[3.5] Help me build a core-only character

[Mikalo]

I've been visiting this site for a long long time but I never dared to post something, mainly because english is not my main language. So yah this is my first post and I don't even know if I'm posting in the right place hahaha
Anyway, long story short, an old friend of mine decided to master a new game (Return to the temple of elemental evil - which he claims the be the best quest ever created) and we'll start at level 4. I have created my first character, something like 10 pages of background and I had to rewrite everything because true neutral is not allowed and he called me a powerplayer (which I'm not) so after a bit of confusion I tried to calm myself and create another character, lawful good this time and 13 pages of background. The build was nothing special, just a normal cleric but he called me powerplayer again. Why? Because I had some non core feats...but he stated that we could use everything. So third try now, I'm not going to write another bg and NO I can't leave the group so I decided to play something silly and underpowered but with core only stuff, I know there are ways to break the game even with core stuff but he's able to ban core rules, feats and classes. So can anyone help me create something? Anything really, we play with a 36 point buy

[ComaVision]

You have far more patience than I do. There's really not any advice we can give, since we have no idea what arbitrary boundaries your DM has set.

[Mikalo]

He said everything 3.5 but no Dragon Magazine and Flaws and the best restriction (my favorite hahaha) NO english stuff. So if we want to play with the ToB for example we have to translate the entire book ourselves hahaha
I decided to stay core only for making things easier, anything goes

[dascarletm]

Dwarf Fighter 4, use a great-weapon of your choice

Feats:
1. Weapon Focus
1. Power Attack
2. Cleave
3. Improved Sunder
4. Great Cleave

[gorfnab]

For a fun Core only build I recommend the Horizon Tripper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?80415-The-Horizon-Tripper-%28Core-Melee-Build%29).

[Eldariel]

Just play a Bard or some caster force multiplier with nothing special in the build and help your teammates do stuff. Generally never gets complaints.

[ComaVision]

For a fun Core only build I recommend the Horizon Tripper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?80415-The-Horizon-Tripper-%28Core-Melee-Build%29).

You damn powerplayer, that's a functional build!

[Mikalo]

It looks like fun haha at this point I'm trying to think at the best way to mock him

[eggynack]

This situation, as you have put it, seems an untenable one. Your DM essentially has an invisible ban list. What I'd recommend is demanding that the ban list be made visible, with the condition that anything that is not on it is allowed. If he insists that there is no ban list, then say that that means that neither of your first two characters should be banned, and that you'll therefore play one of them.

[dascarletm]

It looks like fun haha at this point I'm trying to think at the best way to mock him

Actually you should just play the most useless character ever. Really role-play it up. Think Morty from Rick and Morty if you've seen that show. I'll go fighter again

Halfling Fighter 4
Feats:
1. Endurance
1. Blind-Fight
2. Improved Initiative
3. Die Hard
4. Dodge

Take only feats that are passive defenses, and run around during combat saying things like.
"Gee guys I don't know about this. I think maybe we should just run."
"Oh, no! It's all over!"

Write a backstory on why you have to be with them even if you don't want to be.


This situation, as you have put it, seems an untenable one. Your DM essentially has an invisible ban list. What I'd recommend is demanding that the ban list be made visible, with the condition that anything that is not on it is allowed. If he insists that there is no ban list, then say that that means that neither of your first two characters should be banned, and that you'll therefore play one of them.

I mean if you think rational thinking and reasoning will work with someone like this...

I don't think demanding anything from the DM will lead anywhere, if he/she is the type of person I'm thinking about.

I could be wrong.

[Mikalo]

I just got a message from him because I asked what I can use from the core book, he replied "We'll see while we play" so I'm really tempted by that halfling hahaha or a female half orc?

[eggynack]

I mean if you think rational thinking and reasoning will work with someone like this...
Well, you're not reasoning them out of their views so much as taking a perfectly reasonable stance and letting the chips fall where they may.


I don't think demanding anything from the DM will lead anywhere, if he/she is the type of person I'm thinking about.

It depends quite a bit on why the OP can't not game with this person. Like, does the DM need him, or does he need the DM? Can't tell from context. Either way, only reason my advice isn't to run away from the guy that flushed 23 pages of backstory down the toilet on a whim is because it's explicitly not an option.

[dascarletm]

Oh I agree. I'd totally leave that game, even if my own wife was running it.:smalltongue:

I am in a situation like that though, thankfully the DM isn't terrible, but I can't leave that game (it would cause more trouble than it is worth playing). My solution is that I play something I don't particularly invest myself in. Just have fun roleplaying something silly/dumb.

