CW Samurai or Iaijitsu Master? 3.5

[Lexozorn]

I play a level 3 CW Samurai. Having obtained Iaijutsu Focus thanks to my DM's permission, I have the possibility to prestige it into Iaijitsu master, let's say at level 8 of the CW Sam. Either I do that, or keep the CW Samurai until lv20. So my question is what's better? I really feel like the staredown CW bonuses are not worth it, you get them way too late and they aren't that good, but I really like the lv20 ability. However, the Iaijutsu Master gives a lot of cool bonuses to Iaijutsu focus, which I'd love having, plus the bonus feats, so I could compensate the Kiai Smite loss with extra Smiting.

What would you do?

[ManicOppressive]

From an optimization standpoint, it really doesn't get much worse than the CW Samurai. If you can get out, do so.

Like, seriously, the only reason to stay in that class is for flavor, and even then you're usually better off doing something like Crusader and fluffing as a Samurai. CW Samurai is just bad. That level 20 ability is dependent on HD, and is functionally worse than several spells casters get access to around level 10. None of its class features are in any way notable for their level, and even fighters do everything better than Samurai.

So yeah, go for IM, or break your code and go for Ronin.

[Lexozorn]

So yeah, go for IM, or break your code and go for Ronin.

I read about the Ronin as well. What exactly makes it good? Only the fact that you retain the Samurai abilities, while obtaining SA and Banzai, or is there more I'm missing?

[Hal0Badger]

Iaijutsu master gives you Iaijitsu related abilities, un-achievable otherwise. No bonus feats as well, unlike fighter.

CW gives nothing un-achievable, maybe Staredown ability.

So called Katana and wazizashi are just re-fluffed weapons, not special unique ones neither.

As a whole, I feel the "Samurai" fails to deliver its feel more than any class in the game. It is just a re-fluffed 2-weapon fighting fighter, with less feats to customize and "Staredown" slapped on the top of the class. Besides, I always thought the single katana-users are the most common representatives for the samurai lore, not 2-weapon fighting.

Iaijutsu master on the other hand, at least gives the feel that you are a different and special class, with a unique technique.

[Cwymbran-San]

Is only IM allowed or are other OA classes fair game as well? That would open up some interesting options for your samurai.

[Lexozorn]

Is only IM allowed or are other OA classes fair game as well? That would open up some interesting options for your samurai.

Well, maybe.. What are you thinking of?

[Andezzar]

Well, maybe.. What are you thinking of?Rebuild him as OA samurai for a start?

[Lexozorn]

Rebuild him as OA samurai for a start?

Not an option, the guy's already up three levels, my DM wouldn't allow it (fairly enough)

[gorfnab]

Any chance of multiclassing into Warblade, Crusader, or Knight?

[Lexozorn]

Any chance of multiclassing into Warblade, Crusader, or Knight?

Should be able to do that, suggestions?

[Troacctid]

Warblade is a better Samurai than Samurai. Multiclass as a Warblade, take Diamond Mind maneuvers. Sapphire Nightmare Blade is particularly good with iaijutsu, and Emerald Razor works well with Power Attack.

[gorfnab]

Warblade is a better Samurai than Samurai. Multiclass as a Warblade, take Diamond Mind maneuvers. Sapphire Nightmare Blade is particularly good with iaijutsu, and Emerald Razor works well with Power Attack.
Basically this.

Since you already have 3 levels of Samurai you could do something like Samurai 3/ Warblade 3/ Iaijistu Master 5/ Warblade 9

[Chronos]

Even the authors of Complete Warrior knew that the Samurai sucked. IIRC, the description of the class states that they're nearly as powerful as fighters, but less versatile. OK, so what's the advantage, then?

[Pluto!]

That lawful pouncing barbarian PrC in Oriental Adventures is pretty good. Mix it with Shock Trooper, Karmic Strike and probably a dip into Fighter and Exotic Weapons Master, and you could have a pretty reasonable build for this character without even extending beyond the books already at your table.

That said, Iajitsu Master can be absolutely insane if you build around getting multiple Iajitsu Attacks per round, but that generally relies on certain extremely dedicated Gnome builds.

[A_S]

One thing to note: Although they're overall pretty bad, CW Samurai are quite good at exactly one thing: AoE Demoralize shenanigans via Mass Staredown. Example (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?125885-ShneekeyTheLost-vs-Pharaoh-s-Fist-ToS).

Might be worth looking into.

[ManicOppressive]

I read about the Ronin as well. What exactly makes it good? Only the fact that you retain the Samurai abilities, while obtaining SA and Banzai, or is there more I'm missing?

Ronin gets most of the relevant class features from CW Samurai, and also gets some sneak attack, which makes him just a Rogue with better BAB but fewer SA dice in combat and still nothing outside of combat.

Basically Ronin is still bad, but it picks up enough abilities to at least theoretically contribute.

As with Samurai, there is still literally nothing you can do against undead besides attackattackattack. Cause yeah, it's still bad. Just not AS bad.