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gtwucla
2016-01-16, 12:26 AM
I would like to replace the wizard bonus feat in pathfinder/3.5 that they gain every 5th level to something at least more interesting and class related than a magicky feat. I don't want to decrease or increase their power level, just come up with something relating to the class. Ideas?

So far all I've come up with is choosing a school and gaining +1 DC. But that steps on the toes of school specialists. And choosing a spell that counts as always prepared.

tsj
2016-01-16, 02:56 AM
It might be overpowered, but what if a wizard could ...

Select a warlock invocation as a feat

If he lost
2 spell slots and 2 spells in his spellbook
of a spell level that is equal to the
spell level of the invocation

Fii
2016-01-16, 04:49 AM
Perhaps improve the number of orisons that he has available at will per day? Something like:

Option A: The wizard may add a rare cantrip (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/rare-cantrips) to his spellbook. In addition, he may prepare 2 additional cantrips each day. These function like any other prepared cantrip, and are not expended upon use.

Option B: The wizard may prepare an extra number of cantrips each day equal to his half his Int mod. These work as normal cantrips, and are not expended upon use.

.. If cantrips aren't really what you're shooting for, perhaps boost Concentration. It's hard to raise- and the DCs can be high.

Segev
2016-01-16, 10:24 AM
Given that "+1 to spell DCs for one school" is already a feat, you probably just want to expand what feats the wizard is allowed to take as bonus feats. Add Spell Penetration and Spell Focus to the list, and probably add the Reserve feats to the list.

gtwucla
2016-01-16, 11:36 PM
I was thinking actually along the lines of the Master Specialist and its School Esoterica ability. Maybe have a bit more subtle tricks and call it a spell trick. Make it a list of the 8 schools with 3 abilities tied to each one and make it so you choose a school and gain the first ability. The second time you are granted a choice you can either choose the second ability of that school or a spell trick from a second school, and so on. So just as an example for Divination the first effect would be something like gain an extra sensory for magical effects and then the second effect (should you so choose) you gain a scry effect when sleeping... something like that.

Segev
2016-01-17, 12:52 AM
I was thinking actually along the lines of the Master Specialist and its School Esoterica ability. Maybe have a bit more subtle tricks and call it a spell trick. Make it a list of the 8 schools with 3 abilities tied to each one and make it so you choose a school and gain the first ability. The second time you are granted a choice you can either choose the second ability of that school or a spell trick from a second school, and so on. So just as an example for Divination the first effect would be something like gain an extra sensory for magical effects and then the second effect (should you so choose) you gain a scry effect when sleeping... something like that.

You might check out the SRD; it has Unearthed Arcana's optional class substitution powers for wizards, one of which is to give up the bonus feats for specialist-related class features.

gtwucla
2016-01-17, 06:12 AM
You might check out the SRD; it has Unearthed Arcana's optional class substitution powers for wizards, one of which is to give up the bonus feats for specialist-related class features.

That's great! Thanks.

Segev
2016-01-17, 02:25 PM
That's great! Thanks.

You're welcome. And, since I'm thinking about it now, here is a link (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm) to the rules in question.

raygun goth
2016-01-17, 11:57 PM
There's also wizard discoveries, which you can find here (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-discoveries).

gtwucla
2016-01-18, 04:24 AM
I went with the initial idea using unearthed arcana's class substitutions as a guideline, but I avoided numerical bonuses and uses per day. I'm pretty happy with what i came up with, but I have to admit, I'm having a hell of a time dreaming up Transmutation effects that aren't either worthless, overpowered, or might as well be a spell. I got nothin.

On a related note, I have a second idea (which I won't use for the wizard, but a wizard like class, which also needs a granted 'bonus feat' replacement). What do you think about this idea:

Sympathetic Magic
When you cast a spell of the chosen school gain this temporary effect for as many rounds as your caster level. Effects compound and persist until as many rounds as your caster level from the last spell cast. (wording is a bit iffy, but the idea is there)

Abjuration: Gain spell resistance = caster level

Conjuration:

Divination: When you cast a spell gain +1 Intelligence

Enchantment:

Evocation: When you cast a spell with a damage type gain resistance to it

Illusion:

Necromancy: Gain frightful presence DC = caster level

Transmutation: When you cast a spell gain 1d8 temporary hit points

Segev
2016-01-18, 11:45 AM
I'd make the Diviniation bonus a bonus to Int- and Wis-based skill checks, because a bonus to a potential casting stat, particularly a stacking one as this seems to be, is way overpowered.

