How to play CE?

[theboss]

so me and my friends are planning to run this campiagn and i made up a pathfinder fighter build -(12 fighter, 2 ex-champ of C.L, 2 swashbuckler)
so basically, im a part of unseelies fey and demons brotherhood but still humaniod (the strongest humainod among the group) and since my plan is to become Unseelie Fey eventully i have to be choatic and becuase of this brotherhood(demons..) im enforced to play evil character.. my build is more dex than str and i wear light armor with with a dark cloak..
my brotherhood gave me mission to shot down a lawful orgnazition in some city and all my ways of shotting it down doesnt prove my aligment, firstly i "joined" the oragnazition trying to get it crumble apart from inside but that didnt work correctly because of some unwise choices and conversions i made.
my way of fighting is with 2 scimiters and improved trip followed by the knockdown feat . just for give u more information about my character.
so i'd like to hear some advices in how to play CE, ty in advance

[Draconium]

I'm just gonna go ahead and leave the obligatory handbook link right here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?446414-No-Limits-No-Regrets-A-guide-to-the-Chaotic-Evil-alignment).

[Strigon]

Well, the first step is don't be stupid and murder everyone because you feel like it.
While someone who would rush into town to burn down an orphanage on whim would be CE, they'd be a very stupid version of it.

Breaking it down, we get Chaotic - someone who follows their gut and what seems right at the time, rather than living by a code or structured lifestyle - and Evil - someone who doesn't have a problem doing Evil things.
So, by this, you most likely have a selfish character who does whatever they feel like. They might break their word, betray a friend, murder someone, but most importantly they only do this when it would be an advantage. Many groups ban CE characters because some people think it means "I kill everyone I meet because reasons". A character like this wouldn't live long.

For further reading, many people will probably suggest this: A Guide to the CE Alignment (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?446414-No-Limits-No-Regrets-A-guide-to-the-Chaotic-Evil-alignment&highlight=no+limits%2C+no+regrets).

[Segev]

Yeah, that handbook is an excellent starting point. For you, specifically, I would play the character as aware of his own strength. Don't focus on "being CE." Let it come naturally. Play intelligently. Just remember that, to the CE individual, you are your own ultimate authority. Any other to whom you temporarily bow is a patsy or a bully; somebody you're using or somebody you are currently unable to oppose. Remember that the two need not be mutually exclusive, either. Don't look for excuses to be "CE." Instead, look for opportunities where others' blind adherence to conventional "morals" or "ethics" makes them weak, or makes you the only one who sees and can seize said opportunity. Just remember: don't get caught by anybody who can do something about it.

[theboss]

Well, the first step is don't be stupid and murder everyone because you feel like it.
While someone who would rush into town to burn down an orphanage on whim would be CE, they'd be a very stupid version of it.

Breaking it down, we get Chaotic - someone who follows their gut and what seems right at the time, rather than living by a code or structured lifestyle - and Evil - someone who doesn't have a problem doing Evil things.
So, by this, you most likely have a selfish character who does whatever they feel like. They might break their word, betray a friend, murder someone, but most importantly they only do this when it would be an advantage. Many groups ban CE characters because some people think it means "I kill everyone I meet because reasons". A character like this wouldn't live long.

For further reading, many people will probably suggest this: A Guide to the CE Alignment (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?446414-No-Limits-No-Regrets-A-guide-to-the-Chaotic-Evil-alignment&highlight=no+limits%2C+no+regrets).

"Well, the first step is don't be stupid and murder everyone because you feel like it."
In the last meeting of my friends thats excalty what i did... my friend put a note behind my back says " i have AIDS too" and some guy apportched to me (we were at some inn) and laughted at me, cursing me and spiting on me.. so i killed him. suddenly 10 people jumped at me and i managed to kill 6 out of 10 level 11 characters while im only 15... then i just teleported from there (fey legacy feat).

About the second part, my group doesnt really like me(main reason is that case in the inn) but they wont fight me, at the moment i dont beileve i have any reasons to betry them... anyhow, i think i'll try to get along with most NPC in out campign and try to avoid being stupid and try to kill everyone just for being CE, althought its quite fun.

[Aleolus]

Hear me now, thou who is darker than dusk!
Hear, that which is more red than blood!
In the name of that which has been lost to the bottomless abyss of time eternal,
I summon you, Master of the Ultimate Darkness!
RED FEL!
RED FEL!
RED FEL!

[Geddy2112]

Do: disregard authority and social structures
Do: commit evil acts for your own gain
Do: get away with it
Don't: be a murderhobo
Don't: commit random acts of wanton violence or destruction "because reasons" or "for the eviluz"
Don't: be a dingus who can't function in normal society

[denthor]

you blew the d100% dice god call and got me.

Waits for Red Fel(l) with another lecture on good.

