3.5 Archery Build

[Nerdguy88]

I recently posted about building an up close martial character. This is for a campaign that has everyone using Fighter, Barbarian, Rogue, Ranger. So not a high tier list game class wise. I started thinking about playing an archer instead of a front liner. Here was the idea I had so far. I will edit this post things are posted.

Race: Human
Level 1 attributes
Str 19
Dex 20
Con 18
Int 16
Wis 17
Cha 15

Level 20
Fighter 5/Deepwood Sniper 10/Cragtop Archer 5

The two prestige classes are in no particular order. Deepwood would be taken at 6th level for the +6 base attack bonus. From there it could go either through leveling. With farshot this puts his Composite Longbow(Dragonbone) range at 345ft, can go up to 15 range increments instead of 10, and only takes -1 per range increment. He could shoot 5,175 ft and only take -15. If I took the Woodland Archer feat I get +4 to attacks for each miss in that round. Which would negate some of the range penalty at later levels with multiple attacks.

What feats should I be getting in order to maximize this build?

Edit: Forgot to include that magic is almost non-existent in this campaign.

[Venger]

My condolences.

As ever, Piggy Knowles's Archery Handbook (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?284283-Piggy-Knowles-Archer-Build-Thread) is a valuable resource for your basics on archery.

[Nerdguy88]

My condolences.

As ever, Piggy Knowles's Archery Handbook (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?284283-Piggy-Knowles-Archer-Build-Thread) is a valuable resource for your basics on archery.

Sadly the only part of the post that comes close is The Murderous Sniper. Like I said magic is non-existent. Pretty much all of the builds had magic/psionics.

[AvatarVecna]

If range is absolutely necessary to your build, I'm afraid I can't help you. However, if you're fine getting up close and personal, a Swift Hunter build can serve you well, even in a low-magic game.

[Venger]

If range is absolutely necessary to your build, I'm afraid I can't help you. However, if you're fine getting up close and personal, a Swift Hunter build can serve you well, even in a low-magic game.

also definitely true

dictum mortum (http://dictummortuum.blogspot.com/2011/09/swift-hunters-handbook.html) helpfully explains everything you need to know about that kind of build.

[Darrin]

Fighter 5 is a dead level that doesn't offer any class features or bonus feats. You can get a bit more bang for your buck in the early levels with some multiclassing:

1) Ranger 1. Feat: PB Shot. Human: Precise Shot. Bonus: Track -> Trap Expert ACF (Dungeonscape).
2) Ranger 2. Bonus: Rapid Shot.
3) Fighter 1. Feat: Mountain Warrior. Bonus: Weapon Focus Longbow.
4) Fighter 2. Bonus: Far Shot.
5) Barbarian 1. Whirling Frenzy ACF (Unearthed Arcana). Consider Ape Totem for a climb speed.
6) Deepwood Sniper 1. Feat: Manyshot.
7) Deepwood Sniper 2.
8) Cragtop Archer 1.
9) Cragtop Archer 2. Feat: Improved Rapid Shot (Complete Warrior).
10) Cragtop Archer 3.
11) Cragtop Archer 4.
12) Cragtop Archer 5. Feat: Woodland Archer (Races of the Wild)
13) Deepwood Sniper 3.
14) Deepwood Sniper 4.
15) Deepwood Sniper 5. Feat: Plunging Shot (Races of the Wild)
16) Deepwood Sniper 6.
17) Deepwood Sniper 7.
18) Deepwood Sniper 8. Feat: Improved Precise Shot.
19) Deepwood Sniper 9.
20) Deepwood Sniper 10.

The increased range increments are unlikely to matter all that much in a typical game. I will give you a dollar if your DM ever actually starts a combat with your enemies greater than 300' away.

[sleepyphoenixx]

There's little point in increasing your range for most games, because few fights will even get outside the first range increment of a normal composite longbow.
Cragtop Archer doesn't actually add anything else of worth (and costs a ****ty feat), so there's no reason to take it.

Similarly you won't get much out of the last 3 levels of Deepwood Sniper. You'll never be using Take Aim, rerolling your attacks is available as a weapon enhancement and 10% concealment reduction and True Strike 1/day are not worth 3 levels.

Instead i suggest getting 3 levels of Peerless Archer (SM) for Power Shot. You can get up to 8 to threaten with a bow, but i'd only suggest it if you have nothing else to spend levels on.
The best option would actually be taking levels of Crusader, since some of the maneuvers work well with a bow. I assume it's not allowed in this game though.

[Nerdguy88]

Fighter 5 is a dead level that doesn't offer any class features or bonus feats. You can get a bit more bang for your buck in the early levels with some multiclassing:

1) Ranger 1. Feat: PB Shot. Human: Precise Shot. Bonus: Track -> Trap Expert ACF (Dungeonscape).
2) Ranger 2. Bonus: Rapid Shot.
3) Fighter 1. Feat: Mountain Warrior. Bonus: Weapon Focus Longbow.
4) Fighter 2. Bonus: Far Shot.
5) Barbarian 1. Whirling Frenzy ACF (Unearthed Arcana). Consider Ape Totem for a climb speed.
6) Deepwood Sniper 1. Feat: Manyshot.
7) Deepwood Sniper 2.
8) Cragtop Archer 1.
9) Cragtop Archer 2. Feat: Improved Rapid Shot (Complete Warrior).
10) Cragtop Archer 3.
11) Cragtop Archer 4.
12) Cragtop Archer 5. Feat: Woodland Archer (Races of the Wild)
13) Deepwood Sniper 3.
14) Deepwood Sniper 4.
15) Deepwood Sniper 5. Feat: Plunging Shot (Races of the Wild)
16) Deepwood Sniper 6.
17) Deepwood Sniper 7.
18) Deepwood Sniper 8. Feat: Improved Precise Shot.
19) Deepwood Sniper 9.
20) Deepwood Sniper 10.