I will point out, just for clarity, that the RAW would interact with your transmutation idea by having each spell add only extra hp in excess of what was left from prior sympathetic transmutation effects. That is, if you cast a transmutation spell in each of rounds 1-3, you might gain 4 temp hp in round one, then roll 6 in round two...and that would only get you a total of 6. If you then lost 5 of them before round 3, then rolled 5 temp hp for your spell in round 3, that'd put you at a total of 5 temp hp. They overlap, since they're from the same source.


For Illusion, how about: Gain Hide in Plain Sight, and a +1 bonus to either Hide or Move Silently

For Conjuration: the ability to make up to 5 ft. of your movement each round be a teleportation effect, not having to cross the intervening space.

Zaydos
2016-01-18, 12:52 PM
Divination I would make a bonus to Int based skill checks over Int itself. Partially because odd ability bonuses are taboo, and partially because half the time it will do nothing and half the time it will be... +1 to save DCs and these "halves" are large enough to cover most or all of a campaign within one on occasion or else still just a very long time of nothing. (I'd normally second Segev's fears about casting stat increases but the duration is temporary enough that really it resolves to just a +1 to save DC which is still big)

Before I give advice on "do X and Y and Z" what power level are you looking for. I mean SR = CL will be almost a non-factor unless you boost your CL a lot. Same with save DC = CL (though at 20th level could get decent with that). Transmutation matters a lot at low levels (unlike those two) but d8 temp hp become inconsequential by 12th I'd say. I mean I figure they're supposed to be pretty minor but how minor are we talking about?

Also when you say compounds do you mean stacks? So if you cast 2 necromancy spells the DC would = twice your class level (ranging from super low to all enemies autofail)?

As for abilities...

I'd say your always prepared one is pretty cool, though really do you mean cast at-will (pretty powerful) or you can cast spontaneously (in which case you'd need to probably let them sac other spells prepared for it).

Switch Image needs a DC, as it's a skill check I'd probably make it a fixed, non-scaling DC. Also is this PF or 3.5?

gtwucla
2016-01-19, 12:07 AM
I'd make the Diviniation bonus a bonus to Int- and Wis-based skill checks, because a bonus to a potential casting stat, particularly a stacking one as this seems to be, is way overpowered.

I will point out, just for clarity, that the RAW would interact with your transmutation idea by having each spell add only extra hp in excess of what was left from prior sympathetic transmutation effects. That is, if you cast a transmutation spell in each of rounds 1-3, you might gain 4 temp hp in round one, then roll 6 in round two...and that would only get you a total of 6. If you then lost 5 of them before round 3, then rolled 5 temp hp for your spell in round 3, that'd put you at a total of 5 temp hp. They overlap, since they're from the same source.


For Illusion, how about: Gain Hide in Plain Sight, and a +1 bonus to either Hide or Move Silently

For Conjuration: the ability to make up to 5 ft. of your movement each round be a teleportation effect, not having to cross the intervening space.

That's exactly what I landed on with Conjuration actually. With the Intelligence bonus, I completely agree, but since its very temporary I was thinking maybe I should just tie it to Reflex if that makes sense. Also Illusion, that could work well. What do you think about making it a straight miss chance?


Divination I would make a bonus to Int based skill checks over Int itself. Partially because odd ability bonuses are taboo, and partially because half the time it will do nothing and half the time it will be... +1 to save DCs and these "halves" are large enough to cover most or all of a campaign within one on occasion or else still just a very long time of nothing. (I'd normally second Segev's fears about casting stat increases but the duration is temporary enough that really it resolves to just a +1 to save DC which is still big)

Before I give advice on "do X and Y and Z" what power level are you looking for. I mean SR = CL will be almost a non-factor unless you boost your CL a lot. Same with save DC = CL (though at 20th level could get decent with that). Transmutation matters a lot at low levels (unlike those two) but d8 temp hp become inconsequential by 12th I'd say. I mean I figure they're supposed to be pretty minor but how minor are we talking about?

Also when you say compounds do you mean stacks? So if you cast 2 necromancy spells the DC would = twice your class level (ranging from super low to all enemies autofail)?

