Help me make a melee wild magic sorcerer?

[alphashorty1]

Okay so, long story short is I'm still relatively new to this stuff. 5e is my first edition. Friend is making a new campaign with a lot of restrictions.

Everyone must be an adolescent wild magic sorcerer. We are all classmates in a school in a world where magic is an every day occurance. We cannot multi class ever. On the other hand he is allowing us to pick a weapon to imbue as our arcane focus so that we can wield one handed weapons and still cast somatic spells.

Given these restrictions, I figured there will be a lot of similarities between the 6 of us and I don't like that. So I've decided to make a tanky melee guy who prefers to only use magic to accentuate his physical prowess... Because after all... What good is magic if everyone can do it?

I've decided to be a mountain dwarf to get the proficiencys up to medium armor. Plan to take the feat for warcasting at 4 and then heavy armor at 7. Until then I'll wear medium armor as I have the max +2 dex in starting stats and use shield frequently. Hes a brewer, background guild artisan in brewing and distilling. Standard dwarf who wants to beat stuff instead of finesse.

Question is, what should I do about the spell point stuff. I was thinking quickened spell is a must, but not sure on the others.

Any spells that should be a must? I'd prefer to have anything that accentuates melee like shocking grasp and blade ward.

Any items I should definitely try to locate? I don't know what items exist in this world yet except like a bag of holding.

It's going to be a challenge and I'd love creative ideas. Just make me hit like a truck, get hit less, and make it look as far from the traditional ranged caster as possible! Let's have fun with this.

[ZenBear]

Ask your DM to allow you to take the weapon cantrips from the Sword Coast Adventures Guide. Booming Blade, Greenflame Blade, Sword Burst, Lightning Lure. They're not accessible to Sorcs by RAW iirc, but I expect your DM might allow it for the sake of variety, since he's already houseruling weapon foci and forcing everyone to be Wild Sorcs.

Other than that, Shield and Absorb Elements are solid tanking spells. Blur, Haste, Mirror Image, etc. I don't know the Sorc spell list so these might not be available, but again discuss it with your DM.

[RulesJD]

Ask your DM to allow you to take the weapon cantrips from the Sword Coast Adventures Guide. Booming Blade, Greenflame Blade, Sword Burst, Lightning Lure. They're not accessible to Sorcs by RAW iirc, but I expect your DM might allow it for the sake of variety, since he's already houseruling weapon foci and forcing everyone to be Wild Sorcs.

Other than that, Shield and Absorb Elements are solid tanking spells. Blur, Haste, Mirror Image, etc. I don't know the Sorc spell list so these might not be available, but again discuss it with your DM.

1. The SCAG cantrips are given to Sorcerors.

2. Absorb Elements is NOT given to Sorcerors. Why not? No idea, it's stupid.

If you want to be the Tank sorc, Draconic is much better. Spell slot saved from always on mage armor + more health + easy access to fire resist + more damage from your SCAG Greenflame Blade.

[eastmabl]

Here's my wild magic melee sorcerer build.

* Stout halfling for racial bonus to Dex and Con, with 16s in both ability scores.
* Dump Charisma (or at least make it a 10). Focus on spells that don't have saving throws.
* Dump Strength, because you're going to focus on Finesse weapons.
* Dump Intelligence, because you don't need it.
* Make sure you have an okay Wisdom score, because failing those saves are terrible.
* Daggers (two of 'em for twice the attacks).
* Mage armor spell (16 AC)
* Shield spell (21 AC when you don't have the HP to spare).
* Subtle spell so you don't have to sheathe a weapon to cast a spell.
* Increase Dex to 20 ASAP, and then focus on Con and Cha.
* Use subsequent spells to improve melee proficiency. Haste is clutch, as is Enhance Ability and Blur.

First level: 9 HP, 16 (21) AC and two attacks at +5.
Fifth level: 36 HP, 17 (22) AC and two attacks at +7.
Tenth level: 77 HP, 18 (23) AC and two attacks at +9.

It's going to trail the survivability and damage output of the real martial classes, but you already knew that.

As noted previously, try to get SCAG cantrips. They're very good for the type of build you're making. If so, you might consider alternating Dex and Cha ASIs.

