Dragonball in the Playground OOC III

[cavalieredraghi]

This feeform game/universe is a spiritual successor to NarutoITP, BleachITP and RailITP games. It is an alternate continuity of the Dragon Ball universe created by Akira Toriyama that started out as "What if the Nameless Namekian never arrived on Earth?" and has since set on its own tracks.

Specifically, the main events of the game take place around the time when Namek is undergoing its great disaster - Years 261 to 431 according to DB calendar (http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Dragon_Ball_timeline); In real life terms, comparable from 1500s to 1700s. Rather than a Namekian arriving on Earth and becoming Kami's apprentive, we've had a motley crew of space aliens and time-travellers running afoul of the current Kami and several other things.

To wit, the game being set in the past means a number of things:


Majority of canon characters have not been born, and they're not intended to be major players in the game.
Frieza has not been born yet, the empire of Frost Demons does not yet rule the galaxy, and planet Vegeta (http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Planet_Vegeta) (still known as Plant) still exists. Planet Plant is inhabited by Tuffles. (http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Tuffle)
Saiyans exists, but they are non-spacefaring alien hilllbillies living in the boondocks of Plant and space.
Earth's technology level is pre-industrial, with some exceptions.
Capsule Corporation and the Briefs family obviously don't exist, but if someone wants to play their spiritual (or actual!) ancestors, that's fine by me.
King Yenma exists as does King Kai, and the afterlife is intended to be the same as in canon. Both have made onscreen appearances.
Fortuneteller Baba exists and has made an appearance.
Mr. Popo may or may not exist.
If someone wants to play the mentioned four characters (Yenma, Baba, Kai or Popo), that's okay by me.
Majin Buu, Dabura, Beerus, Kaioshin etc. exists and some of the time-travelling characters have referred to them, but they've not made onscreen appearances and I'd prefer they remain in the background.
Namekians exists, but are going through an extinction event. The equivalents Guru, Piccolo and Kami are supposed to be original player characters, if Namekians ever make an appearance.
Budokai Tenkaichi (The Martial Arts World Tournament) does not exist. Maybe we can get it started in-game.


So on and so forth.

True to the source material's style, there are all sorts of wacky things. Like dinosaurs. And shapeshifters. And talking animals. Players are allowed to play as any of the colourful beings from Toriyama's 'verse. This includes everything from Sayajins to Frieza's species to Androids to other creatures inspired by mythology or science fiction, as long as you can justify them getting involved in the story somehow.

Similar to source material, the idea is also to make timeskips after some agreed-upon points, maybe even a few centuries after we've detailed the origin of Dragon Balls. Currently, a one-year timeskip is planned to happen after the current Dragon Balls have been gathered, after which at least some characters will leave to space to do combat with Frieza's ancestor. With some luck, and if player interest remains, we'll eventually make it to "modern day" and beyond.

Preliminary rules, stolen copied over from other Anime-inspired RPs:

Firstly, no godmodding (or godmoding). A far better explanation of godmodding than I can give is here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1633965&postcount=5).
Second, please remember that we plan to have a far more directed plot than Nexus. Please run any major spanners in the works past guys on this thread first.
Third, don't ruin anyone else's fun. I can't stress this enough.
Fourth, have fun!

New and Improved (but loose) Rules v.1.1!
These "rules" are more loose guidelines that serve another FFRPG very well so I adopted them into this one, because they work.

Consider asking to join in fights before jumping in.
Please respect that all plots might not be open. Alternatively, if you yourself want to keep a fight cordoned off from other participants, say so in the OOC, at the beginning of your post, or both.
TALK major fights over with your opponent!
This is to keep arguments about who's the better fighter, who should win, blablablablabla, out of the OOC. Of course, talk these things over in PM, or some kind of IM service. While arguments might break out over said PM/IM... It keeps it out of the OOC. Which is what we're trying to do here. On that note...
Don't argue in the OOC!
They make the atmosphere oppressive, they make things less fun, and generally unpleasant and maybe even make the arguments larger than they need be. So, if you have a problem with someone, try to talk it out in PM or IM before using the OOC.

The current IC thread is here. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?479860-DBitp-Fruits-and-Veggies) Make an introductory post telling where your characters are and what they're doing, and we'll continue from there.

Past OOC threads:

Dragon Ball in the Playground [Discussion & Interest checking] (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?409236-Dragon-Ball-in-the-Playground-Discussion-amp-Interest-checking)
Dragon Ball in the Playground OOC I (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?437609-Dragon-Ball-in-the-Playground-OOC)
Dragon Ball in the Playground OOC II (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?465532-Dragon-Ball-in-the-Playground-OOC-II)
Past IC threads:

Once upon a time on Earth (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?410706-DBitP-Once-upon-a-time-on-Earth&p=19137325#post19137325)
Knights of Time and Space (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?425117-DBitP-Knights-of-Time-and-Space/page49)
Of Gods and Monsters (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?440673-DBitP-Of-Gods-and-Monsters&p=19796076#post19796076)
Shouldn't we be in Space by now (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?471498-DBitP-Shouldn-t-we-be-in-space-by-now)
Fruits and Veggies (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?479860-DBitp-Fruits-and-Veggies)

To avoid confusion, you can use location tags to indicate shifts in time and place. Like this:

[Earth; East City; Noon]

<Stuff happening.>

[Outer space; late Earth night]

<More stuff happening.>

This way, we can keep track where everyone is, since it's not economical to make a new thread for every little place.

To help keeping track of time, here's a list of known planets and time it takes to travel between them:

From Earth to Namek or Namek to Earth: 3 days with Shenron, 6 days with Arcosian Pod, 30 days with Namekian urchin
From Earth to Plant or Plant to Earth: 7 days with Shenron, 14 days with Arcosian pod, 70 days with a Namekian urchin

These are minimum travel times under optimal conditions. Travel may take longer if complications arise.

---
If you wish to add a Character PM me the info and I will add it.

Character Roster:

Yama no Rojin, Earth's Old God (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19129477&postcount=35)
Ieez, a Frost Demon Exile, Artic's brother (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161689&postcount=34)
Artic, a Frost Demon Exile, Ieez's brother (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19131668&postcount=42)
Android 23, a hapless time traveller (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161657&postcount=31)
Callin Flowers, a Tuffle inventor, New God of Earth (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20213836&postcount=505) [KIA] [Resurrected] [Comatose]
Pekoe, a shapeshifting trickster (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19135790&postcount=58)
The Young Thunder Sage, an evil, evil man (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19153353&postcount=72) [KIA?]
Iris, a former slave (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20172593&postcount=93)
Chassis, wandering Majin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19277044&postcount=309)
Shanakan, Challenge-seeking martial artist and fate mystic (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20172614&postcount=94)
Oxyribo, bio-android from the future (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161689&postcount=34)
Lord Achill Satan, OUR HERO! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19175707&postcount=164)
Android 22, ANOTHER hapless time traveller (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161657&postcount=31)
Aspa, grumpy Saiyajin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20213836&postcount=505)[NPC]
Majin Pokasuu, lost acrobat (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161689&postcount=34)
Lord Lagerin of House Sarkandis (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19524108&postcount=767) [KIA]
Starlight Shimmer, a special agent from Equestria (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19679866&postcount=1262)
Kai of the Sun, beleagured celestial bureaucrat (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19689102&postcount=1315)
Diamond, tag-along kid (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161729&postcount=36)
Luxana, activist demigod (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20172614&postcount=94)
Aphel, Emperor Hailing's right-hand-man (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19353779&postcount=436) [NPC]
Que and Zoyl, twin serpents (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20213836&postcount=505)[NPC]
Agent R.Q.S.W., elite time patroller (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161729&postcount=36)
Sasaki Ryuichi, wandering orphan (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161656&postcount=30)
Vodkana, Princess of Destruction
Spoon, Chef and Prophet of Destruction (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20161681&postcount=33)
Binky the Wonder Majin
Fujitora the Karate Tiger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20183795&postcount=197)
Son of Katas AKA the Nameless Namekian (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20181685&postcount=184)
Rime, Ambassador of the Arcosian Empire (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20219786&postcount=577)
???, god with no name. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20440817&postcount=1215)
Brusal, Tuffle warrior
Kor Flower, Queen of Planet Plant (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20229914&postcount=695)[NPC]
Ulgo Al'taradassium (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?479961-Dragonball-in-the-Playground-OOC-III&p=20559510&viewfull=1#post20559510)
Monseco of Romaine (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20560891&postcount=704)
Vati Moris (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20561177&postcount=715)

Canonical background characters who have made an appearance:
Fortuneteller Baba (Played by Rater 202)
Lord Yenma (Played by Frozen_Feet)
King Kai (Played by Frozen_Feet)
Shenron (Played by Cavalieredraghi)
Supreme Kai of Time (Played by Lord Raziere)
Queen Celestia (From My Little Pony) (Played by Hawkflight)
Doctor Whooves (From My Little Pony) ( Played by Hawkflight)

Roster key:

[KIA] : Killed-in-action. This character has bit the dust, kicked the bucket, thrown in the towel, went to a better place, rests in pieces, yadda yadda. Their place is now in our fond memories and flashbacks.
[MIA] : Missing-in-action. A player vanished and left their character off-screen, but the character was too important to be retconned out. Referring to these characters (and wondering where they are) is allowed, but their fate is left undisclosed unless their player returns.
[NPC] : Non-player character. A character who can be controlled by anyone in need.
[WIP] : Work-in-progress. A character is incomplete and not ready to be played yet.
(Currently played by X) : informs if a character is being played by someone else than who made their registry post.
Crossed-over: This character has been retconned out. They are considered never to have existed in the story. Don't refer to them.

---

Empty character template:

<Your character's name here>

Age: Exact number or rough estimation.
Gender: Male, female, etc.
Height: Centimeters and/or feet and inches.
Weight: Kilograms and/or pounds.
Species: What kind of creature your character is?
Station: Your character's current lot in life.

Description:
[spoiler]What does your character look, feel, smell and sound like?


Personality:
How does your character think? What drives him and what kind of a fellow is he?

History: What has happened to your character before the game and made them who they are?

Story So Far: You can summarize and update here what has happened to your character during the game.

Abilities:

What is your character good or bad at? What special things can he do or knows?

These could include anything from martial arts to ki blasts to magic and shapeshifting abilities.

Other information:

Anything you can't fit to the brackets above, such as equipment or property your character owns.

- - - Updated - - -

Dragonian as for your dealing that depends on you. Que's spell is based of your time ponies and their temporal displacment. Since his magic is time and nature based. So it fits. It is up to you does that make sense?

[Rater202]

You forgot to link the last OOC thread and the last IC thread.

[Frozen_Feet]

You know, when I said I was going to make this thread, I was trying to spare you from the pain of having to update the hyperlinks. (The hyperlinks are also the reason I didn't do it today, because my phone doesn't do those well.)

[igordragonian]

Yo. Frozen.
Do you think it would make sense that Clarin know how to find the DB?

And I'm still wonder if Guit dead. You have plans for him?


Cav-

*blush blush*
I almost thought you have disliked them.
Hmm.. I guess so. But.. what are the limts? It can turn OP very easily.
Would Vodkana be able to seal Apfel inside of a chair? Sound.. wrong

[Rater202]

The dragon balls are currently inactive, so nobody knows how to find them right now.

Wait 123 in game days(130 is a namekian year, minus 7 for the week-long trip to Plant.)

[Frozen_Feet]

Whether Guit is dead is up to you, igor. I'd like for Yamakami to talk to him, though. If Guit is dead, Yamakami will take his soul to be judged by Yenma. That sound good?

[igordragonian]

Rater- thanks for explaining.



Ff... hmmm. I am curiouse for what punishment Guit might get... since his very presence in hell might remind few members there.. about far distant rebellion.

Or maybe, Yamakami would get intrested in the Cross Clan's ideology. Aound good?

And as ghost.. would Guit able to fight, or he would be.. juat a ghost?
The afterlife at dbz always confused me

- - - Updated - - -

Raziere....
You mad me laugh a loud!!!!
Super lol.



I will enjoy my next reply.

How powerful are they btw?

And Ing.. what Spoon's offical status?

"Minister of cooking"?

[Frozen_Feet]

As a ghost, Guit can fight, yes. Raditz certainly fought. But he'd be overpowered by Yenma and Yamakami. Dying tends to make you weaker except when you're Obiwan Kenobi.

EDIT: and I welcome all attempts of trying to convert Yamakami to Cross Clan ways. Just be prepared for Yamakami's attempts to convert Guit to his. :smallamused:

[Emperor Ing]

And Ing.. what Spoon's offical status?

"Minister of cooking"?

I didn't think about that, but sure, let's go with that :smalltongue:

[cavalieredraghi]

You know, when I said I was going to make this thread, I was trying to spare you from the pain of having to update the hyperlinks. (The hyperlinks are also the reason I didn't do it today, because my phone doesn't do those well.)

I don't mind having to deal with Hyperlinks, What I do mind is having to wait. We were posting at to high a speed to wait till tomorrow.

I fixed added the last OOC and ICs that however was not me forgettting as much as.
Person I live with wanting to go hangout while I was working.

[igordragonian]

I can't describe how much I enjoy the "girlyu" team.

[Rater202]

Artic is more or less always in Powered Armor, right?

[cavalieredraghi]

Raziere feel free to step in and tell us to hurry when ever you want.

[Lord Raziere]

Raziere feel free to step in and tell us to hurry when ever you want.

Nah, I'm just chillin' for now. the Androids haven't even snuck away to start their part in all this yet. I've been mostly just trying to slow down my posting speed by waiting until I have 2 or more things to respond to, until enough has finished up elsewhere for me to focus on the Burnouts. like, when the whole Apfel part is finished and they all start going and I probably just have to focus on the Starlight bit on the side, then I can probably get going a little more so that I only have to focus on two things. this was mostly just an intentional part to give you a chance to worldbuild the Tuffles in general before it being contrasted with the Burnouts, but if you have nothing to make.....oh well.