The increased range increments are unlikely to matter all that much in a typical game. I will give you a dollar if your DM ever actually starts a combat with your enemies greater than 300' away.

Oh this is very good! I really like this build actually. I am a little nervous taking that many classes though. I multiclassed ONCE and had a great backstory why to and I still got the "really" look when I showed my character to the DM. It wasn't even anything crazy.

The range actually will matter in this campaign. A lot of open fields and sky battles. MANY things flying around in the air.

[Darrin]

I am a little nervous taking that many classes though. I multiclassed ONCE and had a great backstory why to and I still got the "really" look when I showed my character to the DM. It wasn't even anything crazy.


The Barbarian is there for Whirling Frenzy, which replaces your rage with a Str/Dex buff and an extra attack. The text in Unearthed Arcana doesn't specify melee attacks, so it can be used with ranged attacks. However, it doesn't last long and you only get it 1/day unless you take the Extra Rage feat.

Ranger 3/Fighter 2 might work if the DM gets his panties in a bunch over excessive dipping.

Cragtop Archer and Plunging Shot get a lot better if you can fly. Is Dragonborn of Bahamut available? There are some quirks to it that let you keep your human bonus feat. Or consider Raptoran.

[lkwpeter]

Fighter 5 is a dead level that doesn't offer any class features or bonus feats. You can get a bit more bang for your buck in the early levels with some multiclassing:

1) Ranger 1. Feat: PB Shot. Human: Precise Shot. Bonus: Track -> Trap Expert ACF (Dungeonscape).
2) Ranger 2. Bonus: Rapid Shot.
3) Fighter 1. Feat: Mountain Warrior. Bonus: Weapon Focus Longbow.
4) Fighter 2. Bonus: Far Shot.
5) Barbarian 1. Whirling Frenzy ACF (Unearthed Arcana). Consider Ape Totem for a climb speed.
6) Deepwood Sniper 1. Feat: Manyshot.
7) Deepwood Sniper 2.
8) Cragtop Archer 1.
9) Cragtop Archer 2. Feat: Improved Rapid Shot (Complete Warrior).
10) Cragtop Archer 3.
11) Cragtop Archer 4.
12) Cragtop Archer 5. Feat: Woodland Archer (Races of the Wild)
13) Deepwood Sniper 3.
14) Deepwood Sniper 4.
15) Deepwood Sniper 5. Feat: Plunging Shot (Races of the Wild)
16) Deepwood Sniper 6.
17) Deepwood Sniper 7.
18) Deepwood Sniper 8. Feat: Improved Precise Shot.
19) Deepwood Sniper 9.
20) Deepwood Sniper 10.

The increased range increments are unlikely to matter all that much in a typical game. I will give you a dollar if your DM ever actually starts a combat with your enemies greater than 300' away.

This one looks nice. Go for it!

[LTwerewolf]

I am a little nervous taking that many classes though. I multiclassed ONCE and had a great backstory why to and I still got the "really" look when I showed my character to the DM. It wasn't even anything crazy.

Different classes don't mean you have to have a justification for every part of them. You're multiclassing that much because it fits the concept and there's no one class that by itself fits what you're trying to do. Don't get caught in the common problem of archetypes being locked to classes. Those classes combined simply say "wilderness archer."

[AvatarVecna]

Oh this is very good! I really like this build actually. I am a little nervous taking that many classes though. I multiclassed ONCE and had a great backstory why to and I still got the "really" look when I showed my character to the DM. It wasn't even anything crazy.

The range actually will matter in this campaign. A lot of open fields and sky battles. MANY things flying around in the air.

1. This is why, when I multiclass, I'm building a character as a "class" that doesn't exist. I'm not playing a Monk/Paladin, I'm playing Samurai Jack, and that's the best way to build him! I'm not playing an Alchemist/Barbarian/Master Chemyst, I'm playing the Incredible Hulk. Beyond something like that (where the classes are chosen to make the build fit the theme), choosing classes that are very similar helps a lot. This is one of the reasons I like the Swift Hunter build: the archery version just needs levels of Scout and Ranger to work out, and those classes are basically two sides of the same coin (one focuses a bit more on combat, while the other focuses a bit more on skills).

2. The Greatbow from Complete Warrior has a base range increment of 130 ft; the dragonbone special material (from Draconomicon) adds 20 ft to the range increment; the feat Ranged Weapon Mastery also adds 20 ft to the range increment. The feat Far Shot multiplies this range increment by 1.5, and the Distance Weapon Enchantment doubles it. Using all of these together, you get a range increment of 510 ft. Swiftwing Arrows (from Races of the Wild) halve your penalties from range...but that's not the best option for reducing penalties at this point; if you can get your hands on either a wand of or a continuous item of Guided Shot, you'll be able to get most of your attacks at no penalty for range (although you still are limited to your maximum range of 10 range increments). Yes, this means you can basically hit somebody from a mile away without penalty.

There's better range builds out there (I think Tippy's made one that has a range measuring in dozens of miles, but it might be more than that). There's somebody with an Archery Handbook around here that should prove useful.

[thethird]

I have played that kind of character before and while it's fun to play if you don't have a party to worry about or your party for some reason likes to sit it's not fun in most games.

If you are using your build, i.e. striking from really far away your party is (most of the time) not doing anything relevant in combat or so far away as to not be really your party. If you are with your party when attacked well then what's the point on having such range?