C E is simple as long as you are not hurt and the others are you can bully them into doing what you want.

See the green shoeless god of war you take magic items make deals based on your word and keep them until you do not have to.

Lie to get your way cheat to get your way

say you will do things with no intention or better yet say you will do things and forget you ever said it no contract no way to prove what you said.

Do not turn over money magic items sell everything not nailed down

ABOVE ALL NOTHING IN WRITING EVER.

if the party buries something valuable go and retrieve it with others help have it delivered then murder the helpers.

C E can be fun as Red Fel said the current James Bond can be thought of as CE. Occasional acts of heroism do make you a good and decent guy. Save the party just make sure you get saved

Look for every opportunity to extract all the gold you can from a town then do not save them but keep the gold. Protector indeed. Coward.

Await Red Fels assessment of my thoughts.

Being a good is easier and the progression is the same. Evil never sleeps because it know it would betray so it thinks everybody will betray them.

In a game once I sold a mother and baby to goblins for passage know goblin would use the baby as a soccer ball until dead why making the mother cook it to save her life. But I was N E

[Segev]

Hear me now, thou who is darker than dusk!
Hear, that which is more red than blood!
In the name of that which has been lost to the bottomless abyss of time eternal,
I summon you, Master of the Ultimate Darkness!
RED FEL!
RED FEL!
RED FEL!

You do realize he's the LE guy, not the CE guy, right? I mean, his advice will still be actionable, but he's probably going to be biased.

[Aleolus]

Yes, but I don't know who to call for CE. I haven't been formally introduced to any of the big alignment honchos here other than LoyalPaladin and Red Fel

EDIT: Besides, I had the idea to summon him using the invocation for the Dragon Slave spell and I just couldn't help myself

[FocusWolf413]

It really depends on what kind of CE you want. In this situation, you might want to look at Zahir from Legend of Korra. He believed that chaos and disorder were necessary for the world, and was willing to do terrible things to achieve them. The worst part: he was extremely intelligent, wise, and perceptive. He was convincing. He was more than just a BBEG.

[martixy]

It really boils down to one thing:

Be as evil and chaotic as you want.
Evil mostly means self-centered.
Chaotic mostly means a disregard for rules and authority.

If you are asking how to not lose a character in a hostile environment(such as one of dominated by forces and individuals of an opposed alignment), that one is also quite easy: Be NOT stupid/insane.
How hard is that for people to understand anyway?

Here's a quick litmus test on if you should do something:
Why are you doing it?

Note: Because alignment is a stupid answer. That's confusing cause and effect.

[Red Fel]

Hear me now, thou who is darker than dusk!
Hear, that which is more red than blood!
In the name of that which has been lost to the bottomless abyss of time eternal,
I summon you, Master of the Ultimate Darkness!
RED FEL!
RED FEL!
RED FEL!

http://orig06.deviantart.net/00a0/f/2015/140/7/2/94wi6h_by_tuskyhusky-d8u3bfv.gif

Eh, it'll work.


Yes, but I don't know who to call for CE. I haven't been formally introduced to any of the big alignment honchos here other than LoyalPaladin and Red Fel

Fact is, you could do worse. Granted, I loathe CE with a passion, but generally you should be able to call on somebody who hates something to explain everything wrong with that thing, so you can avoid making the same mistakes. That said, I'd like to point this out:


Here's a quick litmus test on if you should do something:
Why are you doing it?

Note: Because alignment is a stupid answer. That's confusing cause and effect.

This. This should be your cardinal rule. CE is all about two things: C, meaning passion, self-expression, and freedom, and E, meaning power and success at all costs. Together, you get a person who revels in the freedom to be himself, and doesn't care how many people have to suffer along the way. Chances are, he actually enjoys the fact that other people suffer when he gets his way. But ultimately, just because he enjoys indulging himself does not mean that he does so for no reason. No Evil alignment should be doing things "for the evulz," not even NE; there's always a (twisted) logic to it, a reason.

So, that aside, let's look at the OP's concept.


so me and my friends are planning to run this campiagn and i made up a pathfinder fighter build -(12 fighter, 2 ex-champ of C.L, 2 swashbuckler)
so basically, im a part of unseelies fey and demons brotherhood but still humaniod (the strongest humainod among the group) and since my plan is to become Unseelie Fey eventully i have to be choatic and becuase of this brotherhood(demons..) im enforced to play evil character.. my build is more dex than str and i wear light armor with with a dark cloak..

So, there's a CE alignment requirement. And apparently an all-defining dark cloak. Cool.


my brotherhood gave me mission to shot down a lawful orgnazition in some city and all my ways of shotting it down doesnt prove my aligment, firstly i "joined" the oragnazition trying to get it crumble apart from inside but that didnt work correctly because of some unwise choices and conversions i made.

