Looking for some Rougish help!

[SMac8988]

A friend is starting a new campaign and it will be my first true time playing 5e. I have been story telling it for a few months, but have yet to actually sit down and play a character.

So my idea for my character would be a rogue who specializes in interrogation and information gathering possibly even torture. Fighting with possibly two hand cross bows and two sabers.

Was thinking Dark Elf, just to fit towards the dark side of the character, or a tiefling since they are my favorite race since 3.5.

I am thinking we are going level 5, with a buy in of some sort but unsure on that part.

Looking for some other players or DM's who could give me some guidance and stuff on building like this!.

[Mordrigar]

Two level dip into Trickery Cleric gives you a good ability. You can create your own duplicate. Also it adds Charm Person and Disguise Self to your spell list among other useful cleric things!

You can "be friend" anyone with Charm Person. But the spell says, "charmed creatures now they charmed by you." But what if you use Disguise Self? Okay, they know they're charmed by "you" but they don't know who the real "you" are!

Also I think Assassin archetype is the best for Rogues. Because it's damage output is really great. Also with Trickery Cleric's Duplicate ability, you can easily sneak attack your foes. Rogue level 1, gives you expertise. You can choose 2 skills and gain double proficiency bonus. You can choose stealth/perception. Which helps you in and out of combat.

Race: Variant Human (for a free feat of course!)
Class: Rogue 3 / Cleric 2 (of Mask?)
Background: Charlatan (nice skills and useful background)
Proficent Saves: Dexterity, Intelligence

Proficient Skills (1 from Variant Human, 2 from Background, 4 from Rogue = 7 Total)
Deception
Insight
Investigation
Percepion
Persuasion
Sleight of Hand
Stealth

Stats: Okay, you won't shine on this. Because Cleric dip requires 13 wisdom and wisdom is generally a dump stat for Rogue. But don't be unhappy. Because wisdom saving throws are really important. Variant human gives you +1 on 2 ability scores. You can use this on wisdom and make it 14 for a good +2 bonus. This will also help your wisdom saving throws, your daily cleric spells and your perception checks. Also I suggest to take "Resilient" feat for +1 Constution score on 4th class level. Starting with 12 con is not a bad idea for this build because +1 from human and +1 from resilent will give you 14, which is nice. But if you manage to get 14 as a starting point, you'll be happier.

Also, int and cha scores are dump for normal assassin builds but I'm sure you want those high because of wide skill repertoire.

Str is dump.

Dex should be highest, probably 14 or 15. +1 from your human bonus can go here if you're not planning to take Resilient.

[bid]

Proficient Skills (1 from Variant Human, 2 from Background, 4 from Rogue and 2 from Cleric = 9 Total)
Nope. 7 if you start rogue, 6 if you start cleric. MC only gives you the proficiencies listed p164.

Expertise is rogue 1, you might want to use 1 on thieve's tools.

[Mordrigar]

Nope. 7 if you start rogue, 6 if you start cleric. MC only gives you the proficiencies listed p164.

Expertise is rogue 1, you might want to use 1 on thieve's tools.

Ah, of course, I forgot that part, lol. I don't have my book at the moment. I'm fixing it.

[SMac8988]

I haven't ever really played many casters, I tend to lean more toward the martial or half caster classes like Barb or Paladin.

Wasn't planning on muti classing. I feel like the fun that can could be had slicing into someone and using an iron poker to get information, rather than casting spell to make them work with me is more what I was looking for from the character. I want to be that very fine line of bad that can be used for good, and just get concerned with adding the Cleric would make me more reliant on casting things for people to tell me stuff, rather than interrogating and carving my information out of them.

[E’Tallitnics]

Ah, of course, I forgot that part, lol. I don't have my book at the moment. I'm fixing it.

None of them include Saving Throws either.

[E’Tallitnics]

I haven't ever really played many casters, I tend to lean more toward the martial or half caster classes like Barb or Paladin.

Wasn't planning on muti classing. I feel like the fun that can could be had slicing into someone and using an iron poker to get information, rather than casting spell to make them work with me is more what I was looking for from the character. I want to be that very fine line of bad that can be used for good, and just get concerned with adding the Cleric would make me more reliant on casting things for people to tell me stuff, rather than interrogating and carving my information out of them.

Sounds like Mastermind from the SCAG is what you want!

