Looking for Help with "Awaken" spell

[Lord of Shadows]

Greetings Playground,

While working on a prestige class, I came across what could be a really nasty spell modification: Awaken Disease

This would be available to a Prestige Class that creates and spreads diseases across the land. Not sure if Awaken can be hammered onto a disease, but here is a sort-of rough draft to get discussion going:

Original PFRPG Spell: Awaken (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/awaken)

New Spell – Awaken Disease
School: Transmutation Level: Cleric 5
Casting Time: 24 hours
Components: V, S, M (herbs and oils worth 4,000 GP), DF
Range: Touch
Target: Diseased area, creature, or container
Duration: instantaneous
Saving Throw: No Spell Resistance: Yes (Special, see description)

You awaken a disease to human-like sentience. To succeed, you must make a Will save (DC 10 + HD the disease will have once awakened?). Further, if the target is within an area protected by any sort of Spell Resistance, you must also overcome that resistance. The awakened disease will ignore you as long as there are other creatures in the area. You have no special empathy or connection with a disease you awaken, although it will serve you in specific tasks or endeavors if you communicate your desires to it. Further castings of Awaken Disease on the same creature have no effect.

An awakened disease has characteristics as if it were an animated object, except that it gains the [Aberration?] type and it has vision and hearing senses similar to a human's. An awakened disease communicates telepathically.

An awakened disease has 3d6 Intelligence, 1d3 Charisma, and +2 HD. An awakened disease can't serve as a companion, familiar, or special mount.

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[KitsuneBoxing]

While working on a prestige class, I came across what could be a really nasty spell modification: Awaken Disease

Great idea!

I don't think the spell works as it is, because it leaves to many questions. My major question is "what does the disease look like and what can it do?"

This is of course a question of flavor, but not only that. It will affect the creature type, the size and the conditions to create it. Since you've given it the stats of an animated object i assume you want it to have a physical form? And not be an incorporeal disease that simply starts to care about who and what it affects.

If this is the case you have to make certain things clear. One: what determines the disease's size, physical ability scores, alignment and special abilities. In the case of animated objects, this is determined by the size of the object and the will of the creator. Should the caster of this spell be able to apply construction points to the disease, thereby determining what it can do, or is this descided in some other way? And what determines the size of the "object"? DC of the disease?

Two: In what way can this awakened disease spread itself? As it is now, the awakened disease actually cannot spread the disease to others, which i assume is not supposed to be the case. Also, make it clear what happens to the disease once it gets a body. Does the area targeted by the spell stop being affected by the disease, because its form changes into a physical body, or is the physical awakened creature merely a part of the disease, and it can still spread as a normal disease would?

These are the major problems, as i can see them.

In addition to this i would advice to make will save made as part of casting the spell simply be the DC of the disease (with maybe it affecting you if you fail, just a thought). This is in my opinion easier than using a HD that does not yet exist.

Also, while i agree that abberation is suitable as flavor remember that the actual abberation creature type is not very powerful and very much "alive". This means that the created creature must eat, sleep and breathe, and that it has no immunities (not even to diseases), meaning that it technically can fail a save against itself and become diseased. Maybe this is how you want it, or with a few changes such as "an abberation with immunity to diseases", but if it is not then maybe you should consider keeping the construct type, which is very unsiutable in flavor, but perhaps better in its properties.

Also, i would personally make it a level 6 spell. I'm not sure i can argue this, since the spell is not too powerful, but it feels more extreme than "awaken" to me, and of course "animate object" is a level 6 spell.

Also, i would probably come up with two or three extra special abilities that can be purchused using construction points that are specific to awakened diseases. I'm thinking spell like abilities, acid attacks, that sort of thing. But that is definately not necessary.

That's what i have to say, hope it's helpful. I understand that you wrote the spell down as a first draft and that you are aware that it does not hold up at this stage, so i hope i wasnt rude to "critizise" it as it is, but i find it is simplest to talk about actual things that people have written.

Again, great spell idea!