[cavalieredraghi]

I need to start doing that too, waiting to post. anyways I have Plant building material, but I am more then willing to allow everyone else to add what they want. I don't want to have to do everything.

[Rater202]

...Sailor Arcos can tell that Oxy is biologically 15, right?

How old is she, equivocally?

[Lord Raziere]

...Sailor Arcos can tell that Oxy is biologically 15, right?

How old is she, equivocally?

whatever age that makes this funnier, preferably whatever age that makes this hilarious.

[cavalieredraghi]

I will say this the jokes are going right over my head.

[Rater202]

The Leader of the Girlyu force is apparently crushing on the Biologically 15 asexual hermaphrodite.

I'm questioning her age so as to know if it's funny or Creepy.

I mean, if this is an adult attracted to a 15 year old body, well, that's just creepy and will be treated as such.

[cavalieredraghi]

I get we all know that they are using alias while on Plant, but calling them real names, while on a protected line, even if they are quoted is just confusing. Really no need to use code all the time.

[Rater202]

Ieez doesn't want to be overheard by someone who happens to be near by.

[cavalieredraghi]

Who Oxy and Poke?

[Rater202]

Or you know a random Tuffle who might be near by.

Ieez can't sense energy on his own.

[Lord Raziere]

The Leader of the Girlyu force is apparently crushing on the Biologically 15 asexual hermaphrodite.

I'm questioning her age so as to know if it's funny or Creepy.

I mean, if this is an adult attracted to a 15 year old body, well, that's just creepy and will be treated as such.

Well its supposed to be funny, so......probably near his age? we could just explain it as Sailor Arcos being some natural teenage prodigy who combined with Arcosian bias got the position of elite captain way early but has a lot of real skill and talent to back it up.

also how about I start the Androids role on page.....5? that is, if I don't have to start it early or anything. that sound fair to everyone? it won't be an immediate thing, but it will be getting closer to the attack.

[cavalieredraghi]

The empty storage room aside from boxes cure storage room where Oxy Poka and Ieez can,see all spaces and are alone? The only other one there is Callins who is trying to talk to you all.

[Hawkflight]

Yo, Rater, you're up. Don't know if you saw.

[Emperor Ing]

Okay so Apfel's ship is going to arrive on Plant when I think it should because Hyperlight Drives move at the Speed of Plot.

[Frozen_Feet]

whatever age that makes this funnier, preferably whatever age that makes this hilarious.

Obviously she's bodily equivalent to 30, but was locked in a mental institution due to her delusion of being a "magic girl" and is mentally 7 years old. Also, this is her first crush.

Obviously.


I mean, if this is an adult attracted to a 15 year old body, well, that's just creepy and will be treated as such.

15 years of age is when many old societies started considering you a man and gave you a license to marry. Nevermind that such humanocentric excpectations of what's creepy really don't work with two creatures as inhuman as this.

[Rater202]

15 years of age is when many old societies started considering you a man and gave you a license to marry. Nevermind that such humanocentric excpectations of what's creepy really don't work with two creatures as inhuman as this.

"I'm no alien, was born on Earth, damn it!"

An earth with modern earth sensibilities.

Oxy will think that it'd be creepy.

As did Poka when Vodkana implied that she and Oxy were a couple, even exciting that she was a full grown woman and he was just a kid. And also that's the wrong Quadrant for their relationship.

As for humanocentricism, in canon, everything that ins't a god is called Human(Actual Humans are called Earthlings, and they share the title with animal people and monsters,) and the only things that don't have human sensibilities are bad guys or Beerus.

It's a humanocentric setting.

[igordragonian]

Hawk- shall we decide what happened in the meeting between DS and Clarin offscreen? It's probably better this way

[Hawkflight]

Hawk- shall we decide what happened in the meeting between DS and Clarin offscreen? It's probably better this way

Would you rather do it offscreen or onscreen? Because I can do either way.

[igordragonian]

I rather onscreen... but I think you are too busy.. so..

[igordragonian]

Lord Raz-
Mmm.. have you missed my post with Spoon?
He gave them personal designed cookies!

[Hawkflight]

I rather onscreen... but I think you are too busy.. so..

No, I can do it onscreen. How do you want to do this?

[igordragonian]

Well.. I have imagined, DS somewhere "licking his wounds" and Clarin apearing, and giving a namekian healing.

[Frozen_Feet]

Emperor Ing, I love every post about Cirra and the descriptions of various **** you've made. Keep up the good work.

[Rater202]

The scene at the halls of waiting kind of feels like something No Name would but in on.

Do either of you mind?

[Emperor Ing]

Emperor Ing, I love every post about Cirra and the descriptions of various **** you've made. Keep up the good work.

Thanks! I have a lot of fun jotting down the little flashes of inspiration I have.

[Hawkflight]

Rater! From the depths of college, I poke thee!

[cavalieredraghi]

His Anti gravity is what i am talking about. Can't Diamond manually control it if he tried? That is what I am trying to talk about

[Rater202]

His Anti gravity is what i am talking about. Can't Diamond manually control it if he tried? That is what I am trying to talk about

He'd have to jail break it or otherwise modify it to give himself that ability, and at this time that would require surgery because his conversion process was based on Canon!17 and 18, so his body is mostly organic-No panels to open up and tinker-with.

Granted, one of the options for Plan B might make it easier to do that, but that's like, the one option for Plan B that's the least likely to happen outside of plan B.

[cavalieredraghi]

Okay fine, I am not even in a mood to debate things.

[Rater202]

Okay fine, I am not even in a mood to debate things.

I'm sorry to hear that.

*Hugs*

[igordragonian]

Hawk.. you sure you don't want to do Clarin-DS alliance offscreen?

[Rater202]

Que and zoyle are from the Future, right?

[cavalieredraghi]

Sort of from a certain point of view.

[Hawkflight]

He'd have to jail break it or otherwise modify it to give himself that ability, and at this time that would require surgery because his conversion process was based on Canon!17 and 18, so his body is mostly organic-No panels to open up and tinker-with.

Granted, one of the options for Plan B might make it easier to do that, but that's like, the one option for Plan B that's the least likely to happen outside of plan B.

You know, there are other, more non-invasive ways to do it. Telekinesis and the Doctor's magic screwdriver come to mind.

[Frozen_Feet]

The scene at the halls of waiting kind of feels like something No Name would but in on.

Do either of you mind?

I think you're late to the party? I described Yamakami leaving ~15 minutes before you asked the question. It's just Guit fighting Yenma now. If you want the fruitbat to get between them, I have no objections. Ask igordragonian.

[igordragonian]

The more the merrier!

[Rater202]

Ninja'd you, Igor.

[igordragonian]

Ninja'd you, Igor.

I'll edit.
Btw.. who is this god? How does he looks like?

[Rater202]

I'll edit.
Btw.. who is this god? How does he looks like?

Has no nam, pale skin, long pointed ears, bat like wings-he's a highly anthropomorphic fruit-bat.

[igordragonian]

Has no nam, pale skin, long pointed ears, bat like wings-he's a highly anthropomorphic fruit-bat.

mm.. edited.
"cute" kind, or scary kind?

[Rater202]

mm.. edited.
"cute" kind, or scary kind?

highly anthropomorphic.

He unless he opens his mouth, he looks like a human with elf ears and bat wings.

[cavalieredraghi]

Rater I Subtle'd you.

[igordragonian]

How powerful is no name? should we wait to FF? Or to reply to it as it is?

[Rater202]

Rater I Subtle'd you.
fixed

How powerful is no name? should we wait to FF? Or to reply to it as it is?

Strong enough that he'll never actually fight, and it's your choice to wait or respond.

[Rater202]

Okay. If we take Dragon Ball Heroes as a reliable source(big if) than Ultimate Evolution is not unique to Freiza and is golden across the board.

So, I hit 1 of 2.

I'm not sure if I should change my write up or leave it as any precious metal.

[Emperor Ing]

I'm not sure if I should change my write up or leave it as any precious metal.

I say leave it as any precious metal. Gold is just the most common color because gold is only given to those in first place. All lesser colors are relegated to those who just couldn't compete.

[Rater202]

I say leave it as any precious metal. Gold is just the most common color because gold is only given to those in first place. All lesser colors are relegated to those who just couldn't compete.

I don't think you get to pick your color though.

Anyway, if anybody is interested in knowing what the Hell I'm talking aboutIn the (unfortunately japan exclusive) Arcade game Dragon Ball Heroes(which is updated frequently) you choose avatars based on a class and race(Saiyan Avatars also have alternate gendered versions, but the Android and Kaioshin have a two guys and a girl set up and everything else is male exclusive)

The game has a "Class-Up" Mechanic which gives the Avatar characters better stats and better moves when used. For example, a Base Saiyan Avatar is a saiyan capable of going SSJ and the other races are roughly comparable in power to that, and by activating "Class Up" you got to that Same Saiyan Avatar as an SSJ2 with the other races being comparable in power.

Then there's the "Super Class Up" which brings you to Super Class-I've mentioned them before, when explaining something on Frieza Clan cybernetics-and you get a Saiyan character who is SSJ3 and characters on similar levels of power.

Recently they released a "God Class-up" mechanic-basically a tier 4. In addition o being the strongest version of the avatars, a character at this level is either a god or close enough that the point is moot.

Saiyan Class Avatars are Super Saiyan God, Frieza Race avatars are Golden Form, Namekians are something called a "Red Eyed Namek" which loks suspiciously like the transformation the Namek in this Online teaser (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyMx1YjekBY), make of that what you will, and I've got no idea whats up with the rest of them except I'm wondering why the Kaioshin weren't already considered gods and if the Bio-android turning red means what I think it means.http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/f/fd/Img_play_03_04.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20160225140658
http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/8/8e/Img_play_05_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/624?cb=20160225140816
http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/9/91/Img_play_06_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225140845
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/3/31/Img_play_07_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225140910
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/3/33/Img_play_08_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225140953
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/c/cf/Img_play_09_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225141020
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/6/6c/Img_play_10_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225141050

[cavalieredraghi]

Heroes sounds interesting and spoiler heavy.

[Frozen_Feet]

Sounds marketing heavy. :smalltongue:

Anyways, waiting for a reaction from Lord Gero.

[Lord Raziere]

sorry if I haven't replied to anything today/yesterday, strong winds blew and gave my house power outage for the entire day, it looks like a windy season, so if it happens again and get another power outage? don't be surprised.

[cavalieredraghi]

We will filler till needed.

Gah! I can't read what happens in the Burnout sector, because it will just prove that the Androids are just dumb piles of uncaring tech that do not deserve to be in the RA.....

[Frozen_Feet]

I edited in a continuation of the Halls of Waiting scene, since I somehow forgot to do that earlier.

[Hawkflight]

I don't think you get to pick your color though.

Anyway, if anybody is interested in knowing what the Hell I'm talking aboutIn the (unfortunately japan exclusive) Arcade game Dragon Ball Heroes(which is updated frequently) you choose avatars based on a class and race(Saiyan Avatars also have alternate gendered versions, but the Android and Kaioshin have a two guys and a girl set up and everything else is male exclusive)

The game has a "Class-Up" Mechanic which gives the Avatar characters better stats and better moves when used. For example, a Base Saiyan Avatar is a saiyan capable of going SSJ and the other races are roughly comparable in power to that, and by activating "Class Up" you got to that Same Saiyan Avatar as an SSJ2 with the other races being comparable in power.

Then there's the "Super Class Up" which brings you to Super Class-I've mentioned them before, when explaining something on Frieza Clan cybernetics-and you get a Saiyan character who is SSJ3 and characters on similar levels of power.

Recently they released a "God Class-up" mechanic-basically a tier 4. In addition o being the strongest version of the avatars, a character at this level is either a god or close enough that the point is moot.

Saiyan Class Avatars are Super Saiyan God, Frieza Race avatars are Golden Form, Namekians are something called a "Red Eyed Namek" which loks suspiciously like the transformation the Namek in this Online teaser (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyMx1YjekBY), make of that what you will, and I've got no idea whats up with the rest of them except I'm wondering why the Kaioshin weren't already considered gods and if the Bio-android turning red means what I think it means.http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/f/fd/Img_play_03_04.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20160225140658
http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/8/8e/Img_play_05_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/624?cb=20160225140816
http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/9/91/Img_play_06_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225140845
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/3/31/Img_play_07_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225140910
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/3/33/Img_play_08_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225140953
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/c/cf/Img_play_09_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225141020
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/dragonball/images/6/6c/Img_play_10_04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20160225141050

....You know, that could just be an utter lack of customizability.

- - - Updated - - -


"Cause I like the cut of your gib!"

"Carve it into your soul, kid!" :smalltongue:

[Rater202]

Heroes sounds interesting and spoiler heavy.
I know. And it's japan exlucive, which sucks, becuae it's basically everything the fans want-It's full of fun What If Scenarios, females that kick ass, and has a coherent plot.

Gah! I can't read what happens in the Burnout sector, because it will just prove that the Androids are just dumb piles of uncaring tech that do not deserve to be in the RA.....Cav, um... Maybe wait a bit longer to see where it's going first?

[Emperor Ing]

I'm finding myself actually looking forward to Raziere's next posts, just to see the continuation of 22 and 23's adventures in the Burnout Sector.

[Lord Raziere]

I'm finding myself actually looking forward to Raziere's next posts, just to see the continuation of 22 and 23's adventures in the Burnout Sector.

glad to see you enjoying it. its supposed to be a look at Burnouts in general before we see the attack and flesh them out more, and I'm hoping it does that.