MASTERMIND
Your focus is on people and on the influence and secrets they have. Many spies, courtiers, and schemers follow this archetype, leading lives of intrigue. Words are your weapons as often as knives or poison, and secrets and favors are some of your favorite treasures.

[ZenBear]

Keep in mind that the Rogue class is very flexible. You don't have to be the typical sneaky thief. You're choice of Expertise defines your character most of all. Take Intimidate and Insight for interrogations and use the other choices to define other aspects of your character.

[bid]

So my idea for my character would be a rogue who specializes in interrogation and information gathering possibly even torture. Fighting with possibly two hand cross bows and two sabers.

Was thinking Dark Elf, just to fit towards the dark side of the character, or a tiefling since they are my favorite race since 3.5.
You need a Dex race for rogue, see if you can use feral tiefling from SCAG. I don't recommend drow since your target might be in sunlight too often, but that's fluff between you and the DM.


Arcane trickster 3 gives you access to friends and charm person. High elf or feral tiefling can get you 8 16 14 14 12 12 and you can push Int16 if you want.

Supreme sneak and infiltration expertise will have some value if you pick the other archetypes.


Warlock MC opens up many possibilities:
- friends and charm person (no need for AT),
- hex to gimp their check/initiative,
- fey presence or awakened mind from patron,
- familiar spy with tomelock/chainlock 3 or extra attack with bladelock 5,
- invocations to read all or disguise self.
You should start rogue 2 / warlock 3 as half-elf 8 16 14 10 12 16 with 8 starting skills.
You could also go human with actor feat or go Cha14 with feral tiefling.

[bid]

Ah, of course, I forgot that part, lol. I don't have my book at the moment. I'm fixing it.
Looking good now, thanks for the corrections.

[Corran]

No matter whatt build you decide to go with, you should worship Torog, the crawling god, patron of jailors and torturers. Also pick up intimidation as one of your skills, maybe you will also want to expertise in it if you really want to be an ace at interrogating people.

For information gathering there are many ways you can go about it. I'll just add to what has already been said, that you should consider playing a changeling. Changing your appearance at will can be a huge benefit, and it gets even more useful if your infamous character's cruel nature becomes public.

[SMac8988]

I don't think my dm will allow a ton outside of the core books. I maybe able to sway the primal tiefling, which would be awesome.

I think a portion of the story will be able the group raising a rebellion against a monarch. So I think he will use torture to get information and then send a message by leaving people alive or taking our particular targets.

I feel I may end up MAD, needing Dex, Cha, maybe a but of con since the group has no tank yet. And I feel int maybe needed.

[ZenBear]

Try to add a bit more to your character instead of just being "the torture guy." As far as MAD goes, you don't need to be. Expertise gets you exceptional skills without a need for a high stat mod. DEX is needed for attacks and AC, or you could forgo DEX in favor of STR, pick up Med Armored at 1 vhuman, Heavy Armored at 4 and not waste time sneaking around. Especially effective as a Swashbuckler with short swords or scimitars. Either way, develop a few more dimensions to your character.

[SMac8988]

Try to add a bit more to your character instead of just being "the torture guy." As far as MAD goes, you don't need to be. Expertise gets you exceptional skills without a need for a high stat mod. DEX is needed for attacks and AC, or you could forgo DEX in favor of STR, pick up Med Armored at 1 vhuman, Heavy Armored at 4 and not waste time sneaking around. Especially effective as a Swashbuckler with short swords or scimitars. Either way, develop a few more dimensions to your character.

The character is designed to be a father fighting for revenge and to get his daughter back. Basically I was thinking lawful evil, willing to do anything to further his cause and to find her.

He will have been a torturer, which is why I was looking for a way to make sure he was really good at it, then he will evolve more as time goes on. He will most likely be the face of the group and help to form the revolution.

I haven't played a rogue before, so I am kinda unsure on a lot of their stuff and how to build this character as I want.

[ZenBear]

The character is designed to be a father fighting for revenge and to get his daughter back. Basically I was thinking lawful evil, willing to do anything to further his cause and to find her.

He will have been a torturer, which is why I was looking for a way to make sure he was really good at it, then he will evolve more as time goes on. He will most likely be the face of the group and help to form the revolution.

I haven't played a rogue before, so I am kinda unsure on a lot of their stuff and how to build this character as I want.