[Fii]

As for what they look like.. Like these. (http://www.thinkgeek.com/product/6708/)

[Lord of Shadows]

This is of course a question of flavor, but not only that. It will affect the creature type, the size and the conditions to create it. Since you've given it the stats of an animated object i assume you want it to have a physical form? And not be an incorporeal disease that simply starts to care about who and what it affects.

Well, I am kind of undecided on this point, plus there isn't really a standard creature type that a disease can be shoehorned into, except perhaps Aberration. The construct language is just text from the original spell, and is not necessary. I would say think of it as a real-world disease, microbes capable of infecting living tissue and capable of being transmitted in some form (air, touch, etc.). These are the things that need game-world equivalents.

I did come across this in my research on Google: The Spells of Jeshatan (http://w3ww.wargamevault.com/product_reviews.php?products_id=19357&it=1), which mentions a new school of magic called Disease and actually has the spell Awaken Disease. The link is only to a review of the product, so I don't know how they addressed these points.


One: what determines the disease's size, physical ability scores, alignment and special abilities. In the case of animated objects, this is determined by the size of the object and the will of the creator. Should the caster of this spell be able to apply construction points to the disease, thereby determining what it can do, or is this decided in some other way? And what determines the size of the "object"? DC of the disease?

As a disease, if we take the real-world view, I would say it is a cloud of some sort... In the playtest of the setting this is for, there was a massive plague that decimated the world, and it turned out to be spread through the "blood of the world" (a variation on Earthblood). The thought of that Plague having Awaken cast on it is, well, let's just say "end of the world" material. Any "Awakened" part of that plague would have to remain localized. There should also be some way to fight it... Remove Disease seems a little underpowered, and once awakened it is a creature that can be killed... somehow.


Two: In what way can this awakened disease spread itself? As it is now, the awakened disease actually cannot spread the disease to others, which i assume is not supposed to be the case. Also, make it clear what happens to the disease once it gets a body. Does the area targeted by the spell stop being affected by the disease, because its form changes into a physical body, or is the physical awakened creature merely a part of the disease, and it can still spread as a normal disease would?

As an Awakened Disease, it would be sentient in some way, and be able to make decisions and choices. Its driving force would likely be that of a virus given intelligence... it wants to replicate and grow. Creatures infected by it would likely suffer some additional effect besides being sick. I'm still uncertain on that one.


In addition to this i would advice to make will save made as part of casting the spell simply be the DC of the disease (with maybe it affecting you if you fail, just a thought). This is in my opinion easier than using a HD that does not yet exist.

Yes, that works.


...it technically can fail a save against itself and become diseased.

Now that's a scary thought...


Also, i would personally make it a level 6 spell. I'm not sure i can argue this, since the spell is not too powerful, but it feels more extreme than "awaken" to me, and of course "animate object" is a level 6 spell.

I wondered about that too...


Again, great spell idea!

Thanks! And thanks for some great feedback! Let me know any other ideas you have.

[Lord of Shadows]

As for what they look like.. Like these. (http://www.thinkgeek.com/product/6708/)

YES!! :biggrin:

[Lord of Shadows]

Quick question:

Does anyone know of a Template (preferably Pathfinder, but anything is OK) that gives immunity to disease?

Thanks.

[Lord of Shadows]

Tossing out some more ideas:

An awakened disease gains the Aberration (Augmented) type and has vision and hearing senses similar to a human's. An awakened disease communicates telepathically.

Augmented with the Mana Wasted Mutant (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/templates/mana-wasted-mutant-cr-1) (CR+1) Template

Swarm (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/rules-for-monsters/creature-types#subtype-swarm) subtype

As a creature/swarm, spells like Remove Disease, and even Heal, no longer work on a disease affected by Awaken Disease. However, as a creature/swarm, damage spells like Fireball and Lightning Bolt will affect it subject to the details listed here.
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[Lord of Shadows]

Great idea!