[eastmabl]

If you want to be the Tank sorc, Draconic is much better. Spell slot saved from always on mage armor + more health + easy access to fire resist + more damage from your SCAG Greenflame Blade.

Not a bad thought, but OP said:


Everyone must be an adolescent wild magic sorcerer.

[ZenBear]

1. The SCAG cantrips are given to Sorcerors.

2. Absorb Elements is NOT given to Sorcerors. Why not? No idea, it's stupid.

If you want to be the Tank sorc, Draconic is much better. Spell slot saved from always on mage armor + more health + easy access to fire resist + more damage from your SCAG Greenflame Blade.

Perfect! Grab those cantrips, DEX 14 for medium armor, pump STR (try 14/14/14/10/10/10, your MDwarf stats will bring STR/CON to 16 at level 1), try to convince your DM to allow you to take AE (not the end of the world if he says no), focus on spells without saves so you can get by with a low CHA.

[Spectre9000]

Tank Sorcerer Build:

Hill Dwarf Favored Soul (War) Sorcerer 1-20, because you need the health and AC. Favored Soul also gives you an extra attack, the proficiencies you need, and the spells to keep you tanking.

Stats (Point Buy, with Hill Dwarf racials):
15 14 16 8 9 12

At level 1:

You have proficiency with medium armor, shields, and warhammers.
You have 10 health.
You have 12 AC, so immediately go buy Scale Mail and a Shield for an AC of 18.
You have the spell from the War Domain, Shield of Faith, which gives you a +2 Bonus to AC, for a total of 20.
Select Booming Blade as one of your cantrips.
Select Shield and False Life as your 1st level spells.



At level 3:

You Spiritual Weapon, which will give you an additional attack essentially as a bonus action.
You gain Metamagic: pick up Quickened and Twinned Spells
You should also have gained the spells Expeditious Retreat, and Misty Step, to be able to move when you really need to as you're short and thus slow.



At Level 6:

You picked up the Tough Feat at level 4.
Your Booming Blade does 1D8 damage since level 5. You can Twin it an quicken it, for a total possible 3 attacks on a turn. This takes a large number of sorcerer points, however, which is why you also have Spiritual Weapon. Use this only if you really need to nova. This damage increases to 2D8 at level 11, and 3D8 at level 17.
You get a second attack, which isn't that big a deal since you have BB, however it is still good if you ever enter an anti-magic field.
You should have gained the Haste spell, which gives you +2 AC akin to Shield of Faith, but also gives you another single attack as a separate action (so BB then attack, or Twin BB, attack, Quickened BB/Spiritual Weapon for 4 attacks), doubles your speed, and gives adv on dex saving throws.
You should have Half-Plate by now, to bring your AC to 21 with Haste/Shield of Faith; bonus points to Mithral Half-Plate so you don't get disadvantage to stealth checks.
Your Health should be around 60 now (47-72).



From here you can go wherever you like, but you're very tanky now with 21 AC (which will grow as you get magic armor and shield) and a good amount of health. You also deal decent damage with three attacks (BB, Haste Attack, Spiritual Weapon/Quickened BB; 4 if you twin your BB). You can also get where you need to with Haste, Expeditious Retreat, and Misty Step.

Also, Warcaster isn't an immediate necessity due to the rules allowing you to stow your weapon when you go to cast a spell (BB has no somatic components so no need to stow your weapon), and on the next turn draw your weapon when you go to make an attack. As you will be getting hit, it does help to maintain your Haste and Shield of Faith, however, so perhaps think of picking up Warcaster at level 8. your immediate concern early on is getting tanky as that's your primary purpose, which is why the Tough Feat is important.

[ZenBear]

Tank Sorcerer Build:

Hill Dwarf Favored Soul (War) Sorcerer 1-20, because you need the health and AC. Favored Soul also gives you an extra attack, the proficiencies you need, and the spells to keep you tanking.

Stats (Point Buy, with Hill Dwarf racials):
15 14 16 8 9 12

At level 1:

You have proficiency with medium armor, shields, and warhammers.
You have 10 health.
You have 12 AC, so immediately go buy Scale Mail and a Shield for an AC of 18.
You have the spell from the War Domain, Shield of Faith, which gives you a +2 Bonus to AC, for a total of 20.
Select Booming Blade as one of your cantrips.
Select Shield and False Life as your 1st level spells.



