Soothsayer (Divinatory equivalent of Warmage, Beguiler, and Dread Necromancer) PEACH

[Bohandas]

Soothsayer

Saves: Fort (bad), Ref (bad), Will (Good)
Bab: As Wizard
HD: d4
Proficiencies: As wizard

Special Abilities
lv01 Lore, Initiative Bonus +1
lv02 Bonus Feat, Magic Trapfinding
lv03 Advanced Learning
lv04 Skill bonus, Skepticism +1
lv05 Initiative Bonus +2
lv06 Bonus Language
lv07 Advnaced Learning
lv08 Bonus Feat, Uncanny Dodge
lv09 Initiative Bonus +3
lv10 Reflex Save Bonus +1
lv11 Advanced Learning, Skepticism +2
lv12 Bonus Language, Skill Bonus
lv13 Initiative Bonus +4
lv14 Bonus Feat
lv15 Advanced Learning
lv16 Improvede Uncanny Dodge
lv17 Initiative Bonus +5, Skepticism +3
lv18 Linguistics
lv19 Advanced Learning
lv20 Bonus Feat, Reflex Save Bonus +2, Skill Bonus, Unshakable Will


Official Spell progression for this class type
lv01 5/3
lv02 6/4
lv03 6/5
lv04 6/6/3
lv05 6/6/4
lv06 6/6/5/3
lv07 6/6/6/4
lv08 6/6/6/5/3
lv09 6/6/6/6/4
lv10 6/6/6/6/5/3
lv11 6/6/6/6/6/4
lv12 6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv13 6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv14 6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv15 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv16 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv17 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv18 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv19 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv20 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5

though it should be

lv01 5/3
lv02 6/4
lv03 6/5/3
lv04 6/6/4
lv05 6/6/5/3
lv06 6/6/6/4
lv07 6/6/6/5/3
lv08 6/6/6/6/4
lv09 6/6/6/6/5/3
lv10 6/6/6/6/6/4
lv11 6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv12 6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv13 6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv14 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv15 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv16 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv17 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv18 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv19 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5 (/3)
lv20 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6 (/4)


Lore: Bonus equal to 1/2 soothsayer level. Stacks with Loremaster lore ability.

Initiative Bonus: Insight bonus of the indicated amount

Magic Trapfinding: As trapfinding but magic traps only

Advanced Learning (Ex): At 3rd, 6th, 11th, and 16th level, a soothsayer can add a new spell to his list, representing
the result of personal study and experimentation. The spell must be a wizard, bard, or Wu Jen spell of the divination, abjuration, or transmutation school, and of a level no higher than that of the highest-level spell the soothsayer already knows. Once a new spell is selected, it is forever added to that soothsayer’s spell list and can be cast just like any other spell on the soothsayer’s list.

Linguistics: Gain a bonus language plus a bonus feat from the following list
Linguistics Bonus Feats: Dark Speech (BoVD, FC1, FC2), Minor Utterance of the Evolving Mind (ToM), Scribe Scroll, Skill Focus (Decipher Script, Forgery, or Truespeech), Utterance of the Evolving Mind (ToM), Words of Creation (BoED)

Reflex Save Bonus: Insight bonus of the indicated amount

Skill bonus: +1 insight bonus each time to one of the Following: Appraise, Decipher Script, Gather Information, Heal, Knowledge (pick one), Sense Motive, Spellcraft

Skepticism: Insight bonus of the listed amount to will saves to disbelieve

Unshakable Will: If a 20th level soothsayer makes a successful Will saving throw against an effect that normally has a partial effect on a successful save, there is instead no effect. An unconscious soothsayer does not gain the benefit of Unshakable Will.

General Bonus Feat List:
Alertness, Appraise Magic Value (CAd), Arcane Disciple (CD), Arcane Thesis (PHB2), Blind Fight, Brew Potion, Communicator (CA), Cool Head (CSco), Diligent, Disguide Spell (CAd), Dodge, Enlarge Spell, Eschew Materials, Extend Spell, Eyes in the Back of Your Head (CW), Graft Flesh (LOM, FF), Greater Spell Focus (Divination only), Hear the Unseen CAd), Improved Initiative, Insightful (CA), Insightful Divination (CM), Insightful Reflexes (CAd), Investigator, Iron Will, Jack of All Trades (CAd), Lightning Reflexes, Magical Aptitude, Magic Disruption (CM), Magic Sensitive (CM), Metamagic School Focus (Divination) (CM), Mystic Backlash (CM), Negotiator, Night Haunt (CA), Obscure Lore (CAd), Open Minded (CAd, EPH), Persuasive, Scribe Scroll, Self-Sufficient, Spell Focus (Abjuration, Divination, Transmutation, or Necromancy), Spell Penetration, Sunlight Eyes (CM), Track, Vatic gaze (PHB2), Widen Spell



Class Skills:
Appraise, Autohypnosis (EPH), Concentration, Craft, Decipher Script, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Handle Animal, Heal, Knowledge (all), Listen, Perform (Oratory), Search, Sense Motive, Speak Language, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival, True Speach (ToM), Use Magic Device

2+int mod skill points per level



Spellcasting:
Intelligence determines spell save DC
Wisdom determines bonus spells and max spell level
Otherwise as Warmage, Beguiler, and Dread Necromancer.