[Hawkflight]

I actually find myself wanting Starlight to interact with the Burnouts now, thanks to you. XD

[Hawkflight]

He paused. He also decided to add more to his offer. Corrupted or not he was a pony. So even their worst villians had one prime desire.
"And also could use friends."

True! Well, everyone except ... *takes a deep breath* Queen Chrisalis, King Sombra, Tirek, Ahuizotl, the Dazzlings, the Arimaspi, the Chimera, the Chupacabra, the Cockatrice, the Diamond Dogs (RIP Bowie), Dr. Caballeron, the teenage dragons, the Flim Flam Brothers, the Mane-iac, Shadowmane, the Smudge, The Pharaoh, Long-Face, High Heel, the Olden Pony, Abacus Cinch, Rabia, the Nightmare, Spoiled Rich, Suri Polomare, Svengallop, Wind Rider, the Windigos....

[igordragonian]

Not quite true.
hald of the list are beast-animals.
Tirek STILL didn't reformed.
if discord could be reformed- anything could.
and I meant speficly- ponies- Starlight glimmer, Trixie...

[Hawkflight]

Not quite true.
hald of the list are beast-animals.
Tirek STILL didn't reformed.
if discord could be reformed- anything could.
and I meant speficly- ponies- Starlight glimmer, Trixie...

Ah, fair point. Although all of the creatures on my list are sapient, with the exception of the cockatrice.

- - - Updated - - -

Although there's still Queen Chrisalis, King Sombra, the Dazzlings, Dr. Caballeron, the Flim Flam Brothers, the Mane-iac, Shadowmane, the Smudge, The Pharaoh, Long-Face, High Heel, the Olden Pony, Abacus Cinch, Spoiled Rich, Suri Polomare, Svengallop, and Wind Rider. Though some of those could be reformed, I don't think friendship is their primary motivation.

[igordragonian]

I don't know half of those characers..

Pharaoh?

Anyway.. by IDW comic Sombra have been redeemed by friendship.

And even if they don't realize it, friendship issues... that all for ponies.

So I believe. The same way ambition move us humans, friendship (or lack of friendship!) move ponies

[Rater202]

By the way, according to the most recent episode of Super, SSGSSJ is apaently something extra you put on top of the SSJ forms.

[Hawkflight]

I don't know half of those characers..

Pharaoh?

Anyway.. by IDW comic Sombra have been redeemed by friendship.

And even if they don't realize it, friendship issues... that all for ponies.

So I believe. The same way ambition move us humans, friendship (or lack of friendship!) move ponies

See, I more saw Sombra as being reformed due to facing a common enemy than friendship.

Also, I forgot to mention the mane six and princesses from the mirror universe, but I haven't actually read that one yet, so....

[cavalieredraghi]

Cav, um... Maybe wait a bit longer to see where it's going first?

No I know what is going to happen, and even before I did, I pointed out the glaring plot hole to Raziere in a PM and it is still happening anyways.

[Rater202]

Igor, Ninja, Cav, Ninja edit.

[cavalieredraghi]

Edited for you Rater.

[igordragonian]

Rater-fixed


Hawk

hmm.. Sombra was saved thank to his purple girlfriend.


and BTW
are super nameks Canon?

And I wonder what we'l see from Picolo... but I'v got a feeling he'l disappoint us.

[Rater202]

and BTW
are super nameks Canon? Piccolo is a Super Namek after re-fusing with Kami, but all it really means is that he's hella strong, it's not a transformation.

Dragon Ball Online had "Great Nameks" who were Nameks that, when they used the "Giant Size" technique, gained an increase in power comparable to a Saiyan descended human going SSJ or a Majin becoming a Pure Majin. Online was originally meant to be canon.

I also linked a trailer from Online earliar, depicting a Namekian assuming a form with glowing red eyes and a dark aura, and Heros aparenlty adopted the "Red Eyed Namek" as a transformation that brought those particular Namekians up to a level comparable to a Super Saiyan God and granted them Godly Ki, but in the Trailer that Namek transforming was only on the level of a Super Saiyan

[cavalieredraghi]

SO Rater will I expect a reply sometime tonight?

[Rater202]

Sorry. Kinda working on a school thing and trying to decide if I should reply to Igor now or wait for Frozen.

[Emperor Ing]

Now I kinda want 23 and Emperor Hailing to have a Ham vs Snark battle

[cavalieredraghi]

I wonder if you came up with that after the Bitch vs Snark contest of 23 and Aspa?

[Lord Raziere]

I wonder if you came up with that after the Bitch vs Snark contest of 23 and Aspa?

Yes actually. as a sort of continuation of the joke.

[cavalieredraghi]

Yes actually. as a sort of continuation of the joke.

That's funny. :smalltongue:

- - - Updated - - -

I am actually kind of excited about some of the inter character interaction that will happen after the Burnouts. Also Ing when do you want Apfel to arrive on Plant?

[Hawkflight]

I'm trying to remember - is it canon that Namekians consist solely on water, or is that a DBZ:A thing?

- - - Updated - - -

Also, d'awww, now I want Starlight to just show up and hug the little Namekian. :smallfrown:

[Rater202]

I'm trying to remember - is it canon that Namekians consist solely on water, or is that a DBZ:A thing?

It's from Databooks.

However, Piccolo at least is capable of eating, as Sensu beans work on him and he's actually shown eating a few times-A Fish in the pre-timeskip piccolo Junior Arc, he's shown with a plate at the "Hooray, we stopped Frieza Again" party in Super, and is actually shown eating grilled meat when Chichi is cooking for everybody on the way to the Nameless Planet in between Universe 6 and Universe Seven, also in Super.

also, during the Namek arc, you can actually see small plots of land where the Namekians are cultivating somekind of plant, so unless it's a natural filter or they're only doing it because it's good for the environment.

[Frozen_Feet]

Namekians are plant-slug people. In the manga, Dende explains they only need water and sunlight. Piccolo has occasionally been seen eating solid stuff, so they can eat. I'm spinning it as a cultural difference. Piccolo was a result of human influence, after all.

[Rater202]

...I'd honestly forgot abbout Dende saying that, though I don't remember him saying they needed sunlight.... Though to be fair, it'd be pretty hard to tell considering Namek revolves around three different starts so the sun is always up.

Anyway, the Databooks mentioned that Namekians produces enzymes, adn reactions with these ensigns produced all of the nutrients a namekian needed, but that the reactions required water.

A memeber of Team Four Star, either Lani or Kirran(they're hard for me to tell apart by voice) theorized that Namekians have such weird powers because they used Porunga to alter their physiology to increase their survivability

[Hawkflight]

Which reminds me ... how long is Plant's day/night cycle?

[cavalieredraghi]

Eartha during equinox are 12 hours for plant I am going with 16 hour day and night cycles for their equinox

[Frozen_Feet]

Hey Igordragonian, do white Nameks eat? It just occurred to me that since their primogenitor is really old and they're not green, they might be leftovers from time before Nameks became photosynthetic.

Another idea: Cross Clan predates Dragon Balls. Don't remember if you said anything about that before.

[igordragonian]

Hmm...
well, the original concept was.. "Vampire Namekians inspired a bit from Lucifer"
Hmm.. they can't predate the dragon balls, since.. their power been created by the wish.
Or at least so, saying the Trombonicon.
BTW.. if Yamakami study the book, tell me.

[Rater202]

Can Poka and Ieez run into the two grafetiers?

[Lord Raziere]

Can Poka and Ieez run into the two grafetiers?

Yes, also edited my post to include the Offensive Four's PL's. they Burnout's PLs are intentionally designed to not be nice round numbers and work more on rule of funny.

[cavalieredraghi]

Raziere I clearly stated Que was invisible.

[Hawkflight]

I just want to confirm that I understand Vati right - because even if I'm wrong, I don't think Starlight would be. His primary motivation here is a mix between fear of death and feeling betrayed at Callins leaving, mixed with grief at Callins' presumed death, right?

[Lord Raziere]

Raziere I clearly stated Que was invisible.

oh hm nevermind then. guess I'm saving that joke.

@ Hawkflight: not really FEAR of death no, its more like he has unending rage that he doesn't get to live longer. but the other two are spot on.

[igordragonian]

Can Vodkana have one of the graffities to handle?

[Lord Raziere]

Can Vodkana have one of the graffities to handle?

sure, why not

[cavalieredraghi]

How many Vodkanas are there total 5 right?

[igordragonian]

btw- if I won't be able to post in the next two days- Cav may npc Vodkana. She would try to beat the burnout without killing them, and maybe get to the ring leaders, and seal them...
inside her panties or , earings or something.

And seriously.. what do you think should be the rules for a sealing spell?
5 in total. yes

[cavalieredraghi]

Wait inside her panties!? Why am I getting images of "Panty and Stocking with Gerterbelt"

[igordragonian]

Wait inside her panties!? Why am I getting images of "Panty and Stocking with Gerterbelt"

Well she doesnt carry the Z sword on her. So...

And I dont know the refrence.

[cavalieredraghi]

I can't link it, that anime is against most forum rules.

[Hawkflight]

Wait inside her panties!? Why am I getting images of "Panty and Stocking with Gerterbelt"

That season finale was weeeiiird.

[cavalieredraghi]

The whole show was weird, the season finale was balls deep insane.

[Hawkflight]

So, Rime wants to protect the cure, right? So he, and by extension Morian, should be on their way to the palace, right?

[Lord Raziere]

So, Rime wants to protect the cure, right? So he, and by extension Morian, should be on their way to the palace, right?

there is only one Tuffle in all the antagonists who actually cares about it, and they haven't acted upon getting to it yet. things are going way faster than I planned it though. if Callins says the right info to prove he is the real deal and reveals the real info about the cure.....we might be looking at alternate bosses waaaay earlier than expected. pity, I liked Vati's final form the best, but oh well, whatever happens happens.

but yeah, Morlan doesn't care, he is just attacking Rime.

[Rater202]

there is only one Tuffle in all the antagonists who actually cares about it, and they haven't acted upon getting to it yet.

So, um, Oxy staying out of the fight to keep the Cure safe is smart move and not stubbornness?

[Hawkflight]

Hey Raz, can you throw something towards the palace for us? Cav and I were kind of banking on someone attacking the palace, otherwise Starlight is just twiddling her ... hooves.

[Lord Raziere]

So, um, Oxy staying out of the fight to keep the Cure safe is smart move and not stubbornness?

Well, at this rate, he will probably be meeting them shortly. and probably make them become the Final Boss instead of Vati. I didn't expect everyone to play so defensively, and neither did the Burnouts. I honestly expected Oxyribo to be the one fulfilling the roll Rime is at the moment of a seemingly unstoppable enemy for the Burnouts to send the Ex-Suicide Squad Soldier after.

@ Hawkflight: very well. I have like eight other Blazing Elites that I thought people were going to go after., so.....lots to choose to send though...they're kinda all stronger than the first four?

[Rater202]

I honestly expected Oxyribo to be the one fulfilling the roll Rime is at the moment of a seemingly unstoppable enemy for the Burnouts to send the Ex-Suicide Squad Soldier after.

We used a wish to make some of that Cure-probably most of it, considering the flawed cure got scrapped.

Oxy, as the current master of the Dragon Balls, is all about practical wishes.

Cure gets destroyed, wish turns out to be a waste.

Also Oxy was pretty sure somebody would try to take advantage of the chaos to destroy the cure.

[Hawkflight]

So, what should Starlight's power level be now? Back on Earth, it was 9000, boosted to 90,000 when using her power-up.

[Ishimi]

So, went to check the IC thread... Missed like three pages :smalleek:


Then I checked the OOC and was like "oh, it's only a page" then I saw you linked here so there's three more...


Cav, Igor, are you two okay with me timeskipping the Saiyan bit? The only reason I put him in now was to mention Kiswi as well as solidify some back-story in game. The arc won't even begin until way later anyways.

[cavalieredraghi]

That is fine ishimi


On the ic, I am,confused when and why is Vati already there with Kor. How,did time not see him? I swear we need to be more descriptive.

[Lord Raziere]

That is fine ishimi


On the ic, I am,confused when and why is Vati already there with Kor. How,did time not see him? I swear we need to be more descriptive.

I was thinking that Vati wasn't there with Kor already, your the ones who thought he was. I was fully prepared for him to go searching through the palace not knowing his way around.

[cavalieredraghi]

He pretty much told Vati what he wanted to hear, and yet still nothing fine!

I am not posting for a while since nothing is clear or going right.

[Hawkflight]

So wait, should Starlight and Callins talk down Vati now or not?

- - - Updated - - -

Okay, hold up! Where is everyone right now? Starlight is in the main meeting room with Kor.

[cavalieredraghi]

I don't know or care. I am not even sure Starlight is there.

[Emperor Ing]

Artic is on his way to the Palace and will arrive in my next post. Rime is in the Palace (because the Embassy and Palace are close by)

[Ishimi]

Oh, also here is a picture I drew of Ryuichi (http://ishimi2you.deviantart.com/art/Sasaki-Ryuichi-594428838)

[Hawkflight]

Oh, also here is a picture I drew of Ryuichi (http://ishimi2you.deviantart.com/art/Sasaki-Ryuichi-594428838)

Oh, wow! You should draw the rest of the RA too! :smalltongue:

Also, re: pirates - one song always comes to mind when I think of pirates. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pY0gZRb8kE

[Lord Raziere]

He pretty much told Vati what he wanted to hear, and yet still nothing fine!

I am not posting for a while since nothing is clear or going right.

you didn't outright state it. you just implied it, and anyone can do that. you literally just had to say "Vati, I know you had a crush on Kor years ago" and "whoever said the cure was defective lied." and that would've solved it. the entire arc was supposed to be contrived so that Callins to give Callins the opportunity to say those at the end, not in the middle.

whatever, after this, definitely not going to do any more arcs, I put too much work into it and the pay off didn't work out as I expected. its just a mess.

as for talking down....didn't want that to happen until all other foes were defeated. y'know, as the final thing of the arc, or as the second final thing before one of the alternate bosses.

