Help! Potential game-breaking spells

[gtwucla]

This is for a new game with a d20 system (it's safe to compare it to other 3.5e spells/rules). I have a tendency to be very heavy handed with the power level of spells (among other things), so I could really use some help identifying spells that are just too damn powerful. So exhibit A:

Stasis (wizard)
Level 3 Conjuration
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 round
Range: 30 ft.
Duration: 1 round/level
Saving Throw: None
This powerful spell stops or speeds up time within a 5-foot radius. Once cast you must designate whether time is slowed or sped up (you may not change it later). Objects or creatures within the affected area may move outside it, but do so at a speed consistent with the passage of time within the affected space. Time passes 1 minute slower/faster for each round Stasis lasts. In other words, slower time will result in events of the world outside passing more quickly, whereas faster time will result in events of the world outside passing more slowly.
Higher levels: If cast as a level 5 spell, time passes 1 hour slower/faster per caster level. If cast as a level 7 spell, time passes 1 day slower/faster per caster level. And if cast as a level 9 spell, time passes 1 year slower/faster per caster level. Note that crossing the affected plane of a higher level Stasis spell is extremely dangerous as once the plane is crossed the part of the creature or object crossing it becomes immediately affected.

I really like the idea of it, but I can immediately see the abuses and maybe actually there aren't anything but abuses for it. I don't know. I'm playing with time spells right now, something I wasn't going to do, but for certain reasons, here we are. Anyway, delete, edit, or keep, and why? Thanks.

[Zetapup]

I'd say the spell is broken pretty easily. The simplest way to do it is to cast it on your own square and choose to speed time up for you: bam, you have 10 rounds for every one round everyone else gets, and you can still easily interact with stuff outside the square ("Objects or creatures within the affected area may move outside it"), unlike time stop, a 9th level spell which lasts for... 1d4 + 1 rounds.

I really like the idea though, so I'm gonna throw out some potential ways to balance it.

"Time isn't something you can muck around with easily- for every round that passes faster or slower than normal for the target, they later have the opposite effect happen (sped up if you slowed the target down, slowed down if you sped them up). You can choose how many rounds you slow down/speed up a target, up to a limit of 1 minute."
The wording's a bit clunky, but I believe it works. Essentially, a caster has to make a decision of "If I speed myself up for this battle, I might become slowed down later. Is it worth it?" Not sure how much fun this mechanic would make the spell though.

Alternatively, you could add a cumulatively increasing will save/caster level check to affect things outside of the square (not sure how that'd work if you cast it on an enemy's square though). That way, you can't just spam walls of fire or something for 10 rounds.

Those two ideas are just me spitballing, not sure how well they'd work out in reality.

Additionally, what happens if you cast the spell on a five foot square that a large or larger creature is in? Say you cast it on one of the squares that a frost giant occupies. Do they take damage (mostly for the higher level versions)? Is there a reflex save to negate it?

[gtwucla]

That's a good point, thanks! I'm already really glad I posed the question. I was just thinking in terms of casting it on a target to basically get a rest or to temporarily stop a target from dying and so on, which I thought in of itself would appear to me to break the game as far as limiting characters to spell slots and uses per day (as you could make a night of rest pass at 8 rounds)- I didn't even think about sitting inside it and taking on the world around. Both fixes look really cool to me, especially the first one. An easy fix could also be to make the casting time longer, that way there's no possible way to use it on the battlefield, but I like thinking on the lines of your first suggestion (and it goes along with the tradeoff themes of other spells I've created- so that's great).

As far as casting it on a space that a creature passes through or a larger creature is partially in, I thought it would cause catastrophic damage if that time difference was enough (i'm thinking in terms of years here), so much so I wasn't sure it was worth even quantifying, but maybe that's not fair. Maybe instead of part of an object becoming affected only whole objects can be affected? I don't know. The thought of time passing faster for something say your hand, possibly causing arthritis/nail growth etc. (TNG anyone?) is a pretty cool possibility.

[Zetapup]

Glad I could help! Hopefully that works out for you- time magic is annoying to write spells for, since it has to be practical and cool enough to use, but not give too much of an action advantage.