At level 3:

You Spiritual Weapon, which will give you an additional attack essentially as a bonus action.
You gain Metamagic: pick up Quickened and Twinned Spells
You should also have gained the spells Expeditious Retreat, and Misty Step, to be able to move when you really need to as you're short and thus slow.



At Level 6:

You picked up the Tough Feat at level 4.
Your Booming Blade does 1D8 damage since level 5. You can Twin it an quicken it, for a total possible 3 attacks on a turn. This takes a large number of sorcerer points, however, which is why you also have Spiritual Weapon. Use this only if you really need to nova. This damage increases to 2D8 at level 11, and 3D8 at level 17.
You get a second attack, which isn't that big a deal since you have BB, however it is still good if you ever enter an anti-magic field.
You should have gained the Haste spell, which gives you +2 AC akin to Shield of Faith, but also gives you another single attack as a separate action (so BB then attack, or Twin BB, attack, Quickened BB/Spiritual Weapon for 4 attacks), doubles your speed, and gives adv on dex saving throws.
You should have Half-Plate by now, to bring your AC to 21 with Haste/Shield of Faith; bonus points to Mithral Half-Plate so you don't get disadvantage to stealth checks.
Your Health should be around 60 now (47-72).



From here you can go wherever you like, but you're very tanky now with 21 AC (which will grow as you get magic armor and shield) and a good amount of health. You also deal decent damage with three attacks (BB, Haste Attack, Spiritual Weapon/Quickened BB). You can also get where you need to with Haste, Expeditious Retreat, and Misty Step.

Also, Warcaster isn't an immediate necessity due to the rules allowing you to stow your weapon when you go to cast a spell (BB has no somatic components so no need to stow your weapon), and on the next turn draw your weapon when you go to make an attack. As you will be getting hit, it does help to maintain your Haste and Shield of Faith, however, so perhaps think of picking up Warcaster at level 8. your immediate concern early on is getting tanky as that's your primary purpose, which is why the Tough Feat is important.

That's a fine idea. Too bad he can't be a Favored Soul.

[alphashorty1]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the input but yea... We all have to be wild magic sorcerers. Dm plans on ALOT of wild magic surges.

I'll look into the SCAG cantrips because they sound fun... I just have a hard time dumping charisma but it makes sense if there is no save. I will just have a harder + to hit

[RulesJD]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the input but yea... We all have to be wild magic sorcerers. Dm plans on ALOT of wild magic surges.

I'll look into the SCAG cantrips because they sound fun... I just have a hard time dumping charisma but it makes sense if there is no save. I will just have a harder + to hit

If you could 3 level dip Warlock you'd be set, but since you can't:

I would say go Variant Human for Magic Initiate (Mage Armor + 2 SCAG cantrips).

Str = 8
Dex = 16 (+1)
Con = 14
Int = 8
Wis = 10
Cha = 16 (+1)

From here, you use Mage Armor at the start of every day to get 16 AC, which is what you'd like have with Medium armor anyways. It normally uses a spell slot which would suck for a Sorc, but Magic Initiate takes care of that. Better yet, as you increase Dex to up your melee damage, you'll up your AC as well. Getting to 20 Dex = 18 AC, which is better than you'd be able to achieve in Medium armor. Melee sorcs are extremely hindered by spell slot usage, so you're going to want to rely on cantrips for damage. I'd say pick up:

Create Bonfire
Minor Illusion
Firebolt
Chill Touch
Mage Hand (trap roomba)


For your first ASI though, IF you can get SCAG cantrips, I would take Elemental Affinity. Nothing will up your damage more, assuming you're facing enemies that are resistant to Fire.

[Spectre9000]

I've been wracking my head trying to figure a way for a Wild Magic Sorcerer to tank, and the most AC I can get for you at level 1 is 17 (Warforged or Human Variant(Dual Wielder Feat). That, plus your low health isn't enough to tank. Later, once you get Haste, you can boost that to 19, but still not enough. With 2 ASI you can boost it to 21 which is good, but you're looking at level 8 minimum before you reach that high, and you still have low health until you can get Tough, at possibly level 12. Warforged are UA and Dual Wielding presents problems of it's own for a spellcaster, and doesn't work with Booming Blade. You also don't scale well without the availability of Magic Armor and Shields. Only if you somehow acquired the Robe of the Archmagi early could you begin to think about tanking, and that's a legendary item.

