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deathbymanga
2016-01-12, 11:31 PM
So in my campaign I have a player playing a Technomancer Wizard and I realized that the Unearthed Arcana never gave stats for the Vehicles you could conjure or what you can do with the conjuration (for instance my players decided to conjure their car with a snow plow to make it easy to ram through enemies)

Can I have some help stating the possible vehicles you can make?

khadgar567
2016-01-13, 02:51 AM
So in my campaign I have a player playing a Technomancer Wizard and I realized that the Unearthed Arcana never gave stats for the Vehicles you could conjure or what you can do with the conjuration (for instance my players decided to conjure their car with a snow plow to make it easy to ram through enemies)

Can I have some help stating the possible vehicles you can make?
on basic case use charge attack rules with cars size as charger size

deathbymanga
2016-01-13, 03:51 AM
on basic case use charge attack rules with cars size as charger size

would a 4-person car be large or huge?

and what charge attack rules?

and what about stuff like HD and AC and Speed? and carrying load?

Goober4473
2016-01-13, 11:40 AM
and what about stuff like HD and AC and Speed? and carrying load?

If you're playing in a modern or futuristic world, you might want to nail these things down in general, at which point you'll have your answers for summoned vehicles as well.

Or you could do what I'm doing in my D&D In Space game, and just wing it/hand-wave it. They summoned a fork lift to bust down a door, which I had them do with no roll, and now it's functioning mostly as mobile cover.

deathbymanga
2016-01-13, 06:11 PM
If you're playing in a modern or futuristic world, you might want to nail these things down in general, at which point you'll have your answers for summoned vehicles as well.

Or you could do what I'm doing in my D&D In Space game, and just wing it/hand-wave it. They summoned a fork lift to bust down a door, which I had them do with no roll, and now it's functioning mostly as mobile cover.

it's hard to have a compelling fight against a big bad when the players can just drive a semi into his house and be done with it. :P

and yeah, i'd like to be able to stat any of the vehicles in the area

weaseldust
2016-01-13, 08:48 PM
I just came up with this off the top of my head, I haven't tested it in play:

Motorbikes and similar vehicles are Medium, cars and so on (up to 6 seats) are Large, minibuses and so on (more than 6 seats) are Huge, buses and heavy goods vehicles are Gargantuan.

Motorised vehicles can be driven at any of 3 speeds: cautious (100ft/round, a bit over 10mph), standard (200ft/round, a bit over 20mph), or fast (600ft/round, almost 70mph). Bear in mind that these are for urban environments where there might be obstacles. The time to get up to speed is ignored because it mostly won't be significant compared to the length of a round when driving aggressively, though perhaps it should be impossible to drive at a fast speed if you were stationary last round.

You don't need to use an action to control the vehicle (maybe it should use your bonus action each turn? - I'm not sure), but it does occupy one hand and your feet. You must expend half your movement to get into or out of a vehicle.

When you pass within 5ft of an obstacle (creature/object/building/terrain feature) at standard or fast speed, you must make a dexterity check or hit it and cause and take damage (see below). The standard DC should probably be 10, but it will depend on the circumstances. You may add your proficiency bonus if you are proficient with motorised vehicles. You have disadvantage if you are travelling fast, if your vehicle is old or decrepit, or if it is below half HP.

You can also deliberately target an obstacle. If it is a creature, it makes a dexterity save against a DC equal to 8 plus your proficiency bonus plus your dexterity modifier to avoid the vehicle.

If a Medium vehicle hits an obstacle at standard speed, both vehicle and obstacle take 2d6 bludgeoning damage (halved for the vehicle due to resistance - see below). This is halved at cautious speed and tripled at fast speed. The damage is doubled for every size category (of the vehicle) above Medium. The damage to creatures is capped at 20d6.

Creatures hit by a vehicle of equal or greater size are knocked prone and objects hit by a vehicle of greater size are tossed 10ft in a random direction. If a vehicle hits an obstacle equal or greater in size, it spins 10ft in a random direction, comes to a stop, and takes twice the usual amount of damage.

A motorised vehicle has an AC of 16. A Medium vehicle has 30HP, which is doubled for every size category above Medium. Old or decrepit vehicles have half the usual HP.

Motorised vehicles are immune to psychic, poison, and necrotic damage. They are resistant to bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage.

A vehicle shows surface damage as soon as it has lost HP. A damaged vehicle can be repaired and restored to full HP after d4 hours under the attentions of a character with proficiency in the relevant tools. A destroyed vehicle can perhaps be somewhat repaired in the same time, depending on how it was destroyed, but it counts as decrepit thereafter.