[Hawkflight]

you didn't outright state it. you just implied it, and anyone can do that. you literally just had to say "Vati, I know you had a crush on Kor years ago" and "whoever said the cure was defective lied." and that would've solved it. the entire arc was supposed to be contrived so that Callins to give Callins the opportunity to say those at the end, not in the middle.

whatever, after this, definitely not going to do any more arcs, I put too much work into it and the pay off didn't work out as I expected. its just a mess.

as for talking down....didn't want that to happen until all other foes were defeated. y'know, as the final thing of the arc, or as the second final thing before one of the alternate bosses.

Right, we'll hold off then. Sorry it didn't work out like you wanted. I did try to bring it back on track.

[Rater202]

whatever, after this, definitely not going to do any more arcs, I put too much work into it and the pay off didn't work out as I expected. its just a mess.

:smallfrown::smallfrown::smallfrown::smallfrown::s mallfrown::smallfrown:

[cavalieredraghi]

Told you it would have been better that I left.

[Emperor Ing]

Wouldn't we be able to get the plot back on track if Callins realizes (even erroneously) that he can't get through to Vati and 'ports out?

[Hawkflight]

Told you it would have been better that I left.

Not entirely your fault. You were about to back off and let Vati be when Vati decided to just accelerate things.

- - - Updated - - -


Wouldn't we be able to get the plot back on track if Callins realizes (even erroneously) that he can't get through to Vati and 'ports out?

Well, the problem then would be that Vati has already accelerated things to phase 2. It could be done, with skill (or wiping the last page or so of content), but it would be difficult.

[Lord Raziere]

:smallfrown::smallfrown::smallfrown::smallfrown::s mallfrown::smallfrown:

or at least let the entire plan of my next be:

"1. Solitus unites the forces of Hell under himself, and conquers Heaven.
2. ???
3. Arc Ends"

rather than overplanning like this. and no matter how much I am annoyed of you, Cavaliered, this just means we have different ways of thinking about things and not that there is anything wrong with you. Its just that I'm apparently a poor arc planner for your kind of player, or that I got too invested in my plans.

[Hawkflight]

or at least let the entire plan of my next be:

"1. Solitus unites the forces of Hell under himself, and conquers Heaven.
2. ???
3. Arc Ends"

rather than overplanning like this. and no matter how much I am annoyed of you, Cavaliered, this just means we have different ways of thinking about things and not that there is anything wrong with you. Its just that I'm apparently a poor arc planner for your kind of player, or that I got too invested in my plans.

You know, I'm told I'm pretty good at keeping things like this on track. I could help you next time if you want.

Would you like me to tell you how this could have been prevented?

[Lord Raziere]

You know, I'm told I'm pretty good at keeping things like this on track. I could help you next time if you want.

Would you like me to tell you how this could have been prevented?

Yes please. this is already in shambles, so really if you have any questions, I don't care I can answer anything, I'm pretty sure we won't even be seeing Vati's final form unless we work really hard for it, cause it requires a very certain set of conditions to even work.

[Rater202]

I'm pretty sure we won't even be seeing Vati's final form unless we work really hard for it, cause it requires a very certain set of conditions to even work.

You can always recycle it and use it in later arcs, like I did with Sprock-Magenta.

[igordragonian]

Well you always can have Vati be on drugs or something that make unaproachable.


And Ishi- well I'm impressed!

[Hawkflight]

Yes please. this is already in shambles, so really if you have any questions, I don't care I can answer anything, I'm pretty sure we won't even be seeing Vati's final form unless we work really hard for it, cause it requires a very certain set of conditions to even work.

Well, what are those conditions?

And there are really two points at which this could have been avoided. The first was when Callins went after Vati. Since he had a bunch of clones, you could have just straight-up said, "Sorry Cav, that one's a clone." Because there was really no way he could have known. But we could just say that he picked one at random, or the first one he sensed.

The second ... well, I'm not sure if it could have been prevented here, as you had no idea what Cav and I were planning. If you had just waited one more post, Cav would have pulled out at my request (for reasons involving character development). But you couldn't really have seen that coming, and I didn't think to mention it, so ... I guess it's really just the first point.

- - - Updated - - -

Okay, wait wait wait, are we talking him down now or not? Cause if not, I'm cool with waiting until after the fight. But if so, then I'd like to know so I can have Starlight do her speech first.

[Lord Raziere]

You can always recycle it and use it in later arcs, like I did with Sprock-Magenta.

yeah but by then, he will be doing it heroically and it actually kind of requires the galaxy-wide media attention.


Basically imagine the Super Saiyan God Form + spirit bomb's energy gathering, but without pure hearts, so instead replaced by fame, popularity and the raw emotions of people beholding you. Since this is less pure, it requires a lot more people to see and have lots of emotion, that was why he was doing all this- the Burnout attack would stir up a lot of emotion and passion and thus generate enough for the ritual Holmarius made to basically make this easier- a ritual that basically has ritual circles in all major cities of Plant, and basically would give him a spirit/divinity form when achieved, but wouldn't be stable until one million PL. he would start at 777,777 PL at be constantly going up, and so on.

problem is, the trigger for the form to actually start the transformation is to basically nearly DIE. because its basically rebuilding his entire body into a divine one. It would've also turned the moon into a disco ball in the process and basically make him become "Disco Mortis" and such, while glowing in aura of a rainbow. whilst "Death By Glamour" plays.


but alas. won't happen now. should've known better, and yes, Hawkflight, I reeeeaaaallly should've done the "Fake Vati" thing right there, since that was what they were INTENDED to do! AAAAArrrrgh, I screwed up my own arc.

[igordragonian]

Raz-sama, do I assume Vodkana have dfeated the 'ninja tuffles"?
I think you have missed my reply.
I so far really enjoying this.

[Hawkflight]

Agh, that does sound pretty awesome. >_<

Maybe the idea can still be recycled somehow? Or salvaged? Or ... I dunno....

And to repeat my question, which I believe may have nonja'd you ...


Okay, wait wait wait, are we talking him down now or not? Cause if not, I'm cool with waiting until after the fight. But if so, then I'd like to know so I can have Starlight do her speech first.

[cavalieredraghi]

I would have stopped that as a note, since you forced the golden dragon mask that I have been hiding.

[Lord Raziere]

Agh, that does sound pretty awesome. >_<

Maybe the idea can still be recycled somehow? Or salvaged? Or ... I dunno....

And to repeat my question, which I believe may have nonja'd you ...

again, its pretty clear that this has been ruined beyond my plans. best to just take it whatever direction seems reasonable by now, with the two alternate bosses showing up....waaaaaait. I have an idea.

what if Vait redeems himself, by successfully defeating one of the alternate bosses who can't be beaten, by going into his final form? then giving up that power, to resurrect all the people that died in the attack, thus going back to a normal Tuffle?

@ igorraco: yeah, I probably missed it in the excitement, sorry

[Emperor Ing]

I don't mean to come across as condescending, but I do hope this can be a learning experience. No plan survives contact with the enemy PCs and the best we can do is keep our options open for when the unexpected happens.

[Hawkflight]

again, its pretty clear that this has been ruined beyond my plans. best to just take it whatever direction seems reasonable by now, with the two alternate bosses showing up....waaaaaait. I have an idea.

what if Vait redeems himself, by successfully defeating one of the alternate bosses who can't be beaten, by going into his final form? then giving up that power, to resurrect all the people that died in the attack, thus going back to a normal Tuffle?

@ igorraco: yeah, I probably missed it in the excitement, sorry

That sounds like a good idea! I'll post my speech now then.

Also, random question - to we ever plan to do a really long timeskip in this RP?

[Lord Raziere]

I don't mean to come across as condescending, but I do hope this can be a learning experience. No plan survives contact with the enemy PCs and the best we can do is keep our options open for when the unexpected happens.

trust me, when I was planning this arc out, I had that fully in mind and had contingency plans for this arc, fully expecting that Oxyribo would somehow try to derail everything, so I designed in the False Vati Actors in case he thought Vati was evil and want to kill him right off the bat. I fully expected that people knowing Vati was redeemable might not want to kill him to activate the ritual, so I designed in alternate bosses.

for some reason I didn't expect people would be defensive rather seeking them out during battle, I didn't expect proactive effort from Callins, and I didn't expect people would want to spare all the other Burnouts. yep, even with my planning, it still didn't work. so. yeah. guess I have to learn that even more.

[Hawkflight]

Posted. I'll let Vati respond before continuing.

[igordragonian]

Raz-Sama dont be hard on yourself!
It's still can work!
Make the burnouts so crazy and berserk, that as long they breath they fight.
Time is also an issue- every moment they are not dfeated more innocents dies.
Make Vati do something unforgivable- blow up a hospital- just to prove his point.
Actually this arc remind me a lot of few one piece's best arcs.

You need to push our characters to the wall.
There are a lot of burnouts, and so much of us...

[Lord Raziere]

um, if he does something unforgivable, thats kind of like.....against his whole "supposed to be redeemed" thing, and the more I try to make him actually antagonistic in a way so that he can be redeemed from something bad, the more cavalier doesn't seem to like that for some reason. heck, he stated that he doesn't like the Androids being hypnotized for reasons I can't figure out, even though I specified how it works and how Vati sees it, as well as cav making quite heavy-handed judgements about the Androids themselves for their actions. so its like, I can't make him too evil or cav won't cooperate and forgive Vati if he does something that goes too far.

and really, that was supposed to be the intention of the arc, igor. it was supposed to be a big rush of good people doing horrible things because of one stupid lie said by one selfish person and how tragic that it had to turn out like this,and many Burnouts dying because of it. problem is- Cav doesn't seem to want that. and if cav won't cooperate that, it can't happen.

[cavalieredraghi]

Feel free to do what you want.

[igordragonian]

Then why won't you make him have hallucnations. (I written it wrong. Right?) Get inspired of batman's villiains.

Turn Callins into Arcosian in his eyes.
All his enemies have "exposed" themselves as arcosians!
The pony is an arcosian mutant!
But they cant fool Vati!
Oh no! Those sneaky bastards will pay !!

[Lord Raziere]

Then why won't you make him have hallucnations. (I written it wrong. Right?) Get inspired of batman's villiains.

Turn Callins into Arcosian in his eyes.
All his enemies have "exposed" themselves as arcosians!
The pony is an arcosian mutant!
But they cant fool Vati!
Oh no! Those sneaky bastards will pay !!

.....as a side effect of the Ki Serum? that might work. its not the most consistently made thing; it IS made by an 18-year drug-dealer who is also a druggie, underground without proper experimentation in a non-clean environment, who also makes various other drugs that can cause hallucinations...

[igordragonian]

Ok. Hope I helped a bit

[Lord Raziere]

Ok. Hope I helped a bit

You did. I think I know how to get this back on track now. I'm going to be upping the ante through.

[cavalieredraghi]

I will say it now, if the serum is used I leave.

The serum should not give divine powers. That should be the result of a ritual as well as pain and blood being given. The idea that science can improve no is foolish this is why the Half life virus failed in its original desgin. Science can not and should not win.

[Frozen_Feet]

I'd say Vati's stunt is a ritual. He's basically following the footsteps of countless suicidal zealots. It's just that his religion is... durrrrr... Disco? Discopunk? I didn't read the whole IC yet.

But I'll not that I don't think Vati turning into a literal god is in any way necessary. All the crazy fun things like a jump in power or Plant's moon turning into a disco ball can happen without it.

[cavalieredraghi]

I disagree,.

[Hawkflight]

I disagree,.

Mind telling us why you disagree, instead of just saying you disagree? You have to communicate with us, dude. We all need to communicate better.

[cavalieredraghi]

I told you why, and I did not have time to type it I still don't.

[Hawkflight]

Oh, you meant that.

Well, the serum doesn't have to be used, does it?

[cavalieredraghi]

As for why:
The Ritual for gaining power is the catalyst for obtaining said power. However in this instances it is not the ritual that is the catalyst it is the Serum. The Ritual is optional, as it is the admiration that is needed, everything else is opitional. So I repeat it is the serum that is the catalyst not the ritual. Divine power should not be given from science, and it should fail in the power up, just like Half Life has.

[Hawkflight]

I understand where you're coming from, Cav. This matter was clearly important to you, and a major part of what made the half-life virus what it was when you designed it. So, Raz, how about we say the power mostly comes from the ritual, and put this thing to bed, like I should be?

[cavalieredraghi]

Get to bed Hawk.

[igordragonian]

FF, is Yenma going to send Guit to the Heart of *certain planet*
Or to hell?

[Frozen_Feet]

To Hell. He doesn't know where that planet is.

[Rater202]

...I'm confused.

I don't see anyting about Godhead coming from the serum? From my reading it was all ritual.

[Lord Raziere]

...I'm confused.

I don't see anyting about Godhead coming from the serum? From my reading it was all ritual.

Yes. you have the right of it. the Ki-Serum only increases power level, with additional effects of greatly increasing ki control at the cost of a lot of untold side-effects. it has nothing to do with the ritual,and Vati could've theoretically done the ritual by just being 1000 PL, then putting on a normal, if very well done play for everyone.

and it is technically not a godhood, he is sort of a spirit/Legend/thing that if he attains his stable state will just exponentially increase in power as long as he is known as a celebrity where he will then go try to kill Hailing and basically become an eternal celebrity of the universe that everyone worships, if he is killed during the unstable state before he reach one million PL, he will endlessly reincarnate with his memories intact to forever try to rebel again and again. which is why its important he is redeemed- once the Final Form starts going, talking him down is the ONLY option that is non-horrible.

so no, I'm going ahead with it, because cavalier, you got it wrong, the serums and the ritual have nothing to do with each other, so no need to worry. the hallucinations just make sure that well.....Torzikan will explain it, he will now basically be a vital character for exposition now and figuring out what to do.