Basically, unless your DM allows the rules on page 231 of the DMG, which allows you to learn Feats as rewards and training, there's no chance of you being a real tank, just being tankier.

[ZenBear]

I've been wracking my head trying to figure a way for a Wild Magic Sorcerer to tank, and the most AC I can get for you at level 1 is 17 (Warforged or Human Variant(Dual Wielder Feat). That, plus your low health isn't enough to tank. Later, once you get Haste, you can boost that to 19, but still not enough. With 2 ASI you can boost it to 21 which is good, but you're looking at level 8 minimum before you reach that high, and you still have low health until you can get Tough, at possibly level 12. Warforged are UA and Dual Wielding presents problems of it's own for a spellcaster, and doesn't work with Booming Blade. You also don't scale well without the availability of Magic Armor and Shields. Only if you somehow acquired the Robe of the Archmagi early could you begin to think about tanking, and that's a legendary item.

Basically, unless your DM allows the rules on page 231 of the DMG, which allows you to learn Feats as rewards and training, there's no chance of you being a real tank, just being tankier.

Considering it's a party full of Wild Sorcs, being the "tank" is relative. He will be able to take the most punishment out of them all, and with that much blasting power he shouldn't need to take too many hits. Just play smart and don't get in over your head.

TBH it might be a better idea to go VHuman with Moderately Armored for the shield proficiency. Your DM is allowing you to bond to any weapon, so proficiency isn't an issue, right? The difficulty then is casting spells with somatic components. You will have to be willing to sacrifice the occasional opportunity attack to sheath or drop your weapon before casting, which isn't a huge loss especially with Booming Blade. Then when you hit 4 you can grab War Caster and now you get to cast BB as your opportunity attack!

Otherwise the Mountain Dwarf build is decent as a melee damage dealer with more HP than the rest of the party.

[Spectre9000]

Considering it's a party full of Wild Sorcs, being the "tank" is relative. He will be able to take the most punishment out of them all, and with that much blasting power he shouldn't need to take too many hits. Just play smart and don't get in over your head.

TBH it might be a better idea to go VHuman with Moderately Armored for the shield proficiency. Your DM is allowing you to bond to any weapon, so proficiency isn't an issue, right? The difficulty then is casting spells with somatic components. You will have to be willing to sacrifice the occasional opportunity attack to sheath or drop your weapon before casting, which isn't a huge loss especially with Booming Blade. Then when you hit 4 you can grab War Caster and now you get to cast BB as your opportunity attack!

Otherwise the Mountain Dwarf build is decent as a melee damage dealer with more HP than the rest of the party.

As a Variant Human Wild Magic Sorcerer, he wouldn't have the Light Armor proficiency required for the Moderately Armored Feat. The bit about him being allowed to "bond" to any weapon could be interesting if he wants to go more a Bruiser Melee build. He could pick up a Two-Handed weapon, which would still allow for casting.

[ZenBear]

As a Variant Human Wild Magic Sorcerer, he wouldn't have the Light Armor proficiency required for the Moderately Armored Feat. The bit about him being allowed to "bond" to any weapon could be interesting if he wants to go more a Bruiser Melee build. He could pick up a Two-Handed weapon, which would still allow for casting.

Oh balls, I forgot about that. Yeah, I think Mountain Dwarf bruiser is the way to go.

[alphashorty1]

Okay so now I'm confused on what I want to go. The human variant allows me to keep my stats I want, but I don't think I could get the armor I wanted due to profficiency. The mountain dwarf is what I wanted originally though.

I could dump all my stats into dexterity and just use mage armor instead and now I'm ahead the extra feat, but I'd need to waste the spell slot daily.

Regarding the SCAG spells, I still haven't cleared them with my DM. But I'm hoping.

[alphashorty1]

Tell me if this sounds good. Although I like the medium armor proficiency from the dwarf, I think I can beat the level one with my human variant.

15 point base dexterity, +1 from variant gives me a 16 for +3. Mage armor makes that a base 16AC. Take the feat for war caster and find myself a shield. Solves the problem with somatic stuff and at lvl 1 gives me 18 armor class. Unless mage armor doesn't work with shields?

Then I also can't lose concentration easily in melee as well.