A Medium vehicle can safely carry up to 500 pounds. This amount is multiplied by 4 for each size category above Medium. (Not sure what the penalty for going over should be - perhaps disadvantage on checks to control the vehicle and halved speed? Cumulative damage over time?) Note that they could potentially tow more than that - it will depend on the vehicle.

Optional rule: Vehicles destroyed by firearms or by rolling down a cliffside have a 50% chance of exploding, dealing 4d6 fire damage and 4d6 thunder damage to everything within 10ft, with a dexterity save to take half.


Ideas for a snowplough: you deal damage like a vehicle one size larger, you have disadvantage on vehicle handling checks, you halve your speed in each speed category, and you suffer no penalties for moving through snow or similar substances.

deathbymanga
2016-01-13, 10:31 PM
I just came up with this off the top of my head, I haven't tested it in play:

Motorbikes and similar vehicles are Medium, cars and so on (up to 6 seats) are Large, minibuses and so on (more than 6 seats) are Huge, buses and heavy goods vehicles are Gargantuan.

Motorised vehicles can be driven at any of 3 speeds: cautious (100ft/round, a bit over 10mph), standard (200ft/round, a bit over 20mph), or fast (600ft/round, almost 70mph). Bear in mind that these are for urban environments where there might be obstacles. The time to get up to speed is ignored because it mostly won't be significant compared to the length of a round when driving aggressively, though perhaps it should be impossible to drive at a fast speed if you were stationary last round.

You don't need to use an action to control the vehicle (maybe it should use your bonus action each turn? - I'm not sure), but it does occupy one hand and your feet. You must expend half your movement to get into or out of a vehicle.

I'd say it uses your own Movement action to drive a vehicle. and it uses your bonus action to adjust gears (speeds). And to jump from cautious to fast uses an action (Basically a Dash action)


When you pass within 5ft of an obstacle (creature/object/building/terrain feature) at standard or fast speed, you must make a dexterity check or hit it and cause and take damage (see below). The standard DC should probably be 10, but it will depend on the circumstances. You may add your proficiency bonus if you are proficient with motorised vehicles. You have disadvantage if you are travelling fast, if your vehicle is old or decrepit, or if it is below half HP.

What about driving down a tight area? Would you make the check every 5ft or ever round?


You can also deliberately target an obstacle. If it is a creature, it makes a dexterity save against a DC equal to 8 plus your proficiency bonus plus your dexterity modifier to avoid the vehicle.

If a Medium vehicle hits an obstacle at standard speed, both vehicle and obstacle take 2d6 bludgeoning damage (halved for the vehicle due to resistance - see below). This is halved at cautious speed and tripled at fast speed. The damage is doubled for every size category (of the vehicle) above Medium. The damage to creatures is capped at 20d6.

Creatures hit by a vehicle of equal or greater size are knocked prone and objects hit by a vehicle of greater size are tossed 10ft in a random direction. If a vehicle hits an obstacle equal or greater in size, it spins 10ft in a random direction, comes to a stop, and takes twice the usual amount of damage.

Wait, so, a Motorcycle driving into a Half-Orc will result in the Half-Orc knocked prone, and the vehicle spinning 10ft off?

And maybe force a Con Save or be knocked prone? Like in those situations where someone drives into a super-soldier and they get up like it was nothing?

And if the car doesn't spin off when it hits a creature, what happens if the vehicle keeps driving forward into the target? Do they land prone first, or do they not fly until the car stops?

And does moving at fast speeds increase the distance the creature goes?


A motorised vehicle has an AC of 16. A Medium vehicle has 30HP, which is doubled for every size category above Medium. Old or decrepit vehicles have half the usual HP.

What about making saves? like if someone casts Frostbite on the vehicle


Motorised vehicles are immune to psychic, poison, and necrotic damage. They are resistant to bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage.

I'd maybe include a Vulnerability to Acid damage maybe?


A vehicle shows surface damage as soon as it has lost HP. A damaged vehicle can be repaired and restored to full HP after d4 hours under the attentions of a character with proficiency in the relevant tools. A destroyed vehicle can perhaps be somewhat repaired in the same time, depending on how it was destroyed, but it counts as decrepit thereafter.

A Medium vehicle can safely carry up to 500 pounds. This amount is multiplied by 4 for each size category above Medium. (Not sure what the penalty for going over should be - perhaps disadvantage on checks to control the vehicle and halved speed? Cumulative damage over time?) Note that they could potentially tow more than that - it will depend on the vehicle.

Optional rule: Vehicles destroyed by firearms or by rolling down a cliffside have a 50% chance of exploding, dealing 4d6 fire damage and 4d6 thunder damage to everything within 10ft, with a dexterity save to take half.

I'd include taking Fire damage in that situation.


