Jeepers! A ghost PC! (advice requested)

[Excel]

Hello everyone,

Well, I've convinced my DM to let me play a ghost in our evil campaign. At first I was going to make it a bard, but we don't have trapfinding in the party so I volunteered to be the rogue instead. We're starting at level 4 (level 3 for me) and I had a couple questions about playing ghosts.

First off, I was just going to roll normal rogue but are there any archetypes that would be more suited to the inability to actually stab anyone? Although I was going to take the Malevolence ability so I could possess people. Do my feats carry over while I'm controlling someone?

My DM was also wondering about how he'd handle giving me loot since I couldn't equip anything that doesn't have ghost touch. On the other hand I don't care about loot, I'm a ghost!

Overall, I would appreciate any tips on being a spooky ghost. It should be fun playing such a different experience, I just hope my DM doesn't regret it too much! Haha!

[SangoProduction]

I believe (don't quote me on this) that wondrous items can be used as normal by anything, unless it specifies otherwise, like horse shoes.

[Grod_The_Giant]

You might note that there's a trait (Trap Finder) that can make any class with a decent Perception skill into a makeshift trap monkey.

Fun idea: play a Summoner and make your eidolon a medium-sized zombie looking biped. Claim you're summoning your own dead body.

[John Longarrow]

Hmm....

You can walk through walls. Traps can't hurt you anyhow (for the most part). Were I you, I'd do the whole "I go through the entire dungeon, come back and report. Let the party know the entire floor plan, what monsters are in there, where the traps are, and what the loot is.

Then do the same thing but moving in and out of the walls to find secret passages. By the time you are done (could be a couple hours) you should have a good map drawn up of everything. This should include what is in there (You may have even taken over some monsters to kill off enemies ahead of time) where it is, and it its worth it.

No DM in his right mind would let ME get my hands on a ghost... :belkar:

Also grab some weird knowledge skills. May also want Profession(cartographer) or (draftsman) to justify the map making.

[tsj]

I once played a ghost warlock.
The build was heavily optimized to be very difficult to resist the ghosts ability to possess someone...

So when not toying with invocations... I had loads of fun with posessing NPCS

:)

[Florian]

Hello everyone,

Well, I've convinced my DM to let me play a ghost in our evil campaign. At first I was going to make it a bard, but we don't have trapfinding in the party so I volunteered to be the rogue instead. We're starting at level 4 (level 3 for me) and I had a couple questions about playing ghosts.

First off, I was just going to roll normal rogue but are there any archetypes that would be more suited to the inability to actually stab anyone? Although I was going to take the Malevolence ability so I could possess people. Do my feats carry over while I'm controlling someone?

My DM was also wondering about how he'd handle giving me loot since I couldn't equip anything that doesn't have ghost touch. On the other hand I don't care about loot, I'm a ghost!

Overall, I would appreciate any tips on being a spooky ghost. It should be fun playing such a different experience, I just hope my DM doesn't regret it too much! Haha!

Spectral Undead as PC are very difficult to handle, especially the Ghost template.

First, talk to your GM how the PB allocation will be done, as there is a significant change here:
- You only have 4 stats instead of the usual 6 to spent points on.
- Stats work differently then usual, especially CHA and will change when you shift plane
(I would consider it a curtesy to houserale that a "10" must be bought for the stats before the are dropped)

As for equipment, there´s the "Equipping the Spectral Dead" sidebar on p.53 of "Undead Revisited".
In a nutshell: They can only use Ghost Touch equipment and that´s it. If forced to rejuvenate, all equipment is lost.
(That are the same restrictions as used for the Spiritualists Phantom companion)

If playing with these restrictions, it would mostly make sense to either play an Psychic or a Mesmerist.

[Quertus]

My experience playing a ghost was a very different kind of creepy. See, walking through walls, scouting seemed a bit overpowered, plus it involves Scooby Doo-ing the party. Being on my own, and winning everything, until somebody with magic missile just killed me, didn't sound like fun.

So, instead, I had a huge crate labeled "important things - do not touch" or something silly like that. Inside were several bodies, all permanently reduced to 0 wisdom, and wearing rings of sustenance. All could regenerate. I would switch between bodies to bypass the limited duration of possession, and used a hat of disguise to always look the same, no matter which body I was in. So, conceptually creepy, while appearing perfectly normal.

IIRC, there are rules for ghosts getting a finite set of magical items that come with them in ghost form, so long as the real item remains undisturbed with their body. I would recommend being buried with some protection from magic missiles, or a cloak of elven kind, if you plan on going solo.

[Excel]

Hey, thanks for the suggestions everyone! They definitely got me thinking more about what I could be doing.

Florian, we're simply rolling for stats. I'll just use my lowest rolls for Constitution and Strength since they're crossed out for ghosts.

In the end, I'm picking necromancer as my character will be a twisted playwright who raises undead to act out his "art". He then died. He then decided death wouldn't stand in the way of art.

[Jack_Simth]

IIRC, there are rules for ghosts getting a finite set of magical items that come with them in ghost form, so long as the real item remains undisturbed with their body.
Anything you died with, (+ a few items particularly valued, in 3.5, but the OP is asking about Pathfinder), and you keep them for as long as they're not in another creature's possession in both editions. if they were destroyed by the same thing that killed you, they're not getting stolen without some very interesting happenings.

In Pathfinder, pick up a 4k Amulet of Mighty Fists (Ghost Touch, not +1), and Improved Unarmed Strike. Your hands are now "both corporeal or incorporeal" as needed. You can now pick stuff up, disable traps, punch people, and so on without difficulty.

In 3.5, pick up Ghostly Grasp (feat, Libris Mortis), and a pair of material gloves. Any gloves will do. Same effect. Could also get +1 Ghost Touch Gauntlets for 8k to save a feat (and get +1 to attack and damage with your unarmed strike).