Spell List

Lv0- Amanuensis (sc), Arcane Mark, Dawn (sc), Detect Poison, Detect Magic, Easy Math (S&S) Guidance, Know Direction, Light, Naturewatch (sc), Read Magic, Silent Portal

Lv1- Alarm, Allied Footsteps (cm), Amplify (sc), Appraising Touch (sc), Bloodhound (sc), Comprehend Languages, Dancing Lights, Detect Animals or Plants, Detect Chaos/Evil/Good/Law, Detect Secret Doors, Detect Snares and Pits, Detect Undead, Faerie Fire, Find Temple (sc), Guided Path (sc), Guiding Light (sc), Identify, Instant Search (sc), Know Greatest Enemy (sc), Living Prints (sc), Message, Omen of Peril, Spontaneous Search (sc), Targeting Ray (sc), True Casting (cm) True Strike, Vigilant Slumber (cm), Vision of Glory (sc)

Lv2- Animal Messenger, Circle Dance (sc), Continual Flame, Corpse Candle, Deathwatch, Detect Thoughts, Discern Shapechanger (sc), Erase, Eyes of the Avoral (BOED), Find Traps, Healthful Rest (sc), Hide From Animals, Hold Portal, Listening Lorecall (sc), Locate Object, Low Light Vision (sc), Luminous Gaze (sc), Magic Aura, Master's Touch (sc), Mending, Sanctuary, Scent (sc), See Invisibility, Sleep, Songbird (SC) (oratory only), Speak With Animals, Speak With Plants, Ventriloquism, Zone of Truth

Lv3- Analyze Portal (sc), Anticipate Teleportation (sc), Arcane Sight, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Darkvision, Discern Lies, Find the Gap, Fox's Cunning, Glitterdust, Healing Lorecall (sc), Invisibility Purge, Know Opponent (sc), Know Vulnerabilities (sc), Lesser Telepathicv Bond (sc), Listening Coin (sc), Locate Object, Make Whole, Mechanus Mind (SC), One With The Land (sc), Owl's Wisdom, Protection From Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Speak With Dead, Speechlink (sc), Tongues, Weather Eye (sc)

Lv4- Arcane Eye, Arcane Lock, Assay Spell Resistance, Blessed Sight (BoED), Blindsight (sc), Calm Emotions, Chain of Eyes, Daylight, Detect Scrying, Divination, Enthrall, Helping Hand, Implacable Pursuer (sc), Interplanar Message (sc), Lay of the Land (sc), Locate Creature, Remove Blindness/Deafness, Safety (sc), Scent (sc), Scrying,

Lv5- Commune, Commune With Nature, Contact Other Plane, Deeper Darkvision (sc), Dispel Magic, Dream, Echo Skull, Leomund's Tiny Hut, Magic Circle Against Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Prying Eyes, Sending, Sonorous Hum (sc), Telepathic Bond, Zone of Revelation (sc)

Lv6- Analyze Dweomer, Break Enchantment, Create Food and Water, Dream Sight (sc), Knock, Legend Lore, Lesser Geas, Nondetection, Probe Thoughts, Psychic Poison (BOVD), Secret Page, Stone Tell, True Seeing, Wall of Light

Lv7- Brain Spider (sc), Dismissal, Greater Arcane Sight, Greater Dispel Magic, Greater Scrying, Illusory Script, Leomund's Secure Shelter, Lesser Planar Binding, Mass Fox's Cunning, Mass Owl's Wisdom, Telepathy Block (BOED), Vision

Lv8- Cure Light Wounds, Discern Location, Geas, Greater Prying Eyes, Hindsight (sc), Lesser Planar Ally, Mental Pinnacle (EPH), Moment of Prescience, Scramble Portal (sc)

Lv9- Astral Projection, Awaken, Banishment, Contact Deity (CofC), Cure Moderate Wounds, Eye of Power (sc), Fiendish Clarity (BOVD), Foresight, Planar Binding, Seal Portal (sc), Speak With Anything (MotW)

[Cosi]

The casting seems kind of anemic, honestly. It looks like the Soothsayer gets one solid offensive spell a level and it's a level behind what the Wizard gets. Maybe give him some time/action economic spells/abilities or sneak attack.