OK, let's try this again... Don't know how much XP the creature should be worth.
New Spell – Awaken Disease
School: Transmutation Level: Cleric 6
Casting Time: 24 hours
Components: V, S, M (herbs and oils worth 4,000 GP), DF
Range: Touch
Target: Diseased square, creature, or container (max. 5x5x5)
Duration: instantaneous
Saving Throw: No Spell Resistance: Yes (Special, see description)

You awaken a disease to human-like sentience. To succeed, you must make a Will save (DC 10 + Base DC of the Disease). Further, if the target is within an area protected by any sort of Spell Resistance, you must also overcome that resistance. The awakened disease will ignore you as long as there are other creatures in the area. You have no special empathy or connection with a disease you awaken, although it may serve you in specific tasks or endeavors if you communicate your desires to it. Further castings of Awaken Disease on the same creature have no effect.

An Awakened Disease gains the Ooze and Swarm types and has Blindsight out to 60 feet and communicates telepathically. An Awakened Disease has 3d6 Intelligence, 1d3 Charisma, +2 HD and cannot serve as a companion, familiar, or special mount. Its Skills are Fly and Stealth.
Awakened Disease
An Awakened Disease is created when the spell, Awaken Disease, is cast on an infected area, creature or container.

XP ???
N Fine ooze (swarm) (augmented)
Init –5; Senses blindsight 60 ft.; Perception +1

DEFENSE

AC 17, touch 17, flat-footed 17 (–5 Dex, +12 size)
hp 18 (4d8)
Saves: Fort +0, Ref –5, Will –5
Defensive Abilities ooze and swarm traits; Immune weapon damage, see text
Weaknesses vulnerability to fire, swarm traits

OFFENSE

Speed 10 ft., climb 10 ft., fly 30 ft. (perfect)
Melee swarm (except distraction)
Space 10 ft.; Reach 0 ft.
Special Attacks infect (Save, Onset, etc. are same as the base disease)

STATISTICS
Str 1 (-5), Dex 1 (-5), Con 10, Int 12 (+1), Wis 1 (-5), Cha 2 (-4)
Base Atk +1; CMB —; CMD —
Skills Fly +13, Stealth + 23; Racial Modifiers +8 Fly, +8 Stealth, +6 Perception
Languages telepathy 100 ft.
SQ amorphous

SPECIAL ABILITIES

Infinitesimal (Ex)
An Awakened Disease consists of a microscopic cloud of viruses, and as such is undetectable by normal means much of the time. Detect spells will work on it, and some magic items as well. An Awakened Disease leaves no tracks, no scent, and makes no sound. As such, it does not have the Distraction ability that is common to most swarms.

Immunity (Ex)
As a creature, and no longer a true disease, spells such as Remove Disease and even Heal have no effect on either an Awakened Disease or an infected creature. Defenses and remedies for afflictions such as Mummy Rot do not work, since no curse is involved. Physical defenses that normally work against a Swarm, such as Damage Reduction, are ineffective. However, an Awakened Disease is vulnerable to fire and to spells that affect swarms.

Infect (Ex)
An Awakened Disease is an intelligent form of a normally more common or mundane disease, and being sentient it can choose where it goes and who it tries to infect. It ignores incorporeal creatures. When it infects a corporeal creature, it deposits a small amount of itself and moves on to the next target, and can cause a widespread outbreak in a short amount of time. If a creature dies from its effects, the Awakened Disease leaves that creature to seek out a new host. Any creature that is normally unaffected by disease can become a carrier, and the Awakened Disease will infect any other creature that comes into contact with it. The specifics of the disease, such as Save, Onset and Effect remain the same for the base disease that was Awakened.

ECOLOGY

Environment any land or underground
Organization solitary or colony (2–5)
Treasure none

An Awakened Disease is a small quantity of a normal disease that has been given sentience through the power of the spell Awaken Disease. Composed of a cloud of viruses, they are very difficult to detect visually, sometimes appearing as sheen on a solid surface or as a faint, misty cloud. Awakened Diseases reproduce by infecting a host creature and attaching to its cells, increasing in number as the host’s cells normally grow and reproduce over time. In this way, only a tiny amount of the Awakened Disease needs to infect a host in order to keep the disease spreading. Since it is intelligent, it can choose courses of action and make decisions based on what it perceives around it.