[3.5] Ideas Wanted for General Purpose Melee Build w/o ToB

[ericgrau]

Whether it's for boredom or optimization, one of the biggest complaints with melee is a lack of options. I am looking more at the boredom side since I tend to avoid high optimization. What I want to make is a general purpose melee build that has the standard core/etc. tricks built in. So no specialty feats allowed, no ToB allowed (plus I don't personally like the style of ToB, sorry). I've noticed 3 things that fall into this category:

1. Special attacks. Trip, grapple, disarm, etc.
2. Breaking things. Usually a strength check or with an adamantine weapon.
3. Cheap magical trinkets. 1,000 random cheap magic utility items.

#1 is a little difficult without specialty feats. I do want to be able to trip well, but I don't want to give up more obscure options like disarm and overrun to do it. Sure they rarely come up, but the hope is that with a dozen such options I'll be more likely to hit such a situation and be ready for it. So optimizing for all of them instead of individual ones, these special attacks are based on size or effective size, and strength. Getting too large makes it hard to fit in a dungeon, so features like powerful build is handy, as is the ability to temporarily shrink myself for unusually tight spaces. Reach also helps avoid the attack of opportunity when featless, so I think I'll use a reach weapon as well. Beyond that a high strength and BAB is nice because it increases my bonus without making it harder to fit in the dungeon. Many attacks are nice because many attacks means many special attacks, plus special attacks often have bonuses to the roll or touch attacks that negate the penalties from having many attacks. So TWF or unarmed strikes or etc. is ok, since it helps with an overall goal. So I think I need something like permanent or swift action large size + powerful build + high str + high BAB + many attacks + the option to temporarily become medium size when needed. Potions of reduce person for example, if I'm humanoid, or else a psionic item of compression. Anything that eats an action is bad for combat, btw, so the expansion power alone is not enough, unless I can make it a swift with a high level psychic warrior build. Again, no improved trip/etc. specialty feat allowed.

#2 This is similar. High strength, high damage, adamantine weapon. Damage in general is also frequently useful on melee. Again limited optimization so no shocktrooper, but I might be tempted to take power attack purely for breaking items and walls. Likewise any cheap gear that breaks stuff is nice, but nothing so expensive or feat heavy that it forces me to overspecialize. The build must be general purpose.

#3 I can handle this one myself as I already tend to pick up 100 random trickets. Plus there are already guides out there for random cheap essential items. But while I can google them I do appreciate links to them for convenience. General ideas are nice too such as "use poison". Or taking care of major utility goals such as affordable flight items or invisibility detection is nice.

While I don't like specialty feats/items/etc. for this build, any feat/item/etc. that helps with all/most of #1 or all/most of #2 or both is fine. Or anything that helps with one specific thing but is very cheap and may be used simultaneously with other specific tactics is great too. So a guisarme is fine or maybe a spiked chain is less fine (since it takes a feat), since it can help with a few goals but it's cheap and doesn't really interfere with my other options.

So I'm open to build ideas for future reference. Should be viable from levels 5 to 15. Shouldn't overoptimize. No shocktrooper, no uncapped stacking, no loops, etc. If you're not sure what "overoptimize" is, you can always guess or give alternatives and I can adapt it to what I want myself. I don't have any current campaigns in mind since I'm playing 5e right now, but I think it would be fun to have ideas for the future to play an interesting mundane build. And while it's a "mundane" build, using magic to do mundane things is ok, just don't make it a gish who might do spells in place of attacks.

[ComaVision]

So you want a good melee build with options without using any of the resources that make a good melee build with options?

[ericgrau]

So you want a good melee build with options without using any of the resources that make a good melee build with options?
Resource, singular, just ToB. Unless you're counting shocktrooper too, but that has nothing to do with being general purpose. Plus ToB is just magic without magic, not really the style goal.

Using the other 94 splatbooks to do special attacks, or other special tricks you can come up with (as long as the build can do several), or buffing the tricks with spells is ok. Just not attacking with spells directly.