And second stat is con for life or strength. As dexterity goes up so does AC. Spells like shield make it even better

[alphashorty1]

Never mind. I wouldn't be proficient in shields as a human variant. So even in that case I couldn't get to 18 that way. Would need to fear "skilled"

[ZenBear]

Tell me if this sounds good. Although I like the medium armor proficiency from the dwarf, I think I can beat the level one with my human variant.

15 point base dexterity, +1 from variant gives me a 16 for +3. Mage armor makes that a base 16AC. Take the feat for war caster and find myself a shield. Solves the problem with somatic stuff and at lvl 1 gives me 18 armor class. Unless mage armor doesn't work with shields?

Then I also can't lose concentration easily in melee as well.

And second stat is con for life or strength. As dexterity goes up so does AC. Spells like shield make it even better

Unfortunately you aren't proficient with shields. 16 AC is the best you're going to get. Just stick with MDwarf for med armor and 2-hand your weapon, IMO.

[bid]

Never mind. I wouldn't be proficient in shields as a human variant. So even in that case I couldn't get to 18 that way. Would need to fear "skilled"
That's ok, mountain dwarves aren't either.

[Spectre9000]

Tell me if this sounds good. Although I like the medium armor proficiency from the dwarf, I think I can beat the level one with my human variant.

15 point base dexterity, +1 from variant gives me a 16 for +3. Mage armor makes that a base 16AC. Take the feat for war caster and find myself a shield. Solves the problem with somatic stuff and at lvl 1 gives me 18 armor class. Unless mage armor doesn't work with shields?

Then I also can't lose concentration easily in melee as well.

And second stat is con for life or strength. As dexterity goes up so does AC. Spells like shield make it even better

Mountain Dwarves don't gain proficiency with Shields, and if you use a Shield without proficiency you can't cast spells, period.

Your best bet is to go Mountain Dwarf, with these stats after racials: 17 14 17 8 8 10
Then, bond with a Greatsword, as you supposedly get proficiency with whatever weapon you're bonded to.
You'll have an AC of 16
At level 4, you wanna get the Moderately Armored (Str) feat to pick up a Shield, and you wanna get Half-Plate ASAP for 19 AC, and switch to a Warhammer or Battleaxe.
At level 5, you start spamming Booming Blade, and quickened Booming Blade, while keeping Haste up for another attack, +2 AC (21 total), double speed, and adv to dex saves.
At level 8, you wanna get the Tough feat.
At level 12, you wanna get Warcaster
At level 16, you can get Durable feat.
At level 19, you can get whatever you want. You probably won't make it to level 19.

This build doesn't really start to turn into a tank until level 5, then it becomes solid at level 8. Your damage is gonna be meh, but you're a tank so who cares.

[alphashorty1]

Yea that's what I decided. Mountain dwarf and find myself scale fast to get a permanent mage armor.... Although mage armor outscales me fast. Then take war caster at 4, and heavy armor proficiency at 7. Permanent 18 AC is nice while still having 2 hands to fight with and cast spells.

Although I could really just do a high dexterity human variant and use mage armor... Take war caster at 1. I just get higher stats with the mountain dwarf for strength and con.

Looks like I'm stuck at 18AC either way. Just the trade off of do I want to get warcaster early or stat boost early. At 4 it levels out when I take a stat increase on the variant or the feat in the dwarf.

I guess the dwarf ends up with higher life though where the human has higher dex. Blah. So much trade offs.

I can't decide. Higher dex and early feat, or higher hp and saving slots later

[Spectre9000]

Yea that's what I decided. Mountain dwarf and find myself scale fast to get a permanent mage armor.... Although mage armor outscales me fast. Then take war caster at 4, and heavy armor proficiency at 7. Permanent 18 AC is nice while still having 2 hands to fight with and cast spells.

Although I could really just do a high dexterity human variant and use mage armor... Take war caster at 1. I just get higher stats with the mountain dwarf for strength and con.

Looks like I'm stuck at 18AC either way. Just the trade off of do I want to get warcaster early or stat boost early. At 4 it levels out when I take a stat increase on the variant or the feat in the dwarf.

I guess the dwarf ends up with higher life though where the human has higher dex. Blah. So much trade offs.