[Aegis013]

I just got a message from him because I asked what I can use from the core book, he replied "We'll see while we play" so I'm really tempted by that halfling hahaha or a female half orc?

I'm not saying you should do this, but for me, if it is a group I can't leave, this is something I would consider doing:

Take a blank character sheet with no background and when asked anything about your character tell the DM "You tell me." If they ask why explain you can't play a game when you don't know what the game is and the rules aren't available since you can't read the DM's mind.

(I've had DMs who didn't like my level of system mastery build my characters for me before, and while they were entirely incompetent characters, they were fun comedy characters, and nobody blamed me for failing to contribute since I didn't make the character)

[ComaVision]

(I've had DMs who didn't like my level of system mastery build my characters for me before, and while they were entirely incompetent characters, they were fun comedy characters, and nobody blamed me for failing to contribute since I didn't make the character)

Yeah, you may as well have your DM build your character, OP. It sounds like he's only interested in playing with himself anyway. Any one want to start a betting pool about how many DMPCs there are going to be?

[Mikalo]

He even said "You are all going to die at least 4 times" so I'm just going with something really really silly, I hope my other friends won't be mad at me

[Aleolus]

Technically, from the first post, the second character wasn't banned, the op was just called a powergamer for it.

Personally, I would go for a character with really high survivability after that last comment. Something along the lines of "Oh yeah? We'll see about that."

[Shnigda]

Personally, I would go for a character with really high survivability after that last comment. Something along the lines of "Oh yeah? We'll see about that."

Sounds like the GM is the kind of guy who would specifically target that character as soon as he realised they were more likely to survive, just to prove that the GM rules all...

For OP, personally I would just play something that seemed normal (and thus likely to pass the GM's veto) until they were in a sticky situation. Then they bust out some awesome combo thing and ruin the GM's day

[eggynack]

For OP, personally I would just play something that seemed normal (and thus likely to pass the GM's veto) until they were in a sticky situation. Then they bust out some awesome combo thing and ruin the GM's day
A bog standard caster, likely cleric or druid, would be quite good at that. Take any arbitrary assortment of feats in the former case, and any arbitrary assortment that includes natural spell in the latter case, and put together any quantity of power you like from all the spells in existence. It seems possible, after all, that the DM's gaze is focused squarely on build elements rather than day to day stuff.

[Mikalo]

For OP, personally I would just play something that seemed normal (and thus likely to pass the GM's veto) until they were in a sticky situation. Then they bust out some awesome combo thing and ruin the GM's day

Sound like a good plan but is there any way to accomplish something like this with "normal looking feats" or builds?

edit: swordsaged

[eggynack]

Sound like a good plan but is there any way to accomplish something like this with "normal looking feats" or builds?
Yep. Druid. Do anything, be awesome. Check out my fancy handbook for spell list stuff. You could put together a very powerful spell list, get the entire thing banned, and come back the next day with an also very powerful spell list. You could prepare detect poison in all of your slots, take natural spell along with a pile of instances of toughness and pointless skill focuses, and make your animal companion an ordinary dog, while you are simultaneously also a dog, and still overpower the rest of the party. Such is the way of the druid,

[Mikalo]

I'm sold then

[LTwerewolf]

Monk with nothing but metamagic feats. Many metamagic feats don't have requirements, and many have "another metamagic feat" as a requirement. The subheading on metamagic explains how to use them, but doesn't say you require any type of spellcasting to do so.

Alternatively, truenamer with the above, with no ranks in truename. Also do not buy food nor water, but instead spend your money on stuffed animals and bags in which to carry them around.


I am not actually advocating you do those things, it's just that's about the level of character your dm wants to see. Pose the question why you're not allowed to have characters that are actually good at things, then muse that this must be the reason he expects everyone to die 3-4 times, because competent characters wouldn't.


Your dm clearly has a different idea about the game than you. You're writing pages and pages of backstory, which the dm ignores and thinks of characters as stats on a page. Can you explain why you are obligated to game with them? Are you being threatened? Blink once for yes, twice for double yes.

[eggynack]

I'm sold then
Alrighty. Guess that kinda works. I mean, if you go all out, you're likely to actually break the game, but at least you wind up with a build that can be modified by DM intervention without losing its juice.

[dextercorvia]

I had a joke campaign a while back where I rolled a Monk named Benedict <Redacted>.