[Willie the Duck]

...and be sure to offer more variety than just hitting things, but no specialized feats or magic items. And should be viable from levels 5 to 15 (well past the point where unoptimized non-spellcasters lose viability), but one shouldn't overoptimize.

Seriously, what are you looking for? If you don't want anything specialized towards a specific action like trip or disarm, your best bet are size (Potions of enlarge), a high strength (Belts of Giant Strength), and a full BAB class.

[ComaVision]

Resource, singular, just ToB. Unless you're counting shocktrooper too, but that has nothing to do with being general purpose. Plus ToB is just magic without magic, not really the style goal.

It sounds like you want to exclude [Tactical] feats, like Shocktrooper, as well.

[ericgrau]

Seriously, what are you looking for? If you don't want anything specialized towards a specific action like trip or disarm, your best bet are size (Potions of enlarge), a high strength (Belts of Giant Strength), and a full BAB class.
Yeup that's the goal. And yeup size, str and full BAB are some of the common ways. Though something more permanent than potions, since potions eat actions. Can trip and disarm, but can also, bull rush, overrun, sunder, etc., etc. Can't be a focused tripper. If you want to find other special non-magical tricks besides special attacks that's cool too, as long as the build doesn't specialize on any one of them and has several options.


It sounds like you want to exclude [Tactical] feats, like Shocktrooper, as well.
Other tactical feats are fine as long as the build stays general purpose. Shocktrooper is out for optimization level reasons. And never in my entire life until just now have I ever seen anyone else mention the other tactical feats alongside shocktrooper. Especially not as if they were comparable alternatives to it. Shocktrooper is the obvious anomaly among them, the 1/3 of a feat that's better than entire feats or multiple feats. The other tactical feats are sad outcasts that barely even get mentioned.

[Willie the Duck]

Well, natural size change is a problem, as most ways to do that through class abilities (gish or psywarrior) cost bab. What about bear warrior? That gives massive str bonus, size bonus, natural attacks, and full bab. It makes the acquisition of magic items wonky, but doesn't require the acquisition of any particular ones. Feats are pretty open (you'll probably want extra rages, maybe extended ones, and of course every barbarian could use iron will). If you're not going shock trooper, what about lion totem? Without the jump attack/shock trooper cheese it is good but hardly tricked out.

[ericgrau]

Well, natural size change is a problem, as most ways to do that through class abilities (gish or psywarrior) cost bab. What about bear warrior? That gives massive str bonus, size bonus, natural attacks, and full bab. It makes the acquisition of magic items wonky, but doesn't require the acquisition of any particular ones. Feats are pretty open (you'll probably want extra rages, maybe extended ones, and of course every barbarian could use iron will). If you're not going shock trooper, what about lion totem? Without the jump attack/shock trooper cheese it is good but hardly tricked out.

Can the multiple attacks from natural attacks be used to trip, grapple, or etc? Bear warrior is pretty nice but it takes ECL 8 to come online and doesn't get large size until ECL 12. Plus it gives up weapon use which hurts reach and I presume it overrides powerful build too. I could use something else to boost size in the meantime. Losing the option to pick a race with powerful build might hurt. Not sure what to do about that. And lack of a reach weapon might lead to AoO's against special attacks since some foes are large too. Dunno what to do about that either. Are there magic items that boost the reach of natural weapons?

A little LA/RHD is ok, btw, but again assume I start most games around ECL 5.

A magic item that provides a size boost is fine. Being permanently large magically or racially large is fine too, as long as I can temporarily drop it to medium. I think some psionic tattoos of compression solves that, though the duration is a bit low unless augmented at higher cost.

[Essence_of_War]

Other tactical feats are fine as long as the build stays general purpose. Shocktrooper is out for optimization level reasons. And never in my entire life until just now have I ever seen anyone else mention the other tactical feats alongside shocktrooper. Especially not as if they were comparable alternatives to it. Shocktrooper is the obvious anomaly among them, the 1/3 of a feat that's better than entire feats or multiple feats. The other tactical feats are sad outcasts that barely even get mentioned.