The Flyby Attack feat gets stupidly good if you want to snipe. Fire, go into wall for full cover, use the rest of your movement to end up at a random point in the room. Next turn: 5 foot up, fire, 5 foot down, use the rest of your movement to end up at a random point in the room. Requires readied actions (or AoOs, if someone threatens the square you pop out of) to hit you. Works best with critters with strong standard actions, though - casters, generally.

[Alex12]

Fun idea: play a Summoner and make your eidolon a medium-sized zombie looking biped. Claim you're summoning your own dead body.

The Reanimated Medium archetype (for the Medium, obviously) does something like this, except they're possessing their own body.

[Excel]

The Reanimated Medium seems cool, but doesn't actually count as an undead right? Now I'm curious, is there a way for a ghost to possess their own dead body and pretend to still be alive?

[Afgncaap5]

I don't know if it would fit your GM's campaign, but would anything from the Ghostwalk book help you? I've always wanted to use some of that material, but it's never felt appropriate.

[Jack_Simth]

The Reanimated Medium seems cool, but doesn't actually count as an undead right? Now I'm curious, is there a way for a ghost to possess their own dead body and pretend to still be alive?

Yes! One of the Paizo variants is called Reinvigoration, and lets the ghost posess a corpse to make it into a skeleton or zombie. Add casting, and something like Disguise Self or Alter Self, once posessing the corpse, and you can look alive.

[Ikitavi]

Keep in mind that if you are using your abilities to scout deep into the dungeons, if you DO encounter something you can not handle and can not get away from, your party is not going to know where you are or how to get to you.

[Ettina]

In a nutshell: They can only use Ghost Touch equipment and that´s it. If forced to rejuvenate, all equipment is lost.

Would Ghost Touch equipment interfere with phasing through walls? It would suck if your equipment couldn't go into the wall with you.

[Florian]

Would Ghost Touch equipment interfere with phasing through walls? It would suck if your equipment couldn't go into the wall with you.

That´s not how it works.
A ghost (or other spectral undead) exist wholly on the ethereal plane all the time but can "manifest" certain stuff into the "real world" to affect some things. So it does not "phase" through walls, because said walls don´t exist on the plane it is on. Think of it as being different layers of reality that coexist.
Ghost Touch equipment can exist ob both layers, if the user wants it to, but that´s not an automatic property or an "always on" function. If you have a, say, Ghost Touch sword, it only affects the other layer the moment you want it to do so.

Now, also think about a barrier in the ethereal plane stopping a ghost in its tracks even if there is no such thing on the "real" plane.

[Ettina]

That´s not how it works.
A ghost (or other spectral undead) exist wholly on the ethereal plane all the time but can "manifest" certain stuff into the "real world" to affect some things. So it does not "phase" through walls, because said walls don´t exist on the plane it is on. Think of it as being different layers of reality that coexist.
Ghost Touch equipment can exist ob both layers, if the user wants it to, but that´s not an automatic property or an "always on" function. If you have a, say, Ghost Touch sword, it only affects the other layer the moment you want it to do so.

Now, also think about a barrier in the ethereal plane stopping a ghost in its tracks even if there is no such thing on the "real" plane.

Oh, cool. I thought ghost touch stuff constantly existed in both planes.

[Quertus]

Now, also think about a barrier in the ethereal plane stopping a ghost in its tracks even if there is no such thing on the "real" plane.

And think about looting said barrier, because it's likely very valuable! :smallwink:

[Florian]

Oh, cool. I thought ghost touch stuff constantly existed in both planes.

Now that would be annoying. Imagine a Paladin with Ghost Touch Full Plate constantly pumping into ethereal things and such....


And think about looting said barrier, because it's likely very valuable! :smallwink:

Go to the plane, drop a wall of stone spell and done. It is very easy to guard the ethereal plane against stuff by forcing it all to react to it like in the prime material plane.

[Jack_Simth]

In 3.5, the Ghost touch property explicitly says incorporeal or material, whichever is most advantageous.
Pathfinder dropped the "whichever" and made it count as both incorporeal and corporeal. That might mean it's incorporeal for purposes of going through stuff, or it might not. Your mileage may vary, ask your DM>

That´s not how it works.
A ghost (or other spectral undead) exist wholly on the ethereal plane all the time but can "manifest" certain stuff into the "real world" to affect some things. So it does not "phase" through walls, because said walls don´t exist on the plane it is on. Think of it as being different layers of reality that coexist.
Ghost Touch equipment can exist ob both layers, if the user wants it to, but that´s not an automatic property or an "always on" function. If you have a, say, Ghost Touch sword, it only affects the other layer the moment you want it to do so.

Now, also think about a barrier in the ethereal plane stopping a ghost in its tracks even if there is no such thing on the "real" plane.
In 3.5, a Ghost exists both on the Ethereal as a corporeal creature, and (when manifested) on the material as an incorporeal creature. There's actually very few critters that are like this - most are just one of Ethereal, Incorporeal, or Material.

However, the OP has flagged the thread as Pathfinder, and that works differently. Ghosts don't manifest from the Ethereal, they're just straight-up incorporeal. Among other things, this means they don't have an at-will sorta invisibility.
Now that would be annoying. Imagine a Paladin with Ghost Touch Full Plate constantly pumping into ethereal things and such....



Go to the plane, drop a wall of stone spell and done. It is very easy to guard the ethereal plane against stuff by forcing it all to react to it like in the prime material plane.
Warning: You'll need to bring (and leave) some regular stone there, as Wall of Stone must merge with existing stone, and be solidly supported by it. Nothing has real weight on the Ethereal, though, so that's not a problem.