I can't decide. Higher dex and early feat, or higher hp and saving slots later

If you read the post above yours you'll see how to get higher AC and a different progression to keep in mind.

[alphashorty1]

Only thing about that post is that if I get moderately armored before war caster I can't cast spells anyway because although I'll be proficient in spells I can't have a weapon and a shield and do somatic components

[CaptAl]

Dwarven Brute swinging a Maul, wearing medium armor with Warcaster and Tough should be pretty tanky. Especially holding the level one slots back for shield. Take blur at 2nd level to give disadvantage to the baddies. Definitely want to get your mits on Booming Blade to ensure that the mobs stay near you or eat some extra damage.

I'd suggest dumping Cha. You can't multiclass anyway, so no harm no foul if you stick with buff spells like Haste, Blur, and Mirror Image. If you can't get weapon cantrips from the SCAG it'll be tougher to make your melee hits count.

Play him as though he's reticent about being born with magic. Like, he's okay with using magic to make his physical skills better, but hates the flashier aspects. Use your cantrips for things like Prestidigitation, Mage Hand, Blade Ward, True Strike (I know true strike sucks mechanically, but with a low Cha firebolt and the like will rarely hit and true strike at least gives them a fighting chance) and beg if you have to in order to get at least Booming Blade.

Quicken spell, and twin spell would be my recommendation for starting out with meta Magic. Booming Blade with a quickened Booming Blade emulates extra attack pretty well. Plus twin Haste/Blur on yourself and whoever gets the healer feat could save the party's life.

[PoeticDwarf]

If you want to be the Tank sorc, Draconic is much better. Spell slot saved from always on mage armor + more health + easy access to fire resist + more damage from your SCAG Greenflame Blade.

But he has to play wild magic. Although they make better tanks.

In 5e, valor bards, bladesingers and favored souls can do damage as a martial, and it is too easy to use them. Especially with pally or fighter dip. Our DM allows favored soul but I'm going dragonic because it is just a bit more difficult then, without a paladin dip. Probably trying to go net.

[alphashorty1]

So good news. My DM cleared the SCAG for use and the EE companion. So I need info on what's good in them besides booming blade :)

[Spectre9000]

Only thing about that post is that if I get moderately armored before war caster I can't cast spells anyway because although I'll be proficient in spells I can't have a weapon and a shield and do somatic components

That's not true. As I said already, when you go to cast a spell, you can simply sheath your weapon. Then when you go to attack next turn, you can pull it out. Booming Blade doesn't have a somatic component, and Haste is a concentration spell you cast at the start of battle. You won't be casting many spells outside of Booming Blade as your Charisma will be low, and that's not the thematic focus of your build anyway. Also, Misty Step, Blindness/Deafness, and all of the SCAG cantrips don't have somatic components as well. For your build, Warcaster, while certainly nice, isn't immediately necessary.

[alphashorty1]

Okay so one last question. I need help determining one more spell. Cantrips I'm taking booming blade, shocking grasp, blade ward, lightning lure. Level one I have shield.

I need one more level 1. What sounds best?

[ZenBear]

Okay so one last question. I need help determining one more spell. Cantrips I'm taking booming blade, shocking grasp, blade ward, lightning lure. Level one I have shield.

I need one more level 1. What sounds best?

False Life or Absorb Elements (with DM permission) come to mind.

I would advise against Blade Ward. It's a better use of your action to Dodge so you are less likely to get hit at all. I would take GFB or a utility cantrip instead.

[alphashorty1]

I have actually read the opposite. Blade ward supposedly scales better into late game where its more likely to be hit regardless of a dodge.

I do like green flame blade though

[alphashorty1]

I took false life and dropped lightning lure for gfb since I probably wouldn't have anyone fail a DC 11 strength save anyway.

[ZenBear]

I have actually read the opposite. Blade ward supposedly scales better into late game where its more likely to be hit regardless of a dodge.

I do like green flame blade though

Hm, that might be true. Do you expect to hit high level? Is it possible to pick up Blade Ward later? I forget if Sorcs get more cantrips as they level.

By the way, your DM could just have everyone roll for Wild Magic Surges when they cast a spell regardless of class if that's all he really wants.

[CantigThimble]

You might want to consider going Tiefling or Red Dragonborn. Your entire party is wild magic sorcerers. Read 'Party Tank' as 'Still Conscious after 3rd Self-Centered Fireball of the Day'.