You know that Shocktrooper has other options than "combine with leap attack, turn things to fine red mist", right?

If you want to be more interesting than "5ft step, full attack", or "Charge, pulp and splatter" the tactical feats are a pretty good options. I'd check out Shocktrooper AND Combat Brute. Between the two of them, that gives you a handful of extra options for charging, bullrushing, sundering, and tripping. Adding the knockdown and knockback feats lets you use them without even having to waste damage dealing opportunities! Just use power attack! You were going to do that anyway! There is no reason why knockdown and knockback can't both trigger off of the same attack.

Elusive Target can actually be pretty good also in the right kind of game. It gives you an extra option for free tripping, Negate Power Attack is niche but very powerful if your DM doesn't metagame around it, and Diverting Defense is just fun!

[ericgrau]

Combat brute, knockback, knockdown and elusive target seem nice. Nice style too. May need to prioritize a bit because of all the pre-req feats and to stay viable levels 5-15. Some pre-reqs are specialized which was technically not allowed but that's ok as long as I can still fit in a huge number of options overall without doing the same one over and over again. Nor being mediocre at those options, which is hard to do when taking two unrelated feats. That's why I was leaning more towards large size, powerful build, str, etc. since they're more generally useful. But I think Combat Brute, knockback and knockdown could be combined.

Shocktrooper is still out because heedless charge is too much optimization all by itself.

[Triskavanski]

I don't get it.

Actually.. This kinda sounds like my Dirty Fighter build with pathfinder. Sadly 3.5 doesn't have Martial flexibility which is needed to really make a multi-purpose dude like this.

The Pathfinder character used Dirty Fighting to be able to use flanking to get the no-AoO on all maneuvers when flanking. He did focus on the dirty trick maneuver as it was a very flexible one. Then he picked up Press against the wall and Gang-up to allow him to flank a lot more the less maneuverability he and others had due to wall.

[ericgrau]

Martial flexibility does sound perfect. Dirty fighting sounds great too. Not sure if I could get it allowed though, all depends who's running the game at the time. I'll keep them in mind in case I get the chance. If your dirty fighting build happens to be online and you have a link that'd be awesome, otherwise don't sweat it too much since my build is still up in the air.

[DeAnno]

I homebrewed something sort of like what he wants once. Strength, size, defensive options, movement and perception tricks (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?222962-The-Beast-Twice-the-Power-Half-the-Brainpower!-3-5-Base-Class-PEACH). I even included a feat to make yourself smaller when you wanted. It's harder to really get value out of Class Levels for that sort of thing in the game though.

I think your best bet for getting a lot of that sort of utility is your race. (Psionic or non) Thrikreen, Half-Ogre, or Goliath are your best choices there. The latter two give you size bonuses, Thrikreen gives you 4 arms and huge jump checks and some other random stuff. War Hulk is also one of the best places to go for a lot of combat maneuvers, since it gives you Strength. Half Ogre PounceBarb 1/Fighter 4/War Hulk 10/Filler 3 maybe? You can use the Fighter to pick up PA and Cleave to get into War Hulk, and they are useful feats anyway.

[Willie the Duck]

Bear warrior natural attacks sure could do trips and disarms, but you are right, it is very high level to reach (although you are also talking about powerful build, right? That's improved grapple and weapon damage, but no reach, right?).

What about a straight up human fighter/psychic warrior? The original conception I feel was that these guys were going to have so many feats that they could load up with improved trip and improved disarm and improved bull rush and and and...

or is that explicitly what you don't want?

[ericgrau]

What about a straight up human fighter/psychic warrior? The original conception I feel was that these guys were going to have so many feats that they could load up with improved trip and improved disarm and improved bull rush and and and...

or is that explicitly what you don't want?
That would be fine if it could give me ~10 options by level 5-6 but it can't.

