Need Help making a Gun Mage, How do I reload while Dual Wielding?

[D4rkh0rus]

Hey GitP! Reading about the Magus, I stumbled upon the Eldritch Archer Archetype, While it seemed on the outside that it was meant for Bows, I realized that the Class features Don't require bows, just ranged weapons....

Guns are Ranged weapons...

Gunslinger 1/Eldritch Archer Magus 19. Or at least that's the build I had envisioned, Using Ranged Spellstrike and the Two-Weapon Fighting feat chain to get a bunch of pistol attacks.

The problem then becomes, How do I reload these guns?

After researching a bit, I found 3 methods:

Method 1: Gun Twirling. It seems pretty cut and dry, the problem is the amount of feats needed, added to those are the Ranged feats and TWF, and it gets a bit too heavy, meaning this wont come online until much later...

Method 2: Alchemist 2 (Extra Arm). While this one also more or less solves the problem, I find it difficult fitting in 2 levels of Alchemist in the build, not to mention that Having an extra appendage is kinda funky.

Method 3: I read about using the Prehensile Tail ability from Tieflings, With the Grasping Tail Feat, Although I don't really understand how its supposed to work, can someone give me a simple explanation?


Essentially I am trying to find a method that lets me dual wield guns, and reload them too.

Any suggestions?

[raygun goth]

Gunslinger 1/Eldritch Archer Magus 19. Or at least that's the build I had envisioned, Using Ranged Spellstrike and the Two-Weapon Fighting feat chain to get a bunch of pistol attacks.

Spell Combat is a Full-Round Action.
Two-Weapon Fighting is a full attack action.
You can't do both.

[Nibbens]

Hey GitP! Reading about the Magus, I stumbled upon the Eldritch Archer Archetype, While it seemed on the outside that it was meant for Bows, I realized that the Class features Don't require bows, just ranged weapons....

Guns are Ranged weapons...

Gunslinger 1/Eldritch Archer Magus 19. Or at least that's the build I had envisioned, Using Ranged Spellstrike and the Two-Weapon Fighting feat chain to get a bunch of pistol attacks.

The problem then becomes, How do I reload these guns?

After researching a bit, I found 3 methods:

Method 1: Gun Twirling. It seems pretty cut and dry, the problem is the amount of feats needed, added to those are the Ranged feats and TWF, and it gets a bit too heavy, meaning this wont come online until much later...

Method 2: Alchemist 2 (Extra Arm). While this one also more or less solves the problem, I find it difficult fitting in 2 levels of Alchemist in the build, not to mention that Having an extra appendage is kinda funky.

Method 3: I read about using the Prehensile Tail ability from Tieflings, With the Grasping Tail Feat, Although I don't really understand how its supposed to work, can someone give me a simple explanation?


Essentially I am trying to find a method that lets me dual wield guns, and reload them too.

Any suggestions?

Reloading hands (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateCombat/spells/reloadingHands.html)? And it's specifically marked as a Magus spell, so there must be some reason it's there. :P

[SwordChucks]

The prehensile hair hex lets a first level witch reload with thier mustache (or eyebrows or whatever).

Edit: Looking into it further, you might be able to take the hexcrafter archetype with eldritch archer. I don't know if there's a conflict with those two.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Spell Combat is a Full-Round Action.
Two-Weapon Fighting is a full attack action.
You can't do both.
Spell Combat... that's the one that says

As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his melee weapon at a –2 penalty and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this spell also takes this penalty).
right? Ranged Spell Combat removes the clause about needing a free hand, so you should be good to go.

[dascarletm]

Could you pair this with a 1 level dip in Spellslinger?

How would that interact?

[Extra Anchovies]

Vanara and Tieflings with the Prehensile Tail alternate racial trait can carry objects in their tails - it's a swift action to use the tail to retrieve a stowed item, but items already in hand aren't stowed and thus default to the normal free action for swapping which grasping appendages an item is being held by. By passing a gun to their tail, reloading it with the free hand, passing the gun back, and then doing the same with the other gun, both races can firearm TWF with no other build investment (other than the core firearm TWF feats, of course).

[D4rkh0rus]

thank you guys for clarifying stuff!


Vanara and Tieflings with the Prehensile Tail alternate racial trait can carry objects in their tails - it's a swift action to use the tail to retrieve a stowed item, but items already in hand aren't stowed and thus default to the normal free action for swapping which grasping appendages an item is being held by. By passing a gun to their tail, reloading it with the free hand, passing the gun back, and then doing the same with the other gun, both races can firearm TWF with no other build investment (other than the core firearm TWF feats, of course).

Would the Feat Grasping Tail be needed for this, or does this default to the base ability?

[Extra Anchovies]

Would the Feat Grasping Tail be needed for this, or does this default to the base ability?

The alternate race trait is enough on its own, as is the Vanara's default prehensile tail. The Grasping Tail feat only adds more items to the list of eligible Prehensile Tail ART targets (or, for default Tieflings, pretty much just gives them the ART). The ART already states that the tail "can be used to carry items", and since no action type is specified for moving items from tail to hand or vice versa, doing so defaults to the free action used for changing which appendages are holding an object.

The exact sequence for reloading two pistols with two hands and a tail is as follows, broken down into individual free actions:

Start with one empty pistol in each hand, and nothing in the tail.
1. Grab right pistol with tail.
Left pistol is held by left hand. Right pistol is held by right hand and tail.
2. Remove right hand from right pistol.
Left pistol is held by left hand. Right pistol is held by tail. Right hand is free.
3. Use right hand to reload right pistol.
Left pistol is held by left hand. Right pistol is loaded and held by tail. Right hand is free.
4. Grab right pistol with right hand.
Left pistol is held by left hand. Right pistol is loaded and held by right hand and tail.
5. Remove tail from right pistol.
Left pistol is held by left hand. Right pistol is loaded and held by right hand. Tail is free.
Repeat steps 1-5 with left pistol, left hand, and tail.

It might be only one free action to pass an item between two appendages rather than two (i.e. adding the end appendage and removing the starting appendage), but I have a feeling the designers didn't put enough thought into this usually insignificant part of the rules to spell out clearly which was correct.

[D4rkh0rus]

I see, that makes sense.

[Aleolus]

[Joke]Play a female
Take a feat to let you store your extra ammo in your clevage
Name your character Rushuna Tendo
Profit[\joke]