Also, all the +1s to random things seems too fiddly. I'd probably give him one bonus, and have it apply to more stuff as he levels up. Maybe change the capstone too.

[Zaydos]

Soothsayer

Saves: Fort (bad), Ref (bad), Will (Good)
Bab: As Wizard
HD: d4
Proficiencies: As wizard

Worse than any of the fixed list casters so it'll need something to help make up for things.


Special Abilities
lv01 Lore, Initiative Bonus +1
lv02 Bonus Feat, Magic Trapfinding
lv03 Advanced Learning
lv04 Skill bonus, Skepticism +1
lv05 Initiative Bonus +2
lv06 Bonus Language
lv07 Advnaced Learning
lv08 Bonus Feat, Uncanny Dodge
lv09 Initiative Bonus +3
lv10 Reflex Save Bonus +1
lv11 Advanced Learning, Skepticism +2
lv12 Bonus Language, Skill Bonus
lv13 Initiative Bonus +4
lv14 Bonus Feat
lv15 Advanced Learning
lv16 Improvede Uncanny Dodge
lv17 Initiative Bonus +5, Skepticism +3
lv18 Linguistics
lv19 Advanced Learning
lv20 Bonus Feat, Reflex Save Bonus +2, Skill Bonus, Unshakable Will


Official Spell progression for this class type
lv01 5/3
lv02 6/4
lv03 6/5
lv04 6/6/3
lv05 6/6/4
lv06 6/6/5/3
lv07 6/6/6/4
lv08 6/6/6/5/3
lv09 6/6/6/6/4
lv10 6/6/6/6/5/3
lv11 6/6/6/6/6/4
lv12 6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv13 6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv14 6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv15 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv16 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv17 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv18 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv19 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv20 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5

though it should be

lv01 5/3
lv02 6/4
lv03 6/5/3
lv04 6/6/4
lv05 6/6/5/3
lv06 6/6/6/4
lv07 6/6/6/5/3
lv08 6/6/6/6/4
lv09 6/6/6/6/5/3
lv10 6/6/6/6/6/4
lv11 6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv12 6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv13 6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv14 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv15 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv16 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv17 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/3
lv18 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/4
lv19 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5 (/3)
lv20 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6 (/4)

Neither Beguiler no DN need 10th level spell slots. Also an actual table is much easier to read.


Lore: Bonus equal to 1/2 soothsayer level. Stacks with Loremaster lore ability.

Why at half the rate as a bard (lore is literally bardic knowledge by another name) or a cloistered cleric?


Initiative Bonus: Insight bonus of the indicated amount

At 13th level this equals out to a bonus feat! That stacks! For ease of reading would have been nice to actually put in the amount (+1 +1 per 4 levels beyond 1st), but this is a really minor ability.


Magic Trapfinding: As trapfinding but magic traps only

Trapfinding is a weak ability already and doesn't need the restriction. That said it's not much of a restriction as most traps that require trapfinding are magic. Still I'd advice against it.


Advanced Learning (Ex): At 3rd, 6th, 11th, and 16th level, a soothsayer can add a new spell to his list, representing
the result of personal study and experimentation. The spell must be a wizard, bard, or Wu Jen spell of the divination, abjuration, or transmutation school, and of a level no higher than that of the highest-level spell the soothsayer already knows. Once a new spell is selected, it is forever added to that soothsayer’s spell list and can be cast just like any other spell on the soothsayer’s list.

A much wider Advanced Learning than the other classes get, but at very irregular levels. Why the weird levels? The regular 4 level progression (a la DN) works better.


Linguistics: Gain a bonus language plus a bonus feat from the following list
Linguistics Bonus Feats: Dark Speech (BoVD, FC1, FC2), Minor Utterance of the Evolving Mind (ToM), Scribe Scroll, Skill Focus (Decipher Script, Forgery, or Truespeech), Utterance of the Evolving Mind (ToM), Words of Creation (BoED)

This is listed as Bonus Language on the not table above. Do they need to meet the prerequisites of the chosen feat?


Reflex Save Bonus: Insight bonus of the indicated amount

Another stacking bonus feat equivalent! This could do with being higher. I'd say just give them a good Reflex save, give them +1/3 levels insight bonus approximating a good save, or at least look at Scout/Swashbuckler to give them their 'middle' save progressions.


Skill bonus: +1 insight bonus each time to one of the Following: Appraise, Decipher Script, Gather Information, Heal, Knowledge (pick one), Sense Motive, Spellcraft

Can I choose the same skill each time? Honestly I'd either increase it to +3 (and not allow stacking) or just make it all the skills.