DeAnno has the right idea. Those races and war hulk sound nice. I didn't think of anything like thrikeen but yes 4 arms for weapon attacks could be very nice too.

[MisterKaws]

We have a problem here: Generalizing and Being effective don't work well together in D&D unless you're a caster. Getting all of these options would make your damage pretty much redundant, and even your effectiveness in those abilities would be questionable.
The only real option, as others have mentioned, is stacking up size bonuses like a madman, but that also takes away tons of AC, turning you into a glass cannon, which is never effective when talking about melee beatsticks.

So lets recapitulate what you need:


Tons of size modifiers
Tons of AC bonuses from somewhere
Tons of HP
Tons of feats for all those Improved [insert special attack here]
Tons of ways to beat things to death


I'd suggest a shield bashing Goliath Dungeoncrasher Fighter for that:

1-Power attack
f1-Improved Shield Slam
f2-Dungeoncrasher
3-Imp. Bull Rush
f4-Knockback
6-Shield Charge
f6-Dungeoncrasher 2
f8-Combat expertise
9-Imp. Trip
f10-Shield Slam

You can use a Mechanus Gear with a Tooth of Savnok for the movement penalty, with the shield added in, that's a pretty nice bonus to AC, so that's solved. For HP, that's what your throat slot is for, use the Amulet of Health. About size, you have gold, and you should have friendly mages, use them.

So here are some highlights for this build:

Level 1: Slam people's heads to death with your spiked shield.
Level 3: Either repeat Lvl 1's strats, or throw people at walls, it works pretty well.
Level 4: Combine 1 and 3 whenever possible.
Level 6: Now you ALSO trip when charging with a shield.
Level 9: Yup, charge with a shield, trip them, get an extra attack in the process, then throw them at wall(potentially 2 checks for the extra attack?)
Level 10: Add dazing to level 9's strats.
Post level 10: Try to get some pouncing, grab Overpowering Attack ACF and proceed with the slamjam.

I think this is the best I can do within those restrictions.

[ComaVision]

@MisterKaws

That build would be improved by doing a two level dip in Wolf Totem + Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian for Improved Trip without Combat Expertise.

Also, the build seems pretty shield specialized

[MisterKaws]

@MisterKaws

That build would be improved by doing a two level dip in Wolf Totem + Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian for Improved Trip without Combat Expertise.

Also, the build seems pretty shield specialized

Yes, it is a specialized build with generalized options, as that's the only way around it. You can't just cast a spell and get tons of options from that only spell like a caster, so you have to be creative.

[DeAnno]

Dungeoncrasher is a good idea. I still think it works better on a Half Ogre going into War Hulk for these purposes but it is good, especially since Strength multiplies so much. This is the sort of build that lends itself a bit to Shock Trooper but we can ignore it if we want.

Half Ogre 2/Dungeoncrasher Fighter 6/War Hulk 10/Barb 2 (Insert lots of ACFs here)

Early Feats:
1) Improved Bull Rush
1F) Power Attack
3) Knockback
4F) Cleave
6) Shock Trooper Improved Sunder
9) Combat Brute

For the Barb you might take Lionpounce, Whirling Frenzy, Wolf Totem for Improved Trip. Technically you might be able to get all three but you also might not depending on DM. If you can get 2-3 of the ACFs you may want to move up the 2 Barb levels at the expense of War Hulk.

Combat Brute is actually pretty good, especially for the type of character you want, it just gets ignored at high optimization because it is a bit slow. If your enemies live more than one round however it can be pretty ok and is a breath of fresh air. Improved Sunder is also nicer than it gets credit for, especially with Combat Brute, because the most dangerous foe is usually something with class levels and they tend to use gear a lot, so it performs better for your harder fights.

The main show here is obviously the synergy of Dungeoncrasher 6 + War Hulk + Half Ogre Strength though, you'll probably have a Strength of 50 or so towards the end and a +20 bonus is really nice for that sort of thing.