I took the monk class from the phb, but he was a western Friar Tuck style monk. His primary concern was brewing beer, which he was quite good at for a 1st level character. I refluffed the Sleeping Tiger combat style (unearthed arcana) as Drunken Reindeer. He was worthless in combat, his skills were Craft(Beer), Perform (Gregorian Chant), Profession (Scribe), and Knowledge (Religion). When we happened across the quest giving NPC (who was holding up a sign at a town fair) he ignored the quest as too dangerous -- something only a crazy adventurer would do, but offered to redesign the sign (using his scribe skills) to better attract suitable help.

[GreyBlack]

Play a Kobold Paladin with maximized ranks in Knowledge (Religion) and Skill Focus (Knowledge (Religion)). Summon Pazuzu. Wish for a Candle of Invocation. Summon a Sarrukh. Force it to grant you Bestow Ability. Profit.

[Mikalo]

Your dm clearly has a different idea about the game than you. You're writing pages and pages of backstory, which the dm ignores and thinks of characters as stats on a page. Can you explain why you are obligated to game with them? Are you being threatened? Blink once for yes, twice for double yes.

Ok I'll tell you, prepare to laugh. I asked him to be the master. He was our old master and the person who introduced us to the game and I thought it was going to be fun to play with him again, wrong decision I know hahaha but now he's all set and I dont feel like to stop the entire thing before playing at least the first session. If he is that bad and we all agree that we are bored I'll propose myself as master, my original role in truth but I wanted to try and be a player again.
Life is hard hahaha

[Aegis013]

Ok I'll tell you, prepare to laugh. I asked him to be the master. He was our old master and the person who introduced us to the game and I thought it was going to be fun to play with him again, wrong decision I know hahaha but now he's all set and I dont feel like to stop the entire thing before playing at least the first session. If he is that bad and we all agree that we are bored I'll propose myself as master, my original role in truth but I wanted to try and be a player again.
Life is hard hahaha

As a fellow forever DM, I can relate.

[PaucaTerrorem]

Strength based bard. All feats into tripping and disarming.

[Andezzar]

I just got a message from him because I asked what I can use from the core book, he replied "We'll see while we play" so I'm really tempted by that halfling hahaha or a female half orc?If you want to be a "jerk", play a T1 caster, take no feats that impact spellcasting and play competently. When that makes you trivialize the probably easy encounters, volunteer to DM yourself.
If you want to be nice play a god wizard. No one would object to a character helping the group to succeed. If someone has an outrageous claim that you do not pull your weight because you do not kill enough yourself, withdraw your support the next challenging or worse encounter.

Seriously though, find a new group or DM for that group. I doubt you will be happy. At the very least don't let yourself be pushed around by arbitrary rules that you cannot even know beforehand.

[Mikalo]

I decided to go with a female desert half-orc Sorceress. He said I'm obbligated to write a bg because "This is a serious quest" so I'll write about my character being a prostitute and her magic talent used to satisfy her clients (I'll focus on Conjuration so Grease everywhere) but one day she "seriously" decided to save the world because...yes.

Yeah I am that mad and no I really can't leave the group or say the dm to leave the work to me. At least not now

[ericgrau]

Useful yet thematic (kinky) spell list:
0: Daze, ghost sound, mage hand, message, open/close, prestidigitation
1: Grease, unseen servant, silent image.
2: Levitate.
Daze is a good crossbow alternative against humanoids. Message is good for party communication. Levitate is amazing for saving allies, saving yourself, grabbing plot objects, and getting past dungeon challenges. I'm hoping the utility of the rest is self apparent.

Thematic Equipment (4,800 gp):
(2,000 gp) Handy haversack
(300 gp) 2x elixer of love (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#elixirofLove)
(600 gp) 2x bird feather token (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bird) (long distance messenger)
(900 gp) gray bag of tricks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bagofTricks). Sacrificial animals, plus they can do any tricks in the handle animal skill so unlike a mere summoning spell you can make them go, come, stay, etc.
(1,000 gp) 2x whip feather token (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#whip). Superb grappling combatant for winning tough fights.

Thematic mundane equipment (140+ gp):
Lots of oil
(10 gp) Silk Rope (+2 use rope, 4 HP, DC 24 strength)
(130 gp) Masterwork Manacles with good lock (DC 35 escape artist, DC 28 strength, hardness 10, 10 HP, DC 30 open lock)


Scrolls (375 gp):
3x alarm, 3x hold portal, 5x mount, 3x disguise self, 1x animate rope.
Likewise thematic. You can get creative by summoning sacrificial mounts. Heavy, lots of hp.

Still missing: food, water and other basic gear. Melee weapon, ranged weapon, ammo.

[Mikalo]

I love you hahaha thanks for the list