Skepticism: Insight bonus of the listed amount to will saves to disbelieve

This is equivalent to a really bad feat.


Unshakable Will: If a 20th level soothsayer makes a successful Will saving throw against an effect that normally has a partial effect on a successful save, there is instead no effect. An unconscious soothsayer does not gain the benefit of Unshakable Will.

So 1/2 of Mettle (4th level hexblade ability) at 20th level. This would be useful at 11th, at 20th it's just sort of too little too late.


General Bonus Feat List:
Alertness, Appraise Magic Value (CAd), Arcane Disciple (CD), Arcane Thesis (PHB2), Blind Fight, Brew Potion, Communicator (CA), Cool Head (CSco), Diligent, Disguide Spell (CAd), Dodge, Enlarge Spell, Eschew Materials, Extend Spell, Eyes in the Back of Your Head (CW), Graft Flesh (LOM, FF), Greater Spell Focus (Divination only), Hear the Unseen CAd), Improved Initiative, Insightful (CA), Insightful Divination (CM), Insightful Reflexes (CAd), Investigator, Iron Will, Jack of All Trades (CAd), Lightning Reflexes, Magical Aptitude, Magic Disruption (CM), Magic Sensitive (CM), Metamagic School Focus (Divination) (CM), Mystic Backlash (CM), Negotiator, Night Haunt (CA), Obscure Lore (CAd), Open Minded (CAd, EPH), Persuasive, Scribe Scroll, Self-Sufficient, Spell Focus (Abjuration, Divination, Transmutation, or Necromancy), Spell Penetration, Sunlight Eyes (CM), Track, Vatic gaze (PHB2), Widen Spell

This is the only class feature that makes them more of a diviner. Again you should list levels they gain them (2nd and every 6th level thereafter).




Class Skills:
Appraise, Autohypnosis (EPH), Concentration, Craft, Decipher Script, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Handle Animal, Heal, Knowledge (all), Listen, Perform (Oratory), Search, Sense Motive, Speak Language, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival, True Speach (ToM), Use Magic Device

2+int mod skill points per level

This should go much higher in the class (right below or above the tables is standard formatting following the official classes) not at the bottom. They should probably get 4 or 6 + Int skills.


Spellcasting:
Intelligence determines spell save DC
Wisdom determines bonus spells and max spell level
Otherwise as Warmage, Beguiler, and Dread Necromancer.

Why split stat unlike WM, Beguiler, and DN? It's a significant drawback and unless they have a much better spell list they don't need it.

I mean their class features are better than Beguiler's. Nowhere near as good as DN's (Charnel Touch, the 8th level animate undead buff, the improved familiar which gives you 7th level mindblank) and worse than warmage's, but better than Beguiler's... but beguiler has better toughness, better skills (even ignoring skill points per level) and 4 more skill points per level and then cloaked casting can when it actually matters matter. These have nothing that creates synergies with being a diviner and they're just sort of weaker than the other three before spellcasting. If they were a Transmuter or a Conjurer I'd be expecting that, but the problem with fixed list diviners is that while Divination is great for wizards as it allows them to prepare for tomorrow, a fixed list caster doesn't have that option.

The thing that made DN and Warmage interesting was their class features, things that helped them be a better necromancer or warmage. This doesn't really get that. It gets some small (+5, +3, +2, +1) bonuses to a few things that they barely care about for the most part. Still the spell list matters. Beguiler is stronger than DN or Warmage because it has the strongest list.


Spell List

Lv0- Amanuensis (sc), Arcane Mark, Dawn (sc), Detect Poison, Detect Magic, Easy Math (S&S) Guidance, Know Direction, Light, Naturewatch (sc), Read Magic, Silent Portal

Lv1- Alarm, Allied Footsteps (cm), Amplify (sc), Appraising Touch (sc), Bloodhound (sc), Comprehend Languages, Dancing Lights, Detect Animals or Plants, Detect Chaos/Evil/Good/Law, Detect Secret Doors, Detect Snares and Pits, Detect Undead, Faerie Fire, Find Temple (sc), Guided Path (sc), Guiding Light (sc), Identify, Instant Search (sc), Know Greatest Enemy (sc), Living Prints (sc), Message, Omen of Peril, Spontaneous Search (sc), Targeting Ray (sc), True Casting (cm) True Strike, Vigilant Slumber (cm), Vision of Glory (sc)