Edit: You could work the shield tricks from the other post in pretty easily if you get the Barbarian Wolf Totem ACF early, maybe letting Combat Brute and Improved Sunder slide until later. This is the type of guy who dumps Int pretty far so you are not gonna be taking Combat Expertise naturally.

[ericgrau]

Yes, it is a specialized build with generalized options, as that's the only way around it. You can't just cast a spell and get tons of options from that only spell like a caster, so you have to be creative.
I realize this is a difficult goal but I appreciate all the ideas thus far as I can pick and choose from among them. Also since I'm slicing off the upper optimization levels (i.e., I don't want to outshine others who don't optimize so much), that may help ideas that are weaker from being too spread out or aren't part of high op builds or etc.

[MisterKaws]

I realize this is a difficult goal but I appreciate all the ideas thus far as I can pick and choose from among them. Also since I'm slicing off the upper optimization levels (i.e., I don't want to outshine others who don't optimize so much), that may help ideas that are weaker from being too spread out.

Having a focus on ten or more of the special attack options wouldn't be to the point of being normal, it would just be plain useless unless you get to a point where you outsize the Tarrasque, then you can just use your size to do anything, but that's only really possible for a Wu-Jen JPM, so you'll have to make do with three of four options, otherwise you'll be plainly useless.

[ericgrau]

@^ Large size + powerful build + reach + a big strength is plenty for lower op. That's already a +8 + strength, and I avoid the AoO. Most things I can special attack w/o a +4 feat. The other ideas are gravy. The tarrasque I can poke with pointy metal until he's damaged enough (and I think I've checked this before even on a low op build).

[Rakoa]

I recommend Warblade or Crusader, from ToB.

[ericgrau]

Does anyone know a good LA 1 template for large size that would apply to the goliath race (monstrous humanoid type) or half-giant (giant type)? Besides half-minotaur, that's too good. And nothing from dragon magazine either. Plus Forgotten Realms content seems too setting specific to get allowed by the DM often.

[DeAnno]

If you want to be Large at a reasonable price without cheesy-sounding sources its basically Half Ogre or bust, sorry.

Edit: If you wanted to sink a bunch of HD into it you could be a Werebear or something.

Edit 2: Dire Jackals from Sandstorm are large, so you could be a Goliath Werejackal for the low low price of 3 LA and 4 HD.

[ericgrau]

And then no powerful build. Hmm, I might have to resort to half giant or goliath psychic warrior 7-8 at the expense of 2 BAB if I don't want to be too high op. I think there's a reach power somewhere too that works by level 4.
Or maybe I could use warshaper 1-3 with bear warrior or another form of shapechanging to effectively get powerful build.

EDIT: I'll look into goliath werejackal (weredirejackal?) if only because it sounds so silly. That is a lot of LA & HD but I'll have to look at the stats.

[DeAnno]

Lycanthrope Dire Jackal gives +10 Str +4 Con +4 Dex +2 Wis, +4 NA and Large Size in hybrid form, in addition to the Goliath stats (+14 Str, +6 Con, +2 Dex, +2 Wis total). Also if you want you can turn into a big Jackal, I guess. They can track things by scent!

You could take Fighter 2 after for the BaB and then go right into War Hulk.

[ericgrau]

Lycanthrope only applies to humanoid or giant but I can just apply it to half-giant instead. So that's 3 BAB and +12 str at ECL 7 (plus size stuff, other stats, etc.). That's not too shabby. Maybe I'll pick up a deepcrystal weapon to blow my otherwise unused power points on.

Any other ways at ECL 4-6ish, in case of lower starting level? Is there something similar to a savage species progression that I can do for weredirejackal ("werejackal lord"?)?

Also if I do this I'll have to make an entire secret society of werejackals whom are out to get me in my backstory.

[DeAnno]

I can't think of any Large predators/omnivores with 3 HD or less offhand to make it cheaper. You could kind of mess with the savage progression for Werewolf Lord maybe, but none exists for this thing.