[BW022]

I honestly don't see any realistic way of being able to tank in 5e with a d6 hit points and no armour or shield proficiencies.

Mountain dwarf will give you at best an AC of 15 to start and up to 17 (breast plate 5 plus 2 dexterity). You can get a 16 to start with just mage amour and a 16 dexterity. So... mountain dwarf isn't likely to cut it. Most low CR creatures are +3 to +5 to attacks, so you'll be hit 40-50% of the time. You don't have enough shield spells or hit points to survive through most combats... and you know there will be a serious lack of healing in the party. Waiting until higher levels to get heavy armour and shields basically means you need some other tactic to stay alive until you reach 4th or likely 8th level. For all practical purposes... you aren't a tank until 8th or so level which defeats the purpose of the concept.

My advice is to simply multi-class. Ask your DM if your background is that you were say a guard working for the sorcerer school who started picking up magic and then was allowed to attend classes or maybe you were a washed out cleric who ran off and hid at the school because his uncle was one of the instructors and let him enroll late. Take fighter, or better a war, nature, or tempest cleric such that you get the heavy armour and shield proficiencies. Take enough strength to wear heavy armour and use a shield. Cleric is good in that spell slots stack and you'll be able to prepare a few clerical spells -- likely cure wounds and shield of faith. Some domains are helpful. Cleric does mean a 13 wisdom, so you may really have to dump intelligence and dexterity. You can tank and this gives the party some ability to heal. Fighter or possibility paladin is an alternate, but it means no spell slots.

If your DM won't allow multi-classing, it is going to be hard. I would go for a non-combat casting build to start with. Take mountain dwarf. Take strength 16, constitution 16, and dexterity 14, dump intelligence, wisdom, and a leave your charisma fairly low 14 or 12 will do). Take pretty much all spells you can cast outside of combat -- detect magic, comprehend languages, false life, etc. In the morning cast false life and then put on heavy armour and a shield. Just know that you can't cast spells in armour. At the end of the day (or when really needed), you can take off your armour and cast detect magic, comprehend languages, and other utility spells. Your party may appreciate someone able to take these. At 4th or so, consider the toughness feat, and by then you should have enough hit points to switch to medium armor (15+dex+shield) and keep using a shield. Take the shield spell. Drop the shield when you need to cast and loss it entirely when you have enough hit points and defensive spells (such as blur, blink, etc.)

This is still not great. You will especially have issues as if all the party are sorcerers you won't have any healing. The party needs to develop tactics to limit the attacks you are likely to take since you can't take too many hits. Control spells, buffs on you, and immediately helping drop anything in front of you. Your party should be working at range and you are only there to delay the occasional creature which gets through. You likely aren't a great melee character in terms of dishing out the damage and you likely don't have enough hit points (or party healing) to absorb much damage. This also means you are likely a lousy tank and you'll need to accept that others will be doing almost all the damage and casting flashy spells while you are designated to doing little during most combats except getting hit a fair amount when they fail to drop or disable creatures fast enough.

[CantigThimble]

Just know that you can't cast spells in armour.

Wait, why not?

[Captbrannigan]

I would suggest Fire Bolt for a weak ranged cantrip or Prestidigitation for utility. Level one False Life is pretty great, be sure to retrain it as it scales poorly.

He means by wearing heavy armor you aren't proficient with you can't cast more spells.

[lordshadowisle]

Since the entire party must play as wild magic sorcerers, a high level of party optimization must be present, especially if you plan on covering most of the traditional party roles. Sorcerers (except for Favored Souls) generally don't have the versatility to form a single-class party, so it may be more effective to specialize (eg, in hit and run tactics).

My suggestion is for someone (probably not you) to pick up the Inspiring Leader feat, probably using Variant Human. This provides a good amount of survivability to your party, which you will need if you want to melee with a D6 hit die. Another person will probably need to choose variant human to pick up Healer feat as well, unless the game starts at level 4 or there is a reliable source of healing potions around.

For your character, it's probably better to focus on maximizing the survivability rather than melee potential. High AC (mage armor, or dwarf medium armor --> heavy armor feat) supplemented with Shield, and later on with defensive buffs like Haste, Mirror Image, Blur, might allow you survive long enough in melee. Offensively, the SCAG cantrips are your best bet for melee damage.