Lv2- Animal Messenger, Circle Dance (sc), Continual Flame, Corpse Candle, Deathwatch, Detect Thoughts, Discern Shapechanger (sc), Erase, Eyes of the Avoral (BOED), Find Traps, Healthful Rest (sc), Hide From Animals, Hold Portal, Listening Lorecall (sc), Locate Object, Low Light Vision (sc), Luminous Gaze (sc), Magic Aura, Master's Touch (sc), Mending, Sanctuary, Scent (sc), See Invisibility, Sleep, Songbird (SC) (oratory only), Speak With Animals, Speak With Plants, Ventriloquism, Zone of Truth

Lv3- Analyze Portal (sc), Anticipate Teleportation (sc), Arcane Sight, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Darkvision, Discern Lies, Find the Gap, Fox's Cunning, Glitterdust, Healing Lorecall (sc), Invisibility Purge, Know Opponent (sc), Know Vulnerabilities (sc), Lesser Telepathicv Bond (sc), Listening Coin (sc), Locate Object, Make Whole, Mechanus Mind (SC), One With The Land (sc), Owl's Wisdom, Protection From Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Speak With Dead, Speechlink (sc), Tongues, Weather Eye (sc)

Lv4- Arcane Eye, Arcane Lock, Assay Spell Resistance, Blessed Sight (BoED), Blindsight (sc), Calm Emotions, Chain of Eyes, Daylight, Detect Scrying, Divination, Enthrall, Helping Hand, Implacable Pursuer (sc), Interplanar Message (sc), Lay of the Land (sc), Locate Creature, Remove Blindness/Deafness, Safety (sc), Scent (sc), Scrying,

Lv5- Commune, Commune With Nature, Contact Other Plane, Deeper Darkvision (sc), Dispel Magic, Dream, Echo Skull, Leomund's Tiny Hut, Magic Circle Against Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Prying Eyes, Sending, Sonorous Hum (sc), Telepathic Bond, Zone of Revelation (sc)

Lv6- Analyze Dweomer, Break Enchantment, Create Food and Water, Dream Sight (sc), Knock, Legend Lore, Lesser Geas, Nondetection, Probe Thoughts, Psychic Poison (BOVD), Secret Page, Stone Tell, True Seeing, Wall of Light

Lv7- Brain Spider (sc), Dismissal, Greater Arcane Sight, Greater Dispel Magic, Greater Scrying, Illusory Script, Leomund's Secure Shelter, Lesser Planar Binding, Mass Fox's Cunning, Mass Owl's Wisdom, Telepathy Block (BOED), Vision

Lv8- Cure Light Wounds, Discern Location, Geas, Greater Prying Eyes, Hindsight (sc), Lesser Planar Ally, Mental Pinnacle (EPH), Moment of Prescience, Scramble Portal (sc)

Lv9- Astral Projection, Awaken, Banishment, Contact Deity (CofC), Cure Moderate Wounds, Eye of Power (sc), Fiendish Clarity (BOVD), Foresight, Planar Binding, Seal Portal (sc), Speak With Anything (MotW)

CofC? S&S? Overall they have next to nothing to do through most of the game. I mean as a sage that the PCs go to to pay to scry on someone, but for the most part except for the really random and out of place Glitterdust they don't do anything in combat. Or even in most non-combat encounters. Also why does a Soothsayer not get Augury or Divination? Those seem the most straight up their alley spells; they even get Commune. At the same time you have really random spells like Knock and CMW on their list at levels where they're really late (6th) or completely useless (CMW as a 9th level spell why?). Also oddly missed the one offensive Divination spell.

I'd trim their spell list of the random spells, and give them some in combat utility, possibly either more of a martial bent (Medium BAB, some armor), or the ability to grant insight bonuses or something. Looking at what you've given them and Divine Oracle I'd actually give them Su Evasion/Improved Evasion if you want to go that route, Improved Uncanny Dodge, and eventually continual (self-targeted) foresight is an option. Overall, though, they need a bit well more.

[Bohandas]

Neither Beguiler no DN need 10th level spell slots. Also an actual table is much easier to read.


Those weren't meant to be actual 10th level spell slots; they were included to more clearly illustrate how the pattern deviates, I guess it actually made it less clear in practice.

I'd have made a table but I'm not sure how to format one properly in bbcode

[Zaydos]

Making a table is simple. You go find the base class contest and copy the sample table there. My preferred format includes a bit of fanciness with Spells per Day and alt2 instead of 'grid' but it's pretty simple to make either way. Easiest, though, is to find a class with a working table, quote it, copy the table, not actually post the quote, and then refill the table.