[Eladrinblade]

Just noticed this thread. A few weeks ago, I messed around with an "ultimate core fighter" build. This is the best I can do, but when I made him, I was under the assumption that brilliant energy bypassed natural armor for some reason (doesn't even make sense, so dunno what I was thinking), and after that, I kinda moved his weapon enhancements around but didn't do much beyond that. So, his weapon enhancements could maybe be optimized a bit more, but anyway here he is: Tordek Sunderstone (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=666431).

The first thing to say about him is he bought staves for his CL 20 cleric and wizard buddies to use on him (Enlarge Person/Greater Invisibility/Magic Vestment/Greater Magic Weapon) The latter two give +5 and last all day. When hasted (from his boots or from an ally), his speed is 50ft, which ought to be enough for battlefield mobility.

At lower levels, he would have had full-plate and a darkwood tower shield for the massive AC, but at around 10th when he took his two levels of monk, he would have switched to a mithril breastplate and eventually the animated shield. He gets evasion from his monk levels while wearing the mithril breastplate.

With enlarge person, he has a nice 30 str and a size bonus to things. He str checks are his strength (+10 if enlarged), +4 from size (if enlarged), +1 from the stone of good luck, +1 from the pale green prism ioun stone, +2 from his bracers of might (armbands of might, from complete adventurer; his only non-core item), for +18 (+22 on grapples/bull-rushes/overruns/trips/disarms). With a potion of rage it's +19, and with a potion of good hope as well, it's +21.

He has two main spiked chains, and a third unenchanted cold iron one. His first is just +1 magical beast bane (biggest category of monsters in the MM, plus many of them are big and therefor hard to deal with, it also lets him bypass the tarrasque's epic DR when somebody casts greater magical weapon on it). The other is +1 brilliant energy, for when he's fighting other npc's, mainly. It's not good for disarming, obviously. He has other non-enchanted weapons for if the situation calls for something different.

Why have whirlwind attack? When enlarged, he can target 72 squares with a spiked chain, while ignoring cover/concealment from Improved Precise Shot. With brilliant energy (or not, really), he can make one good power attack against a massive number of enemies.

Why have improved overrun? Overrun is often overlooked (no pun intended); it can get you past an enemy in combat, and possibly trip them to boot. People say that improved overrun is bad because it doesn't give the enemy the option to avoid you...but doesn't that mean you could choose to let them avoid you if you wanted? I figure most DM's would rule for that. Regardless, if you don't like it, it's just one feat, you can pick another (I would go with far shot or Improved Sunder [remember, sundered magic weapons/armor can be repaired at 1/2 the usual crafting costs, which is 1/4 the market price). It's not so useful once he gets good at tripping with a spiked chain, but eh.

With quick draw, he can open a fight with a net toss, or use remaining attacks with thrown weapons against enemies beyond melee range. That's mainly what the dwarven thrower is for, but since it's adamantine and bludgeoning, it's also his main object breaker. With bolas and whips, he can even do some battlefield control from a distance (30ft reach with a whip when enlarged).

Improved precise shot also works with reach weapons, so it's good for melee on it's own, but he's also a decent archer (just has crappy spot).

When grappling (or if he just needs to do a lot of damage with non two-handed-power-attack attacks; that's also what his circlet of blasting is for [especially against undead]), his armor spikes and gauntlet are spell-storing with inflict serious wounds (3d8+15 each).
He has a pretty high grapple (+36), but when enlarged it's +41, +44 with a couple potions (which is high enough to grapple just about anything, especially since he can only grapple huge or smaller opponents). He has freedom of movement on a ring, so he's not in danger of getting grappled himself, and if an enemy has it, he can ready or delay a grapple and wait for his wizard buddy to dispel. If it's on a ring like his, he waits for the dispel, then grapples, pins, and disarms the ring. His armor spikes have the wounding enhancement, so his grapple checks always do 1d6+10+1 con (1d8+11 if enlarged), which can deplete an enemy's hp pretty quickly if they had a ton to begin with.
At early levels, when facing enemies that would otherwise be difficult due to grappling (like bears or behirs), he can pump his AC with combat expertise (on top of +x full-plate and +x tower shield), have a caster put grease on him (+10 vs grapples), or just use protection from evil if it's a summoned monster.