Ideas for a snowplough: you deal damage like a vehicle one size larger, you have disadvantage on vehicle handling checks, you halve your speed in each speed category, and you suffer no penalties for moving through snow or similar substances.

weaseldust
2016-01-14, 08:27 AM
I'd say it uses your own Movement action to drive a vehicle. and it uses your bonus action to adjust gears (speeds). And to jump from cautious to fast uses an action (Basically a Dash action)

I was basing it on the rules for mounts, which basically don't use any of your actions at all. I think it's appropriate for a character to be able to drive up, get out, and start firing a gun in 1 turn, which is impossible if it uses all your own movement to drive. I think a bonus action to change gear is appropriate for some vehicles, but not automatics or cars with paddle gears. Possibly not motorbikes, I've never actually ridden one. (Also, in a cinematic car chase, you could be in 2nd gear all the way from 10mph to 60mph - it's not like you care about engine life.)

Another consideration is that there might be weapons on the car (rocket launchers, hub spikes, etc.) that should require a bonus action to use, and you might not want that to conflict with actually driving the thing.


What about driving down a tight area? Would you make the check every 5ft or ever round?

Definitely every round. Or whenever you enter a tight space (e.g. if you start the round in an alley, drive out into a wider road, and then enter another alley, you might need two checks). It's also preferable to roll as many checks into one as possible - if you pass half a dozen dustbins, you don't make a check for passing each one, just one for the group.


Wait, so, a Motorcycle driving into a Half-Orc will result in the Half-Orc knocked prone, and the vehicle spinning 10ft off?

That sounds pretty reasonable to me. Maybe the distance should be more than 10ft if the bike was going fast.


And maybe force a Con Save or be knocked prone? Like in those situations where someone drives into a super-soldier and they get up like it was nothing?

The only thing is, there's already a dex save to avoid damage, so I didn't want to throw in any more saves or resolving the impact might start to drag.


And if the car doesn't spin off when it hits a creature, what happens if the vehicle keeps driving forward into the target? Do they land prone first, or do they not fly until the car stops?

It's too varied to make a hard rule. I'd make the standard case that they just move 5ft to the side from the point of impact, but I'd give them a strength check to cling onto the windscreen/roof if they wanted to, with further saves to avoid being thrown off if the car keeps going.


And does moving at fast speeds increase the distance the creature goes?

That seems reasonable. Up to 30ft at fast speeds, maybe? Or d4*10ft, if you want to randomise.


What about making saves? like if someone casts Frostbite on the vehicle.

Strictly speaking, that spell can't affect objects. And spells that do, like Shatter, don't give them a save. If you really want a con save, I think +6 for a Medium vehicle and an extra +2 per size category sounds reasonable. They should probably auto-fail other saves, though (bearing in mind they aren't creatures, so they can't be subject to charm, illusion, and so on anyway).


I'd maybe include a Vulnerability to Acid damage maybe?

Oddly, acid in DnD seems to affect organic matter more than metal. Feel free to change it, though. If you're aiming for realism, I have no idea how your typical car will respond to being doused in acid, so I can't really help.


A few more things I thought of:

The rules for falling off a bike should be the same as for a horse.

You might want to put a restriction on turning while at fast speed. E.g. every 90 degrees takes 200ft of movement. At the same time, in a cinematic car chase, turning 180 degrees almost instantly is possible at any speed, it just makes a lot of smoke.

You could perhaps allow for masterwork/magic cars that travel twice or three times as fast in each speed category. I'm thinking that Bond vehicles can race through a cramped urban environment at speeds much higher than 20mph.

deathbymanga
2016-01-14, 08:49 AM
I was basing it on the rules for mounts, which basically don't use any of your actions at all. I think it's appropriate for a character to be able to drive up, get out, and start firing a gun in 1 turn, which is impossible if it uses all your own movement to drive. I think a bonus action to change gear is appropriate for some vehicles, but not automatics or cars with paddle gears. Possibly not motorbikes, I've never actually ridden one. (Also, in a cinematic car chase, you could be in 2nd gear all the way from 10mph to 60mph - it's not like you care about engine life.)

Another consideration is that there might be weapons on the car (rocket launchers, hub spikes, etc.) that should require a bonus action to use, and you might not want that to conflict with actually driving the thing.

why'd you want to leave the car? if anything, the car should provide some cover that turn (it'd hardly be a move action to put your hands over your head and duck after stopping the car). In these types of situations also, the Driver isn't someone who's first priority is combat. He should get the rest of the fighters to the location, they all jump out and attack the enemy, and then the next turn the driver gets out and begins attacking also.