CLASS NAME


Level
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Special

Spells per Day








1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th


1st









3
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


2nd









4
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


3rd









5
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


4th









6
3
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


5th









6
4
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


6th









6
5
3
-
-
-
-
-
-


7th









6
6
4
-
-
-
-
-
-


8th









6
6
5
3
-
-
-
-
-


9th









6
6
6
4
-
-
-
-
-


10th









6
6
6
5
3
-
-
-
-


11th









6
6
6
6
4
-
-
-
-


12th









6
6
6
6
5
3
-
-
-


13th









6
6
6
6
6
4
-
-
-


14th









6
6
6
6
6
5
3
-
-


15th









6
6
6
6
6
6
4
-
-


16th









6
6
6
6
6
6
5
3
-


17th









6
6
6
6
6
6
6
4
-


18th









6
6
6
6
6
6
6
5
3


19th









6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
4


20th









6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
5

[Bohandas]

CofC? S&S?

Call of Cthulhu D20 and Song And Silence, respectively


Why split stat unlike WM, Beguiler, and DN? It's a significant drawback and unless they have a much better spell list they don't need it.


Mostly because there's no precedent for a wisdom based arcane caster.

Hmm...What if I had it use the higher of the two scores for bonus spells?

[OttoVonBigby]

I like the concept a lot, but I agree with many of the above comments regarding its "meh" mechanics as-is. I feel like, to justify not playing a straight-up Div specialist wizard instead, the class needs to be noticeably more potent at its core "mission" (divination) than anybody else at similar levels--along the lines of the dread necro. Less versatility, more potency at its "one job."

To me, "soothsayer" implies the following, in order of importance:

1- telling people what the future holds, whether based on actual magical knowledge or logical prediction/inference;
...1a: see the Soothsayer character from Shakespeare's Julius Caesar, who predicts the day of Caesar's death. Right now this class gets deathwatch at level 2, later than Clerics and Dread Necros, when they should get it earlier. There's predecent, too: the Healer class from Miniatures Handbook gets it as a level 0 spell.

2- interpreting the will of the gods (see ancient Roman augury (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augur)), though you can of course ignore this if you don't want any religious fluff at all;

3- having a lot of general knowledge, particularly about the past;

4- being the weirdo in town, or some manner of hermit, mendicant, or vagabond.

I won't offer any other mechanical advice because I lack experience with divination from the player perspective. From what I've read, IIRC it seems like the diviner-style PC is a concept D&D doesn't support that well, but I wouldn't swear to it. I'd research other discussions of divination (and particularly homebrewed diviner classes) if I were you.

But I will say this: if you concur with my fluff-ish opinions above, I think for D&D purposes it might make sense to give them skills and class features that boost their social/diplomancy capabilities, since people will be coming to soothsayers asking for their insights. Alternately, you could expressly NOT give them much of a chance to be socially adept, on account of the "weirdo" factor--plus the fact that a lot of the time people won't like what the soothsayer's predictions are! :smallbiggrin: It kind of depends on what flavor you want for the class.

[Bohandas]

ok,better formatted version

The Soothsayer


Level
BAB
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Special

Spells per Day








0st
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th


1st

0

0

0

2
Lore, Initiative Bonus +1
5
3
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


2nd

1

0

0

3
Bonus Feat, Magic Trapfinding
6
4
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


3rd

1

1

1


Advanced Learning
6
5
3
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


4th

2

1

1

3
Skill bonus, Skepticism +1
6
6
4
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


5th

2

1

1

4
Initiative Bonus +2
6
6
5
3
-
-
-
-
-
-


6th

3

2

2

5
Bonus Language
6
6
6
4
-
-
-
-
-
-


7th

3

2

2

5
Advnaced Learning
6
6
6
5
3
-
-
-
-
-


8th

4

2

2

6
Bonus Feat, Uncanny Dodge
6
6
6
6
4
-
-
-
-
-


9th

4

3

3

6
Initiative Bonus +3
6
6
6
6
5
3
-
-
-
-


10th

5

3

3

7
Reflex Save Bonus +1
6
6
6
6
6
4
-
-
-


11th

5

3

3

7
Advanced Learning, Skepticism +2
6
6
6
6
6
5
3
-
-
-


12th

6/1

4

4

8
Bonus Language, Skill Bonus
6
6
6
6
6
6
4
-
-
-


13th

6/1

4

4

8
Initiative Bonus +4
6
6
6
6
6
6
5
3
-
-


14th

7/2

4

4

9
Bonus Feat
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
4
-
-


15th

7/2

5

5

9
Advanced Learning
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
5
3
-


16th

8/3

5

5

10
Improvede Uncanny Dodge
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
4
-


17th

8/3

5

5

10
Initiative Bonus +5, Skepticism +3
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
5
3


18th

9/4

6

6

11
Lingusitics
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
4


19th

9/4

6

6

11
Advanced Learning
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
5


20th

10/6

6

6

12
Bonus Feat, Reflex Save Bonus +2, Skill Bonus, Unshakable Will
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6
6



Lore: Bonus equal to 1/2 soothsayer level. Stacks with Loremaster lore ability.