His saves are pretty good; the monk levels gave him +3 to each, +5 from cloak of resistance, +2 vs spells from dwarf, +1 from luckstone, +1 from ioun stone.

He makes use of every combat style in the PHB except mounted combat and feinting. His starting base scores were 15, 14, 12, 13, 10, 8.

Anyway, this is just about the best fighter I can make in core. I mainly went with the monk levels to nab 3 free feats instead of just one from the last two levels of fighter, but it came with some other nice bonuses as well, at the cost of +1 bab and possibly up to 4 hp.

[Darrin]

I can't think of any Large predators/omnivores with 3 HD or less offhand to make it cheaper.

Anthropomorphic Baleen Whale is 3 RHD with LA +0. Everything else that's naturally large is at least LA +2.

[DeAnno]

I tend to think of Savage Species Anthropomorphics as fairly high cheese, especially that one, but if he's willing to do it that would be great.

[Warrnan]

Forgive me if any of this is rehash from other posts. There are an awful lot and I didn't read all.

Here is my go to melee guy in a non-TOB setting:

Human whirling frenzy variant Barbarian1 with extra rage and stand still. Your skills are 5+int because of human. Grab intimidate and survival then take the trap killer acf at 3rd level. You can also maintain a good listen skill and a few others. 5+int is pretty good.

Use a few levels of fighter to get some feats. I love these: karmic strike (super good against any melee enemies), combat reflexes, knockdown and mage slayer. Take improved trip from barbarian2 wolf totem ACF. Also grab the spirit lion from complete champion for pounce.

By level 6 or so, you can get attacks of opportunity on anyone and knock their buts in the dirt. Being a two handed weapon type, you can bash everyone for tons of damage.

This is a build with good skills, crowd control, damage, and ok face skills. You can even use never outnumbered and instantaneous rage feat to effectively debuff a group of people you have intimidated. So great!

[Warrnan]

Forgive me if any of this is rehash from other posts. There are an awful lot and I didn't read all.

Here is my go to melee guy in a non-TOB setting:

Human whirling frenzy variant Barbarian1 with extra rage and stand still. Your skills are 5+int because of human. Grab intimidate and survival then take the trap killer acf at 3rd level. You can also maintain a good listen skill and a few others. 5+int is pretty good.

Use a few levels of fighter to get some feats. I love these: karmic strike (super good against any melee enemies), combat reflexes, knockdown and mage slayer. Take improved trip from barbarian2 wolf totem ACF. Also grab the spirit lion from complete champion for pounce.

By level 6 or so, you can get attacks of opportunity on anyone and knock their buts in the dirt. Being a two handed weapon type, you can bash everyone for tons of damage.

This is a build with good skills, crowd control, damage, and ok face skills. You can even use never outnumbered and instantaneous rage feat to effectively debuff a group of people you have intimidated as an immediate action at the beginning of combat. So great!

[ericgrau]

I tend to think of Savage Species Anthropomorphics as fairly high cheese, especially that one, but if he's willing to do it that would be great.
Yeah most likely it will be too much cheese, but I appreciate the attempt nonetheless.

I've added a subscription to this thread so I can find it again later. That way if I get a chance to make this build I can pick and choose from all the ideas and match them to the level of the gaming group and my own preferences.

[Waazraath]

Don't know if this is still relevant for the OP, but some time ago I wrote a handbook on how to get cool abilities for non-magic users (or 'mundanes'). It's a useful tool to look for unusual abilities for melee characters, that usually lack those abilities: http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=11381