[cavalieredraghi]

Have your fun without me

[Lord Raziere]

Have your fun without me

ok, thats your decision, and I'll respect it. I failed in the original intention of the arc, because apparently none of my decisions or intentions for this arc is giving you any enjoyment so....yeah. thats your call, and feel free to rejoin us when its over. thats a fair decision for you to make.

however I still need to keep going so that everyone else at least enjoys this and has a good time. Hawkflight, you want Starlight to be the hero of this arc maybe her and 22 can talk Vati down? I think I can find a way to adjust things so that he can be redeemed without Callins, he was never meant to be redeemable ONLY with Callins...the contingency although I considered unlikely that Callins might not be able to do this, was also considered.

[Rater202]

Have your fun without me

Cav. You said you'd leave if the serum made him a god.

The serum did not make him a god.

Why are you leaving? After everything?

...Uhm.

[Hawkflight]

Okay, Cav? Targalus. Seriously.

- - - Updated - - -

Cav, I meant what I said on Skype. I'm going to go take a long bath. And by the time I get back, I expect to see you have posted in the IC.

[cavalieredraghi]

Cav. You said you'd leave if the serum made him a god.

The serum did not make him a god.

Why are you leaving? After everything?

...Uhm.

The Serum did not get used? Then why is there Hallucinations happening? I thought those were to come from the god serum.

[Lord Raziere]

The Serum did not get used? Then why is there Hallucinations happening? I thought those were to come from the god serum.

there is no god serum. the ki serums are not capable of granting that.

the ritual technically doesn't even grant godhood, it just gives a new spiritual body empowered by the emotions and such of people across the galaxy. its purely a Holmarius thing that has nothing to do with the Torzikan thing. Burnouts specifically do different things from another to stand out from one another, not to blend in or get mixed together.

the hallucination are happening because ki serums were not made in a safe environment- they were made by a Burnout druggie who makes hallucinatory drugs a lot. just an unexpected side effect

[Rater202]

The Serum did not get used? Then why is there Hallucinations happening? I thought those were to come from the god serum.

The serum is just a power boost.

The "God" thing comes from the ritual.

As far as I can tell, and Raz has confirmed, they're utterly unrelated.

[cavalieredraghi]

Then why were you talking about God Vati Mortis, and moons becoming disc balls, after he took a serum. And Secondly why would you not wait for me since it was clear I am not having a good time? I was trying to calm down, yet you just kept posting.

[Lord Raziere]

Then why were you talking about God Vati Mortis, and moons becoming disc balls, after he took a serum. And Secondly why would you not wait for me since it was clear I am not having a good time? I was trying to calm down, yet you just kept posting.

because you keep posting and keep getting the facts that I'm telling you wrong, and implying that your leaving without clarifying that your just trying to calm down. and where did you even get this stuff from, your memory can't be that bad. but whatever, do what you want, I'm just trying to salvage what I can, with or without you.

[Rater202]

because you keep posting and keep getting the facts that I'm telling you wrong, and implying that your leaving without clarifying that your just trying to calm down. and where did you even get this stuff from, your memory can't be that bad. but whatever, do what you want, I'm just trying to salvage what I can, with or without you.

Raz... Not the best way to difuse the situation.

Cav, can you quote the post where she says that? Then maybe we can explain it?

[cavalieredraghi]

No I am going to post. It is free form afterall. We can do what we want. Since you don't care.

[Rater202]

No I am going to post. It is free form afterall. We can do what we want. Since you don't care.

Cav, calm down

Also ninja.

[cavalieredraghi]

I am calm. If Raziere is wanting to continue to act like this that fine, I will keep doing my thing. She can do hers.

- - - Updated - - -


yeah but by then, he will be doing it heroically and it actually kind of requires the galaxy-wide media attention.


Basically imagine the Super Saiyan God Form + spirit bomb's energy gathering, but without pure hearts, so instead replaced by fame, popularity and the raw emotions of people beholding you. Since this is less pure, it requires a lot more people to see and have lots of emotion, that was why he was doing all this- the Burnout attack would stir up a lot of emotion and passion and thus generate enough for the ritual Holmarius made to basically make this easier- a ritual that basically has ritual circles in all major cities of Plant, and basically would give him a spirit/divinity form when achieved, but wouldn't be stable until one million PL. he would start at 777,777 PL at be constantly going up, and so on.

problem is, the trigger for the form to actually start the transformation is to basically nearly DIE. because its basically rebuilding his entire body into a divine one. It would've also turned the moon into a disco ball in the process and basically make him become "Disco Mortis" and such, while glowing in aura of a rainbow. whilst "Death By Glamour" plays.


but alas. won't happen now. should've known better, and yes, Hawkflight, I reeeeaaaallly should've done the "Fake Vati" thing right there, since that was what they were INTENDED to do! AAAAArrrrgh, I screwed up my own arc.
This is what I was talking about. anyways.

[Rater202]

I am calm. If Raziere is wanting to continue to act like this that fine, I will keep doing my thing. She can do hers.

Cav, unless you two can reconcile, we can't keep going.

[cavalieredraghi]

Yet she kept going, I don't see why I can't.

[Rater202]

- - - Updated - - -


This is what I was talking about. anyways.

I don't see anymention of a serum anywhere in that spoiler box.

[cavalieredraghi]

Then why was Vati given three vials of serum each being different, each linked to a different PL. He has only taken two.

[Rater202]

Yet she kept going, I don't see why I can't.

Because she didn't know to slow down.

You mentioned it once, and then you said "No, I'll stop."

[cavalieredraghi]

How was it not clear. She was waiting on Callins to say one thing, if I am not posting then maybe, just maybe you should stop as well.

[Emperor Ing]

Okay this is getting out of hand. Cavalier, can you take a step back and try to look at the situation objectively?

[cavalieredraghi]

I tried and failed.

[Lord Raziere]

Then why was Vati given three vials of serum each being different, each linked to a different PL. He has only taken two.

the hyper ki serum has nothing to do with the ritual. its just another potential thing for him to use as an alternate final form.

[cavalieredraghi]

Then why did you get agressive rather then try and explain that to me. I don't need round about words or fluff, just come out and say it. Also I am going to be crystal clear here. Anti regeneration. This mask was designed to take out Oxy, as well as any godly individual.

[Emperor Ing]

Why don't you start, Cavalier? What's your objection explained in such a way that someone not in this game can understand?

[Rater202]

...Why does callins have an anti-Oxy weapon?

[Lord Raziere]

Then why did you get agressive rather then try and explain that to me. I don't need round about words or fluff, just come out and say it. Also I am going to be crystal clear here. Anti regeneration. This mask was designed to take out Oxy, as well as any godly individual.

well too bad, he is supposed to be a hard foe to defeat, I'm not letting you one shot him, he is supposed to be a near-unstoppable fighter of undeathly horror, and I didn't come up with him to get killed in one post, or this arc so that it can be a cakewalk for you where you solve everything easily. thats not how I work.

[cavalieredraghi]

Okay fine.
Through out this whole arc, when ever I had and idea or a suggestion. I then approached Raziere and was completely reasonable, I would be verbally attacked for daring to make suggestions. I would be assaulted for daring to try and help. So I feel that I did not start this. I was simply trying to help, and every time I was attacked or insulted. I am not putting up with it anymore.

- - - Updated - - -


well too bad, he is supposed to be a hard foe to defeat, I'm not letting you one shot him, he is supposed to be a near-unstoppable fighter of undeathly horror, and I didn't come up with him to get killed in one post, or this arc so that it can be a cakewalk for you where you solve everything easily. thats not how I work.

Well then since you can create a Kai of Undeath but I am not allowed to create kai of death fine. lets just do what ever we want and devolve into chaos.

[Ishimi]

Wait, wouldn't a Kai of death just be a god of destruction?

[Rater202]

Oaky! Can we all just step back, take a deep breath, and all calm the **** down?

And no more IC posts until we've got this settled. They're just making things worse.

[Lord Raziere]

Okay fine.
Through out this whole arc, when ever I had and idea or a suggestion. I then approached Raziere and was completely reasonable, I would be verbally attacked for daring to make suggestions. I would be assaulted for daring to try and help. So I feel that I did not start this. I was simply trying to help, and every time I was attacked or insulted. I am not putting up with it anymore.


your suggestions would've all solved the arc too early, or made Vati do things that I didn't want him to do, or made a part of the arc I already had planned unviable, for any fighting to take place. y'know, the thing DBZ is about? Fighting. cool fights. lots of destruction, powering up. solving our problems with our fists and making friends with our enemies by punching them until they see sense? that DBZ? and not just boringly talking about it?

[cavalieredraghi]

your suggestions would've all solved the arc too early, or made Vati do things that I didn't want him to do, or made a part of the arc I already had planned unviable, for any fighting to take place. y'know, the thing DBZ is about? Fighting. cool fights. lots of destruction, powering up. solving our problems with our fists and making friends with our enemies by punching them until they see sense? that DBZ? and not just boringly talking about it?

Yet clearly we don't do that. How many pages upon pages of posts do we have that are talking versus fights. I know we want to have good fights, but clearly that is just not going to be a thing. Role Playing is not just about fighting.

[Rater202]

What did I just say, people?

[cavalieredraghi]

Rater sometimes things need to be said, fights are going to happen, and I choosing this time this is a battle worth fighting for.

[Emperor Ing]

Rater's right. These arguments aren't doing anyone any good other than raising our emotions and preventing us from having any of the dialogue that would actually solve the problem.

Seriously, Cavalier, Stand down! You too, Raziere.

[cavalieredraghi]

I am going to get some sleep.

[Lord Raziere]

yes, there is more to roleplaying than fighting

but I think we can all agree, fighting in DBZ is pretty important. which is why we plan out arcs, with enemies to fight, so that we can have good ones spanning multiple posts, and have a good climax that isn't solved in two seconds, a good fight isn't in how fast you win, its in how well the flow between the combatants happens, in how long and intricate it can be and the tactics they use, not insta-death tactics. DBZ is space opera wuxia, and big part of playing that wuxia? good, intricate combat that is more than just you winning in the most efficient way possible, its about style, its about how the combatant works, its about a worthy opponent that actually challenges you. otherwise you just have one punch man, which can get boring if you like combat.

Edit: fine. I'll stand down.

[Hawkflight]

Well then since you can create a Kai of Undeath but I am not allowed to create kai of death fine. lets just do what ever we want and devolve into chaos.

Too late for that, this thing has been chaos from the beginning.

That said, I think we need to come to some kind of agreement before we continue. We need to work this out calmly and rationally and come to an agreement. To that end, I volunteer to act as an impartial moderator and councilor to you both, to accomplish this goal.

That said, if you accept my help, I would like you both to do something for me. I would like you to, calmly and collectedly, make a list of your grievances with each other, and don't leave anything out. Put everything out there, but do it in a calm and respectful manner. Can you do that for me?

[Lord Raziere]

very well. just tell me how you want it worded so that I say the list as respectfully as I can and not cause any mistakes in communication. I have been trying to be calm and explain this the best I can, so....apparently coming across as angry. I wish there an emotionless emote.

[Emperor Ing]

I'll get out of your way Hawkflight, but if you need help or Cav/Raziere want a second opinion, i'll be happy to help.

[Hawkflight]

very well. just tell me how you want it worded so that I say the list as respectfully as I can and not cause any mistakes in communication. I have been trying to be calm and explain this the best I can, so....apparently coming across as angry. I wish there an emotionless emote.

A straight, simple list will do nicely. Don't leave anything out, but try to remain respectful and objective.


I'll get out of your way Hawkflight, but if you need help or Cav/Raziere want a second opinion, i'll be happy to help.

Thank you.

[cavalieredraghi]

You are un-moving in your ways. You want certain things to happen even if they make no sense storywise
You get hurt and aggressive when someone is simply trying to help, rather then be rational you attack with your words
You focus on Character development over story, and while in many ways this is good, it forces you to forget the over all arc.
You focus on individuals rather then try and think of them as cohesive group. Sure the RA may fight but they are a group
Once you are offended you become sheltered off, and unapproachable. This hurts most when you get aggressive from simple aid.
We are not the original Dragon Ball not all of us are here for pure fights, some would rather role play. Treat this as it is a Role Play experience
Impatience is another issues for you, as much as it is for me. Pacing the story properly is key

[Lord Raziere]

A straight, simple list will do nicely. Don't leave anything out, but try to remain respectful and objective.


Very well.

1. Aspa's warning of the Androids
Why: the Androids were supposed to be lured to the Burnouts because of their own flaws, and I did not want a warning, so that the Androids would be removed from the action so that others can have the spotlight instead of them; the Androids being in the fight would create a conflict of interest because I'm also playing the villains. furthermore, taking the Androids out of the fight would make sure Callins would have a chance to shine, by warning them, he made it so that I had to come up with different reasons for them to go.

2. cavalier's dislike of the Androids capture
Why: Again, he seemed to dislike it even after I explained it, and I spun it show Vati's merciful side, but he did not like it, thinking it somehow made him less redeemable or something. his proposed alternate plan would be for Vati to observe the Androids roaming about the streets from afar and outright kidnapping them for reasons unclear. I did not want this, as this would be seen as Vati taking the offensive for no clear good reason from his perspective, and would be a pointless evil act that I don't see him doing.