Initiative Bonus: Insight bonus of the indicated amount

Magic Trapfinding: As trapfinding but magic traps only

Advanced Learning: At 3rd, 6th, 11th, and 16th level, a soothsayer can add a new spell to his list, representing
the result of personal study and experimentation. The spell must be a wizard, bard, or Wu Jen spell of the divination, abjuration, or transmutation school, and of a level no higher than that of the highest-level spell the soothsayer already knows. Once a new spell is selected, it is forever added to that soothsayer’s spell list and can be cast just like any other spell on the soothsayer’s list.

Linguistics: Gain a bonus language plus a bonus feat from the following list
Linguistics Bonus Feats: Dark Speech (BoVD, FC1, FC2), Minor Utterance of the Evolving Mind (ToM), Scribe Scroll, Skill Focus (Decipher Script, Forgery, or Truespeech), Utterance of the Evolving Mind (ToM), Words of Creation (BoED)

Reflex Save Bonus (su): Insight bonus of the indicated amount

Skill bonus: +1 insight bonus each time to one of the Following: Appraise, Decipher Script, Gather Information, Heal, Knowledge (pick one), Sense Motive, Spellcraft

Skepticism: Insight bonus of the listed amount to will saves to disbelieve

Uncanny Dodge (Su)

This is similar to the rogue ability, but is asupernatural divination effect and thus does not work in an antimagic field or against attackers protected by mind blank or nondetection. Starting at 8th level, a soothsayer can react to danger before her senses would normally allow her to do so. She retains her Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if she is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, she still loses her Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized.

If a soothsayer already has uncanny dodge from a different class she automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.


Improved Uncanny Dodge (Su)

This is similar to the rogue ability, but is a supernatural divination effect and thus does not work in an antimagic field or against attackers protected by mind blank. A soothsayer of 16th level or higher can no longer be flanked.

This defense denies another rogue the ability to sneak attack the character by flanking her, unless the attacker has rogue levels at least equal to their soothsayer level.

If a character already has uncanny dodge from a second class, the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead, and the levels from the classes that grant uncanny dodge stack to determine the minimum rogue level required to flank the character.

Unshakable Will: If a 20th level soothsayer makes a successful Will saving throw against an effect that normally has a partial effect on a successful save, there is instead no effect. An unconscious soothsayer does not gain the benefit of Unshakable Will.

General Bonus Feat List:
Alertness, Appraise Magic Value (CAd), Arcane Disciple (CD), Arcane Thesis (PHB2), Blind Fight, Brew Potion, Communicator (CA), Cool Head (CSco), Diligent, Disguide Spell (CAd), Dodge, Enlarge Spell, Eschew Materials, Extend Spell, Eyes in the Back of Your Head (CW), Graft Flesh (LOM, FF), Greater Spell Focus (Divination only), Hear the Unseen CAd), Improved Initiative, Insightful (CA), Insightful Divination (CM), Insightful Reflexes (CAd), Investigator, Iron Will, Jack of All Trades (CAd), Lightning Reflexes, Magical Aptitude, Magic Disruption (CM), Magic Sensitive (CM), Metamagic School Focus (Divination) (CM), Mystic Backlash (CM), Negotiator, Night Haunt (CA), Obscure Lore (CAd), Open Minded (CAd, EPH), Persuasive, Scribe Scroll, Self-Sufficient, Spell Focus (Abjuration, Divination, Transmutation, or Necromancy), Spell Penetration, Sunlight Eyes (CM), Track, Vatic gaze (PHB2), Widen Spell



Class Skills:
Appraise, Autohypnosis (EPH), Concentration, Craft, Decipher Script, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Handle Animal, Heal, Knowledge (all), Listen, Perform (Oratory), Search, Sense Motive, Speak Language, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival, True Speach (ToM), Use Magic Device

2+int mod skill points per level



Spellcasting:
Intelligence or Wisdom, whichever is currently higher determines spell save DC and max spell level
Intelligence determines bonus spells
Otherwise as Warmage, Beguiler, and Dread Necromancer.