As for abilities...

I'd say your always prepared one is pretty cool, though really do you mean cast at-will (pretty powerful) or you can cast spontaneously (in which case you'd need to probably let them sac other spells prepared for it).

Switch Image needs a DC, as it's a skill check I'd probably make it a fixed, non-scaling DC. Also is this PF or 3.5?

This is for my own thing. It's close enough to 3.5/Pathfinder and it uses Open Game material so it can be treated as such for the most part. There are three things though that may factor in pretty heavily and that is that the probability of the spell caster going last is pretty high (especially at high levels- though there are some ways around it), there are very few numerical bonuses outside ability scores, class abilities, and skill ranks, and last there are very few magical items. So basically what I'm saying is most the numerical bonuses are going to be coming from the class choice (including spells, abilities, and so forth).

I did mean they stack and you're right, the Necromancy effect (and to a lesser, but no less significant Abjuration) does not work- its either too much or not enough. I base it on spell level of the spell cast, but right now this is definitely a challenge to strike a balance. So far this is what i got: it's a temporary effect (1 round per caster level), likely to only last the one encounter and each effect only activates when a spell of that school is cast (and if you have chosen the school- the idea for now is that you get to choose one every 4th level). For example, if you chose Enchantment school, every time you cast a spell from the school of enchantment your bonus to Will saves improves by 1 for as many rounds as your caster level (and each time you cast a spell the timer resets).

The idea behind this is an alchemist. Most people are familiar with the medieval alchemist in pursuit of immortality and wealth, also the scientist-chemist alchemist. What I'm going for is the ancient world idea of an alchemist. They thought that the process was as much for the end product as it was for the change it would bring over themselves. Hence cast a spell, a secondary effect comes over the casting character.

Anyway that's the direction I'm going. This is definitely a very changeable idea. Im in brainstorming mode, big time. It's replacing bonus feats every fifth level, but these guys have level 1-9 spells, so the idea is to find an interesting, but not powerful ability.

gtwucla
2016-01-20, 11:31 PM
So this is the end idea (an alchemist is a wizard, and this replaces bonus feats); they seem to me to balance against each other well as far as choosing which one you want based on power level- thoughts?

Sympathetic Magic (Su): An alchemist is dedicated to his craft, but it is more than a simple study of the arcane. An alchemist treats spellcasting as a part of his being. With time he develops a strong affinity towards the spells he commonly uses. Each time he casts a spell, not only does the spell produce its described effect, it affects him as well.

At level 4 and every 4th level after, an alchemist may choose 1 of the 8 schools of magic. Thereafter, each time he casts a spell from a chosen school, he gains the benefits as described below. The benefits last as many rounds as the alchemist’s caster level. Multiple castings of a spell from the same school of magic result in increasing effects, for example casting a divination spell increases the alchemist’s Reflex save by 1. The second time he casts a divination spell within the duration of effect his Reflex save increases by 1 again (resulting in a bonus of +2). Any time an alchemist casts a spell from a chosen school the duration of any benefits he previously received restarts, lasting 1 round per caster level. Once the duration ends, each effect resets as if it were the first time he cast a spell from a chosen school.

Abjuration: Each time an alchemist casts an abjuration spell he gains a +1 bonus to Will saves.
Conjuration: Each time an alchemist casts a conjuration spell he can appear 10 ft. away. This is a teleportation effect, which occurs automatically once he completes the spell’s casting. Each time he casts a conjuration spell within the duration of effect the distance increases another 10 ft.
Divination: As an alchemist casts divination spells he gains greater insight. Each time he casts a divination spell he gains a +1 bonus to all Intelligence and Wisdom-based skill checks.
Enchantment: Each time an alchemist casts an enchantment spell his words become honeyed and his ruses seem all the more reasonable. He gains a +1 bonus to all Charisma-based skill checks.
Evocation: Each time an alchemist casts an evocation with a damage-type effect he gains resistance to that damage type.
Illusion: Each time an alchemist casts an illusion spell melee and ranged attacks have a miss chance. The miss chance increases by 10% each time he casts an illusion spell.
Necromancy: Each time an alchemist casts a necromancy spell any creature that targets him with a spell or attack incurs a -1 penalty to its Will save.
Transmutation: Each time an alchemist casts a transmutation spell he gains 1d8 temporary hit points.