Walker in the Waste capstone Dry Lich do you get the level adjustment or no?

[Zephonim]

Archivist 3/Walker in the Waste

So Dread Necromancers and Dragon Disciples both do not pay for their capstone templates level adjustment do I have to pay the level adjustment for Walker in the Waste? When I am level 13 I will be able to be a Walker in the Waste and I am debating if i I should just neglect getting the 10th level of Walking and just getting more levels in Archivist before getting my capstone because I want to have a decent array of spells before I can't get any new spells or get new spell slots for 5 levels

I suppose it depends on my GM as well but I want to have some evidence about this.

I've heard varying people say that no you don't get the level adjustment because you took the 10 levels in Walker and lost 2 caster levels

[Zanos]

The RAI argument is that you don't take the LA because you paid for it with the PrC. The RAW is that a Dry Lich has a level adjustment, and you are a Dry Lich.

[Draconium]

Technically, by RAW, I believe you do. But you also take the LA for Dragon Disciple by RAW too, because RAW is really stupid sometimes. In my experience, most DMs aren't actually going to make you take the LA, but I would talk to your DM if you're planning on it anyways, just to make sure.

[Zephonim]

Technically, by RAW, I believe you do. But you also take the LA for Dragon Disciple by RAW too, because RAW is really stupid sometimes. In my experience, most DMs aren't actually going to make you take the LA, but I would talk to your DM if you're planning on it anyways, just to make sure.

I heard there was a Sage Advice that said you don't take the LA is that true?

[Troacctid]

It's unclear what the intent is, but the text as written definitely does not protect you from the template's level adjustment. If you choose to become a dry lich, then, by the RAW, you have to eat the LA.

Considering that Walker in the Waste is the only known way to become a dry lich, I'm not sure when else the level adjustment is supposed to apply, if it doesn't apply to Walkers in the Waste.

[Draconium]

I heard there was a Sage Advice that said you don't take the LA is that true?

No clue, but I don't think that Sage Advice is RAW anyways. Though if there is, it'd be a nice use for a RAI argument.

[Zancloufer]

It is worth noting (IIRC) that Dry Lich can ONLY be obtained by taking all 10 levels of the Prc and it still has a LA attached to it.

For the more specific cases. Dragon Disciple isn't the only way to be a half-dragon. Also it's not a class feature tacked on at the end, every single class feature (except the 7 bonus spells per day) are smaller parts of the half-dragon template. If you stopped at level 9 you would have most of the benefits of being half dragon. Not to mention if you where a half dragon and took 7 HD of dragon racial HD you would be almost as good as 10 levels of Dragon Disciple. So in that case you "pay" for the LA by taking 10 levels in a sub-par class.

For Dread Necromancer it's a level 20 Capstone. For many games level past 20 means nothing so it's debatable about LA.

[Blackhawk748]

I never force it. I mean you just ate 10 levels of an otherwise mediocre PrC, im not gonna hand out LA for that.

[Draconium]

Another reason that most DMs don't bother with the Dry Lich's LA - gaining LA mid-game is a pain. It jumps your ECL way farther ahead of the rest of the party's, and usually doesn't give you enough benefits to keep up with the party as they get closer to your new ECL. The easiest way around this is through Savage Progressions, but even that isn't very good, because you're still taking the LA.

If your DM's really worried about giving you the template, I would try something like this - when you become a Dry Lich, you take a minor penalty to some of your stats, skills, or rolls, a penalty that slowly goes away until it vanishes at ECL 18, which the LA would normally put you at. The penalty shouldn't be something that makes your character significantly worse, or causes them to lag behind of the rest of the party, but it should still be something you really feel, so that you have a reason to level up and get rid of it. Fluff it as you still getting used to your undead body or something, and you're good to go.

Of course, Dry Lich isn't really that much more powerful, barring the Cha to HP (you're a non-Cha based caster anyways), free resurrection (that takes a really long time anyways), and various undead immunities. I wouldn't even worry about it as a DM.

[daremetoidareyo]

I wouldn't even worry about it as a DM.

Me either. Being a lich isn't that big a deal.

[Blackhawk748]

Me either. Being a lich isn't that big a deal.

Even a normal one, as you gotta be at least lvl 11 and have to do some crazy ritual, which if done right was hard. So you earned that right. Plus its really cool.