As far as casting it on a space that a creature passes through or a larger creature is partially in, I thought it would cause catastrophic damage if that time difference was enough (i'm thinking in terms of years here), so much so I wasn't sure it was worth even quantifying, but maybe that's not fair. Maybe instead of part of an object becoming affected only whole objects can be affected? I don't know. The thought of time passing faster for something say your hand, possibly causing arthritis/nail growth etc. (TNG anyone?) is a pretty cool possibility.

I'd probably avoid an only whole objects being affected clause, since that could lead to some weird/illogical stuff happening, eg, "The aberration isn't affected by the spell at all, since one of its tentacles extends outside the five foot square. However, you managed to age a bunch of plants to death in the five foot square. Congrats!"

For damage, I'd probably look at lower level damage spells, so the 3rd level version of the spell wouldn't do any damage if the creature occupies multiple squares, the 5th level version might do 1d6 damage/caster level (the amount of damage most 3rd level spells do), with a fortitude save to halve the damage, the 7th level version might do 1d8 damage per caster level with a fortitude save to halve it (I'm not sure how much damage most 5th level spell do off the top of my head, but 1d8 per caster level sounds solid), and the 9th level might be a fort save or die due to sudden ageing (long lived races would probably skip this, but still age quite a bit and still take damage), and take 2d6 damage per caster level even if you succeed on the save.

The above damage is only if the creature occupies multiple spaces, including the one the spell is cast on. I suppose they might take the damage repeatedly if they don't move. I'm just trying to make a baseline damage amount so that the DM doesn't have to come up with something on the spot, and you're probably going to want to mess around with it a bit in various situations (eg, you might rule that an elemental doesn't take any damage from the effect, since they don't have a normal biology, whereas a human or something similar bisected by the spell would experience some serious side effects).

For arthritis and whatnot, that's pretty much going to have to be up to the DM to determine penalties, since you don't want to have a couple paragraphs describing the spell followed by 7 pages of possible effects which depend on what limbs are in the aging field. Have fun with whatever you decide happens to the partially aged creature!

[gtwucla]

Fortunately I have a mechanic for arthritis! I'm starting to think I should separate the two thoughts. I have some very powerful time spells, so what I'm in the process of doing is creating one or two lower level spells, so the idea of affecting other creatures in terms of damage and effects, I may separate into two different ideas, maybe target specific. I like the idea of needing to succeed Will saves to maintain your sense of reality. Also the trade off idea. I'll give it a good brainstorming. Thanks again for the feedback.

[Selion]

This is for a new game with a d20 system (it's safe to compare it to other 3.5e spells/rules). I have a tendency to be very heavy handed with the power level of spells (among other things), so I could really use some help identifying spells that are just too damn powerful. So exhibit A:

Stasis (wizard)
Level 3 Conjuration
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 round
Range: 30 ft.
Duration: 1 round/level
Saving Throw: None
This powerful spell stops or speeds up time within a 5-foot radius. Once cast you must designate whether time is slowed or sped up (you may not change it later). Objects or creatures within the affected area may move outside it, but do so at a speed consistent with the passage of time within the affected space. Time passes 1 minute slower/faster for each round Stasis lasts. In other words, slower time will result in events of the world outside passing more quickly, whereas faster time will result in events of the world outside passing more slowly.
Higher levels: If cast as a level 5 spell, time passes 1 hour slower/faster per caster level. If cast as a level 7 spell, time passes 1 day slower/faster per caster level. And if cast as a level 9 spell, time passes 1 year slower/faster per caster level. Note that crossing the affected plane of a higher level Stasis spell is extremely dangerous as once the plane is crossed the part of the creature or object crossing it becomes immediately affected.

I really like the idea of it, but I can immediately see the abuses and maybe actually there aren't anything but abuses for it. I don't know. I'm playing with time spells right now, something I wasn't going to do, but for certain reasons, here we are. Anyway, delete, edit, or keep, and why? Thanks.

It's nice, but it's basically a time stop with more versatility at level 3 without the time stop restrictions, i wouldn't grant the same effect with a wish, so it's broken like hell. The scaling as a level 5 and 9 spell is even worse: every other similar effect in the books states that you cannot rest/regain spells in that burrowed time, here it's not specified, so a level 10 wizard can spend a round in combat and BOOM: 8 hours of rest, 1 hours to study spells and 1 hours of free time to buff the entire party.
I suggest to home rule this way:
Option 1) the time field a 5 foot radius emanation centered on the caster. The casting time is 1 full round, so the time field begin working at the beginning of the next caster turn. The time field boundaries are semi-solid, they deflect projectiles and spells and can be crossed with a strenght check. If anyone enters in the time field while it is effective roll a d10 to represent in which round he crossed the barrier that turn. No scaling with levels.
Option 2) time field works with borrowed time: if i want a 1 round/1minute time field the casting time is 1 minute, if i want a 2 round/2 minutes time field the casting time is 2 minutes. The limit is 1 round/level and there is still no scaling with levels.

