeled best as an expert. (The pope might be an adept. His spell list includes guidance, command and cause fear, so he's probably fourth level with at least a +2 wisdom modifier.) My idea was mostly that astronauts are highly intelligent and skilled specialists, but also have to battle huge G-forces, be in space without constantly vomiting, wear the effects of weightlessness etc. The kind of activities you'd prefer to send a warrior with a camera to do. You can make a badass expert with a good array and the right feats, sure, but they're still people who are among the best in two separate fields, like military surgeons who can operate while returning fire, or world famous bodybuilders turned world famous actors turned world famous politicians. I think Arnold Schwarzenegger may be a bard. Probably a fifth edition build, he seems to be able to substitute strength for charisma on many of his checks.

Also, is there a class with the ability to steer threads way off topic? I think I know someone with a level in that class. :smallcool:

goto124
2016-01-06, 08:08 AM
I figured the space lich somehow decided to take along a few living companions.

Or, more likely, the heroic party is chasing the lich into space.

(Meanwhile, there's a DM out there who's flipping tables upon hearing the party wants to pursue the BBEG to the very end...)

DigoDragon
2016-01-06, 08:09 AM
You could just give him a necklace of adaptation anyway, no? Sure, the lich doesn't need to breath, but being that it sheaths him in a shell of air it would theoretically give him substance for sound to travel through… theoretically…

There was one instance where a player in my group with that necklace ended up in a vacuum. I forget the exact circumstance on how it happened, but I ruled that the necklace would protect her from the vacuum effects and allow her to cast spells with verbal components. Though, anyone else in the vacuum outside the air bubble isn't going to hear it.

falloutimperial
2016-01-06, 02:30 PM
Lichjammer (http://falsemachine.blogspot.com/2015/06/spelljammer-was-good-elves-in-undead.html) seems pertinent.

root
2016-01-09, 01:30 AM
Another good question: would Invisibility protect you against space radiation ? If visible spectrum EM radiation passes through an invisible character without having any noticeable effect (else he wouldn't be invisible), why wouldn't it do the same for x rays and other forms of radiation?

Also now that I think about it, being a ghost or otherwise incorporeal would be great for space travel... Isn't there a 3.5 psionic prestige class that makes you incorporeal by default as a capstone?


Tldr: space is full of invisible liches.

Edit: I also remember coming across a Pathfinder module that dealt with space aliens and elvish austronauts. Think they used Bottle of Air to provide atmosphere inside their metal ship and cast spells to create food and water while using Sending to connect to mission control on land. But that's more of a traditional astronaut situation...

goto124
2016-01-09, 02:15 AM
High-tech-space version of detecting invisibility.

Inevitability
2016-01-09, 06:23 AM
Another good question: would Invisibility protect you against space radiation ? If visible spectrum EM radiation passes through an invisible character without having any noticeable effect (else he wouldn't be invisible), why wouldn't it do the same for x rays and other forms of radiation?

Also now that I think about it, being a ghost or otherwise incorporeal would be great for space travel... Isn't there a 3.5 psionic prestige class that makes you incorporeal by default as a capstone?


Tldr: space is full of invisible liches.

Edit: I also remember coming across a Pathfinder module that dealt with space aliens and elvish austronauts. Think they used Bottle of Air to provide atmosphere inside their metal ship and cast spells to create food and water while using Sending to connect to mission control on land. But that's more of a traditional astronaut situation...

Invisibility isn't as simple as 'block all the light', though. If that were the case, you wouldn't be able to see anything.

I see it more as a kind of illusion that creates an incredibly advanced image around you that, no matter from what angle you look at it, makes it seem like you aren't there. Light that reflects off you is altered to create the image, but you are in no way protected from it.

DigoDragon
2016-01-09, 08:48 AM
Another good question: would Invisibility protect you against space radiation ?

No. You see things because light bounces off objects and then reaches your eyes. Invisible things are just objects where no light is bouncing off (for example black holes and dark matter).

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-01-10, 02:27 AM
No. You see things because light bounces off objects and then reaches your eyes. Invisible things are just objects where no light is bouncing off (for example black holes and dark matter).

That's mostly true in space due to a lack of visible stuff behind it, but in our atmosphere something like a black hole which absorbs light but doesn't let it bounce back looks black.

Mastikator
2016-01-10, 07:38 AM
No. You see things because light bounces off objects and then reaches your eyes. Invisible things are just objects where no light is bouncing off (for example black holes and dark matter).

In D&D invisibility is not transparency. Invisible characters are not blind nor are they protected from light damage.

Invisibility is a glamer spell
"A glamer spell changes a subject’s sensory qualities, making it look, feel, taste, smell, or sound like something else, or even seem to disappear."

Invisibility does not change how you interact with light, but how others visually perceive you.

goto124
2016-01-10, 07:45 AM
What about a creature that sees in ultraviolet? A snake that sees in infrared? Tremorsense? Does invisibility work on those?

TheCountAlucard
2016-01-11, 09:03 AM
Depends on the game and edition, but no, invisibility generally doesn't work on tremorsense because tremorsense isn't sight.

Lord Torath
2016-01-11, 02:08 PM
I second the idea that Invisibility wouldn't protect you from cosmic radiation.
Depends on the game and edition, but no, invisibility generally doesn't work on tremorsense because tremorsense isn't sight.A Silence 15' radius spell centered on you should protect you from being detected by tremorsense, as the tremors are essentially the sound of your footsteps traveling through the ground.

sktarq
2016-01-11, 02:18 PM
As per both the D&D Spelljammer setting and the Pathfinder splat about the other planets in the Golarion Solar system Liches do just fine in the vacuum of space and even have the advantage over living foes. So RAW support Liches in space.

John Longarrow
2016-01-11, 08:25 PM
Liches are powerful spell casters. Remember, any sufficiently advanced magic is indistingishable from technology. That means most campaigns should have a NASA (Nosfaratu Advances Space Agency) working on reaching areas far enough away from the local primary so that Vampires can live without fear of the light.

Âmesang
2016-01-11, 09:57 PM
Suddenly I want to run a WORLD OF GREYHAWK® game where vampires invade Blackmoor. :smalltongue: 30 Days of Knight(s)?

Mutazoia
2016-01-12, 03:59 AM
Liches are powerful spell casters. Remember, any sufficiently advanced magic is indistingishable from technology. That means most campaigns should have a NASA (Nosfaratu Advances Space Agency) working on reaching areas far enough away from the local primary so that Vampires can live without fear of the light.

Great....now I have the mental image of the movie "Iron Skies", but with vampires instead of Nazis

sktarq
2016-01-12, 03:05 PM
Except where will your space vampires get blood (assuming some kind of burn rate or massive desire for it). Liches have no inputs and that is one of the keys for space adaptation ease. So more LASA than NASA