3. observed tendency to try and solve things early and within a single post
Why: he wanted to go meet Vati in the club early to talk to him. I could not allow this, as the entire arc had been planned to make sure that Vati and Callins would meet at the end, because thats when it would all be solved. if I allowed that, I would've either had to start the attack early, or let everything get solved and watch all my work on the fights I had planned become pointless. you can see this tendency in his attempt to talk to Vati during the attack early, as well as trying to kill Tailripper in one post. I do not like such attempts, as they are anti-climactic, robs people of an enjoyable fight and devalues all the planning I've done.

4. seemingly getting facts about the arc I've tried to explain clearly wrong and have mentioned to him in some form or other earlier when I was planning the arc in PM's.
Why: he thought for some reason that there was a god serum when I explained that there wasn't and never mentioned any in the original post of Vati's form. I have mentioned various other things about the arc months earlier that he apparently did not remember, and I in fact remember the "Androids being lured by the Burnouts sirens call" as he put it was his idea in the first place, yet he is the one who didn't want them to go, and doesn't seem to be remember such.

5. Heavy-handed judgement of my characters
Why: for some reason he grew suddenly insulting and angry towards the Androids because of their actions during their adventure into the Burnout Bazaar. while it is intended to showcase a flaw of selfishly wanting a break for a day, and while I understand that cavaliered has stated in the past that he has strong emotional connections to his characters, I still think his particular OOC comments there was out of line. a roleplayer must know when to separate oneself, and control their behavior in regard to a game and the characters within. it is a story, nothing more and stories have people with flaws that sometimes makes them do stupid things. this is to keep them from being mary sues. I did not want the Androids to complete paragons of reason who are always right, so I did this to avoid that.

6. Seemingly emotional unclear communication in general
Why: I still do not know what exactly cavalier intended to do from this side that would make this arc interesting. nor has he clearly stated what he wants from me in this arc. he seems to keep focusing on his emotions, saying "I don't like this" or "Callins won't like that" yet not communicating what I should do about that or if I need to anything about it. then he says "just do what you want" and I do so, then he proceeds that he doesn't like it again, without providing any clear reason why or what he had in mind as an alternative. this thus, from my point of view, sends mixed, unclear signals that do not help me in helping him

7. Que and Zoyl's presence
Why: their incredible power was such that I had to explain how it must be possible for Selraika to get the cure for her to have any tension and be a credible villain rather than a toothless threat. Oxyribo guarding the Cure is one thing, but Que's ward would make it impossible, therefore pointless for Selraika and her motivation. furthermore, he has said they can see all futures. therefore implying that wouldn't be surprised by anything and giving the serpents free reign to auto-win against anything. I simply can't work with such beings that twist the plot so much because of their sheer power when they are not even supposed to be PC's. even if they cannot fight, Callins has offered to somehow kill Selraika with Que in one hit and I explained that no, that would be anti-climactic again and devaluing what I've put into this.

also, his strong attachment to his characters plus Que's judgement of the Androids that is similar to cavaliered's own, give me the impression that he might be using Que as a mouthpiece for his more negative emotions on other characters, while passing it off as "just being honest/blunt". I hope I am wrong.

8. seemingly mistaking foreknowledge for permission to prevent the things I have planned.
Why: when we kept stepping on each other's toes I had to reveal more and more information to cavalier to make sure we didn't. problem is, cavalier from my point of view seems to be taking the foreknowledge as permission to prepare against it and prevent the things I had planned from happening, which was the opposite of what I intended. he warned the Androids even though I told him that they were going to get caught before as a part of the plot. in general he took actions to shorten the arc and make it less climactic than actually make it more interesting with good fights as I desired.

can I think of anything else? no. these are all my points. I hope it has been helpful. (emotionlessface)

[Hawkflight]

I'll have to think about this for a bit, but I know Cav has work in half an hour so I'll post this bit now.



You are un-moving in your ways. You want certain things to happen even if they make no sense storywise
You get hurt and aggressive when someone is simply trying to help, rather then be rational you attack with your words
You focus on Character development over story, and while in many ways this is good, it forces you to forget the over all arc.
You focus on individuals rather then try and think of them as cohesive group. Sure the RA may fight but they are a group
Once you are offended you become sheltered off, and unapproachable. This hurts most when you get aggressive from simple aid.
We are not the original Dragon Ball not all of us are here for pure fights, some would rather role play. Treat this as it is a Role Play experience
Impatience is another issues for you, as much as it is for me. Pacing the story properly is key



Can you give us some specific examples of these issues? While I can work with this, it would help us all greatly if you elaborated a bit more.

[cavalieredraghi]

You are un-moving in your ways. You want certain things to happen even if they make no sense storywise. This is clear as you are trying to come up with round about ways to continue to have Vati be aggressive rather then agree that I gave enough info.
You get hurt and aggressive when someone is simply trying to help, rather then be rational you attack with your words. You did this multiple times over PMs, as well as show how you were unmoving from your ways.
You focus on Character development over story, and while in many ways this is good, it forces you to forget the over all arc. You rather show who Vati was rather then build on the story around you, as well as why the Androids were selfish, you pushed their flaw to a level they had never shown before. You act as if you want them to have flaws like we all have flaws.
You focus on individuals rather then try and think of them as cohesive group. Sure the RA may fight but they are a group. You do this all the time as you try to stop the in fighting of the group. Rather then let things be and play out you do the very things You call me out on such as trying to stop action.
Once you are offended you become sheltered off, and unapproachable. This hurts most when you get aggressive from simple aid. Why do you think I stopped talking to you, why do you think I stopped trying to help.
We are not the original Dragon Ball not all of us are here for pure fights, some would rather role play. Treat this as it is a Role Play experience. This is clear we just went over the a few posts before.
Impatience is another issues for you, as much as it is for me. Pacing the story properly is key. This is clear since you would not wait for all players to post during "Action" or stressful part of the story. Rather you would continue to treat it like we were telling a story.



There is my expanded list.

I honestly don't want Callins Que and Zoyl to be fighters. Callins being the only who can hold his own if needed be. I only wanted Aspa to be the fighter of my characters. Callins was to be my Roleplay heavy character. Que and Zoyl were never meant to be my voice, and still are not, I almost gave up on them in fact as I did not know what to do with them. I personal like the Androids, I may have even been the one who gave you the idea about them going to the Burnouts, even if I don't remember. I have misinterpreted information, but I also have been kept at bay when I tried to help, not only kept at bay but insulted and attacked. Who would not start to get emotional at such attacks? Why then would you believe me able to truly read properly, when I am emotional that was caused by you? Reading is already hard enough for me.


My emotional outburst and unclear communication is less unclear communication and more I don't have time to explain everything, and I can not after I find the time remember why I disliked or have lost the words to describe it. I know I have been out of line, but I am not the only one, and I don't appreciated the way you try to make this one sided. We both have erred. However I never tried to use my foreknowledge as a way to break the game, I did logical moves that would make sense to my character. Aspa warned to androids for she knew they would be appealed to the Burnouts. Callins wished to see Vati, for he had only three people that were special in his life Kor, Aspa, and Vati. Why would he not want to go and see his best friend? Characters are not defined wholly by their flaws, but also their virtues, if I seem heavy handed, it is because there is to much focus on their flaws, their cracks, versus that which makes them amazing

( Me addressing Raziere's points with no emotion, and a calm mind.)

[Hawkflight]

Okay, this is going to be a long one, so I'm going to respond in a similar organized list. That said, just because I am responding doesn't mean I don't want you to reply to each other - in fact, I greatly encourage you to read each others' lists and respond to them, using this list as a source of ideas to aid your discussion, before responding to my own points. Also, sorry for taking so long, this is actually longer than my next school paper and I lost half of it to a system crash.


Raz:

I understand this, and I can understand why you think that. However, I would like to ask: is it really unreasonable for Aspa to warn the Androids about the Burnouts, from an in-character perspective? If this would have prevented the plot from moving forward, then this kind of issue should probably be discussed in the OOC thread, preferably with Frozen acting as the final arbiter as he is the one running this RP in the end.
I see where you're coming from with this, but keep in mind that there are potential reasons for this. I have a friend who was so scarred by Discord (from My Little Pony) that she refuses to partake in anything involving mind control, and to such a person, this type of hypnosis or mind control would be far worse than kidnapping or, in some cases, even death. So, Cav, I put the question to you - why is it that you dislike the idea of the androids being hypnotized worse than the idea of their being kidnapped? Can you please communicate this to us?
I'm going to add something to this: Callins automatically knowing which of the Vatis was the real one, when there were several indistinguishable clones. Now, Callins' desire to see his friend after so long is actually perfectly fair. After all, if you were in another country for six years and just got back to your country of origin, wouldn't you want to see the friends you left behind? In that case, the burden is on the storyteller (you in this case) to anticipate this and find a reason why Callins cannot just meet his old friend immediately. However, Cav, I do believe Raz attempted to do this with the Vati clones. And unfortunately, you did ruin that point by just outright stating you found the right one immediately, without giving Raz a chance to say "no, that was just a clone". But it is on the matter of attempting to kill Tailripper with one hit like you're Saitama that I become concerned. In fact, what you did was actually against the forum rules. It is against the rules to perform a "closed attack" on a character controlled by another player, which is what you did. Not only is it against the rules, it is not very fair to the person playing the character. Do you think that in the future, you can remember this and not attempt to "pull a Saitama", as it were? This one is actually my fault, unfortunately. Cav, I should not have pressured you into posting, and for that I apologize.
This is somewhat understandable, as people forget facts all the time. This is why it is important to make sure all your facts are correct. Cav, in this example, you got upset because you thought the serum was giving Vati godhood, which I understand that you felt invalidated much of the point of the half-life serum as a plot device - the idea being that the serum failed and you can't just science your way to godhood. In the future, do you think you can double-check to make sure you have all of the facts straight? Or at least communicate your concerns in a calm manner, staying open to the possibility that you could be mistaken?
I suppose my response here it obvious, but it has to be asked - Cav, why is it that you feel this way and reacted like you did to what the androids did? Even if it was just your characters' thoughts as opposed to your own, the question remains the same - why?
This is a point where I think we can all improve, even me. Communication, I firmly believe, is the most important thing in an RP, the lynchpin the rest of it cannot function without. It's as the old trope says: poor communication kills. That said, this is a question to everyone, but especially to you two in particular: do you think that in the future, you could attempt to communicate better, especially your thoughts and feelings on these kinds of matters?
I have to ask, partially out of curiosity - Cav, why is it so important that Que and Zoyl be so powerful? What exactly would change about them if they were not so powerful? Or if they were powerful, but their powers had negative consequences or drawbacks that made it so they couldn't just use it to solve every problem? Anyways, this is another communication issue. If we had known that his warding the cure ahead of time would be a problem, I don't think we would have done it. As it is, as soon as we knew, Cav did say that the ward could be broken, so I think Que and Zoyl's presence won't necessarily cause significant problems in the future so long as we communicate. Although I may be approaching this from a biased perspective, as I do want to see how Que's and Starlight's relationship develops from this point. As for using Que as a mouthpiece ... having read through a bit of both threads and speaking with him over Skype, I don't believe this is the case, thankfully. That said, Raz, if Cav promises to keep Que and Zoyl from negatively affecting the plot, do you think you can promise to communicate when you feel like his powers would cause problems?
I think this is basically the first point again, so instead of repeating what I said there, I'll refer you to my response to it.

Cav:

I can understand where you're coming from. This is a common issue, not just among roleplayers, but among RPG players in general. You feel like the plot is being railroaded to a certain conclusion, whereas Raz really wants to show off the work she put so much time and effort into writing. Unfortunately, there really is no good way to resolve this particular instance of this, but I feel like it wouldn't have been an issue if the other points we're addressing were resolved. In the future, if this is an issue and you cannot resolve it with each other, do you think you can post your grievances in the OOC thread, or PM myself or Frozen? We would both be more than happy to help you resolve it.
Unfortunately, this matter is something that occurred over PM, and therefore I don't feel comfortable offering advice on the matter. However, if it happens again, please feel free to ask me for help, and I will be more than happy to help resolve things in whatever way I can.
I can see your point here. This is a major difference of roleplaying styles, and I can see how you could get frustrated at seeing all of the attention of Vati, while the rest of the story suffered for it. Raz, I want to make it clear that I greatly enjoy Vati as a character. However, I do feel like the androids' motivations for going to the bazaar were a bit underdeveloped, and I think this is one of Cav's concerns. I, personally, would love to see more of their motivations here. Show, don't tell. What are they thinking? How are their duties affecting them? Has 23's wonder from meeting Princess Celestia and seeing space already faded, to the point where all they want is some time off? I think we would all love to read more about this. However, Cav, I do want to say one thing. You said, "You act as if you want them to have flaws like we all have flaws." However, I do not believe this is a bad thing. Personally, I feel like most characters should have flaws. It makes them more relatable, and helps us get invested in them. I know that we were talking on Skype about highlighting Callins flaws after this arc, and I think there is some great potential for character growth there. Do you understand what I'm trying to say?
So, do you feel like Raz is attempting to "pull a Saitama" to diffuse the inter-character drama in one post, in the same way you tried to defeat Tailripper in one post? If this is the case, please, let us know. Proper communication is very important here.
Again, this is something that occurred over PM, so I can't really help. Again, however, if it happens again, please feel free to ask me for help, and I will be more than happy to help resolve things in whatever way I can.
This, I think, boils down to a major difference of opinion. Some of us like to roleplay, while some of us like to fight. However, at its core, this is a DragonBallZ roleplay, and one generally goes into these things expecting a lot of battles, just like the source material. I know that I did - in fact, that's one of the reasons I created a pony as my character. I wanted to juxtapose the image of the adorable little pony with the power levels of over nine thousand. However, RPs can be flexible, so if you feel like you're not invested in a battle, let us know and we'll be more than happy to do some roleplaying with you as well. And if your character is meant to play a major role in a fight, please, speak up in advance and let us know that you don't feel like you would enjoy it. Do you think you can do that for me?
Unfortunately, impatience is a matter that many people struggle with. It's not something that is easily overcome, however, I do think that if impatience is getting the better of us and an RP is moving too fast, it's important to communicate that. Oftentimes, we don't realize that our own impatience is negatively affecting others. Therefore, and this goes to everyone, if you feel like things are moving too fast and you can't keep up, please, let us know in the OOC, and I'm sure we will be more than happy to let you catch up. And for the rest of us, if someone is having trouble keeping up, please, give them a chance to catch up and give their input on a situation before moving on.
I want to make it clear that I don't expect these problems to be fixed overnight. These are issues that will take time and patience on both of your parts to address. Do you two think that you can take my advice into consideration?