[DrMartin]

Do you have metamagic feats in this system of yours? because if you do, Sculpt Spell can break this spell even further (on a very basic abuse level, pick the "four cubes" option and all your party is suddenly accelerated).

I would insert a rule that you cannot affect what's outside of the stasis in any way, and that when the stasis ends, a dispel magic-like effect washes over everything in it, ending all spell casts while inside the stasis. So you still need time stop to pull off time stop shenanigans. You can allow it to be used for resting, but i would explicitly exclude recovering spell slot from the benefits of resting inside the stasis. So you can use it for utility, for crafting, to preserve a body or to speed up a chemical reaction, and probably for a thousand other things, but i think most of the adventurer's basic abuse is dealt with

[Melcar]

Just make sure all enemies has a heightened, widened, selective temporal repair on at all times... that might balance things out. And make the spell a level 9.

[gtwucla]

Yes I do have metamagic feats, but no sculpt spell. As a battlefield spell it seems it is frighteningly overpowered. If it was 3 rounds to cast however, that may make it implicitly impossible or at least difficult to cast as a battlefield control spell, or is that not enough? Also, I've said something to this effect:

Due to the barrier created from the breach in time, spellcasters are unable to replenish spells or recover power points.

The dispelling effects are a good idea as well. Something like this?
Once the duration of Stasis ends any active spell effects within the area of effect end, as if their duration is up. Permanent enchantments are unaffected.

[DrMartin]

I would add a sentence about the dispelling effect applying only to the spells cast during the stasis. Otherwise you get a YES! Dispel magic if used offensively.

The three rounds casting time encourages your players (or whoever has access to the spell, for the matter) to go heavy on guerrilla tactics and setting up ambushes. (Compare to an assassin death attack, who also requires three rounds of studying). I don't know how far this would go into balancing things, if you still let who is inside the stasis affect who is outside of it. If you say that what is inside the stasis cannot affect the outside world in any way, you still have a hyped-up sanctuary, ectoplasmic cocoon, and tons of other utility options all wrapped up in a single 3rd level spell - it's probably still overpowered, or at least flexible enough that everybody would want an eternal wand of it.

I am not fond of such things, but you could tie the casting to a hefty personal price. Something like casting the spell makes you instantly age 10% of your race's maximum age, or steal a page from Wish from 5th edition and saying that every time you cast the spell you have a 30-50% chance of losing your ability to cast this spell forever.

[gtwucla]

Cool, thanks. PS. I just realized where I posted this, I thought I did it in Homebrew. The Homebrew forum is the correct place for this, right?

[Surpriser]

Compare the Spell with Time Stop.
It is a 9th level spell (and one of the stronger ones, possibly broken in itself), allows for only 1d4+1 rounds and has a clause restricting you from affecting anything outside.

I think none of the proposed fixes will be even remotely adequate to bring this spell down to an acceptable level.
- No scaling: The original ratio (10 rounds each round) is broken already, so I will assume this fix to be in place anyway.
- Borrowed time: An equivalent slowdown at the end of the duration is pretty much moot, as after a few minutes of basically free personal time, no enemies or dangers will be left standing.
Increasing the casting time would help there, but probably interfere with your stated intent of using it for example to savea friend from bleeding out. Even so, nothing stops me from pulling 10 minutes worth of time to me before smashing the door and annihilating any opposition in the next room without giving them a chance to even react.
- Area decreases: Compare with Time Stop, which actually is personal only.
- Making it difficult to affect things outside the field: The problem with buffing remains. Also, I could simply split up enemy groups by having part of them inside the field instead of having to deal with all of them at once.

To make this spell workable, you need to find a way to completely disable action economy abuse.
One possibilty would be to restrict valid targets to objects (creating an effect similar to Gentle Repose/Unguent of Timelessness).
Another possibility would be to remove the speed-up effect completely and leave only the slowing effect. Still, the conversion rate is probably too high (compare with the spell Slow, which basically halves the subjects actions and speed). A mitigating factor could be that the caster is slowed down too (as the field is centered on the caster), but stuff like Sculpt Spell or Selective Spell could mess with that too.