Spell List

Lv0- Amanuensis (sc), Arcane Mark, Dawn (sc), Detect Poison, Detect Magic, Easy Math (S&S) Guidance, Know Direction, Light, Naturewatch (sc), Read Magic, Silent Portal

Lv1- Alarm, Allied Footsteps (cm), Amplify (sc), Appraising Touch (sc), Bloodhound (sc), Comprehend Languages, Dancing Lights, Detect Animals or Plants, Detect Chaos/Evil/Good/Law, Detect Secret Doors, Detect Snares and Pits, Detect Undead, Faerie Fire, Find Temple (sc), Guided Path (sc), Guiding Light (sc), Identify, Instant Search (sc), Know Greatest Enemy (sc), Living Prints (sc), Message, Omen of Peril, Spontaneous Search (sc), Targeting Ray (sc), True Casting (cm) True Strike, Vigilant Slumber (cm), Vision of Glory (sc)

Lv2- Animal Messenger, Circle Dance (sc), Continual Flame, Corpse Candle, Deathwatch, Detect Thoughts, Discern Shapechanger (sc), Erase, Eyes of the Avoral (BOED), Find Traps, Healthful Rest (sc), Hide From Animals, Hold Portal, Listening Lorecall (sc), Locate Object, Low Light Vision (sc), Luminous Gaze (sc), Magic Aura, Master's Touch (sc), Mending, Sanctuary, Scent (sc), See Invisibility, Sleep, Songbird (SC) (oratory only), Speak With Animals, Speak With Plants, Ventriloquism, Zone of Truth

Lv3- Analyze Portal (sc), Anticipate Teleportation (sc), Arcane Sight, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Darkvision, Discern Lies, Find the Gap, Fox's Cunning, Glitterdust, Healing Lorecall (sc), Invisibility Purge, Know Opponent (sc), Know Vulnerabilities (sc), Lesser Telepathicv Bond (sc), Listening Coin (sc), Locate Object, Make Whole, Mechanus Mind (SC), One With The Land (sc), Owl's Wisdom, Protection From Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Speak With Dead, Speechlink (sc), Tongues, Weather Eye (sc)

Lv4- Arcane Eye, Arcane Lock, Assay Spell Resistance, Blessed Sight (BoED), Blindsight (sc), Calm Emotions, Chain of Eyes, Daylight, Detect Scrying, Divination, Enthrall, Helping Hand, Implacable Pursuer (sc), Interplanar Message (sc), Lay of the Land (sc), Locate Creature, Remove Blindness/Deafness, Safety (sc), Scent (sc), Scrying,

Lv5- Commune, Commune With Nature, Contact Other Plane, Deeper Darkvision (sc), Dispel Magic, Dream, Echo Skull, Leomund's Tiny Hut, Magic Circle Against Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Prying Eyes, Sending, Sonorous Hum (sc), Telepathic Bond, Zone of Revelation (sc)

Lv6- Analyze Dweomer, Break Enchantment, Create Food and Water, Dream Sight (sc), Knock, Legend Lore, Lesser Geas, Nondetection, Probe Thoughts, Psychic Poison (BOVD), Secret Page, Stone Tell, True Seeing, Wall of Light

Lv7- Brain Spider (sc), Dismissal, Greater Arcane Sight, Greater Dispel Magic, Greater Scrying, Illusory Script, Leomund's Secure Shelter, Lesser Planar Binding, Mass Fox's Cunning, Mass Owl's Wisdom, Telepathy Block (BOED), Vision

Lv8- Cure Light Wounds, Discern Location, Geas, Greater Prying Eyes, Hindsight (sc), Lesser Planar Ally, Mental Pinnacle (EPH), Moment of Prescience, Scramble Portal (sc)

Lv9- Astral Projection, Awaken, Banishment, Contact Deity (CofC), Cure Moderate Wounds, Eye of Power (sc), Fiendish Clarity (BOVD), Foresight, Planar Binding, Seal Portal (sc), Speak With Anything (MotW)

[Goaty14]

Mostly because there's no precedent for a wisdom based arcane caster.

Then you make a precedent, because it's called "homebrew", not "do-what-wotc-did-but-make-it-slightly-different".


Lv8- Cure Light Wounds

Lv9- Cure Moderate Wounds

I am disappointed, maybe you will add Cure Minor Wounds as a 7th level spell as well? (If you want healing, add Lesser Vigor to the spell list instead)

[noob]

Why is awaken a ninth level spell and why is it in that list?

[Bohandas]

It sort-of fits but not well, so I stuck it at a higher than normal level

[noob]

Illusory Script as a seventh level spell is again a spell at a way too high level: at that level everybody can get the tools to counter it.
Also in which way does this spell could possibly fit as a spell for a diviner?
major image would make as much sense for a diviner.
illusion magic is some form of overlap with beguiler.
I suggest you go and ask jormengad for information about his class about combining two schools of magic then pick spells who fits in divination and another school at once and add them to your list instead of many of the weird fits.