[Lord Raziere]

Raz:
*snip*

1. It is not unreasonable, that I can agree, I adapted to it after all.

3. I tried, from saying that Vati probably moved out of his old home during the six years time to saying that he was probably at a different club for the next announcement, to the Vati clones, but cavaliered just kept saying that Callins would know where to look, so its like, how can I keep them apart if he apparently knows everything?

6. I will do my best.

7. I will try to be more mindful of such them, yes.

8. Very well.

The Cav points:

3. Very well, I can elaborate upon this, though I do admit that I hadn't adjusted my plans in light of the space journey or the meeting with Celestia-those might've given them character development and happiness that would've made this less reasonable than before when 23 was more arguing with people left and right to try and keep everything afloat. these plans have been here before the timeskip, and the Androids were a lot more argumentative an in-game year ago and more focused on keeping the group together.

if there is more I must address, please tell me.

[cavalieredraghi]

Okay, this is going to be a long one, so I'm going to respond in a similar organized list. That said, just because I am responding doesn't mean I don't want you to reply to each other - in fact, I greatly encourage you to read each others' lists and respond to them, using this list as a source of ideas to aid your discussion, before responding to my own points. Also, sorry for taking so long, this is actually longer than my next school paper and I lost half of it to a system crash.


Raz:

I understand this, and I can understand why you think that. However, I would like to ask: is it really unreasonable for Aspa to warn the Androids about the Burnouts, from an in-character perspective? If this would have prevented the plot from moving forward, then this kind of issue should probably be discussed in the OOC thread, preferably with Frozen acting as the final arbiter as he is the one running this RP in the end.
I see where you're coming from with this, but keep in mind that there are potential reasons for this. I have a friend who was so scarred by Discord (from My Little Pony) that she refuses to partake in anything involving mind control, and to such a person, this type of hypnosis or mind control would be far worse than kidnapping or, in some cases, even death. So, Cav, I put the question to you - why is it that you dislike the idea of the androids being hypnotized worse than the idea of their being kidnapped? Can you please communicate this to us?
I'm going to add something to this: Callins automatically knowing which of the Vatis was the real one, when there were several indistinguishable clones. Now, Callins' desire to see his friend after so long is actually perfectly fair. After all, if you were in another country for six years and just got back to your country of origin, wouldn't you want to see the friends you left behind? In that case, the burden is on the storyteller (you in this case) to anticipate this and find a reason why Callins cannot just meet his old friend immediately. However, Cav, I do believe Raz attempted to do this with the Vati clones. And unfortunately, you did ruin that point by just outright stating you found the right one immediately, without giving Raz a chance to say "no, that was just a clone". But it is on the matter of attempting to kill Tailripper with one hit like you're Saitama that I become concerned. In fact, what you did was actually against the forum rules. It is against the rules to perform a "closed attack" on a character controlled by another player, which is what you did. Not only is it against the rules, it is not very fair to the person playing the character. Do you think that in the future, you can remember this and not attempt to "pull a Saitama", as it were? This one is actually my fault, unfortunately. Cav, I should not have pressured you into posting, and for that I apologize.
This is somewhat understandable, as people forget facts all the time. This is why it is important to make sure all your facts are correct. Cav, in this example, you got upset because you thought the serum was giving Vati godhood, which I understand that you felt invalidated much of the point of the half-life serum as a plot device - the idea being that the serum failed and you can't just science your way to godhood. In the future, do you think you can double-check to make sure you have all of the facts straight? Or at least communicate your concerns in a calm manner, staying open to the possibility that you could be mistaken?
I suppose my response here it obvious, but it has to be asked - Cav, why is it that you feel this way and reacted like you did to what the androids did? Even if it was just your characters' thoughts as opposed to your own, the question remains the same - why?
This is a point where I think we can all improve, even me. Communication, I firmly believe, is the most important thing in an RP, the lynchpin the rest of it cannot function without. It's as the old trope says: poor communication kills. That said, this is a question to everyone, but especially to you two in particular: do you think that in the future, you could attempt to communicate better, especially your thoughts and feelings on these kinds of matters?
I have to ask, partially out of curiosity - Cav, why is it so important that Que and Zoyl be so powerful? What exactly would change about them if they were not so powerful? Or if they were powerful, but their powers had negative consequences or drawbacks that made it so they couldn't just use it to solve every problem? Anyways, this is another communication issue. If we had known that his warding the cure ahead of time would be a problem, I don't think we would have done it. As it is, as soon as we knew, Cav did say that the ward could be broken, so I think Que and Zoyl's presence won't necessarily cause significant problems in the future so long as we communicate. Although I may be approaching this from a biased perspective, as I do want to see how Que's and Starlight's relationship develops from this point. As for using Que as a mouthpiece ... having read through a bit of both threads and speaking with him over Skype, I don't believe this is the case, thankfully. That said, Raz, if Cav promises to keep Que and Zoyl from negatively affecting the plot, do you think you can promise to communicate when you feel like his powers would cause problems?
I think this is basically the first point again, so instead of repeating what I said there, I'll refer you to my response to it.

Cav:

I can understand where you're coming from. This is a common issue, not just among roleplayers, but among RPG players in general. You feel like the plot is being railroaded to a certain conclusion, whereas Raz really wants to show off the work she put so much time and effort into writing. Unfortunately, there really is no good way to resolve this particular instance of this, but I feel like it wouldn't have been an issue if the other points we're addressing were resolved. In the future, if this is an issue and you cannot resolve it with each other, do you think you can post your grievances in the OOC thread, or PM myself or Frozen? We would both be more than happy to help you resolve it.
Unfortunately, this matter is something that occurred over PM, and therefore I don't feel comfortable offering advice on the matter. However, if it happens again, please feel free to ask me for help, and I will be more than happy to help resolve things in whatever way I can.
I can see your point here. This is a major difference of roleplaying styles, and I can see how you could get frustrated at seeing all of the attention of Vati, while the rest of the story suffered for it. Raz, I want to make it clear that I greatly enjoy Vati as a character. However, I do feel like the androids' motivations for going to the bazaar were a bit underdeveloped, and I think this is one of Cav's concerns. I, personally, would love to see more of their motivations here. Show, don't tell. What are they thinking? How are their duties affecting them? Has 23's wonder from meeting Princess Celestia and seeing space already faded, to the point where all they want is some time off? I think we would all love to read more about this. However, Cav, I do want to say one thing. You said, "You act as if you want them to have flaws like we all have flaws." However, I do not believe this is a bad thing. Personally, I feel like most characters should have flaws. It makes them more relatable, and helps us get invested in them. I know that we were talking on Skype about highlighting Callins flaws after this arc, and I think there is some great potential for character growth there. Do you understand what I'm trying to say?
So, do you feel like Raz is attempting to "pull a Saitama" to diffuse the inter-character drama in one post, in the same way you tried to defeat Tailripper in one post? If this is the case, please, let us know. Proper communication is very important here.
Again, this is something that occurred over PM, so I can't really help. Again, however, if it happens again, please feel free to ask me for help, and I will be more than happy to help resolve things in whatever way I can.
This, I think, boils down to a major difference of opinion. Some of us like to roleplay, while some of us like to fight. However, at its core, this is a DragonBallZ roleplay, and one generally goes into these things expecting a lot of battles, just like the source material. I know that I did - in fact, that's one of the reasons I created a pony as my character. I wanted to juxtapose the image of the adorable little pony with the power levels of over nine thousand. However, RPs can be flexible, so if you feel like you're not invested in a battle, let us know and we'll be more than happy to do some roleplaying with you as well. And if your character is meant to play a major role in a fight, please, speak up in advance and let us know that you don't feel like you would enjoy it. Do you think you can do that for me?
Unfortunately, impatience is a matter that many people struggle with. It's not something that is easily overcome, however, I do think that if impatience is getting the better of us and an RP is moving too fast, it's important to communicate that. Oftentimes, we don't realize that our own impatience is negatively affecting others. Therefore, and this goes to everyone, if you feel like things are moving too fast and you can't keep up, please, let us know in the OOC, and I'm sure we will be more than happy to let you catch up. And for the rest of us, if someone is having trouble keeping up, please, give them a chance to catch up and give their input on a situation before moving on.
I want to make it clear that I don't expect these problems to be fixed overnight. These are issues that will take time and patience on both of your parts to address. Do you two think that you can take my advice into consideration?

Raz's points

1. It was never meant to end plot ideas. It was meant to be a reasonable in character interaction.

2. The situation of the whole thing, it happening in a club, it being done by a powerful figure. It seemed to similar to a date rape attempt that is often heard of. The situation gave me images of that, that would be my main reason for issues. Even though that is not what happened, triggers should always be carefully handled.

3. It was not attempted, and I felt I could not have approached Raz OOC about it, given her aggressive behaviors from before it happened. So Like many things were I could not have control, neither could the one with me. If we can not talk and come to agreement, then thing should have happened.

4. I do think I could double check, but once again, give the time it happened, due to the way Raz had been treating me, I was not emotionally well enough to have done it.

5. For the reasons behind why the Androids did what they did was not clear. It was in my mind, a half ass attempt to continue a story that could have been better explained. It was a focus on flaws rather then virtues.

6. As With another fight from before I have attempted to be better at communication, and yet in this attempt like I have repeatedly said I treated with aggression.

7. Que and Zoyl are meant to be the catalyst for what will happen after the RA gets to Beerus level of strength. They are not meant to do anything since they know it will bring about more harm. They are just as much restrained by their strength as it is helpful. This is why they run in a fight, why they are mainly social willing to talk and talk down to. They are meant to get the RA ready in the long run for what is to come. They are not and can not solve anything, and everything. They are meant for things that are to come.

8. Since it is a repeat relook at 1.

Cav's points

1. I could attempt this in the future, however Since it is not apart of the RP Frozen is involved in, His final say is not as firm or solid as you would believe.

2. Pms are to be tossed aside then?

3. I had pointed out in Skype that you misinterpreted me. It is not that Flaws are Flaws it is that Flaws are being focused on more then the whole character. A Character is a mixture of Flaws and Virtues and motivations. All we saw was their Flaw their selfish desire for a day off, not the motivation the virtues as well.

4. I don't see how this ties into my 4. statement, could you clarify? especially when I am the one who has to come up with reasons for why Callins can't see Vati rather then work with Raz on that point.

5. See 2.

6. I have made it clear which Character(s) I would like to be in fights and those in RP. In this Arc those characters have barely been able to do this.

7. I feel at times Pacing is improper for the time of action going. If it is simple RP we should and can reply to those who reply to us. In Action we should wait for all to reply given precise actions are more important. Such as Initiative in D&D.

[Hawkflight]

I'm going to let Raz respond before going in-depth about anything, I just want to say a couple of things.


2. Pms are to be tossed aside then?

Well, yes. Unfortunately, I can't really help you with those, since I cannot see them. I cannot offer advice on something I can't see.


4. I don't see how this ties into my 4. statement, could you clarify?

I'm trying to understand what you were saying, as I didn't quite understand what you meant. I see I was mistaken. Could you please clarify what you meant?

--------------------

One more thing, and this goes for everyone, not just Raz and Cav. If you have a problem with one of the other RPers, and you feel you cannot approach them, please, feel free to contact me. I Pinkie Promise(TM) to do whatever I can to help.

[cavalieredraghi]

4. There has always been a focus in the past that our group the RA, is so individualized that we can't get along. Yep we can, and trying to restrict and bring our characters to how Raziere perceives them is no different then what is going on here. I view these characters to act a certain way, yet I feel I am not allowed to call attention to it anymore otherwise I am the one being turned on.

However this would be less of an issues if 3. was taken into account. Does that clarify?

[Hawkflight]

4. There has always been a focus in the past that our group the RA, is so individualized that we can't get along. Yep we can, and trying to restrict and bring our characters to how Raziere perceives them is no different then what is going on here. I view these characters to act a certain way, yet I feel I am not allowed to call attention to it anymore otherwise I am the one being turned on.

However this would be less of an issues if 3. was taken into account. Does that clarify?

Yes, it does, thank you.

[Lord Raziere]

I'm going to let Raz respond before going in-depth about anything, I just want to say a couple of things.


respond to what? what caval said in his latest post?

Raz-P:
1. kay
2. oh. didn't draw that connection
3. I do kinda remember being frustrated, but I'd say "aggressive" is taking it too far

5. I thought between all the warring personalities, arguments, people making threats, trying to destroy the world, people lying to other people, fighting, keep group cohesion, trying to teach a spoiled rich girl how to be strong but not a jerk, fearing two powerhouses that don't seem to be fully cooperative to the Androids point of view, planning to overthrow an empire, negotiating with divinities, welcoming the new recruits on top of keeping up with their training, gathering dragon balls, saving lives, that the reasons for them wanting to at least take one break for one day would be obvious. Apparently not.

6. "one frustrated PM late at night with apology afterwards after my realizing I gone overboard" is "aggression" now?

Cav-P:
3. well a character isn't all things on all days. people have moods, feelings are not set in stone, they change, they shift, sometimes even from day to day, personalities are not an entirely consistent thing

4. then just say so whether you want a problem solved early or not and I'll step off.