EDIT:
I just saw the idea of ending spells cast within the field on exit.
Good idea, but still not enough.
Consider the following situation:
- I cast this, affecting me and my whole party. We move up to an enemy before they can react and I drop the spell just as my whole party unleashes hell. Basically a free repositioning effect.
- A fight goes poorly for us, so I set up an instant field hospital, i.e. a bubble of fast time where my friends and I can get multiple minutes worth of healing spells in a single (external) round.
- Instant spells effects. There is still nothing stopping me from exploding 100 fireballs per round in the middle of the enemies. If the field boundary stops projectiles or breaks area of effect for spells, I can move such that a single enemy is within the field at all times, and deal with them one at a time.

And these are just the things that came to mind as I was writing this. Interactions with specific other spells (wall of iron for instant castles?), feats (Quicken Spell?) or magic items (Phasing arrows?) could make this spell a nightmare in the hands of creative players.
Basically, anything allowing some creatures to take a lot more actions than others should be treated as broken because no matter how much you restrict it, someone WILL find a way to break it. If it were a 9th level or Epic spell, one could argue that this powerlevel is expected anyway, but certainly not for a 3rd level spell.

[Larrx]

Is this like the "lefty loosy, righty tighty" mnemonic that everybody but me seems to intuitively grasp? (rotational motion cannot be defined that way)

Likewise, "1 min faster" isn't a velocity, and the spell as written actually doesn't make any sense (as well as being horrible broken). 1 min faster than what? 1 min/round? +1 min/round(11 rounds/round)? +1 min/day? /4 years(a leap minute!)? 1 min/sec(600 rounds/round)? Simply +1 min (you get an extra minute, but after that minute time moves normally . . . like Time Stop)? There is a reason why time effects in printed material are phrased the way they are.

[gtwucla]

Wowza, yeah the wording of the spell is wrong. Also why I was not messing with time-based spells.

[Der_DWSage]

Yeah, I'd...never allow this to be used in combat, as that's far too abusable. For context, Celerity is a 4th level spell that only allows a single standard action, and that dazes you on the round after.

If you're wanting it used for out of combat things, slap a 1-minute casting time on there. If they waste ten rounds using this, I guess they merit getting 10 actions per round.

[gtwucla]

For the sake of completeness, here is what its ended up being:

Stasis (wizard)
Level 9 Conjuration
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 round
Range: 60 ft.
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: Will
This powerful spell stops time. On a failed save target creature immediately freezes in place. Once its body becomes completely immobile it can no longer be influenced by the outside world as if sheathed in an impenetrable membrane. Weapons cannot pierce it, fire cannot burn it, even stone cannot crush it. The target is held in Stasis until you release the target, the effect is dispelled, or a designated trigger is activated. You may set a trigger or amount of time, which frees the target when Stasis is cast.

[Melcar]

For the sake of completeness, here is what its ended up being:

Stasis (wizard)
Level 9 Conjuration
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 round
Range: 60 ft.
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: Will
This powerful spell stops time. On a failed save target creature immediately freezes in place. Once its body becomes completely immobile it can no longer be influenced by the outside world as if sheathed in an impenetrable membrane. Weapons cannot pierce it, fire cannot burn it, even stone cannot crush it. The target is held in Stasis until you release the target, the effect is dispelled, or a designated trigger is activated. You may set a trigger or amount of time, which frees the target when Stasis is cast.

May I suggest that you chose a sub school. The Durations is not "instantaneous", but "permanent (D)" And ad spell resistance.

By he way, how does this differ from Imprisonment? Why would I want to use this compared to that? Is it only the range?

[gtwucla]

May I suggest that you chose a sub school. The Durations is not "instantaneous", but "permanent (D)" And ad spell resistance.

By he way, how does this differ from Imprisonment? Why would I want to use this compared to that? Is it only the range?

There are little things (range being the biggest one, the other being certain things are immune to temporal effects) but the biggest reason is to simply finish the set. I have a series of time-based spells and this just completes it.

Speaking of sub-schools, I was going to label it (and others like it) a 'temporal effect' in the same way spells are labeled 'mind-affecting.'