Honestly though, I think everyone will die before level 5 due to someone's wild surge triggering a fireball :smallsmile:

[bid]

In the morning cast false life and then put on heavy armour and a shield. Just know that you can't cast spells in armour.
And you'll have disadvantage on all attacks. So no heavy armor or shield.

Even if it was the case, you don't have the budget for anything higher than chain mail (AC16) or scale mail (AC16).

[BW022]

Wait, why not?

PHP p144, if you wear armour you aren't proficient with you suffer disadvantage on attacks, saves, and abilities scores based on dex or str and you can't cast spells.

However... if you are going to tank and you can't get proficiency in heavy armour... it is still the best you can likely do.

Bid,

Yes... you would have the disadvantage on attacks and yes... you can't afford plate to start with. However... chain and shield is AC 18 which is the same as scale, dex, and shield. If you want to wear this are 1st-level, fine, but you still can't cast spells due to the shield. By 2nd, your party should be able to pitch in and buy you splint mail and shield which is AC 19. Medium + dex caps out a breast plate (750gp) which is only 17 (with dex). I wouldn't want to tank with a 17 AC, relatively low hit points, and no healer. The difference between a 17 and 19 AC until 4th or so is massive... likely resulting in being hit half as often. Something with a +4 is needs a 15 vs. a 13 to hit you.

Again... not a great situation.

[CantigThimble]

I don't think giving up the ability to cast Green-Flame Blade/Booming Blade and the Shield spell in combat is remotely worth a couple of extra points of AC from heavy armor and shields.

[ZenBear]

I don't think giving up the ability to cast Green-Flame Blade/Booming Blade and the Shield spell in combat is remotely worth a couple of extra points of AC from heavy armor and shields.

+1

Better to actually contribute to killing the enemy than be a bit more survivable. Remember that "tanking" isn't really a thing in D&D. There are no aggro mechanics, so there is little to keep the enemy focused on you over your allies. If he actually hits with Booming Blade and presents a serious threat, however, he will still be the toughest member of the party and keep one or two enemies close to him on penalty of more damage.

[bid]

However... if you are going to tank and you can't get proficiency in heavy armour... it is still the best you can likely do.
This ain't WoW, there's no aggro.

No creature will attack that random guy fumbling in his armor. Once the rest of the party is dead, they'll come back for you.

You have to be a credible threat and do enough OA damage to stop a few of them. Otherwise you're no more useful then that NPC you're protecting.

[RickAllison]

This ain't WoW, there's no aggro.

No creature will attack that random guy fumbling in his armor. Once the rest of the party is dead, they'll come back for you.

You have to be a credible threat and do enough OA damage to stop a few of them. Otherwise you're no more useful then that NPC you're protecting.

The closest 5e has to aggro is the Panache of Swashbuckler and the Bear Totemic Attunement of the Totem Barbarian. Even those are more along the lines of penalizing attacks against allies rather than preventing them.

[Spectre9000]

The closest 5e has to aggro is the Panache of Swashbuckler and the Bear Totemic Attunement of the Totem Barbarian. Even those are more along the lines of penalizing attacks against allies rather than preventing them.

*cough* Compelled Duel *cough*

[RickAllison]

*cough* Compelled Duel *cough*

Ahhhh, forgot about that one, thank ye!

[alphashorty1]

It's worth noting that my DM is using the expanded 10000 roll table for wild magic. So less self centered fireballs than it seems everyone expects. But a chance of the nearest sun exploding and instant wiping

[Spectre9000]

It's worth noting that my DM is using the expanded 10000 roll table for wild magic. So less self centered fireballs than it seems everyone expects. But a chance of the nearest sun exploding and instant wiping

Your DM is doing a lot of homebrewing. Just have your DM ok you having proficiency with Shields and Heavy Armor as part of your background. He's seemingly already pigeonholing you so much as is, it's really the least he can do.

However, a thought just occurred to me. Your DM is gonna hate you for trying to go melee and use a weapon. He inherently wants you constantly using spells, which is why he's doing everything he's doing. You can't proc Wild Magic off a Greatsword attack, and you can't proc Wild Magic surges off cantrips. You'll never be proccing wild magic, which is the whole point of what he's doing.