6. you have ample opportunities to fight. one-shotting somebody isn't a fight. fighting is not winning.

[cavalieredraghi]

respond to what? what caval said in his latest post?

Raz-P:
1. kay
2. oh. didn't draw that connection
3. I do kinda remember being frustrated, but I'd say "aggressive" is taking it too far

5. I thought between all the warring personalities, arguments, people making threats, trying to destroy the world, people lying to other people, fighting, keep group cohesion, trying to teach a spoiled rich girl how to be strong but not a jerk, fearing two powerhouses that don't seem to be fully cooperative to the Androids point of view, planning to overthrow an empire, negotiating with divinities, welcoming the new recruits on top of keeping up with their training, gathering dragon balls, saving lives, that the reasons for them wanting to at least take one break for one day would be obvious. Apparently not.

6. "one frustrated PM late at night with apology afterwards after my realizing I gone overboard" is "aggression" now?

Cav-P:
3. well a character isn't all things on all days. people have moods, feelings are not set in stone, they change, they shift, sometimes even from day to day, personalities are not an entirely consistent thing

4. then just say so whether you want a problem solved early or not and I'll step off.

6. you have ample opportunities to fight. one-shotting somebody isn't a fight. fighting is not winning.
Raz
3. It was aggression to me, you continually pushed me away when I simply wanted to have a discussion on the points of the PMs, then called me out on it, as if it was set in stone. You took every situation at is worst rather then discuss it like an adult, then we end up here were we both are Frustated/Angry.
5. You mean aside from the 7 days they just had off? Since we were unwilling to RP space we can only assume everyone was taking the time to relax, aside from those who stated otherwise.
6. Look back to 3

Cav-
3. Yet you only focus on the Flaws, Personalities are key to a character, but you forsake all that is good about the character and try to build them up when they don't need it.

4. I don't want the problem solved early, I just expect you to be better then railroading.

6. Maybe you should recheck the IC.
(this was calm)

[Lord Raziere]

Raz
3. It was aggression to me, you continually pushed me away when I simply wanted to have a discussion on the points of the PMs, then called me out on it, as if it was set in stone. You took every situation at is worst rather then discuss it like an adult, then we end up here were we both are Frustated/Angry.
5. You mean aside from the 7 days they just had off? Since we were unwilling to RP space we can only assume everyone was taking the time to relax, aside from those who stated otherwise.
6. Look back to 3

Cav-
3. Yet you only focus on the Flaws, Personalities are key to a character, but you forsake all that is good about the character and try to build them up when they don't need it.

4. I don't want the problem solved early, I just expect you to be better then railroading.

6. Maybe you should recheck the IC.
(this was calm)

Raz
3. I do not remember actively or intentionally doing that. what I remember is you frustrating me because your suggestions and problems made no sense to me.
5. I did not anticipate that, and there a vast difference between a break cooped up on a ship and a two time travelers finally getting back into an environment that finally feels familiar to them beyond one building, after a year of being surrounded by wilderness, cities that look strange and foreign to them and people that don't share of any of their values. culture shock is a thing.

Cav.
3. the Androids have many virtues, and they are all achieve by them simply acting naturally. virtues are easy to portray because they are a form of success, flaws are harder as you have to remind yourself to portray a character who can fail. thats why mary sues are so easy to make, people naturally gravitate towards success when quality stories comes in when characters suffer, and flaws are what make that happen, especially when they suffer for their success. thats why the Androids backstory is so dark and apocalyptic, to make sure there is a solid basis for suffering.

4. and I expect you to be better than trying to solve everything instantly. so, if we both have done something wrong, let us both try not to do it.

[cavalieredraghi]

Raz
3. Just like how I don't actively remember telling you to send the Androids to see the Burnouts.
5. You did not anticipate alot of things despite all your planning. You control the Androids you made them have to suffer. I was simply trying to give suggestion.

Cav
3. You focus on only flaws, You may not want them to be mary sues, and fine what ever that means. You however by only focusing on making your characters miserable show that you one care to be miserable.
4. That makes no sense, No don't do what you just did, it was wrong. Lets not talk about it and instead get into a fight. I honestly expect you to be better as a teller of the story, you should have trusted me that I was not trying to ruin the plot.

New Point 8. I am starting to wonder if you ever trusted me, or anyone here.

[Lord Raziere]

Cav
3. You focus on only flaws, You may not want them to be mary sues, and fine what ever that means. You however by only focusing on making your characters miserable show that you one care to be miserable.
4. That makes no sense, No don't do what you just did, it was wrong. Lets not talk about it and instead get into a fight. I honestly expect you to be better as a teller of the story, you should have trusted me that I was not trying to ruin the plot.

New Point 8. I am starting to wonder if you ever trusted me, or anyone here.

Ok, the other points I'm seeing where your coming from but these just have me going:

:smallconfused:

because its like, completely out of nowhere, out of line and makes no sense. what could possibly make you think I don't trust anyone, or that I only want to be miserable? if the latter was true, I'd still be living with my father, thats misery enough for a lifetime. as for not trusting anybody, your the one who refuses to elaborate on anything and just keeps saying "trust me" without explanation of what your going to do and how it won't ruin the plot even though I keep explaining plot things to you and trusting you to not use the information to mess things up, then you go and do things that mess things up. from my point of view, I shared that information in trust and you went and betrayed that for your own plan of what you were going to do, without communicating to me what it would be, thus not trusting me to accept whatever change you had in mind.

so.....your jumping to some hasty conclusions here. Targulas.

[cavalieredraghi]

Ok, the other points I'm seeing where your coming from but these just have me going:

:smallconfused:

because its like, completely out of nowhere, out of line and makes no sense. what could possibly make you think I don't trust anyone, or that I only want to be miserable? if the latter was true, I'd still be living with my father, thats misery enough for a lifetime. as for not trusting anybody, your the one who refuses to elaborate on anything and just keeps saying "trust me" without explanation of what your going to do and how it won't ruin the plot even though I keep explaining plot things to you and trusting you to not use the information to mess things up, then you go and do things that mess things up. from my point of view, I shared that information in trust and you went and betrayed that for your own plan of what you were going to do, without communicating to me what it would be, thus not trusting me to accept whatever change you had in mind.

so.....your jumping to some hasty conclusions here. Targulas.

You lost the chance to use that when you caused this fight. For I never once said trust me, to you I wanted to discuss, but you continue to forget you got aggressive so I backed down. You came at me, I even used that very word on You once because I felt threatened. You just keep playing boring Flaw obsessed characters Raziere. Do you want you like since you are in capable of trust.

[Lord Raziere]

You lost the chance to use that when you caused this fight. For I never once said trust me, to you I wanted to discuss, but you continue to forget you got aggressive so I backed down. You came at me, I even used that very word on You once because I felt threatened. You just keep playing boring Flaw obsessed characters Raziere. Do you want you like since you are in capable of trust.

you've said it before, and your the one who brought up trust in the first place, and I like how you avoid the addressing of your own flaws by emotionally focusing on how our relationship is, rather than actually taking a look at what your saying and determining whether any of it makes logical sense, then throwing out wild statements that you have no evidence for, or dramatic sounding sentences that don't actually mean anything. from my point of view, I'm just wanting this to all get back on track, your the one holding this up because your not getting your way, which we have ample evidence of you doing in the past. please quit acting like a drama queen, its not helping your case.

[cavalieredraghi]

You call back on attacks and name calling once more. Shows how you are unwilling to admit your faults Raz. You still try to use you frustration as a weapon to make me back down. I am tired of it I refuse. I wont allow your taunts and refusal to cooperate to end this here. You brought is about from your actions in our PMs

[Rater202]

You both need to step back and cool off a bit.

[Hawkflight]

Okay, two things. First off, I think we're getting a little over-emotional here. I think we should calm down, and make sure that we don't resort to personal attacks. (I am not saying that's what's happening, but I don't think any of us want it to get to that point first.) Therefore, I wish to invoke Targalus.

Second, I can't help but feel like most of these problems could have been avoided if you two had simply asked for help resolving this issue early on. So in the future, do you think, if things are beginning to get frustrated like they clearly were in these PMs, or if you have an issue with something another player is doing, you could ask for help resolving them, instead of letting them boil over like this again?

[cavalieredraghi]

I have and will agree to that again. I still however feel an apology is due from Raziere, on how she, in my opinion, had been aggressive, threating, and just blame thuggish she was to me.

[Hawkflight]

Perhaps that is the case. However, I would like to share one of my favorite storybook quotes with you. "To have a friend, you must be a friend." I don't even remember what book it was form, but that one quote has stuck with me for most of my life. I think we can all agree that both parties have erred here, so maybe the best way to get an apology is to reach across the aisle and apologize yourself?

[Lord Raziere]

Perhaps that is the case. However, I would like to share one of my favorite storybook quotes with you. "To have a friend, you must be a friend." I don't even remember what book it was form, but that one quote has stuck with me for most of my life. I think we can all agree that both parties have erred here, so maybe the best way to get an apology is to reach across the aisle and apologize yourself?

problem:
I don't see what exactly I have to apologize for. I've just been trying my best to make this arc good, and the only criticism I've had for it has been from cavaliered, who has been unreasonable in the past about this, so unless other people would like to speak up to agree or disagree on the flaws that I have, I cannot consider his criticism reliable, and would like a second opinion. particularly since cavalier's statements about me are getting increasingly hyperbolic. maybe there is a grain of truth to what he says, maybe there isn't, I cannot be sure until others stop being on the fence about this and blindly assuming that we're equally unreasonable when its clear that cavalier's arguments are not well thought out or make any sense. I'll apologize for any flaw I have that others can agree with cavalier on and confirm that I do indeed possess.

[cavalieredraghi]

For the first time that I am in the right, you are unwilling to admit it. You are unwilling to admit that I am correct. Why don't you just leave then Raziere?

[Rater202]

Cav, chill.

Both of you, this is no time to be playing the blame game.

[cavalieredraghi]

There is not blame game, I want an apology for the way I was treated, but instead she will act as if she has done nothing wrong. She clearly was never my friend for there would have been trust and discussion in the past, she would not have treated me like she did. We would not be here if she had treated me like a friend and trusted me like I trusted her.

[Rater202]

Cav. Do you still have the PM(s) where you felt she was agressive?

If so, quote them and post them here, so that Raz can either explain them or know what to apologize for.

[cavalieredraghi]

I do not anymore, for at the time I did not think it would become this large an issue. I thought that maybe I was wrong, but seeing her act this way now, I know I wasn't.

[Hawkflight]

Cav, Raz, please. I know you're both upset, and your emotions are high right now, but can you please just apologize to each other and kiss (metaphorically) and make up? I really feel like this argument is hurting us all, you two especially. Please?

[cavalieredraghi]

I am sorry Raz.

[Lord Raziere]

Cav, Raz, please. I know you're both upset, and your emotions are high right now, but can you please just apologize to each other and kiss (metaphorically) and make up? I really feel like this argument is hurting us all, you two especially. Please?

I'm not upset, I'm more pointing out how Cav is pulling his emotional nonsense again and getting kinda confused why no one else is seeing this, because its pretty obvious. if you remember our history, he has done with Ishimi when he first came here, he has done with Rater multiple times, and now he is doing this with me, even though I'm pointing out left and right the logical and rational problems in his reasoning, he isn't listening to me and realizing the mistakes he made, an has made multiple times, and I'm not going to stand for him making up hyperbolic things that aren't true about me, then expect me to apologize for traits I don't have, thats not how an apology works. :smallsigh:

edit: oh. very well I accept, what do you want me to apologize for in return?

[cavalieredraghi]

That is up to you Raz you still backstabbed me no matter what you say.

[Rater202]

http://i1064.photobucket.com/albums/u372/xXHetalia-LoveXx/facepalmcombox2.gif

[Emperor Ing]

That is the worst apology I have ever seen in my life. Cav, do you even think you have anything to apologize for?

[cavalieredraghi]

I am not the one who should be apologizing. I am not the one who was the one who was originally handled with aggression

[Emperor Ing]

But is it fair to say you played a part in escalating the situation?

[Lord Raziere]

http://i1064.photobucket.com/albums/u372/xXHetalia-LoveXx/facepalmcombox2.gif

I'm sorry, I have no words for bad that apology was because of you flinging an accusation of backstabbing you in response to my question to try and patch things up, please accept me just quoting this and making it a x4 facepalm combo.

[cavalieredraghi]

I was not this time Ing, for Tax alone allowed it to escalate well before we came in the OOC

[Rater202]

Not helping, Raz.

[Emperor Ing]

I was not this time Ing, for Tax alone allowed it to escalate well before we came in the OOC

So you had no involvement and your role was total passivity, or you said nothing in the discussion that could have been interpreted poorly?

[cavalieredraghi]

I can see how you are allowing my past to bais yourself. You don't allow yourself to entertain the idea that for once I am actually the victim.

[Rater202]

Cav, don't make this a fight between you and Ing, too.

Ing, maybe back off a bit?

[Lord Raziere]

ok, ok: I apologize.

I apologize for not drawing the connection between the hypnotism and date-rape.

I apologize for not thinking of better ways to be flexible in my plot

I apologize for not talking out my plot sooner with everyone

I will endeavor in the future to improve these three things as I see them what I did wrong, as they are concrete mistakes that I can point to as definite things that made other things go awry. I hope that you can forgive me for said mistakes. I will make sure they won't again to the best of my abilities.

[cavalieredraghi]

Thank you Raz, but that is not what I wanted. I want an apology, an insurance that I won't feel threatened by you again. That I don't have to use the safe word that was made for me, on you. That I don't feel small and weak compared to you. That I can feel safe coming to you and trying to talk, rather then what happened every time I PMed you over the last couple weeks. That is what I really want.