Spontaneous Archivist

[Bobby Baratheon]

How wildly unbalanced would a archivist with spontaneous casting be? What would be the proper ways to nerf it and make it playable? What changes would be necessitated with the class, and could the spontaneous cleric from Unearthed Arcana be a useful template (or perhaps simply the divine spellcaster from the generic classes variant)? This is mostly a thought experiment, but there is a character concept floating around in my head that aligns well with this. I envision it as kind of like the Dovakhiin and the word walls from Skyrim. You jaunt around Skyrim, and occasionally you'll find some old draconic language and learn a new shout. Except here, it'd be a spell.

[ZamielVanWeber]

My first thought is something like spirit shaman. You have a list of spells known like an archivist, except instead of preparing from that list you select your spells known for that day from it. You still gain the spells known and have a huge list and cast spontaneously, but you are more limited on what you can bring as a balancing factor.

[LTwerewolf]

Since they can learn any divine spell, it would be very similar to rainbow servant sorcerers. Incredibly OP.

[ATHATH]

Since they can learn any divine spell, it would be very similar to rainbow servant sorcerers. Incredibly OP.
Rainbow Servant Sorcerers are ok, it's Rainbow Servant fixed-list casters that are the problem.

[Necroticplague]

Since they can learn any divine spell, it would be very similar to rainbow servant sorcerers. Incredibly OP.

Er, how is Rainbow Servant Sorceror OP? You still have the same amount of spells known, you just get to divide it between the Sorceror and Cleric spell lists.

Anyway, to the main discussion topic: This would be insane. The massive amount of spells an archivist can have at their disposal (which is, in fact, every spell, thanks to Southern Magician, Cooperative Crafting, or Alternate Spell Source) is countered by the inability to know which of their spells will actually be useful on a given day. Making them spontaneous completely breaks them. You could always select the exact spell that will solve whatever problem you have.

[MisterKaws]

Er, how is Rainbow Servant Sorceror OP? You still have the same amount of spells known, you just get to divide it between the Sorceror and Cleric spell lists.

Sorcerer can add whatever spell he finds, so no, you don't get the same amount of spells...

Edit: This is why you don't browse the internet while sleep deprived. I thought it was about Wizard.

[LTwerewolf]

Knowstones.

[Necroticplague]

Sorcerer can add whatever spell he finds, so no, you don't get the same amount of spells...
What?

A sorcerer’s selection of spells is extremely limited. A sorcerer begins play knowing four 0-level spells and two 1st-level spells of your choice. At each new sorcerer level, he gains one or more new spells, as indicated on Table: Sorcerer Spells Known. (Unlike spells per day, the number of spells a sorcerer knows is not affected by his Charisma score; the numbers on Table: Sorcerer Spells Known are fixed.) These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list, or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study. The sorcerer can’t use this method of spell acquisition to learn spells at a faster rate, however.
Are you sure we're thinking of the same class?

[Grod_The_Giant]

If you copy the Spontaneous Cleric template, and have a set list of spells known based on your level? Fine. You could reduce the Spells Known chart by one or two spells per level and let him find replacements during adventures (but only up to the normal limit) and be fine. You'd end up a bit above a Favored Soul-- your spell list is better and your inferior chassis doesn't matter once PrCs begin. You cannot have him cast spontaneously from a spellbook of unbound size; down that path madness lies.

[Pale Sun]

You can do it by using the Acorn Trick.

[HunterOfJello]

Depends on spells known. Set it to sorcerer or favored soul spells known number and you'd be fine.

[Thurbane]

You cannot have him cast spontaneously from a spellbook of unbound size; down that path madness lies.

It would be a bit like a Spell to Power Erudite on steroids...

[Zaq]

Yeah, I don't see how this could possibly make sense. The whole point of Archivist is that it can expand its prayerbook with new and weird and exotic spells. That doesn't function on a spontaneous caster. The Erudite is as close as you get to that, and the Erudite is kind of problematic (even minus StP).

[MisterKaws]

What?

Are you sure we're thinking of the same class?

I apologize. I shouldn't be browsing threads about rules while groggy from sleep deprivation.

[Bobby Baratheon]

The Spirit Shaman method would be the way to do it, I think. I mean, obviously unlimited spells known + spontaneous casting would be absurd. But if the player has a few spells known from the cleric list + what they find (up to a set limit, obviously), it would give an interesting feel to the class, especially if you you throw in the spirit shaman spell selection method.

The spontaneous divine caster from UA gets, at 20th level, this amount of spells known (going from 0 to 9): 9/5/5/4/4/4/3/3/3/3 plus domain spells for clerics and summon monster spells for druids. I think the archivist would get something like this: 5/3/3/2/2/2/1/1/1/1 spells from the cleric list plus 2 spells of each level from any divine list, bringing it to 7/5/5/4/4/4/3/3/3/3.

If using the spirit shaman method, I would reduce the spells known from any divine list to 1 (instead of 2) so the total ends up being 6/4/4/3/3/3/2/2/2/2, with the benefit of being able to re-select their spells known each day from what's in their prayer book.

I think that either method would strike an acceptable balance, but that the second is preferable because preserves the archivist's core concept (ie searching for divine spells and putting them in the prayerbook) while providing an acceptable limit on the spontaneous casting of this variant.