Definitely every round. Or whenever you enter a tight space (e.g. if you start the round in an alley, drive out into a wider road, and then enter another alley, you might need two checks). It's also preferable to roll as many checks into one as possible - if you pass half a dozen dustbins, you don't make a check for passing each one, just one for the group.



That sounds pretty reasonable to me. Maybe the distance should be more than 10ft if the bike was going fast.

that doesn't make any sense. Motorcycles don't exactly go flying when they hit ordinary pedestrians. if anything they plow right through them.


The only thing is, there's already a dex save to avoid damage, so I didn't want to throw in any more saves or resolving the impact might start to drag.

so, maybe only be prone if you fail the dex save?


It's too varied to make a hard rule. I'd make the standard case that they just move 5ft to the side from the point of impact, but I'd give them a strength check to cling onto the windscreen/roof if they wanted to, with further saves to avoid being thrown off if the car keeps going.



That seems reasonable. Up to 30ft at fast speeds, maybe? Or d4*10ft, if you want to randomise.



Strictly speaking, that spell can't affect objects. And spells that do, like Shatter, don't give them a save. If you really want a con save, I think +6 for a Medium vehicle and an extra +2 per size category sounds reasonable. They should probably auto-fail other saves, though (bearing in mind they aren't creatures, so they can't be subject to charm, illusion, and so on anyway).



Oddly, acid in DnD seems to affect organic matter more than metal. Feel free to change it, though. If you're aiming for realism, I have no idea how your typical car will respond to being doused in acid, so I can't really help.


A few more things I thought of:

The rules for falling off a bike should be the same as for a horse.

You might want to put a restriction on turning while at fast speed. E.g. every 90 degrees takes 200ft of movement. At the same time, in a cinematic car chase, turning 180 degrees almost instantly is possible at any speed, it just makes a lot of smoke.

yeah, I'm probably going to let the players drive like the movies and pull a donut in the middle of a chace sequence. Though I'd force a Dexterity check to avoid flipping the car


You could perhaps allow for masterwork/magic cars that travel twice or three times as fast in each speed category. I'm thinking that Bond vehicles can race through a cramped urban environment at speeds much higher than 20mph.

oh, i'd definitely allow for special Longstrider Cars to exist. I can definitely imagine a Captain Falcon type character that drives a Longstrider car :P.

weaseldust
2016-01-14, 04:55 PM
why'd you want to leave the car? if anything, the car should provide some cover that turn (it'd hardly be a move action to put your hands over your head and duck after stopping the car).

The driver's seat is still a pretty vulnerable position. If you stop the car between you and your enemies, you can hop out the other side and then use the whole car for cover, rather than just the passenger window, which is what you'd have while in the driver's seat.


In these types of situations also, the Driver isn't someone who's first priority is combat. He should get the rest of the fighters to the location, they all jump out and attack the enemy, and then the next turn the driver gets out and begins attacking also.

It's fine if you want to play it that way, but then who is going to volunteer to be the driver? In practice, it doesn't take any longer for the driver to get out than a passenger (unless the passenger gets out while the car is moving). Anyway, I think motorbikes should definitely work like horses, but I can understand wanting cars to work differently if you want there to be a specialised driver role, or if you want planning an assault-via-car to be a bit more involved than planning an attack on foot.


that doesn't make any sense. Motorcycles don't exactly go flying when they hit ordinary pedestrians. if anything they plow right through them.

As I said, I haven't ridden a motorbike. But from what I've seen, hitting pretty much any substantial obstacle will cause it to go over and come to a sudden stop (it might slide further than 10ft, though, depending on the circumstances).

Searching for video of a bike hitting a pedestrian can get a bit morbid for obvious reasons. I found this one (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3XgG3aIW7A) where everyone seems to be fine afterwards. I'm not sure what would happen at higher speeds - bikes are more stable going faster, but the collision will also be more energetic.


so, maybe only be prone if you fail the dex save?

That's the intention - the dex save is to avoid the collision, so if you succeed, neither you nor the vehicle are affected.


yeah, I'm probably going to let the players drive like the movies and pull a donut in the middle of a chace sequence. Though I'd force a Dexterity check to avoid flipping the car

This sounds awesome.


oh, i'd definitely allow for special Longstrider Cars to exist. I can definitely imagine a Captain Falcon type character that drives a Longstrider car :P.

So does this.


Just one more thought I had - you might want to give vehicles varying amounts of HP to reflect size differences within size categories - e.g. a Mini and an SUV are both Large, but the latter should probably have maybe 50% more HP. To compensate, I'd give the Mini advantage on checks to pass through narrow spaces, and perhaps to safely perform jumps and so on.

Obviously, you can make a lot of this up on the fly. Vehicles are very varied, and trying to account for all of that variation beforehand would probably make the rules very unwieldy.