Ok cool! So DEX/CHA most likely (STR still an option if you're ok with the Feat investment), Mastermind or Assassin seem like good fits (Swashbuckler still an option as well, especially if he was ever a sailor/pirate), and eventually you will want Inspiring Leader when you go full revolutionary. As you level you may want to take Expertise in Persuasion/Deception.

You get 6 ASIs, so you have flexibility with Feats, and the only stat you really need to pump is your primary attack stat. If DEX, you want 20 to have a respectable AC. If STR, you can get away with 18 and score an extra Feat. CHA is only important if your Archetype needs it, Expertise will be sufficient for skill checks.

[SMac8988]

Ok cool! So DEX/CHA most likely (STR still an option if you're ok with the Feat investment), Mastermind or Assassin seem like good fits (Swashbuckler still an option as well, especially if he was ever a sailor/pirate), and eventually you will want Inspiring Leader when you go full revolutionary. As you level you may want to take Expertise in Persuasion/Deception.

You get 6 ASIs, so you have flexibility with Feats, and the only stat you really need to pump is your primary attack stat. If DEX, you want 20 to have a respectable AC. If STR, you can get away with 18 and score an extra Feat. CHA is only important if your Archetype needs it, Expertise will be sufficient for skill checks.

Awesome thank you so much. I am looking over as much as I can while at well. Torture goes for roles as a intimidation right? I couldn't really figure that one out

[ZenBear]

Awesome thank you so much. I am looking over as much as I can while at well. Torture goes for roles as a intimidation right? I couldn't really figure that one out

Talk to your DM about it. I would rule it as an Intimidate check with ever-increasing penalties on Wisdom saving throws as the process goes on. Insight to tell if they are lying when they inevitably break down. There are no official rules for torture in 5e as far as I know.

[SMac8988]

Ok cool. How would Muti Classing into warlock be? Go bladelock after getting assassinate? Just curious?

[ZenBear]

Ok cool. How would Muti Classing into warlock be? Go bladelock after getting assassinate? Just curious?

A dip in Warlock is always useful if you have the stats. Devil's Sight alone is exceptionally powerful, especially when combined with the Darkness spell. There are plenty of options when it comes to a Warlock dip, and I'm not familiar enough with the Warlock class to confidently advise which would fit best. The most important questions would be why is your character making the Pact? When did you come in contact with the Patron? What demands will your Patron make of you in return for your powers?

[solidork]

Things to consider:
-Make sure your DM and party are fine with your character being evil and torturing people. If your character doesn't match the intended tone of the campaign and if the other characters don't want to work with your character then you have a problem. Also, there is a difference between saying "I torture him" and going into extreme detail exactly how you torture someone.
-Don't feel like you have to multiclass.
-Using two hand crossbows isn't a thing. You can't load them, even with the Crossbow Expert feat. That being said, with Crossbow Expert you can still make 2 attacks with a single Hand Crossbow.

[SMac8988]

Really you can't fire them each, then like drop one? Or something? And I need to check with the group, cause the dm is cool with it, players ill ask.

I am just bouncing the idea around. I want to try a rouge and felt this could be a cool, dark character

[ZenBear]

Really you can't fire them each, then like drop one? Or something? And I need to check with the group, cause the dm is cool with it, players ill ask.

I am just bouncing the idea around. I want to try a rouge and felt this could be a cool, dark character

You could, but then you're back to 1 hand crossbow. Ask your DM about maybe having wrist straps for them or clips for repeating hand crossbows. Otherwise just stick with one; it's better anyway cause then you only need one magic weapon instead of two, plus a free hand for spells, object interaction, etc.

[SMac8988]

True true. Sadly I may have up put this character on hold. Our group has requested Mr to play a tank/melee dps. So totem barb is in my future!

[ZenBear]

Or you could build the heavy armor swashbuckler I talked about! :smallbiggrin:

If you don't mind multiclassing, take Fighter 1 for TWF style and armor proficiency, Sentinel at 1 or 4.

[SMac8988]

Or you could build the heavy armor swashbuckler I talked about! :smallbiggrin:

If you don't mind multiclassing, take Fighter 1 for TWF style and armor proficiency, Sentinel at 1 or 4.

Lol maybe... I would have to see. We just added two players to the group, So I may get to change again now.