Okay, hold on. Let me unpack this for a moment.

So, they asked you to "shot down" - I guess that means destroy - a Lawful organization. Makes sense. "All [your] ways of shotting it down doesnt prove [your] alignment." Okay, what?

Say I play a Fighter. He kills Orcs using a longsword. What does the longsword prove about his alignment? Answer: Lawful Neutral, because it's an Incarnate Weapon soulmeld.

So far, you've told me nothing.


my way of fighting is with 2 scimiters and improved trip followed by the knockdown feat . just for give u more information about my character.
so i'd like to hear some advices in how to play CE, ty in advance

Okay. So aside from being Drizz't, with your dark cloak and scimitars and stupid sexy albino hair, you haven't actually told me anything about the character. "Tell me how to be CE" is a meaningless request. I don't know anything about the character other than his derivative fashion sense and a single failed attempt at espionage.

No alignment is monolithic. Each manifests differently based on the character wearing it. There are too many forms of CE to address in this reply. And without knowing about what kind of a person your character is, I can't begin to tell you which is right for you.

Step one is not to be a dingus. Be good to your party and don't make things hard for them. Step two is a mystery unless I know more about the character.

[Grim Portent]

In general I feel one of the best ways to represent CE is to have little to no decision making process that can be observed from outside your own head.

Say for example a guy gets into a fistfight with you. You could react to one such person very differently from another based on a whim. The first time it happens you may just beat the guy down and then force feed him his own ears, another time you may trade a few blows then offer to buy the guy a drink because you happen to like his moxy for standing up to you for a few hits. If you ever lose a fight you could respond in any way ranging from choosing to respect the victor to murdering them in their sleep. It all depends on if you take a shine to the guy.

A good rule of thumb is that you treat any NPC or PC that you yourself take a shine to, for whatever reason, as if they were your friend. Be nice to them, go out for drinks with them, help them out when they need it, that sort of thing. Anyone you don't like, for whatever reason, you treat with derision, indifference, outright hostility or even violence depending on what kind of mood you're in and if you can get away with it. It may not be wise to attack a prick of a noble in front of his guards, but there's nothing to stop you from slipping into his chambers at night and murdering him in his sleep for having the gall to piss you off.

[Florian]

So, they asked you to "shot down" - I guess that means destroy - a Lawful organization. Makes sense. "All [your] ways of shotting it down doesnt prove [your] alignment." Okay, what?

I think that it means "I was sent to infiltrate a LE organization and destroy it from within. I wanted to do it the CE way but failed at that, probably due to pissing of all the major NPC"

What I don´t know is where the tripping, scimitars and the dark cloak fit in here.

[MisterKaws]

In short, it's "Do everything you want, with complete disregard for morals and ethics", if you are a murderhobo or not, depends on your character's smarts: if he's a psychopath, he might like going unnoticed; if he indeed is, then just kill everything in sight, however obvious the consequences are.

[Zhentarim]

If you want to play a high-wis CE, start out CN, in the sense you make your own path and avoid fetters, but avoid getting in trouble. As you gain power, you don't have to pay as much attention to this as you can plan ahead.

[Yahzi]

how to play CE
In my book, that just means that the only value your character respects is strength.

People strong enough to beat him up are cool and he should listen to them. People who aren't stronger than him are irrelevant and don't count any more than dogs or farm animals. Becoming stronger is the only goal worth pursuing.

Now that doesn't mean he goes around kicking puppies. You can be CE without being a jerk. You can even be merciful, in cases when doing so does not make you weaker.

[Bohandas]

Impulsive sadism

[Bohandas]

Characters to emulate:

-Master Shake
-Bender Bending Rodriguez
-The Joker*
-GWAR
-Bob the Angry Flower
-Hunson Abadeer's archdemon form
-Casanova Frankenstein
-Most of the bunnies from "The Bunny System"
-The cast of the "Retarded Animal Babies" cartoons (though many of them are more chaotic neutral)
-the lantern ghost from the webcomic "Muertitos"

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRG1tWQN6e8
*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efHCdKb5UWc

[Florian]

In my book, that just means that the only value your character respects is strength.

People strong enough to beat him up are cool and he should listen to them. People who aren't stronger than him are irrelevant and don't count any more than dogs or farm animals. Becoming stronger is the only goal worth pursuing.

Don´t use "strength", use "force".

A wimpy but fanatic doomsday preacher can rile up the masses und turn them into a murderous mob.
The old but wealthy guy uses his fiscal power to get things done, and so on.

Being top dog takes many forms, personal strength is just one of them (and possibly the weakest form).

[Âmesang]

People who aren't stronger than him are irrelevant and don't count any more than dogs or farm animals.
Except Arnold Ziffel. He's cool. :smallcool: